MTGM EXTRA! "Does opening your relationship REALLY work?! "

0:02Joanne McNally:This is a global production. If you are building a life together and someone wants sex and someone else is an arse but everything else makes sense, is there a conversation to be had like, just go and fucking ride somewhere? I don't know.

0:20This is end of term vibes, this is pre-recorded, so you make note of that. We don't know what's happened because we recorded this. Vogue's off to have the baby now. we're not actually here. Yeah. If anything's happened and we're not talking about it it's because we don't know it happened. Yeah. Yeah. Oh yeah. Okay. Are we leaving that in? We should probably leave that in.

0:39Joanne McNally:Joe, you were notoriously bad at announcing any sort of breaks or, well yeah, breaks in the podcast. So I think it's actually, I think it's great for you to explain what's going on. Vogue's pregnant. I heard about that this morning. Pregnant Vogue Williams. Well, at time of recording she is. At time of episode she might not be. But she's crowning This is nice I saw a hand earlier She's crowning Yeah She's crowning So we said We better get a bonus in Yeah Before the placenta pops There is one more episode To come this Friday Before the little break There will be an episode This Friday How long is the break?

1:20How long did we manage to squeeze? A couple of weeks Or for a couple of weeks We were already due We were already due A couple of weeks, because we take two weeks between each series. And I said, you know what? Because I'm having the baby, let's do four. Let's have four. And oh my God, was I... No, it just was not happening. It's like, oh no, we're just going to double record. We're going to double record.

1:47Joanne McNally:But what I will say is, in fairness to us, I think we can all hold our hands up and say, this job, we are on a fucking jolly. We are stealing a living. We are on a jolly. All we do is talk shit to each other twice a week. It's not a hardship. Some of it's very important news stuff. You sent me a fantastic thing for the podcast. Oh, gotcha. I do think we are changing lives. A hundred percent. Forget. Don't bother looking at BBC News. No, it's us. Don't bother with The Guardian. Just come here for your up-to-date news. Yeah. This is a cultural document. So the rest is politics. The rest is entertainment.

2:27Joanne McNally:we're like the rest is bollocks. Would that be a good name for that podcast? Yeah, the rest is horseshit. The rest is bollocks. The rest is uninformed, unfact-checked bollocks. It's catchy, isn't it? Or as Imo says, let's record this shite. Did you hear that show? It was so funny. She goes, all right, let's fucking record this shit. She's a woman after her own heart. She's a woman on the edge and I love a woman on the edge. They're my favourite type of women. Sadly, I don't think Joanne and I are seen as the talent. That's like some people, that's what they call people in the industry. So like anyone who's like the presenters or something like that would be called the talent.

3:12But Joanne and I, I don't think we've ever been called the talent or elegant would be another one we've never been called. Soft-footed? I actually, I went soft-footed?

3:24Joanne McNally:Sorry, who's called soft? Who is called soft? Some people are light on their feet. Some people are light on their feet. I go around and I'm surprised my foot doesn't go through the floorboards sometimes. God, no, you're registering on the earthquake fucking barometer thing. God, folks here, it's Wednesday. So I went for dinner with Joe Lysett last night who was a friend of mine and obviously we did the trailers together and we were talking about, because when we were doing the trailers there was a couple of hot lads on the crew, right? And Joe was kind of going, would you not like, and I said Jo they don't see me as and like and they they think I'm a can we are we saying c*** on the pod anymore or is that do we bleep it yeah yeah no you can yeah no you can say that do we bleep I don't know I mean let us know in the comments do you like it when it's beeped would you like I think I don't like the words yeah that's internalized misogyny but that's a different conversation I do understand it is quite harsh okay I'll say they think I am a spoiled bitch is probably the better way I would say it so when Joe was suggesting that I try and like jig up to the camera lad I was like Joe they don't like because of this kind of term talent and all like they think we're assholes and actually sometimes we probably are but I was like Joe there's no way like they don't look at me in that way like they don't think I'm an asshole I tried to score one before I tried to score Did you?

