Screen Time for Kids: How Much Is Too Much (and What to Do Instead) with The Screen Time Consultant | Ep. 115

27:11Exactly. Exactly. And I think again, parents are well-meaning, right? We think, And this is a cultural problem that parents, you know, especially mothers, it's this expectation of you're supposed to do it all, have it all, be it all. Pinterest and Instagram and all that didn't make our lives as mothers easier either, right? You know, you can see these images that are all manufactured about, like, glorious parenting life. But the reality is parenting is lots of boredom. It's lots of mess and stress and chaos and looking terrible and yelling at your kids. Like that's what parenting is and that's not what's captured.

27:47And so it is so important that we, I think this is one of those things that's very interesting. I'm curious as again, as a Gen Z, what you think of this is like, I feel like over the last two or three decades, we've sort of told parents that it's good to validate your kids' feelings, which I completely agree with, right? It's great to say, oh, I see you're really upset by that. We have forgotten the second part, which is to say, and I know you're capable of dealing with it. And I know you can handle this. I know you can persevere through this discomfort because what's happened now in, or in the last couple of decades, perhaps as parents swoop, you know, we talk about helicopter parenting today.

28:24We talk about lawnmower parenting, where you go ahead and you mow away obstacles before your children get there. And to me, that is a misguided attempt to help. Again, I think it ends up having the opposite effect. And so I really want to - You're not raising children to grow up to be adults. You're raising children to be larger children. Yeah, yeah. And their brains are fundamentally different. And I think, again, if your intention is to help them, that the best thing you can do is say, ooh, you've got a tough choice to make. Or, ooh, this is a complicated friendship dynamic. And I know you're capable of solving it.

29:02And I'm here to help you if you need it. But like you parents, I mean, again, I saw this teaching was when we started putting grades on the portal, the kids stopped coming to talk to me about their missing assignments and their grades. And instead, I started getting emails from parents. Why did my kid not get this? Why did my kid get that grade? When do they get to do a retake? And it was awful because all of a sudden, the skill building part of middle school became parents micromanaging kids' lives. And I see this in today's world, too, of parents who argue that I need to give my kid a phone to keep them safe.

29:34And the irony of this is that giving a kid a phone actually makes them less safe. And that's not, because, and this is so interesting to me, Pew Research asked parents, like, what are your top three parenting fears? And this was a couple of years ago. And number one was youth mental health, number two was bullying, and number three was kidnapping. Number three would be my number one, which I know is, I know that's silly to say, but. This is it. This is exactly what I would talk about. Because, and first of all, I would ask, why is that a number three fear? Because statistically speaking. I know.

30:08I know. You would have to have your kid stand outside every day for 700 ,000 years to be guaranteed of being kidnapped. Years. Wow. The risk of kidnapping is so small, it is statistically nil, right? I mean, I can tell you why. It's because I see worldwide news. Because. And so I think that all these kidnappers are in my geographic location. that is a hundred percent trust me emily i know i know my fear number one i know i know now now let me combine these two things if our fears are use mental health which we know is tanked rapidly in the last couple decades if we know bullying is our fear we know kidnapping is one of those like outliers because again statistically not likely but do you know this is what i hear parents like i'm gonna give my kid a phone to keep them so they can be bullied more their mental health.

31:00When we give our kid a phone, we increase number one and number two. So this is just an invitation to parents to think about for whom are you giving it, right? When you get to that point in your parenting journey, for whom are you giving it? Is it about your anxiety or is it about your kid fitting in? I mean, and so for parents that you're speaking to, these younger parents, I think the goal now is going to be thinking about how you let your phone use you, right? Like, are you clicking on those clickbait headlines? Because a 24-hour news cycle needs clickbait in order to stay alive. That's how they make money is through ads.

31:37And you only, you know, like, how do they keep your attention? How do they keep, because they need to sensationalize these horrible stories. But you don't hear about all the kids who aren't kidnapped. And those are like millions and millions and millions of children, right? Now, I don't want to diminish fear, right? Fear is real. But to me, that is an invitation for parents to start thinking about what are the risks. John Height's book laid out all the risks that are very real for children and for youth mental health and, you know, for all of the risks that come with too much online exposure. So what do you think is reasonable, healthy, okay, safe screen time when it comes from a one to a two-year-old?

