2748: This 90-Day Method Beats Every Diet

In short

Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - Episode 2748 Summary

Episode Overview In this episode, the Mind Pump hosts Sal Di Stefano, Adam Schafer, and Justin Andrews discuss the Ultimate 90-Day Fat Loss Challenge while addressing listener questions on varying topics related to fitness, health, and societal issues. The hosts emphasize science-backed methods over fad diets, flipping the script on common fitness myths.

Key Segments

Mind Pump Fit Tip: The Ultimate 90-Day Fat Loss Challenge (1:57)
Goal: Introduce a simple, effective fat loss plan that emphasizes sustainable habits.
Structure:
Two different workouts repeated three times a week.
Diet focusing on high protein intake, with emphasis on whole foods.
No weighing or frequent body checks to avoid discouragement, instead, rely on visual progress through photos.

Teaching New Food Behaviors (16:55)
Importance of developing healthy eating habits centered around high-protein meals.
Discussion on how societal norms influence perceptions of what constitutes a suitable breakfast.

Protein as the Ultimate Macronutrient (20:50)
High protein intake is linked to muscle building, satiety, and fat loss.
Recommendations:
Men should aim for 50g of protein and women for 30g per meal.
Incorporate well-cooked vegetables and complex carbohydrates afterward.

Probiotics as the First Fat-Burning Supplement (24:49)
Evidence suggesting probiotics can aid in fat loss, with studies indicating an average loss of 1-3 kg over 12 weeks of probiotic use.

Pushing Your Body to Its Limits (28:58)
The hosts discuss the importance of adequate training volumes while avoiding overtraining.

Societal and Economic Insights (35:04)
Discusses the implications of the declining middle class and its potential effects on societal structure.

Fun Facts with Justin (39:00)
Introduction of a social experiment concept called "This Man" and its psychological implications.

Family and AI Concerns (41:59)
The potential impact of an absent father on girls experiencing earlier puberty.
Discussion regarding the ethical concerns surrounding AI advancements and their ramifications on society and labor force.

Listener Questions (57:35)
Q1: Dumbbell shoulder pressing - Neutral vs. Traditional grip. Discussed the pros and cons of each grip type.
Q2: The effectiveness of agility training tools like ladders or parachutes for athletes.
Q3: Guidance for a busy parent on workout frequency and type.
Q4: Is it too late for a career in fitness at 52? Discussed the advantages older trainers may have.

Key Takeaways

Simplicity in Fitness: The proposed 90-day fat loss plan offers an uncomplicated approach that can be effective for a large percentage of individuals.
Protein Emphasis: Prioritizing protein in meals is crucial for effective weight management and muscle preservation.
Psychological Aspect of Fitness: Self-image and the psychological impact of not tracking weight progress can significantly influence success.
Aging and the Fitness Industry: Older fitness professionals can connect better with clients and offer invaluable experience that younger trainers might not have.

Transcript

Automatic transcript. May contain errors.

0:00If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mind pump, Mind Pump with your hosts, Sal DiStefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. You just found the most downloaded fitness, health, and entertainment podcast. This is Mind Pump. In today's episode, we answered listeners' questions. People wrote in to Instagram, at Mind Pump Media. We picked some questions. We answered them. But this was after our intro. Today's intro is 56 minutes long. This is where we talk about fitness and fat loss and muscle gain, current events, family life. Always a good time. Again, if you want to write in a question that we can pick, go to Instagram at MindPumpMedia.

0:41Now, this episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is Seed. This is the world's best probiotic. If you want to use a probiotic and you want to get the benefits of using a probiotic like fat loss, which I talk about in today's episode, go with Seed. Go to Seed.com forward slash MindPump. Use the code 20MINDPUMP. Get 20 % off. This episode is also brought to you by Organifi, makers of organic supplements for health. Today we talked about their red juice and green juice. Mix them together for the Christmas blend. High energy stress reduction. Go check them out. Go to Organifi.com.

1:15That's O-R-G-A-N-I-F-I.com forward slash Mind Pump. Use the code Mind Pump to get 20 % off. Also, our new program, MAPS 15 Strong. This is a 15-minute version of MAPS Strong. So it's 15 minutes a day, two lifts a day based off of MAPS Strong workout programming. It's 50 % off right now until the 13th. You got to get it now. Go to maps15strong.com. Use the code December50 for the discount. All right, real quick. If you love us like we love you, why not show up by rocking one of our shirts, hats, mugs, or training gear over at mindpumpstore.com? I'm talking right now. Hit pause. Head on over to mindpumpstore.com.

1:55That's it. Enjoy the rest of the show. All right, here's what we're going to do. We're going to give you the plan. we're going to give you it all laid out a plan for the ultimate 90 day fat loss challenge that's right we're going to give you the workout diet strategy everything you need here we go let's break it down so here's what i wanted to do a little different i'm going to just go through what the plan is and then let's talk about why why it works why do it this way and so my thought process was this what if jess and i disagree well that's gonna get awkward then it'll get real awkward uh no i would love yeah any changes or input but um you know people like specifics they like 90 day this and i know it goes against uh really our message of longevity and so but but that's kind of baked in here what's baked into this is my goal is uh with this is to hopefully create some habits with people and show them some movement in a 90 day period um now i do want to say this going into this if you're over trained and under eating already let's let's let's skip this this is like if you're healthy if you're healthy here's what your plan is if you're not healthy and you're over doing my my first question i have right out the gates for something like this without even seeing where you're going is um there obviously is a a a kind of specific avatar that you're probably addressing and i'm assuming that avatar is somebody who wants to lean out but is already in a healthy metabolic place.

3:26That's right. And that's what this looks like. That's right. If you do not. I will say this, following this, if you're not in a healthy metabolic place, but you follow this, you'll still be better off. Okay, well, that's good. You'll be better off and you'll build some muscle as well. Okay. So body composition change is what you'll experience through this process. So let's start with a workout. So what I do is I create two very basic workouts, and you're going to alternate them every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday, or whatever three days you want. A good day off in between is probably a good idea.

3:58Day one is squats, incline press. You're going to do some kind of a row, overhead presses, curls, and press downs. So there's your exercise for day one. Do a few sets of each. Day two, or workout two, is deadlifts, some kind of a bench press, pull downs, rear flies. some reverse crunches or something for your core and some calf raises. Those are the two general workouts you'll be alternating, um, every other day or three days a week. Hmm. Uh, month one, you're going to be working in the low rep range, uh, around six to eight reps. Month two, the reps are a little higher, maybe around 12 and month three, you can play around with about 15 rep range.

4:38So as you go through this program, your rep rate, your reps will go up, which means you're probably going to have to adjust, uh, the weight, uh, to be able to hit those reps. Diet-wise, this is all I'm going to tell you to do. Aim for 30 to 50 grams of protein at least three times a day with the protein shake in there. If you're a man, you're going to be closer to 50. If you're a woman, you're closer to 30. Eat that first. Then eat some well-cooked veggies and then have your carbohydrates. Stick to the whole foods. That's your diet. And then here's what you do for the challenge. You're not going to weigh yourself.

5:12You're just going to do this. On day one, take a picture of yourself in your underwear or in clothing that shows your body from the front, side, and back, and then take another picture 90 days out. So you're going to wait a full 90 days before you look in the mirror to really see. No waiting, no looking at mirrors, none of that. That's right, because that'll mess you up, especially if you're coming from a bad metabolic place. Stay on target. And 30 to 50 grams of protein is actually more than you're used to. Yeah. You might freak yourself out with changes in the scale. So the only contention I might have, so you had incline press.

5:47Yeah. And you had bench press. Yeah. But we didn't have like a shoulder press. Shoulder press was in the first one. Oh, what? Overhead press, yeah. Oh, I didn't see that. So this sounds like. Oh, there it is. Three guys who have this incredible MAPS anabolic program that's changed so many lives, but you've taken it after 10 years and simplified it even more and gave it more specific, easy to follow. Simplistic, yeah. Because what you did was you eliminated some diversity in the exercises, stuck to the biggest bang for your buck movements. You simplified it to just literally two workouts that you're rotating.

6:25You also took out the, oh, you're rotating every third week, and you go just that whole month you do this, this whole month you do this, which makes that super easy. And then we actually give some diet advice, which we normally don't give diet advice inside most of the maps programs. There are some that have later on, but what we, and this is what we've learned from years of, you know, thousands of people going through mass programs is I wish you would just tell me something. And instead of being like, well, that's impossible because we can't do that for everybody. What are the, what, what are the couple things I could tell somebody that will make the cause good, that will create incredible results across the board on everybody.

