2944: Low Reps vs. High Reps — Which Actually Builds More Muscle? (The Answer Surprised Us)

14:43Sal Di Stefano:It's hard too, to tell what's really working well for you, what's where it works well for you. Cause there's, there's, we're all individuals, right? And all of us have shared our own personal journeys of, you know, certain rep ranges, certain exercises, certain rest periods tend to lend themselves well with that client. Like I've had certain clients that just respond better with certain modalities. And if you're doing what I was doing, which is kind of throwing the whole kitchen sink at your body all the time, it's hard to tease out and be like, you know, what, what's working the best or at all.

15:13Sal Di Stefano:Yeah.

15:14Adam Schafer:And that, why is that important to know? Well, I'll do more of what's working the best and less of what's not doing. A hundred percent. Otherwise you don't figure that out. That's right. One of the hacks that I had with clients, and I'm just going to give a general, right? It's very different from person to person, but later in my career, I really figured this out. And it was such a hack because what it resulted in was clients that were less fatigued that actually built more muscle and got results, better results. And here's what it looked like. When I would first get a client, barring any major issue, initially my goal was to get them to do correctional exercise so they can move properly.

15:44Adam Schafer:It's always the initial goal. Then I tried to get them to be able to perform these basic compound lifts really well. Once they felt comfortable with that, which could take anywhere between a month to six months or a year, okay, depending on the person. Once I got to that point, low rep training with my clients almost always worked better. Now, it doesn't mean I stayed there all the time. I would move them out and do different things, but it just was less damaging and demanding on their bodies. They weren't so strong that we were risking injury on their joints. This was like Mrs. Johnson deadlifting 135, Mr.

16:18Adam Schafer:Smith, who's pulling 225 off the floor. But man, they would leave, not feel fatigued, build muscle great. When I would have them do the higher rep stuff, it was like, man, you better have good sleep. Your diet better be good and it's going to fatigue the crap out of you and it just the cumulative stress on their bodies was always harder to manage than the lower rep stuff so a lot of my clients i trained them like this and i'd move out of it to keep them you know the body's fresh but this is where they got the best result this is why maps anabolic started with phase one yeah do you think that's because

16:48Sal Di Stefano:it's sending a a louder signal with just less volume or just yeah stress overall stress oh yeah like you take somebody you're like we to your point like miss johnson yeah um you know she does three sets of five you know three sets of five on deadlifts for 100 145 pounds 135 pounds whatever versus her doing you know three sets of 15 at like 90s or 60 or something like that it's just she's gonna get she's gonna get as much she's telling her body she needs as much if not more muscle to move that really really heavy weight than what she needs to move it's not it's

17:22Adam Schafer:not a bunch of fatiguing yeah work when you know mrs johnson you know doesn't get the best sleep She's got a job. She's got to take care of her kids. So this was like a, this was what I played with quite a bit. In fact, sometimes when my clients would come in and they were really fatigued, we would do sets of singles and doubles at a moderate intensity. I would just have them practice the lift. And it was funny. I'd have to convince them in the beginning to be like, what, am I really doing anything? Like, I feel like we're not lifting much. And then they'd come back the next week and we'd add 10 pounds of the bar.

17:50Adam Schafer:And I'd say, look, he just got stronger. And it just was less damaging. Now, when my clients started getting really strong, which I didn't have a lot of clients that got to that place. Like Doug's a good example. He started getting really, really strong. Well, we're not going to play with the singles and doubles all the time. He's pulling 400 pounds at 165 pounds. Now we're looking at risk of injury. So now we're going to play with some other things. But just something to consider. But I think the important thing to understand with this is do both. Do them in phases. Stick to one for like three or four weeks.

18:22Adam Schafer:Have fun with it. Learn how to train that way. then move into the next one for four weeks. It's one of the best things you could do to get perpetual progress.

18:32Sal Di Stefano:Now, when somebody is looking for body composition change, my favorite thing to tell that person regarding this conversation is the best thing you could possibly do is the thing you're not doing. Of course. Like one of my go-to favorite moves with a client who was looking for aesthetic change was asking them, what do you typically do? Totally. And it doesn't matter what the answer is,

18:55Adam Schafer:whether if it's you tend to live five by five for three years yeah five by five there's awesome we're doing high reps we're super setting change will change yeah and then and and that with the

19:04Sal Di Stefano:with proper eating uh would send this awesome novel stimulus to the body that would would induce

19:10Adam Schafer:muscle good example of that is stan efforting so stan efforting a bodybuilder power lifter at one point he was known as the strongest bodybuilder that there was um and even though the guy could squat 700 pounds. When you see him on stage, his legs seem to be lagging a little bit. And so he started training with Flex Wheeler, who was a top bodybuilder in the 90s. And Flex Wheeler had him doing high rep leg exercises, 15, 20 reps. And Stan was like, man, it was so hard. And I never trained that way. But his legs, he gained like two inches around his quads from training that. Why his body was so used to, because he was a powerlifter, he was so used to training in that way that when he moved the higher reps, boom, he got more muscle.

19:52Adam Schafer:So that novelty effect I think is an important thing to communicate. I'm going to switch gears and talk a little bit about a peptide that I just started using that I've used in the past. It's a mitochondria peptide. In other words, it helps the mitochondria function better. So I've talked about MOTC before, which I always love. This one Justin loves too. Loves it. I'm on it right now. Yeah. Anytime I've used MOTC, I get more energy. I feel better. I get a little leaner from it. Not a lot, but I definitely notice I get a little leaner. There's another peptide in this category that works differently called SS31.

20:28Adam Schafer:SS31 operates differently than MOTC, so it's totally different. Started SS31. I think I love it. Really? Yeah, dude. I think I really like it. More than MOTC or like a similar effect? Similar. Similar with the energy, the clarity, the kind of good mood. You know, your mitochondria is operating well. It's like every cell has more energy. So yeah, it's a pretty good one. And you can get it. For a second there, you weren't able to get it, but now you can.

20:54Sal Di Stefano:Mechanistically, are they doing the same thing? Are they doing something different?

20:57Adam Schafer:Different to the mitochondria. So SS31, I'm reading off the screen here, it targets the inner mitochondrial membrane to repair cellular energy production and reduce oxidative stress. So it helps the mitochondria operate better. If you look up MOTC, Doug -

21:14Sal Di Stefano:I feel like I said that's like the same thing.

21:15Adam Schafer:No. No, it's different. So this targets the inner membrane of the mitochondria to do what it does. MOTC regulates cellular metabolism, insulin sensitivity, and energy homeostasis. But how does it work? It activates AMPK pathway, which acts as a cell's master energy regulator. Here's what a lot of people do with the mitochondria ones, is they'll go one and then they'll do the other one. So they'll do like a cycle of one, a cycle of another one. And what's cool about these -

21:44Justin Andrews:It's good to kind of cycle off and then, yeah.

21:45Adam Schafer:Well, what's cool about them is once it kind of repairs what it needs to do, it's not like you got to stay on it. Then you're good. Interesting. So it's like one of those ones you could do like once a year.

21:55Justin Andrews:I mean, again, we don't like to do this, but I know in combination with red light therapy. Oh, yeah. It's like awesome. Supercharge it, right? Well, especially with the mitochondrial peptides. Oh, dude. Yeah, it enhances.

22:06Adam Schafer:Yeah, and our partners at mphormones.com, they they're able to offer every peptide that is available from an FDA compounded pharmacy. So it's like all the good ones.

22:18Sal Di Stefano:Speaking of that, is BBC available? Not available. Okay. It is back. Yeah.

22:22Adam Schafer:BPC one five seven is available again. So you can get them, get it off there. And you're, I want to ask you, Adam, you're micro dosing. I am. Trisepetide.

22:31Sal Di Stefano:I have been now for.

22:33Adam Schafer:So you're taking like one fifth of a normal dose of a starting dose.

22:36Sal Di Stefano:Yeah. So I started off at five units, and then I went to 10 units. Actually, I started off, they started me off at 1.25 or 1.5, or I mean, excuse me, 12.5 or 15 units. I always, I'm thinking about the needle. It's at one, right? So they started me off a little bit higher. It was too much. I noticed it suppressed my appetite.

22:58Adam Schafer:Because you're not trying to take it for a bunch of weight loss.

23:01Sal Di Stefano:No, I really wanted to use it. I told you guys that when, you know, although I went the first time I did all this, I had all the terrible side effects of losing tons of muscle. And I wanted to see what that all felt like by, you know, treating it like a client would treat it. It was all experimental for me, not trying to, like, utilize it to its, you know, maxing out. Not trying to counter it with all your techniques.

23:21Adam Schafer:Yeah, exactly.

23:22Sal Di Stefano:Now, but what I did notice during that process was, man, my psoriasis was really good. Now, was it good based off of what some of these practitioners are talking about because they think that there's some sort of…

23:35Justin Andrews:Or just that you're a little bit low calorie.

23:37Sal Di Stefano:Or is it just because I'm super low calorie? I wasn't sure. So I wanted to test that. And I was like, okay, well, what if I took a dose that's low enough that I get some of the inflammation benefits from it, but not so low that I can't eat what I need to?

23:51Adam Schafer:You mean not so high that it messes up your food? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

23:54Sal Di Stefano:Yes. so i had i i've been floating around trying to figure out what that number was it seems that it's somewhere between the you know five units to 10 units um which is like what you said like a half or even less than a half of a starting dose and it is like perfect i can i feel the inflammation i can tell it slows down motility which has this psychological side of it too for me which is because it slows down motility, it has changed a lot of night eating behaviors that I've had for a long time.

24:27Adam Schafer:Oh, so you're going to feel like you have a brick if you eat too much and it's hard to sleep.

24:30Sal Di Stefano:Yes. And it only took me a couple of times of testing that to go like, I don't like that at all. And so there's been, it just happened last night where I had a good lifting session. I could tell that I was still hungry. My body was wanting to build and eat more. And so, you know, that's normally what I'd be like, oh, I lifted. I moved a lot. I'm lean right now. I could afford some ice cream where I could afford some high calorie meal. But I know like, oh, like that late at night and something that doesn't easily digest. So what did I go get? Rice and ground beef. Oh, yeah. You know, just another, I had a reheated one of the meals that I normally -

25:10Adam Schafer:It's like another plus side. It makes you want to eat better.

25:12Sal Di Stefano:Yes. So, and so I'm not sure if there's something happening with the GLP. one that is impacting my psoriasis and inflammation as much, or is it curbing some of these negative behaviors that I've had before? All I know is I 100 % am, the inflammation is down big time. I can feel it in my hands and joints. I can see it in my face and I'm holding weight. Like I'm not.

25:39Adam Schafer:You have psoriasis, you can tell? Oh yeah.

25:40Sal Di Stefano:Oh yeah. Yeah.

25:41Adam Schafer:You know, so these are, this is all, so we have friends that work in this space that are doctors that prescribe it, lead researchers. So there are studies that are going on now examining the anti-inflammatory and autoimmune protecting effects of GLPs. Because there's been so much anecdote where people are like, man, this autoimmune issue that I have, I mean, yeah, I'm on a GLP, I'm losing weight, but this autoimmune issue seems a lot better. Or I have these lower inflammatory markers. And it was hard to separate like, well, is it the... Yeah. GLP or is it because you're, you're eating less because eating a lot of garbage will do that too.

26:22Adam Schafer:Right. We'll make your inflammation go up off. But there are a lot of practitioners who've been using off label, essentially these compounded, just like from our partners at mphormones.com, right. You get compounded, um, you know, GLP. So it's not a preloaded pen, which means you can use a tiny dose. You can do large dose. A lot of these practitioners are, I'm talking to, and they're like, I use them for clients all the time that way. Like they don't need to lose weight, but they have, you know this particular autoimmune issue we microdose it and it's a lot better first person i heard talk about that was dr tina when we got on the show i remember she said that she said a

26:56Sal Di Stefano:lot like that you know i i have the same skepticism around it like which one is it that's helping yeah the thing that i find interesting is that if it's if it was from low calorie i would think i would be losing weight but i'm holding so it's not so low that you'd lose exactly so it's not so low of calorie that says that for sure was probably a factor i feel like when i took it the first time it crushed appetite and i was cut i mean i lost 20 plus pounds like quick um but i'm i'm holding about the same i i i felt like uh my body released about three to four pounds of water the the initially the inflammation that i joke about in my face and in my joints i felt like i that went and then i've just held right there i mean i'm just holding it 216 to 218 you guys should see

27:42Adam Schafer:the studies that are being conducted on them right now. It's wild. They're studying them for autoimmune issues. They're studying them for addiction. Addiction, yeah. That is crazy because a lot of people are reporting, and we don't have any studies yet that show that it does this, but this is a lot of anecdote, and the studies are going on right now as we speak. So who knows? The jury's out, but personally, I've heard, again, these practitioners report back that their patients are coming back and saying, you know what's weird? I know I'm taking this for weight loss, but I don't want to smoke anymore.

