Amanda Seyfried is Shaking Things Up With The Testament of Ann Lee and The Housemaid

0:01Hey, Little Gold Men listeners, especially the ones across the pond. We're recording a Little Gold Men episode live in London on the evening of February 19th with the cast of Sentimental Value. We've got a select number of tickets to give out to our listeners. So if you'd like to join the fun, email us at littlegoldmen at vf.com. We hope to see you there.

0:30Hello and welcome to Little Gold Men, Vanity Fair's podcast for film, TV, and awards lovers. I'm Rebecca Ford. My guest today is Amanda Seyfried, who stars in Mona Fastfold's The Testament of Anne Lee as the real-life founder of the Shaker religious movement. Anne Lee is a musical, but don't expect to see Seyfried perform the same way as she did in Mamma Mia or Les Miserables. The film's music and choreography are unlike anything I've seen, and Amanda and I talked about how the rhythmic singing and dancing she had to do brought her closer to her character's state of devotion.

1:19Amanda and I caught up a couple of weeks ago while she was promoting another movie she has out this month, The Housemaid. We chatted about these very different films, the advice she'd give to her Housemaid co-star, Sydney Sweeney, and her extremely niche collection of taxidermy. Let's dig in. Hi, Amanda. Thank you so much for joining us today. Thanks for having me. I can't imagine how busy of a time this is for you. Two movies coming out over two weeks. I'm just curious to start off how that feels for you. This whole experience in the last couple of months has been really just surreal because I don't think I've ever bounced back and forth geographically this way in my life.

2:02and I've been able to stay just very grateful for the fact that these two movies are, not only are they two really, really, couldn't be more opposite movies, but I'm just as proud of my performance in Housemaid as I am as my performance in Ann Lee because I play these incredibly dynamic people and I had an incredible amount of fun playing each of them and to be able to talk about them and really kind of celebrate them this much. It's been really, really positive. Even though I'm dead tired. I got a vitamin D shot today, which I haven't done in like 10 years. And I got to do it more often, I think.

2:48I think we all do. Well, I want to jump to talking about Ann Lee because I got to see this film at TIFF and I was just blown away, especially by your performance. It's just so bold and so big. and I know made for under$10 million. Like what an incredible feat. What was it like for you to get into the mindset of this woman who is a real woman? Obviously this story is told in a pretty unique fashion, but what did that mean for you to sort of get to know her and how much did you know about her before? I think it meant that I needed to dig my heels into some kind of reality that maybe I'm a good enough actor that I can play someone so far away from anything I've ever done in terms of era, in terms of empowerment, in terms of the fact that she was from Manchester, England.

3:43And it's so scary sometimes to commit to something that feels so foreign. And I'm a very brave actor. I do feel like most of my courage is in my work and I'd love for that to bleed into my life. I'm, you know, I'm getting there. And I think even with all that courage and confidence and excitement, I'm still like, how can I possibly relate to somebody who survived in the 18th century and lost four per children and started a religious movement? But then you just have to really just ground yourself and the fact that she's another human being. And I had Mona, who was so passionate about this story and did such an amazing job crafting this rhythm and this journey that she had in her life into something cohesive but also very magical and very unique.

4:39The way she writes is very unique and special and necessary. I just had to hold on tight to her and to the idea that I am absolutely good enough and I just need to work my ass off. It was a whole thing to really wrap my head around playing her, which is like so the opposite of the housemate. I'm just like, oh my God, this bitch is fun. Well, with Ann Lee, I think it's sort of a rare portrayal of this magnetic leader who isn't ultimately a scammer. Her intentions are pure in what she wants to do. Was it ever tricky to sort of walk that line, or did you sort of completely understand what her ambitions were?

5:27All I see when I think about this woman is someone who was so desperate to survive her life after the kind of suffering she went through that she found there was no other way than to just give her grief to God. and to become his servant or like his messenger. And she went through some crazy transformations emotionally and mentally and then really truly believed she was the Messiah and not to harm people or to gain control or power in any way, but quite the opposite in order to bring people together and worship together and build up a community that, you know, turned into like a kind of utopia because everybody was treated so beautifully and like they were all brother and sister and she was mother Anne.

6:27And so much of it has to do with the fact that she had nothing to lose and she only had goodness and love in her heart and compassion. And to lead with compassion and unite with equality it's the simple fact that we can kind of do anything as a group which you know is still we're trying to prove to ourselves again and again and again throughout history that she wasn't a cult leader she was a she led a religious movement to create a place where people could thrive on earth and it was radical because there was one very specific rule that made sense at the time to her and her followers and so be it.