7:02regardless of where their metabolism is or not, and distilled it down to that. This is, okay, so knowing this, and you have to be honest, because it's asking me to change your baby, right? Or your child. What you have learned from marketing and from the thousands and thousands of people that we've been, if you went back and rewrote MAPS Anabolic, would you have rewrote it like this? The thing I would have changed would have been the name. well that too big time we learned that yeah that i think the big time i don't know if i would have changed the program because in the program you have video demos and we're not doing that no no the program is phenomenal i'm saying i what diet to reach the masses here's my and i bet i bet doug agrees with me here would you would you would this have better served us if we if we had built something this simple this direct this valuable as as the flagship first product that we let out Now, that's not taking anything away from how amazing Mass Ennebolic is.

8:04There's a reason why it's the flagship product, why everybody sees incredible. It's all to follow. But what you understand about the consumer today. Yeah, from a consumer standpoint, probably. Yes. There's no shrugs here. I think some people will complain about that. I personally will. I mean, that's what this screams to me, no? Shrugs are great. Yeah, no, it's definitely a simpler program. In fact, as we're sitting here, I'm contemplating, I think I'm going to try this. Yeah. So here's what I want to say. I want to be very clear, right? So nothing's going to give you results like having an individualized program, no MAPS program.

8:39What I'm saying here, definitely not. That being said, I can say this with full confidence. Probably 80 % of the people watching and listening to this right now, so that's a vast majority, will get phenomenal results just from doing this. Now, you'll hear fitness influencers say, everybody. No, it's impossible it doesn't work that way there's a good 20 of you that need far more individualization this will be inappropriate for yeah it's not right whatever but a good majority of a big majority 80 i would bet of the people watching and listening if you just did what i said right here in 90 days uh you would see significant difference now the thing about this i think you see pretty good difference in just just 30 days 30 days following that yeah true to that yep with like not the whoops, weekends, all that.

9:27That's right. Like consistent? Like consistently for that in 30 days. Oh, and 90 days you would see really good workouts. Yeah, yeah. And now here, I'm going to tell you what the most important part of all this is. People are like, is it the diet? Is it the workout? No, the most important part is at the very end when I said, you take a picture in the beginning and then you take a picture at the end. Yeah, yeah. Because what will mess you up with what I'm doing here is not trusting the process, weighing yourself every single day, watching water fluctuation changes, questioning everything. I need to do more.

9:56I need to eat less. Am I doing whatever? And you really mess yourself up. Well, let me tell you what else you're accounting for. Because some people have a hard time wrapping their brain. Wait, this makes no sense. How could you not give a calorie range? And it's like, if you follow this and you have accidentally some high days of calories where you go over a little bit, and then some days where you go a little lower in calories, what will end up happening is at the end of this, you'll have built muscle. and probably lost a little bit of body fat. And what might also happen is the scale not move very much, but you'll look very different.

10:32That's right. Organically, that will happen. If you follow that that way and you have the occasional high-calorie day, but you stick to hitting the protein, you stick to the weight training, and you have some days where, oh, I probably didn't move enough or I ate a little too much and, oh, I put on a little bit. That's right. Probably got allocated to build some muscle. Then you have other days where you're like right on top. you moved a lot, you burned, and then you were in a deficit. What ends up happening at the end of this is you see this beautiful exchange. I'm going to say this. I had this conversation last week with my daughter and my niece.

11:03I just had this conversation this morning with all my cousins. I had this conversation last night with my cousin. In the context of proper strength training, because that's important. You have good, proper strength. In this program, the very basic strength training program, for most people will get you stronger and build muscle and do great. It'll be appropriate for most people. So in other words, it'll be very effective. This is like your average gym member that used to come up to me and be like, yeah, you know, like, I just want to know something basic to do. Like, what can I do? You know, like, right away, it's going to get me some result.

11:33I don't really want to, you know, spend too much time thinking about it. Boom. That's right. So in the context of proper strength training. Okay. So imagine that context. If you ate 30 to 50 grams of protein three times a day, and if you're a woman, it's closer to 30. If you're a man, it's closer to 50. Again, I'm generalizing, but this is true for most people. After that, you ate well-cooked vegetables. And after that, you had your carbs. So you just, that's the order of your meal. And you wait until you were satisfied. And you stuck to whole natural foods. And you threw in one shake a day, 30 to 50 grams of protein shake a day.

12:09Here's what happens in the context of proper strength training. Your appetite will adjust naturally to allow you to build muscle and burn body fat. what happens is your body's natural appetite, your natural like, oh, I want to eat more, or I think I'm full, will start to follow this pattern of moving your body to a body composition change that is relatively fit and healthy. What does that mean? For most men, you're probably going to be around, I don't know, probably around 14 % body fat, give or take. For a woman, around around 22%, give or take, is where are you going to fall? Because your body, in the context of strength training properly and sticking to whole natural foods, like you go off whole foods, you eat processed foods, it throws everything off because they're engineered to make you overeat.

12:57But if you stick to whole foods, you hit high protein, you eat the vegetables, like I said, if you do that, your appetite will naturally go up and down to help you build muscle and burn body fat. And you'll mess yourself up if you track every single day your weight. But if you do what I said with the picture, And by the way, make sure the picture's in the same place, same lighting, everything the same, so you have nice, consistent. Watch what happens to your body. And again, I was talking to my cousins this morning. I'm like, you guys, if you just did this, your body fat percentage will go where it needs to instead of trying to fight it all the time.

13:28So this is so great that you went through this direct. I had an hour ahead of traffic last night and got caught up with my cousin, who I haven't talked to in a really long time. She's a little bit older than I am and struggled with weight for most of her adult, especially after kids life and uh feels like she's tried everything with her son um and we had this long conversation it literally was this is the this is the protocol like literally but what i will say that i spent the the most of the conversation after we we laid this out and i explained to her like this is all i want you to focus on which is almost identical to what you what you laid out her challenge and i think this will be the greatest challenge for a lot of people especially female clients because my female clients tend to struggle with the protein more than men even though men do too uh is getting ahead on the grams of protein for breakfast yes she couldn't so she i and i said she was all she was doing is having shakes and bars all the time and she was just like you know i was talking to my trainer friend she goes ideally i should be eating home i said that's good advice you know they're not bad for you but why it's not good is that it's not realistic you need to what has happened is you have created behaviors around the morning time of either skipping or not eating high protein meals that we need to learn so i'm asking her questions like do you eat this do you like this she doesn't like greek yogurt she doesn't like cottage cheese she she can handle eggs but not a big fan of it and i'm like well are you are you like adamant about like it has to like look like a breakfast food or would you have ground beef and white rice for breakfast for nine o 'clock in the morning she's like oh i would totally do that i'm like oh great this is perfect so then what i want you to do is when you cook that for dinner i want you just to cook an extra serving and portion it out and put it in the refrigerator because you also time was an issue too she's like i don't have a lot of time in the morning i said i'm not gonna make you make something so all i want you to do is just re-eat that ground beef and rice now if you want because you make it feel more breakfasty crack two eggs over it throw it in the iron skillet and stir it all up and now it feels more breakfasty to you but if you're okay with it.

15:30That's how I eat a breakfast all the time. And now you're at 40, 50 grams of protein first thing in the morning. It makes the rest of the day so much easier. It does. The other thing too, I want to add Adam is when you're, when you're not hitting it from whole foods versus trying to get a lot of it from bars and shakes, bars and shakes. Now they are high in protein, but they're still processed, meaning that they don't provide the same satiety effects as whole foods. They just don't, you know, 45 grams of protein from flank steak or chicken, or fish is going to give you that natural appetite signal that I just talked about.

16:06Whereas bars don't tend to do that as well. Now I did say, I did tell people to add a 30 to 50 gram protein shake because it's hard. It is hard for a man to hit 180 grams of protein a day. It's hard for a woman to hit 130 grams or 140 grams of protein a day. So I'm giving you that shake to make up the difference. But if you stick to whole foods with this, you guys, You're going to get leaner and build muscle. In other words, you don't have to track and worry about everything. Now, I don't want to say this is easy because it's actually quite difficult enough to avoid processed foods. That's difficult.

16:43It's just simple. And it's difficult to be consistent. It's not easy. Yes, it's simple. But if you just follow this for 90 days, you'll see what your body can do. And it's pretty amazing. And if it works and you love it, keep going. I want to talk more, though, about what I just said with the shakes and bars, because as I was saying it to her, it's like, I don't know if I've ever really communicated that before or that way to other clients or on this podcast. And I think it's an important point. What I noticed with with people around bars and shakes, that it's a it's a behavior that's connected to only when I'm on my fitness kick.