28:12Yeah.

28:13Adam Schafer:Or I don't want to drink alcohol anymore, or I don't want to gamble. The impulse is gone. Bro, I got a buddy, I got a buddy who has a friend, a close friend of his, who was, who took it for gambling because he had a gambling issue. Wow. And I'm like, did he notice that he wants to gamble less? And he goes, yeah. I don't know. So it's acting, definitely acting on the reward centers of the brain. Theoretically, could it affect these things in any way? Yeah. Theoretically it could. So really weird. It is weird. I mean, here's the deal. For the weight loss effects alone, I predict two-thirds or three-quarters of the American population will be on them at some point.

28:51Adam Schafer:You throw in addiction, you know, positives. Yeah. Oh, my God. Addiction and how many people suffer from autoimmune.

29:00Sal Di Stefano:A lot. Yeah. A ton. Yeah. I know. Yeah. No, I'm pretty fascinated with it. I'm well over a month now. I want to see them. I'll look back and see exactly where I'm at and when I started doing it. But it's been a while now. I'm at least six plus weeks, I think, into it. And I got nothing but positive things.

29:20Adam Schafer:Speaking of medications and stuff, did you guys see this drug? I don't know if it got passed yet. I want to see if it passed the FDA trials. but there's this drug that cuts CPAP. So it cuts sleep apnea. So sleep apnea sucks. If you have it, you have to wear a CPAP machine. 44 % it cuts these sleeping events or these breathing events, I should say by 44%, it's a pill. Interesting. A pill? It's a pill. So why? Because it treats the neuromuscular dysfunction that can cause snoring. Really? Yes. So snoring oftentimes we're like, oh, you're heavy. That's part of it. Your tongue grows. Okay. Well, that's, well, I don't know.

30:08Adam Schafer:We don't need to go there yet. I'm like, ooh. Yeah, yeah. We don't need to go there yet. But we do know that there's some kind of neuromuscular dysfunction that happens with some people. Because some people have sleep apnea that are not overweight. They just have it. You're overweight. You're such a dick. You're a big old neck, dude. Damn. Damn, damn. Shots fired. It's all right. I'm the one that wears a CPAP in here. Calm down, Beak. But did you guys - Holy - Dang, bro. All right. Did you guys - Okay, so let me ask you guys this. Do you guys notice that - Like, you don't have sleep apnea. No.

30:46Adam Schafer:But do you snore if you drink?

30:48Sal Di Stefano:Oh, yeah. Yeah. Or if I'm really tired or something like that. So I periodically will. I always have to ask Katrina because I don't know when I do and she never complains with anybody.

30:58Adam Schafer:A lot of people will say they don't normally snore, but if they drink, they'll snore. It's a neuromuscular issue that's happening. You know what else can contribute to snoring? This is an anecdote. There's a lot of them. Gluten for some people. So people with gluten intolerances will snore more when they have gluten.

31:13Sal Di Stefano:Oh, that's interesting.

31:15Adam Schafer:Because it affects their CNS. Now, side effects of this pill, who knows? Yeah, that fixes this, but then you get anal leakage and all kinds of other things that come with it.

31:25Sal Di Stefano:like it's not bleeding in different areas dude those those i don't snore anymore but i have those uh those funny commercials you know of all the drugs like that may cause you get the micro machine guy at the end and wrap yeah yeah cool my rash is gone but i got 10 of these other things that have erectile dysfunction more women want to talk to me but i can't do anything about

31:44Justin Andrews:it oh my god do you guys know what a merkin is i have a merkin about this yes that sounds so

31:50Adam Schafer:doesn't that sound like from the movie trolls is that what that is no the bad guys no merkin No. I've heard this. Okay.

31:55Justin Andrews:So what brings this up is because like - Merkin. Honestly, it was like - Can we guess? Courtney was talking to one of her friends who was like hairstylist and they were joking because they were talking about wigs and stuff and all this. And it comes up. She's like, do you know what Merkin? I'm like, no. It's a wig - No. For your pubes. Oh, that's what it is.

32:14Sal Di Stefano:That's what it is.

32:15Justin Andrews:I was like, I know I've heard this before. It's not just like a new thing.

32:18Sal Di Stefano:It's supposed to be like stick out of your -

32:20Justin Andrews:It's like a whole - It goes through there and it's like a little beard. you know, for it. How do you keep it on? Well, and two people, so, so actors and actresses, like they do this for like sex scenes too. And they put that on to kind of cover up. Okay.

32:34Adam Schafer:So no normal person is like, I'm going to put on my pubes. Yes. Why? I don't know. I didn't know that was like a desirable thing. Yeah. I mean, guys wear muscle shirts now. But I don't, I have to my knowledge. I put my Merkin on. I don't know. I have, I did not know that women are like, yeah, you know, he's cool. Doug, pull it up. Yeah. My landing's working. You can make me search for this. He's over here delaying over here.

32:53Sal Di Stefano:He just doesn't want to pull it up. I really don't want to pull it up.

32:55Adam Schafer:I mean, I don't think that's a thing, is it? Is that a thing? Where you're insecure because you don't have enough? Well, because back in the day, again, this is like the syphilis days.

33:03Sal Di Stefano:Merkin trends? Yeah, like. Yeah. A resurgence in popularity through high fashion pop culture. High fashion. There you go. You guys are. I thought you were the fashion guy, Adam. Yeah, no, I'm not claiming that. Wait a minute.

33:16Adam Schafer:Public figures like Doja Cat and Julia Fox. I don't know who they are, but they're famous. they bring back the 1970s full bush aesthetic so what I don't understand is why not just grow it maybe I don't know maybe they went too hard and then lasered it at some point now they're like oh no

33:32Justin Andrews:yeah they probably lasered it off dude what the hell why not just grow it

33:38Adam Schafer:listen I'm Sicilian I don't think there's a single Sicilian that needs to wear a merkin that's all I can

33:47Adam Schafer:we don't need those I just thought it was fun I was like, of course, you know, they make wigs, but I'm like, I didn't know they made wigs for that. Ew. Dating back to the 14 and 1500s, they were originally used historically by sex workers to mask the physical effects of sexually transmitted infections. Oh. Just hide it. You got a bunch of crabs on it.

34:07Sal Di Stefano:Oh. You know, it's funny when you see like these new people that do it as a trend right now, they don't know the origin of it. You know what I'm saying? Hey, why are you wearing that?

34:15Adam Schafer:What's going on? So you must tape it on. It's got to have like sticky tape on it.

34:18Sal Di Stefano:Yeah. Or just sitting in the underwear. You know what we should do? It's probably just sitting in the underwear. You know what we should do?

34:23Adam Schafer:We should buy them. Like a Velcro? We should buy them in a different hair color. And see if it arrives.

34:29Sal Di Stefano:I'll wear a red one. I just don't get why not just grow it out. Doug, find me an Irish Merkin, please.

34:36Adam Schafer:Does the carpet mash the drapes kind of a thing? Wow, bro. You could also wear that as a goatee, though, by the way. Yeah, yeah. The Merkin. Downstairs or upstairs. just don't switch them up it's versatile just don't put the wrong ones to the wrong place yeah hey you like my new beard yeah that's my merchant this looks itchy I don't like it oh gross yeah so my goodness alright I thought that was interesting alright this total good segue because now I want everything filtered did you guys read the story the study on HEPA air filters did not did you guys read this have you even seen this Doug I'm surprised you haven't what are HEPA air filters so air filters that use a HEPA like purifier So this is like one of the best air filters to clean out the air.

35:21Adam Schafer:So we have the big one in here. The ones we have in our homes, because we all have the same ones. They are very, very good at purifying the air. They're micro level. Check this out. Trip off this. This was a study. Adults age 40 and older performed 12 % faster on a test of executive function after using a HEPA air filter in their home for one month. Wow. 30 days. wow 30 days isn't that wild jeez imagine what could possibly like what would be for a year

35:53Justin Andrews:dust and they're the particulate matter for the air and by the way microplastics microplastics

35:57Adam Schafer:there's a lot of them we breathe in jeez isn't that crazy wow do you know that in some cases indoor air pollution is worse than outdoor well if they have makes that makes sense because you're

36:06Sal Di Stefano:locked in your clothes just like you know you're in a box yeah yeah yeah isn't that crazy trapped

36:11Adam Schafer:in there so i wonder if like um how much of our like degenerative diseases uh like dementia and might be connected to some of those things. 12 % in a month. There's not a supplement that would do that. That's crazy, dude. Isn't that amazing? That's interesting. Do you guys have air filters in every room at home? No. Not every room. I have two right now. Two rooms, yeah. I want another one. We have them in every single room.

36:30Sal Di Stefano:You do?

36:31Adam Schafer:Remember we moved out of the old place because of the mold.

36:34Sal Di Stefano:Oh, yeah, yeah.

36:34Adam Schafer:And so I got really like - Super paranoid. You're able to not - You didn't have to burn anything? Like it didn't transfer with you? No, we threw so many things away. We bought all new stuff. All new stuff. But I put filters in every bedroom And yeah so Good I'm glad I did That's pretty wild actually

36:53Sal Di Stefano:I wonder how like the biggest offenders I know those like Glade plugins are bad Right those are really bad No I don't do it anymore I used to I used to love those Especially when I had dogs What was your scent?

37:07Adam Schafer:Vanilla

37:10Sal Di Stefano:I'm a big vanilla guy

37:11Adam Schafer:Yeah me too I like that too

37:14Sal Di Stefano:That takes me back to high school though Remember I told you guys that No

37:18Adam Schafer:I don't know Jesus guy I'm sorry I mean Sorry I assumed

37:24Sal Di Stefano:He was in high school dude

37:26Adam Schafer:First of all

37:27Justin Andrews:Second You didn't go to strip club in high school dude No

37:30Sal Di Stefano:It's like my first kiss dog Come on Come on It's like Where were you in high school? What were you doing in high school guy? I worked construction Yeah Oh god I'm over here copping a field and making out You know what I'm saying That's all I'm doing That's true I like this guy. Yeah, I like this guy. This guy's over here, drugs and strippers, dude. Calm down, dude. Calm down, rock star. I wasn't even crazy at all, dude. That's the whole reason why I just calmed down, Aerosmith.

37:54Justin Andrews:I just assumed you were. That's all. I don't know.

37:56Adam Schafer:He was just testing you. Yeah. Shut up. Right, right? Shut up. Hey, did you hear about the otter attack, Justin? You were saying - Okay, so. No, it's not Santa Cruz, but you were saying earlier.

38:07Justin Andrews:Yeah, we have a local, like, famous otter that it's off of Westcliff. What? Because it's like, this is where it lives.

38:16Adam Schafer:I didn't know this about otters. They're territorial. I love otters. They're so cute. They look like little puppies in the water. It's one of my favorite animals. They are super cute. They're vicious.

38:24Justin Andrews:Yeah. So it would swim up to surfers and bite them. And it was funny. It was like - Otter 841. That's his name. Wow. Yeah. It became like people wear shirts with the otters. No way. Yeah. He's like a mascot of Santa Cruz.

38:40Adam Schafer:It's funny. I like the name 841. Is that the zip code or something? No, they tag them. They tag them. So check this out. A veteran open water swim instructor from Reno, so Lynette Beline, 38 stitches in intensive medical treatment. 38 stitches? After being aggressively attacked by a river otter while swimming along the east shore of Lake Tahoe. Wow. Like. Wow, that's vicious. They're not even that big. I didn't think. They could get big. Otters?

39:06Justin Andrews:I thought it was just like little bites. I didn't think. They could get decent size, I think.

39:09Adam Schafer:Dude, I thought they were the sweetest animals ever. How heavy can they get, Doug? Yeah, how big can an otter get? Because that's like a river dog.

39:18Sal Di Stefano:I feel like they can get pretty heavy.

39:19Adam Schafer:No.

39:20Sal Di Stefano:No. No, dude.

