Lou Beckett: Why Mothers Carry So Much of the Mental Load and How to Change It

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0:37It's that assumption of responsibility and that assumption of responsibility never goes. That's how you tell if you're the default parent. Can you just go out for a drink after work without organising anything? If you can, you're not the default parent. Yeah. Do you say yes to something before you've checked? I think sometimes in the moment you don't realise how much you're doing or how much you're achieving because you're on this, what can feel like a hamster wheel of jobs, things to do, stuff to do, just constantly. I don't know who I am anymore. I feel completely lost in this motherhood sphere and I don't know how to get out of it and I need your help.

1:17Hey, welcome to Motherkind. We are proudly sponsored by Wild Nutrition's Women's Supplements. It is me, your host, Zoe, and this is the show for you, the woman behind the mother. During August, the Motherkind team and I try and practice a little bit of what we teach by slowing down. We take some time off and try to make the juggle of the summer holidays a little bit easier. So throughout the month, we're bringing you some of our most loved and listened to episodes of the year so far. Today's episode has been one of our biggest of 2026 and I cannot wait for you to hear it. Here it is. Enjoy. Let me ask you a question.

1:59Can you just decide that you want to go out one evening and just go without having to plan childcare or organise things for the children? If you can, then you are not a default parent and chances are you probably have a default parent, someone in your life who is picking up that childcare slack. Today's guest is Lou Beckett, wife of the famous comedian Rob, because she has just written a book called Lessons from a Default Parent. And she is here to tell us about the moment she realised this pattern where everything was defaulting to her, how it felt and how she's managed to change it. So if you are in the thick of it right now, if you feel like everything is falling to you, if you feel lost, if you feel resentful, then I think this episode is going to help you feel so seen, so understood.

2:48And it's definitely going to make you laugh a little bit. Don't forget to subscribe. Here it is. Oh, Lou, I'm so excited to have you here. I absolutely laughed and cried and raged a bit through the book. And so I just imagine that someone's just pressed play to this episode. They're in the car. They've got two little ones in the back. They've probably had a bit of a rubbish morning. What do you want them to hear from one default parent to the next? that it's okay to say it's hard. It's okay to acknowledge that and it's all right to lean into it, that you're not in somehow letting yourself down or anyone else down by acknowledging just how hard the job that you're doing is.

3:27Because it is really hard and it is relentless. And it's not to say it's not lovely, but it's really hard. And sometimes you've just got to acknowledge that and go, this is a bit shit and move on. Like, it's okay to say that. And when did you first say that? out loud because I think you describe it in the book there's that you know in those early days and everyone's like it's magical and you've got this newborn and it's beautiful that isn't the reality of most of the women that that I know when did you first say out loud this is a bit shit I think it was a slow creep a kind of that realization that oh this is still hard and it doesn't feel like it's getting easier it's changing and it's evolving but bits of it don't feel like they're getting easier because that first bit is so physical you're hormonal you're tired you're exhausted and I kept putting end points on it go well when we get to this point it'll feel easier because and it never really felt easier I don't want to be all doom and gloom if you've got a newborn in your arms you're like oh my god this never gets easier because it does it bits get easier bits get harder but it's it's almost the kind of looking back in retrospect and going, oh, I didn't realise how much I felt some of the things I was feeling, which is that it's hard and I felt a bit lost and I didn't feel like I was doing a very good job.

4:45And now I look back and go, oh, I was doing a good job and I was doing the best job I could and that was good enough. But you don't realise it till you're out of it, which isn't helpful when you're in it and you just need some help or you need someone to go, this is really hard and you're working really hard. It's so true. It's so true. So what would you say to yourself if you could go back to the loo, sat on the sofa, paint us a picture of a moment when you were like, oh, and I want you to imagine what you would say to her. So we'd had one of those days which on paper was meant to be lovely. Me and my friend had taken our two-year-olds up to town across London to see Andy in the Odd Socks.

