2738: The BEST Isolation Exercises For EVERY Body Part

In short

Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - Episode 2738 Summary

Episode Overview In this episode of *Mind Pump*, hosts Sal Di Stefano, Adam Schafer, and Justin Andrews answer questions sourced from their Instagram followers. The episode discusses several topics ranging from fitness tips, healthy eating for toddlers, generational trauma, and more.

Key Topics Discussed

Best Isolation Exercises for Every Body Part (2:21)
Discussion on effective isolation exercises for different muscle groups and their importance alongside compound lifts.

Protein Intake with Butcher Box (20:28)
The hosts promote Butcher Box, emphasizing the quality of meat and its benefits for protein intake.

Reminiscing on High School Memories (26:23)
A light-hearted conversation about old high school photos and yearbook messages.

Breaking Generational Trauma (31:29)
Insights into addressing generational trauma and the importance of breaking negative cycles for future generations.

Children's Independence (36:45)
Discussion on the balance between parental protection and allowing children to have independence.

Treatment Centers for Withdrawal Support (41:48)
Conversations about the benefits of going through a treatment center for addiction treatment.

Faith and Action (47:03)
Discussion about the relationship between faith and tangible actions, emphasizing the importance of working towards one's goals.

Black Friday Sale Promotion (51:01)
Announcement of a special Black Friday sale offering significant discounts on Mind Pump products.

Q&A Segment

Healthy Foods for Toddlers (52:10)
Tips for encouraging toddlers to eat healthy, focusing on consistency and avoiding hyperpalatable processed foods.

Changing Rep Ranges in MAPS 15 (58:05)
Advice on the flexibility of adjusting rep ranges and weights for MAPS 15 workouts to suit individual progress.

Building Muscle in a Deficit for Obese Individuals (1:00:31)
Discussion on the possibility of building muscle while in a caloric deficit, emphasizing the importance of strength training and protein intake.

Managing Multiple Clients in Personal Training (1:04:01)
Tips for personal trainers on how to efficiently manage programming and progress for multiple clients.

Key Takeaways

Isolation vs. Compound Exercises: Both types of exercises have their place in a balanced workout regimen. Isolation exercises are particularly useful for muscle connection and targeting specific areas.

Nutrition: Proper nutrition, particularly protein intake, is critical for muscle recovery and growth. Utilizing resources like Butcher Box can help in maintaining a healthy diet.

Generational Trauma and Parenting: The importance of breaking negative cycles to foster better relationships and healthier outcomes for future generations.

Client Management for Trainers: New trainers should leverage available resources and make use of established programs to effectively manage their client workload.

Transcript

Automatic transcript. May contain errors.

0:00If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mind pump, Mind Pump with your hosts, Sal DiStefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. You just found the most downloaded fitness, health, and entertainment podcast. This is Mind Pump. In today's episode, we answered questions that people posted on our Instagram page, Mind Pump Media. It's a good time. By the way, this was after our intro. Today's intro is 50 minutes long. So we talk about fitness and fat loss and muscle gain, family life. It's always a good time. Again, if you want to post a question that we can pick, go to Instagram at Mind Pump Media.

0:37This episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is ButcherBox. They bring meat to your door, high-quality meat, grass-fed meat, wild-caught fish, chicken, pork, sausage, gluten-free nuggets. You name it, they have it, and it's great prices, I should say. Go to butcherbox.com forward slash Mind Pump. New users will receive their choice of New York strip, ribeye, or filet mignon in every box for free, included for an entire year. Plus you get a discount with that link. This episode is also brought to you by rock recovery center. If you go to rock recovery center.com forward slash mind pump, they are giving away a scholarship.

1:14This is a rehab facility. So if you or a friend or family member is struggling with addiction, go there, fill out a form, see if you can get a scholarship. By the way, they help everybody. So everybody's going to get some help. So if you need questions answer. Just go do that. Also, right now, everything is 60 % off Black Friday, 60 % off every MAPS workout program, every bundle of programs. Everything is on sale. Go to mapsfitnessproducts.com. Use the code Black Friday for the discount. By the way, every purchase gets you right now triple entries, three times as many entries for the contest. Two people get a week vacation at the Mind Pump Park City House.

1:5415 people get personal training. 10 people are going to get the opportunity to hang out here at Mind Pump Studios. It's awesome. And again, everything's 60 % off. MAPSFitnessProducts.com. The code is Black Friday. You guys, real quick, I just want to mention we got a sale. It's up to 25 % off equipment and select apparel on our store right now. There'll be$5 items as well. Sale will be from November 20th through November 30th. Go check it out at MindPumpStore.com. yes compound lifts are the best but there's isolation exercises you should do as well we're going to talk about the best isolation exercises for every body part what they are and why you should include them there might be some debate i don't even list what the exercises are let's see if we all agree it isolated well there's even some debate that means there's still there's still people in the bodybuilding world that actually will make the argument for this What do you mean that isolation is the way to go?

2:49It's better. Really? You don't remember that? Even our good friend Pekulski makes that argument. That they're better? Yes. Really? You don't remember that? Yeah, he's big cable fly for pec development over bench press. He loves to squeeze. Oh, I don't know about that. Yeah. No, I don't. So there's still room. There's room for debate here, too, if you like. I think that there's definite value in isolation exercises, I think he's built so much muscle he forgot. Yeah.

3:22He's so jacked he forgot. That guy can bend over and touch his shoes. You know, I think part of it is, part of it, CNS activation plays a role here, right? The more muscles are involved, the more force that you're having to produce, the more each muscle tends to get activated. Now, this is kind of not really the way to explain it because if you look at like muscle activation, you can't really see this, but I mean, seasoned lifters and coaches know this. Part of it's the carryover for functional strength. The other part of it is just, I mean, is anyone going to argue that squats aren't going to build more quad size than leg extensions?

4:02No, they won't make that with hack squats. But the hack squats is still a compound lift, right? It's not isolation. But that being said, isolation exercises have value. They don't cause as much damage. they allow you to connect to muscles that you might otherwise have trouble connecting to. This is where I think there's a lot of value. So I used isolation exercises with everyday clients primarily to help them feel and connect to muscles that they couldn't otherwise really connect to on a compound lift. So like they might have trouble feeling their chest in a bench press, but I could get them to feel their chest with an isolation exercise.

4:39Now, isolation exercises when it comes to like people who are more advanced it's great ways to add volume without tons of demand and stress i mean you can only do so many sets of squats before you fry yourself but you can throw in isolation exercise to add a little volume uh that doesn't cause nearly as much damage you can really build up lagging muscles and body parts right yeah so there's definite value to that even just from an overall strength perspective but like i think the most valuable thing from you know the performance side of it is connecting to that process and adding that into the overall compound level yeah i agree in fact many of my clients i started with isolation exercises first because of the the level they most mostly are at it was rare that i had somebody hire me who had you know decades of experience in training and had great mechanics and squatted and deadlifted.

5:34That's never the case. Yeah. So almost always, you know, the first time, and I remember learning this early. Early on, my principles are compound lifts are better. Start off with the bench press. Start off with the squat. Start off with these movements. Then you realize these people, they don't feel it. They don't do it right. You're like, what am I doing? You spend a whole hour trying to communicate that. So later on in my career, I realized like, oh, you know, I almost always taught an isolation exercise first specifically for the reason of getting them to feel the muscle before I switch them over to, which is very counterintuitive if you've listened to the show for long enough because all of our programming is not that way, right?

6:09If I'm programming for somebody for the best results, then yes, the big compound lifts first. But if I also am in the same breath, if I'm training somebody who's got little to no experience and the first time they get under a barbell to squat or deadlift and you ask them - Glute activation. Yeah, they're like, glutes? I didn't feel anything in my glutes. Or chest? I just feel in my arms and my shoulders. And so that client does really well with teaching them isolation exercises first so they can feel that muscle work properly. And then getting that understanding, that connection working, then going over to the compound lift.