39:21Adam Schafer:They're 35 to 54 inches long. They're like 11 to 35 pounds. I would have guessed 80 to 90 pounds at least. Good Lord.

39:28Sal Di Stefano:Yeah, yeah. 90 pound otter? Yeah, no, I thought so. They look fat to me. The river ones? Yeah. No, they're so good. Well, I guess they're -

39:35Adam Schafer:Maybe the river ones are meaner. I don't know. Hey, look at those little teeth. Oh, yeah. They look different.

39:38Sal Di Stefano:Is there a difference between the river and ocean ones size-wise?

39:42Adam Schafer:I don't know. But you know what's funny? They're cute because they're furry. If they had no fur, I would not think they're cute. Totally. How big are the ocean ones? They call it sea otter, yeah. 35 to 60. Up to 90 pounds. Oh, God. Big difference. That's a southern sea. That's like the ocean ones, dude. How do we know so much about animals sometimes? Oh, is it the animal shows your son watches? Is that what it is? No, I just thought. Every once in a while you throw out a fact about animals, and I'm always like, how did he know? 90 pounds.

40:11Sal Di Stefano:I mean, I was wrong on the river. I just assumed that they were the same size. I didn't know that they were that dramatically different. It was like half the size. Yeah.

40:19Adam Schafer:Wow. I didn't tell you guys about, speaking of kids, my daughter, my three-year-old daughter, we go to the pool at the gym we go to, and she got her a bikini finally, and she was so excited. She calls it a boob mask. The top. Look, I have a boob mask. Oh, my gosh. I look like mom. It works. Yeah, I did. I guess you got a boob mask on.

40:44Sal Di Stefano:Speaking of that, we're at this interesting crossroad or phase, I guess, with Max. He's at that age now where he's getting too old to like, he's been so comfortable with mom grabbing her boobs. Oh, yeah. He does the same thing? Yeah, yeah. See, my son does that too. Yeah, yeah. And then Katrina's like trying to like, hey, you can't do that. Why? Why can't I do that? They're so soft Explaining it They're so comfortable

41:07Adam Schafer:Yeah He's all dad does Yeah

41:11Sal Di Stefano:You know Or Should we get out of the hot tub And he'll like stick his face Between her butt cheeks And like try and blow Oh my god bro Listen

41:17Adam Schafer:Can I tell you something I feel so much better now I thought my son had a problem I was like Part of me was like Man They don't know I was like My poor kid He's gonna be bad like I was He's instinct So it is normal Yeah yeah yeah Unless our kids are just taking Yeah I don't know

41:31Sal Di Stefano:I don't know Max is doing I mean you know And maybe that's the thing I have to be careful of. Like we've, and I've also started to go like, hmm, this is probably where I need to stop doing this too where it's just like, you know, him and I swim naked in the pool. It's our pool. You know what I'm saying? But that's different. I feel like that's different too. Yeah, that's okay. But I've told you that. But I mean, I think we've just been so comfortable with our bodies open. There's no, there's -

41:50Adam Schafer:My son does the same thing. He grabs my wife's boobs. Yeah. You know, we'll do the same thing with the butt. Yeah. And she gets really, she gets really mad. Yeah. And so she's like, those are private areas. You can't do that. Katrina's at that right now. And he giggles and thinks it's funny. Yeah. And it doesn't help that I laugh, you know, in the background. Because when he first does it, it makes me laugh too.

42:06Sal Di Stefano:We're trying to transition out of that right now. And, like, he needs to know. And, you know, he's rubbing up against Katrina. And he can't control his body yet. And he doesn't know what's going on. And so she's like, okay, we need to learn to have a little bit of our...

42:20Adam Schafer:This would be great to remind him when he's a teenager. He's all weird. You used to grab your mom's boobs all the time. Remember that? Remember?

42:28Sal Di Stefano:but his girlfriend's over i mean it's it's there's there's parts i think that are really cute so i'll come in um because this is like the new talking point and like he's learning that and i told you too he likes to sleep naked right so uh if i if i come in and uh like there'll be times where i you know i get in late or you know i was doing something i hadn't said good night to him and so i'll come in after katrina's already tucked him in lights are out so like that and also come in kiss him good night and stuff like that sometimes i'll lay there for a little bit and remember the first time it happened i didn't know what was going on so i obviously know what's going on now but i would go in and you know it's pitch black and i'm trying to find my way into his bed and i'm normally crawling lay next to him just kind of rub his head and kiss him good night or like that and uh the like the first time this happened like all of a sudden he pops up he gets up and he's like in the cover he's just moving around i'm like what is he doing and i realized that he's he's putting his underwear back on oh so he's feeling a little more conscious yeah yeah Well, he knows that.

43:20Sal Di Stefano:Well, he's been told that, like, hey, when you're laying in bed next to mommy and daddy, like, you're okay. Because he's been told he can sleep naked. He wants to. I tell Katrina, like, let him sleep naked if he wants to sleep naked. But she's like, yeah, but then he crawls in next to me, and he's naked, and his thing gets all hard. And she's like, come on. So she's like, I was like, well, then just tell him when he's laying in bed.

43:37Adam Schafer:Boy, these kids are going to listen to these episodes one day. Oh, my God. Oh, they won't care.

43:41Sal Di Stefano:By the time they finally, you know what our kids are going to care is when they're 30 something, and they'll be in a cell. Yeah, yeah. But anyway, so she's coached him on like, you can sleep naked when you're by yourself, but when you're with mommy and daddy, you put your underwear on. But I didn't know that was going on. I'm like, what are you doing, buddy? He's like, oh, I'm putting my underwear on. Oh, okay. I think it's hilarious.

43:59Adam Schafer:I can never sleep naked because always the thought in my head is if I have to jump out of bed to defend my family, I'm naked.

44:09Sal Di Stefano:Oh, I feel like that's one of the best defenses. It's scarier for everybody. I feel like if I come running out, ass naked with my gun, you are more scared.

44:19Adam Schafer:Yeah, I feel like that's way scarier. This guy's crazy. He didn't even put on shorts. I feel like that's it. I just don't want to be grabbed. Or you go like you're going to grab him. You don't even need a gun. Glad you're here. Jump on you. That would be the best way. You didn't even have to knock, dude. Wasn't there a guy? Wasn't there a dude? dude, I think I read this a long time ago, this article where someone broke into his house and the dude tied him up and then like abused him the whole time. No way. Yeah, dude. Like, yes, I think this is true. It was like, so yeah, dude, remember that? So we were in high school.

44:57Adam Schafer:I don't know.

44:57Sal Di Stefano:There was a guy we used to terrorize that we called Underwear Anderson. And it's because he used to, we used to like toilet paper the house and be like kid shit, right? Oh, older guy. Yeah, older guy. And well, I mean, he was probably our age, my age, you know what I'm saying? And he used to come out and chase us in his underwear. You know what I'm saying? And so we were all scared to death. Underwear Anderson. Yeah, underwear Anderson.

45:18Adam Schafer:Listen, oh, here it is, dude. I told you, look at this. A local shop, so this is an orange, of course, Orange County, Florida. A local shopkeeper and his brother caught two individuals attempting to burglarize their commercial property. Rather than contacting law enforcement, the store owners took matters into his hands, held them at gunpoint, forced relocation. So they moved into the back bathroom. Then they were ordered stripped naked and were severely beaten. Wow. Yeah. When the intruders were arrested for the break in the shop owner was also arrested and faced charges of assault, battery with a deadly weapon, torture, and sexual battery.

45:49Adam Schafer:Wow. But you know what? They're never going to break into a house. What a deterrent. I guarantee you don't drive in an electric fence. Change their life. They'll never do that again. No. You never know. It's like that scene from - Spread the word. What was that? Pulp fiction? It's just like pulp fiction. Yeah.

46:03Sal Di Stefano:I feel like you, you know, that's the F around and find out. I feel like you do something like that, you know, I don't know. I feel like that should be, that's part of the gamble. Your little heist didn't go as planned.

46:15Justin Andrews:Yeah.

46:16Sal Di Stefano:I feel like if that goes down that way, it's like, I mean, obviously you can't kill them. And like, what does torture mean? Does torture just mean like they, you know, they handcuffed him, stripped him down, whipped him a little bit. Like that's, you deserve that, bro. You come in, you come in, try to rob me. Like you just getting a little naked ass whooping is like, that's a luck. You're lucky. You're lucky I didn't shoot you dead. It's like a gift. Or you give them an option.

46:35Adam Schafer:Listen, either call the police or I whip you around a little bit. What do you want to do? Or I'm going to do some things. Let me call my friend. I don't know. What kind of things? Let me call my friend who shows up with a mask. Yikes. That's funny. Anyway, so I want to talk about Manuka Honey, the company I work with, Manukora. Such a good transition. Yeah. Yeah, so good.

46:57Sal Di Stefano:Speaking of stripping so many things. They're going to love that. Strip them naked, throw some honey on them. You know what I'm saying?

47:03Adam Schafer:Okay, okay, okay. Leave them out in the woods. Get the pet bear to finish months.

47:08Sal Di Stefano:Actually, I was going to ask you something about monocore. So yesterday I asked you about the stack for me for the things. It was that. It was. That's the one I forgot. I knew it. I knew it. We were all trying to think of that. I got to give Katrina credit because she actually remembered. So it was funny. So yesterday. Because it's antiviral. Yeah. So the audience knows because we're talking in code here. Yesterday, so my son got sick. He didn't go to school. and I was telling Sal, I'm like, man, you recently talked about one of our sponsors and it's like benefits for like not getting sick or something.

47:43Sal Di Stefano:I couldn't remember what he had said. And I'm like, so, and I said, man, I should really add that to my stack. And I'm like, so I went through the list of things like stack the vitamin D, the zinc, the, um, no,

47:55Adam Schafer:it was, uh, it was, uh, zinc, uh, elderberry. It was, um, uh, what was the other one I told? Oh, thymocin alpha. Yes, thymocin alpha. Thymocin alpha, so that's a peptide.

48:04Sal Di Stefano:And then NAD and glutathione. Yep. And then the thing that we couldn't remember. And so I did all the stuff. I had to contribute. And then what made me remember it was last night. So we have tea like every night. And she had bought this other off-brand honey because our guy next door who does his own honey was out. So we just happened to have this random honey that I had on the counter. And so I just used it. And she's like, why are you using that? why would you use the monochore because like right now max is sick and i'm like that's the thing that sal that's what we couldn't figure out it was that right yeah because it's antiviral

48:39Adam Schafer:antibacterial um and especially when you're being exposed right before you get sick use it yes yep

48:45Sal Di Stefano:yep so there's the there's the monster stack for you right there so nad glutathione zinc elderberry thymusin alpha monochore monochore you want the ultimate defense to getting sick well you haven't Knock on wood. We're talking a thousand right now. But you've been sick inside this room with us. I was. Max has been sick. Katrina has been sick. Have you been sick? No.

49:09Adam Schafer:Justin never gets sick. You don't get sick either. Him and Doug don't get sick. You've been sick three times the whole time I've known you.

49:15Sal Di Stefano:Both my kids have been sick quite a bit. What's interesting about that is the two of you are the more cortisol stress junkies out of all of us. Maybe we're too relaxed. Yeah. Maybe me. Yeah. I don't know. Maybe we need more stress.

49:27Justin Andrews:Maybe. I'm less stressed than I was. when was the last time you had to test it? too busy to be sick last time Cabral did it but last time I tested normal you did? remember that yeah

49:35Sal Di Stefano:yeah wow what would you attribute that because that was something you

49:39Justin Andrews:oh I worked on that so hard

49:40Sal Di Stefano:you did yeah I mean like so hard

49:42Justin Andrews:meaning I slept more yeah

49:45Sal Di Stefano:like I mean

49:46Justin Andrews:tried to change some lifestyle things

49:48Adam Schafer:such as beating the clock you know yeah is late more often? no no no you're not I'm not late no no I was no you're on time was that

49:58Sal Di Stefano:No, that's a fair assessment. I think it's been a long time since I've seen it. There have been many times before that where you were scrambling, doing multitasking, coming in. I haven't scrambled for a long time. Yeah, you haven't. Which is a good sign. No, you're right. But my stress is way down. But sleep, I will say. It's actually rare that I get here, because I'm normally one of the first ones here. It's rare I get here and you're not already here. Yeah, Doug's always here. Which was not the case before. That wasn't. Yeah. Yeah, that's true.

50:22Justin Andrews:I've turned a new leaf. Good.