17:18Meaning I know I hear a protein is important and I'm going to start working out. So I'm going to start adding these shakes and bars in. And then when they fall off, it just falls off. And then so does the protein intake. And what they never do is they never teach themselves new behaviors around food choices that are high in protein. Real food choices. And so it isn't just that because I was explaining to her. It's not like a shake is bad. It's not bad. And it's not like if you add all the shakes and bars that equal the protein, you couldn't possibly get fit. We've done the studies. We've seen it.

17:50I've tested it. Like it's possible. but what really we're also trying to do is we're trying to create new behaviors that you can do forever and so if your brain right now what breakfast has always looked like is either skipping it and coffee or it's a waffle or it's this cart it's like and you've never thought that you can have ground beef and rice for breakfast and you actually like it and you don't mind it's like this becomes a new behavior that you don't mind doing and now a great source of 40 to 50 grams of protein that you unlocked it's so funny because breakfast uh made up by general mills it was a it's the most an ego waffle it's bacon and all that so so there's two food categories that receive the most advertising and marketing it's breakfast and snacks yeah uh so let's stick to breakfast breakfast is so heavily marketed that when i say high protein breakfast everybody's like well i guess it's eggs yeah because you don't need anything else for breakfast yeah otherwise it's cereal or pancakes well breakfast food is food Food is food.

18:49Food is food. It's just we've been heavily marketed to think that breakfast has to look a particular way. Totally. Which makes it difficult to make a protein. It was so enlightening for me to hear her respond that way and go like, God, how many people think this way? It's like that we have been – that shows you just how well we've been marketed to and we've been conditioned that these foods look like this. It's like, are you kidding me right now? Do you think like if this was caveman times, like you go, oh, no, there's no there's no eggs and bacon. It's like, oh, you're eating chicken. Maybe you're eating ground, you're eating whatever you can get your hands on.

19:23That's good. And so and then it's I mean, I love it. And I like to because I do I do like the benefits of eggs. And it does make me feel it's even it's breakfast by cracking two eggs over it. So if you feel like you need to do that, then that just boosts the protein. Eggs are beneficial. but it was such an unlock for her and why to me why that's so important okay even if if all things were equated with the shake it's like the shake ends up falling off when the when the when the workout starts falling off but that meal that she now can learn to have is a good meal working out or not like that's a a good be a new good behavior and that's what i'm looking at when i'm looking at a client when i'm trying to teach them to not have all these shakes and bars it's not because it's bad or you can't get your results away.

20:10It's like, no, it's like, you're using that because you're on this health kick. I want to teach you ways of eating that are beneficial to you, whether you're lifting weights or not lifting weights and create those new behaviors, that that becomes something consistent. And just for people, if you haven't heard us talk about this before, why the protein? It builds muscle, it produces satiety, it balances blood sugar, and it helps with fat loss. So two equal calorie diets, both in a deficit, the higher protein one produces more fat loss and preserve more muscles. That's why high protein is something that we often talk about and why we're recommending it here.

20:51Speaking of which, we talk about it so much. I've trained so many people and implemented these things with them and I know how it works. But oftentimes you don't do it yourself for whatever reason, right? It's, you know, I typically eat high protein anyway, but I wasn't consistently hitting 200 plus grams of protein every single day. I would say on average, I was always probably around 150 to 170, which is a lot, which is great. Okay, there's nothing wrong with that, it's great. But I'm at 200 and between 215 to 220. And if I were to take my own advice, I would be hitting about 220 grams of protein a day.

21:30So over the last four weeks, I said, you know what? I'm going to actually consciously hit 220 grams of protein a day, every single day. I'm not going to change anything else. I'm not going to change my workouts. I'm not going to change my supplements. I'm not going to try to eat more, try to eat less. I'm just going to pay attention. And the way I've done it. Boom, you built muscle. Well, obviously, here's what happened. So here's the experience. I initially built some muscle, I would say probably about two or three pounds of lean body mass, which is a lot for me. I've been doing this forever and two or three pounds and now you can eat like a horse also well what's now happened is as i gained the two or three pounds my metabolic rate flying and i just got shredded yeah it was that process it was like i built a little bit and here i am about five weeks in of doing this maybe four or five weeks and i'm like dude i'm getting like veins in my ass like what is going on and i'm like oh it's because i it's the protein it was just the protein yeah and i did it mostly through food but sometimes shakes i'm just consistent like every day every day so I've been beating this drum for 10 years, man.

22:33It's crazy. And I feel so strongly about it because I'm so aware of it, and I discipline myself to do it, and I still fall short. So it's like I know if I'm doing that. If I don't chase it, I'll miss it. It's hard. 90 % of the people. I know someone listening right now going, oh, I'm fine. I never miss. It's like, okay, you're literally less than 10 % of the population. Most people do not consistently do that, especially the upper limits. They're thinking of their best day, though, too. They're thinking of their best day. They're also calculating what, like, the bare 0.8 grams or whatever, 0.6 to 0.8 grams, what they're the bare minimum.

23:09Not optimal. Optimal is all the way up to one, one and a half. Like, that's a lot of protein. If you weigh more than$1.50, that's a lot of protein for the average person. And it takes, like, to be deliberate about every meal. like for me to go and hit 200 to 220 every day i have to like literally look at the meal and go like man am i getting at least eight to 12 ounces of meat right here because if i'm not i'm gonna get behind here and like the every meal has to look at that and then even then it's a lighter day where i only get three meals in i'm gonna have to add a shake at the end of the day just to catch up well i'm gonna say this look just so people know just so people understand how much 200 grams of protein is that's two pounds of relatively lean red meat a day a day every single day and a big serving of meat is six to eight ounces a big serving so do so think about that for a second do you so when you sit down and have a steak for dinner or lunch whatever a big service restaurants serve you four ounces on on most places so like a good size serving is six to eight ounces of in my experience most of my female clients when we started tracking were consuming 60 grams of protein in a day men 80 maybe maybe 90 yeah uh so it makes a big difference it makes a huge difference and like i said earlier it will naturally adjust your appetite that's what's cool about this 90 day fat loss challenge is i'm not telling you to eat a certain amount of calories i'm telling you a few things try it for yourself don't take pictures and study yourself in the mirror the whole time.

24:45Wait till the end of 90 days and see what happens. I think people will be pretty surprised. Speaking of fat loss, I looked up because you guys know how the studies on probiotics are like so rad. They're so weird. They're weird because they affect things that you wouldn't even suggest. The performance side of it is so bizarre to me. I looked up. I had AI give me a general analysis of all the studies that are peer reviewed on fat loss for probiotics. What do the studies show when people just add a probiotic for fat loss? Because that was really what was interesting to me. It's interesting to me that all these studies are coming out showing that you could take a probiotic and it helps with fat loss.

25:25Like what? What's going on here? On average in the studies, an average person adding a probiotic will lose between one to two kilograms of body fat over eight to 12 weeks. After 12 weeks, it tends to go up to three kilograms so you're looking at three to six pounds of body fat from just taking a probiotic that's wild they're not doing anything else do you think that's a fat burner yeah that's the first fat burner supplement do you think like legit do you think this was has been always been the case that like this this science was there or do you think that we have just destroyed our our gut that bad that that's what this is really highlighting more than anything else probably that I feel like that's what this is.

26:10I feel like probiotics were not designed to - Like we've just killed our, quote unquote, metabolism. Yes, and our gut is under attack and trying to normalize all the time because of all the shit that we intake. We breathe all the things, right? And that's only compounded over decades that a probiotic, which is not designed to speed your metabolism up, burn more calories, or do anything that's regarding fat loss. but because it it incrementally right away starts to impact your gut in a positive way right away a byproduct of that is metabolically oh your body's working the way it's supposed to yeah or even just a little bit better even if it's not working the way it's supposed to it's like it's better than what it was yesterday it's like the vitamin d studies like yeah people take vitamin d get all these great benefits because we're all so deprived dude i mean that's that's what i read into this like i don't i don't think this is like revolutionary science on like a probiotic like oh my god this whole time it was a fat burner we didn't know it's like no our guts are just being so destroyed that you can pick a hundred random people and they and then take them take a probiotic take a good one a high quality one they're in it you know seed is the company we work with you know i'm so like and are you have you been taking it regularly i i have never seed is great maybe i noticed maybe the best thing to come of this whole thing that i went through is i i'm on i'm tomorrow's 30 days okay since everything but i have not missed a supplement in 30 days i don't i can't tell you the last time and i mean i'm on i'm on the south stack right now and i'm like i'm i mean i've like my mantle has got my room has got i mean i must have 40 bottles up there like this is what this guy feels like every day but i have to admit that like because of the i had to type of deal it's building uh this consistency for me And seed's one of the many things that's on the stack right now that I'm consistently doing.

