G7: UK expands Russia sanctions

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1:19Hello and welcome to News Hour from the BBC World Service. We're coming to you live from London. I'm James Menendez. And we're going to begin today in the lakeside resort of Evian-les-Bains in France, where leaders from the G7 group of industrialised nations are meeting, not to take the famous waters, but to try to make progress on some of the intractable conflicts facing the world today. Iran, and by extension, Lebanon, is one of them. We'll be talking about that later in the program. The other is the war in Ukraine, now well into its fifth year. European members of the G7 want the US to put more pressure on Russia to come to the table.

2:00Well, today in France, President Trump met his Ukrainian counterpart, Volodymyr Zelensky, ahead of further talks between them later. We had a good meeting. I'm meeting him later on. We had a very good meeting. Look, Russia should make a deal. Russia's lost tremendous amounts of people, and so has Ukraine. Last month, they lost 35 ,000 soldiers between the two. Think of it. On a monthly basis, they averaged 25 ,000 people, mostly soldiers, young, beautiful people. BBC's James Waterhouse is at the summit and joins us now. James, is there a sense among European countries that the US has taken its eye off the ball when it comes to Ukraine?

2:45And what do they want the US to do? I think that is why the Europeans are equally seeing this as an opportunity. You know, before the summit even started, Donald Trump was declaring this agreement reached with Iran, brokered by Pakistan to end the war. So did that mean, they hoped, the US president would be in a more amenable mood? Does that mean he's got the extra headspace to turn back to Ukraine and use the influence his allies so desperately want him to? But it is clear that Donald Trump is more eager to talk about the war in Iran, a war he waged with Israel a few months ago now. We've seen a special meeting about Ukraine this morning.

3:33It seemed Volodymyr Zelensky from small talk he was making with Emmanuel Macron of France. It wasn't clear whether he was going to have a sit down with Donald Trump. That is now happening, we understand. But he is still having to fight for his ear. And what they want is simply for him to get tougher on Russia and better support Ukraine. I would be surprised if the US president would agree to such a thing so directly, given his reluctance to do so at this point. And what does increasing the pressure on Russia look like? I mean, we have had rounds and rounds of sanctions, haven't we? We've had rounds and rounds of collective Western sanctions.

4:09We've seen that notably with the previous Biden administration. But in terms of Trump, he's penalized Russia's biggest oil company, for example. But beyond that, you know, as recent as last week, this is a White House reluctant to not just condemn Russia for its continued invasion of Ukraine, but say when Russia tests the collective resolve of the NATO alliance or launches missiles into European territory elsewhere, NATO airspace, for example. America, on one hand, has said we will defend NATO territory, but it has never said where those missiles have come from. That is very telling. Washington says it's because it wants to broker a peace deal.

4:50It doesn't want to be seen to be taking sides. But here we are again with another Western summit trying to get Donald Trump's attention rather than looking to collaborate and find unity on some really significant issues. James, thank you very much indeed. The BBC's James Waterhouse at that summit in France. Well, that desire among European countries to put more pressure on Russia stems from the realisation that the tentacles of Russia's war in Ukraine have spread much further afield. That was brought home in stark fashion on Monday in a courtroom in London when two men were convicted of a series of arson attacks on property belonging to Britain's Prime Minister Keir Starmer, a Ukrainian and a Ukraine-born Romanian national.

5:32Their identities, though, are something of a red herring because a painstaking BBC investigation has established a link between them, the attacks, and Russia. It's the work of BBC reporter Daniel De Simone who began by telling me about the fires last year. So in May last year, there were three arson attacks against property and a car connected to the Prime Minister of the UK, Sir Keir Starmer. One of the properties was somewhere he'd lived previously, And the final property he still owned and only left in order to move into 10 Downing Street. The arsonist is a guy called Roman Lavrinovich, a Ukrainian guy, who's now 22.

6:09He's the one that started all three fires. The trial, there were three people on trial. Two others were charged with conspiring with him, also Ukrainian. One of those was found not guilty. The other one was found guilty, but only Lavrinovich actually started the fires. But you've described this as a strange trial. I think you say that the author of the drama wasn't there in court. So it was a very strange trial. This was straight arson. It wasn't terrorism. It wasn't espionage. The motive for the defendants, particularly Lavrovich, was purely financial. There was no ideological motive. Indeed, when he was arrested and he was asked, do you know who the prime minister is?

6:47He said he didn't even know. He didn't even know who Keir Starmer was. So he had been recruited online and he had been approached by this mystery Russian speaker. who had the name EL. And then he was first offered money to put up posters, then to do graffiti, and then to carry out the arson. So it was sort of escalating criminality. The posters were like for a far-right group. The graffiti was Islamophobic graffiti on mosques, defacing mosques. So your extensive investigation really has been focused on the identity of EL. What did you manage to find out about him? So, yeah, we wanted to understand what had actually gone on because the police were saying, well, they don't know who EL is and they can't connect any of this to a foreign state.