50:25Sal Di Stefano:I wonder how much that is playing a factor. The sleep for me is a big one. Oh, the sleep is huge. I got a 60 last night. Oh, no. Yeah, just because I didn't go to sleep on time. I didn't go to sleep on time. What were you watching? No, I was trying to get some from my wife all night long. Oh, okay. And she was like, and normally she's game always, but she knows that it gives her energy and it puts me to sleep. So that's how it is.

50:51Adam Schafer:She's like, I need to sleep.

50:52Sal Di Stefano:Yeah, I'm like, I need to sleep. and she's going like she turned you down that never happens i know well that is because you know what i miss my window so which i don't like that no i don't like putting me in a window yeah like and so she she's like you know hey let's go it's like six o 'clock you know so i'm like that's too early i want to relax a little bit i want to do my thing and then i will or whatever with that and then because i miss my window she's like no it's gonna wake me up and then all night long i'm trying and then i can't sleep because i'm like yeah yeah yeah so you know it's i don't know about you guys but that's my like you know she says she says no and then like an hour later you know keep wandering yeah it's like like there's something subconscious i don't think i'm not even like doing it like trying it just like subconsciously like let me see if my wife just

51:34Adam Schafer:my wife tells me i'm just how you're receiving this she says i'm incessant like i'll come on to her and then like it's always at the wrong time she'd like just have told me she has a migraine 10 minutes later i'm like hey you're in the mood she's like i just told you i don't I totally don't feel good. And then I'm just kind of like persistent. It's the sales guy in me. You know what I mean? It makes me good at sales. It's hard for me. You know what I mean? I'm like, well, there's, you know. Circle the wagon. That's another objection.

51:58Sal Di Stefano:It's only been five no's. I got two more to go.

52:03Sal Di Stefano:I'm getting better though. So that's what happens. I go to bed and there's at, you know, 10 o 'clock at night and all night long, I still think I have a chance until three o 'clock in the morning. You know what I'm saying? Oh, no. I just realized, oh, now you're bad. Yeah, I'm mad.

52:18Adam Schafer:Say no to her next time. Get her back, dude. That's a good marriage right there. I got a study for you guys on homeschool. Did you guys hear about this? No. So this was a peer-reviewed study that was the first nationwide homeschool achievement study in 15 years. You want to know what they found? What? From homeschool kids? What? They scored 29 percentile points higher in reading, 25 percent points higher in language, 25 % points higher in math, 26 % points higher in social studies, and 27 % points higher in science. So generally speaking, they perform better.

52:53Sal Di Stefano:You know what I find so interesting about that is how different that is from what I felt like the narrative was. Yes, totally. It's so opposite of what I think people thought before. Or is it, Sal, has public education just got that bad? Or is it just a combination of the two? Like maybe homeschooling isn't that much better. It's just that public school is not so bad.

53:19Adam Schafer:Here's what I know. Because now I know because we homeschool. And I know enough parents that homeschool now because we homeschool. One thing that always, this is consistent across the board from everybody I've met. It takes them an hour or two hours to do all the schoolwork of the day. That's it. Yeah. So you normally go to school for like seven hours. These kids are done.

53:37Justin Andrews:You don't have to start super early in the morning.

53:39Adam Schafer:No, dude. Dude, like no kid performs awesome like that. And nobody has as much of a vested interest as a parent.

53:46Sal Di Stefano:So I look at this great example in front of me of my son's age and three different approaches to this, right? So we've got you and Jessica with homeschool. I've got my best friend who's public school and they're teachers. And Katrina and I who have Max in private school. And I would say all of our kids are excelling. but it strategically from different for different reasons right like your point about homeschooling yes like so exactly like you you've pointed out the benefits and and of homeschooling so that uh obviously i've seen what with max and his school like i'm so impressed with like i know that i don't have the what jessica has the disciplines you need if you're going to homeschool

54:29Adam Schafer:i could never do it if it was on me oh i know i know there's just so much so much so much more

54:34Sal Di Stefano:outside of just parenting. Instructure. Yes. That, that you're, you're, you're teaching them and it's not as simple as just, you're not teaching them math and education. Like there's values that his school is teaching him beyond education that I love. Right. And I would like, man, I wouldn't even think to do that. And it's so cool that this school does that. Then I see my, my best friend who's his kids are going to public school, but they're teachers. And so school doesn't end when school ends. Like they spend a lot of afterwards. They're very, and their kids are wicked smart. But I also think it's because they don't just, it doesn't end at school when they get home.

55:08Sal Di Stefano:They're both teachers. So everything is a lesson. And I remember my mom, my mom's like this. If you watch my mom, when my mom - But she's a teacher. She's a teacher. So when she, she doesn't play with my son. She teaches when she plays with my son. So like everything is a teaching lesson. And that's if you've ever, if anybody who's been married to or knows a teacher in their family, that they have that, especially good ones, right? They have this gift where everything they do, is it like every meal, everything. And I feel like homeschool moms have this trait. They start to learn how to do that, how to build a lesson in everything that they do.

55:42Adam Schafer:And the other thing too is there's a, I don't know how you would control for this, but I would imagine that the kind of parents that want to homeschool are generally more vested than the general group of parents who sends their kids off to school. In other words -

55:57Justin Andrews:Less like disconnected.

55:58Adam Schafer:Yeah, like how much of this percent, you know, 25 % better at these, you know, categories, is it that just because the parents care and they're involved? It's a big factor. Because I wonder if you took the parents whose kids go to school, public school, and then took the ones that actually are involved, would we see the difference?

56:16Sal Di Stefano:You know what I'm saying? Well, the other thing you could also ask yourself, you should ask this too, is like, you know, how important is love, right? For a kid, right? In the process of raising. and how much of love is translated as in time for them. Yeah. So in other words, you homeschooling them. You spend more time with them. You spend way more time with them, which is perceived as more love. You're right. And so is the more love playing a bigger factor in all those categories?

56:45Adam Schafer:There's a downside to it too, and people don't want to talk about this, but I'll say it as a parent. If I had to homeschool my kids and it was all me, you get no breaks. I mean, I'm not going to lie. Sometimes you send your kid to school and it's good. You like the school. You get a break. Yeah. You get like a three-hour break when they're little, a six-hour break when they're older. You get to do other things. That's rough. My wife gets no breaks except for the ones I come in and step in and give her. Otherwise, it's all shifting. And then it's hard for you to share that break with her.

57:15Sal Di Stefano:You know what I'm saying? So, no, 100%. I couldn't do it. I couldn't do it. I have so much respect for somebody who does do that or chooses to do that. I think that it's, it's incredible, especially to be good at it. Right. I think it's incredibly challenging. It's again, what I, uh, I have, I'm so grateful for that we have is that we can send him to a school that I feel is teaching a lot of things that one I want. And then two, I wouldn't even have thought of that. I think it's so valuable.

57:40Adam Schafer:One of our big motivations for it, well, a couple, one is we want to be able to teach them some of the stuff that we want to teach them that you want, that you'd have to like specifically find a school that's going to teach a particular way that's hard the second thing is there's things that i don't want them to be taught that a lot of the especially public schools around here yeah where i'm like you know what

57:58Sal Di Stefano:you don't even find out till after that was my biggest consideration yeah i know was uh was diving drove me out yeah no 100 i've had that talk many times i said the the day they teach something that i don't want my son teaching i'll i'll pull them out i have friends who

58:13Adam Schafer:Who found out after, after the kid learned the, the, whatever they were teaching them. And it's like, dude, well, and then, yeah.

58:20Justin Andrews:And there was this like idea that they could opt out. Like, like my kids could just walk out, you know, not have to like, it was like sex education. And that was just like, the, the teacher was literally like, no, you can't leave and you can't like hold on. And you know, this became, yeah, it's became, and it's like, you can't, you can't say that's how the experience is going to be. and then now you're like literally going against what you're telling me is going to happen in the class so we're like dude we're out of here yeah i mean katrina and i we went down to the principal

58:49Sal Di Stefano:and asked all the questions do you teach this do you teach this do you like i want to know like i want to i want to know before it happens not after the fact because i didn't ask the questions because i want to i want to find all that stuff out so i i agree with you i think it's not just uh the stuff that you want them to be taught it's also stuff you don't you don't you don't feel their your kid needs to be taught especially at a young age yeah it's like at one point you know he can

59:11Adam Schafer:learn about some of it's appropriate and some of it seems innocuous like i'm not even talking about the controversial stuff necessarily although that's part of it some of it's just like you don't i don't think you need to be teaching a third grader that we're destroying the earth and that you know if we don't change directions in 10 years like what are you teaching my third kid who can't have zero control over that to panic and freak out fear fear fear yeah all these animals are extinct and we're killing them all you know and the kids in third grade are like what yeah What are we doing? It's like, why do they need to know that?

59:40Adam Schafer:So they can do what? Nothing. They can't do anything about it. Why are we placing this in their lap?

59:45Sal Di Stefano:And there'll come a time when they will learn and then we can talk about it. We can discuss that. But at that age, it's like -

59:51Adam Schafer:The worst thing you could do is learn about something extremely stressful that you have zero ability to influence or control. That's a very, that's not a good place to be for a kid. It's scary.

1:00:01Sal Di Stefano:I think a lot of that stuff too is predicated on how a teacher delivers it. because I think that can play a huge role too. Because you could talk about an animal being extinct and you can do it in a way that makes people, you can make the kid feel like we're killing these things. That's right. There's two different things. Versus like I just used to be a lot. Exactly, yeah. There used to be a lot of them. They've died off is one thing. And being extinct is one thing versus saying like humans are killing it. Like that's how they present that information has a lot to do with that information too.

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1:02:07Sal Di Stefano:our first caller is mark from wisconsin mark what's up what's happening hey guys this is cool thank you you got it man how can we help you well i'll keep the intro short uh got into fitness a few years ago been listening to your show for a couple years now want to thank you very much for your no nonsense you know just delivery on fitness right keep into your core principles, finding unique ways to, you know, continue to just get those across. But I'm a guy that focuses on goals. And I kind of had a weight loss goal when I started, I got there, noticed I was starting to get a little stronger, which was awesome.

1:02:47Sal Di Stefano:And every couple months, I'd have to go to the local gym and pick up a couple more weights, right, pick up a couple more weights. And I, I'm an older guy, I'm in my late 40s, but I feel really strong.

1:02:59Justin Andrews:And I I want to set a goal of maybe going like to a potential strongman competition.

1:03:05Sal Di Stefano:So I went online and started looking at like some of the categories and things you have to do. But I just don't know, like, you know, it seems like there's not a great separation of age, weight limit, skill level. And I'm looking for some advice. Like if that's not the right thing to do, tell me like, I want to get strong and I want to have something to look forward to and see if I can compete with other late forties.

1:03:32Adam Schafer:All right. Good question. So let's back up for a second more. Cause I'm reading your email and it says, um, And essentially, you're talking about needing a new goal. And it sounds like without a goal, you kind of feel bored or you lack direction. Does that resonate? Right.

1:03:48Sal Di Stefano:100 percent. I got my personal trainer certificate about two years ago and I put programming together, would go to the gym all the time. And now, you know, again, life just gets in the way. And when I go outside in my garage and work out, it's I just don't have the programming set. I'm always doing something a little bit different, not working on progressive overload, not focusing. I'm just happy that I'm out there and doing something. But I've noticed the strength kind of go away a little bit. So I, I, I want to get back.

1:04:18Adam Schafer:So the root, the root issue, uh, and, and just correct me if I'm wrong. The root issue is just kind of, you're losing that spark and you want to kind of reinvigorate that spark. Okay. So there's a couple of things here, uh, that we want to address with that. Now, one, uh, and I do want to say that having goals is great. I mean, we always encourage people to have goals. That's a big part of fitness, but there is a downside, uh, to goals, which is that you always need to have a goal in order to find yourself having the motivation to be consistent or to, like I said earlier, to have that spark with fitness.

1:04:53Adam Schafer:And that can actually be detrimental. Now, it's not often something that someone runs into because most people just run into the problem of not being consistent. But when somebody's really consistent, constantly needing a goal can actually pose a challenge. And what you sometimes find with people is I would have clients that were like this is that they had to sign up for something all the time. Yeah. This is the only way they could be consistent with the workouts. And what it, what it can, what it did for many of them is it just moved them in directions that wasn't really good for their bodies, uh, or they would, uh, overtrain or burn themselves out because they had to get the next marathon, the next triathlon, the next whatever.