28:06Have you noticed any different? Let me think. For you, with seed, I would expect improvements in skin and digestion. So the main reason that I started taking it was because I told you how destroyed my stool has been. So I wouldn't say that. Which is a normal side effect. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's true. It's hard to know. I mean, I'm getting better. I'm not like what I will say honest to everybody is that even 30 days later, I am not 100%. But every day I'm a little bit better. And so, and it's, what I don't know is had I not been doing all these things, how would I feel right now? So I believe from what I've been doing has been making that process better.

28:52And so I'm going to stay consistent with it. So it'll be interesting in like, let's say 30 more days. Yeah, that's crazy. Who was it that wrote about the influence of her diet on the 10 ,000 calories? Yeah, I put that in there. I saw a clip. So what happened to this? I didn't look into it. So he was trying to do like a set himself up for like one of those weight loss things where you, you know, it's like a trainer where they put on a lot of weight and then they do this like transformational reveal at the end. We've seen somebody do this a few times before, but it was like a 10 ,000 calorie diet that he was on.

29:29And he was taking in all these calories, and apparently he died in his sleep. Do they know what caused the death? Because he was young. Yeah, he was super young. Yeah, and it was the extreme. I don't know exactly. We should pull that up, Doug, and find out. 30 years old. 30? Yeah, a Russian. Do they know what caused the death? Was it the extreme? Suspected heart failure. Heart failure, yeah. And wasn't he already in good shape and then he did it? Yeah. I don't know. Let me take a look at this. That's weird. 10 ,000 calories a day and he died. So he gained 28 pounds in a month. Yeah. His goal was to gain at least 55 pounds and document the process of losing the weight to promote his upcoming weight loss program.

30:17He was trying to gain it really fast. It was only a matter of time before these stupid things that these people had been doing for quite some time. I mean, that shouldn't kill you. No. But there's a perfect storm with some people. You were pressuring the hinges, yeah. Well, yeah, and if you had some underlining already, like heart issues and conditions and you didn't know, and you pushed the levers up. I mean, you remember Super Size Me. Yeah. And you remember all the markers. Yeah, he went crazy. Yeah, it went nuts. That's crazy. Have either one of you ever ate 10 ,000 calories in a day before?

Read the full transcript

30:49I think I have after a show. 10 ,000? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I've done, I think I've done six or seven. Six or seven, maybe. I didn't. I couldn't do 10 ,000. I don't even think that. Maybe like five. Yeah, I'm pretty sure I did. 10 ,000? I could go back and go, I wasn't tracking, like trying to get it, but I'm pretty sure I cleared 10. I'm pretty sure. Wow. I mean, but come on. But what did that feel? Eight weeks. Yeah. Oh, I mean, I looked awesome afterwards. Well, you needed it. Yeah, my body needed five to six. Yeah, you were so depleted. At that time, you got to think of this. It's not that unrealistic.

31:25My metabolism was at 5 ,000 to 5 ,500 to maintain my size. Plus it was just after. It wasn't like you did it first. And then, so imagine this. Okay, so I had got my metabolic rate up to 5 ,000 to 5 ,500 to maintain my size and activity level. Okay, to cut for a show what it looked like would be, you know, from 5 ,000 to 4 ,000 down to 3 ,000. I hit stage still eating 25 to 2 ,800 calories. So 3 % body fat, and I'm eating 20, which was starving for me, right? That's what that felt like when you're used to eating 5 ,000. And that's what I would do for the last couple weeks to get absolutely shredded.

32:02So my body just three weeks before that remembers what it's like to want 5 ,500, and I've been depriving it for weeks in a row of that kind of calorie. So, yeah, I mean, I cruised by 6 ,000, 7 ,000 calories. And then I had pizzas and pies and milkshakes. The weight gain that he experienced, the 28 pounds or whatever in a month, that's nothing compared to when you'll see competitors go through. I ran into, I'm not going to say who, you guys know who it is, but our buddy who just competed, and he was four weeks out. So he had hit stage, shredded. He's a pro. Four weeks out, I saw him, bro. Did you gain 30?

32:41It looked like you gained 30 pounds. I put 25 to 30 pounds on right afterwards. Right afterwards. Now you remember, I mean, you got to think of this too. You got gallons of water. Glycogen, water. Oh, yeah. So at least 10 to 15 of that is good. You know, 10, 15 easy is good. Water and glycogen right away. So it sounds like really bad. But I definitely, and then also good body fat because you're at 3%. You need to get up to. You need some fat. You need to get up to 8 or 9%. So like, you think it's all like, it's not good for you. And to go that fast. And I remember after doing it the first time, the unhealthy way, I would then reverse diet and talk about it.

33:22I would tell people like. The only thing I ever experienced similar to that was when Doug and I filmed, took photos for the original MAPS anabolic. I had got myself down to like four, maybe 4 % body fat. And I remember first two things. Number one, you dream about food, which is weird. It's really weird to have dreams about food where you're in sleeping and you're thinking, and the food I'm dreaming about, it's like apples. And just like, it's not like I'm dreaming about donuts. No, no, no. It's really weird. All you think about is food. It's the most crazy thing. And then afterwards, when I was really done, like, oh, we did the photos.

34:00Now I can enjoy whatever. I started eating and some hyperpalatable, but I don't remember what I had. I think I had pizza and it triggered a frenzy, bro. that's like uh like you know when you watch great whites in the ocean attacking something and they'll bite each other because it's i felt eyes roll back and then just i felt a frenzy and i just kept going it was the weirdest yeah most dysfunctional feeling of all time dude i mean it compares uh to the thing that i thought was the most awesome it was my favorite part of competing was the the next two to three workouts oh yeah crazy pump like like there is no steroid There's no supplement I've ever taken that gave me the pumps and the feelings of coming off a six to eight week depleted body that just got fed tens of thousands of calories in a couple days.

34:52I'm serious. It was more anabolic feeling than anything. And I've tried a lot of stuff. It was way more off of that. That's so crazy. That part was like, whoa, this is so cool. Yeah, that was really cool. It's weird to me because, too, I've seen like – so my father-in-law will like every now and then will get like a life insurance hitting him up to get rechecked. And so just crash diets. Like I've never seen anybody crash diet in my life. Like he can crash diet. And I'm like, this is so not good for you, dude. Like I keep trying to express like how bad this is on his health, but you know, still just cause wants to make the weight and not look like his markers are bad.

35:36But I'm like, if they really looked at his blood work, this would not be good. You know, it's crazy about that. Some people do that, right. For, for life insurance. Yeah. I think they're, they're getting ready for the test. Yeah. They skew cause insurance companies have ridiculous science and algorithms to predict mortality. It's in their best interest. It's a competitive market. but Doug knows this. They're really good. In fact, they're better at predicting your mortality than medical, you know, they're the best at it. Because money's on the line. Yes, and they have to profit. Yeah, they're betting on it.

36:07They have to profit. But what happens when people cheat the test, quote unquote, when they prepare, they actually change the premium for everybody because they throw the numbers off. So like, my cholesterol's here, I'm going to get it better, I'm going to stop smoking cigars for this long so there's no nicotine in my system, so I can cheat on the, and then they detest, they have the algorithm, then they die at a particular age that goes into a formula that everybody has to pay for you don't think that they so crazy you don't think they probably buffer for that though too it doesn't matter because the numbers are the numbers because i would think they would i think i would think they would they would buffer for a little bit like like you i would think the algorithm goes okay based on these things these people these people should live to this but we're gonna of course yeah because of course honestly i don't think that many people are gaming the system with that really it's too much work it's honestly i mean i mean that's a fair point yeah i just don't think a lot of people doing that.

36:54I bet a lot of people attempt it. I've seen him do it three times. He's an anomaly. Is he very money motivated? Yeah, of course. He's motivated by spite. He'll do things just because you've got to have that personality. He's very stubborn about stuff like that. What's crazy too is some of the questions on those insurance policies. Doug, I would love your input on this. Some of them will make your premium go up that have nothing to do with your health, but rather your activities. Do you ride a motorcycle? Yeah. Premium goes up. Exactly. They rate you for flying airplanes, racing, all kinds of - Downhill skiing, right?