7:35Because it was a Russian speaker, there was obviously a sense, could this be Russian operatives? Because it's a well-known thing now that Russia deploys and uses so-called proxies to carry acts of sabotage throughout Europe, Ukraine and also in the UK. You know, they recruit low level criminals online, pay them to do things. We looked into it and we were able to find a lot of other messages posted by EL online where he had offered Russian citizenship in exchange for sabotage attacks in Ukraine, had glorified Vladimir Putin, had glorified Russia. and he had also promoted this far-right group, which the posters were for, in order to try and provoke trouble in the UK, like provoke violence, discord, set communities against each other.

8:25The attacks on the Prime Minister were just part of a much more extensive campaign and that campaign really follows a total blueprint, which we've seen for other Russian operations. What we then found is that there was an actual Russian diplomat who was in this far-right chat group which created this group. And his name is Evgeny Lukshin, so initials being EL. We found that Lukshin's father had been in a diplomatic role in Denmark, so that fitted. But there was more to it because when we looked into Lukshin, he was connected to very high levels of power in Moscow and has been trained in information warfare by senior figures close to Vladimir Putin, by senior spies.

9:10And we found messages from Lukshin showing him and other people who are being trained in formation warfare discussing how to create and promote Russian narratives. I put it to the Russian embassy here in London. They've denied any connection to any of these incidents and said that they reject any attempt to link Russia to unlawful activities. I suppose the key question then, Daniel, is how far up the chain does this go? Can this be linked to the Russian government? Can it be linked to the Kremlin? I spoke to people who know about this, including Ben Wallace, who is the defence secretary here in the UK for several years and security minister.

9:49I put it to him. How far up the chain could this have gone? Who might have signed something like this off? I think President Putin is very clearly behind stepping up actions on the United Kingdom, launching attacks on assets or properties linked to the prime minister. It's a very deliberate change of policy. I think that would have been signed off at the highest levels, if not the president, certainly the National Security Council or indeed members of his inner circle. And that was Britain's former Defence Secretary, Ben Wallace, of the Conservative Party. I was also talking to the BBC's Danielle De Simone.

10:27Well, Graham Downey is a member of Parliament for the governing Labour Party here in Britain. And he first gave me his reaction to that link between those arson attacks and Russia. This is essentially a foreign nation conducting a threat against a British prime minister. I think it's a shocking thing to see. And we've already seen over the last few years that we've essentially already are in a conflict with Russia, whether that's the attacks and the surveillance we see on our subsea cables, whether it's attacks in cyberspace or through social media that's undermining our democracy. But this is a huge escalation to something that looks as though we've had a foreign power actually conducting a direct threat against a British prime minister.

11:09And I think we need to really wake up to the level of threat that shows to the British public. Should the prime minister call out Russia directly for orchestrating those arson attacks against his property, do you think? I think he absolutely should, yes. I think if that's what the evidence is telling us, that that's been conducted, there's no point in hiding away from the fact that, as I say, I believe we already are in a conflict with Russia. We need to treat the situation as though that is the case because that is the facts of it. I think we should be doing everything that we can to make sure the British public are fully aware of that level of threat we face from Russia as well and it has a direct effect on their daily lives as well as this kind of shocking attack on our democracy as well.

11:47What does that conflict, that threat from Russia look like from your constituency in Scotland? Scotland really is very much the frontline part of the UK that's on the frontline of a conflict with Russia through the High North, through the Greenland-Iceland-UK gap. We have subsea cables in Scotland. We have energy pipelines, obviously, in Scotland that come into the northeast and other parts of the country. These are all the vulnerable parts of any country's infrastructure, and that's where Russia is really threatening us every single day and playing as though they are treating us as though they're at conflict and war with us, and we need to start responding in kind.

12:22So I would say the UK and Scotland in particular is already on the front line of a conflict with Russia. We've had new sanctions announced by the government today. Are they making any different to Russia's behaviour? I think Russia will respond to what it sees as strength from adversaries. That includes sanctions. I've seen some of the details of them today. I think they are a very good start. I think we must keep making sure we can do everything we can. But importantly, it's the British public we need to make sure are on side with what we're doing and are aware of the very real threat that we face from Russia.