1:05:30Adam Schafer:So keep that kind of in mind. So there's nothing wrong with goals, but what we also, what we also want to do, and you've been working out for a while now, we're in the same age category, is we want to find workouts that are just fun for the sake of the workout itself. And that's a great place to be. Like if you just enjoy the workout because it's fun, if you enjoy being active because it's fun, you'll never run out of that spark. It'll always be there because the spark really is just that workout itself. It's not that I'm necessarily aiming for something. It's that I just enjoy doing what I'm doing.

1:06:03Adam Schafer:And that's a really,

1:06:04Sal Di Stefano:really good place to be well we have to talk a little bit about why that is too because at some point you you reach these goals or you you hit peak right so like one of the things you've been going through is you you lost all this great weight that was a huge goal you've accomplished that you know now let's say yeah you're seeing strength go up so now we start we set this strength goal and strong man we're probably going to see some strength but eventually you get to a point where at your late 40s, you're strong as, you're hitting your 90 percentile strength. You got good cardio, like all these things.

1:06:36Sal Di Stefano:And so it can get really discouraging when you don't see progress. And part of, I'm definitely way weaker than 35-year-old Adam. I definitely don't look as good as 32. And so if I'm always drawing back to like if I have to have this competition, I'll look like I'm failing all the time. So if I were to go try and chase something that I've already peaked at, and that's the driving motivator, then it can also work against me as like, well, shit, I remember when I was so much stronger than this. And it's like, so that's part of why that strategy of always having this serious goal you go towards can be a failing strategy, especially as we age and we've been doing this for decades.

1:07:19Adam Schafer:Yeah, there's a psychological phenomenon you'll see with people when they accomplish a massive goal and then they'll have a period after of what can feel like depression. So it's like, I want to be a bestselling author. I get there the year after that, it's like one of the hardest years of my life type of deal. And so that's just some of the things you might run into. Now, I will say this, you are interested in doing a sport that does have a small, but very tight community. So like powerlifting, strongman tends to have a really great tight community. And so my recommendation to you, if this is something you're interested in is to find a local strongman training gym or group, if one exists near you, go to it and you ask them and say, look, I've never done this before.

1:08:05Adam Schafer:I'd love to try. What does that look like? Is there something I can sign up for? Or what do you recommend? And then become a part of that community and then take it from there. And I think that would be the best strategy moving forward. And I would recommend that to you if you were 26 instead of 46. So I would say the same thing. I'd say, go find a strong man club, uh, introduce yourself. And they love that. I mean, you go in there, as long as you're serious and you're not, you know, and you're like, Hey, look, I want to do this. I want to learn this. Like, what should I do? Uh, they're typically very welcoming, encouraging.

1:08:36Adam Schafer:And then you just go from there.

1:08:37Justin Andrews:Yeah. I also think too, like, I mean, it's finding another thing to stimulate, uh, to, to keep the training fresh. There's nothing wrong with that. I think too, like, so if this is more of a long-term goals, like a, uh, a macro goal, goal. Right. And then you have all these micro goals in between. So if strongman is something that you are really kind of into, there's a lot of unconventional movements within that. Okay. So now we have to break that up. It's like, okay, can I, can I learn, you know, some of these like really unique lifts and can I just start there? And, and, you know, how do I, how do I approach that and then get good at the skill of each one of those different types of lifts?

1:09:19Justin Andrews:And I think just like tackling that piece by piece and then really seeing you know the result of that and the overall strength that that's going to provide and then bleed into the rest of your training i think would be rad and then at that point you're like wow i've accomplished all these new you know sub skills that now i can apply and like maybe i can you know be in this community and i can compete and i can you know you know move forward with this and so for me it would be like tackling a program of is like old time strength and really kind of breaking it down, you know, on a micro level of like, you know, can I, can I really sustain and hold this heavy weight overhead, you know, with one arm and can I control that?

1:09:59Justin Andrews:And, and can I own that? And, and then kind of move and progress from that. Cause it's totally different than, than, you know, going to the gym, just showing up, building muscle. Like this is really movement focused. This is really, you know, technical. And I think like each one of those is super technical. So if you geek out on that and that

1:10:16Sal Di Stefano:interest you uh there's a lot of room for that i love i love that advice that just and probably will serve you uh for much longer right i mean you could spend the next five years uh working at strongman specific lifts getting good at a circus press right getting good getting good at specific movements uh and and that's kind of how i would go after like our strongman or i mean our um our old time strength program is I would look at it as like, here's all these movements. Several of them will be very unfamiliar. I'm going to pick one of them. I'm really going to hyper focus on to get really good at now.

1:10:53Sal Di Stefano:Obviously you're practicing kind of all of them, but it's like the goal is I'm really going to try and get strong and perfect this movement on this one and just keep cycling through it and probably interrupt those every two to three times you're running that program with either symmetry or our performance programs to address mobility and joint health and uh and then after you've done it a few times and feel very proficient at it then you could also go join a club or sign up for a strongman competition and do that so okay that'll probably set that goal out nice and long so you have something to work on for a while and probably a safer smarter approach towards a goal like that too i love i love justin's advice yeah

1:11:31Adam Schafer:thank you that's awesome yeah you got it we'll send old timey over to you mark

1:11:35Sal Di Stefano:oh well thank you guys so much that'd be great yeah yeah you got it man give it a shot let us know how you like it. Yeah, yeah. Keep us posted. Love to hear how the journey goes. It's fun, man. Yeah, you can have a good time with it. I will. Well, thank you guys so much. I appreciate your time. All right, brother.

1:11:46Adam Schafer:Right on. You guys remember when we had Mark Manson on the show a while ago? Yeah. And his life goal was to be a best-selling author. Yeah, yeah. Writes the subtle art of not giving an F. It crushes. Crushes. And he was depressed for, I think, a year. Right afterwards. Afterwards. And I've seen that with people with fitness goals. Yeah, you peak and constantly needing to chase the next goal. Uh, and then it stops serving you and starts becoming an issue. Um, uh, and then the people that I know when I would manage gyms, people that were so consistent that were in their sixties and seventies, even, uh, they're, they didn't really have a specific goal.

1:12:27Adam Schafer:It was just, they loved it. They loved it. They love coming in. They love the way they felt. They love the workout. They look forward to each one. And they, it was never an issue of, you know, I got to get this next, like lose this body fat, build this muscle. It was just, they just enjoyed the process. And when you enjoy the process, forget it. Everything else takes care of itself. Yeah. Our next callers are Leah and Audrey from Wisconsin. Oh, hey, how are you guys doing? Nice to meet you guys. How can we help you? Yeah, you got it.

1:12:56Justin Andrews:So we want to ask a little bit of a mother daughter programming question for you guys. So I'm 36. I've been in law enforcement for 15 years. I've trained consistently for about 11, but took a little bit of a break in 2021 after I had sort of a traumatic injury issue happen and then kind of restarted again last year with Audrey. She's big into wrestling, and I wanted to introduce the weight training aspect of it along with her wrestling training. So I just kind of want to get your advice on what we can be doing together to help her the most with her wrestling. She's going to be a sophomore this year.

1:13:37Justin Andrews:Last year, she competed in the 107 category.

1:13:41Adam Schafer:Awesome. Awesome. That's awesome. Yeah. All right. So there's going to be a bit of a difference between – so are you looking for a workout for both of you or something for your daughter? that you could help with?

1:13:51Justin Andrews:Yeah, no, I think something for both of us, we've been running with maps anabolic for like the last three months we've been doing, like we did the intro portion really nice and slow and steady to teach her the foundational, like the big three movements. We really want to focus on making sure her body's doing the right mechanics when we're going into squatting and dead lifting in particular, just so we're not developing any bad habits. Um, so we've been, we're still phase one of that. Um, but yeah, just kind of looking for something that both of us can do together. Um, I think since I've got a relatively decent history of working out that I can keep up with her to some extent, she can definitely kick my butt in the cardio aspect of things, but yeah.

1:14:31Adam Schafer:That's awesome. Okay. So it's going to be very different in season versus off season for your daughter. So when she's in season, it's gonna be very little strength training. So I'm very familiar with wrestling training and it's brutal volume. There's a lot. So in season, uh, her strength training is going to be minimal, like very minimal, like, like maybe three exercises once a week. Like that's it. Okay. Off season, a traditional strength training program is totally fine. Um, and, and what does, let me ask you this. What does off season look like, uh, for her? Is she doing anything at all for conditioning or what does that look like?

1:15:08Yeah.

1:15:09Justin Andrews:So right now we have her meeting with a wrestling specific coach once a week. And then her and I are either in the gym resistance training once or twice a week, depending on what our schedule looks like.

1:15:19Adam Schafer:That's perfect. Okay. Off season, it's going to be very basic strength training for her. So the most bang for her buck is going to be in getting good at the super basic compound lifts. No, it's not specific, like wrestling specific strength training. That doesn't come into play until, you know, three or four years from now. Right now, what we're looking at is building foundational strength. So things like squats, deadlifts, overhead presses, rows, pull-ups, you know, that kind of stuff. Really good wrestling exercises. Are you familiar with the Zurcher, like deadlift, Zurcher squat? Okay. Really, really good for wrestling because it's, you know, like a Zurcher deadlift, for example, the weight is in the crooks of your elbows and it's like you're holding somebody.

1:16:08Adam Schafer:So it simulates what it would be like to clinch with somebody to do a throw or a takedown. Split stance lower body exercises are also excellent for wrestlers because it's strengthening her leg. Now, squats are great too, but you also want split stance exercises because when she's doing like a takedown, a single leg, a double leg, she's shooting. And it's usually one knee that's forward when she's driving through to do the takedown. and so what you would essentially do in the off season is you would pick two it'd be two full body workouts it'd be one leg one push one pull maybe a core exercise and then you're done one of those workouts should have a split stance one of them should have uh like a bilateral um and that's off season in season she's doing like two or three exercises once a week and that's it so right now

1:16:56Justin Andrews:I'm doing power lift 15 with my son and we're doing it three times a week. And to his point about just doing, you know, focusing on the compound lifts from what you're talking about, I think like, what do you guys think about like a 15 strong, but like split up. So you'd probably do it like three times a week, not like the full, you know, five day cadence. It just because the volume of it, I think is more appropriate. The focus of it's more specific to those like compound lifts and then you can get introduction to you know are you take are you taking uh because it's

1:17:30Sal Di Stefano:got that's got that's six workouts so are you are you pairing two of the workouts so is it four exercises in her workout or are you only doing two workouts two lifts i'm only doing two lifts okay so i just want to make sure that's clear so she knows that when we send it to her so it's like we'll send 15 strong to you in there will be six workouts basically what justin's saying is taking

1:17:48Adam Schafer:you're doing three of them one week do the next three the next week and so on mainly uh because

1:17:53Justin Andrews:of the skill of wrestling, I want her to stay specific to that. You know, when conditioning wise or movement wise, the weight training itself, if you just like stick with those two exercise, but you ramp that intensity up like progressively, I think that'll serve her a lot better.

1:18:11Adam Schafer:Yeah. The name of the game with a young athlete, especially in a sport like wrestling is injury prevention and building good stability and strength. And she's especially in season, she's going to be towing the line constantly between overtraining and, you know, what she could tolerate type of deal. And so we want to build resilience in her body in the off season. And in in season, we're trying to manage stress quite a bit. So I'm sure you already know this. And this is very, I have teenage kids myself, like most important thing is going to be sleep and nutrition for both those things. Those make the biggest difference, but 15 strong is a great program for her to follow.

1:18:53Adam Schafer:Now, Lee, for you, you're not doing the wrestling in season. So your volume can be higher than hers. You could probably do double that. Yeah, so you'd be doing twice as much, essentially, than your daughter with the strength training. But you'd be there, of course, watching her technique and form and doing all that. Do you have Mavs 15 strong by any chance?

1:19:11Justin Andrews:No, we don't.

1:19:12Adam Schafer:Okay, that'll be the program we'll send you. Yeah, I'll send you that. Yeah, and we'll do that.

1:19:17Justin Andrews:That'll be awesome. And then, is there anything specific that I need to be looking for with her just cues that she's overtraining, because that's really what I'm worried about come wrestling season. Right now, she's right around 116, 115 for body weight, but when she gets stressed out, she tends to not eat enough.

1:19:34Sal Di Stefano:Decrease in strength, stiffness and tightness, achiness. Durability. Yeah, those things are the big thing.

