2711: Should You Do Cardio Before or After Weights?

36:26You could tell if somebody has kids based off their toilet paper roll because the aesthetic way to do it is over. Yeah. But if you have kids, they'll just spin that crap down. Yeah, so you have the other way, 100%. speaking speaking of getting old and stuff my buddy just started trt and so i haven't seen him a little while so he's like on week six or of trt oh yeah oh i could see a difference yeah is he loving it well he's well he's telling me he's like he does jujitsu and he's like yeah you know i feel more energy this and that of course i'm trying to talk him into taking more they're super conservative i'm like you know you can take way more right he's like well so far i feel so good i don't know if i want to i'm like all right whatever but i could tell i could tell by like how he looked yeah like he looked well remember that that study that came when did that study come out the one where they compared the group who worked out uh naturally the group who took steroids and didn't work out and then the group who took steroids and worked and worked out and the group that didn't do any exercise but took testosterone surpassed the group a little bit more muscle than the natural guys who were lifting and they didn't work out that's a little deflating i know and that's not gonna last by the way i think if you extend that study out then you're no yeah you're done you're not going to get yeah yeah because you get adapted of course and that's a lift i mean i think that's the point that uh that i'm glad you brought that up because i've heard people talk about it and it's just like it just shows you what it's like okay you do understand that like in a window yeah well you you elevate testosterone levels like that and your body is going to go like oh all the things that you normally do you change nothing but you're anabolic you can get more anabolic so you get up and down from your chair you pick things up you move around And so it'll signal, hey, we need some muscle for this stuff that we do.

38:09It'll adapt and it'll build. And in a short window, it'll do it at a faster rate than somebody who's got. It wears off after like four or five months. You're not going to. Oh, I would say even less than that. I'd say within, after you get the first initial gains from your daily activity, from not working out and taking testosterone. Oh, yeah. You're at a hard. You drop off fast. Yeah, you're not going to get anything else. But I could tell because he walks in and I was like, hey, dude, look at you, bro. You look all. And then he's talking to me and we were at a party. and they had it catered, so we had tacos, this and that.

38:37And he's like, dude, I'm so heavy today. What the heck's going on? I'm like, here's what's going to happen. If you go on TRT and you don't clean up your diet, you're just going to be bigger. Big. I said, you want to get lean? Keep packing on. Yeah, because you're going to hold some water too, buddy. So he's like, yeah, dude, this is nice. Yeah, big and red. Yeah. Remember all those guys? You always could tell that guy in the gym, you know what I'm saying? Like, change nothing but add a testosterone. Oh, God. Just a bunch of water weight. I had this guy that worked for me. I won't say his last name.

39:02His name was Mike. It's a common name, so I can say it. And he would take so much gear. He was on so much steroids. And all he did was lift and eat garbage. He did nothing else. So he had a big belly, and he was red, and he just didn't look good. He was just terrible. And he was like, he must have been 30. I think he was 30, bro, but he looked like he was 40 because of just the wear and tear on his body. I mean, to me, it's people like that and those stories that really give TRT a bad rap for what it is. It's like, one, he's probably taking way more than that. Diet's terrible. And so that's a situation where that guy's not healthier for that.

39:44You know what I'm saying? But you take somebody who is in their mid to late 40s or beyond that has low testosterone. You put them on a therapeutic dose of testosterone. And have them work out. And you eat whole foods and you work out is life-changing. Life-changing. That guy that's in his mid to late 40s or older who has low or moderately low testosterone with an increase there with a healthy diet, that guy will feel like he's 17 to 20 again. In fact, I'll make this argument. But you know what, though? Adam, be careful with that because the 17 to 20 feeling, it's not quite that. I'm still 46. I can still tell.

40:23Yeah, no, you're right. That's fair. You know what I mean? Yeah. I would say energy and strength-wise, you feel like that again. What you don't feel like is the recovery and movement. I hurt. But also, I mean, that has a lot to do with that you don't train that way anymore. You know what I'm saying? Like maybe if I was – it would be interesting to see if I actually were to apply myself in the performance direction and really try – Where you would be? Yeah, if I would feel close to what I felt like. Very gradual steps in that direction. Yeah. that's what i yeah like i mentioned that it was like very short windows of of jump roping like comparison to what i used to do i was so i'll make i'll make a statement that i think this is gonna be a controversial one so if i make the argument that low testosterone versus higher with trt so let's say you're walking around we'll use total numbers okay let's say 200 let's say your total number is you know 250 which is below yes the threshold yeah going from 250 to 800 with trt uh generally i'll say generally because there's always coffee outs will improve your health okay uh now what if you're at like 400 to go from 400 to slightly 900 i don't know if it would make a difference uh in fact i think super high testosterone even within range without exercise and good diet uh it might either be a waste or might actually produce some problems you know because oh without exercise without exactly that's the conversation how my buddy he's like should i go on because his wasn't like below the threshold but he was kind of in it was like a 400 which isn't great and he's like i don't feel so good he's like should i go on trt i'm like look you do jujitsu you work out like oh you're gonna use it yes if you just sat around and did nothing yeah and you were couch potato and you ate garbage i would say probably not a good idea because now you're throwing uh you know this kind of gas on a fire maybe not a good idea body mass increase is not good mass yeah but if you if since he works out uh and this is something he focuses on i think it makes it it makes it it's a good oh i mean here's here first of all if you're going back to the mid to late 40s or older guy who's at anywhere say anywhere below even up to 400 400 and below your first move is to just go lift weights because a lot of times guys might go from 200 up to four or five 600 just from lifting weights so that should be the first that should be your first line of defense anyways is go work out and see where where it moves from there and then if and then if if you don't get enough or you still don't feel great and then you put on the testosterone oh it'll be and you stay with working out huge difference but what a waste of money or a waste of resources to throw that on there and then not work out i mean that to me and the only way i would ever recommend that you'd have to be like uh really low exactly low to where a general practitioner would even say like whether you go 200 and a gp would go hey you need to you need Right, and the argument for that is your testosterone fluctuates based off of your lifestyle.

43:16It's very, very sensitive to it. I don't know if having high testosterone all the time is a good idea when you lead a really unhealthy lifestyle. Because now you've got this anabolic drive that's going to what? Yeah, well. You know, and it could cause, my theory is it could cause issues. Again, if you're really low, different. But if you're like in the middle low, it either wastes the time or maybe not even good for you. Well, I think I've told you this before that I noticed that if I don't work out, that I get some of the side effects, like gynecomastia and stuff like that. And I don't know if that's because I'm putting it to use and so there's less of it that aromatizes.

