A financial planner's advice for spending without guilt

0:00This message comes from Dataiku. AI is everywhere, but companies struggle to prove results. For that, they need people, orchestration, and governance working as one. Dataiku is the platform for AI success, built to bring it all together. Visit D-A-T-A-I-K-U dot com slash NPR. What's something that you have felt financial guilt about? Oh, things that I have felt financial guilt about. There are so many. I bought a home in 2004. Then I went and bought another home in 2006. And basically in 2007, it was worthless. I held on to that home until I think 2017 and finally sold it short even all that time later.

0:50I did not make my money back on the home. I ended up having adverse credit history because I sold the home short. So that was a pretty embarrassing thing that happened. Hey, it's Marielle Cigarra. You're listening to Life Kit from NPR. And that was Lauren Williams. She's a certified financial planner and the founder of the company Worth Winning, where she helps young people organize their finances. Before her finance career, Lauren was an Olympian in not just one sport, but two. I am the first American woman to earn a medal in both the summer and the winter Olympics. I did three Olympic Games in track and field and then one Olympic Games in bobsled.

1:26Lauren bought her homes while she was still a professional athlete. But soon after, things shifted. I didn't have a sustainable lifestyle or career life after sport that was going to allow me to be able to pay a mortgage that was as high as it was. And I learned that pretty quickly after, you know, things started to change sports wise. I had an injury and the market wouldn't allow me to sell the home. And so the guilt came from this idea that I am going to have to get rid of this, that this is a place where my family members come and meet. It has been, you know, a social environment for so many people.

1:59It's been a safe haven. But also the idea that, like, you know, I'm this big time athlete and people think that I earn and I save in a certain way. And I actually ended up using the money I had set aside for my taxes that year to take out a second mortgage because I did a poor investment. So you talk about guilt. This house was tied up in so much of the financial mistakes that I made over the course of my time as an athlete that the guilt just kind of piled up. And it actually became kind of representative of just like guilt in general. Yeah, it's almost like it's guilt for like, how did I not do better?

2:33I should have known better. I should have known this. I shouldn't be in this situation. I had everything available to me. I can imagine those are some of the narratives that were going through your head. Exactly. And then they don't allow you to be able to make other decisions where you can't actually move forward because you feel so guilty. So I didn't want to tell anyone that, you know, I made this bad investment and I no longer, you know, I no longer have my tax money. And now I needed to take out a second mortgage on my home. I did all of that secretly. and so the guilt kind of piled up because I did have a financial advisor that I you know I ended up talking to about it eventually but I did not initially because of the guilt that I was carrying and maybe you know some other decisions could have been made earlier on if I hadn't you know felt so guilty that I wanted to hide those things.

3:24On this episode of Life Kit Lauren and I are going to talk about how to manage financial guilt whether it's coming from overspending not spending enough or something else. We talk about guilt-free spending buckets, following your own money values, and having conversations about money-related guilt. Well, it sounds like a common reason for people feeling guilt is overspending. Like, I made a bad investment, or I just have, like, been spending my entire paycheck. I have a lot of money on credit cards now. How do you get started with tackling that guilt and moving forward? So one of the things I think about is this like idea of, you know, the big bad B word, budgeting.

4:09I like to refer to it as a spending plan. But really like mapping out what it is that you want to spend money on in addition to, you know, what you are spending money on is a great place to start. Because the idea for me is that we create what I like to refer to as kind of like a guilt free budget. That's like looking in to what your values are. So I value family. I want to spend time with family. My family lives far away. I want to travel to be able to see my family. That's a very clear thing that you shouldn't feel guilty about. A lot of times people come to me and they're like, oh my goodness, I spent$6 ,000 on travel last year.

4:45I'm a bad person. Actually, the narrative should be the value is to be able to see my family. In order to be able to do that, I need to travel. And so let me organize my budget so that there is a space for travel. So I don't need to feel guilty when I spend$6 ,000 a year on travel. Now, when we look at the budget, we do look at the other things. Like, what does your rent look like? What does your car note look like? And let's go through all these other pieces of the puzzle. Because like I said, the general reason you're coming is that you feel guilty because of the overspending. But maybe it's like, I don't need a two bedroom apartment.

