The Highs and Lows of the Venice, Telluride, and Toronto Film Festivals

0:04Hello and welcome to Little Gold Men, Vanity Fair's podcast for film, TV, and awards lovers. I'm Rebecca Ford.

0:11John DeFore:And I'm John Ross. We have a packed episode for you today. This is one of the busiest times of year for us because we are just back from the Whirlwind Festival tour of Venice, Telluride, and Toronto. and at the same time the Emmys are in three days this Sunday. So today we'll recap all the highs and lows from the festivals with our guest Joy Press who was in Venice and then we'll get into the Emmys by sharing some of our predictions for the most closely contested races. Speaking of the festivals, John and I are back. John literally just got off a plane and onto this podcast. We're just back from Toronto.

0:48For those who haven't heard our episode from Tuesday yet, John has officially joined as a co-host of Little Gold Men, and we made him hit the ground running by co-hosting our Little Gold Men Live with me. We interviewed Riz Ahmed and James McAvoy in front of a wonderful audience at the St. Regis. John, I'm so happy you're going to be a part of this family.

1:08John DeFore:Thank you so much. I am super excited to be joining this podcast. Like I said, in Toronto, I have been a fan and have been listening since the very beginning, and I'm very excited to be working with you, Rebecca, throughout this season and talking all things entertainment, awards, and everything in between. Yes, you're just as big of a movie and TV fan as me, so I think this is going to be really fun. But I am going to grill you right now before we get into the episode. Okay. And as the latest host of Little Gold Men, I think it's only fair that you get to present some Little Gold Men awards, which, as listeners know, the very prestigious Little Goldman Awards consist of a handful of categories that we've come up with, and our judge today, John, will select the winner for each.

1:58Are you ready, John?

1:59John DeFore:I'm as ready as I'll ever be. Okay. So the first category is most earned Oscar win. So right away, I take issue with this because... This is going great. Yes. So I took that as like who worked the hardest to get their Oscar. And in recent memory, I don't know anybody who did more to win an Oscar than Eddie Redmayne for Theory of Everything. so that is the most earned Oscar in terms of like he put in the time he put in the work he did more screenings more imaginary awards that are given out by random film festivals all those things I give that to Eddie Redmayne in terms of like my most favorite recent Oscar win of course it's Parasite yeah yeah I guess it can be interpreted in different ways But you're right.

3:00I remember Eddie was like at every regional film festival that existed that year just to like get two more votes. So, yeah, it's a good pick. Any one. It worked. All right. So the next one is the most undeserving Oscar win.

3:18John DeFore:I am going to go with Frances McDormand for three billboards of whatever the name is. I can't remember the name of the movie. I don't care. I hated that movie so much. I didn't like her performance I thought it was very one note and she won against an actress that I really wanted to win which was Saoirse Ronan for Lady Bird who I think you know that movie is a coming of age story it's about a teenager and it's like the Oscars felt like oh for some reason that's not as important as a woman screaming at everyone for two hours I recognize that Frances McDormand is an incredible actress For Fargo, deserved For Nomadland, deserved But I just, for three billboards It was not for me Yeah, and it's true Like Lady Bird has stood the test of time And that performance always will And I think we watched her come of age with that movie too So that's a good pick All right, best acceptance speech I mean, the Halle Berry acceptance speech is one of the most iconic of all time.

4:33John DeFore:And I think is the standard in which a lot of acceptance speeches are judged against because of the emotion, because of the historical significance. It was one of the most beautiful Oscar dresses ever as well. I mean, you just can't deny it. So I would say that. And then I have another one. the costume designer of Marie Antoinette when she won walked up onto that stage she had no idea where she was she referred to the Oscar as a cute little trophy or something it's one of my favorite like sort of French like I don't care I don't think this is a big deal totally out of it acceptance speeches that I think about still to this day for some reason my god I don't remember that one.

5:24I'm going to have to watch it.

5:25John DeFore:It's fun. It's like 15 seconds. She gets up there and she's like, thank you for this little trophy. It was nice to make the film. And then she just wanders off. The audience is shocked. They're like, does she not know where she is? Does she know this is the big one? No. Yeah. That's so funny. It's a good one. All right. Last one here. An Oscar win that didn't happen that you think could have changed history. I mean, there are so many and there's so many probably deep within Oscars history. in terms of the industry and like how things are working now had Roma won over Green Book I think we would see a very different Oscar campaigning strategy amongst streamers amongst studios I think narratively things would just be very different because I think the Green Book win was such a surprise.

