Best and Worst States for Saving a Down Payment on a Home

21:21So what do you think? By the way, because I know you'll give real answers, when I heard Jim, man, I heard J-I-M. And then when I see it up on the screen, I'm like, this is Bo's people right here. If you're G-Y-M. So go ahead. I'll let Jim Rat to Jim Rat talk to each other.

21:39Brian Preston:The answer is personal finance is incredibly personal. So can you increase the value of your rentals on your net worth statement? Can you mark them to market and can you use an estimated value? Absolutely. That's something that you certainly can do. And even considering that they are investment properties, I'm not even going to fight you on that. I'm not even going to give you, because, you know, we talk all the time about how we value our primary residences and we value them at original cost. We don't inflate them up unless we end up selling them so that the net worth statement stays conservative.

22:13Brian Preston:Rental property is a little bit different. So you get to choose if you want to do that. Now, here's one thing I do because Brian and I, we own a couple of different commercial properties. Rather than marking them up to value, I want to be careful letting my net worth statement move because of factors that are too far outside of my control. What I want to see in my net worth statement is how did the numbers change based on the things that I directly control based on my savings rate, based on the way my investments are growing, based on the way that I'm paying down debt, those types of things. Just because I happen to be in a really hot real estate market and something might change and might go up in value, I want to be careful getting too excited about increasing those real estate values, especially if I have no desire in the near term to turn those into liquid capital.

23:02Brian Preston:If I know that I have real estate properties are going to be long-term properties. I likely care more about the income that they're generating than the capital appreciation that might show up on my net worth statement. So if it were me, I would probably list them at cost plus improvements, but I'm not going to fight you if you want to do them at market value. Yeah, I think, look, for investment property, it's perfectly fine if you want to do market value. Here's what I would use as the decision matrix for myself is the reason we get so hard on personal residences is because it's just hard to unless you you have to you have to sleep lay your head down somewhere so we just don't want you to have this false sense of that you have all this money or net worth behind you when it's all just tied into your home net worth because like Bo you even talked about your house that you you bought in 2020 yeah we built it in 2020 it's already doubled 100 so I mean if we just counted that that is that what did you do to create that and could you use it because if you moved here in Williamson County you would more than likely have to still come out of pocket you'd have to come way out of pocket your interest rate would probably be twice the rate of what it currently what you're under so maybe it's just there's a lot of stuff there it would not be a positive for you to sell this you'd have to go move to Iowa to actually make this work for you um is what we learned you know, from the content earlier today.

24:26And that's just not the reality of the world. Now with investment property, I'm willing to give you a little more grace. So here's the thing you need to ask yourself is how are you looking at your investment property? And if you think you are going to use this as part of your retirement, and you're also being honest with yourself that this is going to be liquid because real estate's not liquid, but some markets are more liquid than others. And if you think that, hey, this market, I would be able to move this asset. And yes, I'm going to use this asset, even including the appreciation in my retirement plan.

24:57So there's a lot of assumptions going into this. By all means, I think you could because you've now leaned on the fact that this is going to be usable assets for my future and built into the plan. What I don't like is when people use their primary residence and the net worth, and it's an artificial comfort because you're going to live in that house. And if you had to go reset where you lived, it's just so hard with interest rates and without moving and changing school zones and everything else. And I think a lot of people are fibbing to themselves if they're not going with that more conservative cost plus improvements to keep you honest.

25:37Well, Jimman444, I hope that helps as you do your annual net worth statement. And you know what? Today's a day of celebration. I'm going to go off script and call today Tumblr Day.

25:47Brian Preston:Oh, I think this is three weeks in a row. Remy's feeling good. It's two in a row. Holy cow. I love it. Tumblr birthday day. Tumblr birthday. Exactly. We're giving out birthday presents for our birthday. I like that. I like that. It's better to give than to receive. Jimman444. If you would like a MoneyGuy Tumblr, just email winner at moneyguy.com. Since we answered your question. I'm just curious about our financial meetings. Can we do a quick poll of who has already completed their net worth statement? Can we ask our audience? Yeah, that'd be fun. Can we do that? Content team. Can we get that going in the chat?

26:16Brian Preston:See if we can get those knobs spinning. And we'll check back. I had to confess, because I didn't even... This microphone just attacked me. Did you all see that? I didn't even get into town until Saturday night. So I didn't even get to work on my net worth until yesterday. And you start itching, right? I was twitching about it a little bit. But you got to it. I got to it. I didn't get it completed, because the problem I realized, and I haven't... Bo's been so busy, that to get access to see what my wife's assets are worth, in the investment programs, I need Bo's help because I don't have all of her user ID and passwords.

