Supreme Court Rebukes Trump in Case He Feared

0:00Michael Popok:E. Jean Carroll is a winner. She is a survivor. She has more dignity in her discarded toenail than Donald Trump has in his entire life and entire body. As the United States Supreme Court has just ruled against Trump, effectively 9-0 in favor of E. Jean Carroll, the only person on planet Earth that proved in a court of law that Donald Trump is a sex abuser. And now with this new ruling, rejecting the meritless bad faith filing by Donald Trump to reconsider the decision by the Supreme Court that they just made in June to reject his application for an appeal, to now reject his motion to reconsider their rejection.

0:45Michael Popok:She has now gotten her$5.5 million released from her lawyer's trust account. And now we're on to bigger and better things than$91 million that Donald Trump owes her for the second trial. I'll catch you up on all this breaking news. I got some amazing clips that will bring the receipts about why Donald Trump lost today. And it's a pretty dark day for Donald Trump when even two members of the United States Supreme Court who have been accused of sex abuse and or sex harassment in their lifetimes, Kavanaugh and Thomas couldn't even see clear to join together and say, well, we would grant the appeal.

1:27And the only thing he was appealing and asking the court to reconsider was whether prior bad sexual misconduct acts should be allowed into the jury.

1:36Michael Popok:He didn't say he didn't do it. He just said, but my other times that I did it, the jury shouldn't have known about. Forget it. Even this Supreme Court didn't side with him. 9-0 against him today and in favor of the dignity of E. Jean Carroll. I'm Michael Popak. You're on the Midas Touch Network and Legal AF. Thanks for all of your support while I was traveling. I was doing videos. I was keeping the content coming to you, but I'm back. I'm back. And I'm so glad one of the first stories that I'm covering is E. Jean Carroll. How did we get here? E. Jean Carroll worked for Elle magazine back in 1996.

2:10Michael Popok:She testified, along with a series of other people who were credible witnesses to a 9-0 jury in New York, Southern District of New York, presided over by Judge Kaplan. She said she was sexually abused and assaulted by Donald Trump in a dressing room in a department store 200 yards catty corner from Trump Tower on Fifth Avenue. And the jury believed her, mainly because she was telling the truth, as were her other witnesses. Donald Trump couldn't even bring himself to testify in that particular case. And he's been defaming her ever since. In fact, when Trump testified, he said, oh, she's not my type.

2:52Michael Popok:I would sexually abuse her as if the victim has to be his type. Sexual abuser? No, I never sexually abused her. She's a shakedown artist. I never met her. There's no proof that I ever met her. And I don't even know who the person is. until that fateful moment in the trial and in the deposition before it, when Donald Trump got confused and befuddled and couldn't figure out who was in the picture and thought that E. Jean Carroll was his own second wife, Marla Maples, proving, I guess, that she was his type. Again, doesn't matter whose type. That's not a defense in a sex abuse or rape case. Who can forget the moment that the the light bulb went off for E.

3:35Michael Popok:Jean Carroll's lawyer, Robbie Kaplan, that Donald Trump was had. And this was a video clip that was played for the jury and led to him being a judge, a sex abuser. Play the clip. I don't even know who the woman, let's see. I don't know who, it's Marla.

3:54You're saying Marla's in this photo? That's Marla, yeah, that's my wife. Which woman are you pointing to? Here. Carol. The person you just pointed to was Eugene Carroll. Who is that? Who is this? And the person, the woman on the right is your then wife? I don't know. This was the picture. I assume that's John Johnson. Is that Carol? Because it's very blurry.

4:17Michael Popok:Now, he continued to abuse her and defame her after he was president. And that's what the first trial was about. That was what the$5.5 million trial was about.

4:32Michael Popok:The comments that he made, including defaming her, are now legend. Here's a clip. Read the next, go ahead, that she's not my type. Yeah, because it's not politically correct to say it, and I know that, but I'll say it anyway. She's accusing me of rape. A woman that I have no idea who she is. It came out of the blue. She's accusing me of rape, of raping her. The worst thing you can do, the worst charge. And you know it's not true, too. You're a political operative also. You're a disgrace. Just as a reminder, E. Jean Carroll sued Trump, alleging that he raped her in Bergdorf-Gobin Department Store in the mid-1990s and then defamed her when he said she's not his type, he didn't know her, and that she made up the story, and it was a hoax.