6:22John DeFore:And then I think it highlighted to streamers a very stark reality that there is some bias in the Academy that is going to take some time to overcome. Yeah, I think about that one a lot too. It's a good pick. Well, congratulations to all of today's Little Goldman Award winners, especially the Marie Antoinette costume designer, who maybe will care more about this one than that one. We're going to take a quick break. And when we're back, Joy Press will join us to discuss everything that happened at the Fall Film Festivals these past couple of weeks. Stay with us.

7:07Hi, I'm Nicole Phelps, the Global Fashion News and Features Director and co-host of Vogue's podcast, The Run-Through. Each week on the show, our listeners get an all-access pass to the world of Vogue with the latest fashion news and the most exciting voices in the industry. On Tuesdays, join me to hear interviews with influential leaders in the industry like Calvin Klein, Daniel Roseberry, and Jonathan Anderson. On Thursdays, join head of editorial content at Vogue, Chloe Mal, and head of editorial content

7:36John DeFore:at British Vogue, Chomanadi, as they explore style and culture through the lens of fashion with guests like Martha Stewart, Kamala Harris, and Tracee Ellis Ross. The Run Through with Vogue, new episodes every Tuesday and Thursday, wherever you get your podcasts.

8:01Welcome back to Little Gold Men from Vanity Fair. We're here with Vanity Fair television correspondent Joy Press, and we're about to recap all of the biggest films and updates from the fall film festivals. Thanks for being here, Joy. Thanks for having me.

8:14John DeFore:So Joy, you attended the Venice Film Festival. Rebecca, you attended Telluride and we both attended TIFF. So I think between the three of us, we have a pretty good idea of what worked and what didn't work for our listeners as it relates to the premieres throughout the three festivals and what it means for the upcoming awards season. Joy, do you want to tell us a little bit about your, what was it? It was like 48 hours in Venice? Yes, I airdropped into Venice. It was pouring rain and I'm a Venice virgin. So it was a very intense experience, but I definitely would not have missed it. It was extraordinarily glamorous despite the rain, but also, you know, kind of a weird vibe.

9:05I mean, there were like Gaza protests. There was a lot of political movies, but you know, the cinephile vibe is incredibly strong in Venice. So I love that. Yeah, I think that's why Venice has become much more important as the Academy has become more global. It's like, this is why Venice and Cannes, I feel like, have really increased their importance in sort of the awards, you know, festival gamut. But Joy, I wanted to talk specifically about what you got to see on the ground there, because I think you were there for a couple of the more, maybe polarizing films. It was a really strong lineup, but, you know, us from a distance, it might have been different than it was on the ground.

9:42So maybe we should start with After the Hunt, Luca Guadagnino's film, which I know you're able to go to the premiere. From a distance, it sounds like it didn't go over that well, you know, just looking at reviews that came out of Venice. But what was it like for you? I mean, the crowd was extremely excited about the movie. And, you know, it is hard to tell. having sat through pretty much every premiere that I went to there was a crazy ovation. And it ramped up over the, you know, even like 48 hours that I was there, you know, went from like a six minute ovation to a 15 minute ovation. So it's hard to really judge by that.

10:22It did get a really, really fervent response. You know, I mean, the actors were teary. Everyone was just like so excited about Julia Roberts. I feel like in the aftermath, it was very polarizing, not surprisingly, but every other person I talked to had a completely different take on it. So I don't feel like there was a consensus, but certainly the movie star element of it went over very well there. Yeah, I think because it was Julia Roberts' first time ever there, and obviously Luca is like a hometown hero. Yeah, there was no way it wasn't going to get one of the warmest ovations that they had this year.

11:03I mean, I think, yes. I think Luca is beloved. I think people saw it as a thought-provoking film, which I think is appreciated there. You know, I think that part of it was interesting to people and, you know, was framed as a Me Too film. But I think in Venice, there were very, you know, kind of complicated and subtle responses to it, so.

11:28John DeFore:Did you enjoy the movie personally? Loaded question. Yeah, I wanted to like it more than I did. I will say that I did find myself thinking about it over the next few days. But no, it was definitely not like a home run for me. So the movie takes place at Yale and is centered around a Me Too accusation, quote unquote, in academia, specifically in America. Do you think that that element of the movie is what was a little bit lost on the European audience there? I mean, there are definitely things that get lost in translation, for sure. I do think that my sense is that Europeans are fairly sophisticated in terms of their understanding of America.