4:54Like proper Yeah proper tried to score one There was two reasons Spenny went in And told him that he He had fancied him And Spenny and him were friends But I quite fancied him I still follow him on Instagram And I was trying to score him Spenny Sorry

5:11Joanne McNally:Couple of holes in the story Spenny was friends With the cameraman Yes I'm going to need evidence of this I'm going to need evidence Or did he just realise He fancied the cameraman befriended him and told him to fuck off. That's what I would think. It was one of those. And then he went off and shot a couple of pheasants. Yeah, I don't think I don't think Svenny's going for pints with the cameraman. Sorry, Svenny. Svenny cock-blocked me all over the jump. There was this famous guy that Svenny knew and I was like, I really fancy him. And this was before me and Svenny had got together and Svenny was like, oh, I could probably set you up with him.

5:47Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then texted and then threw in that he was seeing me. Of course.

5:52Joanne McNally:We've all played that game. Oh, no, she's a lesbian. I've got a friend. She is a lesbian. I'll set you up. Yeah, we've all played that dirty game. When I was in Ibiza with Brendan Courtney, I was like, Brendan, as a gay man, I deserve you to be camper because you are, I'm getting, if there's an I coming my way, and there wasn't many, but there was an I occasionally. He's not gay. I was like, Brendan, flick a wrist there, will you? Put some tassels on your tits. Do something. Because they're not reading you as gay. And now I look married to a man in chinos, which is also an issue. I was like, no, no, no, no, no.

6:35I'd never hook up with a man in chinos.

6:37Joanne McNally:I was like, Brendan, if there's anything you could do, if you could just maybe wear a pair of heels on our lunch out, they'll know then. A wedge, something. But the Birkenstocks, they're reading straight. And you're cock blocking me. I remember once when I was like, I had gone see the prodigy with one of my really close friends in Hoth and we were only friends. And like, we still are friends to this day. Like we've never, we've kissed each other, but we've never done anything else because we are truly friends. But we went to... Who is she? We went to the... I was a boy. And so we went to the prodigy and then we decided that we were going to...

7:14And everyone else had been invited to this party. And for some reason, we weren't going to the party. And we were like, we'll go to the spirit. Who is this person? just this big block it out so obviously we went off to spirit just the two of us and we were like you know what let's go you'll meet somebody and I'll meet somebody and this will be a great night we'll both be each other's wingmen and off we went to spirit nightclub anyway and then so no one wanted to score us because they thought we were together so no one wanted to kiss us so we started kissing each other but then every so often I'd be like I'm going to go off I see a lad over there that I like and I'd go off and try try and get the lad to kiss me and they'd be like if you

7:50Joanne McNally:if a guy did this to either of us we'd go mental he was doing the same we didn't want to kiss each other we were only imagine that we were each other's backup so every so often he'd go off and try and kiss someone and I'd go and we were like god no one's biting no one's biting and it was because we were just deranged and then we'd end up kissing each other and then going off and trying to find someone else and they'd be like what is that weird couple doing but we weren't actually a couple so as the as the token man in the room can you please explain to our very deluded friend here I can tell you if somebody fancies me and if somebody doesn't fancy me I am everyone fancies you according to the demand do you remember that?

8:34Joanne McNally:one of the funniest I'll never it was one of the funniest just because she's the smile on her she's like what was that? I'm on fuego everyone fancies me everyone fancies me yeah everyone fancies me in just a big photo I honestly yesterday yesterday when I saw there was a headline again yesterday and Spenny had warned me not to say anything I was like I'm telling Jamal what you said about like sex when you're pregnant blah blah blah and the Daily Mail was a headline and I was like oh god all day I was kind of walking on eggshells I was like is he going to see it is he going to see it Vogue says that Spencer Matthews has no interest in intimate relations anymore and then I was like I was getting really worked up about Spennying it and giving aid to me.

9:18But then I was like, fuck, my mom definitely is going to see that.

9:21Joanne McNally:She'd be delighted. It's every mother's dream that her daughter gets pregnant via immaculate conception and that she's not getting pawed by some lad. So Sandra would be delighted. But you know what I do think is interesting? And obviously because you are a father for the Daily Mail, there's this weird line where like we want to have the crack and speak freely on the pod. And then when something gets turned into a headline, it's half annoying. I'm always thrilled because it brings more traction to the pod, but I'm aware it's like personal life. But at the same time, we feel like we're speaking in a vacuum here.