6:45Yeah. So for people who aren't familiar, isolation exercises are exercises that primarily move just one joint. Compound lifts use two joints. So a press, elbows and shoulders, a lateral raise would just be shoulders or a tricep extension would just be the elbow. That being said, you don't really ever purely isolate a body part. Other body parts are always involved in stabilization and holding things. And so it's kind of a myth that it's called isolation. But for the sake of this episode, isolation exercises are typically single joint exercises. I'm so glad you brought that up because this used to be like one of my biggest pet peeve, the arguments with people that try and make claims of isolating a part of a muscle.

7:28It's like you can't even isolate a muscle. Let alone the peak of the muscle. Yeah, exactly. Let alone this part of a muscle. Those 15 % of fibers right now. Is a ridiculous thought process in itself. So I'm glad you brought up that even isolation exercises are not true. I try to say emphasis. We're putting emphasis, as much emphasis as we can on this muscle because it is impossible to isolate. The best bodybuilder in the world at Mind Muscle Connection cannot isolate a muscle. He still will have an antagonist muscle and surrounding muscles that are supporting it firing somewhat, even if most of the load is being taken by that.

8:07You're just anchoring your feet into the ground. So that being said, anybody who tries to tell you they're isolating a part of a muscle is even crazier. Yeah, that's right. All right, so let's start with chest. Let's talk about our favorites. I'm going to go with an incline dumbbell fly for me. Now, I like incline dumbbell flies because I noticed with my clients, it helped with shoulder stability. It helped them get a good, deep range of motion and stretch. A lot of people are tight across the chest. And then from an aesthetic perspective, just because it looks better to develop your upper chest.

8:44Now, why not a cable fly for me or a pec deck, which are great, by the way. I think those are great exercises. I would argue with you right there is those are the top two. Yeah, so I could go either way. But the reason why I like a fly is it loads the stretch. And you see a lot of hypertrophy benefits and correctional exercise benefits in that. But you could talk me out of it. So that's not why I like it. So, I mean, I'll just double down for why I like it. I always liked the incline chest fly because what it does the shoulder girl naturally. Yeah. Cause gravity, it's one of the hardest starts about teaching a client to like, say, do a bench press, right?

9:21A compound movement for the chest is their ability to retract, depress the shoulder girdle and keep it in that position as they press forward. And there's something about being in an inclined position with heavy dumbbells point. It just kind of throws you there. Gravity puts you there. Yeah, gravity kind of pulls the scapula back and down, which is that natural place you want to teach a client to get into. And so for that reason is why I really like this exercise over chest flies, cable flies, although cable flies would be a close second. Yeah, I mean, I would agree with that. I like the cable flies for just that consistent resistance, however.

9:56Yeah, so I understand the argument with the load and the stretch, but two, there's value to that consistent muscle tension. Tension, so they're constantly thinking about the chest all the way through. That's why I – A lot of connecting to that, which I prefer. If you have trouble connecting to your chest, you want tension at the squeeze. Right. And a cable fly will do that because you'll hear, bring them together. Someone with poor connection, you have them focus on that squeeze in the middle. They tend to be able to feel their chest. It's funny. That's one of the few cable exercises I see you doing consistently.

10:26I know. I know. I love it. And it really is. It's just a connection thing. And I want to make sure that I'm – it's a feel. I feel my way through that. But I do – when I'm not like incorporating that and then I go to do bench, like I notice the difference. For back, for me, crossbench, dumbbell pullover. Oh, interesting. That's your go-to isolation. I think it is – well, it is a – this – okay, a dumbbell pullover crossbench. I mean it's the only real – I guess now that you say that, it's the only one that really isolates anything. Yeah. Anything else you can make a case of. But it's not just that because you could do a straight arm pull down or a rope pull down and it's a similar movement.

11:04Yeah, but pullovers are better than that. But, well, I mean, crossbench dumbbell pullover, just the range of motion of the shoulders, the stability, the mobility, and then the carryover. This is one of the few, quote unquote, isolation exercises that I would bet has a lot of carryover to the real world. I know it did for me in grappling and judo and jiu-jitsu. I just like, too, that it's closely related to the tricep as opposed to the bicep. Yeah. So it's like a totally different feel because normally everything that I'm doing for pulling and gripping, I'm feeling a lot of bicep. Well, I think it's important the audience knows this, too.

11:39There's like name all the isolation back exercises. There's only a couple. There's not many. Yeah. I don't know. Is there any more? Pullovers and pulldowns. Name me another one. You can do a scapular shrug or something weird that nobody ever does. Yeah, some weak asses. so i mean at first i got a knee-jerk reaction from you but then i thought about that for a second i thought well wait a second there's there's not many true isolation exercises the back is such a big muscle with different muscles uh that you incorporate different parts of the back in almost every other traditional lift so just so the audience knows that that's not sal making the case that oh it's better than a row it's better than a pull up those are all compound we're saying isolation yeah those are all considered compound lifts that that obviously would make the top of the list, but there's not a lot of isolation exercise.

12:27If I had to pick one isolation exercise for the back, the pullovers aren't even a close second. It's the king of that for sure. All right, now we're getting to delts, rear flies for me. It's because everybody likes side. I love that you picked that. Everybody likes side laterals, and I get it, but this is one of those few times when I can go both aesthetic and functional and corrective. It's the best. People need to strengthen that separating out movement. they need to strengthen the rear delts it's good for shoulder stability then aesthetically speaking if you want round delts we've said this so many times on the podcast build your rear delts not your side delts you build nice rear delts you got round looking shoulders uh so it's like both for aesthetics and function i mean i don't think anything i i don't know what episode we did recently where i brought up the bent over reverse cable fly pull through that i do i don't think anything beats that for an isolation exercise for the rear delts.

13:22I mean, it puts you in the fully stretched position. You got constant tension all the way through it. Yeah. No arguments for me. That would be number one for sure. Now we'll go biceps and triceps. Now, technically, almost every exercise is isolation. There's a few compound lifts, but I guess we'll just pick our favorites for biceps, preacher curl, for triceps, overhead tricep extension. But we don't need to spend a ton of time here unless you guys have a favorite my debate would be uh concentration curls over over that seated concentration curls would be i like those i haven't done those in a while spider curls another good one yeah haven't done a while justin doesn't do anything he's like what's that incline bench and i'm letting him hang yeah incline curls yeah dude what about triceps you like overhead rope i like overhead rope overhead Yeah, that one.

14:12That's a really good one. The only reason why I even balk at preacher curls, because I think preacher curls are amazing, is because I remember how I used to do them as a teenager when I was young, is one, I would not take it through four-inch motion. No, you've got to go all the way down, bro. Yeah, yeah, right. I would not go all the way down and load it all the way and use a lot of body rock and momentum to get it up just so I could put on an extra foot pass. Lock and go full extension. Yeah, it's really like the tech. where I feel like it's a little more traditional to do like your basic concentration curl.

14:44Do you do the Arnold bent over concentration curl or the arm inside the thigh concentration? The arm inside the thigh. Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah. The Arnold bent over. Prison style. I mean, I tell you, when I was jacked and feeling myself, I did the Arnold style. Yeah, yeah. You'll find me doing it inside my thigh though if I'm doing it more like that. That's great. All right, glutes. You know, can you call a hip thrust? You can't. Yeah, I would. That's like the only way to isolate. I mean, no, there's donkey kickbacks. No, hip thrust. I can't get on board with it. But a hip thrust is technically compound, right?

15:17Because the knee joint with the hip joint, I mean, it's not a lot. And you can load the heck out of a hip thrust. Like, you could lift more weight. You get extension, but yeah, there's not a lot going on at the knee. You know, we're going to piss off some people. I'm sure Brett Contreras is not going to like this. But I would kind of make it more isolation than compound. It's technically not, though. It's a compound lift. Well, listen, if you're doing all the other glute compound lifts, that's got to be in there. That's closer to isolation than the other ones. Oh, yeah. Yeah, if you compare that to a lunge, a step up, a squat.