5:17I just got one because I thought it was only 300 bucks more. But you're not using that other bedroom at all. And so now we have 300 bucks a month, which is almost$3 ,000 a year or more than$3 ,000 thousand dollars a year that we can redirect to the travel budget. And so it's really about building a budget that is in line with your values so that you can feel guilt-free with the things that are important to you. And one thing you noted there, people will jump from, you know, I spent six thousand dollars on travel to I'm a bad person, which I know therapists will often interrupt that thought and teach us how to interrupt those thoughts and say, is that true?

5:56That statement, I'm a bad person. Like, do I know that to be true? Is it definitely true? And who would I be without that thought? I find that to be a really helpful exercise for myself because then you're like, you know what? It's actually not true. I traveled because I love it. I traveled because I went to see my family. Like, none of those things point to me being a bad person. When you can lift some of that off of yourself, then I feel like you can start to move forward. Yeah, I always tell my clients, you need to separate your mistakes from your self-worth. A mistake does not say who you are.

6:32A bad financial decision does not define your character. And so we need to, like you said, revamp what we're telling ourselves, the narrative that we're saying, and fix that to say, I am allowed to enjoy the money that I earn. I am allowed to spend money on travel to see my family because that is important to me. and then you work through, like I said, the other piece of the puzzle of what you don't value and you throw that stuff away so that you can feel really good about everything. Takeaway one, if you feel guilty because you've overspent, remember your money mistakes do not determine your value as a person.

7:07They don't define your character. And you can make changes in the future. It's about making a budget while still leaving space for some of the things that bring you happiness. We'll have more on that after the break.

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9:22Another thing that I find helpful in terms of guilt is remembering that there's no one really keeping score. I mean, yeah, there is a credit score, but it's like, okay, so you overspent on that dinner or you didn't look closely at the price of something and you just told your friend to go ahead and buy the tickets. And then you were like, oh, that was way more than I meant to spend. I didn't realize they'd be that expensive. You know, it's sort of like, okay. so you know i i think that's exactly right um for me it was those usher concert tickets recently oh yeah me and my sister are going to december and she was so excited about it and i was just like excited to spend time with her like i don't really care about the concert to be quite honest but i was like oh i know it's gonna be expensive and so mentally i put aside like 300 bucks and it was like 600 she's like i bought them and i was like oh okay and so to your $600.

10:30Exactly. I'm like, are we going to get to like have dinner with usher afterwards? Like, how does this work? But I think that's a perfect example of the idea of, hey, go ahead and do it. And you don't think that it could even be that expensive. And then afterwards, you're like, oh, man, I made a mistake. What do I do in order to kind of fix my mistake? It's look at my budget, look at the spending I have coming up and just reorganize myself but now I got to go find 300 other dollars but I don't have to end up in credit card debt I don't have to let this be something I pay for for the next you know six years I just have to say hey there's something else that I was probably going to do later on this month or in the next couple months because like I said those tickets are not till December where I can cut those out and I can still come out in the green as long as I look at it like that as long as I'm proactive in thinking about you know okay I did something impulsive in the moment.

11:25Let's just regulate going forward. And so those little small steps, that little bit of progress, I think makes a big difference. Like you said, it's one thing that I did that wasn't necessarily right or aligned with what I plan to do, but it doesn't make me a bad person. And it doesn't have to ruin my whole financial picture. It's not that I'm not going to retire because I bought these tickets to the concert. We're always focusing on the guilt piece of the puzzle. What good came out of the thing that you're feeling guilty about is like a good first step to take as well. And then like educate myself so that something like this doesn't happen in the future and I can feel more confident in my financial situation going forward.

12:01Yeah, I love that. Focus on the good that came out of it. One thing I like is this idea you've mentioned of a guilt-free spending bucket. So it's like if you find yourself overspending, you do want to go through and figure out where you can cut back, but that doesn't mean you have to deprive yourself of all fun and joy. I never, ever recommend that people deprive themselves of all fun and joy, even when you're focusing on debt. So there's some talking heads out there that would tell you, you know, eat beans and rice, look at the wall, don't leave the house, you know, just suffer until you've paid off all your debt, as an example.

12:41That is not the way that I like the budget. You should always have a space for saving, and you should always have a space for yourself. You need a discretionary spending bucket. And sometimes that bucket will be smaller because you're working on paying down debt, because you have other things going on as far as your priorities after you've kind of looked at your budget and said, OK, these are the things that I want to spend money on. These are things that align with my values. I want to get my credit card debt done by December or, you know, whatever goal you've set and you've organized things accordingly.