26:49I do, but then it sends a message to her phone and it's just magical. It's a mess. So Bo is part of my net worth process and I haven't been able to go get what her 401k and Roth are worth.

27:00Brian Preston:It's so funny. These guys even like each other often, but you're seeing it, right? No, it is a crucial part of the process, but it is proof right there, right there. All right, let's do another question. Does that make you happy to know that you're in a delay of why I couldn't complete all the liquid assets? I love that. I've updated all my stuff, though. Let's let folks answer that have you done your net worth statement yet question in the chat, and we'll do another question and come back to it. Liam C. is up next. It says, if Roth assets are so amazing, why not just go straight for backdoor Roth or mega backdoor Roth conversions all the time?

27:34Are there any downsides?

27:38Brian Preston:Well, okay, you asked in the testing world, we call this a trick question, right? Because should you take advantage of backdoor Roths and should you take advantage of mega backdoor Roths? And for those of you that don't know, backdoor Roths are where you make too much money, you can't put money directly into a Roth IRA. So you have to fund a traditional IRA, do not take the deduction, you convert it to Roth, it's called a backdoor. Mega backdoor is where you put money into the after-tax portion of your 401k and you convert those after-tax contributions to Roth. It's a completely tax-free conversion because you've already paid tax on the money.

28:17Brian Preston:Do we love those and should you do those whenever you can? Most likely, yes. Because what's happened when you're following the financial order of operations and you're in the place where you're having to begin to make those kinds of decisions, I need to do backdoors because I can't do direct and I need to fund after tax. It likely means that you've already exhausted all of your pre-tax opportunities. You've likely already done your full salary deferral, the$24 ,500 into your pre-tax 401k. So you've done step six. And now that you've done that, you are looking at the other areas where you can still get some tax incentive via saving.

28:58Brian Preston:If Liam really wanted to ask a good question, I think the way I would have switched it is, hey, should I just do Roth salary deferrals as well? Well, here's the downside is because for both of those things, you're in the highest of income tax brackets. Because backdoor Roth means you make too much money to do traditional Roth contributions. Mega backdoor Roth means you make so much money that you're going to maximize the 415 limits. And that's over$70 ,000 for somebody who's my age. so it's 72 yeah yeah 72 is the new 415 limit is that even for everybody for everybody plus ketchup for over 50 so wow we're getting close to 80 000 so so you to be able to save that level of assets you got to be cranking through some some high income so now let's say well okay so if you're making that type of income 37 percent marginal i mean federal marginal rate and then if you live in states like california somewhere else it could be 12 13 on top of that so and then you put on top of that, what if you're self-employed and you've got, you know, surcharges and you've got, you know, the, the self-employment taxes and those types of things.

30:06It's, it's conceivable that 45 to 53 % of your money is just evaporating to taxes. So as much as I love Roth money, do I want to, while I'm in my peak earning years, paying 50 cents on the, every dollar I earn to taxes, is that the best use of it? I would say no, because more than likely what I could do is take advantage of all these huge savings opportunities, take the tax deduction now, because now I'm saving, essentially the government's funding half of my contribution because I'm saving that much in taxes. And then if I leave the workforce before required minimum distribution age at 75, I might have an opportunity where I get to legally manipulate the tax code by doing Roth conversions at much, much lower tax rates.

30:55Because think about how many states also exclude retirement-type distributions and other things, plus you're in a lower tax bracket for a federal standpoint because you don't have earned income anymore. All of a sudden, your light should be going off and going, wow, this is, yeah, I love Roth. It is my favorite child. But when I know that there's a headwind of 50 cents on every dollar going to taxes, I'm going to be thinking a little bit different about how I'm making those contributions

31:22Brian Preston:that's right, that's exactly right so Liam it's not a is it bad it's not an either or, it's a both and we love when we see folks doing all these things maxing out pre-tax salary, you should be doing backdoor doing backdoor, doing the mega backdoor if you have the right account structure, I do need to always remind people because I still remember one of my dearest friends, he wrote me this is probably a year and a half ago and he's like Brian I did that Roth conversion I saw that show I mean I did the backdoor Roth contribution because I saw your content on that and I was like I almost said his name I said you can't do that you have IRA and assets you have a big IRA sitting out there and he's like oh so make sure you have the right account structure before you just start gripping and ripping that's what this is one of the reasons this is why we do what we do is that I love for you guys when you get into more complex stuff consider taking the relationship to the next level if because this is exactly what we help our clients navigate is doing the backdoor contributions to their Roth IRAs, making sure it's right on the tax return, because by the way, that gets screwed up all the time, too.