15:51Deadlift. Yeah, deadlift. I mean, by far, the hip thrust is. You're just going to get a weird exercise outside of that, I feel, to try and isolate your glute. Yeah, you're doing like the kick, you know, the abduction. The weird curtsy version. Yeah, it's like. Which, by the way, dude, I can hip thrust so much weight. I didn't even know. I did not know I was good. What a great role. Such a weird flex. I'm so glad you're bragging about this. Listen to me right now. Listen. Let me hear you brag about this. I was, I can. You guys, I can hump a house. Dude, I can put, I can put 600 pounds in the bar and crush a hip thrust.

16:22Now I'm so, I believe you. That's the funny part. I hope Dylan edits a clip of you doing it with like a tutu on or something. Dude, listen. So cool, bro. Listen, I made fun of him for so long I shouldn't have. I didn't know they were as good at him. Now I feel like I need to brag. Now, okay. Now, okay. complete transparency then since you are the only person that cares enough to do them that much um the other carryovers from it what do you have so it makes your deadlift my deadlift went up yeah it did for sure yeah and it in my butts you know there's more in the extension you notice the difference in your butt because your wife knows that she keeps talking about my butt so i guess yeah she said it looks like it's made out of wood depends on the amount of slaps yeah like carved out of wood is what she said i don't know like a interesting compliment yeah because wood could be flat.

17:06No, no, like carved out of wood. Maybe some of my skin's brown. So it kind of looks... It's partially racist. It's like oak. What do you mean, babe? What's talking about... She's like, no, it's solid. It's all right. I don't know. But anyway, hip thrusts, I guess quads, sissy squats. Oh, yeah. No argument here. Oh, that'll light those quaddies up. Yeah. Leg extensions is boring. Now, wait a second. I mean, so because you got the hip, the knee, and the ankle all kind of involved in that. It's still just knee. It's still just a knee. Yeah, okay, listen, if you can call a sissy squat an isolation, then you can definitely call a hip thrust.

17:43Because there's as much play in the knee and ankle in the sissy squat as there is in a hip thrust. But you know, the thing with the, you know, you brought up leg extensions for injury, correctional exercise, for certain applications, leg extensions are great. They're really great. You can't sissy squat if you're trying to fix injury problems. Because you're going to mess yourself up with a sissy squat. So those two have to have an asterisk because you're going to have the biomechanic police come in. And be like, well, no, technically. You know, he's thinking of a badge. Yeah, there's definitely that.

18:12There's definitely. The internet's got those kids. You know what I'm saying? Can't wait to tell you you're wrong. Yeah, dude. One pump got it wrong. That's not an isolation exercise. So technically there is. But I mean, it's close to an isolation exercise as you can those two. And I would throw them in there. So I'll take that. All right. Let's go hamstrings. What do you guys think? Do you guys like seated or lying leg curls better? Which one do you guys like better? I like lying. Is a Romanian deadlift not considered isolation? It is. Romanian deadlift wins. It is, right? Yes. Because it's hip.

18:46And you're locked. It's just hip, yeah. You're in a locked position and you just slide the hips out. That's isolation, bro. That's as good as it gets. Yeah, that's good. That's as good as it gets right now. Yeah, you win. That one's it. That's it. You can't beat Romanians. No. No, definitely no. And you should be in a locked. That's also a good butt one. And you should be locked out. I mean, technically wouldn't like a good morning. Good mornings are great, but you know what's the problem with good mornings? I mean, I prefer Romanians, but I'm just saying. You know what the deal with? I love good mornings.

19:09The problem with good mornings, though, is if you don't have good control and stability, it's like people turn it into some weird. Well, I know. You got to, yeah. I mean, it's definitely you have to have a prerequisite before you do that. For sure. And most people that do heavy, heavy good mornings, it's almost like between a squat and a good morning. That's right. Yeah, yeah. That's right. You got a lot of knee flexion. all right core uh long lever physio ball crunches do these right these will light up your abs like nothing else but no that's that's my pick yeah you guys i like those that's it yeah i like those all right okay how many is that one two three four five six seven eight it's nine huh decline yeah i was just thinking about how like i would blend this with my our grade eight you know you're turning into great nine or no no no it's just like so like no imagine that this is the evolution to the grade eight is that you you start to add these later so it's like you follow great phase two you exactly more longer maybe you follow grade eight for a solid couple months and then as you because you remember grade eight's all good all the good compounds right so you got a while to get really good at those and then as you can handle more volume you these are all the isolation single joint movements huh treacle it trickle them in trickle them in yeah Wouldn't that be a good idea?

20:23I like that a lot too. We're giving away our secrets. I know. It's good stuff. I had friends over the other night because - You have friends? Yeah, I do. Besides us? Because we weren't there. I know. Congratulations. I'm a devoid. My other friends. No, I had people come over because I told you guys I went to that concert. And so they had dinner with us and we were all hanging out. And so a couple of the couples, this was the first time we hung out with them. and uh my wife made my wife's like really she makes these lamb chops that are just famous right she makes them so good so she made these lamb chops she does this dish where she goes pasta with pesto lamb chops and asparagus it's like her her go-to and uh we're all talking about the meat and they're like and so we talked about like how much meat do we eat so like one guy's like oh my wife needs to eat more meat sal talk to her it's like sal how much meat do you eat every single day i'm like yeah do you want like two pounds like around two pounds bro people looked at me like two pounds of meat you eat two pounds of meat a day i'm like yeah did you flex for them afterwards no but i mean that's where you flex yeah what do you think you just got here the carbs did this well this isn't from rice you know what though but it's what's uh whenever i talk to people outside of our fitness right right they think it's crazy it is crazy to people like Because it's so much protein.

21:44This is the reason why we hammer this on the podcast so much. I always know we have a divided audience. We have hardcore fitness people that listen to this because they're hardcore fitness people. And then we have people that are being introduced to fitness that listen to us. And the hardcore fitness people think it's like, of course I eat that much protein. Of course it's like - A gram of protein per pound of body weight all the time. Yeah, all the time. No problem. This and that. And I eat lots of it. It's like, dude, the average person thinks they're eating a lot of protein because they have dinner.

22:14They have one piece of meat. Or they have a turkey sandwich. Yes, dude. Cool, he had 10 grams. Yes, or an egg. 180 to go. Yeah, they had an egg or two for breakfast. And so they're like protein eaters. Well, so we were talking about this and they're like, how does this work? So I started talking about ButcherBox and how they deliver all this meat. And they're like, do you eat all that meat that they send you? We order on top of that. We get meat on top of the ButcherBox. Same. Yeah, just kind of breaking it down. And I'm like, we blow through the tri-tip that they send us. I've never actually – have you ever tried to calculate the amount of pounds of meat you get when you get in the box?

22:49Especially now, too. I don't know. Because the kids are eating a lot. It really depends on what you're ordering, right? I get the big box. Yeah, but I mean, if you order the chicken versus ordering like ribeyes, for example, you're going to get more chicken for a pound-wise than you are ribeyes. It would be just interesting. I'm sure on the box, it's got the net weight on there. I wonder what, I'm just curious. That's a good question. Yeah, I'm kind of curious until you said that, because I always thought when we first started getting them, I thought like, I remember telling Katrina, like, why is our grocery bill so high?

23:19She's like, you really think that butcher box is lasting us the whole? Because they send us a$200-something dollar box. Yeah, yeah, no. And that's for the whole family. Yeah, yeah. Well, I mean, I have kind of a small family. I know, what's going on here, Adam? It's just you, Katrina, Max. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We eat a lot of protein. Oh, my son, dude, I love my heart. So this weekend was my birthday, and his best friend's mom, we celebrated on Friday, both Katrina and I's together. And she's like, hey, I think I'm going to have Julian's parents, who's Max's best friend's parents, who we really like a lot, just pick him up from school and keep him until like 8 or 8.30 and then she'll bring him home with that.