1:19:41Adam Schafer:So is it okay if I go a little deeper into that while you're on her street? Okay, so the big thing to consider with a weight class sport like wrestling, and this is just as true for the guys, okay? The body dysmorphia is very high in weight controlled sports. So constantly cutting and trying to make weight. What you see with young girls is, and you see this common with girl sports anyway, but especially with a weight class sport is they lose their period. That's a big sign right there. You lose your period. We're not eating enough and we're overtraining. And it tends to be accepted as like, oh, that's just what happens.

1:20:20Adam Schafer:But that right there is a big sign. And then also with weight class, and I know coaches hate it when I say this. Yeah, they hate it. They really don't like it. But when I would train young wrestlers, I mean, if they're within five pounds, that's fine. After that, I'm like, you're wrestling in a higher weight class. Because the constant like. Try to stay at that weight as much as possible. Some of the hardest clients I've ever trained were clients who had been in a sport for high school and especially college where they were always fighting to be in a weight class. And then they get out of those sports.

1:20:52Adam Schafer:They're trying to live a regular life. And their relationship with food and training is so difficult to unwind. It's very, very difficult to unwind.

1:21:00Sal Di Stefano:And another way to say this is that she will do better with five to 10 pounds more muscle on her in a higher weight class than she will do cutting eight pounds down to the lower weight class that they might originally say she's in. And this will also impede on our ability to build muscle and build strength if we're constantly always trying to cut down to a weight. And so these coaches sometimes, they want to put a kid like, oh, I need somebody at this weight. So she's close to that. So we're just going to put her there. It's like, I mean, if this was my daughter or son, it would be like, no, we're going to build muscle and get strong and do all the things that you're trying to do right now.

1:21:37Sal Di Stefano:And kind of where her weight lands, that's what class she's going to be in. That's kind of the attitude I would have is in the offseason, you guys build, get strong, do all the things you were talking about and what you're already kind of doing. And then when season comes in, wherever she's close to, that's the weight class we're going to. I'm not allowing some coach to tell me like, oh, I want her in this weight class right now. And then all offseason, she's trying to keep her weight close to that and not build when that's what she should be doing right now is building strength and feeding, fueling her body to build strength.

1:22:11Sal Di Stefano:Then we'll dictate where she's going to be.

1:22:14Adam Schafer:And Lee, like coaches are very convincing. And so what they'll, and that's their job. Like you're a coach. Your job's the win. So I get it. But what they're going to say is she's got a lot of talent. If she's this weight class, she could totally dominate. She's got a lot of potential here. And so as a parent, you're like, oh, I don't want to take away from my kids potential success. And so it starts to become compromise. And I'm telling you later on, this can turn into some kind of big issues. And so the weight class part, I'd be very careful with. And so the goal would be make sure my daughter eats, make sure she eats enough protein, make sure she sleeps.

1:22:48Adam Schafer:Does she feel good? Is she getting stronger? Your mom, you know better than anybody. So you'll be able to know, oh, you know, she's a little irritable. I think she's overdoing it or whatever. Um, and, um, and, and this, and strength is a great, uh, metric. Yeah. Like if she's getting stronger, she's probably doing a lot of things, right. Uh, if her strength's not going up or it's going backwards, uh, sometimes, oftentimes that means we're doing a few things wrong. And sometimes, oftentimes it means just doing too much. Okay.

1:23:16Justin Andrews:That sounds great. Yeah. And, um, as far as deadlifting is concerned, we i started her off on a straight bar and then we moved over to trap because i noticed that she was struggling a little bit with just the positioning of the bar and feeling with her body good call and now we're back to a straight bar is there a preference versus one or over the

1:23:36Sal Di Stefano:other i love what you did uh typically with athletes were trap bars kind of where we stay i think the the skill of learning how to do a good deadlift is is a great skill for her to have yep so if if and i think what you did is perfect if you notice form techniques off let's go to a trap bar let's get good at it if she's having good technique in a conventional deadlift i love that yeah if you but you see it off then i absolutely you're not but by the way there's a few ways out

1:24:01Adam Schafer:by going trap and there's a few ways to measure strength increases so i'm glad we're going here one is the obvious there's weight on the bar that you're adding the other one is her techniques better technique sharper and i you know when i'm training a kid like technique is everything like I just want to perfect your skill, perfect your skill. That's going to translate better to the sport anyway than just adding weight to the bar. So if she's, you know, if you got weight on the bar, she's doing a straight bar, you notice her technique's a little off, lighten the load, let's get perfect technique.

1:24:30Adam Schafer:That's the most, that's going to be the most important thing. You also want to consider, you know, body coordination isn't where it's going to be eventually. Her body's still changing. so that's going to change uh how she moves or how how acclimated she is uh to you know doing certain exercises so technique is going to be uh paramount um and that'll serve her much better than being like i think we can add five pounds to the bar technique's a little off but okay you're not hurt we'll just keep going like yeah don't go in that direction right definitely wanting to avoid any injuries long term yes yes but uh 15 strong's got a lot of exercises that i think will translate to her sport.

1:25:11Adam Schafer:But honestly, here's the thing. You don't need to overthink a lot with a young athlete. It's like if they get better at certain basic exercises, the carryover is massive. It gets much more specific when she's 18, 19, 20. Now the strength training gets very specific, but at 15, 16, it's just like, let's just get you overall better.

1:25:33Sal Di Stefano:In the next year, if you guys just get proficient at the major lifts, meaning your form looks flawless, and you add a couple pounds to the bar on top of that, that's a huge win. Yep, yep. Like, that's a good goal. It's like, let's get the most beautiful deadlift, the most beautiful squat, and if we can add five or 10 pounds to the bar along the way too, that's a win. This is complimenting her skill.

1:25:57Justin Andrews:So, yeah, you just doing that and building overall strength and just add, it's going to translate so well. But really, the skill is the highest important right now.

1:26:06Adam Schafer:Yeah, I'm glad you said that, Justin. So she wants to be good at wrestling. Wrestling more is going to do that better than anything. Strength training is literally supplemental. It's very supplemental. So don't make that the focus. It's not the focus. The focus is not lifting weights. The focus is wrestling. And then how do we support that in the most effective and also gentle way we possibly can? So if you feel it's starting to kind of impede on your performance with wrestling, this is where we kind of toggle back a bit. If she's like, hey, I came back from wrestling practice and I was sore from our workout and it was hard to do wrestling practice.

1:26:41Adam Schafer:Okay, we got to back off on the strength training.

1:26:43Justin Andrews:Yeah, that's good to know. And we've been trying to be very listening to our bodies and be intuitive with what's going on. If she's having a really hard time at practice, we back off on the weight training. Or if training's a little bit hard, then we take a break from that too. I don't overdo it with her at all.

1:26:59Sal Di Stefano:And then I can't stress the fueling the body. Fuel that body. Give it what it needs. protein is so important.

1:27:06Adam Schafer:The challenge with teenagers is...

1:27:08Sal Di Stefano:That is. That's why I'm saying that. Every young athlete I've ever trained, getting them to hit protein consistently is one of the hardest things, and it is one of the biggest game changers.

1:27:20Adam Schafer:Here's the two challenges with teenagers, always. Teenage athletes. Go to bed on time. That's a very difficult one. And sleeping in doesn't make up for it. It's better than nothing, but doesn't make up for it. So that's number one. And by the way, teenage girls need about nine to 10 hours of sleep, especially if you're training hard, not eight. It's like nine to 10. So go to bed on time, eating breakfast. That's the other challenge. Eating a protein heavy breakfast is very, very challenging. But if you do that, it sets you up. Yep.

1:27:47Justin Andrews:So I just want to get it on the record that Parmesan bagel with cream cheese is not a protein breakfast.

1:27:54Adam Schafer:No, it is not. No, she would probably, you want 30 grams of protein in her breakfast. Yeah. So some kind of meat, chicken. It doesn't have to be a breakfast food.

1:28:02Sal Di Stefano:Or something that's easy, like those Greek yogurts that have 20, 30 grams of protein in it. That's a real easy. That's normally where I got to start a lot of my young athletes because maybe they don't have a big appetite or they want something on the go and fast. And so I love those. What are they? Oikos. I always say the name wrong. Oikos or however the hell you say it. They come in those little things. They're 20 grams of protein in one. And they're little. And so they can like shovel those down real quick before they head off to school or do the thing. With some granola and some berries. Yeah, and that's a great way, or double it up if you have enough of an appetite.

1:28:31Sal Di Stefano:Now you've got 40 grams of protein. Starting your day like that is huge to being successful. And know that the way protein works is that you could have a really good day on Monday, and if a huge day, you go over on Monday, Tuesday you're low, that extra doesn't carry over like carbohydrates and fat. That means you miss. That's a not successful day. And you don't want to have too many of those not successful days of hitting your protein because it'll impede your pursuit of getting strength, getting stronger and building muscle.

1:28:59Adam Schafer:There's two directions here. I'll highlight for you, mom. So one is restrict, which is going to be very, that's like the natural, easy direction with a weight class sport. The other one, which you can start building now is I got to get my protein. And one of those will serve her for the rest of her life. The other one will be a challenge for the rest of her life. So hitting protein, if that's the target, number one, that's going to serve, it's going to make you recover faster, stronger. You're going to get stronger than the other girls. You're going to feel faster. You're going to feel like you've got more gas in the tank.

1:29:31Adam Schafer:The other one, you might make your weight class, but it's not going to feel as good. And so it starts in the morning.

1:29:35Sal Di Stefano:The way I motivated my young athletes to do this, this is our competitive edge because this is one of every young athlete's challenge. I guarantee it. So athletes focus so much on their sports or that. And it's like, listen, if I can get you strength training and I can get you hitting your protein every single day, that is going to give us a massive competitive edge against everybody else because I know that 90 % of them won't do those two things consistently. Oh God, 100%. I guarantee 100 % of them are not eating enough protein. So those two things are a huge lever that we can pull that I'm here to help you support you through that.

1:30:08Sal Di Stefano:And so drill that home. You hit that protein and take consistently. You compliment the strength training, get good at the technique like we're talking about. And that will give you one of the greatest competitive edge against your peers.

1:30:20Justin Andrews:I love that. love that and we very much went into the whole wrestling journey with the mindset of once we start restricting calories and really focusing on what weight class we're supposed to be in that's when it's time to pull the plug on wrestling because i was a 15 year old girl once upon a time and we all think we're fatter than we are and i'm like we don't need to add any of that to the equation just be strong be healthy be happy that's all i need yeah you're doing it right mom yeah good job all right good job awesome well thank you guys i don't know audrey do you have

1:30:49Sal Di Stefano:anything you want to ask about no i would i would love updates so as you get into the season please please keep us informed we love hearing from our young athletes that we uh we help out so i would

1:31:00Justin Andrews:love to hear for sure thank you guys so much for everything we do we appreciate it all right guys

1:31:06Adam Schafer:thanks weight class sport so yeah man i've trained a lot of men we just helped somebody not that long

1:31:12Sal Di Stefano:ago i've trained a lot of guys over the last caller not like the last caller but one of the last batches the guy who struggled and we had a 90-day follow-up remember and he blew his mind because he was one of those ex-athletes that was forever i think was it wrestling i don't remember what sport it was or running or it was some sport that kept him dieting his whole like life and he

1:31:31Adam Schafer:was so afraid to bump his calories yeah yeah and then he we bumped his calories and he was just

1:31:36Sal Di Stefano:leaner stronger felt better everything you know so no it's it's for sure i tell you what though i I mean, she, you know, I don't know how long, did she say how long she'd been listening to the show? Because she definitely, great approach. MAPS anabolic. They sound like they stayed in the pre-phase for a very long time. Like she worked on technique. She backed her off deadlifts. She put her trap bar. She saw the technique was off, went back, you know, like.

1:31:58Adam Schafer:I mean, I'll add this because you kind of made this point. Now this changes as you get to higher levels, you know, get up to college. But in this, at this stage, if you want to have a huge advantage over your peers, you just eat right and go to bed. Eat right. Right, because nobody else is doing that. Everybody else is staying up late.

1:32:14Sal Di Stefano:You eat right, go to bed. You're like way advanced. And somewhat get good at these movements. Yeah, I know. Yeah, you're so much further ahead to your peers. Our next caller is Liz from Utah. Hi, Liz. How you doing, Liz? Hi. Great to be on.