12:21I mean, they absorb so much American culture. So, you know, I never kind of assume that they aren't getting things. But, you know, it's definitely in a very American setting and controversy. And the university, you know, issues surrounding it are probably a little bit lost. Yeah. Yeah, I saw the film early and liked it quite a bit. I think Andrew Garfield is doing a really incredible performance in there. I hope that he gets some sort of run for that because it's a super complicated role. Agreed. And yeah, I think it does have that sort of sticking power where people want to talk about it. So I am curious to see what happens, you know, as we head to New York and other festivals with it.

13:06John DeFore:I wonder, actually, I understand why they took the film to Venice. It's glamorous. It's Julia Roberts. It's Luca. I wonder had they held the film and just did the first premiere out of New York Film Festival, if they would have had a little bit more of a splash. Because I think Venice is so crowded and I think the film is polarizing. I think had they just saved it for that New York Film Festival opening night, they would have owned like a week's worth of press out of it and out of the conversations that were being had about it. that's the one premiere in these festival lineups that I sort of questioned if that was a home run for Amazon MGM.

14:06But John, if they had done that, then we would have never gotten that viral moment of that Italian interviewer asking the actors, but only asking Julia and Andrew about the Black Lives Matter movement being, quote, over and their amazing reaction and Io's incredible response. So I'm glad things unfolded the way they did.

14:27John DeFore:And if you want to see three stars at work, each of their responses was spectacular. Andrew looking at Julia, Julia then asking the reporter to repeat the question and take her sunglasses off, which was pointed. And then Io's very thoughtful response. In some ways, I think that was better than any standing ovation that they could have gotten. That, I think, is going to get more eyeballs and more interest into what is this film really about and how much of a conversation starter it really is. Joy, the other big premiere that you were there for was Frankenstein. And I know this was one that we were all very curious to see how it played there because I was at the same time at Telluride and had found out it was going to be a sneak premiere there as well after Venice.

15:26So there was a lot of anticipation. What was that like for you? Well, first of all, let me just point out that the movie is two and a half hours. So the fact that, you know, people sat through this two and a half hours and then like clapped just endlessly. I mean, as someone sitting there in the audience, I was just staggered. I'm like, it's done now. No, no, it's just, it's going. And I stayed to kind of watch the experience. And I was kind of just to the right of Guillermo del Toro and the whole cast. And so I could sort of watch them and watch the waves of the ovation, you know, every time it seemed like it was going to stop.

16:06you know one of them would make a gesture or put their hand on their heart or hug you know oscar isaacs would hug jacob alorty and then suddenly the crowd would explode again so you know overwhelming an absolutely overwhelming response um but you know it's a visually stunning movie so it makes sense and from what i could tell um guillermo del toro is you know completely beloved. I saw him getting in a water taxi after the premiere and people were just shouting like, you know, we love you. Bravo. So yeah, it was definitely a love fest. I had a similar experience at TIFF because he was being honored at these awards and he films a lot of his movies in Toronto and has a very deep connection with the city.

16:57So I expected a standing ovation, but then he was like trying to leave and like every single person stopped, Every waiter, every person working the event, like everyone wanted to talk to him. So it's both the community and like beyond the community that are obsessed with him. So I think we have to consider that when we're talking about how this film might do as well.

17:15John DeFore:And nobody does more Q &As for other directors than Guillermo. I mean, at least I went to six screenings last season where the surprise moderator was Guillermo del Toro. So he is really beloved by the filmmaking community. I got to see Frankenstein as well in Toronto. And you can see all the work that goes into making a production like this. And I think that his filmmaker friends will be on the ride with him this awards season to support him. Because he has supported them in their endeavors. Yeah. A few other films that I feel created a lot of positive buzz during the festival. I would say from afar, it looked like Park Chan-wook's No Other Choice, Testament of Ann Lee, House of Dynamite, and Begonia seemed to all go over at least pretty good there from what I can tell.

18:17Was there anything else you feel like got a lot of good attention there? I feel like The Testament of Anne Lee was really kind of a surprise sensation, you know, because it's like a musical biopic about the founder of the Shakers. Like, it just doesn't immediately sound like a hot film, even with the Europeans or especially with the Europeans. But I think that that seemed to just go over fantastically well. And I think House of Dynamite, Catherine Bigelow's movie, seemed to be very well received. That played after I left. But I heard people talking about Rebecca Ferguson as like one of Netflix's big Oscar hopes.