13:14But you will leave something that you can put aside specifically for you to be able to go out and do whatever. And that bucket you like you spend, like you said, literally guilt free. Whatever's in it, do what you want with it. What do some of your clients put in their guilt free spending bucket? Oh, it's shoes, lots of shoes. Travel is usually a big piece of the puzzle for a lot of people. And sometimes I say, let's just separate that out all together. That doesn't have to be your guilt-free bucket. Your guilt-free bucket is where you can allow yourself to be impulsive. You know, you're out and about and you see something really cool that you're into.

13:47You know, I had a client that really loved mugs and she's like, I just can't stop buying mugs. I don't even drink coffee or tea, but, you know, I started collecting them when I was younger and I just can't pass up a really cool mug. And so, you know, in her guilt-free budget, if you just find a random mug that you want to buy and it costs 12 bucks, even though you're never going to drink out of it, like, have at it as long as that line item is there. Takeaway two, if you find yourself spending more than you have, it is a good idea to cut back, but that doesn't mean complete austerity. Set up a guilt-free spending bucket.

14:22Decide what you want to spend money on based on your values, and then let yourself do it guilt-free. You'll hear more from Lauren after the break.

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15:18How might someone walk through their categories of spending and figure out what they can trim out? Pull up your credit card bill from the last month and look at what you spent money on. And so now you're looking over everything and you're saying, okay, I spent$78 on this meal. I didn't like the person that I was eating with. I didn't like the food that I ate. And so you're just like, this didn't align with my values. And so in order to get rid of the guilt, you look at it and you say like, okay, I don't feel good about what I did. That's where the guilt came in. But what am I going to do going forward?

15:52I'm not going to hang out with so-and-so. The next time they invite me out, I'm just going to say no, thank you. So you're constantly looking at your budget, your spending, your credit card statement to be able to say, like, what did I do that doesn't align with the person that I want to be? What you're saying is making me think that a lot of what we identify as guilt, that feeling after spending money, is actually misalignment. Yes. It's like, I spent the money and I didn't enjoy it. And that's why I feel guilty, yes. So it's like doing an audit of your spending, looking for places of misalignment.

16:30Absolutely. And then just realign. You know, it could be from one week to the next. It could be one from one month to the next. It could be one from one day to the next. You're just like, wait a minute. Catch yourself in the moment and just say like, this is not something I want to do. This is not in line with who I want to be. And so therefore, I'm going to, you know, pivot to X, Y, Z and do this instead. Takeaway three, do an audit of your finances to see where there's misalignment. What are you spending money on that you don't actually value? That's where to cut back. I thought of another type of financial guilt that some folks might feel.

17:08If you're in a couple and one of you makes a lot more money than the other one, there could be guilt both ways in that dynamic, right? Guilt that your partner pays for more stuff and you feel like you're not holding up your end of it. Or guilt that you're the partner with more money, but you still want to split things halfway or you don't want to pay for certain stuff. Or you're kind of annoyed that you have more money and then you feel guilty about being annoyed about that. I feel like money is one of the main things that couples fight about. And guilt probably plays a big role there. Yeah, no, I think you're exactly right.

17:48I've actually had this conversation with my significant other fairly recently as the breadwinner for our household. Like I do it with pleasure. But the conversation sometimes is like how making sure that the other person feels good about how they're contributing otherwise. There are things that I can't do when I'm working that my partner does. You know, taking our eight-year-old to soccer, I don't want to go to soccer practice ever, you know, if I can avoid it. And that is so valuable to me. But you're right, he feels a lot of guilt as, you know, there's the stigma of like male versus female and, you know, the breadwinner.

18:24And then there's cultural, you know, my spouse is Colombian. and there's just, you know, so much of I want to be able to contribute and just reminding the other person like, hey, you are contributing. You're just contributing differently. The monetary contribution does not make me more powerful than you. We are a team that are working together and everybody's contribution to this family is very valuable. So having that conversation once again is so important to be able to help your significant other work through that guilt if that is something they're experiencing. Takeaway four. If you or your partner are feeling guilty because one of you makes more money than the other, it can help to talk about it.

19:02And if you're the breadwinner and your partner's feeling guilty, you might remind them of the contributions they make outside of money. If they take care of the house or the kids or your elderly parents, or they're the ones who do all the planning or the household finances. Of course, this approach will only work if you do feel like they're contributing. But if not, that's worth a conversation too. Another kind of financial guilt is the guilt you have from not spending more, right? From not giving more, for instance, to family members or to friends who have less than you. How would you counsel clients who are feeling some of that guilt or responsibility?