1:32:28Justin Andrews:Thanks for having me. I appreciate it. You got it. How can I help you? Well, I just have a question. I love helping older populations, senior citizens get stronger. I help them with their metabolic health. healthy habits, all of that. Often they are not comfortable with going to the gym or say they don't have time or they have a lot of injuries. So I typically start them just with like walking and band workouts from home. But I also teach aqua fitness at our rec center. And we use dumbbells and, you know, noodles, different, different forms of exercise there. And I'm wondering if there is a program that I could help with building strength for older people that maybe have injuries or can't get into the weight room.

1:33:15Adam Schafer:Yeah, good question. So give me a little more detail. When you say older, what is the age range we're looking at?

1:33:20Justin Andrews:Oh, typically mid-50s to, I mean, I have a couple ladies in my Aquafit class in their 80s, so.

1:33:27Adam Schafer:Awesome. Okay, big difference. There's a big difference there. And these are deconditioned kind of beginners?

1:33:34Justin Andrews:Yes.

1:33:34Adam Schafer:Okay. So So it's going to be very, very basic. We have a program that you can pull from, but even some of the exercises in the program I send you might be inappropriate for like, let's say some of the 80 year olds or people who just aren't unable to perform certain movements. Map Starter would be the program that I would send you that you can pull from. And then really, you really want to scale things back to meet the person where they're at. So I'll give you an example, okay? So very basic exercise. I'll give you two examples. one basic exercise is a squat, right? A standing body weight squat.

1:34:09Adam Schafer:Oftentimes when I had somebody in advanced age come in to hire me, they could not do a basic body weight squat. And so what I would do is I would take a bench and I'd put some support pads on it. So I'd elevate the bench essentially and I'd have them sit down slowly and stand up. And so that was the regression for a squat. And then as they got better with that, I would remove a pad so the squat was a bit lower and I'd wait until they could get like 10 good ones. And then I'd lower it again until they could sit all the way down on a bench and stand up with control. Another example is like a very basic exercise, like an overhead press.

1:34:45Adam Schafer:Oftentimes my advanced age clients couldn't even fully extend their arm. So without weight, they just couldn't get a full extension. Their arm would stay bent or they'd have to lean back or do something like that. And so what I would do is I would have them hold onto my fingers. I'd have them push up as high as they could. Then I'd pull their arms up to the full extension. I'd put them in good position. And then I'd say, try and hold your arms here. I'd take my fingers away and have them do an isometric at the top. And so this is where your mindset needs to be with modifying movements for people so that they can progress in an appropriate way.

1:35:19Sal Di Stefano:I would say teaching a class setting to advance age has to be the most difficult thing to do. It's, I think class settings are already tough to try and appeal to 10 or 20 people that are all uniquely different and have different capabilities. But if I'm dealing with at least 20-year-olds to 40-year-olds that can do a lot of basic movements, you can probably put together. But to Sal's point right now, you could have some great exercises I put together, but then they're totally inappropriate to an 80-year-old to possibly do. I would say that most of the people

1:35:58Justin Andrews:are probably like 50 to mid 60s. There are, there's just a couple older ones. But the nice thing about working out in the water is I have ladies that come with a walker, you know, can hardly walk, but once they get in the water, they do fine. And that's one thing I love about aqua is they can go at their own pace and they can adjust things. And so I teach pretty intermediate and we do lots of weights and reps, but I just wondered Like as far as an aqua class, I teach how to activate muscle protein synthesis through nutrition three times a day. So I'm actually seeing muscle mass or skeletal muscle go up every week just through nutrition.

1:36:35Justin Andrews:But I want to accelerate that with exercise. So as far as like working out in the water, would you say that that's doable to increase muscle strength?

1:36:44Adam Schafer:Absolutely. So isometrics are great in the water with older populations. And so what they would do, like an example would be you're standing, maybe supporting yourself at the side of the pool. You lift one leg up straight as high as you can and then hold it. And so there's a lot of these isometrics you can do in the pool because the pool provides buoyancy. They can get themselves in a position and then hold for an isometric. And isometrics are great for building strength and muscle, especially in people who need to regress to that particular level. So think of that, like what positions can I get this person in that they can hold in the pool because the pool allows them to do it for like 15 to 30 seconds.

1:37:23Justin Andrews:Okay. And as far as progressing, you know, when I follow your programs, we typically progress in weight to get stronger. But in the pool, when we don't have a lot of options of increasing weight, would you just say more reps? Would that be the best route to go?

1:37:41Adam Schafer:More reps, more time, increased tension. More velocity. Yeah. And then here's the other thing. Do you offer one-on-one to any of them if they want it?

1:37:49Justin Andrews:I haven't. Most of my clients that I coach are over phone and Zoom, so I'm not in the gym with them personally unless I'm teaching a class.

1:37:56Adam Schafer:Okay. Because that would be another thing, would be to offer one-on-one with the people that need it. Yeah. Yeah.

1:38:02Justin Andrews:Okay. And what about for someone like myself? I mean, I've been very consistent in the gym for about four years, really increased muscle strength. But it seems like over the past year, like I'm just kind of really in the thick of perimenopause. All my joints hurt. It seems like I'm nursing a lot of injuries, shoulder, hip, knee. And so I don't feel like I am progressing so well in the gym. Would something working more on the water with it being better on joints? do you think I would see results in the water? Because right now I teach on the side of the pool, but if I myself got in and really worked on weights and exercises in the water, do you feel like someone that's maybe not a beginner would see results?

1:38:47Adam Schafer:I don't think that would be your workout. No.

1:38:49Sal Di Stefano:Although that wouldn't hurt you to do that in addition to what you're doing.

1:38:53Adam Schafer:I think getting in the water, the benefit of that would be, it would make you a better coach because you're in the water and you are feeling the water. And so it allows you to adjust technique a little bit better. but I don't know what the recommendation would be for you without knowing what your workout looks like right now and what your nutrition looks like right now. And we can go into that if you want.

1:39:13Justin Andrews:Oh, if you have time, I, I typically, I love to follow like your anabolic and aesthetic. I've been kind of playing around with the kettlebell workout. And I feel like my biggest problem is I probably don't warm up or I have an hour in the morning, hour and a half to get in and get, and some of those are longer. And so I, I probably don't prep enough. And so I probably trying to lift too heavy without warming up. Yeah.

1:39:45Adam Schafer:So typically when I'm, so if I'm looking at an avatar that you kind of fit, right? So you're, you're working fitness. You've probably been doing it a while. Um, and now you're starting to notice a lot of aches and pains and also based off of the program, one of the programs that you mentioned, which is MAPS Aesthetic, I can pretty much, I think I can confidently guess that you're overdoing it. You're probably doing too much volume in your training. I don't think it's an issue of warmup. I think you're probably doing too much. And so the cumulative stress is now turning into lots of aches and pains.

1:40:15Adam Schafer:So like MAPS Aesthetic for sure is too much volume for probably 99 % of people who listen to our show or just people who work out in general.

1:40:29Adam Schafer:MAPS So scale the, if you're feeling pain, scale the volume down.

1:40:33Sal Di Stefano:MAPS 15 performance is what I put her on.

1:40:35Adam Schafer:Yeah.

1:40:35Sal Di Stefano:MAPS 15 performance would be a great, it would reduce volume, address, you know, unilateral multi-planter type movements, which would benefit joint health. And I think that would be a great, a great program for you to follow and see how you feel from that. We'll send that to you if you don't have it.

1:40:52Justin Andrews:Oh, that's awesome. I haven't tried any of the 15. I, I always feel like that would be too short.

1:40:57Sal Di Stefano:That's every, all of our fitness people think that. And then we get them on it and they go. I like that too.

1:41:04Justin Andrews:Cause we need to really focus on movement in different planes of motion to the programs you had mentioned are very, you know, a sagittal plane focused only. So to get that variation is going to help a lot to compliment that strength

1:41:21Sal Di Stefano:stability there in the joints. Yeah. I love 15 performance for you. Be perfect.

1:41:24Justin Andrews:Okay.

1:41:25Sal Di Stefano:All right.

1:41:25Justin Andrews:I was thinking maybe I needed to spend more time like priming or, you know, like those kind of things. But you think just cutting it down. That won't hurt.

1:41:33Sal Di Stefano:So it's great. It's not a bad idea. If we're setting you up with 15 performance and you're used to running an anabolic or aesthetic, it's going to give you way more time because you don't need – now you have all this extra time. So if you do anything more, apply that to mobility and priming. Yeah. So spend time doing some 90-90s and do some thread the needles and wall circle. like do do some of these movements to benefit your hips and your shoulders in in in conjunction with the two exercises from 15 performance so that would be wonderful so if in a perfect world you follow the weight training from 15 performance and then absolutely with your more with your free time that you have uh because the program's a lot shorter use that and apply that to hip and shoulder mobility thoracic mobility and do that every day uh with it would be awesome okay perfect

1:42:23Justin Andrews:I spent a lot of time kind of physical therapy exercises on my shoulder, on my hip. I have a torn labrum. So that's kind of like prime probably like just lighter, lighter reps. But I like that idea of doing that. Yeah. We'll send that.

1:42:39Adam Schafer:We'll send you a starter and a 15 performance. You get two programs.

1:42:42Justin Andrews:Oh, I would love that. Thank you so much. And then as far as the older, you know, older population, if that were you saying try to get them out of the water and doing, doing things or.

1:42:52Sal Di Stefano:I think what Sal said that is great advice. Like you can progress isometrics, right? So if you can coach, it's hard virtually, but if you can communicate well enough to them how to intensify the isometric, that's like progressing an isometric. So first it's like learning how to just hold your leg up and that alone will be challenging and they'll probably be shaking a little bit. And then it's like, okay, now you're there. Now intensify it, you know, activate your glutes, activate, you know, so learning how to, you know, squeeze, extend your leg, flex your quad, flex it as hard as you can. Like, so coaching like that and getting them to intensify it will actually progress it.

1:43:27Sal Di Stefano:And then if they want more and then it would be trying to get them to come out of the pool and let me do some of these exercises for a map starter. That's why we're sending that to you is that you can pull from some of those movements and then ideally coach one-on-one with some of them if you can.

1:43:42Justin Andrews:The pool is a little difficult. It's mainly cardiovascular. So do you have any of those actual dumbbells that like push? Yeah, we have a variety of different sized dumbbells. We have noodles. We have kickboards. We have buoy belts for deep water. So we actually get a pretty good workout with all of the dumbbells. I try to do a typical routine that I would do like in the gym with weights, but move it to the water. And then I like to teach them a lot while I'm teaching things that they could do at home, like calf raises while they're brushing their teeth or squats or, you know, like just more movement.

1:44:17Justin Andrews:and the nutrition to go with it.

1:44:19Adam Schafer:So if your goal is to help them improve their longevity and vitality, which is what it sounds like, the two most important things that trump everything else, number one is consistency, and number two is community. So if you look at the data on older populations, what improves their longevity and vitality in regards to fitness, it's consistency.

1:44:41Justin Andrews:Keeping pain free with their joints.

1:44:43Adam Schafer:That trumps the most perfect workout. It's just that they do it. And then community is massive for longevity and health. So as a coach, as a teacher, number one for you is to make them want to show up. I know that sounds crazy, but it's like, how do I, like, I got, I want to make this. They love coming. They want to come. They want to do this kind of thing. They want to see each other afterwards. You can even organize things outside of the, uh, of the class itself. Those things will do more for the longevity than going from a okay workout to a perfect workout. I agree.

1:45:14Justin Andrews:Yeah, we have a great community. We'll get 50 people in a class and they love coming. So I think that the community is there and they're loving, like I'm just really trying to teach them healthy habits and learn why they're getting stronger, not just for strength, but for blood sugar balance and all of those things that go with it.

1:45:34Sal Di Stefano:Is this your main business, Liz, or do you do something on the side also? Is this your main business?

1:45:39Justin Andrews:Not water fitness. That's just something I started on the side just because I wanted to be able to help older people. And I don't see them in the gym. I see them in the water. So I do that more for fun. I'm a metabolic health coach for the past 15 years, and I just help people balance blood sugar. I teach muscle protein synthesis activation to build strength and healthy habits, exercise, sleep, water, hydration. Awesome. Just kind of an overall healthy lifestyle.