23:56And so throughout the party, Katrina was getting all these pictures of him, you know, eating popcorn, having a movie night. And they ordered hamburgers in. and he gave back the buns and just ate the meat. Oh, God. I did not teach him to do that. My son just loves meat, doesn't care for buns. That's so great. Yeah, doesn't care for buns. Turned down pizza last night and rather have the tri-tip steak. I'm sure parents are like, oh, my God, he's got the fitness dad. Yeah, I'm sure they think that. Are they tyrannizing this question? So his dad's really cool. His dad's like, you don't want the bun or any of the fries?

24:30He's like, no, I'm kind of a meat guy. and so Carlos the dad starts laughing he's like I'm a meat guy too I like it you know so that but it's like my son went to Sunday school the other day uh and they're like oh tell him it's his you know he's telling us he's like mom tell him it's my birthday they give us a lollipop so we're like all right so we tell him you know it's his birthday so he goes in there we're in the service and one of the people comes and finds us in the service and she's like is is this lollipop okay he asked if it had red dye in it like oh yeah he asked about the red dye yeah he's like he gave him a lollipop he's like wait a minute does this have red dino whatever blue dye this i made the same mistake max always ask now all the time i'm all embarrassed like oh god i went too far with that one i didn't mean to do that but hey dude listen uh we've said this on the show many times and i don't eat i always heat eat high protein but i've made a conscious effort typically i fall around 190 grams of protein a day give or take but lately i've been trying to go 220 consistently because i weigh about 215 ish pounds so i'm like you know what let me and i'm lean so it's not like I'm hitting close to lean body weight.

25:34So I'm aiming for an additional 30, 40 grams a day. Big difference. You did really? Big difference. Just that extra 30, 40 grams. I always noticed that. And it's not like I was eating low before. It's just that extra serving. And it's not a lot of calories because it's really lean. I'm only adding a couple hundred calories. So much work. Dude, it's a lot, dude. It's so much work. I have to add shakes. Only when I'm bodybuilding, did I ever be that? was I ever that consistent with 230 grams plus. But I noticed strength right away. I noticed recovery right away. I noticed sleep. Sleep right away.

26:10That's the selfie I sent you guys when I made a joke. I'm like, look at this, guys. All natural herbs.

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26:17But it's because I've been hitting protein. It's because I've been hitting it. Justin blew it up. He did. He blew it up. Does anybody put wallet pictures anymore? Do you guys ever use them? No. I told you. He used to be how you'd show your girlfriend, right? Yeah. The Olin Mills pic. This is my girlfriend from Canada. I have a box from high school still that have all that stuff still in there. You saved them? Yeah. I saved them this whole time. We've got all the pictures of - So here's the thing, though. I dated a girl. My girlfriend, my junior - Wait a minute. What are these pictures of? Oh, your ex-girlfriends?

26:47Yeah, they're all in there, too. Wow. Yeah, yeah. Like their volleyball pic where they're like - Yeah, totally. No, the cheerleader one with this and their legs are crossed in the back. Oh, right. Yeah. This one. Yeah. You know? yeah that was so i mean uh so the two girls i did in high school my sophomore girlfriend uh and my junior senior girlfriend all were like photographer chicks so this was before everybody every phone had a yeah yeah i gotta remember that right so like they literally like carried cameras around like one of uh the the girl sophomore was um what's the asb was in part of that and was like the whatever one was part of your book and taking pictures so she had a camera all the time we were dating so she took pictures all the time and then my next girlfriend was a car guaranteed you're in the yearbook yeah yeah so then the next girlfriend was hardcore to photography so yeah i have this just big shoe box that's just overflowing of like photos you guys have your yearbooks oh yeah of course why haven't we brought them in oh we haven't you know what's funny is to read uh what people's comments oh it's so funny i had a stupid thing i signed oh what did you decide life is a joke laugh it up wait this was your thing that was my thing dude I don't fucking know I have no idea come on I was a teenage kid you know what I'm saying like I have no idea this will be cool this will be cool in 30 years real cool guy I'm sure I wrote Italian Stein on 90 % of whatever oh my god oh my god yeah this is a good lesson this is a good lesson for kids everything you do now you will hate in the future you're dumb as cool as you think you are you're gonna think i probably wrote some beavis and butthead thing or something stupid remember how stupid like the shows you watched back in the day i i was getting angry because of my kids like you know they're they're into some like stupid spongebob or some like i don't there's some new show that's like a cartoon where it's just like the it's just so is it friendly something yes something friend i knew it yeah i knew they watched that yes they love it and i'm like something friends yeah oh it's hilarious it is funny it's really dumb but it like brought me back and i was like what is it we were into really dumb shows you don't know something you're already too old it's on am i want to say it's on amazon it's on it's something friends and it's amazon and i think and it's so random and so I sent did I send you guys a clip so you'll find clips of this show and you can't even believe some of the stuff they do it's wild is it because it's so politically incorrect is it because it's so random random it's just random and dumb it's what would you guys compare it to because we like Beavis and Butthead was random and dumb it's kind of like Ren and Stimpy yeah yeah those are all like there's one where the guys go so these are like they're like rent-a-friends so they go to cheer people up yeah and that's their jobs and there was one episode where one of him goes to hell and and he's like stuck in hell and he makes a deal with with the devil he's like if i make you laugh like can i leave he's like yes and the devil's like this really angsty dude like like he's like on a he's playing video games he just gave up and everybody in hell is like dude he's not himself he's even like torturing anyone anymore you gotta cheer him up and he's just in there playing video games and he's like ordering doordash you know it's so stupid dude dude yeah it's so dumb so that's still a thing yeah i i love it that's a good one do you remember do you did you have like a sign off do you remember your sign off like yearbook i bet you did i totally did i totally i don't remember what i said it was really dumb i'm sure it was like something like something about like uh party or whatever like what party party you know party on like yeah i was like wayne and garth or something like party on like with like go hang loose like cool do you know what's yours was just really i don't remember it's probably signed the italian's something like that dude it was something like that i can guarantee i mean i think yours wins if that's what it is because i still do it i stuck with it mine is mine was like probably some sort of like hidden trauma front you know i'm saying like i mean those are like rough years for sure my laughter masks my tears yeah no totally i'm just seriously like if i think about like okay well i'm trying to think we're talking i'm like why would i even say that and i'm like i probably said it because those were hard times for me at home oh that's sad and so home it was just like i just was but i had such a i had such a positive uh attitude though like i didn't um and so that's what that was is that but that's probably a lot of that is that's that makes me sad bro no it's not i was talking i was a very happy kid yeah very happy kid you are resilient as hell i was uh talking with someone uh the other day about she was thinking about stuff she did when she was 15 and how, you know, she's like, I know it was supposed to be traumatic, but it really wasn't for me until I had a 15 year old kid.

31:43And then I, and then I, for some reason I said, what if that happened to my child? And then she's like, oh my God. And there's this, I don't, there's a psychological phenomena where if, when you think back to when you were a kid, you can't not have your current mindset and wisdom. So when you think back to, Like, yeah, it wasn't that bad when I was 15. It was. You're just thinking of it now with your adult life. I told you that just happened to me. Yeah, you did. I told you that. I didn't share that on air, but Adam Lane Smith interviewed me. Oh, that's right. And, you know, asked about myself like as a – or no, not Adam Lane Smith.

32:20This was – Larry Hagner. Thank you. Larry Hagner from Dad Project asked me that. Totally caught me off guard. Because I remember when I turned the age that my dad was when he committed suicide. And my entire, so I was seven when he, when he, when he took his life. So from seven all the way to my thirties, if you asked me about it, I could comfortably just talk about it. No big deal. And not that it was no big deal, but it's just that I dealt with that. I hadn't really thought about it a lot. Didn't really weigh on me much. I mean, in fact, most of my life, I was used to growing up without him and whatever.