18:59Yeah, that one was like super secretive before Venice. You know, some of these films, the studios allow people like us to see early, but that one, they really kept it under wraps until the festival. So I agreed. I think it did play well. Before we move on to Telluride, the awards did come out for Venice. And sometimes, like, the Golden Lion is like a very clear signal that that movie is going to be an Oscar contender. But I do think this year's, that may not be the case. Jim Darmusch's father, mother, sister, brother won the top prize. And then the rest of the films, I'm not sure there's a ton of contenders here.

19:39I think the most notable is that Benny Safdie won for director for The Smashing Machine, which is an A24 film that I know is doing an awards run. So this might be one of those years where these winners don't exactly match up with what happens for the rest of the season.

19:54John DeFore:I agree with you, Rebecca. When I saw the awards come out, it felt a little too esoteric. to really apply to this season's awards race, except I think it does give a bump for Benny. Okay, should we move on to Telluride, which is where I was and I had a great time, my favorite film festival of the year. The interesting thing with Telluride is Venice is going on at the same time. So on the ground at Telluride, people are talking about what is working in Venice and it sort of affects what people try to see. But I think the big news out of Telluride was Hamnet. It had its world premiere there. It's Chloe Zhao's movie that has an incredible performance from Jesse Buckley and also an incredible performance from Paul Meskel.

20:45And it just played super well on the ground there. Chloe did this thing where when we sat down, instead of doing like an opening remarks, which is what most filmmakers do, She had us like close her eyes, put her hands on her heart, take deep breaths and do like a full meditation before it started. And like I'm into that woo-woo stuff, but like everyone signed up for that. And it really affected the way you experienced that film. So I wish they could do that at all screenings. But it was.

21:15John DeFore:She did it at Toronto as well. Oh, good. Oh, good. She did it at Toronto and agree, Rebecca. Like a lot of the times when that would happen, it's like, oh, I roll moment. But it felt so genuine from her. Then you go into seeing the movie, which is a whole different devastating experience. And it felt, sometimes you see a narrative be formed very early on in awards season. And I think this sort of idea of being a part of nature, being this meditative state, the dream work stuff that she talks about, it fits very organically with the film that you're watching. And so on top of Hamnet being so strong, I think it also really felt like this is a film where their messaging is very, very clear right away.

22:14John DeFore:Didn't you feel that way? 100%. But it doesn't feel manipulative either. No, not at all. It's real. It feels very authentic. Yeah. So what else at Telluride was exciting? I mean the other big world premiere was the Springsteen movie Deliver Me From Nowhere mostly because Bruce Springsteen was there and I got to moderate a panel with him and the crowds went wild and it like people really loved it I think there's a certain demographic that this film is really really going to work for Jeremy Allen White and Jeremy Strong are both very good in it and it's a lot to live up to but I think their challenge is going to be being compared to Timmy's film from last year.

22:55Complete Unknown. Complete Unknown, yes. And, you know, it's not the movie you expect when you go in expecting sort of a Bruce Springsteen, like, rocking concert film. It's about a much darker time in his life. So I think it's managing expectations when the movie goes wide.

23:11John DeFore:Should we talk about TIFF? That's the one where Rebecca and I joined forces. Yeah, I had two days at home and then I went to TIFF. I was joking that I've seen Ethan Hawke more in the last two weeks than I've seen my own children, but it's fine. TIFF is interesting because there's a lot of films that go there from Venice, and I feel like a totally different kind of audience gets to see them. And I think it just gives you a clearer picture of what's working and what doesn't. John, what did you think was sort of the standouts there? Well, Hamnet. I mean, of the fall festivals, the film that I think just had a, you know, perfect run, if you would call it that, is Hamnet.

23:55John DeFore:The ending is get ready, everyone. I mean, really, like, bring your tissues. the audience was deeply, deeply moved. I think for it to play as well as it did at Telluride, which Telluride is a audience of cinephiles and people that are really in the industry. They bring in some Academy members and then they do have these sort of Telluride ticket holders that I guess, you know, go every year. Toronto's audience is much broader. And Hamnet was the film that played extraordinarily strong for both. I went to the Knives Out premiere, which is a very Toronto film. It has premiered in Toronto, I think, all versions of it.

24:56John DeFore:Yeah, they all did. This Knives Out, surprise guys, is like the funniest one. And the format is different than the first two. It's actually more of a two-hander between Josh O 'Connor and Daniel Craig. And that had a very, very big premiere and a big reception. Do I think it's an awards movie? Not really, but maybe in the world of SAG and Golden Globes. But in terms of just like entertainment, a lot of jokes, it totally makes you rethink Josh O 'Connor, not just as a great dramatic actor, but a great comedic actor as well. that had one of the biggest reactions of any of the films that I saw at TIFF.