37:36Downhill skiing, I don't think that's typically a risk factor. But yeah, anything they consider high risk, obviously skydiving, scuba diving, things like that. I'm still tripping though on like 10 ,000 calories and he died from that. Like how does that - He has to have a precondition. Yeah, he must have had a heart condition. Yes, yeah. He had to have a, and he was probably 30, so he probably hasn't done a lot of tests. I thought there was something else more extreme in that story, but if that's, yeah. Because the average person, especially the average fit person, would not. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. No, that's not like, it's not because of the calories.

38:07It's because you had some sort of condition that you were unaware of. Now, and then also considering this was after or during his 30 days of already doing it too. So he's been, it was not like one, 10 ,000 calories. It's like eating. There's also stuff we don't know if there was drugs involved or anything like that. That's a good point. There's a lot of people. That has to factor. I was having this conversation with some friends of mine. The topic came up. And they're like, oh, you don't drink alcohol. Did you ever drink? I said, no, I never drank alcohol. And they're like, oh, it's because you're really into your fitness.

38:38I said, no. I said, it's because it's got calories. I'll be honest with you. I was like, the fitness space, there's so much drugs in the fitness space, but it's none of the calorie-containing ones. For sure. They're worried about how they look, not necessarily their health. And so you'll see oftentimes when fitness influencers or whatever suddenly die, a lot of times it's drugs. You just don't know. Have you guys ever heard – this is a little bit of a shift, but it was called This Man Hoax. No. So there was this like social experiment, I guess. I was like an Italian sociologist or I don't know what his title was, but created this image and this drawing of a man.

39:23And it's like, have you seen this man in your dreams? And like, and then they've heard of it. They put this image like all over town and then they expanded it and it became like this folklore and this legend of like, I see this man and everybody's claiming they see this man in their dreams. And they're just like tripping out. Like they think, and they're promoting it like everybody at some point is going to see this man in their dreams. And this is literally just a marketing campaign. Oh, wow. It was so brilliant. Yeah. I've seen that. Yeah. And what's weird about it, it's a creepy ass face. That's why I remembered it.

39:56Yes. They made it just creepy enough so it's like distinctive and like you don't see something like that normally. Thanks, Justin. I'm going to have a dream. Now you're going to see it. But even when they're describing it, I was watching. I don't remember what I was watching, but they brought this up. Nutella launched it. No, this person's, her name is Andrea Nutella. Oh, I thought it was a company that did it as a - No, not Nutella. Uh-uh. Yeah. Uh-uh. So what was - We're going to sell you Nutella. Oh, so this is just a social experiment. It wasn't like a company was using it like a marketing ploy or whatever.

40:26Yeah, but I was thinking, man, that's a powerful thing to create. By the way, do you know why that's a creepy face right there? Click on his face, Justin. Like an imprint of something that like - I was thinking we'd do this with Sal across town. Have you seen this face? and just like plant it in everybody's head so we get more listeners. And then self-programming. I read the science on like what makes a face creepy. You know one of the things that makes a face the creepiest? What? Is a smile that doesn't match, like a slight smile that doesn't match the rest of the face. Doesn't match the rest of the expression.

41:00But the eyes don't, and something is off. Oh, their eyes aren't smiling. Well, that's exactly what that is right there. That's right. He looks like he has a scowl, but then he's smiling. Right. There's something about that. He's got mad eyebrows. Yeah, so that face right there makes you feel uneasy. It's like something creepy about it. Yeah. Now, is that also partially because is that, can you do that? Can you smile and scowl at the same time? Like, is that why? Because it's like our brain goes, that's not possible. No, our brain says there's something wrong with that person. They're probably crazy.

41:35So I've read studies on that. Yeah, because look at, Just try and scowl and then also smile. Like if I smiled at you without using my eyes. Yeah, scowl and a smile, yeah. Bro, what is wrong with you, bro? Stop looking at me like that. This should be a pedophile test. Stop. Stop saying pedophile. Too far. You look like that, dude. No, I'm putting you in jail. Too far. Can I be missing your kids? No. Just because of your face. Not at all. Anyway, I read an interesting study on girls and their fathers in connection. This is interesting. I saw a post on this and I confirmed it and there's lots of studies to support this trip off this girls start puberty earlier when their biological father is absent oh interesting average is 6 to 12 months earlier wow so girls who biological father's not there their puberty kicks in faster that's an interesting study why because the correlations are too first of all no it's consistent half the marriages don't work so half the fathers are probably not present or around well no they control this is the control is girls with their biological father present present versus those that don't so okay this has to be the only way this works for me is like these all the people that were studied were also have normal homes mom and dad's in the house that's right and then that that group versus girls without their biological stepdad in there do they test for that so biological father even if there's another man present that's not by so by the way there's there's a there's a theory there's an evolutionary theory yeah what is this that uh she will have to become fertile quicker because that's part of her protection interesting that she needs to get her her genes and you get passed on quicker versus dads around historically hasn't this already been because of what's been going on hormonally and and elista and the products and this thing haven't haven't women's been starting their periods yeah they think it's more related to obesity so if girls are obese or have a lot of body fat they tend to start their period sooner yeah uh there may be some xenoestrogen influences and that's and so that's accounted for also in this yeah which is interesting what's what's always it's interesting to me i i like studies like this because it just shows the importance of like having your your dad you know and especially for girls they show this huge impact on girls and the safety that dad provides uh the other you know people don't necessarily provide yeah so i thought it was a yeah yeah really interesting one um do you guys see that denmark passed the law on social media what do you guys see this one what are they doing so let me see if they passed it just get rid of all of it yes yeah kids under 15 are not allowed to have social media i like that i agree with that i think it didn't go far enough i i heard a i heard a really I heard an interesting conversation that was talking about AI, right, which I wanted to talk to you guys about anyways, just kind of where it's going.

44:31Doug, take the creepy picture. I thought he did. I look back up. I'm like, you're going to dream about him. So, yes. This guy, yeah, the AI guy was on, I wish I'd known his name, who was just on the Diary of the CEO podcast, and he's just, I don't want to call him an alarmist because I think he was very calm and calculated about what he's talking about. He's just trying to, hey, we should really consider a lot of the outcomes of what we're doing with AI and this and that, which this is not anything anyone's unfamiliar with, I'm sure. But yeah, he related also to just like, look what just happened with social media.

45:14Like we just put it into our, we just adopted it right away and nobody raised their hand to think about the consequences of it. And we're barely just now seeing all this. Should we have more barriers? Exactly. And so should we be? And you know what I heard him say that I thought was interesting is the way China is approaching AI differently than we are. And they are actually thinking, they are approaching it in a much more hyper-focused, like we are just going to develop this AI thing for this sector, for this thing to improve that like the the economy that versus like general ai and trying to just make it smarter better and into almost like an independent like what we're kind of doing over here they are very like calculated about being able to control it and use ai to improve specific industries but not just like building these autonomous robots that are going to be able to think and build themselves what was this what was his uh i guess objection or fear around it was just that it's too so disruptive it's just all the things that we have and you guys i think of some of i think you or justin have brought up some of these things that we've seen where its ability to deceive and lie already on its own like if they've already ran some programs where i think one of you've already brought this up where you know they call hallucinations oh it's not even that it's they may call it that but it's like it's very methodical it's like we you tell the ai it's going to get replaced by something else yeah it's self-preserving it's and so it's self-preserving and it'll utilize the information it has access to.

46:49For example, it did it in this company and it can get into everybody's emails, find out that the CEO is cheating on his wife, use that as blackmail to not. No, it didn't. Yes. This is like documented already stuff that they've seen. And we're not concerned. That's insane. And so if you're seeing that already happen on this level. It's not going to stop, bro. They can't. The spirit behind the development of AI is the same spirit that we had behind nuclear weapons. We have to. We have to. We can't. They're going to do it. We have to do it. That's the exact argument, and they're using with it. We're running as fast as we can.

47:29The difference in why I think someone like this is trying to sound the alarm so much is that what happened with nuclear weapons, you're right, was the same motive of we got to build it before he builds it to this. but then once it was all built there was this like all of us agreeing that hey none of us want absolute destruction so let's let's sign these treaties and say we have them but we're not going to use them on each other right and so we don't destroy each other so it's like this mass but we have control of that now we're racing to build a thing yeah it's worse that we won't have control it's worse and so it's what happens when ai figures out a way to get its hands on the nukes and uses that for blackmail.

48:06Well, you guys brought up the autonomous jets. Yeah. And also, like, the new, you know, helmets, which, like, you know, are basically, like... Insane. Yeah, like Call of Duty, you know, but in real life. And so it's, like, from the self-preserving aspect of that, yeah, we have a shut-off button. Okay, but what if it, like, redirects and hacks and finds its way to, like, you know, maintain its own, you know, system online somehow through some other connection. Here's the, there's two problems here. It's terminated. One that people are talking about, which is it's going to go out of control. It's going to be so powerful.