12:55And that will have very meaningful impacts on their lives, whether it's through cyber attacks or potential threats to energy infrastructure that will directly affect their bills and their way of life. We've seen Putin already use energy as a weapon in Ukraine. There's nothing to say he will not do that with us as well more directly in the future. The threat of arson against the prime minister shows how far they're willing to go. And yet, aren't Western countries sending rather mixed signals? And partly because of the war against Iran, we've had the US easing some of its sanctions because of fears over energy prices.

13:26The UK has delayed some of theirs. From Russia's point of view, it doesn't look like a particularly strong message, does it? Well, I would say the UK sanctions have increased under this government. I fully support that happening. I think we need to make sure we continue to do that to find the pressure points that will hurt Russia, frankly, and drive them towards a more moderate position and make them realise that we acknowledge the threat that they're posing to us and we're willing to respond. That was Graham Downey, an MP for the governing Labour Party there. You're listening to NewsHour from the BBC World Service.

14:12This is James Fernandez with News Out Live from the BBC. Let's head to Vietnam now and the country's grisly trade in cats and dogs for restaurants. Selling their meat is not against the law with the right permits, but it seems illegal trafficking in the animals is widespread. Police today said they'd managed to reunite dozens of cat owners with their pets after breaking up a gang who'd been stealing them to sell on as food. Na Pham is a freelance journalist based in Hanoi. She's been telling me more. The local government in Ho Chi Minh City decided to organise a crackdown on the rings that were responsible for stealing cats and other animals, are the pets from innocent owners across the city.

14:59So they rescued something like 400 cats. Most of them are pets and reunited lots of them with their owners. And that is the biggest case ever that I've heard of that pets have been rescued and returned to their owners. How were these cats taken? I mean, are they taken, what, from outside people's houses, from the street? Yeah, interesting you ask that. Two days ago, actually, I was shown a CCTV clip. Actually, all the people in my world were shown that just as a sign of warning that some thieves actually going around the community at night and they use some kind of electric device to paralyze the pets temporarily and then catch them with nets, like, you know, butterfly nets, things like that.

15:47So there are a few methods of catching pets, but that is the most popular one. And lots of cats in Hanoi actually have been caught and been stolen that way. A happy ending, I guess, for some of those cat owners who have been reunited with their pets. But as I understand it, some of the cats were so badly treated that they didn't make it. Is that right? That's right. Lots of cats actually died in the process. But, you know, there's only one aspect of the trafficking of pets, cats and dogs inclusive, because most of them actually end up in restaurants. The practice of eating dog meat and cat meat is still quite rampant, quite prevalent in Vietnam.

16:28You know, during the old times, it's the only source of food or protein that people could get. But now they still keep that practice. And restaurants that sell cat meat and dog meat are still quite popular in not only in Hanoi, which means city, but also other cities across the country. And I think with the flow of tourists, especially foreign tourists into the country at the moment, the government really wants to do something to show that we cannot continue that barbaric practice of eating cat and dog meat. Oh, really? So they're trying to dissuade people from eating it, even if it is obtained legally, the meat?

17:06Well, you know, eating dog meat and cat meat is actually not banned in Vietnam. You are allowed to eat it and restaurants are allowed to sell them. They have to obtain some kind of license like any other restaurant. However, you know, eating stolen cats and dogs is obviously a crime. and the government is really keen to promote their images you know as animal friendly no abuse of animals and especially now people really love their pets you know for for them you know like my mother who has two cats you know she probably loved them more than me so you know obviously people really really treasure their their pets and the government wants to show that they have that commitment to not only preserve the image of the country but also to respect other people, the population's feelings and their unions with their pets.

17:59The Vietnamese journalist Nga Pham speaking to me from Hanoi.

18:08Now last night's one of the best games of the Men's Football World Cup so far, a two-all draw between Iran and New Zealand in Los Angeles. The logistical problems for the Iranian team have been well documented and the squad has been ordered to return to its base camp in Mexico and not remain in the US to recover. Let's hear a bit more about the game itself. The BBC's Isaac Fannin was at the match. We watched a fantastic game of football. I'm not going to lie to you, I wasn't expecting it. When I saw on my bill that I was going to be watching Iran against New Zealand, it was not a match that I thought was going to be one of the highlights of the World Cup.

18:45It finished 2-2 and I have to say it definitely was one of the highlights of the World Cup so far. Let's get some perspective from a couple of fans of the Iranian team. I've got Art Fethahari who has a YouTube channel, Melly Talk, and follows the Iranian team. And I've got Samson Tamizhani, presenter of the Goal Bezan podcast which is dedicated to Iranian football. I know New Zealand fans are going to be delighted with that 2-2 result but I don't think you two are. Yeah, of course. You know, this is a horrible result. This is a game Iran had to win coming into this game. The pressure was on them.