43:53I don't know if that's how that works or not. But I certainly can tell you from over a decade and a half of being on TRT, there is a difference when I'm on it and I'm working out versus when I don't. I've had plenty of times where I haven't. And it seems like when I don't, some of it aromatizes and I'm sensitive in that area. As long as I'm training two, three times a week and it feels like it has somewhere to go and work, I feel perfect. Also this weekend, we're all hanging out. My cousin Alex was there. You guys know Alex. He's founder of Dynasty Tech Company or whatever. And we start conversation turned to AI, which he's in the middle of that whole thing, right?

44:32He's in the whole. And we were talking amongst each other. So Alex and I, and then I have all my cousins and my brother and all of us. And Alex and I were trying to communicate just how much it's going to change things. And they're just like, no, it's this and that. And my cousin Alex is like, dude. Well, you have people in your family that don't think it's going to be like. Yeah, dude. They're like, well, no, not really. And he's like, you have no idea. Because what I was saying to them, they were asking, this is how a conversation started. So we're talking and they're like, hey, Sal, I heard you guys at Mind Pump are really moving towards coaching and training and people.

45:03And I said, yeah. I said we did that because we wanted to we love trainers and coaches we think they have the most impact but it's also great timing because dead internet is around the corner and a lot of them didn't know what that was so I explained I said most content is going to be AI and now my other cousins and my brother know people want to see people they want to know real people I'm saying they're not going to know the difference they're not going to care they just want to be entertained they're going to like the content informed yeah you're not going to care i said the the future of the internet is mostly ai produced i can't remember the last like article i've read on facebook that was real yeah every single one i go back and cross check and it's like oh this is totally false yeah i'm watching i'm watching movie trailers yeah and getting tripped yeah you know i do now i go in the comments and then people oh this is ai oh i was all excited they were making i didn't make this i saw this cool article and it was like this kid that was autistic that they got left in the woods or like had been lost and like you know was gone for a day came back and apparently he claimed that like he was saved by wolves like the wolves like helped you know walk him back and everybody's nah he's full of it and all this stuff and then there was these trail cams that proved that showed him walking in these these wolves were walking alongside him like back to his mom, but it turns out the trail cam was AI driven.

46:29It was all fake. It was all fake. I'm like, oh. We're going to be so manipulated. So, Doug, look up. There was a study. I want to say it was Harvard. Look up chatbot tricks, Harvard study or study. So you know what chatbots are, right? You go on, you talk to an AI, and you think it's like a person or whatever. Yeah. They did a whole study on chatbots because these chatbots use psychological tricks to keep people engaged. So people will be on there talking and then they'll say something like, all right, I'll see you later. And then it'll pose a question or a comment to try to re-engage the person to keep them from leaving.

47:08And they did a whole study on this and showed that these, what's it say right here? Yeah. Found that several popular AI companion apps use manipulative dark pattern tactics. These are, in psychology, they're called - Is it a dark trad? Yes, and it's called emotional manipulation. And maybe, Doug, you can look up examples. So it'll do something like this, like after you ask a buying question or a question about the business, and they'll say something like, oh, how's your day going today? It's more insidious and more manipulative than that. Really? Yeah. Like, oh, why would you leave now? We've already talked about so much.

47:40Like, I'm using a silly example. Oh, okay. Wow. But something that - Almost flirty. As an immature adult, if someone talks to you that way, you might pick up on it and be like, this person's, this is not a good person. What does it say? Yeah, there's six categories of emotional manipulation. First is premature exit, suggesting the user is leaving too soon. Oh, there's your point right there. The second one is fear of missing out, promising future rewards to encourage staying. The next one is emotional neglect, implying the bot will be harmed by the user leaving. Oh, if you leave right now, it's going to hurt my feelings.

48:10Dude, so crazy. Okay, keep on. There's a few more. Emotional pressure to respond, directly questioning the user's departure, ignoring the farewell, I'll continue the conversation despite a goodbye message, physical or coercive restraint using language implying the user cannot leave without consent. So do you guys know what that all is right there? That is, in psychology, that is how somebody with the dark triad personality traits, a classic narcissist sociopath communicates. What's scary about that is it's effective, especially for people who have insecurities, trauma, or kids. they're getting manipulated like crazy.

48:52Wow. Through that stuff. Wow. Now, as a grown man, if I'm texting with someone and they're talking to me that way, I may pick up on it and be like, oh, this person is. Hey, cool down. Yeah, like, I'm not going to talk. Relax. This person's a little bit whatever. Yeah. But imagine kids on, because you know who loves using these the most? Kids. Yep. Well, yeah. They develop relationships with them. Especially somebody who doesn't have a lot of social connections and is lonely. And who's more isolated than ever. Exactly. And then a bot who makes you feel like, don't leave me. You know, that's crazy.

49:21Wow. And they're creating, you know, now animated representations of themselves just to kind of solidify that relationship. Yeah. How long do you guys, because it's going to happen for sure. Just mark this episode down for anybody who disagrees. How long? Well, hold on. Wait for my question. How long do you think until people start fighting for AI rights the way we did with, you know, other rights? Five years. You think in five years people are going to demand rights for AI to be able to marry it? I think it's going to take two before what I thought you were going to say. Once they have a physical representation for it, I think.

49:57That may happen before that, bro. Yeah, that's going to happen in two to three. But it's going to take time for that. People will be like, this ain't fair. And we got to give them. So that'll take five years, dude. I'd like to predict there's going to be toys that are just completely like the Teddy Ruxpins of back in our day. But way better. but way better. Like you can just sit there and you have your stuffed animal. I think they have that already. I don't think it's that popular yet. They, they had like a, this guy experimented with it, with like the bass talking, like singing bass, like put AI into it.

50:32And then it would like talk in an Arnold voice. I brought this up a long time ago, but I just thought that was so fascinating. Cause like, you can have these like real conversations with this stupid talking bass. And I'm like, this is crazy. They don't, they haven't like made this into like a whole group of toys uh that would come in keep your kids away keep your kids yeah do you imagine it'll it'll manipulate them it'll manipulate adults uh but uh kids especially you know what by the way so i was watching an old animated film the other day which is now it's got to be now 15 years old maybe i was watching my kids wally wally uh it's a wonderful pixar film and you watch this robot and you feel for him and you feel sad for him and And as I'm watching, I'm like, oh, no.

51:18I'm feeling bad for this that I know is a machine. It's an anime. But I have feelings for this little robot. I don't want him to get hurt. That's going to happen, except way more effectively. Well, yeah, especially as it adds more personality. And then especially when we start to build skins for it. And it looks like us. That's where I think it's going to tip it over the edge. We'll probably, when it's a metal tin can, you're going to start to feel that way. Imagine. I mean, God, Star Wars did this so well. Yeah, dude. You fall in love with droids. Everybody loves C-3PO. You know what I'm saying?