32:49Right. But the year I turned the same age that he did when he had, he had committed suicide, it hit me different because I'm now that age and I'm thinking, God, to exit right now like and this is i mean this is at 32 so this is well before math i'm just barely dating katrina at the time uh but life is good and i'm and at that time i feel like there's so much more ahead of me and i'm like man i couldn't imagine going on then so fast forward larry haggner's in here and he's interviewing me and uh he also his father committed suicide so we have that in common and we've talked about i've had a couple good episode episodes with him before getting into that deep stuff and uh he hadn't seen me since since right when max was born it was the last time i interviewed with him was almost six years ago and he's like he brings up my dad's stuff again and then he goes uh you know have have you thought about your son is almost the same age as you were when he took it and boy like because now you can see yeah just wild it hit me like a ton of bricks because uh when i thought about it as a 32 or as his daughter it like i thought about the most that year of my life and i thought oh wow i can't believe he exited like this but it didn't hit me like a ton of bricks it hit me like a ton of bricks when i mean it was like i remember on air i paused like for a really long time and i was like whoo like i hadn't thought about that because i had never tried to look at it through my own lens yeah i was looking even when i thought about it with my dad i thought about it through his lens at 32 as a man as a grown man and where at my life not as a little innocent child perspective of a kid so to to put it in perspective because now you see your son yeah i see my son oh my god yeah oh it just it it took me back dude it took me back and i went whoa i was like what a different hit it's a really good exercise for people we've all been through stuff everybody has some more than others think back to those challenging moments and then imagine it happening to someone that you know or care about that's that age it's you can really really understand the trauma versus looking back at your current state of mind you know what's a trip about it sal that because i did a lot of like unpacking right on it that really tripped me out was that when i was that age when that all happened i felt like i was the mind of a 15 year old or like or 18 year old you know so like that as crazy as that sounds but I thought I had so much more responsibility.

35:17I thought I understood so much of the world. And then I see how innocent my son is. You're still a kid. Oh, he's like still a baby to me. You know what I'm saying? He's so, so innocent. But then also makes me very aware like, whoa, there's a lot going on in that brain. Just because he talks about simple things and stuff like that, those wheels, because I know what my wheels were turning when that happened in my life. and I know how much of that time I remember that I go, whoa. So it took me back in double way. One, it put me in looking through my own, trying to look through my own eyes through my son at that age.

35:54Like, holy shit, that's crazy how young that is for that to have happen. And then two, it was, boy, I remember a lot going on and thought a lot. And I thought I had deep thoughts. So like, whoa, he's got deeper thoughts than you think. Totally. I was thinking about just because my daughter's about to get her license and drive. And I think back to the crazy things I did in a car back then. And as an adult, I'm like, oh, my God, that was crazy. Now that I have a kid who's going to drive, I think if she did that. And then I realize I was a child. What was I thinking? And it puts things in a different, completely different perspective.

36:32But it's also good, too, to build in that practice because a lot of times we can be like, I can't believe they did that. Then you forget the wild shit that you did and still survived. But it's scary, man. I'm going through that same thing with the driving. Yes. It's really eating at me. It's like, well, he's going to be fine. There's going to be a lot of benefit to it, but it's really like it puts the brakes on everything. You think you're so confident at that. Yeah, I'm like, ah. You think you're so. When I was 16, I was so. Now, with you guys, I imagine, because you actually are, I know you, you can tend to be more like nervous about that than you.

37:12You're the one who pushes Courtney, right? When it comes to like, let them be free, let them figure it out. Right. Are you that way or is Jessica more that way? That's a good question. I'm probably more protective. No, she's probably more protective with the little ones, but with my older ones, I tend to be a little bit more protective, but that's different. That's just cause I was, because of the divorce, uh i have this tough time um you know not not trying to corral everything which is just a totally different thing but i could see with the little ones i'm a little bit more push them out maybe but you have to ask me again let me i'd have to think about that i mean it's something that i know that katrina and i are working on that like uh like and i again especially after adam lane smith understanding that like you know she's the ceo in this and like has a very good wise voice and so like i don't push that hard but i'll say things like she's just her morning we we were sleeping in and max is at this wonderful age where he can go down and kind of make himself breakfast and kind of hang around and play and do his own thing for like the first hour or two and we we can actually sleep in a little bit uh on saturday mornings and so it was especially when we have a late friday night like we did and so we were doing this and uh she gets up and she like cracks open the door so and i'm like trying to sleep i don't want to hear him with his toys i'm like and i'm like what are you doing i'm like the kid knows how to open a door why do you got to open the door i want to hear my son i'm like oh okay whatever so i go back to sleep you know trying to figure out but that's like one of those things of like i'm i'm so ready to let him have more independence and i trust him especially him he's not like he's not the kid who's going to get up climb on the counter and get into the knives no like that's just not my son like he's not like that at all so i i have that confidence now maybe if he was a kid like that that was always breaking things or getting stuff maybe i'd be a little more like that but because i feel like he's really sound when it comes to that there's some kids where it's too quiet you gotta go check yeah yeah no no totally i like i get that like and he's not that kid i'm like you're gonna go down there and he's like drawing a picture on the freaking you know like or he's playing with his trucks by himself like that was always the deal like i was making especially with my oldest with Ethan, it's like, if he keeps proving that he's going to make the right decision when he's challenged, like I have to reward that.

39:31And so, and that's kind of where, you know, we discussed it a lot and it's, it makes, you know, it's uncomfortable because there's like, he'll be somewhere. We know he's there. And I'm like, I know his plan, but then she'll be looking on the phone. She could see he's not there and starts freaking out. And I'm like, they're, they're on a run. They're going to get some food. They're doing like, it's not a big deal. Like stop, stop stop you know and like let him like you just have to give him space yeah and it's it's difficult because i'm like he's gonna make the right decision even then like let's say he gets in like a situation where it's unsafe he's gonna call me yeah and you'd like and we've established that and like i have to trust he's gonna do that or it's like then he's not gonna tell us yeah it's like one or the other yeah you know what are we what are we like leading towards with this and so It's tough.

40:19I just saw our boy do a video on that. His name's slipping me right now, who we're doing the mentor family with. Scott Donald. Shout out to Scott Donald. Just did a clip on that exact thing, and he calls it the no rule call or no questions asked call. And so if you have a teenager, he goes, we have a rule that no matter what trouble you're in, what you did wrong or whatever like that that if you don't feel safe you want out you need help no judgment you call you call us and no questions asked and you won't get punished we won't ask you or berate you what's going on like that's a just you know you have that with us that's great yeah and i think that's you that's how you build that where the kid feel because that that's where you don't do that you know what i'm saying like you know why because exactly because some kids like man all my friends are smoking pot or they're all going to do this thing I don't want to be here but if I tell my parents I'm going to get in trouble whereas they know there's no questions asked I'll get bailed out I'll be able to bounce my parents aren't going to ask me and what's funny is you probably end up telling your parents anyway right and then it's up to you as a parent to keep your cool and not get upset that your kid was somewhere where he wasn't supposed to be or at a party where you originally said there was going to be parents or whatever the thing may be but I mean I think it's such an important thing to establish with your teenagers so they feel safe to be able to have that conversation.

41:48So this is part of the commercial, Adam, so I'm sorry to ask you this and I'm prepared, but for Rock Recovery Center, I know you're going through still the withdrawal with Kratom. Yeah. And this is what, day 10? I might go on. So it was Wednesday of last week, and I'm already on Monday of this, so we're on, is that 12? 12? 12, something like that. And it's nasty. Yeah. now because rock recovery for people don't know this is a rehab facility um it's what they specialize in right so you go in there you stay there we partner with them because we love them they do a great great job um what do you think would be the benefits for somebody going through even something like what you're going through in a facility like that do you think it would just if they're there if they were if they because we have a relationship with them and they were here i would have checked myself really oh well i told katrina that that's how this came out was i looked at her and i said uh i know that i'm so bad that i think i might have to check myself in and i don't want to do that and so a lot of my motivation to keep going was to prove to myself that i wasn't going to have to take a week or a month off and lock myself into a facility where there'd be people around the clock supporting me and help me.