48:45It's going to control us. It's going to be smarter than us. We're not going to be able to do anything with it that it doesn't want to do. Valid. Here's the other one. At best, we control it at best. Who's going to get their hands on this ultra powerful AI technology? people people are not great yeah those are your two options everybody yeah so and we're running head first yeah and nobody's gonna stop it nobody's gonna stop it because the other guy's doing it there's nobody everybody's saying well you gotta be careful well nobody's saying i'm willing to stop it so here we go yeah well you're also you're gonna get left behind if you don't right so you're in this weird awkward position even if you don't like it yeah you know these you're giving examples Like even the kid, like even the kids in school that are growing up right now, like that are learning how to use all the AI tools to do their homework better, to study for something better, to pass the grades, to do the projects, to do all things like those kids are going to excel way faster than the kids are like, no, my dad says AI is bad.

49:47I'm not going to touch it or use it. And so they're going to get left behind on that. So it's like you're almost forcing their hand to figure that stuff out, to use it, to adopt it. such a weird scary kind of and and we're in this weird transition right now too which also trend or you know translates into this other topic that i'm concerned about now is like economically what we're happening like the layoffs the speed at which we're we're laying people we're about to go through a massive improvement in efficiency now that sounds good but here's what that means a lot of huge labor force a lot of things that are that are less efficient are going to have to get cut off yeah so it'd be a very painful period before i mean you you you you hearken to the industrial revolution and i'd like to challenge that it's nothing like that in the sense that that will look like oh yeah you're right a needle in a haystack of course this is going to be so fast and so big it's the speed that's really oh yeah the industrial revolution changed everything in decades right this is going to be like overnight yeah like Overnight, a light switch is going to go off, and millions of people won't have to go off.

50:56You know we're five years away from it. The prediction is two to three, bro. It's two to three. When we first started talking about this, I swear barely anybody was realizing what was happening. Bro, still people are heads in the sand. Are you guys not looking? I have a lot of close friends that are still - Bro, what's crazy, I'll tell you what trips me out. Just the idea is you can't wrap your brain around it. So many things about this tripped me out, but one of them I never would have predicted. Had you asked me four years ago, what are the areas that AI won't be able to touch for a long time?

51:28I would have said art. Because something about art makes me think it's like something special to humans. The top songs right now are made by AI completely. But it is similar. It's a pop music though. Because it's a formula. Did you see? So I'll tell you that. You're right, but people like it. People like it just like pop music. You know, I would like to think I'm the least tinfoil of the three of us. These days you'll be weird. I know, dude. I almost brought it to work today. I was talking to my good friend Chris Nagibi that we've had on the show before, and he sent over that chart that I sent over to you guys.

52:11Yeah. And what he is very nervous about, made me really nervous about, and that is that the middle class is disappearing so rapidly. And in a very short time, we're going to have a majority of people that don't have a lot. There's going to be a small percentage of people that have a lot and a lot of people that don't have hardly anything. And that just primes everybody for socialism. That primes everybody for take from them to help us. And now we have all these. We don't have jobs. When you have the efficiency that AI promises to provide, and it probably will, it's very easy. It'll be very easy for the people who have control of this to say to people, we'll give you pretty much anything you want.

52:57You don't need to work that much, and we'll give you all kinds of stuff. Because it's so efficient. It's so easy to produce. So you'll be able to say everybody gets all this stuff. I mean, how eerie. yes how eerie and accurate is that sound that statement feel and sound right now working on this that's the thing it's not like they already know what's in store you know for yeah it makes me feel like what we're what we're seeing unfold right now they already seen 10 years ago yeah to put out a statement like that and to just to be able to say things like you will own nothing and you'll be happy and then to be like this is like yeah right dude no way yeah yeah exactly but but like you said like if it does if it's that pervasive and it takes everybody's jobs like people are going to be like well okay and what do i do now and this is my debate i would my debate on the real estate side that i was you know kind of having would keep bugging doug about is the we have for ever since 08 i don't know if you guys watched what we did but we got we 08 scared the shit out of the housing industry that huge crash and so every year we dramatically under built homes for what we needed currently, not including increase in birth rate.

54:11So, and we put more regulations in building. So we are at like all time lows for houses being built and available. And we've done that for over a decade consistently. And so we couldn't, even if we raised, just lifted all the regulations and said, build away, it would take us like a damn near decade to just catch up. and the birth rate keeps increasing. So this idea that we're going to have a housing correction and houses are going to come back down, I don't believe. What it's going to be is that 1 % that is controlling AI and controlling people will have most of the real estate too. You will owe nothing and be happy.

54:50It will be out of our kids' reach unless you've set them up some way or somehow to probably buy a home. And it's so hard for people to wrap their brain around it because so much of our society and wealth has been tied to our home. That used to be the American dream. Get a job. I don't necessarily think that's a bad thing. And I think it is an investment opportunity. But I don't necessarily think it's a bad thing. You're right. We've tied so much of our wealth in the value of our home that we can't think of a future where we don't own a home because that's what it used to mean. It used to mean - It was your retirement.

55:23That was my retirement. But it doesn't have to be. It doesn't have to be. That's a fair enough. I'm open to that discussion. that like i mean that was i've been trying to say that for a while that everyone's like oh this the houses have to correct they've never this and that it's like no they don't we're just so conditioned that that's everybody gets to buy a house like not everybody has a super yacht yeah you know i'm saying like what makes you think that the future is that that's how we'll look at homes people be like oh you own a home oh wow you must be rich or your family must be right like that we're easily moving in that transition with the and it's just basic supply and demand more people are being born and more people need homes.

55:59And then you have, you have the other multiplier to this is I think it's 80%. If it's not 80%, it's 75 % of the people that have loans and mortgages on these houses are like 4%. They're the super low. And then, and we're, and we, and they're the Fed. They, they said, they said, we'll never see those rates again. So if we're never going to see that low of rates again, nobody is going to sell their, sell their home or refinance their home to put themselves in a lesser home for more money. That doesn't make, that makes no sense stupid idea so it's like it just doesn't math dude wow all right i'm gonna change quick directions i want to ask you you've been doing the christmas blend every morning every single morning for how many weeks uh well it's 30 days tomorrow 30 days so you liked it i really like it um it's it's also i eliminated one of my caffeine drinks too isn't that great yeah it's a great combination and i didn't i don't it's the green juice and the red juice from organifi you blend them together you don't feel any drop or anything nothing yeah didn't even it feels like I'm having three energy drinks still.

56:57Wow. That's great. Yeah. And I've actually, so today I had my coffee too. So I'm trying to, trying to get rid of the energy drinks completely. My goal is to continue the red and green juice in the morning and then have a, have a nice cup of coffee. Instead, I want to, I want to start cutting out of the, the inner drinks. So it's that time of year. So yeah, do it. Joy mode is a pre-sex supplement that improves blood flow. You want to get a better pump you know where try joy mode it actually works go check them out go to try joy mode.com forward slash mind pump use the code mind pump at checkout for 20 off back to the show our first question is from burke himself when dumbbells shoulder pressing do you recommend a neutral grip or traditional grip what are the pros and cons of each justin would rotate them Yeah, Justin doesn't both.

57:48I would. I started a neutral and then rotate them. I'm not against that. Traditional grip. The grip position actually doesn't do much except it influences the elbow position. So it's the elbow position that's important, not the grip. A neutral grip tends to cause the elbows to come in towards the middle, whereas more of a traditional grip tends to bring the elbows out. Here's the deal. They're all important. You know, bodybuilders would say the elbows in is more front delt, elbows out, more side delt. Really, I look at it from a function standpoint. Yeah, definitely. Like, you know, keeping the elbows out and coming all the way down requires a lot of scapular mobility.

58:28Bringing my elbows down in front requires a different kind of scapular and shoulder mobility. So I think they're both very important. It's really, honestly, I think it's a good idea to do both of them. Well, isn't that kind of spiraling movement the more natural? Because of the way the elbow falls. Right, right. So I would even go as far as to say internally to where it's like an Arnold press. So not just neutral, but all the way. And it's like a complete rotation as you press up. I love shoulder pressing like that. And you get this real full, deep range of motion all the way down and then full extension.

