In short
The 1991 poisoning and death of Wilkes-Barre electrician Bobby Curley from extreme thallium toxicity, initially misdiagnosed as Guillain-Barré syndrome, later reconstructed as months-long poisoning via Bobby’s thermos and a final dose in a hospital soda cup; investigation ultimately leads to his wife Joanne Curley’s arrest and guilty plea.
Guest backgrounds
No guests are mentioned; this is a podcast-exclusive story episode.
Key claims
Thallium was highly regulated and “banned” in household products, making accidental exposure unlikely. A new toxicology method (hair chemical markers) established multiple poisoning dates from Oct 1990 to Sept 1991, ruling out co-workers and Bobby’s brother David. Joanne had motive tied to wrongful-death settlement money and life insurance.
Notable examples
A prank “thallium wiping rag” note in the chemistry lab; traces found on the lid ridges of Bobby’s thermos; Joanne’s “iced tea leftover” explanation; Bobby’s final hospital coma and death after life support removal.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOThe Life of Bobby Curley
1:59 to 2:10
Story of Bobby Curley, his family, and the anticipation of a court settlement.
“That's why USAA makes it easy to keep all your coverages in one place.”
The Life of Bobby Curley
2:16 to 2:26
Story of Bobby Curley, his family, and the anticipation of a court settlement.
“Membership eligibility and product restrictions apply and are subject to change.”
The Life of Bobby Curley
2:36 to 4:28
Story of Bobby Curley, his family, and the anticipation of a court settlement.
“stood in his recently renovated kitchen in the city of Wilkes-Barre, Pennsylvania.”
Bobby's Work Routine and Challenges
4:28 to 6:41
Bobby's daily work routine as an electrician and the challenges he faces.
“you know, punch the clock and keep earning money for the family.”
The Unusual Incident at Work
6:41 to 8:43
An incident involving a prank at work and Bobby's growing illness.
“ladder inside of that chemistry lab, running electrical wires above the ceiling panels.”
Declining Health and Hospital Visit
8:43 to 11:20
Bobby's health deteriorates leading to a hospital visit and diagnosis.
“He just pushed the sickness feeling he was having out of his mind.”
Bobby's Recovery and New Symptoms
11:20 to 12:43
Bobby's initial recovery from Guillain-Barre syndrome and new symptoms.
“which came and took Bobby to a nearby hospital.”
Bobby's Recovery and New Symptoms
12:51 to 13:27
Bobby's initial recovery from Guillain-Barre syndrome and new symptoms.
“All you have to do is sign up to get your$25 bonus.”
Bobby's Recovery and New Symptoms
13:30 to 14:57
Bobby's initial recovery from Guillain-Barre syndrome and new symptoms.
“That's fanduel.com slash predicts to get your$25 bonus.”
Bobby's Mysterious Illness
15:05 to 21:08
Follow Bobby's troubling medical journey and the baffling symptoms he faced.
“On September 7th, so now a week and a half after Bobby came back from the hospital, well, he was back there again.”
Show all 21 chapters
Investigating Thallium Poisoning
21:09 to 23:39
Explore the investigation into Bobby's death and the discovery of thallium poisoning.
“by a single massive dose of thallium, whether accidentally or on purpose, they didn't know.”
Family Suspicion and Relationships
23:40 to 27:06
Delve into family dynamics and suspicions surrounding Bobby's wife Joanne.
“Granted, it was on a near microscopic level because any amount of exposure could actually be lethal and those two were okay, so obviously they had not received a lethal dose.”
Family Suspicion and Relationships
27:17 to 28:09
Delve into family dynamics and suspicions surrounding Bobby's wife Joanne.
“Everybody learns a language for different reasons.”
Family Suspicion and Relationships
28:19 to 29:19
Delve into family dynamics and suspicions surrounding Bobby's wife Joanne.
“Summer is a great opportunity for kids to review challenging concepts, strengthen core skills, and head into the start of the school year feeling more prepared.”
Detective Cawley's Investigation Deepens
38:47 to 41:46
Follow Detective Cawley as he revisits Bobby's case and explores suspects.
“Seven months later, in late May of 1992, Detective Cawley sat at his desk, thumbing through the notes from all the interviews and polygraph tests that he and his team had carried out since the previous October.”
A New Hope in the Case
41:46 to 42:00
Detective Cawley seeks new forensic tests to solve Bobby's death.
“Which was heartbreaking because earlier that day, he'd been informed that the district attorney had decided to actually shut down the investigation into Bobby's death.”
The Investigation into Bobby's Death
42:00 to 48:01
Learn about the circumstances surrounding Bobby's mysterious death and the investigation that followed.
“all he could do was close the case file and stick it in a drawer.”
Joanne's Arrest and Sentencing
48:01 to 48:34
Discover the aftermath of the investigation leading to Joanne's arrest and her eventual sentencing.
“And the other financial motivation was by killing Bobby, she would also receive the life insurance payout.”
About Our Stories
48:34 to 49:01
Understand the narrative style and creative liberties taken in the podcast's storytelling.
“guilty and so was sentenced to 10 to 20 years in prison.”
About Our Stories
50:38 to 51:11
Understand the narrative style and creative liberties taken in the podcast's storytelling.
“But oftentimes, it's hard to find the right mattress for that deep sleep without trying it in person.”
About Our Stories
51:15 to 51:33
Understand the narrative style and creative liberties taken in the podcast's storytelling.
“Eligible items are in stock and available for free local delivery.”
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:00On the afternoon of September 30th, 1991, an investigator in Wilkes-Barre, Pennsylvania, walked carefully through a college chemistry lab that was also a potential crime scene. The room was a complete mess, with construction debris all over the place and lab equipment strewn across all the countertops. In fact, it was so cluttered that the investigator hardly knew where to begin. But then he noticed something laying on a nearby counter. It was the soiled rag with a handwritten note sitting right next to it. And when he read that note, he was astonished because he realized he could be the next to die.