5:22So this is the first time that, you know, we're going to see now what the jury saw yesterday, and it's the first time the public will see how Donald Trump answered these questions. This comes from the deposition he sat for in October of last fall.

5:34Michael Popok:Another piece of evidence that Donald Trump didn't like that came into evidence in the first trial had to do with this Access Hollywood tape, the one where he was caught on hot mic with Billy Bush saying that he could abuse a woman, shove his tongue down their throat, grab them by the genitalia and get away with it because he was a celebrity. That got played for the jury as well, along with the testimony of at least two other women who said under oath they were sexually abused by Donald Trump in and around 1996. Donald Trump was asked about the Access Hollywood tape in his deposition with Robbie Kaplan.

6:08Michael Popok:And here's what he had to say. Play the clip. Video. I just started kissing them. It's like a magnet. Just kiss. I don't even wait. And when you're a star, they let you do it. You can do anything. Grab them by the you can do anything. That's what you said. Well, historically, that's true with stars. It's true with stars that they can grab women by. Well, that's what that's if you look over the last million years, I guess that's been largely true. Not always, but largely true. Unfortunately or fortunately. And you consider yourself to be a star. I think you can say that. Yeah. You see why the jury hated him?

6:48Michael Popok:Now, he couldn't even bring himself. This case was being led by Alina Habba and Joe Takapina. He couldn't even bring himself to testify. He's such a coward. Instead, he was playing golf in Scotland at Turnberry, his golf course. He threatened that he'd return to testify, but never did. Here's a clip of him in Scotland talking to the press. I have to leave Ireland and I have to leave Scotland where I have great properties. I have to leave early. I don't have to, but I choose to. Will you attend the trial, Mr. President? I'll probably attend. And I think it's a disgrace. It's a disgrace that is allowed to happen.

7:21It's called false accusations against a rich guy, or in my case, against a famous, rich, and political person that's leading the polls by 40 points. And I have to go back for a woman that made a false accusation about me. And I have a judge who's extremely hostile. And I'm going to go back and I'm going to confront this woman. This woman is a disgrace, and it shouldn't be allowed to happen in our country.

7:50Michael Popok:Put that in context. That clip was when the trial was going on for several weeks in federal court in New York. You see how much he cared. But the moment of truth in the trial, I know because I interviewed E.G. and Carroll, is when Donald Trump got up, buttoned his coat, and stormed out in front of the jury as an insult to E.G. and Carroll, again, his sex abuse survivor, an insult to Robbie Kaplan, her lawyer, and to the jury, and to the judge, and walked out when Robbie Kaplan, E. Jean Carroll's lawyer said, make him pay. You know how much he's worth because she put on the evidence. How much will it take to stop him from defaming her?

8:31Michael Popok:Here's my interview with E. Jean Carroll on that point. What was the moment in that trial? Was it the photo and Robbie's masterful cross examination that got played about not recognizing you along with your former husband in the picture. That is the funniest. Your moral of a matrix. Is that a turning point for the jury? The dialogue, I said to Sean earlier, we were discussing your book, I said it was, you know, Chico Marx is told by Samuel Beckett. It was hilarious. Wow, thank you. Wow. But the cross-examination was hilarious. She, I think, now people will argue with me about this. That was the moment when the Carroll team knew we had won back in the deposition.

9:21We just knew. But the moment we thought we won the trial was Robbie was giving her final argument and she was fired up. She had taken all the evidence from his fraud case deposition about how much money he had and was telling the jury how rich he was. And as she was saying, how much will it take to make him stop? She drove him so insane. He stood up and walked out. All right, he left. And the jury saw that. and boy that that's what a guilty man does that he turns tail and robbie kaplan ran him out of court yeah that makes a lot of sense i think that was the moment that they just you can't just what a baby i mean what a little tiny baby that's what a baby does or a dog not my dogs my dogs and you tell him to lose.

10:28We've seen your dogs. But as a trial lawyer who's handled high-profile cases, I got to tell you, if I had that cross-examination that Robbie did against my client happen to me, I would have gone into overdrive to convince my client to settle. Because seriously, I mean, I would just be straight with them the way that Habba would never be. I would say, this is a loser. You are going to go down in flames, 9-0 in front of a jury, again in New York. I can't, there's nothing I can do. I can't work around that piece of evidence. Do you think you can say that to Trump's face? I've said it to people like Trump.

