In short
The Supreme Court’s pending decision on whether Donald Trump can use an executive order to “hijack” the U.S. Postal Service and disrupt mail-in ballots for the midterms; the episode argues the clock is running out and that an injunction from Judge Talwani should remain in place.
Guests
Dana Nessel (Michigan attorney general) and Rob Bonta (California attorney general), interviewed as part of a panel with other Democratic AGs.
Key claims
The proposed USPS portal/citizenship list is illegal and unimplementable before Election Day; postal workers warn it’s a “catastrophe” and violates the Purcell principle; evidence suggests USPS may be violating Judge Talwani’s injunction.
Notable examples
The June Supreme Court ruling allowing mail-in ballots after Election Day if postmarked on election day; Missouri congressional district map ruling (pro-Democrat) is treated as a data point but not decisive for the mail case. Survival guide: vote early, track ballots, use provisional ballots if not received, and use secure ballot drop boxes.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOSupreme Court and Election Integrity
1:00 to 1:13
Discussion on the Supreme Court's impending decision regarding mail-in ballots and Trump's influence.
“In business, the best days are when priorities stay on track.”
Supreme Court and Election Integrity
2:20 to 4:20
Discussion on the Supreme Court's impending decision regarding mail-in ballots and Trump's influence.
“Time clock is ticking down on the United States Supreme Court to enter its ruling about whether they're going to let Donald Trump hijack the post office.”
Insights from Democratic Attorneys General
4:20 to 5:46
Insights from interviews with Democratic AGs on mail-in ballot challenges.
“they are going to block Donald Trump's attempt to hijack the post office, and they're going to support Judge Talwani's decision.”
The Stakes of Mail-in Voting
5:46 to 9:13
Exploration of the importance of mail-in voting rights and legal authority.
“Why don't you talk to our audience about what's at stake with this mail-in ballot Supreme Court shadow docket ruling?”
The Stakes of Mail-in Voting
9:28 to 9:42
Exploration of the importance of mail-in voting rights and legal authority.
“Excite OSA is an FDA-cleared prescription-only device for primary snoring and mild obstructive sleep apnea.”
Implications of Supreme Court Decisions
9:42 to 12:06
Analysis of the Supreme Court's decisions related to voting and mail-in ballots.
“My impression from being a regular commentator and analyst about things at the United States Supreme Court is that they're not really related.”
Survival Guide for Voters
12:06 to 14:00
Tips for voters on ensuring their ballots are counted and the voting process.
“But for me, what just happened about congressional maps in Missouri is not necessarily going to dictate what their voting pattern is going to be about mail-in ballots.”
Voting Procedures Explained
14:00 to 15:43
Learn essential voting procedures and how to ensure your vote counts.
“Write that down, a provisional ballot that you can get from your election office.”
Transcript
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2:13Michael Popok:Bum, bum, bum, bum, bum, bum. Learn more at Farmers.com. Underwritten by Farmers Truck or Fire Insurance Exchanges or Affiliate. Products not available in every state. Time clock is ticking down on the United States Supreme Court to enter its ruling about whether they're going to let Donald Trump hijack the post office. and deny you and me and 50 million other people your mail-in ballots for this midterm or beyond. We're now two days, soon to be three days, after full briefing, in which the Supreme Court has received briefing even from postal workers that have told them it will be a catastrophe and impossible for them to double-check mail-in ballots against some half-baked citizenship portal that's not even properly rolled out nor trained on yet, and to start jerking around about envelope design with optical readers without training, it is impossible, they've told the court, for the mail and the Postal Service to implement Donald Trump's executive order.
3:13Michael Popok:And every day that we wait, because there is no administrative stay in place by the Supreme Court, they're letting the clock wind down. an injunction is still in place by Judge Talwani up in Boston. Her injunction blocks the Postal Service from even rolling out the portal, from rolling out or rejecting ballots. And yet there is evidence that that is what they're still doing in violation of Judge Talwani's order. She tried to hold the ring with her preliminary injunction. It was not blocked by the Supreme Court, neither by Ketanji Brown-Jackson, who's responsible for the First Circuit Court of Appeals out of Boston, nor by any other justice.