5:23Love Andy. Everyone loves a bit of Andy. My daughter loved a bit of Andy. Apart from on the day we slept up to town and across town to see Andy. Of course. screamed blue murder at the meet and greet I've got the photo of me wrestling her while everyone tries to smile you know through the screaming around us and then on the way back she managed to I still don't know entirely how she did it I'm heavily pregnant with our youngest as well at this point she manages to tread in dog poo but gets it all up the back of her legs and we're walking home from the station because I was like it'll be fine we can walk so it's it's freezing she's covered in dog poo we've had one of those days where I'm I'm ready to sit in the corner and just cry at this point and now she's covered in poo so I have to take her trousers off she's on my shoulders with bare legs in December I've got a photo of her wearing like a bobble hat she's having a marvellous time at this point she thinks it's hysterical but I'm like schlepping up the road with a two-year-old a half-naked two-year-old on me I can feel people looking at me from their cars judging why my daughter's naked basically well not naked but half naked and I got home And I was like, what is even the point?

6:27What was the point of today? I've spent a whole load of money, a whole load of effort. I don't think she's even had a nice time. I've not had a nice time. And just you have those days where everything has felt like hard work from start to finish. And I could have cried at that point. and looking back now I'm like but you went out you did something it doesn't always have to work you've tried your best and some days it works and some days it doesn't but at least you've tried and actually somebody told me once and it really has stuck with me that it's much harder work to be a good parent than bad and that's why it feels like hard work and if so if you really really feel like you're slogging your guts out sometimes you're not getting anywhere at least you're putting in the work at least you're working at it that's true is that why you wanted to write the book to really bring that visibility to being kind of the default parent and the one day in day out yeah I think it was to give name to something that if you're doing it you already know you already know how hard you're working but it's nice to have it recognized it's very validating and I didn't realise how validating it would be until I'd written it that actually almost looking back retrospectively going I did all of those things and I'm still doing it and I've done it and look at what I've achieved because I think sometimes in the moment you don't realise how much you're doing or how much you're achieving because you're on this what can feel like a hamster wheel of jobs things to do, stuff to do just constantly and I don't need to tell any default parent out there or any kind of mum out there, how much it is they're doing, because you know that you're doing it.

8:09It's nice to look at it and go, oh my God, I'm doing that. And have it really recognised and kind of so you can celebrate that achievement. Yeah, I think that's it. Giving a name to something always makes us feel more seen, right? Yes. When you were researching it, because I know at the start of the book, you pull out some brilliant research. What was some of the research that really made you feel like, okay, it's not me. I'm not failing. This is almost a universal experience when you are the default parent. And why is it that it's typically the woman or the mother that becomes the default parent?

8:41So I did a bit of research before I started the book, just in case. I had that little moment where I was like, oh my God, what if it is just me? What if you are just really shit at this and no one else is struggling? There's a couple of stats at the start of the book from the UK government. So obviously very relevant to where I am. and where it's like mums are doing more of the childcare on any day of the week, weekend, weekday, whether they're working or not, mothers are doing more childcare than fathers. And where fathers, the only area where it's in any way kind of equitable between mums and dads is that recreation, that fun childcare, the kind of the logistical, managerial, educational, the kind of very physical, basically the bits where you have to be a nag, the bits where you have to be boring, bits where it can feel like a real grind it tends to fall overwhelmingly on the mum it's not fair it's without being all negative it is wildly unfair that that falls on women when really once you get out of that newborn pregnancy bit there's no real reason why it should once the kind of biological necessity short of availing yourself of all of scientific advances and marvels and and whatever child care help you can rope in there's no real reason once they're not teeny tiny babies anymore why it has to be the mum but it's the kind of that president is set where it is the mum and it is the mum overwhelmingly doing most of it how did that get set up in your home then?