32:27Also working through should you be doing Roth conversions if you're leaving the workforce early or even in plan conversions if your if your plan allows that we look at all that stuff. Yep. That's great. If you want to learn more about Abound Wealth, you can click on become a client at moneyguy.com and learn a little more about it. And also, to Liam C., if you would like a MoneyGuy Tumblr, just email winner at moneyguy.com. Quirk, quirk, quirk, quirk, quirk, quirk, quirk, quirk, quirk.

32:52Brian Preston:People are asking for it. I'm glad you did it. That's the first one of 23 seconds. And by the way, we're still doing in true tried for fortune. I'm using it as a Tumblr. I mean, I'm actually using it as a koozie. Bo's using it as a Tumblr. It can transform, in case you wondered what that sound was. Yeah. Okay, we have some results from the poll. 76 % say yes, they have it. Wow! Financial mutants. That's unbelievable. That's probably killing the microphones, but still, it's worth a clap. It's worth a clap. We love to see it. Our entire editing team. Yeah, they're like, ooh, no clapping on air. By the way, solid choice for us not to run AC today.

33:28Brian Preston:It is so hot. I wasn't going to say that. How did we just make the decision that we were going to just hotbox this thing today? I just knew that I wasn't free. Like, happy birthday. Make it hot as it can be because Brian's going to wear layers. And by the way, I wore a shirt because I wanted to. Look, I don't mind. It's a live stream, but we're going to be recording other content. Are you taking? Yeah. Hey, that's right. I wanted to show a little pride. I mean, I know my dog's lost. I know my dog's lost, but I'm still proud of him. I'm proud of my dogs. I am too. I thought the sweater was gone.

33:57I thought he was taking it off. I mean, I'm hot enough to take it off, but I'm not. Probably for the best. Especially, you know, if you do stuff, like you ever take it, you're in good shape, so you probably hope. When you take your layer off, you usually show your belly. and I'm not going to make that mistake publicly.

34:18On that note. Have you not noticed? Yep, every time. That's why. I know my wife is a good wife because sometimes when I take my thing off, she'll grab the shirt underneath and give a helping hand. She doesn't want that belly to be exposed either. That table muscle. That's hilarious. This is really funny. Oh, man. God, I think I just got hotter talking about it. You did. Jeez. If I start sweating, it's not because we ate hot wings. It's because they hot boxed us.

34:48Brian Preston:By the way, did you see that there were a lot of requests for Money Guy hot ones? Did you see that? It keeps popping up. There were. Can I say it's a new year? We've had some ralliers for that. New year, 20-year anniversary of the show. I'll have a request for my audience. Oh, is that thing said 75? What are we doing here? We paid the bills. We can afford AC. But here's my request for the audience. All the times I see hot ones, I even see it like even some of the bigger shows like Rogan. Others say, hey, what's a person we should have on? I never see our Money Guy people. Y 'all are so active for us, but I never see anybody out there pitching us for those.

35:33Brian Preston:I'd be like, we should have the Money Guy show on. If you want to know what really drives the engine, because we're not a big corporation, is when we collabs are a big part of it. We're trying to do more and more collaboration. So if you can be part of that engine, or maybe you have a connection on some of these, these bigger shows, a friend of a friend, we're not against it. Look, I even have, you know, I found out that an organization I give charitably to is involved with a comedian in town. And I'm, I'm even working that angle. I'm beyond now trying to figure out how, let's figure out how we can push this thing to the next level.

36:10Brian Preston:So if you have a connection to Hot Ones, we'd love to. Or go in the comment section. I'm worried about my, I think it'd be great TV or great reaction. Bring on Brian Preston and Bo Hanson. But I think I'm not a hot. I mean, I would probably die. I don't eat spicy. I mean, I eat spicy stuff, but not real spicy stuff. I don't like being uncomfortable. It wouldn't be good. Neither of you are big spicy people. So that would be a short-lived. I mean, we order Hot Ones. But we don't order Hot Ones. I don't know how hot hot. It's not the same. People get the cluck out. Oh, from Hattie B's? Yeah. We don't do those type of Nashville hot chickens.

36:47We stay more mild. You don't have to go that hot to where you make yourself sick and don't enjoy the rest of your vacation. Wow. Probably ought to answer a question on a financial show. We should. Keith S. has a question.

37:02Brian Preston:Brian, do you remember when we decided to go all in on our YouTube channel, but we just didn't know if all the hard work was actually going to pay off. Oh, yeah. It was a little scary at first because you have all the what ifs. What if nobody watches our videos? What if this doesn't work? What if we're just talking to ourselves? But thankfully, we took the leap. And honestly, it's been one of the best decisions we've ever made. And if you're thinking about starting a business or launching a side hustle, let me tell you, having the right tools makes all the difference. And that's where Shopify comes in.