9:54Joanne McNally:We forget. I just feel like we're out with our friends. That's the thing. It's like we're out with our friends, but we're not. Well, remotely. Remotely. On Friday, we'll be in person. We will. We'll be in person. Oh, my God. The mice are gone. Are they? Sorry, no. The mice are dead. oh oh ding dong so when you come over you're each getting a shovel and we're gonna there's a lot of digging to do I'll have to take a picture now to be honest my kids would love to see that yeah the mice are there's no squirreling there's nothing there's there's nothing

10:38dear girls I'm a 5 foot 6 American don't know how the metric but the but I weigh 341 pounds so who knows how many stone. I live in Honolulu, Hawaii and I'm 58 years old. If they make a bikini in my size, I'll wear it. Of course you should. So Vogue, if someone tells you to cover up, tell them to fuck all the way off. You are completely allowed to wear whatever the hell you want. Trust me, there are a lot of big Samoan Polynesian women here that support you and respect your right to wear a bikini. Sincerely, Sarah, an Irish-American. P.S. Good luck with the tour, Joanne. Sarah. What were you saying about your bikini?

11:16I can't remember. I was just saying, remember I was saying that people said that I shouldn't be, no. Oh, sorry. People were saying I shouldn't be wearing one. Yeah, yeah. I think you're dead, right? I think that everybody's body's different. And if anyone wants to wear a bikini or whatever you feel comfortable in, wear it.

11:33Joanne McNally:Do you know what I actually think is really freeing about going on holidays? Because I think when you're in your own little cocoon, rotten in your bed, and you're scrolling, and you can get very lost in, you know, there's a lot of like body shy talk and what's right and what's wrong and feeling shit about yourself. When you go on holidays and you're on a beach with just, with like your fellow human beings and you realize those things, those bodies, those aspirational, in inverted commas, bodies that were like brainwashed by, they're fucking, they're not, they're not around. And like, when you see normal, I'm going to say, I shouldn't say that, that's not the right term I find it very reassuring when you're on a beach beach bodies exactly you just see people all sorts of fucking tits out ass out whatever and we're all we all look great we're having a good time like we're just like enjoying your lives and making memories and swimming and on lilos and having cocktails and what seems important when you're on scrolling online has it loses all importance when you're actually in the world does that make sense?

12:36not that this matters either but like everybody looks very different when you're in a certain light, when you're taking a picture at a certain angle and doing certain things as well. So like when you're just walking around in the wild like everybody like everybody looks normal. And there's nothing wrong with saying you look normal.

12:55Joanne McNally:Yeah, also sometimes, you know, and this is, this isn't like a heavy fat drop, but no one thinks about us the way as much as we think about ourselves. No one gives a shit. totally agree that's the truth like that's just the truth such an Irish Irish mom thing to say it's true who looks at you anyway who looks at you I've been guilty of that as well you're going on holidays and you're like freaking out and you're like oh shit I need to like change like and you're like once you land you're like no one gives a shit and suddenly I don't really give a shit either yeah you know it's great I can't believe someone listens to us in Hawaii Vogue we should do a show there and write it off.

13:40Perfect. She's back to writing stuff off. Great idea. Okay. That would work. We could write that off. That would work. We could write that off, Jo. Could we not write that off? We could write it all the way off. You're allowed to write that off. Flights and everything. It's a show. We're writing it off. If you're going there to work. It's just that woman. It's a show. Yeah. We'll come to your house. Just you. Just you and your gaff. Yeah.

14:05Joanne McNally:Yeah. Yeah, a one-on-one. It's like cameo, but like in the physical world. Okay, my wife has lost the desire. Hey Vogue, Joanne and Jo. One of the unicorn straight men listeners here. Writing to you as a huge fan and student of your teachings. Student of your teachings. I'm 46 years old. I'll accept. I understand more about women after listening to your podcast than I have for the first four decades of my life. I've been married to my wife 42 for 7 years and we've been together for 12 I've always had a slightly higher sex drive than her but for the first probably 5 years there was never a problem we have 2 kids and sex has become much rarer after that there have actually been whole 12 month periods where we haven't had sex and I've found it really hard that is hard most men in this email section are being discussed for cheating but I genuinely have never and never would.