32:22I mean, the philosophy that I take, which I call tech intentionality, right? And I always say I'm not anti-tech, I'm tech intentional. The three sort of questions I want, or the three pillars I want parents to think about is less is more, later is better, relationships and skills before screens. So for under two, I'm going to say the ideal, and I'm also going to say I'm not judging you, okay? Because I know parents are going, oh my gosh, if she says a number less than what I do, I'm going to feel like I failed. You're not failing. But less is more for that age group. Ideally, almost little to none.

33:01That means though, if you are one to two year old is going to watch a show, we go back to choices within choices. Put it on the big TV. Make it long form content. Make it in the shared space where there's parents around who can talk through it with you. Don't hand over the phone or the iPad. If you can avoid that, that will make your future parenting years much easier. I have never had a parent say, I wish I gave an iPad sooner. It's always, I wish I waited. So take it from those parents. You can always give it later. But if you can delay it a little bit longer, that makes your parenting job easier.

33:38I also think it's okay to co-view. You know, sometimes it's fun to look back through family videos and be like, Like, this is when you were a baby, you know, like sitting together and navigating that screen together. That's okay. Cause what are you doing that for like five, 10, 15 minutes? Like that's okay. But so just remembering less is more later is better relationships and skills before screens. And that being said, there may be days that you just, you're sick. You're whatever. You're pregnant and you're in the first trimester. Oh my gosh. I busy town mysteries is the soundtrack crack of my second pregnancy because my toddler would nap and I would lie on the bed with him watching Busy Town Mysteries like eight months pregnant.

34:20Again, I'm not judging you, but make those the exception, not the rule, right? And again, thinking about slower content, go back to Mr. Rogers. Honestly, Mr. Rogers is the best. So slow, so wonderful. Interrupting this week's episode real quick for this week's segment of ModMail. If you're new here, this is the part of the show where I answer a listener submitted situation or scenario. Basically, you write in your tricky situation and I give you advice only a real mom friend would give. Here's the email we're answering this week. Hey, Layla, love the podcast. Seriously, it's my favorite. I recommend it to all my friends.

35:00But I am wondering what you do about mom guilt. When I'm with my kids, I crave alone time. When I finally get alone time, I just end up missing them or feeling guilty for not using it well. Do you ever feel like that? Like no matter what you do, you're always wishing for the opposite. How do you find a balance that doesn't leave you feeling guilty all the time? Oh, I think that every single mom alive has struggled with mom guilt one way or another. You really can't win. I mean, you said it best. Like if you're with them, you are like, oh, I should be doing other stuff. And when you're doing other stuff, you're like, I should be with them.

35:45And even with you're with them, you're like, I should be doing more. I should be doing more. So it's never ending. And so just know that you're not alone with that. So I have definitely felt it. What I will say really has been the biggest help in me. I don't know if it's, if overcoming would really be the best word because I, I don't know if it's something that you overcome. I just think it's something that we all experience because we love our kids so much. And motherhood is this awesome, beautiful, but still really hard thing. So like, you're going to have guilt no matter what you do. You just kind of have to accept it, unfortunately.

36:33So I don't know if like overcome is the best word for it, but I think perhaps the best way that I like minimize it is using my time well. And in order just to keep this brief, I'm going to share the biggest thing. And actually, this ties in really well with today's episode, which was not planned at all. So when this was recorded, I was really inspired by this episode when it was recorded, this one with Emily on screen time. And since then, I have completely been so much stricter with my phone because I I noticed that my mom guilt was more present when I had an unhealthy level of usage on my phone, whether that be in front of my kids or behind my kids.

37:32Because when I wasn't with my kids and if I was spending an obscene amount of time on my phone and I wasn't with them, then I would feel guilty like I wasn't using my time well. Because yeah, I mean, I would be doom scrolling. Like that's not using my time well. I'm not serving anyone. I'm not even filling my cup. you're left after scrolling like you're left more depressed and drained than you were even when you begin began so I'm very pro fighting activities that actually rejuvenate and recharge you and don't deplete you more um so when I was away from my kids and I was still like you know doom scrolling then I would feel guilty because I wasn't using that time well because I wasn't that's not a good use of our time and then if I was on my phone in front of my kids I would feel of course, guilty again, because that was some, like, I shouldn't be on my phone.