43:09And she was like, I don't think anybody else could have done that by themselves. She watching what you went through, knowing I couldn't do anything for you, not having any, because there's a lot of stuff that the recovery centers have to support you like medication wise and stuff like that to make, to ease the withdrawal, which is gotta be unbelievable. Like to be in a facility where you have support. what you're doing yeah exactly support professionals tools uh medications all the things people that have been through it they know exactly oh he's feeling this right now give him this or oh he's this is what he needs to do like there's 24 hours yeah and there's 24 hour uh support um yeah no i was on the brink of that dude i i told her exactly that that if uh if i couldn't do it and uh i was gonna i was gonna check in to to to make sure that i i mean to me it was that if I can't prove to myself right now that I can do this a hundred percent, then, then I need to admit that I need somebody to help me.

44:08So that was, that was this. One thing you did that is part of their program and other programs, but they, they do this a lot. You said what brought you, what helped you a lot was watching people talk about their challenges with Kratom. Yeah, I didn't. And so like, I know Rock Recovery does this, right? Where you meet your, you do these meetings with other people and you, and it helps. I guess for the first time in my life, I understand the AA meetings now. I understand that more. It was, I tell you, I'm no exaggeration. I probably watched 50 recovery videos of like long 20, 30 minute videos. What is it about that helps?

44:49Is it just like, okay, someone else has done this. They've gone through this as well. Yeah, I think there's a lot of little things. um like so when you're in it you're like you have like especially when it's getting worse as you're as you as you first get in it um you're like oh fuck like how long is this going to just keep getting worse and is it and like what to expect so hearing people that have come out the other side and be like it was like this and then and then going like okay that's what i'm going through right now like okay so just being able to relate to somebody like okay this person uh um went this where this is where they were at and this is how long it took that and oh okay i'm what i'm feeling right now is the worst part this is what they they they also experienced this at this time um relating that you know i'm sure there's a there's a there's a part of my myself that you know beats your own beats up your ego uh that you allowed something like this you know to happen to you so hearing other people especially when you i mean i saw all kinds of crazy stories And when you saw professional people and people that have a lot of good things going in their life, you tend to attach addiction to losers or this or that.

46:03And so it's like there's a lot of people who are just normal people that let something like this get a hold of them. And so that part helps. Yeah, there's a lot of things that I didn't realize. It wasn't like I went in like, I need to watch videos. I just was like researching and then it started and I was drawn to it. And then I realized like it just, and it gave you strength. Yeah. It just, it gave me strength through, I mean, you're not sleeping for days. And so, uh, and trying to sleep is painful. So just being up, a lot of times what I would do is I would, uh, I'd start watching them like on YouTube, but just even sitting still on the couch or in my bed was too much.

46:43So I, I'd throw it on my, my headphones and then just go for a walk and listen to the recovery. talks, you know, the people just that are going through it or been through it. And, uh, yeah, no, that's what kept me going through the hardest part for sure. Well, so yeah, people, you can go on their site, uh, and they give out scholarships. So, you know, if you, if you need help or someone else go there along, uh, along the lines of kind of just, you know, uh, just talking about the things that we struggle with or thankful for another episode drops on Thanksgiving. Is that true? So it's perfect timing.

47:13So I, I texted you, Adam, I was driving and I just was, I don't remember where I was going and I was praying and I just started to just, just be thankful and look back and just having these realizations, uh, just, just, just being blessed with these realizations, you know, how awesome I used to think I was, which this doesn't sound like an awesome, a great realization, but it really is because I had you asked me then I wouldn't have thought this, but looking back, I'm like, man, I thought I was so awesome. I thought it was all, I was so great, but really, um, it's not, it's not me. None of it is.

47:52And even just this, just what we do here without you guys, this wouldn't exist at all. Uh, and so I was just feeling so grateful that, um, that, you know, what I, I get to do this and I, what the people that I've been put with were the right, exact, perfect people to make something like this possible because without you guys and your strengths and what you guys can do um like this none of this would be possible so it's just it was just it's just wonderful very thankful humbling but in a good way you know drive i have i have more thoughts around that just for you um because i know where you're at in your journey right now too and uh you're just in a humble gratitude place of understanding the power of God and how he can work in your lives.

48:42But also one of my favorite verses in the Bible is faith without work is dead. And so he can give you all the gifts in the world, but if you don't take action and you don't do anything with him, they don't happen, bro. So yes, you are blessed. Yes, we are blessed. Yes, um you know he probably put this all together but all it takes is one of us not having the faith not putting the work in for it not to manifest well even that's a blessing even that's a blessing even even the story we tell the story we've told many times where we recorded i don't know 15 episodes with with uh with we had a fifth partner and he dropped out and i've told this story before but now I see it differently.

49:29He drops out and he had the social media pull. He was the one that was going to give us our initial growth. And I think most people would have been like, we just did all that work. The guy with the following is gone. Like, let's just, I don't know, what are we going to do? Let's just stop this because we spent so much time doing it. And instead, every one of us was like, no, that's a gift. That was a blessing. Yeah, but you got gifts and blessings before you found him and you've, you, you use them and you put them to work. You know, you, we all are not attracted to each other if we, if we don't have those things.

50:01And so all I'm saying to you is that, you know, it's, it very much so he has a plan and very much so he gave you wonderful gifts, but there's a lot of people that have wonderful gifts that don't put the work in, that don't have the faith and don't do those things. And so it doesn't just also just miraculously happen. And so it takes a lot of effort, whether you knew you were doing his work or not. You know, he knows more than you or I ever will, or, you know, and sometimes it's always part of the plan. And so, but to not also understand that it takes effort, it takes work, and, you know, faith without work is dead.

50:47And so, uh, you know, a lot of people, you know, pray and, and, and hope for things to happen and they just wait. And there's, it's very important that you also work and you put the work into it. It's good. It's good stuff. So hard transition, but we have for our black Friday sale. So right. So 60 % off everything, all the programs, plus every purchase enters you into our contest for like the week, free vacation at park city, personal training right now through cyber monday you get triple entries so if you haven't gotten a program yet at 60 off or a bundle at 60 off and you do it now you get three times as many entries uh to enter into those contests let's go triple it's maps fitness products.com the code is black friday and again you can get a week free vacation at the mind pump park city house uh plus a thousand to travel.

51:3915 people get personal training. 10 people get to hang out here at the studio. Triple entries. Check it out. Let's go. The world's best probiotic is Seed, hands down. Probiotics give you lots of health benefits, not just including gut health benefits, but skin benefits, muscle recovery benefits, stamina benefits, mental health benefits. It's all backed by data. Again, Seed's the world's best. Go to Seed.com forward slash MindPump. Use the code 20 mind pump for 20 % off back to the show. First question is from no insta Kelsey. What are kind of healthy foods to your toddlers like to eat? I'm struggling with my son.

52:18Oh, good question. Uh, my toddlers, healthy foods that we give them that they like, uh, it would be berries, cheese, uh, nuts, fruit. Um, and you know, different kinds of meats. My kids will actually enjoy eating, um, different kinds of meats. Uh, Butcher Box has really good gluten-free nuggets, which are like a treat for them. But I think one of the challenges with this with toddlers is we can give them things that are hyperpalatable. And then when they know that's an option, they won't eat other things. When kids are hungry, they tend to eat. And I know some kids are way more picky than others.

52:58I get that. But I think sometimes we give them these different options. And then we're like, okay, well, why won't you eat these? He's, well, I want the crackers that I always eat, you know, type of deal. Yeah, I feel like I'm less qualified to answer because I only have one kid. But I know what we did with him. There were none of those options. He ate what we ate. And, you know, sometimes he wasn't as hungry, and so we didn't feed him that much. But then when he was hungry, then we fed him what we ate. And so I think what happened – so my best friend is trying to unravel this right now with his wife.