10:23Because you've got this weird sort of setup where you have a partner who goes off for extended periods of time. Tell us about how that got set up and when you realised it was happening and what was it like now? Is it the same? Is it different? I don't think we ever spoke about it properly. It was just a kind of fait accompli. So I'm aware that I'm in a fairly, not unique situation, but it wouldn't have made sense for us to do anything else. So Rob's career was really taking off and he was getting all of these amazing opportunities to do all of these different work things and it it wouldn't have made any sense for me to go oh actually you're in teaching right I was in teaching but I've also got ulcerative colitis and that had really really been exacerbated by teaching not that you can't teach and not be stressed I however got very very stressed while I was teaching and it exacerbated my colitis to a point where I was I didn't want to be off more than I was in because it's really disruptive to the kids and and you know you have to build relationships and and things like that so I to try and get my clients under control I'd already taken a step back from work I'd gone to part-time and then I'd I'd kind of come off from work completely and was doing supply teaching and going back into my my previous school so like really it wouldn't have made sense at that point when we had this tiny baby and Rob was getting all of these amazing work opportunities which I wouldn't have wanted him not to do I really wanted him to do that and it wouldn't have made sense for me to go oh actually no you stay at home so I can go and make myself ill doing this even though I loved my job I loved it I love teaching and I would like to go back to some form of it one day it just wouldn't have made practical sense so we kind of fell into it and I think that's half the battle or that was half the danger of it that we just fell into it there was no real conversation so then we never had that conversation of like well what's the kind of the short-term plan what's the long-term plan how is this going to be divided because looking back I think we could have avoided a lot of what I was feeling if we'd just had a conversation about it I think that we did so common that people just you just slip into these roles particularly if it's the mum that has a kind of nine months maternity leave, you just slip into being that default parent, don't you?

12:46And then suddenly, because you're the one that's organised the childcare for you to go back to work if you are, you're the one that's then managing the childcare and the nursery's got your number on file. It's that assumption of responsibility. Yeah. And it's really, really subtle. But once you've clocked it, it's the, I assume I'm busy with the children unless I've booked it off. Yes. And even the phrase booked it off. I'm not booking like a day off work. I am. But it's whereas Rob assumes and I think most non-default parents. So most dads in this instance assume that they're free unless they've been told otherwise.

13:22Yes. Whereas most mums assume that they're not free unless they've specifically arranged childcare. And that's not even just telling their husband or their partner, the dad, whoever. Oh, I'm out. It's like, I'm the one that organises a babysitter. I'm the one that would phone my mum. It's that assumption of responsibility. And that assumption of responsibility never goes. It's just there. And it transcends maternity leave. And it kind of just carries on. and it's really, really difficult to shake once it's ingrained. Yeah, because you say in the book, that's how you tell if you're the default parent.

13:58Can you just go out for a drink after work without organising anything? If you can, you're not the default parent. Yeah. Do you say yes to something before you've checked? Because Rob goes, and again, this is not bashing Rob completely because I think almost all partners or dads, fathers would do it. He's like, I've arranged to go to, that's all right, right? And I'm like, I would never say that sentence. I have to go, are you in? What are you doing? Is my mum free? Can we book a babysitter? It's just the assumption of responsibility.

14:34How is it different now? Is it different now? It is different now in that Rob read the book and took it in the spirit in which it was intended. I want to talk about his right to reply. Which it's, you know, he's definitely, he made himself solely in charge of sun cream on holiday which sounds small but actually that needs to be applied four times a day and it's a pain up a lot of my time and like my headspace on holiday because he was in charge of sun cream he was like i've never done the sun cream really i'm gonna do the sun cream and i'm like lovely you do the sun cream you enjoy that like it just it did make and it's made a real difference not sun cream especially but i think he's just been much more mindful of how much he was letting me do.

15:20I don't know if that's the right phrase as such, but how much, and I talk about it, and I think when I've spoken to other people and other people that've read the book, it's what they've said as well. It's not that their partner wouldn't, it's just that this situation has happened right from maternity leave, even right from being pregnant you're the one that's pregnant you're the one that then gives birth and then you're the one kind of feeding and looking after this baby that then your roles kind of get set and so then it's not that they wouldn't do more it's just that they've never had to and it's not occurred to them too because it's working so unless you kind of actively say this isn't working for me and i need you to do more why would they flag it yeah well they wouldn't there's not going to flag to there yeah exactly tell me about Rob's right to apply what surprised you about some of his responses some of what he was saying I was very pleased with how receptive he was to it but in terms of what surprised me his eagerness to be off work I don't think in reality he would enjoy it when he's like oh I would I would work less and you could go back and I'd be a full-time I was like no you wouldn't you know you wouldn't I really don't think he would not in reality but I think what surprised me is how much he recognized as well that we never sat down and spoke about this this is the kind of first time really we've had a real proper conversation yeah get a conversation I've had to put it on the internet and then write a whole book get to get his attention and like and he is a brilliant dad and a brilliant partner and very very generous with his kind of effort and time and would do anything for us and it just made me think that like on paper I have a lot of support I'm incredibly lucky my mum lives nearby we don't have a lot of the worries that I know a lot of people would have you know if I wanted a full-time nanny I could have one I don't want one but do you know we could there's a lot of things that i could solve and i'm like i am still really struggling with this and i've got a partner who is really supportive what if you've got one of the partners that is a selfish ass how do you know a lot of those about as well so many rob loves to going but i'm not as bad as so-and-so i'm i'm not married to so-and-so and i wouldn't be married i wouldn't have married that person like that's not a good thing you talk about a parenting plan as a way to have these conversations yeah tell us about that looking back I think I what would have been really beneficial is to have these conversations if you can before you have children yeah I'm not saying you've got to plan out the next decade of your life and then it'd be set in stone but have the conversation about what's important to you and what you think you might want to do it might all change in the moment you might have your baby and go oh my god I love this and I can't imagine going back to work full-time or going back to work might be really important to you and your identity and so like have those conversations before the baby's here because it's so much easier to do it when you're not exhausted hormonal and it almost turns into even with the best one in the world it turns into a competition and but I'm doing but I'm doing you're both working the hardest you ever have and so it's really hard to then bring it up after that because it feels like you're going on the attack it feels like you're saying you're not working hard enough or you're not doing enough and that's not what I was saying to Rob it's more that I don't know who I am anymore I feel completely lost in this motherhood sphere and I don't know how to get out of it and I need your help to create enough space for me to find my way back out so it's doing it in advance when you're not completely adult by exhaustion and hormones and demands on your time what was it like when you felt completely lost in it all did you feel like you couldn't remember kind of who you were anymore what was that like I think there's again it's a couple of things where maybe this situation is maybe slightly more unique to me than other people but everyone will have had their own version of it of at the same time I became a mum Rob's career took off massively and I took a step back from my own career so kind of three things simultaneously I felt like I got completely lost within that of the only thing I had really to talk about because that's all I'd done that day was what I'd done with our daughters and then people would ask me a lot about Rob or what Rob was doing because what he was doing was really visible and it was very interesting and you kind And find yourself a number of years down the line going, I don't think I've got anything to say.

20:13I didn't feel like I had anything to add to a conversation. I think every mother's felt like that. Oh my God, I felt like that. Yeah. And you feel like you've got nothing. I don't know what to say. Yeah. Well, what have I done? I've done nothing. What have I read? Nothing. What have I achieved? Nothing. And you have achieved. That's the thing to take away from this. You have achieved. It's just not. I'm very much like, I like a certificate. I like Ofsted coming in going, you're an outstanding. or good teacher or I like having something tangible. I can go, this is what I've done and aren't I good at it?

20:45No one does that when you're a mum. That's the thing, it's so invisible. Yeah, it matters so much but it is so invisible. And if you're kind of raising sane, healthy, happy kids, no one goes, well done, yours isn't an arsehole but no one says that but you kind of want to go, thank you, I'm working really hard at making sure that you don't. You have no idea what it takes. I'm really trying to not be the sociopath and I'm really trying to make sure that they're not the weed. But like very rarely do you get anyone going, you're doing really well. Yeah. Like good job. It sounds patronising, but I would have bloody loved a good job.

21:19Oh my God. Someone once saw me calm my two-year-old down from a tantrum and she said, oh my God, you handled that so well. And I burst into tears because no one had ever said anything like that. I had a business band on a train who asked me to, could I get her to keep it down? I mean admittedly she was feral really going for it she really really wanted to get off the train between stops is this to do with Andy or unrelated no we were going up for another lovely day out me my mum we had a three year old and a one year old and she just wanted off the train so she was like screaming by the doors and I was doing my very best to kind of remain very calm neutral doing my little internal chance looking over her head just not giving in to what she wanted which was to repeatedly kick the door and press the button and I wouldn't let her do that.

22:05So she was just having a meltdown and he asked me to keep it down and I was like, sir. I was quite proud of myself because I didn't cry until I got back to my seat. And I was like, have you ever tried to contain a one-year-old? I should be congratulated for keeping my calm and not giving in, not told off. And then I walked back to my seat and burst into tears. I was just like, oh, you awful, awful human being. Like I'm having a much worse morning than you. I don't know what's happened in your morning, but I am having a worse one because I'm dealing with her. so like just be nice and yeah awful it's the same on planes isn't it when people just don't have the understanding of what it's like yeah the whatever you're listening to that parent is listening to it much closer and being responsible for it and feels awful feels awful

22:55and so thinking about that time when you sort of felt lost and how did you come out of that and Well, have you? Do you feel differently today? I feel like I'm getting there. I feel like we're kind of clawing it back, writing the blog, and then it kind of developing into the book has been really, really validating. And again, I keep going about retrospectives, which isn't helpful when you're in it, but didn't realise how validating it was almost until it was done and given voice to a lot of the things that I don't even think I realised I was feeling until I look back and I was like, oh, I didn't realise how much I was in it or how lost I felt.

23:34And it has been a really slow process. So if you're right in the trenches of it and you can't remember who you are and you can't remember what you used to do or think or know, it does get better. It just takes time. And you have to try and give yourself the space and the freedom to find yourself again. And it feels really selfish, but it's not selfish. it's not selfish to care about yourself as well as your family and it's not selfish to carve out time for yourself as well as your family it just feels it but it's not but the only way through it really is through it yeah and i think there are certain things that you can only see retrospectively i don't think when you're in the moment you can actually see it you're just too in it aren't you yeah so i think it's so helpful to look back because anyone listening who's got those little ones and be like okay maybe i'll feel like that i can't see it now but i think i will feel like i am doing it and i can do it and it is okay and how much you are achieving like babies change so much from babies to toddlers children and even in six months if you look back say six months ago whatever age your child's at think about how much you've done since then and so i think sometimes it is good to stop and take stock quite kind of consciously yeah stop and take stock of okay okay what have we done in the last six months or where am I now or how do I feel because it can help it can really help yeah I want to I love this list the cheat sheet of the overwhelmed because I can imagine right back in the day when my two were little I would have just grabbed this and maybe taken one and it says you're absolutely right the house would fall apart without you women spend 10 extra hours a week multitasking household tasks compared to men you don't have the same amount of free time you're right and it's not fair men have half an hour extra free time a day on average that's 164 hours a year you are more tired women lose 40 minutes of sleep per night after baby men lose only 13 i swear it's more than 40 as well yeah what is that felt really low minutes of sleep that's the average apparently talk about you lose seven years of sleep in the first decade or something and it takes you a decade to get it back is insane I know I've spoken a lot about in the book about don't be argumentative like don't Ziggy and Anna Williamson who was amazing has given some really good advice about how to kind of communicate productively with your partner use the word I statement yeah but sometimes you do just need to win and I feel viscerally sometimes I just need to win so if those stats help you win they're 100 % and it's not something that you're just really tired or you had a hard day it's like no no the people at Harvard say I've lost more sleep than you or the UK government says you're not doing enough it sometimes you just need to win and if it helps you win have at it yeah exactly get the book so you can find this little page here find the page so page 187 for the overwhelmed if nothing else that page alone is worth it I think so I think so this phrase default parent how did you kind of discover it and were you like oh my god that's what I am had you heard it before you realized I hadn't heard it before I know it has been out there I'm not laying claim to it that's not I was in the pub with my fellow mum friend who and we'd had quite a lot of red wine and we were really going on a little kind of spirally rant and in the midst of that I said kind of it's just being the default it's just being responsible all the time and it really and it stuck with me obviously I know I'm not the first it's not something I'm claiming but it covered more than the mental load because I think we've we've heard a lot about the mental load and that is absolutely a massive part being the default parent it's not just the thinking it's the doing it's the responsibility it's the physicality of being the default parent it's that I physically have to be there and that has a real impact on your time and on your kind of ability to be yourself again if you physically have to be in a lot of the places you have to be as a mum have to be at pick up you have to be there like someone has to be with the baby it's a real biological I know damn it no if only we could leave them a little bit no if they could be left for more than three seconds at a time you could really get yourself again but sadly someone has to be with them otherwise you will go on a list and if someone's listening and they're like i am a hundred percent the default parent you know and you've written the book and and you've you've kind of had this experience what are some of the things that you really wish you'd known that you know now that what you think would help someone talk to your partner talk to them early and don't feel bad about saying I would also like these things I would also like to be able to do xyz because there is value in you feeling like you again because you're not going to be able you can't pull from an empty cup you've got to be able to have your own time and rest and and I know that that is that sounds really if you're in the midst of like newborns going you've got to have time to have self-care I wanted to punch people in the face when am I going to get this time what do you mean like obviously you can't but it's so important to talk to your partner or if or if you've got maybe you don't have a partner maybe you're a single parent in whatever your kind of family dynamic setup if there's people within your network that you can speak to that can help facilitate just that little bit of time to take a step back even if it's half an hour while they pushed a pram around and you sat by yourself and just breathed and reset just for a little bit have a look at who's in your network that you could try and utilize or lean on a bit because it's really hard to ask for help and don't feel bad about it I've got enough to feel bad about yeah we'll always find something to feel bad about so like well you said that I was really struck by this line that you said I spent the last 10 years feeling bad about something yeah constantly I think most mums do in some degree I mean I think my biggest takeaway from writing in the book is just how much unnecessary guilt and pressure I've put on myself and no one else was doing that bits of it you know obviously that the comparison trap and Instagram and all the other people who love to tell you all the advice and things you should be doing and the way you should do it and the you know gouge your own eyes out in the end don't you you know go that's not helpful is it but I had my first daughter just by both of them just before Christmas but my first one wouldn't breastfeed at all and we're like we're two weeks away from christmas i'm quite clearly on the edge of a physical and mental cliff about she just wouldn't breastfeed she wouldn't do it she she was tiny she wasn't premature she was just really weenie she was like five eight she just couldn't seen between us we just couldn't do it and so she was she wasn't putting on any weight and the health visitors were coming and they just kept telling me things that well why don't you go to a breastfeeding cafe why don't you try swinging her head around why don't you try i was like what I needed then was somebody sane and from outside of our little bubble who was all too tired and hormonal to go it's okay if you want to give her a bottle of milk it's okay if you want to do this I just needed somebody to step in and take it off my shoulders because it was just and I think I started my parenting journey feeling like I was failing and that's never really left me and actually it would have been so much more productive and so much better for me over the past 10 years to just let some of it go just go I you know I'm trying my best and that is okay that's fine where do you think all that pressure on yourself was coming from if it wasn't coming from outside where where was it coming from I think most normal people want to be the best parent they can there's very few very few people who don't actually care most of us care deeply deeply deeply about being the best parent the best mom the best dad whoever and so it is coming from inside but then because so many people do it you've got so much advice so many comparisons so many all this helped me or i did this or the best way to or the those i just think those parenting books typically don't help i've got to say no i think books like this help i mean they're about your misery company if nothing else so if it makes you feel better someone else was struggling I would way rather read a book about the reality of what your lived experience relating to mine than someone telling me how to identify the right cry at the right time for the right hunger cue.