7:08Like what a beautiful legacy. Yeah. This story is so much about faith. So I'm wondering what your perspective on religion and faith was going in and if playing Anne Lee had any shift in your own perspective. It's interesting because I've thought about that too. And I appreciate religion for so many reasons. It's mainly that it makes people feel like there is a greater purpose, like they have a greater purpose. It makes them feel safe when they could feel fear. It brings people together. It unites people in a way that is so positive in so many ways. For the most part, I see it being just a wonderful thing to have in life, that connection, that relationship to a higher power.

7:56I am not religious. I was brought up in United Church of Christ where I went every Sunday I was confirmed I would say I'm agnostic but I think Mother Nature is my higher power for sure I feel the most at peace and the most spiritual and the most connected to something bigger than me when I'm in the woods you know or when I'm with animals but that's not that different I think yeah it's kindness it's about kindness right we have to talk about the musical numbers because I could have watched those on repeat during this movie. They're so incredible. What was it like learning that dance choreography?

8:37Because I do think it is quite unique. How long did you have to learn and what did it sort of like feel like for your body? At first, it feels really incredibly exhausting and annoying because my brain doesn't collect data fast enough or doesn't remember data fast enough for me so i it's frustrating i'm just not i'm not a natural mover however the end result and the end game and the reason behind it all was so important and i i just love celia raston hall i love the way she moves i really connected to the fact that there was a reason behind every movement there was a symbol behind every movement and i my body can still move that way and there's a rigidity to certain shaker movements and there's also a freedom and an openness too and it's really i've never moved like that and we don't have footage of them dancing we only have paintings and drawings and translations you know just a text and these testaments of her written by other people throughout the centuries and it's It's really fascinating how artists today can translate things into a whole new kind of method, really.

10:01I think Celia has invented some incredible things, and I think she's learned a lot in her career, and she's been able to mix everything to create these very specific dances. But once I knew them, I was just deeply, like I got further embedded into this story and into what Ann Lee may have been feeling and thinking. And I took everything that I had in those moments in my body. It's a beautiful thing to express yourself through movement. And then when you add song and singing and breath and just engaging in your body in this way to express somebody's pain, it's very, you can say it's indulgent because it is, but that can't possibly define what it was for me.

10:51Just as a performer, to have all that access, to have all these tools working together, it definitely enhances the whole acting experience, which is why I love musicals so much. Even if it's ABBA, this is very different. This is so grounded in profound pain and profound worship. but it still has the same effect when you're dancing with a group of people creating that energy you can get euphoric and that's what the shakers did they would just dance for hours you mentioned mamma mia and obviously you did les mis before three iconic musical movies already under your belt were you looking for another musical opportunity or i was yes oh i'm always always ready to do the next musical.

11:42I love anything, even like the TED TV show that I've been doing. It's an animated show and it is so fun. And my character sings a bunch. Just if anybody who wants me to sing, I'll be there. Do you feel like you've changed in that respect of your performing since, you know, making Mamma Mia and starting out in those? You're the same. I think the, the more ways of expressing yourself, the better. Even taking into account the nature of learning those choreographed moves. It's like, it's a real bitch. But when you get to the other side of it, like anything, it's such a wonderful feeling. And it's so highly effective for the audience.

12:30It just takes you there. It just takes you deeper into wherever you are. It makes you feel alive. And that's why we dance. That's why we sing. Yeah, it's really, I'm not a musically gifted person, so I die for musicals to like watch people like you sing. And it's just so incredible. I know, I'm always like striving to just be a little better and sing a little better. And I've got my strengths and weaknesses when it comes to my vocal cords and the way I use my voice. But this movie has made me step back a little bit and appreciate what I already have as opposed to like trying to get better. My voice coach is like, where have you been?

13:15Because I've known her for so long, but I'm like, I'm okay now. I'm okay for now. And she's going to see Ann Lee and I know she's going to love it. But I'm also just like, I think my plan was to do a musical on Broadway. And then when I made the decision to never put myself through that, because to be honest, my stage fright is like life's too short and then it's the time away from the kids it's a grueling schedule when I decided that I was never I was I wasn't going to do that for the foreseeable future I just took a step back from from voice lessons and I remember the day on set actually I was in Budapest we were in the big mansion house the first week and I remember thinking I'd had two nightmares back-to-back about doing this musical on Broadway.