19:22They had to win this match. And, you know, we see a lot of the same things we've seen over and over. Some poor player selection, some poor substitutions as well. And, you know, same old story. And, you know, to be honest, I'm not surprised about this result because we've been seeing the same old story over and over with Iran's head coach, Amir Galanoi. We were at that game and we saw New Zealand produce a phenomenal performance. and two of their goals were absolutely fantastic from Elijah Just. I mean, they're goals that if another team scored it, we would be saying that those goals are some of the best goals in the world.

19:55It's just one of those where you just came up against a really, really good team. And I know you would have looked at this game and thought, we've got to win this if we've got to progress. Well, if you've seen the defence that Iran has had in competitive matches, you'll see that they are stagnant at best. and full of holes, and that's exactly what we saw the first couple attacks from New Zealand. The Iranian defense basically looked like training cones, if you're of the critical perspective that we have, and all the space in the world to make a clinical finish, and they did. Do you not think that, obviously, everything that's happened, that they've had to deal with a lot of outside noise, and that may have been cause for some of the performance tonight?

20:40I know that's something that's going to be brought up a lot. But then on the flip side, there's been more of this mindset of these players have been together for a long period of time. They've been practicing a lot together. You know, it wasn't like they're waiting for so many more of the other foreign legionnaires to show up. And then, you know, it's taking time for us to gel. You know, I'm not in the business of making excuses. I'm on the business of looking for excuses. Iran could have played better tonight. No, they should have played better. And they did not. Do you think that they can get out of this group?

21:07And how does that look like? Obviously, Belgium next, and then Egypt. Obviously, Egypt and Belgium, that one finishing 1-1. And as you mentioned, Egypt will be delighted with that result. Yeah, there's a great quote from legendary college basketball coach Nolan Richardson, who emphasized conditioning and stamina. He said, fatigue will make cowards of us all. When I look at this Iran team being the oldest squad in the World Cup with defenders who are very unreliable and with the substitution decisions from the coaching staff and then the outside noise, which the coaching staff is quick to make as an excuse whenever they don't get a desired result, the faith is low.

21:53It's obviously not mathematically impossible if we've only played one match, but the faith is low at this point, knowing that Egypt exposed Belgium with very impressive speed, speed that we do not have and for you Art any hope I'm gonna be honest of course there's hope I mean because they have a point right now right you know in this world cup there's 48 teams the top two advance and then the eight best third place teams also advance so even if the next match against Belgium doesn't turn out well it's still possible because if they get a win against Egypt and Seattle then you know I think that that should be good enough to get them to the next round.

22:27I mean, they can do it, but it's not going to be easy. Art and Samson to Iran fans speaking there to the BBC's Isaac Fannin. There is, of course, full coverage of the World Cup, all the results, all the stories on our website. Just head to the World Cup part of it, bbc.com forward slash news. And of course, you'll find on our website all the latest on our top stories, including that G7 summit, talking about Iran, talking about Ukraine, all the latest updates on those live pages. But do stay with us here on NewsHour. Much more to come in the next half hour.

23:23the origins and evolution of Made in China, because it actually wasn't inevitable. What we're talking about is the world's largest communist nation is at the beating heart of the capitalist system. For more, listen to The Global Story on bbc.com or wherever you get your podcasts. Decisions made in Washington can affect your portfolio every day. But what policy changes should investors be watching? Listen to Washington Wise, an original podcast for investors from Charles Schwab, to hear the stories making news in Washington right now. Host Mike Townsend, Charles Schwab's Managing Director for Legislative and Regulatory Affairs, takes a non-partisan look at the stories that matter most to investors, including policy initiatives for retirement savings, taxes and trade, inflation concerns, the Federal Reserve, and how regulatory developments can affect companies, sectors and even the entire market.

24:20Mike and his guests offer their perspective on how policy changes could affect what you do with your portfolio. Download the latest episode and follow at schwab.com slash Washington Wise or wherever you listen.

24:36Welcome back to News An. The Traitors has over recent years become the biggest show on TV. There are now more than 40 versions around the world. And next year in London, there's going to be a stage version, or rather there are going to be five stage versions. The stories of murders, banishments and baffled faithfuls have been turned into a series of plays. David Sillito has been talking to the people, turning reality TV into drama.

25:06A group of people from across the UK have been invited to this castle. The format makes the audience feel omniscient. Maybe it's because we know who the traitors are and can sit in judgement. And that sense of, well, I know who they are, why can't you spot it? It makes you feel good as a member of the audience. This is Stephen Lambert, who makes the UK and US versions of the traitors. Who will live, who will die. All those cloaks and those burning fires and the whole theatricality of murder and banishment, it just sort of screamed, turning into a play. And so they turned to comedy writer John Finnamore to come up with an idea of how to do it.