The Surprise Emmy Winners Saved the Show

0:03Hello and welcome to Little Gold Men, Vanity Fair's podcast for film, TV and awards lovers. I'm Rebecca Ford. I'm John Ross. It's the morning after the Emmys and with a new host and lots of surprise wins, there's so much for us to talk about. To help us get into all of it, we have our colleagues, Hillary Busis and Chris Murphy, who are here today. Thank you guys for joining us. Thanks for having us on the show. Very excited to be here. John and I were up a little late with the Emmy parties, so you guys are going to have to hold it together for us, I think, today, but we're going to do it. We were past our bedtime.

0:40Yeah, how were the parties? How was everything that happened after the show? It was interesting. I think it's really fun to go to parties when there are a lot of surprises because everyone wants to talk about it. So we both went to the Governor's Ball, which is on site at the Emmys. It's where the winners get their trophies engraved, and it's a really celebratory thing. But what I noticed is that everyone left pretty quick to go to all the sort of special studio parties that were all over town. I went to Netflix. It's like the official after prom that the school throws. Yes, right. And then kids go to their friends' real parties.

1:15Where their moms aren't home. It's also the first place where you can get even a bite of food. Oh, yes. Like real food. Rebecca, you mentioned the concessions in some of the story in one of the live blog posts that you wrote yesterday. You saw Tom Colicchio waiting for nachos. I wouldn't call that food though, Hillary. Light bites. It's like heavy gross bites. But the Governor's Ball does have good food. I scarfed down a few things there. And it was cool this year. They had booths from each of like a lot of the top chef contestants. So if you're like a top chef fan, you could like bounce around and get food from a lot of the different chefs that you may know from that.

1:51So that was a really cool theme thing. But yeah, then I went to Netflix and obviously Adolescence was like king of the town there. They just like took over that party and there's always a good dance, a lot of dancing at a Netflix party. So that was a fun one. And I went to HBO, which they had, I think, a bit of a surprise night in terms of they performed better than they thought they would. Casey Bloys looked really happy. David Zasloff, the head of Warners, was there. it was at the San Vincente bungalows and they sort of did it up like a house party so like different rooms were slightly differently themed it was a good party it's I mean way back in the day HBO used to throw this like I don't know it was like 2000 person party that was like everyone and their mother was there this new version is much more intimate and fun.

2:54Olivia Rodrigo was there, so I got to see a pop star. Oh, wow. And then she was talking to Sam Nivola and Iris Apatow. Lisa from Blackpink was there, and everyone wanted to take a photo with her, regardless of stature or fame. Celebrity to celebrities. It's always interesting to figure out who those people are. Yeah, Lisa was the one that people were like, I guess I do want a photo with Blackpink. Well, before the after parties, John and I were also both in the show where I thought there were a lot of exciting moments, many more than I had anticipated. So I wanted us all to talk about the biggest surprises of the night from the actual show.

3:37Yeah, totally. After Jean Smart got her, what, 20th Emmy for Hacks, I was like, all right, whatever. But then things really got shaken up. Yeah, I think I got the most predictions I've ever gotten wrong this year because there were just so many surprises. But in the end, I'm so happy for that because it made the show way more exciting. Yeah, we pretty much got everything wrong, which is tough hosting this podcast. That was a rough, that was rough to face. A humbling beginning. A humbling experience. But what do we think was the biggest surprise of the night? I mean, it's got to be... The pit. Oh, I see.

4:13I was going to say Jeff Hiller. Oh, that's interesting. See, there you go. That's how many surprises. That's true. Okay, two HBO slash Max surprises. Yes, two. I do think those are, I think for a show, definitely the pit edging out Severance is a huge surprise. But that was sort of a two-horse race. Like Severance had the momentum being the most nominated show of the night and whatnot. But the pit was always sort of like clipping at its heels and you could sort of feel momentum building for it as the night wore on. But Jeff Hiller, I mean, if you literally looked at the odds. Yeah, Jeff Hiller even getting a nomination felt like a huge deal.