11:08You know, that's the thing. Even if you started to say it, he would cut you off. I don't know if anybody can actually say that. Maybe of course Epstein, maybe not. I don't know. Life insurance. We all know we need it, but we keep putting it off because we think it's complicated or expensive or that, I don't know, will live forever. Stop telling yourself you'll handle it later and take care of it today with SelectQuote. In 15 minutes, you could have coverage that fits your life and budget. Here's what makes SelectQuote different. Their licensed insurance agents work for you, not for one insurance company.

11:45They compare options across multiple carriers to find you the right coverage at the lowest price. Even if you have health issues they can help. High blood pressure, diabetes, heart disease. Their agents know which carriers will give you the best rate for your specific situation. Other brokers push policies that pay them the most. SelectQuotes agents actually shop for you. Get the right life insurance for you for less at SelectQuote.com slash Legal AF. Go to SelectQuote.com slash Legal

12:21Michael Popok:I love E. Jean Carroll for many reasons. The dignity about her, the authenticity about her, the fact that she's never allowed being a sex abuse survivor to find her, even though it changed the trajectory of her entire life in many, many ways, many, many terrible ways. Here's E. Jean Carroll doing what she does best, which is with a sense of humor going after Donald Trump. Play it. See, I don't understand how people can be afraid of a fat, elderly man who wears apricot makeup, his hair done up like Tippi Hedren in The Birds, and sits in a courtroom and moans and groans and complains and snorts when the jury got a load of him.

13:16They were mesmerized. You have never seen anything like it. He never sat still and he talked the entire time within earshot of the jury. He belittled Alina Haber Esquire, his own attorney. He would spit as he was talking. He didn't smell so good. And the high point of Donald Trump in court was the moment he stood up with steam coming off his back and hot air blowing out his ears because Robbie Kaplan was giving the final argument and she was asking the jury how much it would take to make him stop and she drove him. You think Robbie Kaplan's afraid of Trump? No, She turned it around. She drove him so crazy, Joanna.

14:16He stood up in the courtroom and left. He stormed out. When a man is innocent, he doesn't storm out of the courtroom. He stays and fights. He turned tail, turned tail and stormed out of the courtroom. He lost right at that second. I mean, he looked he couldn't have looked more guilty.

14:43Michael Popok:Now, what just happened with this United States Supreme Court? Relatively straightforward. He took an appeal after he lost. That appeal went through the Second Circuit Court of Appeals a couple of times and rejected a request for the entirety of the Second Circuit Court of Appeals to to rule in his favor. Rejected all about this evidence. Again, he's not saying on the appeal he didn't do it. he said, my other bad act shouldn't come in about sex abuse. That's it. So his lawyers file a petition for writ of certiorari, asking, requesting that the Supreme Court take up the case because they control their own docket.

15:20Michael Popok:Out of the tens of thousands of cases, civil and criminal, federal and state in this country, only about 100, 150 end up at the United States Supreme Court every year. They control their own docket. They have to approve the petition for appeal. And they sat on that for 13 different conferences from February until June, and he could not find four votes. He needed four votes to bring up a petition for a rid of Saoirse right. Couldn't find four. Couldn't find them, let alone five to rule in his favor. And finally, in June, they put the nail in the coffin, and they denied the petition. Game over, right?

15:56Michael Popok:No. He wants to delay. Why does he want to delay so much, knowing that he's going to lose these things? Because he wants E. Jean Carroll to suffer because he wants her to disappear, to die before she can recover. It is obvious. He wants to be paying the estate of E. Jean Carroll. You know, she's 83 years old. You know, she's a couple of years older than Donald Trump, but she's not going anywhere. Uh-uh. So he lost his appeal. He lost the petition for appeal. Couldn't find four votes. They finally killed it. They then, the lawyers for E.G. and Carroll, filed their motion to get paid from the cash bond that Donald Trump had deposited in the court running with interest now at about 5.5, 5.6 million dollars.