53:34and he has kind of like his stern way. He was talking to me. I try and tell her, I'm just, don't eat, don't feed him. Don't feed him. And we were laughing, right? Kind of tongue in cheek, but he's serious. And I agree with him. It's just that if you don't give them the treats and snacks, eventually they will get really hungry. And eventually sweet potato and chicken or steak or whatever tastes really good. It's amazing when you are absolutely hungry. But what happens when we introduce a lot of these processed hyperpalatable foods to kids at a very early age, it hits that reward center and they crave it.

54:09And so when they say they're hungry, they're really not hungry. They're craving that snack or that treat that you've allowed them to have in the past. And then you want to sit down and have dinner and they're like, well, no, I want the goldfish or I want the whatever the processed food thing that you've allowed them. And they think that that's an option and it's like no this is just this is what we have to eat and if you're not hungry you know but what you do what you do is you don't in my opinion okay everyone's different how they i would just be like okay if you're not hungry son you don't have to eat right now let me know when you're hungry and then when he's hungry then we eat that that's the option and and then and with with kids it's like it's consistency is so important it's so important that you're consistent with that if you are trying to get him to eat these good foods and then you know pizzas on tuesday with the family you guys go buy mcdonald's on wednesdays and then you're also it's like man you're just gonna have an uphill battle like um but we we were this we made we were very mindful of this from day one and we're very consistent and what's cool for the maybe early parents is that it's cool if you lay the foundation early while they're toddlers because now at six years old, I'll let my son almost eat anything he wants.

55:22And it's so cool that I just told the story earlier on the podcast that he was at a friend's house. They ordered burgers. My son gave back the buns and the fries and ate just the meat. And it's not because I tell him he can't do that. If he would eat a burger, I wouldn't care. But he's eaten consistently like that for so long. That's what he craves and that's what he likes. Yeah. I don't have much to contribute because they're so old now. But I mean, it really boils down to the consistency of it. And it was for us it was to find those healthy foods they actually do like and so this was something i kind of worked with my wife it was like okay he really likes this type of meat and you know to make sure that we still had that available we introduced something new on top of that uh just so you kind of start stacking other options uh around but because we we get in that point where we have a really like our first kid was very on board like he would eat all the healthy food but uh you know the youngest had was very stubborn and would just hold out and so he wouldn't eat and he wouldn't eat for a day and then he wouldn't eat for the next day and we're just like okay we gotta get feed him something this kid is crazy stubborn yeah uh and then so we would just okay well he will eat this so we're gonna make this but you have to you know and it was just like consistently uh you know a lot of times you want to abandon ship and make things easy and i understand that and it's we we're tempted to do that a lot but you know it it's it's part of being a parent it's tough do you remember when uh whenever it made the turn because i know that you've shared this story a little bit before how how dialed you guys were with everett you were a little more loose i mean with uh ethan you were a little more loose with everett you felt like you noticed the difference probably being loose and then then you how did you recorrect because i feel like he's he's good he's good yeah i think it would now yeah he's a good eater now and it's I think it was more when he was around 10 or so, like 9, 10.

57:17It was a battle up until then, like from a toddler up until then, and it's just how it was with him. And just establishing that, though, he's got a good baseline, and so he'll still be able to have a treat and then leave it and not eat the whole thing and that kind of thing. But again, because the oldest will now have exposure to friends who have like candy or have like these other things. And then that's how he was starting. That was starting to trickle down to him. And so, you know, you're going to battle that. But yeah, again, it's, this is like what we're eating is your, and I like that because we, we, we tried to establish the same thing is like what we're all eating as a family is what we're eating.

57:59And then, you know, from there, if you're still hungry, like we have it available, but it's not in the house. Yeah. Next question is from Kevin OG. is it okay to change rep ranges and adjust weights for maps 15? Yeah, I hope you do. Yeah. I mean, adjust weights for sure. If you get stronger rep ranges, the rep ranges that are effective, uh, for building muscle and strength are wide. There's a wide range. It's between one to probably around 25, I would say, but I'd say for argument's sake, you probably want to stay within the rep ranges of like six to 15. Why, why not below six? You can below six, uh, But it requires better technique and focus.

58:39Why not above 15? Stamina starts to play a role, which is okay if that's what you want to train for. But I think between 6 to 15 is a nice range for people to work within. And if you go lower rep, you're going to have to add the weight. And if you go higher rep, you're going to have to lower the weight. But there's nothing wrong at all with the job. I mean, you should adjust rep ranges for well development. I used to tell clients the rule of five, just go 5, 10, 15, 20, 25. So stay in one of those rep ranges. either running fives, running tens, running fifteens, running twenties, you can go to 25.

59:10But that was kind of the idea. It's like, if you want to change your rep ranges, rule of five, you know, if you're, if you've been doing fives, go to tens and then fifteens and 20, that they're all, all those have like, and they're, and they're different enough, right? The difference between five and 10 and 10 and 15 and 15 and 20 is, is enough to create a novel stimulus to you, but you know, absolutely adjust it. But we always, I do want to make a point to say this though, not including weights. If you are strong and the weight you chose the last week is too light, add weight. Go more. We'll always say that.

59:41Especially in that type of a structure with the Mass 15. I think it invites you to really crank that dial, that intensity dial a little bit more because you have the opportunity to recover. And it's very beneficial for that. So from that perspective, anytime you can add weights, add weights. But I always encourage people to run our programs as laid out in regards to sets and reps and exercise selection at least one time all the way through to let the programming do what it's supposed to. Unless this is an advanced personal trainer who's asking this question and then why are you asking this question?

1:00:20You can do that. But for most people, you will benefit from running through the professional protocol that we built and then modifying it to some of the questions you're asking. Next question is from Sam Oday. Is it possible to build muscle in a deficit when you're obese? My thinking is your body has enough energy to use that you can still build muscle as long as you're hitting your protein target, even if you're in a deficit. So this is a good question because we've said before that if you're not feeding yourself excess calories, your body doesn't have the materials to build. So this is a logical question, right?

1:01:01Well, I have excess calories stored on my body. Can that make up the difference? No, and here's why. Now, technically, can you build muscle in a cut? You can. But here's why this doesn't happen. When you're in a deficit, your body is thinking conserve calories. Yes. So building muscle is a - Counter signal. It's counter signal. If I'm eating less calories than I'm burning and my body's having to tap into itself, albeit stored body fat, it really doesn't want to add this active tissue called muscle that's going to, for lack of better term, speed up your metabolism. So it's sending a signal that says don't try to burn more calories.

1:01:43Let's get that. In fact, the signal you're sending in a deficit is to pair muscle down. Now, if you strength train and hit high protein while being in a calorie deficit, you'll mitigate that quite a bit. Maybe even negate it completely through that process. But being in a deficit and trying to build, this is like turning a light switch on and off at the same time. A lot of times, it doesn't happen. Now, I want to address the anomalies that somebody who's listening is like, but wait a second. I was on a weight loss journey and I lost 50 pounds and I did a dextra scan and I saw I did build muscle.

1:02:15And I've addressed this before. If you're on a calorie deficit, that isn't like a dramatic calorie deficit. Like you're not on a thousand, fifteen hundred calorie deficit every single day. It's not like our body's working on this perfect clock, seven day a week, 24 hours. So what it means is that in a 30 day window, you are mostly in a deficit. But there can be periods of time, say you ate a big meal, where your body signals that you're in a slight surplus, even though you're in a total deficit overall. And so there's a possibility that somebody who is in a deficit trying to lose might add a couple pounds of muscle through that process.

1:02:56Normally, that means they were at a really good deficit, like they're not too extreme of a deficit, so that there's actually sometimes in the deficit where their body's at a maintenance or even a little bit of a surplus. but the overall 30-day window looks like a total deficit. And so you'll see that sometimes where if you are – but at the end of the day, you're lifting weights to spare as much muscle as you can. You're in a diet – That's why you're lifting a deficit. You are lifting to send a signal to hang on to that muscle because if you don't – because I don't want the attitude of this person to be like, oh, well, shit, if I can't build muscle on this weight loss program, I might as well stop lifting weights.