38:24So most of my, my mom guilt actually came from a unhealthy relationship that I had with my phone. And once I got that in check, I have really not experienced the same amount of mom guilt that I used to experience. And I think it all comes back to being a present mom. And I know that many, many, many women work, the majority of moms are working. So when you hear like be a present mom, I'm not saying that and being like, you have to stay at home because I don't believe that everyone, I don't like, I don't, I don't subscribe to that culture that everyone needs to be a stay-at-home mom. But what I do mean is in the time that you have with your kids, that you are fully present, that you're not scrolling, that you're not responding to emails outside of working hours, like that you're being present with them and you are using that time well.

39:31That's what I think. That's why I had a really hard time with my screen time on my phone because that was taking me away from being a present mom. And once I got that in check, my mom guilt kind of like literally went away. So hopefully that tip helped. I think that this is a very like large topic and I actually encourage you to go back and listen to a past episode of mine all about mom guilt. If you type in wherever you're listening to this on, if you type in learning to mom, mom guilt, the episode will come up and it is so, so good. I truly love it. And hopefully that was helpful. Now, if you're looking for advice, email me at learningtomompodcast.mommail at gmail.com with the subject line, mom mail, and then keep your ears open because we might just answer it on an upcoming episode.

40:22So can screen time affect things like social skills, like you just talked about in your third point there, relationship and over, like things like attention span, social skill, and even speech development. Yes. Yes. So all of that. And there is increasing research to support that early excessive, excessive being the operative word here, right? Early excessive screen use harms development. So again, if you're listening and you're like, oh my gosh, my kid gets like 30 minutes or an hour of Miss Rachel every day. I mean, look at this from the displacement standpoint. What else is happening during the day?

41:02Are they getting outside time? Are they being read to? Are they doing three-dimensional tactile play with blocks and sticks and whatever, imaginative play? Are they getting time with siblings, cousins, peers of their own age group? Are they being talked to? that's a huge huge indicator of developmental um growth is is the number of words a child hears every day and then verbal conversation talking to your one to two-year-old I mean you can talk to them about adult stuff it doesn't matter just say like gosh I have to get ready for this meeting today and I don't know if I'm ready and I've got to go get these materials the two-year-old doesn't care but like you're engaging with them in conversation like back and forth that is all free easy stuff parents can do.

41:48Again, and I see that the problem with putting sort of direct time limits on any of this is that people, parents often feel like, well, I failed because I'm never going to be that number. Or, you know, I don't know, that's not sustainable for me. I think trying to flip this into the exception rather than the rule and framing the language. Like, if I can help parents think about what's coming so that you're using language like, Like, I am exhausted. I'm eight months pregnant. Today we're going to watch whatever. And that's today, right? Kids can't think about, especially a two-year-old, can't think two weeks down the road.

42:23So just keep it in that next few hour window. One interesting story, I've spoken a couple of times with some occupational therapists, you know, who work with young children. And in the last five or 10 years, she said she has seen such a huge change in fine motor skills. So like, for example, used to be working with young children, like four to six on pencil, like handwriting, holding a pencil, right? Occupational therapy stuff that would have been true for our, even your generation, my generation. Now what she's working on are helping children turn the pages of a book because they can't do that.

42:58And so again, like we don't think about that as a skill, but it is, and it's a fine motor skill. And so when we think about that from a brain development, right, we think about there was just a story a couple weeks ago about kindergartners falling out of their chairs at school because they lack core strength to sit for long periods of time. Now, whether or not kindergartners should be sitting in chairs all day is a completely valid question. but the fact that teachers are noticing that happening and that has a lot to do with their core strengths because they're not playing outside as young children as much.

43:34You know, adults call that exercise, right? Like we do that to keep our bodies healthy. Children need that and they need multiple hours of that. We just don't call it exercise. It's play. And there's ways to do that, but it does impact, you know, brain development. We're hearing stories of, and this is all again there's evidence for this as well like myopia which is a permanent nearsightedness that the rates of myopia have gone up because of spending so much time in front of screens you know this is it can lead to long-term serious vision issues right and again I you know like your vision vision is how your brain interprets what you see so it is brain related even though we're talking about like eyes right so there's again I don't say this because I want to scare people.