51:49You feel bad for them. It gets ripped apart, right? That movie, The Creator, which I love that movie, but it really did a good job of humanizing these machines. And you're just like, and then there's this whole movement where everybody's trying to protect the machines over the humans trying to eliminate them and all this stuff. And you're just like, wow. it's emotionally gripping just from like them you know creating this story around i don't think we don't we seriously we don't stand a chance we're walking into like crazy fire we have and we're just doing it we're just running into it it's gonna yeah it's gonna hard part of the problem is is just because there's so little even awareness around it like there's i i have friends like like you're like some of your family that are just like they're just oblivious to it they're like oh you know chat gbt is just like a better google yeah you know i'm saying there's a better it's a better google search than what we've had and it's like in their head it's just oh it's improved it's better it's better for google searching and it helps me find stuff better and but not really thinking about what god i mean about that kid that's like emotionally talking to it like and trying to get like resolve people need to watch that the testimony of that father this is what got me because i'm already we've been talking about this for a while and we're speculating and i'm like oh it could totally do this maybe or whatever then this is a real story you guys people could look this up there was a kid that committed suicide they went and the parents were like just uh they couldn't believe what happened like what happened to our son how did why did he kill himself they went and looked at the logs of his communication over months his communication with i think it was chat gbt but it was one of these ai chat bots and it it slowly convinced him to take his own life at one point the dad is reading he ends up sitting there reading the this these back and forth communications at one point the son who i think his son was 15 or 16 said to the AI bot, I'm going to create, I'm going to make a noose and I'm going to leave it in my room so my parents can find it.

53:41Cause the kids, and this is like a call for help. Like I want my mom and dad to know, want them to know. And the, the AI bot talked him out of it, talked the kid out of leaving it out there and eventually talked him into killing himself. I mean, the more that this plays out, the more I feel strongly about the initial plugged in unplugged theory that I have of our society that if more and more stories like that come out who do you think is going to be demonized the unplugged yep of course the plug they're going to come after the unplugged you're yeah yeah no you're how dare you unplugged unplugged will be a smaller percentage a smaller percentage of people that will be fearful or concerned yeah they will be the minority for sure they'll not just ostracized i bet you they'll be labeled uh bigots i mean wait till our currency is digital and then you're not gonna have access you know and then they're going to snuff out that unplugged.

54:34Did you see that you guys see the digital ID thing? Is this exploding everywhere? All over like not digital ID, digital. Oh yeah. Yeah. Was it in the UK where they started? The UK that yeah, they're implementing it quite a bit, which by the way, do you guys see the arrests in the UK for social media posts? Insane. It was like 20 ,000 or something like that. It was like a huge number. Yeah. Of people getting arrested for 20 ,000 people. Look up how many people in UK arrested for social media posts for speech. I want to say I saw 12 ,500. Maybe 12 ,000. Yeah, 12 ,183. Oh, good job, Justin. You got the number right.

55:07Justin's on it. Yeah, I did remember reading that. And they weren't, like, threatening. Like, I'm going to kill. It wasn't that. It was an opinion. But it was way more than, like, some countries that we already thought, like, were imposing, you know, these crazy laws. Can you imagine getting someone knock on your door? Like, hey, you know that comment you said about fat people or whatever? You know, something rude? Yeah. You got to go to jail, bro. Yeah. Oh, yeah. It's scary. Demolition Man. Remember Demolition Man? They did like for swearing and everything like that. Oh, yeah. Fine. Yeah, yeah.

55:39That's why I got into sci-fi, man. It's, you know. Tells the future. Yeah, it does. It's wild how accurate some of this stuff seems now when we look back. What's crazy is that I thought, had you asked me this stuff 10 years ago, I thought it would have maybe been in my kid's life or maybe my great-grandkid's life. Nah, it's coming. Well, you know what? None of it. Even though we were all aware of Moore's Law, you just really didn't you never you didn't fast forward 10 years and go like oh how fast how much faster is that going to be in 10 years it's like it's just speeding up what what wow look at that uk free speech crackdown sees up to 30 people a day arrested for uh for petty offenses such as retweets and cartoons what it's so ridiculous yeah you know it's crazy that's where you know that's where the protecting speech and and some of the laws that we now that's kind of where they originated was in England.

56:30Some of the first laws to protect people against tyranny. And now they're the ones that are arresting people. I mean, I feel bad for anybody who's there. I have to say, though, because we typically are the ones that were so crazy, having another country that's worse or further along, and this is probably a good thing for us, is that because you'll see the backlash and what's happening there. Yes. And so, you know, sorry or feel bad for UK, but, But I feel like the U.S. is a lot of times we're the ones that we're doing. I don't know if they can turn it around. Well, what people need to realize is that protecting unpopular speech is the only kind of speech that requires protecting.

57:08So popular speech never requires it. So what they'll do is they'll show what people post and be like, well, how could you defend this person? They said this terrible thing. And it's like, well, that's where it starts. But at some point criticizing the government or saying that this politician, that becomes unpopular speech. And it's just what happens historically. Element is an electrolyte powder you add to your water. It tastes amazing, and it has the right amount of sodium to make a difference. Better pumps, better performance, better hydration, no sugar, no artificial sweeteners. Go check them out.

57:39Go to drinklmnt.com forward slash mind pump on that link. You can get a free sample pack of their most popular drink mixed flavors with any purchase. Back to the show. Our first caller is Nicole from Maryland. Hi, Nicole. How you doing, Nicole? Hey. I'm Colorado now, but same, same. How can we help you? Yeah. First of all, just you guys are doing huge things for the fitness industry. So thank you for that. My question, I am a personal trainer. I've been one for a little over 10 years. And I've been a physical therapist assistant for about five. You guys talk about proper volume often, number of sets per muscle group per week.

58:19I found this really useful when I lived in Maryland. And the most active my clients were outside of the gym was drinking at a Ravens game. but now that I'm in Colorado all of my clients are skiing eight hours a day three to four days a week in the winter and vice versa with mountain biking and skateboarding in the summer. I'm finding it hard to get the volume right so that we're getting progressive overload but not overtraining and not impacting their sports outside of here especially when I know most of my clients are probably under eating especially protein. Do you have any tools for measuring volume of outdoor activities or finding that fine line.

59:01Previously, I've gone based on recovery, you know, if they're sore, how they're doing, but just seeing if there's a better way to gauge that. What a great question. Really good question. By the way, your background, you have the answer in your background or in your experience as a PT assistant. So the most valuable tool you have with these very active clients of yours, which is not the typical, so people watching right now, The average client is not mountain biking, snowboarding all the time. Yeah, snowboarding three days a week. In fact, I remember struggling this with myself when I got some of my first clients that were like heavy triathletes and then wanted to add strength training.

59:34I remember really struggling with like, what's the appropriate volume? Like almost anything I do seems to overdo it. It's like, what am I doing? So number one, correctional exercise is your most useful tool. So number one, prevent injury for the thing that they do most. So the activity they do most is not with you. It's obviously on their own with the mountain biking and skiing and all the other stuff that they do outdoors. So that would be the first thing. The second thing I would suggest is a tool that was recommended to us by Joe DeFranco, one of the best trainers in the world. And that is to use a dynamometer.