15:04I adore my wife. I find her so attractive but I don't initiate sex anymore because it's really hard when she rejects me. I've tried to have conversations with her about it but she just gets annoyed. I get the added mental load of having kids and the stress and not being in the mood but I feel like I've lost a part of our relationship and it hurts so much that she doesn't seem bothered. I don't know what the next step is if there is one. I would never leave her because every other part of our relationship is great and we're happy otherwise. I just hope that the desire returns one day but it's easy to lose hope would love to get your thoughts that's a really difficult one because like everyone's need and want for that is so different and it's hard to meet somebody that's going to be on the same wavelength as you all the time and of course you've got dips or you've got times where it's like you're having it more but like going 12 months is very difficult because then it gets to a point where it's just embarrassing having to like and she's probably at the point now if it's gone that long that like it would be like I'd be a bit embarrassed if it had gone on that long because I'd be just a bit like oh god like it just would feel like a whole new thing again and it would feel like a big thing because it hasn't happened in so long and

16:20Joanne McNally:Listen I'm going to say it and like this is a sweeping generalisation but like whatevs I think men and women ride differently I think we're differently wired in that regard. I think men ride functionally. It's just like they just want to like, I don't want to be too crass now because we're, we've, people from Hawaii listening now, I don't want to lose them.

16:47Joanne McNally:If you've come this far, I think it's pretty okay. No one's coming, Joe. That's the problem. It's a tale as old as time. Women lose interest. They're not arsed anymore. Men still ride functionally. yes this is a very hetero take on it but that's the world that I know and I think once it's gone it's kind of gone and I think there's a lot of angles here you know if you're you know I think it's unfair to deprive someone of sex if it's if it's an important part for them in a relationship I also think on the other hand there's more to relationships than sex I would refer this man to there's a book that I've I'm sure I've spoken about before by Esther Perel called Mazing in Captivity which talks about the kind of trickiness of monogamy in when we live so long and how we're kind of probably not wired to maintain it for that long.

17:38Joanne McNally:And watch her YouTube. She has a TED talk literally about this, about the fact that like lust is in the unknown. And when you get to know someone for ages, I also think there might be some weird wiring in women where it's like, if you have a kid, you're kind of like, I'm fucking done with you now. I've got my kids. I don't know. That's it. That's from the Dr. Joanne Pops psychology circus. I think it could have to do with things like perimenopause menopause coming on you don't fancy him anymore how about that how she feels but she obviously she hasn't said that like they've tried to have the conversation I think that this is something that needs to go to because I think it's lovely that you're still so madly in love with her and you want to stay with her and all those kind of things we're not talking about cheating you don't want to cheat on her you only want to be with her you still fancy her And I just think that that's really lovely.

18:28And I think that if you sit down and talk to somebody who's going to be like a mediator to chat through all your feelings and how you're doing, how she's doing, because you don't know how she's feeling. Maybe she's having confidence issues or something like that. But I do think that I personally think that there is saving something like that. I think that women have different parts of their lives where they don't feel like having as much sex. And like I have I have people in my life who are like in their 80s and they're still having sex.

18:54Joanne McNally:so like yeah it's not like but are they no i know i'm sorry i shouldn't say i don't mean to sound like i'm saying that all women hit a point and don't have sex what i mean is i i know that women they have certain different priorities at stages they're like i'm fucking raising kids now i couldn't be arsed with you or like i don't fancy you as much i don't feel as attractive anymore there's i have like wild spirals of completely differing opinions on this stuff there's a part of me that thinks if a man even responds to another woman's DM, he should be buried alive immediately and have a cement block put on his feet and thrown him in the sea.

19:29Joanne McNally:And then there's another part of me that is like, if you are building a life together and someone wants sex and someone else is an artist, but everything else makes sense, is there a conversation to be had? Like, just go and fucking ride somewhere. I don't know. Like, if it's that important to you. No, I don't think the thing about it is he doesn't want to do that. and she is, I would say that she's probably going through a hard time as well, but you are. You're a great guy. Yeah, you sound amazing, but I do think therapy, couples therapy sometimes is really important to do. I don't personally do it at the moment, but it would be something that I would do if I ever needed to.