44:20I say this because every fight you have to minimize, delay, you know, be more intentional about your screen use is a way of getting your child the support skills, development opportunity they need to be healthy and thriving as they grow. Right. And I think sometimes that means going against what everyone else is doing or feeling like you're the only one. and, you know, we'll just do this one family at a time if we need to. You know, you're right to be concerned. You're right to ask these questions. And you're right to have those uncomfortable conversations and be like, no, we're just going to delay or no, we're not ready for that.

44:58Or we don't do that in our family. And you don't have to judge others to do it either. You can just say, oh, I read this interesting book or I read this article or I'm wondering, you know, how do you handle this? Like bring it up in conversation. Yeah. And I think too, it's really daunting if you have been relying on screens for a while, like, gosh, I think back to when I was pregnant with my second and there wasn't a day in that first trimester that the TV was not on. Like that was my lifeline for my toddler at the time. And it was really hard to then, once I started finding the energy and feeling better to get out of that routine, but then it just, it just gets easier over time.

45:36Yep. Exactly. It's going to be a high pain point at first, and then it'll get a lot easier. I think the other thing is there's ways to wean off of the screen. So like, again, I that's a scenario that I imagine many of your listeners have experience with, you know, the second pregnancy and having the toddler being exhausted. Don't underestimate things like audio and music. And they're even like, I mean, maybe not for two year olds podcast, but there are very wonderful, like storytelling apps, or again, I know I'm saying apps, but like from a parent controlled device, if you need to lie down on the couch and you can turn that on and provide some Play-Doh or some other sort of tactile toy, that can be a really great alternative, right?

46:17And, you know, again, I think the goal here is the intentionality. Like if you're going to do the screen or the TV show or whatever, just be intentional about it and let it go. I'm going to do this right now because this is just the choice I'm making. And if you find you're saying that multiple hours a day, multiple days a week, that's an opportunity to revisit it. But if it's a couple times a week, once a week, I mean, again, I don't want parents to feel so defeated that they don't make any changes. Because even small incremental changes matter. And I also, I really do believe we are fighting for our kids' future mental, physical, cognitive, and emotional health when we set limits when they're younger.

46:58That's a huge thing. So, yes, because this is really just the building blocks. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, I don't want to maybe it's a spoiler alert. Maybe parents are already aware, but like there's a very high chance that your child's going to go to kindergarten and be given an iPad at school. And I am very upset about that. And I would love to invite your parents to refuse that, in fact, because I think it is absolutely contradictory to child development, to good education. and I'm fighting that on multiple levels, but I think it's important that parents, this is what makes it so hard. You could be doing everything right at home.

47:33You could be setting limits. You could be intentional. And then your child goes to kindergarten and they can watch YouTube at school, right? Yeah. It's not good. It's so difficult for me to not have these conversations and get so fired up. And truly one of, so I thought, you know, I was homeschooled to a high school and I really thought I would never homeschool. And then I started having kids and I was like, eh, maybe 50, 50. And then I just continue. And it's really the screen conversation that now I'm like, I'm most likely going to homeschool because I don't want my kid to be in a classroom.

48:08And it's like with AI, just like, Oh, I know I want them to be critical thinkers, like all this stuff. Yep. Like if we could just, can we just get technology back to what it was like in the nineties and the early two thousands, you roll in that TV. We watch Bill Nye and the laptop cards are a computer lab. Most schools don't have computer labs anymore because every kid is one-to-one, you know? And so, yeah, I mean, I'm with you a hundred percent. I have a whole document I wrote called the four norms of ed tech about what I think educational technology should look like. And it's not at all what it looks like today.

48:43And, you know, this is like getting more into my advocacy stuff, but, you know, these tech platforms are collecting data about children and selling it to third parties without parental consent. I mean, the data privacy violations are deeply concerning and a huge threat to safety, to critical thinking, to democracy. You know, it's, you're not wrong to have those questions. And I think I am for the first time hearing parents of young kids start to ask really good questions about, wait a minute, why are you giving my kindergarten or an iPad. Like we just spent birth to five fighting that pressure.