1:03:28No, that would be a horrible idea because then what will happen is you actually might see the scale go down a little bit faster, but then you'll be paring down muscle. 40 % of the weight loss will be muscle. Yes. So you are sending a signal to the body to just hold on. We need this muscle. We may not have enough material to go build muscle, but we're not going to get rid of any of this that we already have because this guy is making me still lift weights. So I'm going to keep that. So dropping 20 pounds on the scale and losing no muscle is a bigger success than losing 30 pounds on the scale and having lost 10 or 12 pounds of muscle along with those 20 pounds of fat.

1:04:00So keep that in mind. Next question is from Wally. how do you deal with a mass amount of clients? I have 17 clients right now, and I am finding it difficult to stay on top of their programming and progress at times. This is interesting because 17 clients isn't a ton. I mean, are you training them four days a week each or three days a week each? You've got yourself a decent book. This is probably, you're looking at 34, maybe 40 sessions a week, probably more like 30 sessions a week, which is full time. Yeah. But you may be, you may find it difficult to stay up on the programming because you're writing up their programming well before their workouts and you're doing all that.

1:04:44When, and I used to do this as an early trainer, I'd write up the workouts before they come in. And then I realized when I would train clients, I'd have to change so much of it while I was training them because I was watching them move. And like, well, I have this exercise down, but really I got to do this. First you have to learn to unlearn though. Yeah. That's true. That's true. Yes. You got to go through that process. Yeah. So this, these types of questions sometimes dude i'm oh i wish i wish you guys did this when i was a 19 20 year old trainer and i had nothing to do with you guys and you guys built all this stuff because i would rip all your shit and i would have made four times as much money as i made as a trainer the fact that we have all this free content and even our programs that all go on sale for 60 off so i don't know do the math if you own every single program and mod and free guide we had like i would have all of that at access i would never write a program again i would pull from your guys's stuff i would then take two minutes to customize it to the client who has rolled their ankle or can't go four days a week they're two days a week maybe cross out this exercise oh do this one instead and like be done with it like why would i why especially as a trainer who's less than a decade into training think that i'm gonna sit down and write better programs for my client five years into my career than these jerk offs who've been doing it for 60 years and thousands of clients like and they have all this stuff like blows my we and when we meet trainers that don't take all of our stuff like dude go take it and go help people yeah for sure there's so many tools now and but again i'm gonna go back to like okay 17 clients i and yeah look when you're training 30 sessions a week it does it you're on for 30 hours if you have no systems maybe but like come on i look you guys know how disorganized i am i don't have any systems i had that's exactly yeah yeah right steal all this stuff i had i had i had no i was unorganized so over the three of us justin was the most organized by far for sure sal and i were a shit show yeah posted notes whatever on the fly.

1:06:50Yeah, but it's all up here. And it's like, you go. But I mean, this didn't exist. Like, if this existed, I mean, I would be - Especially with CRM. Bro, I would use all of your guys' stuff. Like, everything. I wouldn't even answer questions anymore. I'd go to ask - Client would ask me a question. I'd be like, give me two minutes. But askmindpump.com, I'd plug it in. And then I'd be like, here, I made a YouTube video for you. And here's a white paper to go right with it. week you're like i do also think there's a i think some trainers over program when it comes to the clients for sure now programming is more you have to be more precise when programming when i'm writing a program for someone i'm not going to train if someone tells me i'm going to work out for the next three months like i'm happy that's when it matters i have to really think about it yeah when you're coming to me and every time you work out you're with me i'm going to usually do full body and I'm going to watch how you move and based on how you move and how you felt yesterday and how your sleep was, which I'm going to ask you every session, my workout is going to adjust in the session.

1:07:50And so there's not a lot of, you have a skeleton for it, but literally everything is the best train, the best trainers that listen to us and follow us. The top trainers use all the mass programs for the scaffolding. That's what they do. That is like every, the client maps anabolic or whatever. That's what they're following. And then they make micro adjustments based off of that. On the fly. Yes, on the fly. But that is their scaffolding. It's like, this is what we're doing today. And then, oh, that client can't do barbell back squat, so I just put this in. It's like that's the majority of your programming thinking.

1:08:21Like the fact that you would, when the resources that are out there are like - You guys are hurting Adam right now. Oh my God. Well, it's crazy because I can relate to this guy or girl. Guy, girl, do we know? I guess a guy. Okay, I can relate to this person because I was as if not more disorganized than you were. So I was definitely, but stuff like this didn't exist. There wasn't somebody having all the programs for every type of client you had. There wasn't like an askmindpump.com that gives me all the answers. There wasn't YouTube clips broken down. There wasn't white papers and blogs for every single question a client will ever ask.

1:08:54Like, come on, dude. Adam's about to go Wes Watson. It's still one of my favorite. You kidding me? 17 clients? 17 clients? Yeah, dude. Get out of here. You know how many sessions I was training a week? At one point, it was like 55, 60. Bro, I maintain this as a fitness manager. Yeah. I had 17 to 20 clients as a fitness manager running the show. Come on, guy. Get your shit together. We just made him feel terrible. All right, look. A little tough love. If you like this show, come find us on Instagram. We'll see you at Mind Pump Media. Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body, dramatically improve your health and energy, and maximize your overall performance, Check out our discounted RGB Super Bundle at mindpumpmedia.com.

1:09:40The RGB Super Bundle includes MAPS Anabolic, MAPS Performance, and MAPS Aesthetic. Nine months of phased expert exercise programming designed by Sal, Adam, and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels, and performs. With detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos, The RGB Super Bundle is like having Sal, Adam, and Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Super Bundle has a full 30-day money-back guarantee, and you can get it now plus other valuable free resources at mindpumpmedia.com. If you enjoy this show, please share the love by leaving us a five-star rating and review on iTunes and by introducing Mind Pump to your friends and family.

1:10:27We thank you for your support, and until next time, this is Mind Pump.

From the publisher

In this episode of Quah (Q & A), Sal, Adam & Justin answer four Pump Head questions drawn from last Sunday's Quah post on the @mindpumpmedia Instagram page.

Mind Pump Fit Tip: The best isolation exercises for every body part. (2:21)
Getting your protein in with Butcher Box. (20:28)
Reminiscing on old high school photos and yearbook sign off's. (26:23)
An exercise in breaking generational trauma. (31:29)
Letting your kids be free and have more independence. (36:45)
The benefits of going through a treatment center to help with withdrawal. (41:48)
Faith without works is dead. (47:03)
Earn triple entries NOW for our Black Friday sale! (51:01)
#Quah question #1 – What kind of healthy foods do your toddlers like to eat? I'm struggling with my son. (52:10)
#Quah question #2 – Is it okay to change rep ranges and adjust weights for MAPS 15? (58:05)
#Quah question #3 – Is it possible to build muscle in a deficit when you're obese? My thinking is that your body has enough energy to use so that you can still build muscle as long as you're hitting your protein target, even if you're in a deficit. (1:00:31)
#Quah question #4 – How do you deal with a mass number of clients? I have 17 clients right now (big box gym) and am finding it difficult to stay on top of their programming and progress at times. (1:04:01)

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Exercise Video Demos – Mind Pump TV
Mind Pump #2684: Do ONLY These 8 Lifts to Achieve an Amazing Body
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Sal Di Stefano's Journey in Faith & Fitness – Mind Pump TV
Visit Seed for an exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! ** Code 20MINDPUMP for 20% off your first month of Seed's DS-01® Daily Synbiotic. **
Mind Pump #1827: The 3 Best Rep Ranges to Build Muscle & Burn Fat
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People Mentioned

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Bret Contreras PhD (@bretcontreras1) Instagram
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Adam | Relationship Psychology (@attachmentadam) Instagram
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