37:33Brian Preston:Shopify powers 10 % of all e-commerce in the U.S., from startups to even popular brands like Allbirds and Untuckit. And they make it simple. You can build a professional online store with ready-to-use templates, plus AI tools that help write product descriptions and even improve your photos. It's basically like having a marketing team in your pocket. Email campaigns, social posts, all designed to help you find your customers. And with Shopify, you can handle everything from inventory to payments to analytics, so you don't need to manage a bunch of tools on different platforms. Everything is all in one place, making your life easier and your business run smoother.

38:11Brian Preston:Look, you don't want to miss out on what's next because you're so worried about a bunch of what-ifs. It's time to turn those what-ifs into With Shopify Today. Sign up for your$1 per month trial at shopify.com slash moneyguy. Go to shopify.com slash moneyguy. That's shopify.com slash moneyguy. This episode is brought to you by Indeed. Stop waiting around for the perfect candidate. Instead, use Indeed Sponsored Jobs to find the right people with the right skills fast. It's a simple way to make sure your listing is the first candidate C. According to Indeed data, sponsored jobs have four times more applicants than non-sponsored jobs.

38:53Brian Preston:So go build your dream team today with Indeed. Get a$75 sponsored job credit at Indeed.com slash podcast. Terms and conditions apply. It says, how would we know how much we can reduce retirement contributions if we have been contributing 25 % and DDD plan forecasts show we are well ahead of retirement needs? We're 36, have 500K plus retirement balance and a net worth of$1 million. Let's go. I'll let you answer the technical, but I want to give Keith some just finger in the air feedback on this. is I know most people don't cross millionaire status until they're somewhere between 47 to 49 years of age after saving and investing for 27 years.

39:35So the fact that Keith has already got over half a million dollars in retirement assets, a million-dollar-plus net worth, and he's 36 years of age. So you think about that, that's 11 to 13 years ahead of schedule. That's unbelievable. That's pretty amazing.

39:52Brian Preston:Yeah, I think what's interesting, do you have Wealth Multiplier over there? I do. At 36, the wealth multiplier, what is that? I got to go to the back page for that one. 36 is 11.33. Yeah, so just think the work that you've done up to this point, if you just took that$500 ,000 in investments and multiplied it by 11.33, that's what you're on your way to without even saving anything else. And let us tell you, from where we sit, objectively, you are way out ahead of the curve relative to your peers. like other 36-year-olds to have half a million dollars of investments and have a million dollar net worth is unique.

40:31Brian Preston:You're in a fantastic spot. And so your question was, I had to read it twice. I thought you were saying, hey, when? Like, how do I know when I can back down? But that wasn't actually your question. You asked, how would I know how much? Okay, I feel like I'm in a great spot. How do I know how much? That's one of the reasons why we designed the Know Your Number course because the way that you determine how much you can back your savings down is really a mathematical function. You have to determine, okay, what's the finish line? What's the goal that I'm working towards? And once I can define the finish line and I understand where I'm at today, my starting point, then I can put together what's required to get me from where I am today to where I ultimately want to be.

41:12Brian Preston:And that number will tell you what savings rate is required to do that. Now, let me give you a few, a few caution. What am I trying to say here? A few like words of caution. We, there was an episode that released yesterday of making a millionaire with Danielle. If you've not watched this episode, you should watch it because she was in a fantastic spot as a young person. And she had this desire to do coast fire. And she said, Hey, here's what I'm going to do. I've really been killing it since I've been young. I want to bat down now so that I can hit this number. And then at this age, it was like 37.

41:47Brian Preston:I'm going to back down even more and I'm just going to coast. And we said, Hey, we love that. That's a great idea. Have you done the math on it? And what we did is we had this wonderful conversation and we actually did the math with her for her showing her, Hey, the goal, the thing that you want to do is, is possible. But the strategy that you have in place right now was not likely to get you to where you ultimately want to be. There are some tweaks and some changes that you should make now, and it was purely a mathematical function of how much do I need to be able to live the life that I want to live and how much do I have to save now to get there?

42:21Brian Preston:So, Keith, what I would encourage you to do is, one, go watch that episode, and, two, work through that exact same exercise. If we know what our goal is and we know where we are today, what steps are needed to accomplish that? And this is one of those times, Keith, where when you begin trying to answer those kinds of questions, it does get a little more nuanced and it does get a little more complicated and you begin to introduce yourself to maybe I don't know all the things that I should know. This might be a wonderful time to consider having the conversation about when it might make sense to bring on a professional, to take the relationship to the next level because you've only navigated this one time, but a well-seasoned professional has likely done this hundreds of times.