0:34But before we get into that story, if you're a fan of the strange, dark, and mysterious delivered in story format, then you've come to the right podcast because that's all we do. So if that's of interest to you, please empty the follow buttons mailbox and then restuff it with expired pizza coupons and mysterious credit card offers. Okay, let's get into today's story.
1:16Been sitting on a business idea? My advice? Don't overthink it. Just take that first step and make sure you have the right tool, a robust selling platform like Shopify, to help turn your idea into something real. Shopify checkout takes just one click, so it helps more of your customers finish their purchase. And when they come back, their details are already saved. With Shopify, nothing stands between your idea and a real business. So go make it one. If you're ready to stop putting off your business and start hearing cha-ching, then you're ready for Shopify. Start your free trial at shopify.com slash mrballin today.
1:50You heard that right. Start your free trial today at shopify.com slash mrballin. Again, that's shopify.com slash mrballin. For the military and their families, change is a constant. That's why USAA makes it easy to keep all your coverages in one place. Bundle your USAA auto and renter's insurance together and save big. Visit usaa.com slash bundle auto property to see how much you could save. Multiple product savings do not apply in all states or to all situations. Savings subject to change. Restrictions apply. Membership eligibility and product restrictions apply and are subject to change. USAA means United Services Automobile Association and its affiliates, San Antonio, Texas.
2:35Early on the morning of August 19, 1991, a 32-year-old man named Bobby Curley stood in his recently renovated kitchen in the city of Wilkes-Barre, Pennsylvania. He walked over to his fridge, opened it up, reached inside, and grabbed his bag lunch, along with his thermos, and he was just about to head out the door and go to work, but he stopped and gave his wife Joanne a kiss on the cheek and said he loved her, and then he left for the day. So Bobby and Joanne had been married for a year, and they lived with Joanne's four-year-old daughter, Angela, in a duplex in a working-class neighborhood. Bobby was an electrician, and so he made pretty good money, but the Curleys were by no means rich.
3:14However, Bobby knew that that actually might change soon, because Joanne was on the verge of winning this big court settlement. Joanne had actually been married once before, but her husband had died in a car accident about three years ago. His car had collided with a tractor trailer, and the driver of that tractor trailer was eventually found to be the one at fault. And so now, Joanne's lawyers and the trucking company's lawyers were finally closing in on a financial settlement to compensate Joanne for her first husband's wrongful death. It had been a really stressful process, and Bobby had definitely noticed that Joanne had been more sullen and stressed than usual as they were going through it.
3:52But now that the case was finally wrapping up, Joanne did appear to be sort of back in good spirits. And, you know, while nothing was official yet, it looked like they were going to receive approximately a million dollars in compensation, which was obviously really exciting. In fact, the two of them were already mapping out how they might spend some of this money. Some of the ideas they'd come up with included taking Angela on a few big trips and also maybe using some of that money to finally fund Bobby having his own business, something he'd always wanted to do but lacked the resources for. But for now, you know, the settlement was not complete, and so Bobby had to go to his normal 9-to-5 and, you know, punch the clock and keep earning money for the family.
4:35So for today, once he was outside, he simply got into his car and made the short drive to his current job site. Ten minutes later, Bobby parked outside of a science building on the campus of Wilkes University, which was a small college in Wilkes-Barre. He saw some of the guys on his crew standing out front, waiting to be let into this building. So Bobby, who was the foreman of their crew, he got out of his car and said good morning to everyone and then walked up and unlocked the doors. Then they all went inside and got to work. And working at this location had really become a pretty big routine for this crew.
5:10Because by now, Bobby and his crew had been coming here, working here, for a few months now. And this job was a really big job. Bobby and his team were helping renovate the entire building, which included all the classrooms, all the laboratories, hallways, everything. And so they still had quite a bit of work to do. But there was another reason this job was taking as long as it was. And that was because when Bobby's crew had first shown up at the building, they had expected it to be totally prepared for them, meaning all furniture and equipment would be cleared out. But instead, they found a ton of stuff just kind of everywhere inside the building, because the building clearly had not been prepped at all.
5:47The chemistry lab, for example, still had random flasks and chemical bottles and, you know, wet rags with weird substances on them just laying around the room. So as a result, Bobby and his crew had been forced to do a ton of cleanup, you know, before they even got into their jobs that they had not planned on, and it really set them back. And so now, just to stay on schedule, they were regularly putting in 12-hour days basically every day they were there. And so all these extra hours had Bobby feeling completely exhausted, and lately, he had sort of felt kind of sick almost, and he just sort of chalked that up to basically overworking.
6:25But Bobby never complained. The overtime pay was great, and he really enjoyed working with these particular guys on this crew. You know, these guys were basically his friends. So normally, the long work days were actually kind of fun, as exhausting and awful as they were. Later that afternoon, Bobby was standing on a ladder inside of that chemistry lab, running electrical wires above the ceiling panels. And as he was doing that, he suddenly heard this loud commotion coming from across the room. Bobby realized what he was hearing were guys on his crew basically shouting and laughing. So he climbed down to see what was going on.
6:59And when he walked over there, he saw that everybody was gathered around one of the members of the crew, whose name was Sammy DePasquale. And Sammy was sort of doubled over, coughing and spitting and holding a Coke can in his hand. Another member of the crew, whose name was Robert Marconi, explained to Bobby when he walked over that somebody had swapped out Sammy's Coke with a different Coke can, one that was filled with chewing tobacco spit instead of soda. Bobby cringed. I mean, this was absolutely disgusting. Even as a prank, this was awful. But it was also sort of par for the course for the guys on Bobby's crew.
7:35This is sort of what they did. They were always playing pranks on each other to kind of lighten the mood on long work days like today. And everybody was laughing, even Sammy, who'd been the butt of the joke. And so eventually, you know, Bobby joined in too. He thought that this was ultimately good for morale, as gross as it was. And after a minute or so, Sammy recovered from his coughing fit from drinking this disgusting liquid and vowed sort of comically to get payback on whoever switched his Coke can. Then after that, all the guys got back to work. And so Bobby, he left the group and went back over to his ladder.