49:16And now I just send them to school and they're being given this iPad. Like, are you kidding me? So I hope that that pendulum is swinging a bit. Um, I mean, I, I'm seeing that in some ways, but yeah, it's, it's pretty distressing and hopefully everyone listening, we can help swing the pendulum together. Yes, I agree. I agree. And I mean, again, like I said, I wouldn't get out of bed in the morning if I didn't have hope that changes is coming. And yeah, there, there are things that we can do. And yeah, I'm, I'm very happy to be talking about this. I do want to talk about, you said, you know, one of the biggest things that we can do is really model behavior.

49:54Yes. I'm glad we're coming back to this. Yeah. Let's talk about that. Obviously this is something that I struggle with and I talk about how I struggle with it because I have a job on my phone, right? And that is, that has caused a lot of tension for me emotionally and mentally because I don't. So anyway, I struggle with that, but I'm, I'm actively trying to find solutions and healthier boundaries and all this stuff. What I see, Emily, and something that breaks my heart as a mom is the amount of parents who go to the playground and are on their phones. I know they go to the children's museum. We are on our phones.

50:37we take our kid to swim class. We are not watching our child in swim class. They look back at us through the glass to see, mom, did you see me? I did a good job. We are scrolling TikTok. I know. I know. Yeah. Yes. And so start again, replacing judgment with curiosity. I think it is I'm with you, but hear me out. Moms get a lot of flack. Moms feel a lot of pressure. I mean, And yeah, I said moms, but trust me, it's a lot of dads. It's dads too. We have to remember these products are designed to hook and hold all of our attention. Yes. So you're very susceptible to those persuasive design techniques as well.

51:17But, or and I should say, I agree with you. And I've been there. I've done that. I have guilt that I feel about my own use sometimes. And so I want to give a strategy that I think is really valuable. and I learned this from another an educator and it was actually about helping kids learn executive function skills but I apply it to screen time and it's this idea of living your life out loud so what it means is every time I'm reaching for my phone I narrate what I'm doing as I do it I'm picking up my phone I'm going to check the weather I'm going to see how far swim how long it's going to take to get to swim lessons I'm going to see if I need you know to text you know my friend about pickup tomorrow.

51:59It's a play by play. Part of what this does is it brings intentionality to how we are using it. It brings our awareness. That's the that's step one. The next time the next layer to this is adding in the emotional component. So I'm reaching for my phone because I'm standing in line at the coffee shop and I'm bored. So I'm scrolling through Instagram like I'm just standing here and you're saying this out loud. Is it socially awkward? Totally. but if you feel like if you if you make yourself do it right if you get into the habit of doing that what it does is it brings awareness it's kind of like writing down what you eat you know it sort of makes you more aware of what you're eating so again it's that sort of first act of increasing awareness then what we can do is invite the other adults in our house to do this as well and please note i'm only talking about adult behavior right now i'm not talking about kids we are not asking our kids to do this although eventually that's the goal but like my husband started doing this and he went to work and he was like, it's so weird.

52:55Now, every time someone's looking at their phone, I want to be like, you're not living your life out loud. And we start to change the norm, right? About what's acceptable. It used to be so rude that people would look at their phone instead of talking to you or, you know, fubbing. Why are we so afraid of being awkward? Well, that is a brilliant question. And I think that's why we've become so, like, these are such a great way of distracting us from all those awkward, bored, you know, socially uncomfortable situations. Maybe it's my homeschool background that it's like, I'm used to being awkward.

53:28Like, oh, I love it. There's no shame. There's no, no, no. And I'm with you. And like, this is the part of like that why technology was created to make our lives easier and more efficient in some ways. That's great. And it is a tool, but it doesn't, you know, learning happens in moments of friction, right? If we want to learn how to cope with awkward situations, we have to be in awkward situations. So there's a lot of courage being asked of parents to do this, right? To say like, you know, and maybe it's, you leave your phone in the car. Do you need photos and videos of every swim lesson your child does?