43:04Brian Preston:So we would encourage you if This is something you're really thinking about, and you're going to make a big decision, like backing down your savings or taking your foot off the pedal. You want to make sure that you're doing it at the right time, and you don't have a false sense of optimism like what Danielle had. I was just going to share, because you said the Know Your Number course, which it is a course, but when I hear the word course, I'm like, it's going to be feel good, unicorns, roses, and those type of things. No, this is actually a tool as well. It's actually got a spreadsheet built into it for you to go navigate and you figure out if you're ahead of the curve, behind the curve, or right where you're supposed to be.

43:39And I even liked it because it really lets us nerdy folks toggle the numbers. You can change rate of return. You can change your savings rate. You can change inflation predictions. I'm dropping stuff. So it's really valuable to let you kind of toggle and find out exactly where you are in that process.

43:57Brian Preston:That's great. Keith S., thank you for the question. Just email winner at moneyguy.com if you would like to cash in on your Money Guy Tumblr. Kenneth has a question next. It says, hey, Money Guys, I'm stuck on a decision to pay off a second mortgage at 8.25 % rate early. So he's paying that off early or continue to max out retirement. Is a second mortgage technically high interest debt? How does he decide? I mean, we're going to need more information, but I will tell you, eight and a quarter doesn't get me excited. I mean, that's well above. I mean, because right now mortgage rates are below six.

44:37So to know that you're paying an over 3 % headwind, that seems like a bridge into high interest debt.

44:47Brian Preston:Let me tell you some questions I'd want to know the answer to, Kenneth. I'd want to know how old you are. I'd want to know what the rate on your primary mortgage is. I'd want to know what your asset structure looks like outside of this home. And I'd want to know what your income and savings rate looks like. I'd want to have all of those different variables to determine, okay, what does make the most sense? Because depending on your age, eight and a quarter percent may indeed be high interest. If it's high interest, it falls into step three. You got to really extinguish that. But perhaps based on where you are and based on your age, maybe eight and a quarter is not all that high.

45:26Brian Preston:Or maybe it shouldn't be considered high interest for you for some unknown reason that we may not have clarity into. Because I'd also want to ask, what are your long-term plans with this house? Is this a house you plan on being in for a long time? Or is this a house you think you're likely going to sell in the next year, two, three, four years? So I'd want to know all of those variables to help discern and determine, does this qualify as high interest debt? Because I think so often people just make the assumption, when it comes to personal finance, that ought to be one size fits all. Oh, if I got a mortgage, I got to pay it off.

45:56Brian Preston:Or oh, if I have a car loan, I got to pay it off. Or oh, if I have student loans, I got to pay it off. And there is nothing wrong with getting rid of debt, with paying it out. We love being debt free. We love folks not being encumbered. But we recognize that every financial decision we make has an opportunity cost associated with it. If I choose to do this, I'm choosing to not do this. If I choose to pay this off, I'm choosing not to deploy the dollars elsewhere. And when it comes to finance, we think there's a better way to do money. We want you to make sure that you're making optimal financial decisions that give you the highest probability of reaching your ultimate long-term goals.

46:32But real talk, though, Kenneth, in the fact that Financial Mutant, to I don't know if you're a Financial Mutant, but I'll talk to you like you are, That would bother me if I had eight and a quarter sitting out there like that. So, you know, do the homework that Bo is suggesting and to figure out where you are and where the purpose is. But then any margin or excess you have in your life, let's extinguish that because that would just yuck. That would just not be fun to have sitting on your net worth statement. All right. Good stuff, Kenneth. Thank you for being here. I know you've had to do some research on home equity lines and stuff.

47:05What was the rates that you found when you looked at it last year?

47:08Brian Preston:Well, a year or so ago, it was like seven and a half, seven and a quarter. So this seems high, but here's what I don't know. I'm just thinking through all the different scenarios we've seen. This could have been something where Kenneth bought his home and he got a primary in order to get the main mortgage. He did a piggyback. Well, this is a piggyback, right? So this is really an interesting thought exercise. Again, we don't know values. We don't know how much is there. But let's say that his primary mortgage is at seven and a half and he also has this secondary that's at like eight and a quarter.

47:37Brian Preston:Well, rates have come down now. 30-year rates might be somewhere like 6.5%, 7%. So it's just worth entertaining and looking at all of the different options that you have available to you to make sure that you make the most optimal decision. Because the decision that makes the most sense today, given today's interest rate environment, might look different than the decision that would have made the most sense three years ago. That's why, again, it's very nuanced and it's very personalized. Almost like personal finance is personal. That's it. It's personal. Kenneth, if you would like a Money Guy Tumblr since we answered your question today, email winner at moneyguy.com.