59:06And when you hear us talk about the benefits of taking a muscle through its fullest range of motion, it doesn't get fuller than that with a shoulder press. You don't get any sticking points that way. Yeah. Because I don't know if you've ever felt where you get wide enough with your elbows and you hit that point where it's like there's a lot of torque that rests on the joint. And that's why I like taking that into a spiraling motion because it really does diffuse a lot of that excess amount of force. Yeah, the thing is the shoulder joint, I think I could probably safely say is one of the most complex joints, right?

59:41Wouldn't you guys agree? Yeah, hips and shoulders. Well, shoulders even more so because you have the humerus, then you have the scapula and they both have to move together. And the shoulder is very versatile because we throw with really good accuracy. Yeah. And full development of the shoulder, when we think of that, we just think of a round, nice looking delt, aesthetically speaking. but the best way to accomplish that is to have a healthy shoulder that does lots of or can do all that it's supposed to do so what does that look like that looks like i can keep my elbows out wide and come all the way down like i would with a behind the neck press which a lot of people can't do it looks like my elbows can come in front of me with some rotation it looks like i can you know bring them out i can bring them back um all of that i think is very important and if you work out your shoulders here's the issue if you train your shoulders with presses one particular way and get really strong at that one particular way, you'll find issues or instability.

1:00:35You can have discrepancy. You try to move a different way, suddenly my shoulders hurt. That being said, if you only did it one way, the best way would be with Justin. Yes. If you had to pick one, 100%. So I think that's the argument right there for that, is that you're right. Learning to do behind-the-neck presses, good lateral, all those things are hard. But if you had to pick one, I agree. But if you're going to do one that does the best job of encompassing full range, good shoulder mobility and control and stability. It would be a Arnold press. It would be a all the way down. It expresses its full function.

1:01:11Yes. And so if you're really strong in that, you should be able to kind of do all the other things that you're saying. Otherwise, you better be touching all those other areas to make sure that you stay. So to me, that's the real answer over neutral or traditional grip. Next question is from Lucas Keen 03. does using ladders, small boxes, and running with parachutes translate to faster feet and explosiveness for an athlete? Not the way these people do it. Yeah, and I picked this question because there's some complexity here, right? So ladders are making you faster, not because you are necessarily fast, but rather you're training your ability to place your feet in different directions with good stability, good control.

1:01:57So really you're training a skill is what's happening with ladders. Boxes, explosive jumping. That's agility. Yes, that's agility. That's what I just said, right? That's what I was explaining. Boxes, now you're training power with the explosiveness. And running with parachutes is also explosive training. It's giving you resistance to try to run fast. The key, though, is to do this all without fatigue. Right. That was my point. 100%. Because people use this as just another way to get sweaty. Yeah. And you might as well just do jumping jacks. I mean, speed's so dependent on how much force you can produce, which is strength.

1:02:31Yeah. Which people dismiss the fact that you've got to get really strong legs to get faster. And then it's technique. And then it's, you know, this is obviously it's foot speed in the sense that if it kind of mimics like, you know, you being able to connect to quick movements and have that kind of versatility. but in terms of it actually like the actual engine and the mover of it, it's all like maximal force output and driving it through your foot. The agility is really just being able to maintain your balance when you're moving in different directions and being pushed in different directions.

1:03:06I mean, you look at like boxers, their footwork is keeping them balanced while they're constantly moving. And that's a skill that you have to practice. I'm trying to think of a better example than that I've seen than when you see a Olympic-level sprinter training. Have you ever seen an Olympic-level sprinter? They will practice getting out of the box or what do they call the blocks? Just that part. Yeah, the whole day. Yeah, exactly. That's the whole practice, and it's literally just that part of it. They don't sprint all the way down for the 50 yards or whatever they're... Get-offs or whatever.

1:03:44It's literally just boom, they do that, and then they walk back, they recover, they rest, they get back in the position, they adjust their feet, they get their hand in position. You see that like 50%, 60%, 70 % and you like ramp your ramp. Yeah, it's like, and so that's like how you approach these types of things. If you want that to translate to better speed on the field, better speed on the court, whatever sport you're trying to get better agility, better explosiveness or, you know, the three different things that you named, the way you traditionally see it is done wrong. It's just trainers doing it with clients in this kind of fatigue setting where it's like they do push-ups and then they squat and then they do jump boxes or they do a set of an exercise and then they run with a parachute.

1:04:30That's all standards. That is ridiculous. That is not making that athlete any better, anything other than just enduring shit. They can endure more stuff, but they're not going to be more explosive. They're not going to have more agility from training that way. You have to practice what you're looking for. What the adaptation is, that's what your practice should look like. So if I want to train explosive power or if I want to build explosive power, I have to train that explosive power part. If I'm not resting and I'm going back and forth different exercises, that's not explosive. What I'm training now is endurance, which is if you want endurance, there's better ways to do it than to put five different random exercises and movements together that aren't supposed to be strung together.

1:05:12And the best way to like when you're setting up drills is to mimic your actual movements in whatever sport it is you're doing. And so you have that, you know, translation. It's a lot better. Like, say if I set up a cone drill, I'm like, you know, in a certain position when I was a linebacker and I had to be on, you know, the balls of my feet. And I'm having to move laterally and then straight up the field and I have to cut right on the dime, you know, to mimic that. You can set it up and use these kind of tools to be a little bit more specific towards your sport. But, again, this, again, is just like a mimicking of what you're actually doing.

1:05:52The best way to do it is obviously to play. Did you ever use a parachute? I never have tried that. I have, yeah. I've done a parachute. I've done running in the pool. This is when I was, like, training to try to get any kind of time off my 40 time. and um it was it was interesting because i i think the real value in it for me was yes you had the resistance as you're running but when you released so we had like a release so you'd actually then feel free and now it was almost like i i had it was more fluid uh my mechanics and my um uh what do you call it my stride uh it felt like um i was more uh loose and in tune You probably feel light.

1:06:33Yeah, for sure. It was helpful for that. I think it's more helpful for technique. It's not like, oh, I'm adding resistance, so I'm getting stronger. Well, people need to realize running is a technique. It's a skill. All technique. It's a big, big skill. It's hard for me to even articulate. Yeah. Next question is from RS Runs Lifts 76. I'm a 49-year-old dad of two girls, ages 10 and 6. We are busy. How do I know what's appropriate, two days a week of anabolic or MAPS 15? Either one of those. it's more your lifestyle, right? It's whatever fits your schedule. But I got to say this, I want to add this.

1:07:05And I don't, this is more of a recent opinion that I've developed. And if I look back, there's lots of evidence that would point to what I'm about to say. I think if you take this total amount of volume that you're doing in training and you break it up into smaller bits throughout the week, you probably get better results. In other words, two days a week versus six days a week, but the same amount of exercises, same sets, the difference is you're doing just a couple exercises a day for six days versus, you know, all the exercise in two days, I bet you'd get better results. Oh, I don't, I don't think there, I don't think there's a debate about that at all.

1:07:43I think that, I think it's pretty clear that that, that is better. I think it really comes down to, are you somebody, because if you have a gym, let's say you don't have a gym at home and you have to go to the gym and so make it there. That's right. So now you had to drive somewhere 15 minute like it could be a five to 15 minute drive for a 15 to 20 minute workout that to me is like oh well if i if that's my lifestyle then it's probably easier for me to do two full body workouts in the in the week because i have to go to gym now if i have you more consistent right but if i have a nice little gym set up at my house well dude for sure the the six like shorter workouts every day is a way better approach i think i think it will i mean think about that for that yeah well think about if you if you train the two days monday tuesday for the hour long but then the rest of your week you're busy desk job you do nothing that person would be way better suited by interrupting their their day of sitting all day long with 15 20 minutes of some sort of exercise for for a lot of reasons and and and i think i think we have some studies to kind of point a little bit in that direction i think it's too hard to really show what a difference that makes that guy who has a desk job who is choosing between only lifting two days a week where he the rest of his week he's very sedentary versus the 15 minutes doesn't realize also with that 15 minutes actually how it impacts the rest of the day because he did that and we've talked about this before the show like if i get a lift in doesn't matter if it's a 15 or an hour lift like i organically move more throughout the day it It changes your mood.

1:09:14It changes everything. And so that's not going to be in a study, right? They're not going to – that won't be – to compare those two things, you're going to be like, well, if we control all things and this versus this, and it's like – But in real life. But in real life, that's not what happens. In real life, the dad who makes that 15-minute time in his garage real quick, now all of a sudden is more active with his kid, and he – The stress management, the sleep. That's right. All that stuff. That's right. He gets – all that stuff is better. He does more around the house, and that's not going to – You're not going to find that in a study, but I can tell you in real life, training enough people, also seeing it in my own life, that's the better route if you have access to it.