54:00I can tell you I'm 47. I don't have a single video of me until probably my teen years, like because they did. And it was an old school video. Right. I don't have that. And I'm okay. I mean, I'm curious sometimes like, oh, I wonder what it would have looked like as a toddler on video, but I'm really okay. And honestly, people are When are you going to go back and watch these 20 million videos you've taken? So be intentional about it. Say like, this is the day I'm going to film swim lessons and then I'm going to leave my phone in the car or bring a book. Like it's very different to read a book than it is to scroll through Instagram, you know, because again, we've got this persuasive design, the dopamine snacks.

54:37It's just trying to pull our attention away that a book doesn't unfortunately have that same power. And so, you know, again, I think one of those aha moments for us was when my husband was putting my son to bed and he was probably seven or eight at the time. And, you know, he's lying with him in his room and my husband had his phone like down at the edge of the bed. And he was totally doing that like strolling thing. And my son sat up and he goes, Daddy, I can't compete with your iPhone. And my husband was like, oh, ouch. And that was the day we decided no adult phones in kid bedrooms. Like that became now, did we break it sometimes?

55:15Yeah. But again, I always tell parents go for the 80, 20, like 80 % of the time parent the way you want be within your values. You're going to make mistakes. That's normal. But like, whew, that was a heavy one. And now that my son is 17, you know, it's like, we don't lie with him in bed anymore. It's like, I'm now on the other side of that. And I'm thinking, when did those days stop? You know, now, now I don't have that. And I'm not saying that's made people feel guilty because I know that's what people are going to hear. But I think phones out of the bedroom is a very low hanging fruit. And I also mean adult bedrooms.

55:48So I know this is everyone's alarm clock. And I am here to tell you, and I don't take money from the alarm clock industry, they are cheap. They are effective. They're not internet connected. They go off when you set them. You do not need to doom scroll before bed. Get your phone out of the bedroom. That is step number one for parents wanting to think more tech intentionally about phone use. because let me tell you why. When your child turns 13 or whatever age they get a smartphone, they are going to come to you and say, well, you have your phone in your room at night. You always have had it in your room at night.

56:19So why can't I? Doesn't mean you have to have different rules or the same rule for your kid, but it makes it a lot easier to be like, you can't have your phone in your room at night as a teenager because we don't keep our phones in our room. Phones don't go in the room at night, right? That's just the way we do it in our family. So thinking kind of down the road about how you can establish some of these behavioral norms now oh my gosh those teen years will be easier not easy but easier right yeah yeah oh I have so many thoughts my husband and I do no phones in our bedroom and it's amazing because then we just get to pillow talk that's great 95 percent of adults have phones in the room at night that's my favorite part of the day is laying down in bed at the end of the day and just you know of course I'm like 500 miles a minute my husband's like go to bed that is so important though and I think again, like that, that's wonderful.

57:08That's really good. Doesn't, and it doesn't, again, baby steps, put your phone on the other side of the room, put your phone outside the bedroom door. It doesn't have to be like separated, you know, like there are ways. Yeah. Again, that's the displacement. What are you losing or missing out or replacing when you have your phone at your bed? And I think that's why also I'm really passionate about just my generation, like putting down our phones when we're present with our kids, because we all, all of us now have realized how quickly time goes. Yeah. We're making like time with our kid goes because they grow up so freaking fast.

57:38Yeah. We're only making our time. We're only making time go so much faster because even with the moments that we have where we should be present, we're not being present. Right. Right. Well, you just reduce the time with your kid by an hour because you spent scrolling or you spent looking at your texts or whatever. Yeah. And, and again, I, I, I'm always conscientious of like not shaming and blaming parents like to feel guilty because we have plenty of that. And you're right. This is it. We get one childhood with our children. So go for the 80, 20, 20 % of the time, fine, have your phone out, but 80%.

58:17And again, I think the collective action piece of this is really important because it's much harder if you're the only one without a phone. Yeah. Like maybe it's a matter of like sliding over to someone at swim lessons and starting a conversation with them, right? Like, so then the phones go away because you're conversing and that's different. Like you're talking to someone now and you can see you're communicating. And so I think it's hard and it matters. I mean, I really tell parents like, this is a fight worth having. It's a fight for you as much as it's a fight for your children. So, so good.