4:49So him winning. Yes. That was the surprise. That was shocking that he even got in. So the fact that he won, and I'm pretty sure if you looked at the odds, he was like 34 to 1. Like the least likely to win in that category. So him winning, and it's an amazing win. He's such an incredible comedian, New York improviser. Anyone who's seen 30 Rock, that iconic episode on the plane, he's the flight attendant where Liz Lemmon gets trapped on the plane. He's like an amazing comedian. And actor and him winning and beating out a really wonderful and a very queer group in Bo and Yang, Coleman Domingo, Michael Urie, and, well, not queer, but Harrison Ford was really kind of amazing.

5:28Yeah, most of whom he has seemed very excited for him to win. They were kind of clutching each other and like cheering on Jeff as he took the stage. They were screaming. They were like, they were absolutely positively buzzing after he won. Yeah, I can't remember a time when the person we talked about as like the biggest surprise nomination became the winner. Because you just sort of assume they're in the last slot of the group. But I just can't believe that the TV Academy rallied behind him like that. It's such a wonderful win. And nice after Somebody Somewhere got canceled too. Like this was the last show.

6:00I think that show was a very tiny but fiercely beloved show by the people who watched it and loved it. And I think a lot of actors really liked it. A lot of actors really respect Bridget Everett, who starred and created it. Although it didn't do sort of big numbers, I do think its fan base was really passionate and really, really intense in a way that we don't typically see that often, or especially in television with the Emmys. It's more like an Everything Everywhere All at Once Oscar campaign, where it's just a lot of really passionate fans sort of like that spread, and I think pushed him over the edge.

6:39Also, I do think it being the last season, it's like, oh, well, you know, this is the last chance to vote for the show. You know, might as well vote with my heart. I think that Andor winning in writing for a drama series was a similar win where there's probably a smaller but very vocal group of boosters who are able to influence the result in a surprising and exciting way. Let's talk about a couple more of the acting surprise wins before we get to the big drama series surprise at the end. But I thought Tramiel Tillman was like such a wonderful surprise. In the episode before this, Joy Press had joined us and was like, I wish he would win, but I know he has no chance.

7:19And then it happened. So I feel like she kind of voiced that into existence. And then he gave such an incredible speech. So it was like one of my favorite moments, I think. Do you think that in Tramiel Tillman's case, he benefited from there being so many White Lotus and other... I mean, well, he was also competing against two other castmates of his from Severance, but I think that the White Lotus concentration may have made it, like split that vote between Walton Goggins and Jason Isaacs and Sam Rockwell and allowed Tramiel Tillman to kind of surge. Well, yes, and also the fact that the White Lotus fully flops this year.

7:54Yeah. Didn't win a single... So maybe not that many people were even voting for them to begin with for the third season, which I think many people agreed was probably, you know, one of the weakest season thus far. But yeah, I mean, Tramont Tillman, incredible win. I would say best speech of the night. It has to be said, he's the first black actor to ever win that category in 77 Emmy ceremonies. So there was historical import. I mean, that's crazy to say, but it's true. And a really deserved exciting, unexpected win. and he was able to deliver on, in a short amount of time to give a speech, he was really able to deliver.

8:31And I think that he was delivering like that on the campaign trail the entire Emmy season. Interviews with him, Q &As with him, he was really strong, he was really dynamic. I think sometimes, you know, you wonder, like, how much does campaigning really affect the final outcome with him, I think it did. I think he introduced himself to the Academy and the Academy really felt connected to him in addition to giving one of the strongest performances on that show. Yeah, I think in a similar way, it feels like Catherine Lanasse's win was probably in part because of, again, the sort of White Lotus split and the fact that that show didn't do as well because we had been sort of debating, you know, Carrie Coon or Parker Posey.