48:14Carson has a question. It says, I'm a senior in high school. Oh, man. Let's go. I have a 529 account for college with about 80 % of my four-year tuition cost to earn my CFP degree.

48:29Brian Preston:Let's go. It's currently invested. When should I start moving funds to less risk? you're gonna Carson if you're a senior he's in the window that means that graduations in May semester starts you don't have to do it all at once because by the way they're not gonna make you pay all four years of your tuition when you show up on your freshman day um but that August tuition that's pretty short-term money right like that's there I would definitely diverse I would be starting to dial down that asset allocation on that money this is one of the reasons why because in and Carson you may not struggle with this but we see this all the time someone finds himself in a situation like, oh, okay, well, yeah, but I think the market's going to have a good first quarter.

49:09Brian Preston:So maybe I'll just wait until March. And then the market kind of goes down a little bit. Oh, well, gosh, it was so much, but maybe I'll just wait until June. And you get into this mindset where you begin trying to time it and trying to play with it. It's one of the reasons why when it comes to goals like education funding, and we look at 529s, we love, and this is a time where like a targeted date type fund is a wonderful solution. Because if you're 529, we're invested in some sort of target date fund, the glide path would have likely already happened for you. So when you were younger and these dollars were building, they would have been more aggressive.

49:46Brian Preston:But now as you are approaching that time, when it is, you are going to need these dollars and tuition is going to come due, it's probably going to be in a much more conservative allocation where you actually have liquidity available when you need it. So I would think, certainly for this first year and maybe even for two years, I would start thinking about having cash available no matter what happens in the market. Oh, yeah. I mean, look, the typical allocation that a 529 is going to do if you're using their age-based program, it's getting probably pretty close to 100 % of this money is going to be in short-term reachable assets.

50:25So right there, that ought to be an indicator that you, at a minimum, probably want at least half of this money to be off the table. I would think so. So you have the next two years covered of college. But that doesn't – I mean, because that's the thing. It then becomes a personal decision on how fast you wind down the – I'm assuming you're in a 100 % equity allocation of some sort. It's back to an analogy we made at our last live stream that I was at, which Bo was talking about playing Russian roulette, and I was talking about landing an airplane, is that there's ways you've got 80 % of your education funded.

51:07It would be really sad if all of a sudden we had a 2008-type market and all of a sudden you had 40 % to 50 % of your education funded, and now instead of coming out of college probably debt-free, you might have to come out of college with student loan debt all because you were getting really cute and sensitive trying to time the market. Don't get caught up in those games.

51:30Brian Preston:I'll tell you what, Carson, to be a high schooler and to be in this live chat listening to this show, good for you, my man. That is awesome. The future looks bright. If you can start figuring out how to make wise financial decisions now and you take that through your college career into your early adulthood, the sky is the limit for you. By the way, for an 18-year-old, because I have a dear friend that was on our family vacation over the Christmas break. He's turned 18 today. I give a shout-out to Finn. His wealth multiplier at 18 years of age is 107.83. That's wild. Think about that. Every dollar you save by the time you retire is going to be worth close to$108.

52:13Don't sleep on that. That's powerful stuff. Anytime I see a question or comment that's like, I'm in high school or I'm listening with my high school, I'm like, yeah. That's awesome. They have so much opportunity. It's just so fun. And we're really glad to have you, Carson. So thanks for your question. If you would like a MoneyGuy Tumblr, we'd love to send you one. Just email winner at moneyguy.com. Next question is from Jack M. It says, my work matches our 401k contributions in a single lump sum contingent upon working through the end of the calendar year. Last day provision. If I'm planning on finding a new job this year, should I redirect those funds?

52:52That's only on the matching money.

52:54Brian Preston:Yeah, because your money is still going in there. It's still being invested. And we still want you, again, assuming that you're in the right place in the financial order of operations, right? Now, if you have high interest debt or if you don't have a fully funded emergency fund, then understand where you're coming from here, right? You're like, ah, maybe I shouldn't do this because I'm going to leave. But what happens if you don't leave? And we see this all the time. People have these plans. They're like, man, I'm planning on finding a new job. I'm planning on looking. But what if that doesn't happen?

53:26Brian Preston:You don't want to get to November to simulate, holy cow, I had this wonderful opportunity to go make 100 % rate of return, a 50 % rate of return. And I thought I wasn't going to be there, so I didn't do it. In our experience, most often, if you can get a match, if you have the ability to go grab a match, even if there's a chance that some of it may be forfeited, it likely still makes sense to go do it just in case it doesn't get forfeited. Well, and, Bo, if you're curious where Bo came up with those things about the employer match versus emergency reserves and high-interest debt, he was using the financial order of operations.