1:46:10Sal Di Stefano:I was just asking because I think the ideal thing is to kind of do all the things we're talking about in the water. And then when people are wanting more, then I would, I mean, if you're open to like coach, take them individually. Say, hey, listen, Susie, you're doing so great in the water. If you want more, you want to do more, I would do these one-on-one sessions with you. And so I would just have an offer for that progression because you can do a lot in there. And like Sal saying the big things for longevity are making sure they show up. They love it. but you might have the occasional person that is maybe in their fifties and they're like, they want more and they're loving the progress.

1:46:43Sal Di Stefano:And it's like, I would have an offer if I was you that was like, Hey, for those of you that want to keep going and progressing or doing great, I have this one-on-one thing that I do.

1:46:51Justin Andrews:Yeah. Well, I have to fit it in with the five kids and the 93 old grandma is like all the things. So I don't do a lot of one-on-one in the gym. Okay. um, a great idea. Um, But I do recommend your programs to a lot of people that are just getting started just because I love your programs. And I usually recommend the bands program if they're just starting, wanting to do something from home. Right on. But you mentioned your map starter. Would that be better than the bands for someone that doesn't have a lot of equipment and doesn't want to start at a gym? They're both minimal.

1:47:25Sal Di Stefano:They're both good. They're both minimal equipment. The starter includes a stability ball and some dumbbells. That's it. So it has a little bit more to it than probably just bands. bands is probably the easier, like just getting someone started. They don't have much, just get some bands.

1:47:40Justin Andrews:Suspension trainer would be another good option. Yep. Okay. Like a TRX?

1:47:45Sal Di Stefano:Yep. Yep. Okay. Perfect.

1:47:48Justin Andrews:All right. I love that. Yeah. I just, cause I'm trying to build consistency without them going to buy a bunch of equipment first. I'm just trying to build like that consistency first. So perfect. You guys are awesome. I appreciate your help. Thank you.

1:48:00Adam Schafer:Right on.

1:48:01Justin Andrews:Okay.

1:48:03Adam Schafer:that's my favorite uh my favorite group to work with it's so fun yeah it's so fun working with people like that yeah pool stuff you know it's funny as a young trainer this is just this just shows immaturity right as a young trainer how stupid you thought oh i just pull workouts oh what a waste looks ridiculous like what like how couldn't have been more ignorant well i mean it's

1:48:21Sal Di Stefano:what you i mean it's funny it's very helpful we talk about the things that drive us crazy some of were things we're all guilty of at one point uh you know as a 20 early 20 trainer everything you viewed was through the lens of building muscle or burning body fat and the perfect workout yeah well just i mean the ultimate everything is building muscle and burning body fat and that's when you in the context of that or through that lens that those do suck but through the lens of longevity and health and community and well she said it you get someone in a walker who can't

1:48:53Adam Schafer:stand up straight they can stand up straight in the pool yeah and that is a wonderful way to strengthen that position yeah i mean our next caller is justin from florida what's up man how

1:49:02Justin Andrews:you doing justin hey guys how you doing good man how can we help you yeah not a whole lot man first of all i just want to say uh thank you to you guys i started uh listening to you guys back in 2022 and through the years i mean on and off my fitness has kind of been a up and down roller coaster going through the Marine Corps and such to where they pretty much just slay your body in one direction and it's not a healthy direction. And then getting out, I mean, I've always struggled with my weight and whatnot, but from 2022, I started listening to you guys and I got connected with the MAPS anabolic program.

1:49:45Justin Andrews:And when I started that program, I was probably weighing around 245 ish. And within three months, I scaled down to 199. So the program was very effective. I loved it. I loved what you guys preach on a daily basis about fitness. And not only that, about, you know, just self-care, mental health wise, you guys have helped me out a lot when it comes to my mental health as far as even you know i listen to you guys about your father figures you know how you guys live your life with your families and such um i live my whole life without even knowing my dad you know so i uh i commend you guys and i thank you guys for everything that you do for the community um thanks man thank you so with that um after anabolic i did a little bit of.

1:50:41Justin Andrews:I did power lift and then my work life changed. I changed careers. I went into the post office. I'm a letter carrier with them. And then I started getting on the program Maps Transform. And when I was doing that program, I was in the second phase and I was doing preacher curls. And when I just went down, I think I hyper extended it too far down and my right distal bicep tendon ruptured off the radius forearm bone and they had to do a complete reconstruction surgery on that. So with that, I went out of work for a little over a year with that injury and it just mentally wise really, you know, set me back and even health wise, It really set me back, even to the point to where when I wrote my letter, I mean, I don't have it in front of me to read it.

1:51:45Justin Andrews:But, you know, I'm one of the heaviest points to where I've ever been in my life, being around like 260 or plus, you know. And I've been in all the way down to, you know, when I was. It's funny listening to you guys and everything that I was doing wrong. you guys called out and I started trying to slowly change over that time you know as far as even counting my calories I was so particular and everything that went into my body I was tracking and you know I just got really too much for me um mentality wise that I didn't want to do that anymore um to where that's when I really went into power lift and I just stopped tracking calories and I just started feeding protein into me.

1:52:33And then, so I don't really know why I got the injury.

1:52:38Justin Andrews:Maybe it's because of bad form or whatnot, or just my body, I'm not sure. But I'm just at a point to where I'm trying to really figure out what's the direction of my health and the best approach to it, take it, you know, to go, I guess.

1:52:54Adam Schafer:Yeah, dude. Yeah. Thanks for calling in, man. Thanks for the kind words. And thank you for your service. Thank you. Do you mind if I get more into your email? Because there's some stuff you sent in your email that you don't really mention. Do you mind if I bring some of it up? Oh, yeah. No, that's fine. Okay. So there's some underlying things that we need to place in context to help with how we approach fitness and nutrition. So since you got back from Afghanistan, PTSD, depression, anxiety have kind of played a little bit of a role in all of this. Okay. Um, exercise, uh, and nutrition are phenomenal, uh, for helping with things like anxiety and depression.

1:53:35Adam Schafer:Uh, and as those get better, PTSD tends to get a little better as well, but it can also make those things worse. A lot of people don't talk about how fitness and diet can make anxiety, depression, and PTSD worse, but there are ways they can make it worse. And one of the ways it can make it worse is by trying to control everything through diet exercise and lifestyle, like trying to control every calorie that comes in my mouth, looking at all my workouts. Like I need to make a progress every time I train, or if I'm not progressing in a specific way that I'm failing and that can actually make things a lot worse.

1:54:11Adam Schafer:And I don't know if that resonates with you, Justin, uh, with, you know, yeah,

1:54:16Justin Andrews:it's home alive.

1:54:17Adam Schafer:Okay. So what we need to do, number one, and this is going to help you with a lot with the other goal that you have, which you mentioned in email, which is like, Hey, I want to get in better shape and lose some weight. What I want to ask you is forget the goals, forget weight loss, forget getting stronger, forget all that stuff with exercise. What makes you feel the best? What makes you feel good when you're done?

1:54:42Justin Andrews:My energy.

1:54:43Adam Schafer:Okay.

1:54:44Justin Andrews:So you want to just go ahead,

1:54:46Adam Schafer:go ahead, go ahead. Sorry.

1:54:48Justin Andrews:No, I just, um, one thing, like I said, my energy, but you know, coming home and just my son seeing you know what i've done and everything he just his uh

1:54:59Adam Schafer:sense of pride that comes over him really yeah does it a lot for me i hear you dude i hear a little underlying something there too which i think all dads uh struggle with which is uh we want uh we want to make our kids proud yep uh but i think your kid's probably pretty proud of his dad regardless. So, and I can say that pretty confidently. So, all right. So the energy makes you feel good. So when we're doing exercise to improve the way we feel, there's two ways that exercise improves how we feel. One is in the short term. So when we're active appropriately in the short term, all those feel good chemicals go up and we feel good.

1:55:38Adam Schafer:Then in the long term, the way fitness makes you feel better, there's two ways. One, it makes you healthier and a healthier brain and body tend to be happier. And two is the sense of accomplishment and the consistency. You're doing something hard, you're staying consistent with it, and that just makes us feel really good. So what we want is we want something that allows you to tap into both of those every day. So what would be better probably for you would rather than doing three longer workouts or two longer workouts a week, would it be to do a short workout almost every day. so almost every day you do this workout that gives you that kind of like feel good in the moment but also long term is going to contribute to better health so the maps 15 style program would be ideal for someone like you now ideally i don't know what your schedule looks like but ideally you'd want to do it uh first thing in the morning because it does uh when you look at the data it does tend to set the stage for most of the day now if that's not possible it's not a big deal.

1:56:41Adam Schafer:But if your schedule can work around that maps 15 in the morning, uh, would be great. The second thing I would do now you're a male carrier, so you probably get tons of steps already.

1:56:51Justin Andrews:15 ,000. 15 ,000. Okay.

1:56:54Adam Schafer:So I heard you say 15 to 20 ,000 steps a day. Is that correct? Yeah.

1:56:58Sal Di Stefano:It's got, he's got it written up there too.

1:56:59Adam Schafer:Okay.

1:57:00Justin Andrews:Yeah.

1:57:01Adam Schafer:Maps 15 is your workout. Now let's talk about diet with diet. I just want one rule. That's it. We don't need more than one rule. eat whole foods try to eat whole foods try not to eat anything that's not whole foods that alone is going to help with the weight loss goal but it's definitely going to help with making you feel better and it's also not so controlling that we're you know creating this anxiety around everything that we're putting in our mouth and counting things it's just whole foods Matt's 15. Here's the other thing. When you cut out, the fellas and I talked for a second, so you lost connection, but we're going to set you up with our concierge coaching for free for two months.

1:57:38Adam Schafer:Thank you so much. That way you meet once a month with a coach, a mind pump coach, and then you report back to them and they'll help move you through the process.

1:57:47Justin Andrews:Give you some accountability.

1:57:48Adam Schafer:It'll give you 60 days of that. And they're going to walk you through this process, modify anything you need or whatever, and kind of coach you for the next 60 days. and I'd like to see if I can hop on one of those calls if possible so I can talk with you personally on one of those coaching calls.

1:58:03Justin Andrews:Sure. And I appreciate that so much, really, from the bottom of my heart. Thank you so much.

1:58:07Adam Schafer:You got it, dude. And then if I can add one more thing, it's just because I have a little bit of knowledge around PTSD because I have people close to me who've had some of that. And one of the most impactful things you could do is be a part of some type of a community. And so if you're not a part of a community that helps support that, makes a huge difference. The place that I would recommend is a church. And so there's something to look into to have those people kind of do life with you. Makes a big difference. In the data, it shows it makes a huge difference. So just something on the little extra there.

1:58:41Justin Andrews:Okay. Yes, sir.

1:58:42Sal Di Stefano:All right, dude. All right. We're going to hook you up with one of our coaches. Got you, Justin. We're going to work through this whole thing with you, dude. Got you.

1:58:49Adam Schafer:That's tough, dude. That is very tough. But what I said about exercise and diet with anxiety and depression is true. It can make it a lot better. It could also make it worse.

1:59:00Sal Di Stefano:Well, yeah, it's like somebody who has body dysmorphia or eating disorder and exercise and working out and eating healthy. Becomes a part of the problem. Yeah, it could be a good thing, but it can also be a really bad thing if it becomes this massive form of tyranny, like you talked about. And that's what it is, is he's tyrannizing himself through it, which will force him eventually to rebel and swing the other direction. But we'll help them. We'll get them on our concierge and have our coaches to walk them through this, get them going.

1:59:29Adam Schafer:Look, if you like the show, come find us on Instagram. It's Mind Pump Media.

1:59:32Justin Andrews:Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body, dramatically improve your health and energy, and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB Super Bundle at mindpumpmedia.com. The RGB Super Bundle includes MAPS Anabolic, MAPS Performance, and MAPS Aesthetic. Nine months of phased expert exercise programming designed by Sal, Adam, and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels, and performs. With detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos, the RGB Super Bundle is like having Sal, Adam, and Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price.

2:00:14Justin Andrews:The RGB Super Bundle has a full 30-day money-back guarantee, and you can get it now plus other valuable free resources at mindpumpmedia.com. If you enjoy this show, please share the love by leaving us a five-star rating and review on iTunes and by introducing Mind Pump to your friends and family. We thank you for your support and until next time, this is Mind Pump. Summer's almost over, so don't waste your last grill nights on a grocery store run. With good ranchers, premium American beef, chicken, and pork, show up at your door, ready for the grill. Good Ranchers delivers 100 % American meat from trusted farms and ranches with no added hormones or antibiotics.

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