14:06And I was just talking to my agent in a little break in my corseted dress and thinking, I can't put myself through that. It's a devastating thing to uncover about myself, but it doesn't mean I'm weak. It just means that I know myself well enough to know that this will break me. And that was really liberating. So now I sing the way I sing and, you know, I don't need the stamina for a musical. I'm just going to keep going in this very specific way because it feels safe and it's fun. So that epiphany just came while shooting this. Yeah. That's pretty recent. Oh, okay. I think it also had to do with the fact that like, I was just singing all day long live, moving in the heat.

15:03And I was like, I couldn't do this for six months. No, no.

15:12More with Amanda Seyfried after a quick break.

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17:02Welcome back to Little Gold Men from Vanity Fair. Amanda, you have another movie out this month, The Housemaid, And I have to say, watching that movie with an audience was an amazing theatrical experience. People were really participating. Like they were laughing, they were yelling. It became an interactive movie. It's really so fun. You can't plan on that. Right, right. It was the only movie that I've seen that like shocked me as I was watching it, even though I know the story. Even though I know what I did on that day, I still was more of an audience member than I've ever been. at my own movie.

17:40And I'm not surprised that it turned out this good. Paul Feig is one of the greats and I've been dying to work with him for years, like a decade. And I know this book is so exciting to read. It's so fun. But I just didn't, I didn't think it would impact me personally that much. When I think about watching both these films in theaters, as we're saying, it is such an incredible experience. Is that part of your intention when you're picking films is like, you want it to be a theatrical movie or no? No, it's like, it's all about the journey. It's unfortunate that we lose so much control as actors, but that's our job.

18:20You know, we can provide only so much. You just have to trust a bunch of the process, but in order to prevent it from being a nightmare or prevent it from turning out terribly, you can make certain decisions like, do I want to work with this director? Do I understand his vision? Do I trust his or her vision? Do I think this character is learning anything or experiencing anything that I might want to learn or experience or discovering anything in a fun way? Like, is this going to be fulfilling or enlightening at all? Like, you have all these decisions that you can make. Like, oh, where's this shooting?

18:56Is it shooting in Scotland? I'm probably going to have to pass. My kids are a certain age, so. Yeah, we have kids around similar ages. I get it. Yeah, it's like this time, not so good, unless they come. But it's just those decisions that you can make. And hopefully if you've made them the right way, if you really consider them, then you're probably going to have a great experience playing this character. And honestly, you have to just trust in what they're doing and hope that it turns out to be a good movie. You and Sydney Sweeney star in The House of Me and have amazing chemistry together. And it made me think about how she's sort of having this breakout moment now that you have had in your career before.

19:42How do you view how she has to handle sort of that moment when the fame really becomes a part of your job, which you've handled for a long time? I don't envy anything she's going through. I've spent a lot of time with her. We just hit it off immediately. She's a sweetheart. she's a very generous a very kind person at her core it is absolutely undeniable when you know her and you just want to root for somebody like that but I also just want to root for actresses in general like I right I see listen I have to be honest I did not have a moment like she's having ever I didn't have something come out overnight like the same thing with Lindsay Lohan who I I really, you know, we're buddies.

20:29And like, I think it's really, really, really harmful to people to have that kind of overnight spotlight because any press, good or bad, is still a blinding spotlight. And you have to maneuver and negotiate your way around it and outside of it. And it's just like, it's acrobatics that I don't think most people are capable of figuring it out at that age. or even my age, I'm 40, and I just, I think it's hard to have that many people looking at you and watching you, and I never had that. I never, I didn't have an overnight success. You know, people knew me from Mean Girls, but I could walk anywhere I wanted.

21:10Sometimes boys would ask me if I could tell if it was going to rain, but that was nothing compared to what, like, in my generation, what Lindsay had to deal with, and it's just dangerous because when you have people shitting on you or just idolizing you and following you around, it can't be good for your psyche. It can't make you feel safe in the world. Right. But I actually admire the way Sid shows up for work. You know, she always has a smile on her face. Even if she's miserable, there's no way you're going to know. I have to dig to find out if she's okay. And she's a professional. I hope it doesn't change.

21:55I hope she doesn't harden. And if I have anything to do with that, I'm there. But when you have that kind of talent and you have that kind of drive, you just want to keep seeing them find their way and keep working because she's worked a lot in her short life, I think, and we want to see each other succeed, most of us, especially women in Hollywood. We don't have it as easy as men, duh. We all know that. I'm not saying anything new. I just know that we've, you know, we related on a lot of those subjects when we first met. And we're two different people, but we have a lot we can talk about as just being women in Hollywood.