54:01You, too, can go download this. Go to moneyguy.com slash resources. I was personally thinking about myself. The two jobs I left before I went and started my own firm, I left the public accounting firm. I put in my notice. It was like April 16th or whatever. No, I did it right. I didn't want to stick my employer during the middle of tax season. Plus, let's face it, this is something I always tell people. Pay attention to when bonuses are paid. If you know that you're going to get a large year-end bonus, don't go transition to your new job on November 15th. Because you have worked 11 and a half months of the 12 months to get that year-end bonus, and they're more than likely not going to, you don't get the year-end bonus if you put your resignation in or the big profit sharing contribution, whatever it is.

54:51That's why the second firm I left, I put in that notice on November, I mean, on February 15th. And it was primarily so I could capture the two things. I wanted to capture my year-end bonus and I wanted to make sure I qualified for another plan year on the retirement plan. That stuff went into my calculus on once I made the decision that I was going to leave. I was like, okay, now that I made the decision on them, I'm going to leave this, this job. Now let's talk about when, you know, based upon all the variables of bonuses and other things. And, and also, I mean, back when I was working in government, I was troubled by like police officers that would leave the, the, the county government that I was working with to go to another, a neighboring county when they were At that time, the vesting into the pension was much, much easier.

55:44And to be within 12 months of being vested in the pension and see people leave to go get a job in a neighboring county for 5 % to 10 % pay raise, it broke my heart because they just weren't doing the calculus on what is that pension, some benefit from that pension worth. So take into account when you're making those big life decisions. This is part of the measure twice, cut once. Timing matters on some of these employer benefits.

56:16Well, Jack M., thank you for the question. We would love to send you a MoneyGuy Tumblr before I go on. Email winner at moneyguy.com if you would like to get one. All right, we've got another question from Hoke4. It says, hey, MoneyGuy team, the wife and I are 28 in step eight. We are refinancing our home from a 7.530 year to a 5.9925 year. Should we pay closing costs in cash or roll them into a loan? We have cash and plan to stay for seven years. What do you think, Brian? Well, this is always a math equation. It really is because, you know, I know we think right now 599. By the way, kudos to you because you dropped your interest rate by over a percent and a half.

57:07That's pretty powerful stuff.

57:08Brian Preston:And if you've been in the house for five years, you're staying on the same payment schedule, which isn't crazy. I like the logic that you're going on this. The thing is, and I don't mind paying cash for the closing costs, but sometimes you'll find out when you start getting into this refinance game, is that if you go and you, especially if you shopped the refinance, you might be able to refinance not once but twice. And you're going to be, the closing cost is just part of the field of play and it goes into the equation. So that's why I've seen where you can actually, especially on such a big drop in rates, you might be able to just take a little hit on the rate, not have any closing costs because of the way they price the structure out with the thought that if rates dropped another half a percent to a percent, you could do this game.

57:59If you pay cash, it is a sunk cost at that point, whereas if you roll it in. But that doesn't mean you shouldn't do the calculation. And what I'm talking about doing the calculation is you figure out the payments and you figure out how many months it's going to take you to break even on this. I mean, do you agree or disagree? No, I agree with you.

58:16Brian Preston:I'm just thinking through. When Hoax says that they're in step eight, that tells me, it says my wife and I, this is a married couple, When I hear that we're in step eight, there's a few things I know. I know you've got a fully funded emergency fund. I know that you're maxing out a Roth IRA or perhaps a Roth and a spousal or perhaps backdoor Roths. If you have an HSA, I know you're maxing that out. You're also, in your employer-sponsored retirement plan, maxing those out. Or at least saving 25%. Or if you're in step seven, you're saving 25%. So if you're doing that, Hoke, and you're at the place where you've got a substantial bucket of assets behind you and you have an income that can stand to this.

58:56Brian Preston:Generally speaking, I just love... You just convinced me. Just paying cash for the closing costs. Now, if you're someone and you're like, man, I'm my first home and I've been saving for a down payment and I'm 28 and I don't really have a lot behind me yet, well then that, especially at a 5.99 % rate, I do think it'd be justifiable. Okay, roll the closing costs in so that way you can get some dollars working for you and make up for lost time. You kind of have to triage where you are right now, but just based on the context clues, I'm leaning towards telling you just to write a check, cover the closing cost in cash.