3:58Michael Popok:And I want to also, on this hot take, give you my impression as to whether the fact that the Supreme Court in the last 24 hours has voted and sided with Missouri's Supreme Court in terms of using a more pro-democratic map for congressional districting starting now, whether that ruling that comes through Justice Kavanaugh also indicates that they are going to block Donald Trump's attempt to hijack the post office, and they're going to support Judge Talwani's decision. And then I'm also going to give you a survivor kit, like a survival kit for voting and using the mails here on the Mitest Touch Network on illegal AFs.
4:48Michael Popok:OK, Wednesday, 10 a.m., all briefs needed to be in related to whether Donald Trump can take over the post office and shut it down effectively and not deliver mail consisting of your ballot, nor deliver it back to election offices in time for the midterms or beyond. Donald Trump's effing with the mail because he knows he can't win fair and square if people vote in the numbers that are required. Now, I've already interviewed 15 Democratic attorneys general that were in Detroit this week for their conference, their quarterly conference, this time about voting and voting protection. And they made it quite clear to me.
5:36Michael Popok:I did an interview of Dana Nessel, the attorney general of Michigan, and Rob Bonsa, the attorney general of California on the same panel with me, talking about the impossibility of executing on this particular plan. And here's a clip. Why don't you talk to our audience about what's at stake with this mail-in ballot Supreme Court shadow docket ruling? Well, unfortunately, nothing less than the right to vote. The franchise, the right from which all of the rights flow is at stake. And more and more people are voting by mail. It's become a way to avoid barriers and make sure that the right to vote is brought closer to more voters.
6:23And I think it's very clear that the United States Supreme Court should deny the federal government's request for a stay, that the preliminary injunction that's in place from the federal district court should remain in place for a whole variety of reasons. You touched upon a couple of them. The most important is that this proposed rule by the United States Postal Service is illegal. The United States Postal Service, the president in the executive branch, they have zero authority over determining the time, place and manner of elections that is reserved by the U.S. Constitution to the states and to a degree to Congress.
6:58It's also not something that can be implemented. As you mentioned, the portal is not open. The federal government is saying, do this thing immediately and we're not ready for you. So wait a few more days as the clock ticks and we move closer and closer to the election. There was a whistleblower who said that this process has been sloppy and rushed, that there are catastrophic risks potentially here. They are trying to pilot something during an actual election. And there's rules against making changes like this, particularly the Purcell principle, which says when you get into a certain window close enough to an election, you don't interfere with the election.
7:38You let the existing rules play out. if you wish you can wait for the next election here I think the court addressing the substance for the first time hopefully will make a declaration that the United States Postal Service and the president have no say in determining the time place and manner of elections or you know including a citizenship list administered and implemented by the United States Postal Service in this election or any election I hope they put it to bed permanently that would be appropriate that would be consistent with the law.
8:10Michael Popok:Just delivered the damn mail. Okay. So what does it mean that the Supreme Court in the last 24 hours sided with the Missouri Supreme Court against the Secretary of State of Missouri and is requiring that a 2022 map that's more pro-Democrat be used instead of a 2025 map? Does that indicate that there are also votes to deny Donald Trump a win at the post office in the case that's pending there, which matters to the rest of us. 50 million people voted by mail the last time around. Do you snore? Did somebody hand you a CPAP and did you quietly stop using it? The mask that never quite seals, the hose tugging at you every time you roll over and a machine sitting abandoned in a closet.
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9:39Michael Popok:Individual results vary. Risks and benefits at springsleep.com. My impression from being a regular commentator and analyst about things at the United States Supreme Court is that they're not really related. See, the Supreme Court bends over backwards, usually, about maps, usually supporting the Republicans. But when it comes to voting, they take a different tact. On ballots, they don't like interference with the right to vote. And on mail-in balloting, back in June, they entered a ruling against the Trump administration about mail-in ballots, particularly a ruling that mail-in ballots could come in after an election, as long as they were postmarked the day of an election and didn't have to be counted on the day of elections.
10:38Michael Popok:Donald Trump wanted all mail-in ballots in on the same day, on election day, and counted on election day, which is absolutely impossible. And that was shot down and rejected by even the MAGA on the Supreme Court, like Amy Coney Barrett. I think that case is your data point for as we wait on this ruling. That's why I was not shocked that Ketanji Brown-Jackson did not enter an administrative stay, and nobody objected to that. She did not block Judge Talwani's injunction, stopping this process, protecting the mail-in ballots while they were considering it. And days have ticked off. It's not just Wednesday till Friday.