20:10I don't think there's anything wrong with it. I think it's a brilliant thing. I deal with you. If it's someone, okay, let's do it. Fine. I deal with you. But I don't think that this is the end of this relationship but I do think it's gone so far now that it's gotten to a point where it's a bit embarrassing probably.

20:25Joanne McNally:I also think it's okay to acknowledge that this man has needs and that he has a need in his relationship that isn't being met. I think that's okay to acknowledge. I don't think he's the devil like I think it's okay to say that and whatever happens I don't know but I think it's okay to be like I don't think you're evil for wanting to for being disappointed that you're not riding your wife I mean the fact that you've maintained monogamy to this point is I'm like blown away in the last couple of episodes there have been some really nice comments on YouTube and elsewhere if you're able to leave comments on the platform that you listen on please do comment if there's any thoughts that you have or email hello at mtgmpod.com as well get down in the comments let us know what you think there were some very nice things said about the woman who'd emailed last week about wanting to find friends and yeah go and check those comments that was loneliness it's the it's the epidemic it's the current epidemic that's the big problem they're like we're lonelier than ever before yeah this is my this is my last point i will say some of the happiest couples i know are gay men in open relationships i don't know how they do it they're men i don't know like I don't know how you think or act Jo but they seem to have it nailed they're like we're mad about each other we have a life it's very hard I'm just not wired I just couldn't do that you've got unlearn unlearn jealousy and everything I feel like men can separate sex and love in a way that I anecdotally am unable to do would that be right Jo?

22:05maybe All very generic And general sweeping statements I think anything that you do choose to do Everybody needs to be on the same page Don't go down that road on your own Did you just allegedly me talking about Don't fuck anyone over Just allegedly Monogamy No no no

22:29I think you did

22:32Joanne McNally:Ride responsibly I think that's what Jo was saying in that would be. She's responsibly. She's responsibly. That is. No cheating if you can avoid because it just hurts everybody's feelings. It's so messy. Like even when I was on holidays and there was a part of me that was like, it'd be nice to be here with someone, but whatever. It's not my life, not my journey. And then I'd sit beside, there was one couple in particular that I was, they were in the hotel, the same hotel as I was in Marbella. And they weren't, they just weren't getting on. Like they just, they either weren't talking or you could just, I was like, oh this energy is like I could just feel it and I was like do you know what there's nothing worse there's nothing worse no I hate I don't want to than being in a shit relationship and staying because you feel just like this is just you know you've made your bed and you have to lie in it now not writing I don't know if this makes me like a selfish person or something but I would not lie in any bed that didn't make me happy like I wouldn't I wouldn't be able to do that I'd rather take the really hard difficult road if something wasn't right for me then having to be like no i need to suck it up i've got i've got four kids now like i'm lucky that i'm in a happy relationship like i we're we genuinely we were very lucky but i think as well spenny once said something to me like two years ago and i was like god you selfish prick but then i'm like no actually he was dead right he was literally like like we always we just do everything with the kids and only think about the kids and he was like but like what about us we need like we come first because without us there is no family dynamic and like we just make a real effort to try and like even if it's going to the gym together or like going for a walk together or i went and dropped gg to camp with him in the car so like we had like 15 minutes today in the car chatting just little things like that i just think i've found stuff like that very helpful just to make a little time for each other so maybe if you and your wife tried to make I don't know if you're spending lots of time together but like separate time from the kids where it's just you and you're just being back in your relationship Vogue as a closing thought I very much look forward to the Daily Mail headline tomorrow that says Spencer Matthews doesn't prioritise his children I might I might re-share it I might re-share Am I still your friend?

24:55Joanne McNally:Are you still are we still doing regular interviews? Are we still Vogue Williams? tells a friend or have we moved on oh no no no no you're Joanne have I been interviewing you for three years oh I'm Joanne now that's good that's fine you're Joanne but anything you say doesn't get put in the headlines and even if it's all you doing and I get started I know you're a clickbait queen also please keep sending in your emails hello at mtgmpod.com they're great they're great emails yeah I can't believe you got that right send us anything I'd never vouchers thoughts articles Tron would like a one for all nature I got sent a ninja coffee machine when I say I've been tagging the thing to pieces because now of course I'm a greedy bitch I want the barbecue