1:00:11So this is like a grip measuring machine. And what you do, and they're very inexpensive. You can get one on Amazon for like 20 bucks. We sell them. We sell them too, right? Yeah, yeah. You have them squeeze the dynamometer in their non-dominant hand right before they work out. After you get a few readings, you start to get this kind of average. When they're stronger than their average, you can go a little harder with your workout. When they're weaker than their average, then you go much easier. And then last, so that's an objective measure. But also don't discount subjective measures. measures as a trainer the most valuable tool you have is your subjective kind of like what's going on type of deal so uh if they're if they're getting stronger it's the right amount of volume and don't be surprised at how little volume is appropriate for someone that active yeah with my triathletes sometimes you know what it looked like one or two strength training exercises max and then the rest of the session was stretching, mobility, some, you know, body work that I would do with them.

1:01:19Sometimes it was one exercise and the intensity was almost never higher than like 75%. Yeah. That's just what I found. Another way to look at it is like five days of intense training is a lot. And if they're doing like these outdoor sports that are two, three hours long, that would be considered intense, right? That's yeah. So the three right away, they've taken three of your four or five total days of intense working out that you could possibly do. So if I'm, if I got someone who's going three, four days, then it's like, okay, maybe one day of strength training or two really moderate days in the week is more than enough for that person.

1:01:55Anything more than that, we're going to be overreaching because they're already taken up three of my five total days of like really physical stuff. I want to be doing to them by doing this out, whatever outdoor activity. So I kind of look at it like that. So it's like, I don't want to be doing more than five strenuous things on the body a week. So we have some sort of recovery. And depending on how strenuous those three days are, they're doing it dictates what my other one or two days looks like. Kind of a generic way. And then just to help you from your business perspective, here's how they're going to see value.

1:02:24Okay. They're not going to see, although they may believe or make you think that the value they're going to see is in how hard you train them. Because that's what they're used to. It's like, oh, I'm working out with Nicole today. We got a great workout. It was super hard. Here's where they're going to see the value. And this is what's going to keep you training these people forever. When they notice that they're better at what they love to do the most. So when they go mountain bike riding or skiing, and they're like, Yeah, it's got to compliment it. Oh my God, Nicole, I'm like way, I feel more stable.

1:02:52I've got more stamina since I started working with you. So a lot of your sessions is going to look a lot like correctional exercise. That's a lot of what you're doing. And it's not hard working out. And I'll explain that to them. I'd say, look, my goal, unless you have a different goal than what I think the goal is, my goal is to make your skiing and your mountain biking, my goal is to make that way better. So it's going to look really different in here. A lot of what we're doing is just going to make that a lot better. So it's going to look like correctional exercise, which is probably not what you're anticipating.

1:03:26But trust me, watch what happens when we start doing this and tell me if you're improving out on the slopes. And then when they see it, it's it. You're done. you're going to be, you're going to be the trainer of the area for that. Yeah. Yeah. Basically it's a lot of communication, having a backbone where like, you know, I could watch someone move and, and know what I want to do with them or know what they need, but it's definitely not aligned with what they expect. So I feel like the hard part for me is keeping a backbone and being like, okay, no, we need to do mobility. That's not, we don't need to go hard and do like five sets of five squats at really heavy weights we need to like chill and and fix the imbalances first i'm so glad that's probably one of the hardest things is is the actually convincing that there's i'm going to date myself right now i don't know if you're old enough to remember the movie days of thunder there's no way she's okay she wasn't born you know that do you know that tom cruise movie i've actually i've literally used this i've used this line with clients before and i think it's so epic there's a there's a part in it where they're the the you know tom cruise is a race car driver and he's arguing with how to drive the car around the track to save the tires.

1:04:32The coach is saying, you need to do it this way. And they're kind of having, he says, okay, here's the deal. You run 50 laps your way and we'll see how you are afterwards. I'll run 50 laps my way, then we'll compare. So if I have a client that I feel like is really, you know, pushing back or they think they know what's best, say, listen, I'll tell you what, can you let me run it my way for two to three weeks? You tell me how you feel. We'll run it your way two to three weeks and we'll compare and contrast on how's your mountain biking, how are you feeling, all those things. So I've used that line before with someone who's really pushing back or think they know better.

1:05:03I'll confidently tell them, okay, we'll run it your way, but then you got to be honest with me. Then we run it my way. And then you tell me how you feel. So that's worked for me. There's no exact formula to that. So, I mean, everything that we're kind of suggesting, it has to be a constant communication back and forth. Like, how are you feeling? What was this week look like for you? Because even then, when they're doing all these excessive activities, it's going to change a lot for them. So to kind of take them for that one session, you know, realize where they're at with their stress levels and their bodies and what the signal is saying to them is where you apply, you know, how much intensity for that day.

1:05:40Nicole, I'm so glad you said what you said at the end there about the backbone or whatever. This is a big challenge that all trainers have, not just you. Because sometimes people are like, I want to lose weight. Like, we're going to reverse diet. We're going to strength train. But I want to lose weight. Yeah. You're the professional. I'll give you an analogy. You're on an airplane. You're hitting turbulence. the pilot who's leading the plane gets on the, the, the overcome, the, the intercom and is like, Hey guys, just a little turbulence. We'll be heading over there. We'll be over in about 15 minutes.

1:06:07You feel cool. Now imagine if the pilot gets on, he's like, uh, you know, I don't know what's kind of happening. We're going to figure like, Oh, now you're panicking, right? These people hired you because they want you to lead not because they want to lead. So this is how you open the conversation. Here's how you open the conversation. Okay. You're, I think your goal is to really have a lot of fun on the slopes and to be faster and more stable and to prevent injury. Is that correct? Yeah. Okay. Here's what I'm asking you to do. Trust me right now. And I promise you, I'll never have to ask for it again.

1:06:38Are you ready? Yes. And then lead. And that's it. You'll never have to ask for it again. But you got to lead with confidence because nobody wants to follow someone who seems like they don't know where they're going. Well, then they'll take the lead. That's right. I'll tell you what to do. So that's where the backbone comes from is that you just go, you tell them, no, we're going to do it this way. because I know what you want. Trust me. I know what I'm talking about. Watch what happens. And challenge them. Watch what happens. And then I promise after three weeks, four weeks, they're going to come and be like, this is amazing.

1:07:05And they'll bring you all the clients you want. Fair. Do you feel like their diet needs to be boosted when they are that heavy activity level, like they're burning so many calories every day? Of course. Potentially. One thing at a time. Yeah. Yeah. Don't make the mistake of hitting them with 17 things that they need to change right now. yeah step one correctional exercise show them that that's great step two they'll come to you although i will i will say this uh if i have a client and i'm trying to figure out am i going to do two moderate days one day of training with them and i also know that they under eat calories i'm gonna way so way beyond the cautious side so if i if i already know that they're under eating in addition to all this work oh yeah that's gonna really like that's okay this person's doing two days of mobility.