8:08And as he was climbing back up, he paused about halfway because he felt this sudden wave of sickness come over him. It almost felt like he had a flu coming on, which didn't really surprise him because he had been doing all these overtime hours and he really had felt run down as a result of it. And so, again, he's just sort of chalking up the way he feels to overworking. And so as Bobby is standing on this ladder, he kind of told himself, you know, just suck it up. This will pass. And he just stood there on the ladder. And after a minute or two, that sensation of being sick did sort of pass. And then, because he was not a complainer, he was a hardworking guy.
8:43He just pushed the sickness feeling he was having out of his mind. He climbed back up and got back to doing his wiring.
8:54But four days later, on the morning of Friday, August 23rd, Bobby felt worse than ever. As he made his way across the college parking lot towards the science building where his crew was still working, he felt like his feet were heavy and he was constantly short of breath. And then as the workday went on, you know, continuing to run wires in that chem lab, Bobby got really sweaty and really hot. His co-workers noticed and kept coming up to him to ask if he needed to go home early. But even though Bobby totally did need to go home early and felt awful, he would just tell them, nope, he was just fine.
9:29And so Bobby would manage to get through that particular workday. But then at the end of the day, when it was time to go home, Bobby felt so relieved. He could not wait to just get home, crawl into bed, and sleep. But by the next morning, Saturday morning, that heavy feeling in Bobby's feet had turned into this really intense burning pain that actually went all the way up his legs. And then his hands went numb. At this point, Bobby had to admit to himself that this was not a symptom of overworking. He was sick, like something was wrong with him. So he went to his doctor. But the doctor told him that despite what he was feeling, the symptoms were not that serious.
10:12Like it didn't appear that something was seriously wrong with him. And so ultimately, he just told Bobby to, you know, go home and get more rest. That's what you need right now. So that's exactly what Bobby did. For the rest of that Saturday and all day the next day Sunday, Bobby didn't do anything except lay in bed. But by that Sunday evening, Bobby still felt horrible. So he picked up the phone and did something that Bobby basically never did. He called one of his co-workers and told them that unfortunately, he would not be able to come to work tomorrow. When Bobby woke up the next morning on Monday morning, the day he had taken off from work, he was in so much pain that he couldn't even stand up on his own.
10:52His wife, Joanne, tried to help him get out of bed and go to the bathroom, but he was physically too heavy for her to lift. And so Joanne actually ended up calling Bobby's brother, David, to come over the house and help. But even with David there, who could now basically help move Bobby around the house, it was very clear to Bobby that whatever was happening to him was not some minor issue. Like, this was serious. And it clearly was not going away with rest like the doctor had said it would. And so at some point that day, the family called an ambulance, which came and took Bobby to a nearby hospital.
11:26But by the time they got there, the pain in Bobby's legs had gotten so bad that Bobby was literally periodically screaming in pain, and he also had begun to vomit. But after several hours of non-stop pain and non-stop testing at the hospital, the hospital doctors came into Bobby's room and they told him and his family that they actually had good news. They knew what was wrong with Bobby, and it was treatable. They diagnosed him was something called Guillain-Barre syndrome, which is a condition where the body's immune system attacks the nerves and causes tingling in the feet and hands. But the staff assured Bobby that all he needed was a very specific medication, and then he would feel a whole lot better.
12:10Bobby was incredibly relieved, as was his family, and that day he began taking the medication, and quickly his pain became tolerable, he stopped vomiting, and before long he actually felt good enough that he was able to go home. It seemed like Bobby had really turned a corner here and that everything really was going to be okay. But within just a few days of being back home again, Bobby's pain came back even worse than before despite still taking this medication, and he also began experiencing a new symptom. His hair started falling out.
12:50You can predict the Summer Soccer Showcase action all the way to the final match with FanDuel Predicts. All you have to do is sign up to get your$25 bonus. I didn't expect FanDuel Predicts to change how I watch these matches, but it really does. It's easy to use, and once you've made your predictions, you start paying a lot more attention to big moments throughout the tournament. Instead of just, you know, kind of casually checking scores along the way, you find yourself following along the entire time to see how everything plays out, which just makes watching way more fun. Sign up now for your$25 bonus on FanDuel Predicts.
13:27Go to fanduel.com slash predicts to sign up. That's fanduel.com slash predicts to get your$25 bonus. Offered by FanDuel Prediction Markets, LLC, a registered futures commission merchant, 18 +, bonus is non-withdrawable and expires seven days after receipt. Trading derivatives involve significant risk and may not be suitable for all investors. Manage your activity with their consumer protection tools. Restrictions apply. See terms at fanduel.com slash predicts slash bonus dash offer dash terms. Getting paid twice a month does not mean money is scarce. It just feels that way. That feeling makes you do weird stuff like putting things on a card you didn't need to.
14:06Earning removes that feeling. With Earning, you can access up to$150 per day of money you have already earned, plus up to$1 ,000 between paychecks. Standard transfers take one to two business days with no mandatory fees, and expedited transfers start at$399 and cap at$599. 5 million people are already on it, and honestly, it's wild it didn't exist sooner. Download Earning on the App Store or Google Play. Spelled like earning money without the G. Type in Mr. Ball and Podcasts Strange, Dark, and Mysterious Stories under Podcast when you sign up. It'll really help the show. Earning is a financial technology company, not a bank.
14:43Access limits are based on your earnings and risk factors. Standard cash outs take one to two business days with no mandatory fees. Expedited transfers available for a fee. Tips are voluntary and don't affect the service. Available in select states, terms and restrictions apply. Visit Earning.com for full details.
15:05On September 7th, so now a week and a half after Bobby came back from the hospital, well, he was back there again. And to Bobby's horror, this time, his doctors actually seemed kind of baffled by his symptoms. They told him that sudden extreme hair loss was definitely not a symptom of Guillain-Barre syndrome. So they told Bobby that it seemed like their initial diagnosis must have been wrong, despite the fact that the medication they gave him to treat, GBS, had helped him for a little while. And so the problem now was the doctors were basically at a total loss as to how to help Bobby. They really didn't know what was going on.
15:43And so for the next nine days, doctors ran test after test on Bobby, and all the while, Bobby's pain intensified so much and became so constant that he basically fell into this almost delirious state, like the pain was completely too much. And then eventually, all these doctors who ran all these tests came back to Bobby and his family, and they just told them that we don't know what's wrong. Like all these tests did not provide any clarity, and so basically we can't help you. And they told Bobby that now the only choice was he needed to be transferred to a bigger, more specialized medical facility in Hershey, Pennsylvania, which was about 100 miles away from Wilkes-Barre.
16:25A few days later, a neurologist named Dr. Robert Brennan walked down the hallway of the bigger hospital in Hershey, Pennsylvania. He was heading to the room where his patient, Bobby Curley, was staying. And even from several yards down the hallway, Dr. Brennan could already hear Bobby screaming and cursing at the nurses. Ever since Bobby had arrived at this hospital, his behavior had gotten more and more unhinged. At one point, Bobby had even thrown medical equipment across the room. And so now Dr. Brennan had to keep Bobby physically restrained to his bed. And so Dr. Brennan, when he reached Bobby's room, took a deep breath out in the hallway, and then into the room he walked.
17:04And inside, he saw Bobby strapped down to the bed, and he was screaming and thrashing around violently. And Dr. Brennan found himself just feeling awful about it. I mean, he felt really bad for Bobby. But really, he didn't know what to do for Bobby. He and his staff had tried basically everything they could think of to try to treat Bobby's pain, but nothing had worked. And so, on this day, Dr. Brennan couldn't do anything except what he normally did, which was just stand in Bobby's room sort of helplessly as Bobby screamed and flailed in pain. But on September 22nd, so six days after Bobby arrived in Hershey, he finally fell silent, because on that day, he slipped into a coma.
17:50Three days later, Dr. Brennan felt very defeated as he stepped into Bobby's hospital room. There, he saw five members of Bobby's family. His wife, Joanne, his four-year-old stepdaughter, Angela, Bobby's adult siblings, Susan and David, and Bobby's elderly mother, Mary. They'd all come to be with Bobby after he had fallen into this coma. Now, they looked up at Dr. Brennan expectantly. And Dr. Brennan, he took a deep breath, and he said he had some bad news. New test results had come back. And now, based on those results, they knew what was wrong with Bobby. Dr. Brennan told the family that what Bobby was suffering from was something called thallium toxicity.
18:30And when he said this, Dr. Brennan watched the family for some kind of a reaction. But the family just stared blankly at him like they had no idea what that meant. So Dr. Brennan went on and explained that thallium is an extremely toxic chemical. In fact, it can kill anyone who touches it, ingests it, or even just inhales its fumes. And he told them that, you know, this is really unusual because thallium is highly controlled in the United States. It's actually banned in household products. So this is not a chemical that, you know, Bobby just could have accidentally stumbled upon. This is pretty rare.
19:06And so at this point, Dr. Brennan just paused and let the family sit with this new information. And the family, I mean, they looked at each other like, wow, this is awful, but nobody knew how to react. They just kind of looked back at the doctor, waiting for him to explain more. But when the doctor didn't say anything, Bobby's sister, Susan, just asked in a quavering voice, you know, what can we do? At that point, Dr. Brennan just shook his head and said, unfortunately, there's no cure for thallium poisoning. Two days later, on September 27th, Joanne stood next to her unconscious husband in the hospital, and she nodded at the medical staff that was gathered all around him.
19:44It was ultimately Joanne's decision whether or not to keep Bobby on life support. But with no hope of a cure, Joanne had ultimately decided that the best thing to do was to take him off life support. And so after giving the signal to medical staff, Joanne, her daughter, and the rest of Bobby's family, that kind of stepped back from the bed, and they watched as the staff walked over and removed Bobby's ventilator. And then Joanne had to watch as her husband took his final breath.
20:19On the evening of October 21st, 1991, so about a month after Bobby died from thallium poisoning, a police detective named Harold Colley sat at a big table with seven other men inside of a steakhouse in Wilkes-Barre, Pennsylvania. The other men were a mixture of coroners and investigators from all across Pennsylvania. Some were from the Hershey area, where Bobby had died. The rest, like Collie, worked for the police in Wilkes-Barre, where Bobby had lived. The men were there discussing the investigation into Bobby's death, and they had been doing this for the past three hours already, because there really was so much to talk about.
20:56They had already covered Bobby's initial autopsy results, which showed that he had a staggering 900 times the lethal limit of thallium in his system when he died. And so they were working under the assumption that Bobby must have been poisoned by a single massive dose of thallium, whether accidentally or on purpose, they didn't know. And so they discussed theories for how this could have even happened to him. Because remember, thallium is not just a chemical you can get from the store. I mean, this is something that is highly regulated. So how did he come in contact with it? Their first thought had been basically what everybody else suspected, which was, you know, Bobby must have been accidentally poisoned at the Wilkes University chemistry lab where he'd been working for so many months.
21:41And they actually had a bunch of records from a preliminary examination of the lab. And according to these records, one of the first things investigators had found inside of that lab was five vials of thallium in one of the storerooms. They'd also found a rag that was laying out on a countertop that presumably was there when Bobby first arrived and he and his crew began cleaning everything up. And next to this rag was a handwritten note that had a warning on it that literally said, thallium wiping rag, touch me and die. The rag had actually caused a huge amount of panic amongst the investigators when they had gone in to begin sweeping the lab for signs of thallium, because people were fearful that maybe they'd brushed up against it and touched this rag and were they going to get thallium poisoning.
22:29However, they actually tested the rag and it came back negative for thallium, as did all the surfaces in the lab and also the air in the lab. And so the investigators had finally decided that that note must have been a joke or something. Also, the university insisted that all of its thallium was accounted for, meaning none of it could have been, stolen or misused in some way to poison Bobby because they would know about it. And so at this point, the university had actually been sort of ruled out as where Bobby got poisoned, which really didn't make sense to Detective Cauley or the other investigators at this dinner.
23:06Because again, thallium is hard to come by. The idea that Bobby was working in a lab that contained thallium, but that wasn't where he was poisoned by thallium, seemed almost impossible. It had to have happened there. But they had gone out and tested all of Bobby's co-workers who had also worked in that lab with Bobby for so many days and so many hours, and they all came back negative for thallium exposure. However, Bobby's own family, his wife Joanne and her four-year-old daughter Angela, they had tested positive for thallium exposure. Granted, it was on a near microscopic level because any amount of exposure could actually be lethal and those two were okay, so obviously they had not received a lethal dose.
23:52But there were very small traces of thallium in both of them, which was odd. And so everybody at the table agreed that the right thing to do here was to speak to Joanne and see if maybe she had some ideas of how she and her daughter and obviously Bobby could have maybe come in contact with this very rare and lethal chemical. And then also, they need to get inside of the family's duplex to search it, literally, for thallium. But first, there was the problem of jurisdiction. Bobby had died in Hershey, but he'd gotten sick in Wilkes-Barre. So, after some discussion, the men decided that the Wilkes-Barre police should be the ones to head up the case because that is where Bobby actually got poisoned.
24:32The next day, Detective Collie invited Bobby's siblings, David and Suzanne, to the Wilkes-Barre police station. And right away, it was quite clear that both of them were very suspicious of Bobby's wife, Joanne. They told Collie that Joanne had been acting really strange for months, both before and also after Bobby's death. David said when his brother had first gotten sick, Joanne had barely lifted a finger to help him. She'd called David to come over and look after Bobby, acting like she needed somebody strong enough to move Bobby around, which was true. But while David was upstairs literally carrying Bobby to and from the bathroom, Joanne stayed downstairs with her daughter and totally ignored them.
Read the full transcript
25:15She didn't even pretend to want to help. She basically let David do all of it. And Susan said, even though she didn't know for sure, her impression of Joanne right after she had taken Bobby off life support and he's died. Her impression of Joanne was she was hugely relieved. Collie listened and nodded and sort of gave the impression that he was following along and basically believed them. But inside, he wasn't really convinced that what they were describing was highly suspicious behavior. When David came over to help Bobby, I mean, that was because she had asked him to do that after trying at first, unsuccessfully, to move her husband around.
25:52And then when David was there, I mean, you know, she does have a four-year-old daughter. She can't just leave her unsupervised. Or maybe she doesn't want her daughter to see Bobby, and so she has to keep her downstairs. So there's like an explanation for that. And as for Joanne being relieved after her husband's death, you know, everybody dealt with grief differently. And Bobby's death had been a really traumatic, drawn-out process for everybody involved. So maybe she was relieved, but not because she was happy about it. It could have just been the end of a nightmare chapter in all of their lives.
26:24And so after he had listened to their concerns, Colley began to redirect the conversation, and he began asking David and Susan about their relationship with Bobby. They both said they were very close with their brother, even as adults. They said they lived nearby, and they saw each other quite a bit. David in particular said he spent a lot of time with Bobby. He said they often went fishing, and recently, together, they had renovated Bobby's kitchen. And this caught Collie's attention, because it sounded like David and Bobby had finished this renovation project around the same time that Bobby first got sick.
26:59Collie didn't know if this was relevant or not, but it was interesting. So at the end of their discussion, he just thanked David and Susan for all the information and told them they were free to go.
27:17Everybody learns a language for different reasons. Maybe you just want to watch K-dramas without subtitles. Or you want to talk with family members, but in their native language. Your life is unique, so your language learning should be too. I remember trying to learn a new language before a trip, and most of the systems that I tried felt pretty generic. But with Rosetta Stone, it was completely different. It adjusted to how I was learning, so it felt more like I was actually preparing to use this language, not just learning how to regurgitate it. Rosetta Stone Sapphire is designed for personalized learning, helping you go beyond generic lessons and focus on the topics that matter most to you.
27:53If you want to take your language skills to the next level, don't wait to try Rosetta Stone Sapphire. Mr. Ball and podcast listeners can get 20 % off their Rosetta Stone Sapphire subscription when they sign up today. You'll get unlimited access to all 25 Rosetta Stone languages, plus all the new Sapphire learning tools. Visit rosettastone.com slash mrballin to redeem your 20 % off. Again, go to rosettastone.com slash mrballin and start learning a language for real. Summer is a great opportunity for kids to review challenging concepts, strengthen core skills, and head into the start of the school year feeling more prepared.
28:27And this is where IXL can help. A couple of things that I like about IXL is that it's really easy to fit into my kids' busy summer schedules, and the instant feedback helps them understand what they missed instead of just moving on. My kids also like how engaging it is, which makes a big difference because they actually want to use it instead of it feeling like just another assignment. IXL is an award-winning online learning platform that helps kids truly understand what they're learning. IXL is used in 96 of the top 100 school districts in the U.S. and studies show kids who use IXL score higher on tests proven in all 50 states.
29:05Make an impact on your child's learning. Get IXL now. And Mr. Ballin Podcast's Strange, Dark, and Mysterious Stories listeners can get an exclusive 20 % off IXL membership when they sign up today at IXL.com slash Mr. Ballin. Visit ixl.com slash Mr. Ballin to get the most effective learning program out there at the best price.
29:32A few days later, on the morning of October 25th, 1991, Detective Cawley and three other investigators sat at an interrogation table in the Wilkes-Barre Police Station, right across from Joanne Curley and the lawyer that she had brought along with her. Collie didn't know what to make of Joanne yet. Obviously, she and her daughter had also been exposed to thallium. So that could mean that they too accidentally were exposed to this chemical, same as Bobby, but obviously on a much smaller scale because they lived. Or they could have also been the target of somebody trying to poison this family, and ultimately just Bobby was killed from this poisoning.
30:10Or Joanne could be the poisoner. She could have poisoned her own husband. I mean, you know, Bobby's siblings are talking about how awful Joanne was acting towards her husband in the wake of his illness. You know, maybe she poisoned him. And in doing so, she accidentally exposed herself and her daughter. Basically, Collie couldn't tell yet if Joanne was a victim or a perpetrator. So he made sure to watch her very carefully while another investigator began asking her to explain how and when her husband first got sick. Joanne said that Bobby had been complaining about feeling pretty run down for what felt like weeks or maybe even months.
30:48But he hadn't had any major symptoms until a week before his hospitalization in August. And she said that much like Bobby, she had just kind of chalked it up to he had been overworking or maybe he had some standard illness that would just go away with rest like that first doctor had said. She said that she had never even heard of thallium and really at no point had it ever crossed her mind that maybe Bobby had been poisoned by thallium. As Collie listened to Joanne tell this story, he was struck by a couple of things. First of all, Joanne said Bobby had been feeling pretty run down for a while before his death.
31:23This seemed to conflict with investigators' assumption that a single massive dose of thallium had sent Bobby to the hospital and ultimately killed him. It seemed more likely, based on what Joanne said, that this poisoning happened over a period of time. And the second thing Collie was struck by was actually just Joanne's general demeanor. She had just recounted in detail, you know, the story of her husband dying, this awful, awful death, phallium poisoning is a horrible way to die. And as she's describing it, she's not shedding a single tear or really acting at all like she's even upset about it.
31:58And so at this point, Collie was beginning to wonder if maybe Susan and David had been right about Joanne. She really did not seem to care much about her husband's death. And so what Collie did is he stopped the other investigator and he leaned forward and he just asked Joanne point blank, how do you explain how you and your daughter were exposed to thallium? And immediately, Joanne had a story, a bizarre one. She said Bobby really liked to drink iced tea when he was at work. So every morning, she would fill his thermos up from this big pitcher of pre-made iced tea that she kept in their fridge.
32:34And so Bobby would take that thermos with him to work and he would drink the tea all day and then come home with the thermos. And some days when he would come back, Bobby had not drank all the iced tea. There'd be some left inside the thermos. And so Joanne said what she would do in that case was she would take the remaining iced tea still in the thermos and she would pour it back into the pitcher in the fridge, basically to salvage what was left of the tea. And she said she and her daughter also drank from that pitcher. So in essence, she sometimes was drinking from the same tea that Bobby was drinking from directly.
33:12And so perhaps in that way, if he was being exposed to thallium, maybe it was getting into that tea that he was bringing home. And, you know, she believed that maybe that was how she was being exposed, by drinking the leftover iced tea. Collie glanced over at the other investigators in the room, and they all looked as baffled as he was. This iced tea explanation was pretty out there, but it was so weirdly specific that they really couldn't write it off. And Colley knew that, you know, if the iced tea theory was legitimate, it might be able to explain why all three people in this family, all living in the same place, had such drastically different levels of exposure.
33:50Basically, Bobby could be having this huge exposure to thallium outside the house, and then basically remnants of the thallium exposure are finding their way back into that leftover tea. So it's a really small amount of thallium. That's coming back home. It's being mixed in inside that pitcher. And so when Joanne and her daughter are drinking from that pitcher, you know, they're only getting a very small amount of thallium. And so again, it's out there, but it would explain it. So Collie asked Joanne if he had her permission to not just search her whole duplex to check for thallium, but specifically check her fridge, check her pitcher, her iced tea pitcher, and all the thermoses that Bobby brought to work to see if there was still trace levels of thallium inside of them.
34:34And he was worried when he asked her this question that she might refuse or give some reason that she couldn't, but Joanne immediately agreed without any hesitation. That same afternoon, Collie, his investigators, and a crime scene unit arrived at the Curley's duplex to begin their search. Cauley looked on as the crime scene unit entered the duplex and immediately began scouring every surface. And they found absolutely no trace of thallium anywhere in the house, except for in one very specific location. The thermos Joanne had already told them about, the one that Bobby would bring with the iced tea in it to work and then back again.
35:12Traces of thallium were found on the little ridges at the top of the thermos, where the lid screwed back on. And this was huge, not only because now they had the first clear sign of exactly where the thallium was coming in and out of Bobby's life, but more specifically, because it was at the top of this cup that obviously Bobby is drinking from, this showed that the way the thallium wound up in Bobby's system was because he ingested it. That was something they didn't know at this point. Now it seems very clear that's how it happened. But despite this revelation, it didn't explain how Joanne and Angela were also exposed.
35:50Because when they tested the big pitcher of iced tea in the fridge, it didn't contain any thallium. And also, just finding the thallium at the top of the thermos didn't explain how it actually got there. But for Colley, what really stood out about finding thallium on this thermos was that this item, this thermos, is something Bobby took to work and home every single day. So it seemed like maybe, you know, Collie and his staff had been too quick to rule out where Bobby was working. I mean, he was working in a chemical lab that contained thallium, and they had ruled that out as the place where he could have been poisoned.
36:28Now, it seemed like they needed to take another look.
36:38Pet parent guilt isn't something that's talked about much, but it's a feeling we all know well. When daily life gets in the way, it can feel impossible to measure up to our beloved pet's unconditional love. Traveling for work is never the hard part. Leaving behind my six cats and three dogs is. My daily routine goes from loud and chaotic to way too quiet. But one thing I never compromise on is their health and nutrition. Every one of them is on Hills Pet Nutrition, so I know they're getting exactly what they need to stay happy and strong. And so even when I'm away, missing all the barking, the purring, the non-stop attention, I still have peace of mind.
37:14Because they're not just pets, they're family. But you're doing better than you think you are, and Hills Pet Nutrition is here to help make this whole pet parenting thing easier with science-led nutrition to support their unique needs and lifelong health. You can feel confident that you're doing right by your pet and taking care of them with guilt-free meals they can't get enough of. Because you're only human, there's Hills. Science does more. Ready to give more love than humanly possible? Find your pet's new favorite food at hillspet.com slash ballin. That's hillspet.com slash ballin. We all have our own time-saving hacks for everyday life, and I'm always looking for little ways to save time.
37:51Whether it's just ordering things online instead of making another trip to the store, or taking care of a few small tasks while I'm already waiting on something else. Those little time savers add up pretty quickly. But if you're a business owner, how can you save time hiring? ZipRecruiter. ZipRecruiter has a new feature that quickly lets you see the most interested, qualified candidates first, so you save time by meeting the right people faster. And right now, you can try it for free at ziprecruiter.com slash ballin. Their powerful matching technology finds qualified candidates quickly, and these candidates can tell you in their own words why they're interested in your job.
38:30No wonder ZipRecruiter is the number one rated hiring site based on G2. Save time and meet great candidates sooner with ZipRecruiter. Four out of five employers who post on ZipRecruiter get a quality candidate within the first day. Try it for free at ZipRecruiter.com slash ballin. That's ZipRecruiter.com slash ballin. Meet your match on ZipRecruiter.
38:56Seven months later, in late May of 1992, Detective Cawley sat at his desk, thumbing through the notes from all the interviews and polygraph tests that he and his team had carried out since the previous October. One by one, they had brought in all of Bobby's co-workers and grilled them about Bobby's death. And all of the co-workers had more or less said the same thing. Bobby was well-liked, and nobody they knew would want to harm him. Some of the co-workers did admit that they did like to prank each other a lot, but they said the pranks had always been, you know, pretty harmless, and spiking somebody's drinks with chemicals was way, way beyond anything they ever did.
39:34At least, that's what all of them said. But two of Bobby's co-workers, Sammy De Pasquale and Robert Marconi, had failed their polygraph exams. In fact, the polygraph examiner said those two had literally gotten the worst scores he had ever seen. So very quickly, those two shot to the top of Collie's suspect list. And so Collie had pressed both of them about whether or not they had pranked Bobby by putting thallium into his thermos. Maybe they didn't know how dangerous thallium was, but did they put something in his thermos? And they said, absolutely not. They didn't do that. But Collie didn't believe them, because he'd already heard about previous pranks that involved swapping out co-workers' drinks for things like tobacco spit.
40:18So what's to say they didn't put thallium in Bobby's thermos? It just sort of tracked. The problem was, Colley didn't have any actual evidence that he could use to arrest either of them, especially since the university continued to insist that none of their thallium was missing from the lab. Now, Colley knew it was possible the university was wrong, that maybe there was unaccounted for thallium, but he had no way to prove that. Collie also felt pretty suspicious of Joanne and also Bobby's own brother, David. You know, Joanne, for obvious reasons, was still suspicious. She had thallium in her system, she seemed oddly detached from Bobby when he was dying, you know, kind of letting other people take care of him, and apparently was relieved when he was taken off life support.
41:03But even if Joanne had wanted to poison Bobby, it was really unclear how she would have gotten her hands on thallium. And then as for David, the reason he was sort of suspicious to Collie is because he spent a lot of time with Bobby. And he also did that kitchen renovation with him. And so there's all these moments where he's alone potentially handling chemicals with Bobby before he got sick. So basically, David had the opportunity to poison Bobby, but there really was no motive. And just like with Joanne, Collie felt like, you know, where would David get the thallium? That was the big question.
41:38Where is the thallium coming from? And so at this point, Detective Cawley was basically at a dead end and just did not know how to take this case. Which was heartbreaking because earlier that day, he'd been informed that the district attorney had decided to actually shut down the investigation into Bobby's death. The case was officially cold. And so since Cawley could not revive it, all he could do was close the case file and stick it in a drawer.
42:07One morning in August of 1994, so more than two years after the investigation into Bobby's death was shut down, Detective Cawley walked up the porch steps of the duplex where Bobby had lived, and he knocked on the door. Cawley had been thinking a lot about this case recently, and today he was hoping that Bobby's widow, Joanne, would help him take one last shot at cracking it. A moment later, Joanne answered the door, and once the look of surprise left her face, she invited the detective inside. Collie quickly explained to her that the reason he was here is because there had been this technological breakthrough in toxicology testing.
42:43The Wilkes-Barre police were now able to perform a new type of test that had not been available to them three years ago when her husband had died. And Collie believed that, you know, this information they could get would help them figure out what actually happened to Bobby once and for all. Joanne's eyes lit up at this news, and she was about to open her mouth to reply, But Colley quickly added there was actually a catch. He said in order to do these tests, they would have to exhume Bobby's body. And the only person who could give investigators permission to do that was Joanne. Colley waited while Joanne processed everything she had just been told.
43:20He tried not to let it show on his face. But Joanne's response to this would basically decide the entire fate of this case. If she said no, there really was nothing they could do. The evidence contained inside of Bobby's casket would be lost to them forever, which meant if somebody had intentionally poisoned Bobby, they would never figure out who it was, and so the killer would never be brought to justice. But unsurprisingly, Joanne said yes, of course. Later that month, on August 23rd, Colley went to the cemetery where Bobby was buried, and he watched as a backhoe dug up his grave and pulled his casket out of the ground.
43:56The police and coroner then took custody of Bobby's body, and they would go on to perform these new toxicology tests. And when the results came in, they gave Cauley the exact information he had hoped for.
44:13Based on the police investigation and critically, those new toxicology tests, here is a reconstruction of what police believe happened to Bobby Curley.
44:29The first time the killer slipped thallium into Bobby's thermos, Bobby was busy working in another room and didn't notice, which was exactly what the killer wanted. The killer did not hate Bobby. In fact, they really hadn't wanted to kill him until he had started talking about opening up his own business with that settlement money his family was going to get. And the killer just could not let that happen. Because if Bobby went into business for himself, he would ruin everything. The killer believed that by poisoning Bobby one time, that that would kill him, and then all their problems would be solved.
45:04But the next day, Bobby actually seemed fine, sort of unfazed by the poison. So the next time the killer got the chance, they added a little more poison to Bobby's thermos. And when Bobby again stayed healthy the next day, well, the killer just added a little bit more the next time, and they just kept on doing that. They were afraid that if they added too much at once, Bobby might notice and then they would get caught. So for months, Bobby was being poisoned, but didn't really show any significant symptoms. But finally, in August of 1991, Bobby started showing really severe symptoms. Remember, his legs were in extreme pain, his hands were going numb.
45:43And when he called in sick to work on that Monday, that was when the killer knew they were certain they had finished him off. Except they hadn't finished him off. Because when he went to the hospital, Bobby just continued to cling to life. So the killer actually went to visit Bobby in the hospital. And while Bobby was sleeping, the killer slipped a final massive amount of the poison into a soda cup that Bobby kept by his bedside. And when Bobby woke up, the killer kind of casually encouraged him to drink the soda. And Bobby did so without any hesitation because Bobby had no reason not to trust the killer.
46:21Because the killer was his own wife, Joanne Curley. She had actually started poisoning him almost a year before she actually murdered him. But investigators didn't realize this until a new type of toxicology test allowed them to figure out exactly when Bobby was being poisoned. This test worked by analyzing some of the hairs that Bobby still had left on his body. Basically, every time Bobby was poisoned, a chemical marker was left behind in his hair. So as his hair grew out, the strands sort of became timelines that showed exactly when he had been poisoned. And when Colley, through these tests, discovered that Bobby had been poisoned multiple times between October 1990 and September of 1991, these dates ruled out Bobby's co-workers and his brother David.
47:15The poisoning had simply started too early for David to be responsible and went on far too long for his co-workers to be guilty. But the timeline clearly ruled in Joanne. And when police began digging into why Joanne might have wanted to kill her husband, they realized she'd convinced Bobby to make her the beneficiary of his life insurance policy just days before poisoning him for the very first time. And so Joanne's motive was money. She did not want Bobby to have any of that financial windfall she was going to get from the death of her earlier husband, the wrongful death lawsuit, where she was going to get a million dollars.
47:53Even though she kind of acted like, you know, yeah, Bobby's going to use some of that to start his business. She didn't want that. She did not want him to have any of it. That was her money. So that was one motivation financially. And the other financial motivation was by killing Bobby, she would also receive the life insurance payout. As for where Joanne actually got the thallium, she would admit that she had used an old container of rat poison that did contain thallium that was manufactured in the U.S. before thallium was banned in household products. On December 12, 1996, five years after Bobby's death, Joanne was finally arrested and charged with first-degree murder.
48:33Joanne ultimately pled guilty and so was sentenced to 10 to 20 years in prison. She would wind up serving all 20 years and was released from prison in 2016.
48:53A quick note about our stories. They are all based on true events, but we sometimes use pseudonyms to protect the people involved, and some details are fictionalized for dramatic purposes.
49:09The Mr. Ballin Podcast, Strange, Dark, and Mysterious Stories, is hosted and executive produced by me, Mr. Ballin. Our head of writing is Evan Allen. Our head of production is Zach Levitt. Produced by Jeremy Bone. This episode was written by Luke Barats. Research and fact-checking by Shelley Hsu, Samantha Van Hoos, Evan Beamer, Abigail Shumway, and Camille Callahan. Research
49:55Thank you for listening to the Mr. Ballin Podcast. If you enjoyed today's story and you want to hear more like it, go ahead and check out our YouTube channel just called Mr. Ballin, where we have hundreds more stories, a lot like this one, but most of them are not available on this podcast. They are only available on that YouTube channel, which again is just called Mr. Ballin. So that's going to do it. I really appreciate your support. Until next time, see ya.
50:37Sleep is so critical, especially that deep, comforting sleep. But oftentimes, it's hard to find the right mattress for that deep sleep without trying it in person. That's why Helix and Steinhoffels have come together, combining their years of mattress knowledge and technology to bring you your best night's sleep. Helix Sleep's award-winning mattresses are now available to try and purchase at 13 Steinhoffel's locations, an in-store opportunity you won't find just anywhere. Plus, Helix and Steinhoffel's are offering 20 % off all mattress orders for our listeners. Please visit helixsleep.com to find your nearest location.
51:14Remember to ask a team member about their selection of award-winning Helix Sleep mattresses. Eligible items are in stock and available for free local delivery. That's helixsleep.com to find the store nearest you and ask about Helix Sleep. With Helix and Steinhoffel's, better sleep starts now. The most memorable gifts aren't found, they're made. Zazzle is a custom marketplace where you pick any product, a mug, a card, a tote, a phone case, and make it personal, a photo, a name, an inside joke, the kind of gift that actually fits the person. That's what 30 million customers have been coming back to Zazzle for over 20 years to find.
51:54Right now, save 25 % on your first order at Zazzle.com. That's Zazzle.com. Make it z-amazing.
From the publisher
On the afternoon of September 30th, 1991, an investigator in Wilkes-Barre, Pennsylvania walked carefully through a college chemistry lab – that was also a potential crime scene. The room was a complete mess, with construction debris all over the place and lab equipment strewn across the countertops. It was so cluttered that the investigator hardly knew where to begin. But then he noticed something laying on a nearby counter – it was a soiled rag with a handwritten note sitting next to it. And when he read the note, he gasped. Because he realized that he could be the next to die.
You can WATCH all new & exclusive MrBallen podcast episodes on my YouTube channel, just called "MrBallen" - https://www.youtube.com/c/MrBallen
If you want to reach out to me, contact me on Instagram, Twitter or any other major social media platform, my username on all of them is @mrballen
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.