16:42Michael Popok:And Donald Trump said, no, I've got one last Hail Mary. And the judge said, what is it? I'm going to file a motion for reconsideration. There was not a glimmer of hope in the rejection of the original petition. And now he's going to move to reconsider. In order to move to reconsider, which is granted once every 10 years, you have to show a change in facts or law that the court in equity should acknowledge and give you another shot at your appeal. There was no change in facts in law between June and July. There was a change in law firms. Sullivan and Cromwell, write that name down. Sullivan and Cromwell, Donald Trump's law firm of choice.

17:22Michael Popok:Personal law firm. They're going after sex abuse victims. Oh, yes, they are, to try to claw back their money. And they filed a whole brief made up of cut and paste and odds and ends and gobbledygook and bad faith and lobbed it in to delay, delay, delay. She got paid her money. She's been waiting because she's got honor and dignity until this last gasp effort by Donald Trump ended. and finally with the Supreme Court rule today, 9-0, no one dissented. No one, not even Kavanaugh, not even Thomas. Rejecting finally, and that's it. That is the last nail in the coffin. That is the silver bullet. That is the stake through the heart for the case.

18:10Michael Popok:It is over. She gets paid. What does it mean for the bigger case? The one where she won 83 and a half million, now 91 million dollars running with interest. That had to do with the second case two months later in which the jury, a second jury, was instructed they are not to try the issue of whether Donald Trump was a sex abuser or not. That has already been decided by a prior jury. We call that race judicata. That's it. You are to decide if he defamed her and the amount of damage and punitive damage when he was president the first time. He used to sit in the Rose Garden, you know, in different places abusing her.

18:47Michael Popok:I don't know her. I don't like her. She's a, I never met her, all this other stuff. Not my type. And that's when punitive damages came into play. And Donald Trump testified in that case. And jury hated him for many of the reasons I just outlined with Eugene Carroll. And they came back at 83 and a half million and now at 91 million dollars. Donald Trump is claiming the I word immunity. He loves immunity. And usually the Supreme Court does too when it relates to Donald Trump, but not this time, I don't think. Immunity for criminal acts, putting the guy in prison for doing stuff related to his presidency, all right, Supreme Court doesn't like that.

19:24Michael Popok:But this is stepping across the line. This has to do with federal employee immunity. We call it Westfall immunity. It has to do with you. If you do something within the scope of your work, within the scope of your duties, within your job description, then you cannot sue that person for civil liability for money damages. The government steps in, it becomes the United States of America on the other side, sovereign immunity, you're done. Trump's arguing, I'm an employee, federal employee badge number one, and that's been established. He is an employee. He is entitled to that kind of immunity, unless he stepped across the line into personal conduct to defend himself against sex abuse charges or proving sex abuse and defamed her along the way.

20:11Michael Popok:He can't be defamer in chief. That's not part of his job description. That's what multiple appellate courts have said. That's what every appellate court in federal court looking at the issue. They also said he waived it because he and Alina Abba waited months, up to 15 months, to bring up this issue. Waived. He argues, you can't waive immunity. Immunity is a thing. It can't be waived. I don't agree with that. So he filed a new petition for an appeal that's currently pending. It'll roll over to this next term, which opens the first week in October, probably this time next year. I'm hopefully reporting that he couldn't find five votes to deny E.

20:52Michael Popok:Gene Carroll that$91 million. Now, the cynic in me says, when you're talking about $91 million, maybe the Supreme Court finds a way to bend over backwards to help Donald Trump. I'm not so sure that Amy Coney Barrett is going to find that a president of the United States who attacks the sex abuse survivor is worthy of having immunity and hasn't stepped out of that box of immunity. I'm not sure even Chief Justice Roberts does that, who wrote the immunity decision. We'll follow the case closely, but we are one step closer to justice. At least she got her $5.5 million as of today, and we'll see what happens on the next go around.

21:33Michael Popok:I'm Michael Popak. You're on the Midas Touch Network. You're on Legal AF. Take a minute, hit the free subscribe button. Until my next report, I'm back. Michael Popak. Can't get your fill of Legal AF? Me neither. That's why we formed the Legal AF Substack. Every time we mention something in a hot take, whether it's a court filing or a oral argument, come over to the Substack. You'll find the court filing and the oral argument there, including a daily roundup that I do called, wait for it, Morning AF. What else? All the other contributors from Legal AF for there as well. We got some new reporting.

22:05Michael Popok:We got interviews. We got ad-free versions of the podcast and hot takes where legal AF on Substack. Come over now to free subscribe.