22:38And she's got a lot on her plate. But I just want to keep watching her work. And, you know, I have really great women in my life, great actors that I've gotten to work with. and who have championed me. Who were some of your early champions? I mean Cher, of course, now. Cher, of course. She's so loving. But also like Jean Triplehorn played my mom for years and she made me feel like a professional. She made me feel like I was appreciated as an adult in a way that I didn't feel like I was. And then working with Julianne Moore in my early 20s, She's also just so good and so professional, but also has a lot of fun.

23:26We're able to laugh about things, even though some of the storylines were pretty dark. Being seen as an adult and being appreciative for my work, but also understanding that I'm younger and leaving room for me is just what was a wonderful thing. Because not everybody's like that. But my God, I mean, it's been so great. I have just great women around me. Do you have a role from your past that maybe holds a special place in your heart that maybe isn't one of the ones that, you know, people stop you on the street for, but something that is very important to you? Yeah, Chloe, the movie I did with Julianne Moore, it holds a special place in my heart in that it was a really scary, intimidating part to take on, but that I knew for certain that I needed to do because I knew that it was going to challenge me in ways that were going to shift the industry's perspective on me and my own self-worth as an actor.

24:27because I knew that if I could do it, that I would have been really proud of myself in a way that I desperately needed because she was such a different character and she was doing things that were very scary for me. And I didn't really understand her. So it was just all a big, big, messy challenge that I knew Adam McGowan was going to help me through and bless him. And that really did, it did everything that I wanted it to do for me in my work. I felt like a better actor because of it. And I felt like people had seen a different side of me and I'd proven something about my art that I needed to prove.

25:08Amanda Seyfried has been working in Hollywood since she was a teenager. But what keeps her going outside of making movies? That's up to the break. Don't go away.

25:27I'm Shilpa Oskakovich. And I'm Jazzy Sefcek. And we're the hosts of the Bon Appetit Bake Club podcast. Bake Club is Bon Appetit's community of confident, curious bakers. Jazzy and I love to bake. Some might even call us obsessive. And we love to talk about all the hows and whys and what didn't work that come with it. Every month, we publish a recipe on BonAppetit.com that introduces a baking concept we think you should know. Then you'll bake, send us any questions you have, and we'll get together here on the podcast to talk about the recipe. So consider this your official invitation. Come join the BA Bake Club.

26:01New episodes on the first Tuesday of every month, wherever you get your podcasts. Happy baking.

26:14Welcome back to Little Gold Men. So Amanda, I love to ask people, outside of filmmaking and storytelling, what do you nerd out about? What are you like obsessed with or really passionate about these days? I'm obsessed with yarn and crocheting and art. Yeah. I love fiber arts. I love creating things that I can give to people. I think it's super, super fun. And it gets me up in the morning. It's the only thing in life where I think if I didn't have it, I would probably sit around and scroll on my phone. Like it gets me up. as soon as I put the TV on mostly Bluey right now for my son he gets up early and eats right away I put Bluey on and I go sit and I do whatever I was working on the night before every time I start a new project it gives me so much so much pleasure it's exciting to be inspired about a new pattern or a new like purse, I make a lot of purses or a new something somebody wants that's so cool Yeah, it's my therapy.

27:20It's, you know, give me a 10-hour plane ride. Give it to me. I will piss all over that plane ride. You will have a purse by the end of this plane ride. I can't tell you how many times my ball of yarn has rolled down the aisle. It is so awkward because I'm on my knees in very, very thin aisles. Yeah, of course. Looking for my ball and like following the yarn. And the more I pull on it, the further it goes. I was very delicate with it. And then I have to go ask people in their seats. Like, I'm sorry, there's a ball of yarn under there. Wow, that sounds amazing. I'll have to try it. I need something like that.

27:56It's crocheting. Once you learn it, you're like, how did I not know this? This is the simplest thing in the world. It looked hard. You need to give yourself two tries. Okay. Don't quit after the first try. Yeah. That's, you will want to. Okay. The second try, you're like, oh my God, I get it. This makes so much sense. Now you're just going to, you're going to do granny squares. You're going to make people things. You can make bowls, baskets. All right. Sweats. You're selling me on it. I need like coats.

28:26We're going to wrap it up with something we called the Proust Roulette. You know, Vanny Fair is known for this questionnaire we have in the magazine, but we've kind of shortened it to a little lightning round for you. Are you ready to do this? Yes. Okay. What is your most treasured possession? My most treasured possession is my dog's fur. He's not dead yet. He will be, and I'll still have it. Like I can't, I won't even, Isabella Rossellini keeps telling me to send it to her. The fur? The fur. So her spinner will spin fur that looks like Finn's fur from a goat, cashmere, or a sheep, whatever she's going to make.