19:41It's a conversation where we have to just kind of unroll the idea of, you know, who are these people that you feel obligated to? Why do you feel like you cannot enjoy what you have just because they don't? Why do you feel obligated to help them if that is something that you're feeling? And why do you feel obligated to, you know, to kind of over save? Because that's something that I see quite a bit as well, is they're just not spending any money whatsoever, because they feel guilty about enjoying. And so now they just have this stockpile of money, not because there's like a financial goal or a big savings goal that they have.

20:13It's just like, I don't feel good about spending it. And so the way to work through that piece of the puzzle is to think about this, like, okay, I don't feel good about spending this money, but so-and-so, you know, fill in the blank with the person that you, you know, think is less off. What would they want for you? How do they feel about you? When they look at you, are you thinking that they want to see you fail? That they want to see you suffer. And so asking questions like that, sometimes you get the answer pretty quickly. No, of course not. You know, my sisters don't want me to, you know, live in a cardboard box.

20:51They want me to have a great life. They want me to enjoy the fruits of my labor. And, you know, I hear it all the time, even now that I should work less. We have to like ask ourselves the hard question of like, where am I getting this narrative from? And then challenge ourselves so that you can decide, you know, is there really a good reason that I'm doing this? Yeah. And how much do I want to set aside for them? Like, let's say you have like a niece or a nephew, and I have some friends who are setting aside investment money for their niece or nephew's college, for instance. There's probably a more structured way to do it, you know, like where you're saying, okay, I am going to give, but it's got to be part of my budget, and I have to be clear with myself about what the limits are.

21:39It almost always leads back to having a conversation with someone, whether that is a financial planner, it is accountability partner, the person that, like I said, you feel obligated to. But having the conversation and just getting it out there helps you unravel the idea that you're thinking. And once you've said it out loud and someone tells you like, hey, that sounds preposterous. Don't save all your money and never spend any of it because you're already on track for retirement. Let's go on vacation. Someone just even telling you, giving you permission to do so is so freeing sometimes that you're like, wow.

22:16But where does guilt come from frequently? Secrecy. And you're not talking to anyone about what you feel guilty about. And so you're just playing this narrative over and over again in your head when it's actually not true at all.

22:31Takeaway five, if you feel guilt for spending money on yourself when you could be giving it to others, Lauren says, remember that being financially secure is not something to apologize for. And the most productive question to ask yourself in these cases is not, do I deserve this? But what am I going to do with what I have? Make sure your financial foundation is secure before you start giving your money away. She says if giving leaves you unable to pay your bills, build your emergency fund, or save for retirement, it may not be sustainable. And when you're deciding to give money to family and friends or to charitable groups, ask yourself what causes and people matter most to you and how you can give in a way that aligns with your values.

23:13Also, Lauren recommends that you decide what you're comfortable giving before somebody asks, so your decisions are guided by your values rather than by emotion or pressure in the moment. In one word, what would you say is the antidote to financial guilt? Education. Education gives you confidence. And confidence is the thing that allows you to get rid of the guilt. I love that. I would say as a backup word, conversation. Absolutely. Lauren, thank you so much for this. Con gusto. This has been a great conversation. I feel less guilty already. Yes, I like it. Mission accomplished. I hope you enjoy the Usher concert.

23:59I do too. I'm sure he'll put on a great performance. I think he's a great performer. All right, it's time for a recap. Takeaway one, remember your money mistakes do not determine your value as a person. Takeaway two, if you find yourself spending more than you have, you do want to go through and cut back, but that doesn't mean you have to deprive yourself of all joy. Set up a guilt-free spending bucket. and decide what you want to spend money on based on your values. Takeaway three, do an audit of your finances to see where there's misalignment. What are you spending money on that you don't value?

24:36That's where you cut back. Takeaway four, if you or your partner are feeling guilty because one of you makes more money than the other, it can help to talk about it. And if you're the breadwinner and your partner is feeling guilty, you might remind them of the contributions they make outside of money. And takeaway five, if you feel guilty for not giving away more of your money, first make sure you're able to take care of yourself and any dependents financially. Then ask yourself what and who matter most to you. And think about how much you're able to give before somebody asks. You want to make these decisions from a clear-headed place, not just because you feel guilty.