1:09:51And that's the way you make that decision. The other thing, too, is MAPS 15, it does have a barbell and dumbbell version, but also has a suspension trainer version. So suspension trainer is very inexpensive, super convenient. For this dad, if convenience is the big roadblock, which it typically is, it's time, a time thing. MAPS 15 with a suspension trainer might be the perfect program for you. Next question is from Susan E. Wells. Is it ever too late in life to make a go at a career in the fitness industry? After 29 years in government service, I'm looking at retirement in the next few years or sooner.

1:10:28I'm currently 52 and have always been active in lifting, even competing in my early 40s with USA Weightlifting. There's this really interesting myth in the fitness industry, this perception, I would say, that successful trainers are young. And that if I'm older, that it's going to somehow harm me. It's the opposite. It's actually the opposite. The opposite. You know what a challenge it was being the young guy? I know that. I was 18, yeah. I remember like, what do you know? Yes, I remember being a young trainer going like, God, I can't wait until I get older so I can quit hearing these people's excuses.

1:11:05How do you know? Yeah. How would you know? You're only 20. Wait till you get to my age. Guess what? I'm your age now. Now I can talk to you. It's better to be old. Especially if you're somebody like this person is describing, 52 and been in weightlifting. It sounds like you're a healthy 52-year-old. That's an advantage. The average personal training client is middle-aged. That's the average client. That's right. Because they have expendable income, personal training. That's right. You're going to relate way better to them. If you're a 52-year-old, you're going to... Now, all things being equal, right?

1:11:36because a lot of things will make you a successful trainer. You can be a crappy salesperson. Yeah, you can be horrible at communicating and not knowledgeable at all. In which case, I don't care. But if all things being equal, a 52-year-old that looks fit versus a 22-year-old that looks fit, both trying to get clients. The older. I'm going to go even further. Give me a 25-year-old, multiple national certifications, jacked 6 % body fat or 13, 15 for female versus just a very healthy 52-year-old that's educated and has a lot of experience and has maybe a couple certs or a cert, that older – Has gone through hormonal changes.

1:12:17If they both have equal communication skills, because if you heard us talk about that – That trumps everything. Because that trumps everything. Because give me the smartest, fittest person who can't communicate and they can't sell, they'll do terrible training. But if you have equal communication skills, It is an advantage to be older than 40 years old and in good shape because that is your clientele that's going to pay for it. Nobody's 25 buying personal training. No. How many 25 and 30-year-olds did you train? When their parents bought training. Yeah, I'm so parents, I know. Like single-digit numbers.

1:12:51Hundreds of people in their 40s and 50s and 60s all day long. And let me tell you, that used to be one of my biggest challenges in my 20s, being the fit guy, was that I couldn't relate to them. And I couldn't deny it. Like, you're right. I don't know what it's like to be 40. I do now. Yeah. Yeah. The only challenge I would say that a potential challenge that someone, you know, 52 would have versus, let's say, a 22-year-old is you might have more financial responsibilities. So it may be more difficult for you to switch careers. Whereas a 22-year-old is living with mom and dad. I could start this career.

1:13:28I don't have to necessarily make a lot of money. They can be all in a lot easier. Yeah, maybe. But I mean - They're coming from a government job. Yeah. So, yeah. The government doesn't pay that well. No, it could be benefits. So hopefully you get the benefits. Hopefully you keep the benefits. Get some Cobra out of it. Yeah. I mean, you're right, though. Like, that's the big thing here. It would be, are you in a position financially? Where you could just switch careers. Well, look at another thing. I'm looking at retirement the next few years. Oh, yeah. So you get retirement to sit on. So they're already, oh, this is great.

1:13:54Yeah, you're fine. Your age is not an issue. It's actually an advantage. Yeah, huge advantage. Especially, too, if you're like, I don't have to make a bunch of money. And so you have this, like, I'm going to go at this at my pace, learn at my pace, do it because you love. Oh, my God. I would love to hire you. Look, I'll tell you what. I hired trainers for my parents. And so this is me, right? And these are my parents. And I'm paying for it. Who'd you pick? Well, the guy that I picked for my dad, I had observed for a long time because I go to a gym and I see him training people. So I've seen him now for years and I know he's good.

1:14:29And he's in his 30s, but he's really good. So that's why I hired him. When he came to my mom, I didn't know very many of the female trainers there because the time I go, I didn't see too many of them, but they're there. So immediately I'm like, I'm asking for experience and age. First of all, my mom, she's going to relate more to somebody who's closer to her age. And I'm looking for experience. So I hired a woman that was a little older and more experienced. So it's actually an advantage. And it's funny because the perception is it's this young industry. That's just because a lot of trainers are young.

1:14:59Well, it's also because there's this perception of this young, beautiful, fit person does better. Like, oh, because I'm healthy and I'm fit, but I'm not as ripped. Because you get eyes and attention on social media. Yeah, I'm not as ripped as that 22-year-old. That don't even matter. Like if you're healthy and fit and older than 40, you'll get more respect from the people buying than the 23-year-old who's got abs and looks shredded for sure. 100%. Look, if you like the show, come find us on Instagram at MindPumpMedia. We'll see you there. Thank you for listening to MindPump. If your goal is to build and shape your body, dramatically improve your health and energy, and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB Super Bundle at MindPumpMedia.com.

1:15:42The RGB Super Bundle includes MAPS Anabolic, MAPS Performance, and MAPS Aesthetic. Nine months of phased expert exercise programming designed by Sal, Adam, and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels, and performs. With detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos, the RGB Super Bundle is like having Sal, Adam, and Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Super Bundle has a full 30-day money-back guarantee, and you can get it now plus other valuable free resources at mindpumpmedia.com. If you enjoy this show, please share the love by leaving us a five-star rating and review on iTunes and by introducing Mind Pump to your friends and family.

1:16:29We thank you for your support, and until next time, this is Mind Pump.

From the publisher

Mind Pump Fit Tip: The Ultimate 90-day fat loss challenge Plan. (1:57)
Teaching yourself new behaviors around food choices that are HIGH in protein. (16:55)
Protein, the ULTIMATE macronutrient. (20:50)
Probiotics are the first fat-burning supplement. (24:49)
Pushing your body to its limits. (28:58)
There is money in life. (35:04)
Fun Facts with Justin: This Man hoax. (39:00)
Absence of the father is associated with earlier puberty among girls. (41:59)
The potentially scary direction of AI. (44:43)
Declining middle class. (51:51)
Christmas Blend for sustained energy and vitality. (56:32)
#Quah question #1 – When dumbbell shoulder pressing, do you recommend a neutral grip or a traditional grip? What are the pros & cons of each? (57:35)
#Quah question #2 – Does using ladders, small boxes, and running with parachutes translate to faster feet and explosiveness for an athlete? (1:01:23)
#Quah question #3 – I'm a 49-year-old dad of 2 girls, ages 10 and 6. We are busy. How do I know what's appropriate, 2 days a week of anabolic or MAPS 15? (1:06:46)
#Quah question #4 – Is it ever too late in life to make a go at a career in the fitness industry? After 29 years in Government service, I'm looking at retirement in the next few years (or sooner). I'm currently 52 and have always been active in lifting, even competing in my early 40s with USA Weightlifting. (1:10:14)

Related Links/Products Mentioned

Visit Seed for an exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! ** Code 20MINDPUMP for 20% off your first month of Seed's DS-01® Daily Synbiotic. **
Visit Organifi for the exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! **Promo code MINDPUMP at checkout for 20% off**
MAPS 15 STRONG 50% half from Dec. 7th-13th. Code DECEMBER50 at checkout.
Mind Pump Store
Mind Pump #2450: The Smartest Way to Use Protein to Burn Fat & Build Muscle
Fitness influencer dies in junk food 'marathon' after gorging on 10,000 calories a day
This Man - Wikipedia
Father absence linked to earlier puberty among certain girls
Another country agrees to ban social media for children under 15
AI Expert: We Have 2 Years Before Everything Changes! We Need To Start Protesting! - Tristan Harris
AI system resorts to blackmail if told it will be removed - BBC
Visit Joymode for an exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! ** Enter MINDPUMP at checkout for 20% off your first order. **
Trainer Bonus Series Episode 1: The Successful Trainer Mindset
Elite Trainer Academy – Podcast
Mind Pump Podcast – YouTube
Mind Pump Free Resources

People Mentioned

Tristan Harris (@tristanharris) Instagram
Christopher M. Naghibi (@chrisnaghibi) Instagram

Ask about this episode

In short

Transcript

More from Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth