2830: The Best Push Pull Legs Program For Building Muscle (MAPS PPL)

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1:18Finish things off with a complimentary boot brand to make them extra special. Come for the boots, stay for the good times. Tecovis, Forever West. If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mind Pump. Mind Pump. With your hosts, Sal DiStefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews.

1:42Adam Schafer:You just found the most downloaded fitness, health, and entertainment podcast. This is Mind Pump. Today's episode, we talk about a brand new MAPS program. MAPS, push, pull, legs. PPL, you asked for it, you got it. By the way, there's two versions of this program. One for men and then one for women. The programming is different. Women have a more higher emphasis on lower body volume, glute training, shoulder volume. Men, it's more traditional. Now, because it's a brand new program, we're launching it right now and it's 40 % off. If you go to mapsppl.com, use the code PPL, you get the price slashed by 40%.

2:20Adam Schafer:Also, if you sign up within the first few days of the launch, you can attend live coaching by one of the Mind Pump coaches. They're going to do three days of coaching, breaking down things like nutrition, exercise, lifestyle, really to help you become more consistent and maximize your progress through the program. We also include a supplement schedule guide, which will be free with this program. Again, you can get all of that included, 40 % off, mapsppl.com. The code is PPL. This episode is brought to you by one of our sponsors, Paleo Valley. Now, they make paleo-inspired supplements, meat sticks, and more to improve your health, fitness, and vitality.

3:02Adam Schafer:I love their meat sticks. They're not dry. They're delicious. They're grass-fed and fermented, so they're wonderful. They taste good. They're good for your gut. Go check them out. Check out some of their other supplements as well. go to paleovalley.com forward slash mind pump that link will get you 15 % off all right real quick if you love us like we love you why not show it by rocking one of our shirts hats mugs or training gear over at mindpumpstore.com i'm talking right now hit pause head on over to mindpumpstore.com that's it enjoy the rest of the show for the last 10 years the most commonly requested body part split program by far it's here is ppl push pull legs people send us messages all the time can you please make a maps program please that is a push pull legs split we haven't done it until now introducing maps ppl we're going to talk about that program right now what's in it and whether or not it's right for you you can talk about what's special that we did this time

4:01Sal Di Stefano:that we've never done before too yeah oh yeah we'll get there we'll talk you're saving no i

4:05Adam Schafer:I might as well say it now and then we'll get to it later. But this is the first maps program where we have, they're both PPL. So there's two of them. Uh, but one of them is geared towards what men typically are looking for in a program. And then the other one's for women. So when it comes to training men and women, I mean, exercises are the same. Like there's no difference except there are preferential preferences are different. Yeah. So, um, so we, the programming is different, slightly different for the male version versus the female version. And we've never really done that before. But again, we're trying to listen to our audience and give them what they want, which again, this is why we wrote a PPL program.

4:44Adam Schafer:Easily the most popular, there's a lot of different ways to split up body parts and bodybuilding style training. It's got to be the most popular ones, right?

4:51Sal Di Stefano:Yeah. I would say this is probably one of the most popular. I mean, I don't know about you guys, maybe not Justin so much. I bet you, this is probably one of the more popular routines you personally have followed most of your life if i ever did a split um it would be something like this for sure is that always i mean are you did you mess around much with body

5:12Adam Schafer:part splits did you mess around i've done individual body part workouts um but if the one split that i liked was typically this and it was typically a a three-day like the one we have here like a three-day a week kind of routine yeah um because what it allows for is a lot more volume per body part in a singular workout, right? So you can either do your full body split, which we're obviously very big fans of. And then there's the, you know, the splits where you're only doing a few body parts. And one of the benefits of that is, I mean, you really get to focus on a body part and you get to do a lot of volume in one workout and different combinations of exercises.

5:51Adam Schafer:And you're hitting it from different angles. You get the pump, the whole deal. That's probably why it's such a popular split. Is this one, this one's for you as well?

5:58Sal Di Stefano:Yeah, this is one of the top ones. I've run an upper-lower split quite a few times, and then I've ran a split where I do legs, and then I do chest-back together, and then I do shoulder-arms together. Arms, sure. And then I run a routine like that. It's very similar, though, to what this is. Those are probably my three most common splits that I do, but I love the push-pull legs.

6:27Adam Schafer:So push represents the muscles that are involved typically in pushing exercises for the upper body. So this would be chest, shoulders and triceps, pull is back and biceps, and then legs is legs. And so it's just kind of an easy way to break up the body. And the reason why you would combine all the push muscles for the upper body in one workout, this is just kind of the theory around it, right? Why would we put all the push muscles in one and all the pull muscles in another one? They're working together. And you're already kind of working. So if I'm doing, you know, if I start a push workout with chest, my shoulders and my triceps are getting some work.

7:05Adam Schafer:So it makes sense to work them in that day as well, rather than the next day when they've gotten some work already the day before type of deal and they might already be sore. This is just, you know, when body part splits. Body part splits became popular when bodybuilders really started to ramp up training volume. Because full body splits were the name of the game for a long time. but as bodybuilders got more advanced and as they started to add more volume, because volume does contribute to muscle growth. That's a fact. That's one of the factors that plays a role. You know, if you're doing, you know, you're doing nine sets for every body part, you're doing a full body work.

7:43Adam Schafer:It takes forever. It's too fatiguing. Yeah. It's a two and a half hour workout.

7:46Sal Di Stefano:Yeah. And a lot of times the back half of the workout is junk volume. Done. Totally. Yeah. You're not, you're, yeah, no. So I, I, I like this too. um you know most all the research points to you know optimal frequency for hypertrophy being somewhere between two and three times hitting a muscle right so it lends itself well for a routine like that where you're gonna hit the muscle at least at least two times in the week

8:09Adam Schafer:you know so that that part uh i love yeah this what it feels like if you've never done a split like this before um if you're really a big fan of like the pump this is really good for that uh Because, you know, if I'm going to do nine sets or six sets for body part, like you would in this program, I mean, you're really maximizing the feel of the pump. Does that contribute to muscle growth? There's a lot of debate around that. But it definitely contributes to the enjoyment of the workout. And I'm always for that. Like if you do something that you really enjoy in your workout, so long as it's not detrimental, I think it's a positive because it increases the odds you'll want to do it.

8:52Adam Schafer:And you'll do it enthusiastically, which contributes to better workouts. So I think it's definitely something to consider. So because I hear people debate the pump, you know, and, you know, some people will say, and I probably am more in this camp, that if you get a really good pump, it's more. the reason why it's a good thing is it's probably pointing to the fact that you're well hydrated well rested yeah well nourished not necessarily that the pump itself is doing anything but is it enjoyable well yeah it's a really you know if you're trying to work on a body part and you want to see what you look like or what it feels like to have it be more developed i mean you could do that with a pump and kind of give yourself a sneak peek at what you may look like in a year would you say that's probably the biggest pushback for people that didn't want to try out the total body splits yeah because the pump they get those specific muscle groups like pretty fired up those

9:43Sal Di Stefano:100 i mean that was why i didn't like uh full body for the longest time was because i was so attached to the pump yep that's how i started was in these splits i mean we used to just focus on one muscle group uh early on and so you get these massive pumps in one muscle and so to take somebody like that who's used to feeling a big pump in in the body part they're working and then ask them to do like this kind of full body routine where you could literally i mean i could train a a maps anabolic day and and not fill much of a pump at all no because you're you're in and out you're in and out of each muscle group and you know that's that's tough and so i think that was one of the biggest hurdles was convincing people uh that had who had enjoyed chasing that pump to follow maps anabolic all the way through i think that was when we first started that was the feedback oh it doesn't feel like i'm doing enough that's right everybody always said they need to do more because they weren't getting this massive pump from the workout it's like just trust the process go through it you'll see and then we obviously over time we convince people but i'd argue that's probably the

10:46Adam Schafer:number one deterrent was uh yeah and it's nothing to sneeze at again i'm gonna say this again like um that's not that's not nothing like if uh if doing something in a workout is something really enjoyable and it's not detrimental. Is the pump detrimental? No, there's nothing wrong with the pump. So, so getting a pump, isn't bad for you. It's not going to take away from your gains. It's not going to take away from your performance. So even, uh, even though some people can argue that the pump itself is beneficial. And again, there's controversy around it. I don't care. I know it's not detrimental.

11:18Adam Schafer:Uh, but if you enjoy it, then go for it. And if you enjoy your workout, Look, this is a personal trainer. One of the things that I focused heavily on was helping my clients develop a relationship with exercise where they enjoyed it. If I could do that, I won. I 100 % won. Because no matter how effective a workout is, if they're not enjoying it, it's just not effective. They're not going to want to continue doing it. So that's one of the big things about it. There's also the strength stamina aspect of it, right? So which probably has some potential for helping someone with their gains. If you always do full body workouts, which are great, and you suddenly switch to a split like this, you're not used to doing that much volume in one workout.

12:02Adam Schafer:And what you'll find is doing a workout like this is that initially your strength will drop off very quickly. So if you're always used to doing just two or three sets for chest and then, you know, doing it maybe multiple times a week, if you do a workout where it's nine sets for chest, you'll find after the fifth set, strength is gone. Fatigue and strength. That's right. But you actually build it. Yeah. By the end of the routine, you'll adapt.

12:25Sal Di Stefano:By the end of the workout, the program, you will feel a huge difference.

12:28Adam Schafer:That's right. And if it's novel, you're probably going to build. And that's the value of it really is to introduce it, change it up. And I think that that's why too. I think it's great that we have options out there that people already enjoy anyways. Totally. So it's a three-day program, you know, push, pull legs. Ideally, you would do a day off in between. That's how the program is written. And it's three phases, and each phase is about three weeks long. So you're looking at a nine-week total program. So just over two months, essentially, is what you're looking at. And each phase is different.

13:03Adam Schafer:The programming in each phase is different. One of the phases is actually quite different from the other two. And the rep ranges are different. Now, the rep ranges that we're using are kind of hypertrophy ranges. The first one is a low rep range, but you're looking at, you know, around five or six reps, maybe even a little lower, a bit heavier. Then you get into the kind of, you know, second phase, which is eight to 12. And then we threw in a five by five phase at the very end to really focus on building the strength. And I like that we ended with the five by five at the end of this. So you could really see how well.

13:39Sal Di Stefano:That was one of my favorite things that we did with symmetry. Symmetry is the only other program where we did something like that.

13:43Adam Schafer:That's why we put that in here. because we got such great feedback.

13:46Sal Di Stefano:Yeah, and I think that was a cool way to end a program so you can really start to see like, oh, what a difference that made. And so this is cool to see that this is only the second program that we've incorporated like ending the program with like a five by five.

14:01Adam Schafer:Yes, yes. The other thing too is this is the first time we've put very specific dietary advice or instructions in a program. Typically, it's kind of advice and guidance. And we went full on like, this is what you're going to eat if you want a bulk. So for people who are trying to build or reverse diet or bring up a weak body part and they want to build muscle, they are very specific. Here's the formula. The formula is very basic and very specific. It's like, this is the protein you're going to eat based on your body weight plus add this much. this is the carbs you're going to eat and this is the fat that you're going to eat um and your body weight dictates the calories and it will put uh both men and women in a surplus um and i wanted to make it as straightforward and simple as possible because anytime you get dietary advice that gets a little complicated yeah you know here's the formula for that reason yeah yeah plug this in minus that add that type of deal people are getting a little bit uh confused it's not so effective um we're like okay this is going to be a nine week bulk nine week bulk that's what you're going to be on if you follow this and there's straight up go in the bulk 100 and the it's in there for both the male and the female version of the program well this really this really appeals

15:22Sal Di Stefano:to the the person that is kind of aesthetic driven or wants to build hyper i mean build muscle i mean this is kind of that's really what a ppl program is geared towards and it's not that you won't get strong doing it it's not that it doesn't help in a lot of other ways it's just that looking for hypertrophy yeah that's the main focus and hypertrophy we want to be in a calorie surplus yes and that's why this is unique where we gave that kind of advice because typically people always ask well is should i run in a cut or can i run in a bulk i mean you can do you can do this and make arguments for both yeah and you could do you could totally do that but if the goal

15:56Adam Schafer:is to build muscle but we wanted to put specific like you want to build here's your diet yes and then watch what happens we also put some supplement advice um in there as well and then the men and women's version have just uh different programming so uh women just again we train people for a long time we've been doing the podcast for a long time they typically want more training volume leg volume for the legs and the glutes and more of a shoulder development emphasis rather than let's say chest development emphasis. And so the programming is different. On the push day, typically, like what you see in the men's version is you'll start with chest, which makes sense typically when you're looking at exercise order.

16:37Adam Schafer:But with the women's version of this, most women are more interested in shoulder development than they are chest development. It gives them more of that aesthetic look. And so you're actually starting off with shoulders and there's more volume for shoulders, less for chest than you find in the men's version. and there's less overall volume for the upper body because we moved it to the lower body for women and then the order of the exercises is also different on leg day there's gonna be more glute focus than quad focus you're still hitting the quads it's just the order is different so the

17:10Sal Di Stefano:focus is heavier well and i think the most important thing to point out with that that where i see people go wrong when when they create their own program is they don't take in account the thing that they want to focus on that you you need to take volume from somewhere else you can't just add a bunch of volume and this is a mistake that i used to make as a kid also is just like oh i want to develop this muscle group so it was just like oh i'll keep doing everything i'm doing and then i'll just add more of this and so the the real getting less of everything right so the real the real art to this is when you have a client who's like hey i want these areas that i really want to focus on in this case with the women you're talking about shoulders and glutes primarily the the big focuses it's like okay well that's great well then we have to take from somewhere else because we don't just want to slap on more glute, more shoulder stuff than is already in a typical program.

17:54Sal Di Stefano:And I think that's where it gets a little murky for the average person is like, okay, where do I take from? Why do I take from there? How do I order the exercises differently? And so that's the real unique part about these two.

18:06Adam Schafer:Totally. Now, one other thing we did, which we just started implementing recently, we just did this for our last program launch, and it was the first time we did it. And it's something that we thought about in the past. We'd never really implemented, but now we have a training and coaching staff here at MindPump that does an excellent job. And so one of the challenges that we've had to, what we've tried to overcome was helping people, A, get started on the program that they purchased and then B, complete it. Yeah. Okay. Now there's an industry average. Industry average for online programs is dismal.

18:42Adam Schafer:Okay. People buy programs, they don't even touch them. They don't even open them, let alone complete them. It stays in their email. Now our average is triple what the industry average is. And I think that's because of the podcast. People listen to us. They hear our advice. They trust us. And so maybe they're more invested. But it still isn't over 80%. It still isn't a majority of people. So there's a lot of people that don't complete a program because, look, that's the issue with all fitness. All fitness is, can I stay consistent? Can I finish this? Can I keep going? We talk about that on the podcast all the time.

19:13Adam Schafer:That's the big challenge. And so what we did for our last program launch is we had one of our top coaches do some free coaching, some free group coaching at the end to help people get started, to talk them through with diet, and to help them finish out and continue afterwards. And the response we got was more than we could have even anticipated.

19:37Sal Di Stefano:Well, he covers diet, the training, lifestyle, kicking off the program. I think it was a huge success. So this was our last time was our first test run of like, okay, how well will this go? I was so impressed with not only the attendance, but then also how long everybody stayed in through the whole process. Oh, yeah. Typically when you do something online like this where you have like a webinar that somebody is showing up to, you have maybe a 50 % show on the first day that dramatically drops. And then every day you see it kind of trickle down. And then you also see, even within the day, early on, people stick around to kind of hear a few things and then bounce.

20:18Sal Di Stefano:The engagement that Cole had, such a testament to, one, I think your point of how valuable I think this is for everybody. Then also what a great coach he is. I think he does such a good job communicating. And the feedback that we got on the last day when we hop on was incredible. Just everybody saying how helpful this was for them to start. And so I think this is going to be going forward anytime that we release programs or do something like that is set this up with it to set people up with success. Yeah.