32:26but I think as well that's it we we we know so much more than we did we've got access to so much more than we did and actually my little pea brain hasn't evolved enough to see 300 mums on Instagram or wherever else all doing it brilliantly and aesthetically pleasingly and you know weaned children all on organic homemade if you can good for you I'm pleased for you piss off I don't need it it's not something my brain needs to deal with when it's so true it's so true our brains are just not designed no for that we're designed to be in a small community where we see a few other mothers around us doing it not open and see what you know Beyonce is giving her twins carefully curated staged and it is a lot of it is staged and curated and held back for a nice photo on a Wednesday rather than what's actually happening so just let it go let the guilt go let the comparisons go you're better at that now letting the guilt go do you feel more confident I am I feel less guilty about doing stuff for me now and I'm not saying like I swan off on girls weekends all the time it's not that it's I mean I'd like to but it's I feel less guilty about saying I'm important in this dynamic too that actually I have to I'm not saying I have to come first second third whatever but I am part of this dynamic too that there is we've got the girls and obviously their needs come first because they're my children I had them and I want them to be as brilliant as they can be and I want them to have everything that they need and want and all of that but also I'm important in that dynamic as well I'm not just their mum I was a person for a full 29 years before I had them and I'm still a person now and I think that person got lost a little bit in the robbers working the girls were growing up and I'd forgotten to put myself into the mix and I'm still struggling with it a bit like it still goes against a kind of almost like decades worth of ingrained no no I'm just a mum I'm just doing that and you're not just a mum you are the mum you're their mum and it's and that is a whole job in itself but if you want to do something as well as that lovely don't feel bad about it everyone else is doing not everyone god I've just done the comparison trap everyone else is doing it but dads can go and they don't seem to fall into this kind of spiral of self-loathing that mums do a lot that's really dramatic self-loathing but i think it's important to kind of give yourself a break and step back from it yeah i think so too and i think it is accurate so kind of the self-loathing i think that we do we are so hard so hard on ourselves so what's the next chapter for you excuse the book pun No idea at the moment.

35:25Absolutely none. We haven't really looked beyond... Focusing on the book. Beyond the book. No, I mean, it's been a real, obviously, like, gear shift. Because I hadn't worked. I say that in inverted commas, because I have been working. You haven't done any paid work? No, I haven't had a paid kind of job, like an employment job, since I left teaching. so it's been a real kind of really interesting gear shift to go back into I'm going to work I've got something I have to do it's been really lovely from a very kind of selfish again in inverted commas to have things in the calendar that are mine yeah that can't be moved because their work yeah has it changed the dynamic at home it has in that we're both kind of it's that assumption has been taken out of it that we can't just assume now that Rob can put anything in the diary that needs to be put in because I might have something on and that wasn't there before and that's and that I want to hold on to so whatever I do after the book you need to be putting a lot of meetings in the diary in the diary whether they're real or not they could be real to be in there we don't know they're not yeah so it's been that's been a really interesting gear shift just having a kind of more equitable sense of oh no this has to go in and this has to be not respected because he did respect it before I don't want to make anyone think that Rob didn't respect my time or what I was doing he really did I just didn't and I think that's important to note I didn't respect it Rob did and actually I think writing the book and going back over it has made me kind of value what I did a lot more.

37:11I think that's so important and it's so important for everyone to hear. I always ask the same question at the end, which is if you could give one gift to all the mothers in the world, what would it be and why? Let the guilt go. And whatever that guilt looks like for you, whether it's that your child's eaten from pouches for the last week instead of something that you've lovingly blended and cooked and steamed yourself, let it go. whether it's you feel bad because you need to have a little bit of time off and you needed to go out for an evening so you had to ask your partner to stay in that's not selfish let it go whether in whatever capacity letting go of that guilt looks like for you and that will vary for everyone depending your situation what age your kid is what you're doing just let it go because it is pointless and the only person that feels bad is you so let it go it's pointless and if you can't let it go pretend to yeah fake it just just fake it yeah i say about sitting with it just sit with it if you feel selfish fine sit with it because it will pass and if it doesn't pass it might get small enough that you can ignore it such good advice i love it and the book is out in feb yep february 12th out today actually yes out today it is out today please go and buy one i'd be very grateful even if for just the cheat sheet i think it's a great gift as well thank you yeah buy it for the default in your life yeah so that you can say you understand it's like i see you i see you and if you know if you're wondering at home am i the default parent if you're wondering you're not so maybe buy it and learn what the default in your life has been saving you from so true thank you so much thank you for having me

38:55that was the episode i hoped you loved it if you did please make sure you subscribe and i will see you next time