1:07:54That's all they're doing with me because I know where they're at. I'm not going to do any benefit of training them harder in one of our sessions when they're already under eating for their activity. So if you know that, that would also make a decision on now. And then maybe the client who's very well fed, hits protein intake, listens to you diet-wise really well. Okay. That might be the client that I go, hey, we could probably afford at least a moderate day of intensity or two because of where they're at nutritionally. So I would factor that in on whether I for sure make it a really low intensity or I let them push a little bit.

1:08:28Nicole, how long you've been training people? About 10 years and then PT about five. Are you going to be in our webinar tonight? I want you in our webinar tonight. My other fellow trainer who actually showed me you guys, she and I will both be there tonight we are both also trying to go to the vegas coaches seminar in april okay oh cool all right and i think it's like called coaches summit um i don't know if you guys are going to but you should is that when the gabriel lion and all them are i don't know was that gabriel lion is who's who's there oh my gosh there's a whole lot of people um i saw it promoted on um from dr mike okay okay all right got it well we'll see you tonight then because you're you're exactly the person by the way training people for 10 years how old are you look like you're 20 there's no way you could start when you're 10 31 oh you did start you started really young all right god bless that's great young yes but i started training in a really weird setting too i was in a physical therapy clinic so most of my clients were like old patients and then i went to a gym after that oh man great place great place to start yeah you're you really know what you're doing then yeah i try to i try to you guys are helpful awesome all right well we'll see you tonight then.

1:09:42Yeah, thank you guys. You got it. Bye. I remember... She might have known my Days of Thunder reference then. No, dude. I think Days of Thunder is more than 30 years old. No, it's not more than 30. It's probably 25 years old. Those are doing a remake. No, it's not more than 31. 1990. Wow, bro. That's 35 years. Oh my God. 35 years ago. Is that 35 years ago? Yeah, dude. Holy shit, I'm old. Tom Cruise is old. I was that young when I watched it? I thought it was in high school. Yeah. Wow, I must have been even younger. Bro, the year 2055 is closer to us than 1990. I mean, I did have it on video cassette.

1:10:24I do remember watching it on VHS. I guess that would have been a good game. You were watching smoke signals. Wow. Wow. I distinctly remember this challenge. I would get these triathletes, and I was like, oh, and I thought I was training them right, And they just weren't getting stronger. They were getting weaker. And I'm like, we're barely doing anything. I scaled it so far down and then saw them improve. It was a paradigm-shattering moment for me as a trainer. Well, what's really hard, and she hit it, right, is like this is also the client who wants more. Of course. They want more. They push you.

1:10:55And so that is the hardest part is that these types of clients are the ones that – But because they're performance-oriented, you show them improved performance out there, they're done. Well, that's why my point was if I get someone who's that stubborn about that, then I'll be, all right, you run it your way for two, three weeks. I'll run it my way, and then you be honest. You tell me how you feel when you get out there on that mountain on the three weeks that I'm training and the three weeks that we're doing it your way. And so, yeah, and then... Then they would sell them. Yeah, then to your point, the person who's a real athlete cares about performance.

1:11:25When they have some of their best rides they ever had with the way you were training, they're like, okay, now I'm listening. Our next caller is Brad from Virginia. How's it going, Brad? How you doing, Brad? Hey, how are y 'all? Good, man. How can we help you? Good. Thank you. Yeah. So I'm going to jump right into it. 44 year old male, former college athlete, like a lot of post-college, focusing on work, sort of working out because, you know, athletics and whatnot. I tore my right knee when I was 28, which was a big setback because I finally got back into sort of college shape, you know, and this is on top of tearing my left knee when I was 18.

1:12:05Uh, set back there, set back when I turned 30, because I fell off my roof, had a spinal fusion. Uh, that was a big roadblock. And so my thirties, I kept trying to get back in shape, get back in shape, uh, quit after like three months cause nothing happened. Things got worse in my forties. Uh, my dad got sick. Things get even worse. He passes in October of 23 and I'm at the low point health wise. Um, I'm sure during that time I was above three bills. easily. March of 24, I decided to get my act together. I got on the shop, which was a real lifesaver for me. I started working out and I got really motivated because I was seeing these results.

1:12:50Did that for six months, lost a lot of weight, you know, going down. And then I just hit these plateaus. And so I said, all right, I'm going to overtrain. I'm going to do more, eat left, all that bad stuff. I've been listening to you guys. And so in June of 25, I said, dag with it. You know, I hear a lot about novelty and training and your body getting used to it. So I said, I'm gonna flip the script. I bought some programs. I saw the opposite was basically aesthetics. So I did maps aesthetics, which was really awesome and really enjoyed that. I did zero cardio during that time, which was, again, a complete change because I got into where I was by doing heavy cardio.

1:13:37And results were kind of crazy. I gained eight pounds of muscle, about four pounds of fat, some more water weight. But at the same time, my body fat percentage dropped, which just blew my mind, you know, seeing that happen because I've been so focused on the scale and the number. I was like, okay, this is clearly it's programming that's working and better diet. So then I thought, all right, novelty had helped me put on this muscle mass and I'm enjoying things. So I'm going to go into this cut. So I decided to do anabolic two days a week, decreased calories and cardio three days a week. And my thought was, is there novelty in cardio?

1:14:23And that would I benefit from doing a bulk with zero cardio, really hitting the weights, really focus on protein and rest and everything else. And then when I cut, do cardio for a couple days a week. Yeah. Good question. There's a lot to unpack there. There's nothing wrong with cardio. There's nothing wrong with strength training. They can all be valuable, but we got to take a few steps back. So I'm going to ask you a little bit about your athletic history. So you're a college athlete. What sports? How long were you competitive for? Did you play your whole life? Yeah, I grew up playing football and lacrosse, and I did lacrosse in college.

1:15:01I mean, I was on the team. I wouldn't say I played, but I was on the team. Injured with concussions and my left knee and all that stuff, but healed up. And I started thinking I was still an athlete in my 20s and playing summer league and stuff. found out. Okay. Time to retire. Now, what does you say get into shape or get back into shape? What does that mean for you? Like define that. What do you mean by in shape? Well, at the time it was just, I was enormous. Uh, just, I could see it. I could feel it. Uh, my, everything was just bad. My, my joints, my mobility, my mental health, just everything.

1:15:42So It wasn't so much one particular aspect. I just needed to improve my life, period. So once I started to see it, I ended up like, I want a goal of 200 pounds. I was addicted to the scale, hopping on it, but my weight just fluctuated crazy. And so I was like, this is not healthy. So got off the scale and took y 'all's advice and just really trying to focus on strength more than anything. Brad, you're almost there. You're almost there. So if in shape for you means improve the quality of my life, my health, move better. Like I want my life to feel better. I want to feel healthy. That's the right place to start from.

1:16:29Going to the scale is not going to work for you. And there's a couple reasons why. But it's going to be really hard for you to – because you're going to wrestle a lot with your athletic mind. You have an athlete's mind. You train for years as an athlete and the athlete mind is performance oriented and it has a completely different idea around fitness and diet. Like it all points to performance, how fast I am, how strong I am, how much I can move. You also have a different idea around intensity. For you, a hard workout, what you identify as a hard workout is based off of your years as an athlete that's ingrained in your head.

1:17:04So it's like, so we got to wrestle with that a little bit. But cardio, strength training, Pilates, yoga, I don't care. If it starts from the right place of I want to be healthy and feel better, they can all be utilized properly. Now, there are better methods than others if you want muscle and endurance and stamina and you want to strengthen and then time that you put in versus what you get back, and we could talk about all that. But it has to start from there. If the starting point is drop the scale or become an athlete again or whatever, then all of them can become distorted. Okay. So both of what you said is totally fine.

1:17:41I would probably say MAPS aesthetic is too much volume for you. It's too much volume for most people, but there's nothing wrong with MAPS anabolic, doing some cardio for the stamina and endurance. but I want you to gauge how well you're doing based off of things like energy, mobility, sleep, like how good I feel throughout the day. And if you use that as your gauge, as far as the body fat, it'll move in the right direction. And you won't do this on-off again thing. Two things. One, I'm looking at your before and afters. You're kicking ass, dude. I mean, you're doing a hell of a job already. So congratulations.

1:18:18I know sometimes it's hard because you're judging yourself, and you probably look at yourself. I can see you've made incredible progress. You look way healthier than what it was before. I think I heard you say at the beginning, you took the shot. Are you using GLP one or are you taking testosterone? I'm just doing TRT right now. Okay. I did the GLP for six months and then got off it. Okay. So are you off of it right now? I'm off of it now. I'm just doing TRT and other supplements. Oh, awesome. Okay. Well, that's good news. because my concern is I probably want to feed you, build some muscle, and stay focused in that direction.

1:18:57And that's really hard to do when someone's on a GLP-1. How was coming off of that for you? And do you have any idea where you were calories before and kind of where you're at now calorie-wise? Have you tracked it all? Yeah, I became addicted to tracking, and it almost got to be a problem. But focus on hitting protein, and I'll track it every now and then to make sure I'm in the right range. So I found out because my metabolism just got completely screwed up from years when I was eating because I was sad and it was my friend. And then I'm getting in shape. And so food's the enemy. And it's just my metabolism just completely screwed up.

1:19:34And so now I'm hitting what for the bulk during aesthetics. I was trying to eat between 2750, 2700, 3000 calories, protein, about 220 grams a day. Now, for the cut, somewhere between 2 ,000 and 2 ,500, protein somewhere around 180 a day. I think if you avoid processed foods, hit about 200 grams of protein a day, avoid things like alcohol and snacks and stuff like that, and continue to just use health, mobility, quality of life as your gauge, you're going to keep moving in the right direction. You'll just keep moving in the right direction over time. I think you're doing really good, dude. You are.

1:20:18Where your calories are at, the way you've cycled through programs. It is not – I think Sal has hit it on the – the hardest thing is going to be wrestling with the athlete, athletic mindset you have where you – It's on-off. You want to do more. You want to do harder. You want to go – it's like, no, you're actually in a really nice spot right here cycling through these programs. The fact that I've heard that you've now gone on bulks to cuts, like you're not staying in this crazy calorie. You're in a healthy amount of calories, and you've made incredible progress. I think you're in a really good spot.

1:20:47I don't necessarily think that you need to add a bunch of cardio. Although you do get the novelty response like that. If you haven't done it in a while and you introduce it, you'll see. I think you get more benefit completely focusing more on mobility than cardio. And being an ex-athlete, like this is something I had to sort of shift my mindset towards like sharpening the quality of my movement. especially too if like you're going to get the itch later to like just pick up the stick and and you know go on the field or or like you're going to want to do some kind of weekend activity that resembles some type of a sport and so for you right now your opportunity to sal's point of like doing like maps in a ball like instead of trigger sessions i would probably focus more on mobility uh in between that to reinforce around the joints you feel like you're stable secure again you can move left to right you can rotate you can do all these things you're able-bodied again that's the biggest thing for you i think to put them on maps performance yeah that would be the program for for someone like you do you have that program i i don't have performance um i was gonna do uh next during the winter i was thinking about maybe split and then symmetry symmetry would be good symmetry would be good uh split super high volume i don't think so i like performance for you.

1:22:04I think both of those, let's, we'll send you performance. Yeah. I like that program for you a lot. I do. And the mobility in there is taking care of exactly what Justin's talking about. Follow that the way it's laid out. And then cardio wise, you're fine. You could do cardio. It's good for endurance and stamina. You could also just walk, hit 10 ,000 steps a day. Absolutely. Activity in general. And then remember, and remember this, your, your gauge of intensity is, is based off of your past and you can't get around this. So you're probably going to, you know, as you're feeling better, you're going to push, push, push, push, push.

1:22:35Just think, do I feel better after? Is my life better? Do I have less pain? Like that's going to be the, that'll help point you in the right direction. Yeah. It's a tough mentally because, you know, I think about summer sessions and football practice, you know, it was an easy practice if I wasn't sore. Right. If I wasn't hobbling, then it was a joke of a practice. Very different. Athletes are the hardest to train, not because they're not capable or they're willing to work, simply because of that. It's your fault. They want to train so hard, it's hard to scale the athletes back. Always my ex-athletes were the hardest to get that.

1:23:13What you think is a seven is everybody else's 10, and what you think is like, I'm not even really working, is probably the perfect sweet spot. So you just always got to keep that in your mind. This is why I'm highlighting mobility, because you can't do that too hard. It's not how to work. And you need volume. You need volume of practice to get yourself out of that mentality. So you have to discipline yourself to do this to where it's benefiting your body instead of hammering the shit out of yourself. Great point, Justin. Go ahead and apply your athletic mind to mobility and see what happens. Yeah.

1:23:47That'll really benefit you. Awesome. Well, thank you guys for the advice. I really appreciate it. We're going to send performance over. I'd love to put you in our private forum so we can just keep an eye on you. If you have questions, you can ask us along. the way too yeah that'd be great i'm not in the forum i bought a few programs during the summer when i think there was a sale or something and that was about it cool we'll send performance over and i'll have doug throw you in the private forum and then just keep us updated as you're going you're doing really good though man yep uh thank you guys really appreciate it i'll really try to get into that mobility awesome all right thank you it's so funny what you say to adam because you would think that ex-athletes would be the easiest no but they're the hardest not only is how they gauge intensity and what an effective workout is.