9:28And I think I underestimated the power of the pit clearly in many ways last night. I think that Catherine Lanasa won because she was the only actor on the pit brave enough to attempt a Pittsburgh accent. And how did she do? You know, I am a Pittsburgh native. I need to put that out there. I think she did great. I think that it is a voice that it's similar to the Delco accent. It's a little different. If you've watched Mirror of Easttown, you have a sense of what it sounds like. You sound insane when you try to do it. People think that you are making up the way that people talk from Pittsburgh.

10:06But you know what? She really went for it. She did those ews. That is what they actually sound like. Every person in that hospital should be speaking like Catherine Lanasa on The Pit. This is the one quibble that I have with that series. maybe in season two, they'll get more Yenzers to be consultants or something. But yes, that was why she was the Emmy winner of my heart. Thrilled to see her take the stage and talk like a normal person. I think something that surprised me, but in retrospect shouldn't have was Stephen Graham. I knew adolescence was going to win a lot, but I just thought Colin Farrell had that one in the bag.

10:39And after Kristen Miladi won, I thought that that was definitely going to happen. But Stephen Graham really won and I'm glad he did. I think he gave such sweet exception speeches and apparently he's like the sweetest man in town. So I was happy for him. But did you guys expect that one? I did not. I love to see a short King win though. So I was happy to see Stephen Graham. But I mean, it's interesting. I knew Owen Cooper, the little boy. I knew he was going to win. That was pretty clear. Aaron Doherty, who won Best Supporting Actress, that was also pretty much set in stone. And I do think Stephen Graham, I think he won it for his acting, but also as the creator, as the writer, it was sort of all encompassing.

11:22And of course, Adolescence also won, you know, Best Limited Series. But I do think that his total creative involvement and it being like really his project and how what a smashing success. I think that made it hard to ignore. Yeah, I'm sure that's one of the reasons that Seth Rogen won so many times too. Like he and Stephen Graham both walked away with multiple Emmys. Stephen Graham got three. Seth Rogen got four. Yeah, and Adolescence was an old school Emmy sweep. Like, it won pretty much every award it was up for. Every single one. Yeah, I think if they had put even Erin Doherty in lead, she would have beat Kristen.

12:00Like, that's how inevitable the sweep felt. That would be category fraud. That would be category fraud. Which never happens. But that's how much I felt confident that that show was just going to sweep. so I wasn't so surprised about Steven winning over Colin. I just think that they felt that this was the most important show of the year. And what was interesting is the show has all these, you know, pretty deep themes, especially relevant to recent news. And that didn't come up in any of the acceptance speeches. I mean, the narrative around the show as it was coming out was about, you know, boys, red pills, this, that, what's going on online.

12:51And then I kind of expected at some point when they were like winning their 27th Emmy that they were going to get into like what the show was about. But they really steered clear. Yeah, that's a good point. There wasn't even a call about like, we can't like leave our boys behind. like even something kind of anodyne and like non-political. Yeah, just like violence is bad. Very simple. Well, I think we should wrap up this section by talking about the final prize of the night when the pit beat Severance. I had been very confident in my Severance prediction all the way through, but like I said, I underestimated the pit.

13:29Were any of you as surprised as I was? I will say I did call my shot. Yes, you have to show it off a little bit. in our live blog we have receipts it's true we have receipts that at the 11th hour right before they were about to get to the category I was like wow I'm really feeling the pit's momentum I'm gonna go on our live blog and say I think the pit is gonna take it I think it's gonna beat Severance and I think HBO Max is gonna win and I was right it's sort of like calling your eight ball right before you shoot it into the pocket but I'm sorry keep your sports metaphors to yourself this is not the podcast this is not the space for that but this is not a safe space.