59:30That step eight is doing a lot of work. And that's a great point because we don't, I mean, it does bother me when people, when you roll the cost in, because you know, you're going to be paying those costs for years to come. It's something to be aware of. Also, you know, a lot of people, I don't know if we talked about this. When you refinance those home origination fees or any points or anything, when you first buy the house, that stuff's immediately deductible when you file your taxes and if you're automized. But when you refinance, it's amortized over the length of the loan. So that's something to be very mindful of as you're keeping track of things.

1:00:07That's great. Well, Hoke4, thank you for the question. If you would like a MoneyGuy Tumblr, just email winner at moneyguy.com. And don't forget, your opinion matters. I want to hear it. Go to moneyguy.com, fill out the Money Guy questionnaire, and let us know what types of things you'd like to see from Money Guy in 2026 and beyond. Even if we can't do every single one right away, we will know that you want it, and we will take it into serious consideration. So I'm excited to go check out all of your responses, read your comments in this official place. And remember, it's only going to be open for a week.

1:00:43So do keep that in mind. We want to get everything in one place, and so don't sleep on this. We really appreciate you taking just a few minutes of your time to let us know what you want because we really are listening. Yeah, if you want to do a, because like I said, this is a 20-year birthday celebration for the Money Guy Show. Hard to believe. It's crazy. I mean, I think about that and the fact that creating, content creation is such a unique thing. Because this thing, if y 'all don't know, a lot of you, because a lot of people don't know, is because now this thing has turned into its own enterprise.

1:01:12This really did start as a passion project. I felt back in 2006 I was so inspired when I got my first iPod I always wanted to be a school teacher I thought I was going to close my career out either teaching in high school or teaching at a college personal finance and then when I got my first iPod I was like Eureka this is the thing that's going to change the world and I was like this is my opportunity to do this and I just did it as a passion project I still never forget when I won't say her name but the first she's still a client of the firm and she'd probably love to know that we're still giving her shouts out.

1:01:502008 because we started the show in January 2006 2008 I had a listener who had a layover in Atlanta airport and she asked if we could just meet up because she was thinking about hiring me and I was like you want to hire me? I never thought this was going to be a marketing platform it was more of an education platform and then I think about that conference I went to I wish I could remember what year that was but was that like 2012, 2014 somewhere in there where I had an advisor that the show had gotten enough traction at that point that I was bragging about how big the audience was and he was like how many clients are you picking up from this and I told him the number that number is so small compared to the audience size and he's like are you asking for business I can't ask for business that would totally blow this thing up it would be like an infomercial then And he was like, no, I think based upon what you're giving away on that show, you could start asking for business.

1:02:45I came back and I told Bo, and I was like, Raj said we should start asking for business. And it was like the most dumbest, you know, it's the most basic thing, but that's when we started talking about taking the relationship to the next level. And you guys have shown up, and you have revolutionized the ability. And then I think about us just getting into YouTube, turning a podcast into a YouTube platform, and then adding all the other platforms, and now having multiple studios, multiple employees, thank you. I mean, I hope that comes through is that we are so thankful for everybody here who's made The Money Guy go beyond this pet education project and turned it into an actual world-changing platform.

1:03:25I mean, I really do. Even this morning in the content meeting, if you haven't gone to our website, go check it out because this thing has been just completely beefed up. I mean, I give kudos to Rebi and team because this thing is a, the search engine is legit now. In the past, we've had issues with it. And we even have some other ideas that we're kind of working in beta fashion behind the scenes on that will take advantage of some of the newest and latest and greatest technology that we're even kind of previewing internally. But this thing is a resource to help you turbocharge us. Because I've realized we have the perfect platform to create the abundance cycle that is a win-win.

1:04:03come take all the free stuff we can give you so you can turbocharge and take your relationship you know and your assets to that next level but when you do take those assets to the next level and you start feeling that success i hope you'll remember who planted all the seeds of knowledge all those nuggets and that's when the the abundance cycle takes the relationship to a whole nother level because we work with clients i think we're in 48 49 states at this point yeah so um thank you all for making this all possible it's way beyond when i do these studio tours I'm just a guy with an iPod that just wanted to be a school teacher, and y 'all have made us world changers, and that means a lot to us.

1:04:41I'm your host, Brian. Joined by Bo, Reby, and the rest of the content team. Money Guy team, out.

1:04:45Brian Preston:The Money Guy Show is hosted by Brian Presson and Bo Hanson. Brian and Bo are partners with Abound Wealth Management. Abound Wealth Management is a registered investment advisory firm regulated by the Securities and Exchange Commission in accordance and compliance with the securities laws and regulations. A Bound Wealth Management does not render or offer to render personalized investment or tax advice through The Money Guy Show. The information provided is for informational purposes only, may not be suitable for all investors, and does not constitute financial, tax, investment, or legal advice.

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