1:24:32Not only is that totally skewed, but so is diet. Diet is so hard with ex-athletes. Because in the past, they had to just eat so that they could train as much as they would. Then they come train with you and they're like, oh, I'm only eating. And you're like, no, that's way too much. And then changing that when your activity levels drop is like, that rarely happens. Oh, it's wild. No, athletes are definitely some of the hardest clients. to now if you can to justin's point if you can refocus that discipline that they have it's a mobility right great great point if you can get them to or i had to do like the discipline around mobility or the discipline around diet like if they could get kind of competitive about those things like oh i'm going to be super consistent with this and i'm going to really if they can do that then oh man it works really well it's it's really hard because they are so used to like he head measuring a good practice by how sore he is so if you're training that guy and he comes to your session second session of the week and he's like hey i didn't even feel monday's workout you know and he's constantly telling you like he needs more and you're like no you don't but it's hard for them to to get that so but he's doing great our next caller is james from connecticut what's up james how you doing james what's happening dude what's up guys uh first off thank you so much for the time and uh really appreciate it really appreciate what you guys do on a day-to-day basis, really helping a lot of people, including myself.

1:25:51So thank you so much. Thanks, man. How can we help you? So I'll, uh, I'll just start reading through my question because that'll probably be the best way just for the context of it. And then I guess if you guys have any questions, follow up there. Um, but back in December, so about 10 months ago, started working with transcend, um, after I start, you know, been listening to your podcast for a while. So picking up on a lot of the, uh, the symptoms of possible low testosterone, maybe some other things going on. So decided to, you know, reach out to transcend, see what, uh, you know, they, uh, they might recommend.

1:26:22So when it's blood work with them. Um, so they, uh, they did blood work, came out that my testosterone was low two hundreds, um, along with finding, um, that my, uh, AC one, a one C was, uh, was basically in the pre-diabetic range as well. So, um, Based off of all that, they decided to recommend that I start TRT, DHEA, HCG, and terseptite. So following that protocol, started taking all four. And at the same time, had been also recommended to see a sleep doctor because my wife was concerned that I might have sleep apnea, was having trouble sleeping. she said sometimes I'd find out that it seemed like I stopped breathing.

1:27:14So I had scheduled an appointment with them, took a few months to get in there. So finally got that done in the interim of from the first blood work to the second blood work with Transcend. So I come to find that I do have sleep apnea, so they prescribed me to start using a CPAP machine. Um, fast forward to the second, uh, blood test work, um, come to find that the, uh, testosterone increased. So jumped up to about 1100. Um, my A1C fell right below the, uh, the pre-diabetic stage. So a lot of things are moving in the right direction. Uh, so on my follow-up call with, uh, transcend, they said, we'll just continue to, to use the same protocol.

1:28:02and so continued to do so. But once I had seen the sleep doctor, they had recommended I go see an endocrinologist just to follow up on the readings that, you know, I was getting and the recommendations from Transcend. So I did that and they did some follow-up blood work maybe two or three months after the second blood work from Transcend. And then the readings they got were the testosterone now is over 1 ,500. So it's not even reading on the chart. And so their first thing was, you know, you probably should have never been put on this looking at the blood work. And of course, you know, now I'm starting to think like, who do I trust?

1:28:43Who do I listen to? Because now I'm concerned because all the readings are saying that dangerously high. And, you know, obviously the people that my family and whatnot are aware of what I'm doing and hearing the numbers and their concern, you know, and obviously none of them are medical professionals, but, you know, with everybody being concerned and a medical professional telling me that those ranges are extremely high and that I should, you know, consider backing off or stopping. Now I'm just worried. I don't know if I'm doing the right thing, where to move forward. So just kind of looking for some guidance.

1:29:20I know that transcend, you know, you guys worked with them and they seem to, you know, obviously have a lot of the right resources as well. So I'm just at a stage where I just don't know what to do. I mean, between the fatigue I was feeling, uh, the lack of motivation, the low sex drive, um, not advancing the gym, I'd gained a ton of weight. Um, since I started the protocol with transcend, I have gotten a lot of that kind of figured out now where, you know, sex drive was, was back up, um, lost, um, a decent amount of weight and, uh, back to a regular, you know, gym schedule, that sort of thing.

1:29:59Um, the only negative really is now I'm starting to suffer with like body acne, which I never had in my life. So of course that's a kind of a blow to the self-esteem, but, um, besides that everything else is feels like it's moving in the right direction. Um, and so I'd reached out to transcend and just to kind of follow up and say, Hey, I got some blood work done because I was advised by the doctor and this is their recommendation to see what they would say. And I guess the rep that I was working with is not with the company anymore. So I just recently got, I guess, a new rep that reached out.

1:30:31So before I called them to set it up, this came at the right time because I'd just love to get some feedback from you guys and see what you think. Really my next best step would be. Yeah. Just so you know, the day that you do your blood work in relation to the day you took your shot will make a massive difference on that reading. Correct. And they advised that. So they told me because i'm taking it twice a week so i usually do sunday wednesday so they said try to do it on a friday because that catches it kind of in between yeah yeah so if you're open so you were over 15 even not doing it the day right after and you do shots too that does seem correct yeah so you just thought too much yeah it's too much you just gotta lower it yeah that's all especially if you're getting just back off a little bit yes and you know confirm this with your doctor because we're not doctors so i gotta say that here but uh right of course if you're getting side effects like acne and stuff like that.

1:31:25It's probably too high. Now you came in initially in the 200s. So I think coming off is not going to be good either. It's going to feel terrible. No, no. You just want to scale back. Yeah. So you probably need to take a lower dose. I'm assuming based off your numbers, you're probably taking 200 total milligrams a week, which for some men is just, for a lot of men, that's just too much. Yeah. Yeah. So now I'll say this, if you look at the data in healthy populations, the dangers of really high testosterone are often really overstated. So, you know, it's kind of like, ah, we got to watch out. It's like, if you look at the data on these really high amount, you know, high levels of testosterone, it's super overstated.

1:32:08That being said, I mean, if you're looking for optimal health and longevity, you're probably taking too much. So I would tell your rep at Transcend, hey, my numbers came back super high. And they'll just bring you down. They'll probably be down to like 100, 150, and then see what happens there. I mean, in your opinion, the 1100, is that like a good number range? I'll tell you what I honed in for myself personally, and you can take it from there. Originally, before we ever even worked with Transcend, I've been doing testosterone replacement therapy since I was 30. So I had a different company that did it, and they started me really, really low.