14:09We don't have billiards here. Billiards, wow. Look at Marty Supreme over here. No, he plays Pink Kong. I don't have anything. But I will say, I do think, and I think I might be part of the silent majority here who I've tried to watch Severance and I can respect the craft and I hear great things about it. For me, it's so slow that I haven't been able to get through it and I haven't really watched every episode and I don't think I'm probably the only person who hasn't engaged with it in the way that the pit, it was addictive. I couldn't stop watching it. I was like downing screeners every hour, every episode shot in real time in this Pittsburgh hospital.

14:47So yeah, well, I do think Severance, obviously it's beloved and, you know, Brett Lauer won and whatnot. I do think some people find it kind of boring. Chris, you're 100 % right. Severance is like the promise of a meal that you will really enjoy like two to three years from now. And the pit is like, here is a burger. Let's dig in. Like, I think that it just combines the best, like aspects of network television with the best aspects of streaming in a very appealing way. It's propulsive. It's a procedural, but the production values are really good. The acting is really good. Like, I just think that it hits a lot of buttons at a time when, you know, broadcast TV has kind of dwindled into nothing.

15:32It's especially appealing that it's this throwback. Yeah, I can totally understand why it surged. Well, aside from the winners and losers, there were lots of new changes to the show itself. After the break, our review of Nate Bregazzi as the host, our favorite presenters, and more. Stay with us.

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16:51Welcome back to Little Gold Men from Vanity Fair. Let's dig into the show itself. I want to start with our first-time host, Nate Bregazzi. How did he play at home, I guess, is my question for you, Chris and Hillary, because I have heard mixed things. Woo!

17:08Well, I mean, while we're, yeah. Okay, I'm being a little tongue-in-cheek, but it was really, really not good from my critical vantage point. And I'll tell you why. Okay, Nate Bregazzi, a wonderful comedian, he sort of burst onto the scene on Netflix with stand-up specials, and then he hosted SNL, and he had like a really huge hit sketch with Washington's Dream that a lot of dads loved across America. And he's become, you know, a cultural figure in light of that. And so that's wonderful. It's a little bit of a left field choice, right? He seems to be sort of a consensus. You know, he's from the South.

17:44He's very, you know, pork chops and football type of vibe. He's clean. Like, that's one of his big things is that he does not deliver blue jokes. He does not swear. Yes, 100%. Okay. And this is, and my heart is open. You can be whoever you want to be. and host an award show. Okay? But one thing that you have to do is tell jokes and you have to actually tell more than one joke. His only bit the entire night, well, after beginning the entire evening with a reheated version of that Washington Stream sketch about the Emmys, which I thought was pretty funny, but it was, again, you immediately recognize it as a microwaved SNL sketch.

18:23His only joke was this tracker that counted his donation to the Boys and Girls Club of America. He said he was going to donate$100 ,000 to them and that he would take money away if people went above 45 seconds on their speech and he would add money if people went below 45 seconds on their speech. So that's like a fun joke in concept, ha ha ha, gamifying the awards. But that was his only bit the entire night. And he even told Variety that before the awards happened. So it's like, I already knew that joke going into the ceremony. So it wasn't even like a fresh joke. Then the execution of that joke, it just robbed us of seeing any real speeches.

19:03Everybody was so nervous about robbing money from children in need that they really didn't want to go over or go long. And then on the other hand, we have the presenters who can take their sweet time. Jennifer Coolidge is doing her tight vibe. Jennifer Coolidge was not doing a tight vibe. It was a loose seven. It was a loose seven. Ray Romano and Brad Garrett too are filling time at the end. so it's like it's completely weighted in the wrong direction and I'm sorry in the year 2025 if you're watching the Emmys you probably want to see what the speeches are alright you're probably there to see who wins and to see them use their perhaps probably one moment ever on this platform to thank who they want to thank and say what they want to say it was like a cute idea that would have been good for one joke maybe at the beginning and then we moved on but it was the and I please please write in and call me if you told another joke at all throughout the night because I don't remember it, if so.