58:49Emily, I could keep you forever. Especially so wonderful. I know that we're closing out on time. So I really just want to kind of like open-ended. Yeah. What did we not talk about today that you want young mothers to know when it comes to technology and navigating technology in our home? So, I mean, I will say I have a lot of hope for young people. So like I taught a university seminar this spring and my students were like in their early 20s. And it was really, it was both shocking and inspiring because I realize how, I talk about this all the time. I write about it. I think about it. I speak about it.

59:31And to get this new audience of class, you know, students in my class, they didn't even know what I meant by ed tech. They hadn't heard about like screen time and parenting because they're between, right? They're young adults, but they don't have kids yet. And I was, when they started asking me questions, like I was shocked by what they didn't know. And then it gave me such hope because as I started to teach them, they were like, wait, what? Kindergarteners have iPads? That is insane. And it was like, oh, I'm not crazy either. Young people get that this is insanity. And so it makes me feel a lot of hope.

1:00:11Another thing that, you know, I was talking about how judgy parenting can be. And one of the really cool things about this world, and both in the parenting approach, but also like the activism I do, it's a really nonpartisan issue. And in a world that is so politically mired, hot, testy, scary, volatile, this feels really hopeful. Because I have talked to people from A to Z on the political spectrum who share my concerns. And that is so inspiring. Yeah. And I just feel like this isn't about, you know, making a political point or scoring, you know, one for the team. It's like, we're talking about our future citizenry when we fight for this.

1:00:57Yes. Like they are our future leaders. Exactly. Exactly. So it doesn't matter. I mean, it does matter. Like, but, but it doesn't matter who you are as a parent or who you voted for, what, you know, what your job is, like your kids are going to be part of that future citizenry. And we have a duty to protect that. And to, you know, I mean, I'm, I'm sounding all patriotic, but I really believe that there's a reason that democracy has lasted as long as it has. And I don't, and it's fragile and I don't want to see it be taken over by a citizenry that can't think critically, you know? And I think that to me is what makes this really powerful as a fight.

1:01:39Yes. And I love that point that, yeah, you're right. It doesn't belong to a specific party and there really is power in numbers. And if we can come together and just create like the building blocks from when it starts when they're so young. Yes. Yes. Then that's just going to, yeah. Like I don't want my future senators to not understand how to socially handle situations because they grew up in an online world and not in reality. Exactly. And, and, you know, again, you, your generation and the parents listening, you are a very powerful vote voice in this, like, you know to be entering this with the awareness that you have and your own experience of technology and raising children in this I mean the potential to change things quickly is is significant and that again that gives me a lot of hope because sometimes I feel like a little bit like I'm out here screaming into the void but I know I'm not alone and so I you know take heart have courage do hard things don't judge yourself be kind to others replace judgment with curiosity those are sort of the things that will get you through this.

1:02:49And yeah, I'm honored to have been able to have this conversation with you. Thanks so much for coming on, Emily. Where can people find you? Oh, the irony. I'm on social media. I mean, yeah, I do. I post mostly on like Instagram and LinkedIn probably, but I actually would love to point people to my newsletter, which is a weekly essay that I write about parenting or screens or school. And all those old essays live on my blog. And so that's a really good starting point. It's the screen time consultant.com. And I do, I do work with schools, I do private coaching with families, I'm happy to travel, you know, but obviously, I have to charge travel.

1:03:32So, but I'm open to creative ways of doing this. I really, I love speaking. I mean, I really find it. You're good at it. Oh, thank you. Thank you. Well, and I have a lot of video content on my website too. So that can be a starting point for people who are ready for the whole talk. Loved having you here today, mom friend, for you to get a feel of exactly like what every episode inside the mom club is like, because you get the full length unedited episode without ads, but you get it two weeks earlier than everyone else. So if you've ever wondered what you're missing out on, this is it, but for every single episode.

1:04:09episodes inside the mom club are anywhere from 15 to 30 minutes longer than what you hear here and don't forget if you join this month at the mom club bestie tier and choose the annual plan you'll automatically be entered into a special november giveaway where i'm reimbursing two besties for their entire year inside the mom club so head to learningtomompodcast.com join join, choose the bestie tier, sign up for the annual plan, and I'll see you inside. Can't wait to meet you there, mom friend. Oh, and of course, that's in the episode show notes below for you.