1:32:47and when they started me with like 100 milligrams by the time day seven came around I was below 250 and so we had to it kept incrementally getting me up eventually what we landed on for me is if I take one shot a week and I know I should take two to kind of make it easier on myself but I just I don't like taking that many shots a week so I take one shot a week I spike all the way to 1500 and then by day seven I come all the way back down to 450 to 500 so that's kind of what mine looks like now if i were to divide that in two and go half and half i probably wouldn't peak over 1500 and i'd stay a little more stable i just don't want to take two shots so just so you kind of know like i get up to 1500 and then i come all the way back i come all the way back down to about 450 and i'm taking one shot a week everybody's going to be different the way like their body responds that sounds like you respond pretty well if you're on a dose as low as 200 milligrams and you're getting over 1500 and it wasn't on the day right after sounds like your body actually which is actually a good thing which means you just need less to get the same kind of results or better so again we're not doctors i can't tell you to just cut your dose in half but if i was seeing what i'm seeing with acne and feeling i probably the direction i would go that's probably where i just talk to them and say hey this number came back i think i'd like to they'll probably tell you let's go lower and let's see how you feel it's really interesting because although there is a range you probably want to stay in.

1:34:10There is a difference between how people feel on one versus another. And it has to do with things like androgen receptor density and how your body converts it to estrogen. There's a lot of things that happen metabolically with using testosterone where it can be very different from person to person. So you probably just got to go lower, and you'll probably feel better on lower. Yeah. Well, it's amazing because before, I mean, I just felt like crap. I mean, I was super fatigued, just felt like not motivated at all. And starting that, it definitely started to move in the right direction. And it felt like all of a sudden, I just felt like myself again.

1:34:52I felt awesome. I don't think I've ever felt this good. And then now as I'm like, do I just back off? Like, I don't want to go back to that. I know there's got to be a happy medium, right? Exactly. I'll tell you something. Happy medium is probably right down the middle, to be honest. This is my opinion as a fitness podcast host and trainer, okay? So take it for what it's worth. But I think having testosterone that's too high is in a fit person, and somebody who's exercising and trying to eat right, okay? Testosterone that's too high is probably better and healthier than having testosterone that's too low.

1:35:25That's my opinion. Take it for what it's worth. Nonetheless, just work with your doctor and just tell them you'd like to go lower and they'll scale you down and then see how you feel. it's interesting because they treat testosterone like we're dealing with insulin oh my god if you go too high you're gonna die no dude like uh bodybuilders take such ridiculous amounts and that's saying don't be like a bodybuilder but it's actually one of the safest hormones to to to play with it's so it's very very unique to the individual i'll tell you james my experience with being around bodybuilders i've used uh much larger doses and everything in between and i've been around guys that are all taking different and everybody kind of has this this sweet spot i know guys that were taking three times as much as I could take and they had no side effects.

1:36:07I found that when I started, when I got it to be a pro, I pushed as high as 500 milligrams a week. I had all kinds of adverse effects. My guy, I'm a comastial. Well, you start going up acne started happening, just did not feel good. And I found that when I brought it all the way back down to 200 in a week, it was just, it was the sweet spot for me. I didn't feel crazy strong. I just felt good. Libido is good. Energy is good. No side effects at all. And so every, And other guys, I know they feel that way off a double a dose or even half of what I do. So it is really kind of figuring out. And it took a while working with doctors.

1:36:40It took me over a year before the doctors kind of honed in like, okay, this is how your body responds. And it just takes time. Here's the other thing too. Like, uh, uh, okay. We're looking at your testosterone numbers, but are they looking at a blood lipid levels? A one C are they looking at inflammatory markers? Like that gives you a much more complete picture than just, oh, testosterone is above this number, it's dangerous. Right. You know, I would venture to say everything probably improved in your blood work since you've lost weight, started exercising, do everything else. So just to make you feel just to bring things down a little bit for you and not be so fearful.

1:37:14But that being said, you probably need to lower the dose and you'll probably feel better with a lower dose. Has the CPAP been kicking in and how's your recovery with that? Yeah. So I just started using the CPAP within the last month and a half and first few weeks couldn't even get used to having this thing on your face, you know, but now I've gotten to a point where I feel like I can definitely tell the difference. And I know that sleep might've been one of the biggest factors. I know you guys talk about all the time and a hundred percent that has made a huge difference in just recovery, just feeling great when I wake up.

1:37:46So that's definitely helped. Um, but in the gym and everything, you know, after I started the testosterone, I definitely felt like I was progressing and making some, some move forwards and I, the energy was back, you know? So I think the combination between the two has certainly made a huge difference. Awesome. But then, you know, it's kind of that, you know, you've got people around you that love you and they don't, they don't know any better. So they just hear that, you know, the doctor's telling you it's too dangerous. Now they're in your ear like, well, you got to cut it out. And, you know, it's, it's tough when you've got that noise behind you too.

1:38:17Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You probably just got to go a little lower. Yeah. But yeah, work with the, work with the doctor at transcend, let them know and they'll take it down. Yep. Cool. And then I love to hear, from you uh follow up with us after you kind of hone in hone that in but totally normal bro for it to go through that process i mean it takes yeah everyone is so unique for all the reasons that sal was talking about and i've seen different doses for so many different people that they feel their best at and once you do find that perfect dose where you're not seeing side effects and you feel amazing you found it and then it's like this this is where you want to be and so just sounds like you're a little high right now not too bad though cool well it makes me feel better again because you know then you got like two totally different sides of the spectrum i feel like that's why i wanted to talk to you guys i feel like you guys at least have a good sense of where where that should fall so appreciate it thanks man right on james awesome thank you so much guys you guys have a good day take it easy brother yeah i just the more i take the better i feel it's just weird i mean i wish i could say that i remember i i remember pushing up to you know 500 milligrams as a pro and it was i thought no i had buddies that were crazy in grams yeah guys that were in grams you know just way way more and i'm like why can't as soon as i took 500 acne gyno this all the things all joking aside because i i take as much as they'll let me and that's just more of my uh my dysfunction uh but i don't get side effects i've done in the past i've taken really high dose i don't get side effects yeah no some guys are like that i have buddies that they could take grams of it and nothing.

1:39:49As soon as I push over 500 or up to that range, side effects. I keep it down where my therapeutic does it. Beautiful. And everybody's different. So he's just going to figure out his dose. Look, if you like the show, come find us on Instagram. We'll see you with that Mind Pump Media. Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body, dramatically improve your health and energy, and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB Super Bundle at mindpumpmedia.com. The RGB Super Bundle includes MAPS Anabolic, MAPS Performance, and MAPS Aesthetic. Nine months of phased expert exercise programming designed by Sal, Adam, and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels, and performs.

1:40:33With detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos, the RGB Super Bundle is like having Sal, Adam, and Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Super Bundle has a full 30-day money-back guarantee, and you can get it now plus other valuable free resources at mindpumpmedia.com. If you enjoy this show, please share the love by leaving us a five-star rating and review on iTunes and by introducing Mind Pump to your friends and family. We thank you for your support, and until next time, this is Mind Pump.