19:57It just was just such a flop and a fail of an idea that ruined the ceremony from the viewer's standpoint at home. But I, you know, I don't really care that much. So you liked him. What you're saying is you liked him. Yeah. It's great. I mean, I agree basically with everything that you're saying, Chris. I think more globally, there just needs to be some kind of movement toward having awards show hosts who don't think that the very concept of having an awards show is stupid. Like, I think that you can be Nikki Glaser and you can roast celebrities. I think that that's fine, totally above board. But I think that if you don't have some kind of respect for the institution of handing out statues to famous people for, you know, work that isn't very hard, then like, what are you doing here?

20:50I just, if the entire kind of premise of your hosting gig is what I'm like, this is dumb, ha ha, like, look at all these idiots, then that doesn't make me excited that like I'm watching because I want to. Like nobody's forcing anybody to watch an awards show. Like I think that somebody like Conan O 'Brien strikes a really great tone where it's like silly, but it's not mean spirited. And yeah, I think the countdown clock was mean spirited, not unintentionally maybe, But yeah, just really put it a kind of a sour taste over the night. Well, Nate was underprepared. I mean, I think that's the answer.

21:25He didn't have enough material. I mean... Good thing they didn't announce him like several months ago. Yeah, yeah. So much time. I thought he started off strong. I think he has a good sensibility towards him. I agree with you, Hillary. The sort of like being like, I don't watch television and I have no idea who these people are doesn't totally play well in the room, but I think he didn't do it in the way that, like, you know, maybe Ricky Gervais or Joe Coy. Oh, yeah, he's not a Joe Coy. Yeah. Like, there are definitely, there's a spectrum. But he's just puttered out. He ran out of steam. Yeah, I think the Boys and Girls Club tracker bit could have worked if he did it, like, once in the beginning, an update in the middle of the show, and then at the end.

22:12But the whole, like, because, I mean, And you knew that he was not going to take money away from these children in the end. So I think it could have been sort of a light bit. But the way that he depended on it so much. And then it sounds like it was on television during every speech. We only saw it in the room a few times. I think they maybe realized that things were going. That having that timer running behind someone when they're having like maybe the biggest moment of their professional career is extremely unfair to them. So like the emotions it would create within a viewer to like feel bad for this person who's also winning.

22:49It was just so confusing that I, yeah, they should have made that one tiny part of the show, not like the entire show depends on this one bit working because it just really left a sour taste, I think, for a lot of people. It was a really interesting choice too to open with that basically an SNL sketch. then Nate Bargetzi like disappeared to allow Stephen Colbert, CBS homegrown talent, for the next year at least to present the first award. And, you know, Colbert, who got fired over this summer very unceremoniously, set off this big wave of kind of existential angst for network TV and late night talk shows.

23:28But he got this enormous reaction in the room. It kind of seemed like he was there to really start the show. And then after that award presentation, Nate Bargatze reappeared and gave a monologue. Like, the momentum was just really off. I actually thought that worked, surprisingly, because it's like he opened with the sketch, then you had Stephen Colbert, who had such goodwill, then he went into the monologue. So I sort of thought that flow worked. It was just an hour in, we were just recycling the same material. You know which presenter did play very well at home, at least for me, was Jeff Probst.

24:12Yeah, that was the best fit of the night, 100%. That was great. And that was more of what, like, I mean, that's like inside baseball TV for TV's sake. Like, that's what these award shows should be. It's like, we're all here because we like TV. So why don't we reference things that are on TV and have Jeff Probst do, you know, a survivor ceremony when it's two nominees against each other. Like, that is the type of thing that I feel like people would like to see more so than like clutching my pearls, wondering if Dan Gilroy is going to take$20 ,000 away from children. Yeah, for TV, buy TV. I agree.

24:47Well, I think this is going to be a great way to segue into our next segment here because we are going to attempt to share our best ideas for making the Emmys better and getting more people to tune in. So please stay with us. We'll be right back.

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