11:19Michael Popok:It's been going on since last week. There's been about six or seven days that have ticked off the midterm clock on mail-in ballots. So by running out the clock and not caring about the clock, I think that combined with the mail-in ballots decision from June is an indicator that the Supreme Court is going to side against Trump, is going to side with Judge Talwani, is going to block the post office being weaponized and some sort of double check against some list to deny you your mail-in ballot. I believe that is what we're going to report on Legal AF and on the Midas Touch Network. If I put all the data points around it, I believe that's what's going to happen.
12:06Michael Popok:But for me, what just happened about congressional maps in Missouri is not necessarily going to dictate what their voting pattern is going to be about mail-in ballots. I do believe that the June decision in favor and supporting mail-in ballots is a more likely indicator that they're going to support mail-in ballots again and protect it from the evil clutches of even Donald Trump. I asked the panelists that I spoke to, the Democratic attorneys general, about whether our audience should worry about the vote and worry about their mail-in balloting. And here's a clip. Do you think, A.G. Refield, do you think the United States Supreme Court sees through this?
12:51Michael Popok:Do you think that at least when it comes to this particular executive order and this attack on mail-in balloting, that they're going to side with the rule of law? Unquestionably. And I feel very confident. I mean, the Constitution is incredibly clear. I think it's clear to Americans that this really isn't about mail-in voting because all of us want the same thing. We want accurate, honest elections, right? We want to be able to cast our ballot for who we want to represent us and then have that ballot be counted, whether or not we win or not. That's how our country is founded on. I believe the Supreme Court justices feel the exact same way.
13:26And what the Trump administration is doing right now is not about trying to have accurate and fair elections, about rigging the elections, about power. It's about retaining power. And what can they do before Election Day to manipulate the votes that get counted?
13:40Michael Popok:So here's the survival guide. Vote early. Vote early. Make sure you square it away. If you vote by mail, you have a tracking number. Use the tracking number to figure out whether your ballot has been received and counted. If it gets too close to the election and it should have been there, but it's not, maybe because of the post office or otherwise, then vote a provisional ballot. Write that down, a provisional ballot that you can get from your election office. And then if your mail-in ballot doesn't arrive, your provisional ballot becomes your vote. So that's very important. If you don't vote provisionally and your ballot doesn't show up, you didn't vote at the midterms.
14:22Michael Popok:In addition, if you get your mail-in ballot, either because you went and picked it up yourself or you got it through the mail, when you deliver it back while you could use the post office, why risk it? Take it or have somebody drop it off for you in one of those secure metal ballot boxes that are out at various locations. You can find them online in your state, in your area, near your precinct. And get that ballot into that box to be counted. Trust that process. So once you square away voting, then you can continue to do things like helping to register people to vote, be an election watcher, a poll watcher, inside or outside polling places on election day.
15:05Michael Popok:But square away your vote. Vote by mail, but deliver it back to a box. Vote provisionally if you don't see your mail-in ballot show up on time. And if you see anything that looks suspicious in the polling place, on the way to the polling place, any kind of interference or harassment, armed guards, checkpoints, you name it, call your state's attorney general, especially if you're in a blue state, because they are ready for it. You don't have to scramble around like, I wonder who I call. Call your state's attorney general. They are the ones that are leading the fight to protect your vote. Until my next report, I'm Michael Popak.
15:46Michael Popok:Can't get your fill of Legal AF? Me neither. That's why we formed the Legal AF Substack. Every time we mention something in a hot take, whether it's a court filing or a oral argument, come over to the Substack. You'll find the court filing and the oral argument there, including a daily roundup that I do call, wait for it, Morning AF. What else? All the other contributors from Legal AF are there as well. We got some new reporting. We got interviews. We got ad-free versions of the podcast and hot takes. where legal AF on Substack. Come over now to free subscribe.
From the publisher
As the Supreme Court burns down more time on the clock, indicating that it will likely vote against Trump’s attempted hijacking of the post office to block mail-in ballots from being delivered to voters, Popok, who has interviewed Dem Attorneys General who brought the case to the Supreme Court and are ready to pounce as soon as it rules, prepares an analysis of what is likely to happen next and provides a voter survival kit about mail-in balloting you won’t want to miss.
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