Italy calls for Spain to be suspended from Schengen

0:02Hello and welcome to NewsHour live from the BBC World Service in London. and I'm Rebecca Kesby. Spain has lashed out at European partners today following criticism of its handling of the migrant surge into the North African Spanish territory of Ceuta earlier this week. More than 50 ,000 people, mostly young Moroccans, rushed across the border en masse, many swimming around the coastline. Well, 22 of the 27 EU countries have signed a joint letter calling for action to prevent similar incidents happening again, and emergency talks are planned now for Tuesday. But the Spanish Prime Minister, Pedro Sánchez, says the security of external borders in Europe is a shared responsibility of all member states, and he accused critical governments of being selfish, polarising and unlawful in their reaction.

0:54Well, earlier, Spain's Interior Minister, Fernando Grande Malasca Gómez, defended Spain's handling of the crisis, and his words here are voiced by a translator. Those who have come illegally have received a very clear message that that is not the way to come to Spain. We continue to work internally and we continue to collaborate with Morocco and we will continue to convey this message within the European Union and we will not allow partisan attitudes and ignorance and bad faith jeopardise such an important thing as the pillars and the basis of what the European Union stands for. The Spanish authorities in Ceuta say that most of the illegal migrants have now returned to Morocco and new precautions are in place to stop such an influx again.

1:53But that hasn't stopped the Italian government from temporarily suspending the free movement agreement with Spain known as Schengen. The Italian Prime Minister, Giorgia Meloni, called the scenes shocking. Finland and Denmark also back Italy's move, and the Czech Prime Minister has also urged a temporary suspension of Spain's Schengen membership. Spain's Prime Minister, Pedro Sanchez, said prejudice, fake news and ignorance are behind the complaints. But I've been speaking to Italian member of the European Parliament, Nicola Procaccini. He's from Ms Maloney's Brothers of Italy party and close to the prime minister.

2:31I asked him why has Italy decided to suspend free movement with Spain? If you are not European citizens, this means that you must be subject to border controls. We are talking about partial and temporary suspension, and this is not the first time that happens in Europe. Usually it happens when you have some threats like what we have seen in Ceuta. So this is why many member states co-signed the letter to ask for having a meeting as soon as possible in the European Council, a meeting for the interior ministers as soon as possible to speak about what's happening in Ceuta. and we think we need to suspend Schengen because there's a threat and illegal migration is now in Ceuta.

3:32This is a danger for European citizens. Is it necessary, though, because Ceuta actually isn't part of the Schengen agreement, is it? So nobody could come freely from Ceuta to Italy. This is not correct. This is not correct. Ceuta is into the Schengen Treaty, absolutely. We understand that it isn't, actually. No, no, no, you're wrong. Obviously, they have a different situation, but they are into the Schengen Treaty. And let me be clear. As you know, and what is written in this letter from the 22 member states, we think it was a huge mistake to grant the legal status to 500 ,000 of illegal migrants.

4:22That is exactly what the Spanish government made a few weeks ago. Let me put to you what the Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sánchez is saying. He has said that the security of our external borders is a shared responsibility of all member states. And that's true, isn't it? I mean, he's calling, well, I guess Italy, but other countries as well, that are criticising Spain, selfish, polarising and unlawful in their reaction. I mean, shouldn't Italy be offering to help its neighbour Spain to deal with this crisis that happened? France, Slovakia have said that they will help even the UK and they're not even in the EU anymore.

5:07The Italian government say that he's ready to help Spain in every way it's possible. But at the same time, we condemn this regularisation of 500 ,000 of illegal migrants because this is a pull factor. There's no suggestion that the Spanish authorities are actually welcoming these people from Morocco, these illegal migrants, or want them to stay. I mean, they're trying to deal with what they're describing themselves as a crisis. Actually, it's quite interesting to hear what the Slovakian Prime Minister Robert Fico has been saying. He points to Italy and says it's only a few years ago through the Italians' lax approach, his words, allowing illegal migrants to enter EU countries in massive numbers that cause serious crises elsewhere in Europe.

5:59He's right. I remember very well that France, for example, but even Germany and many others, they closed the borders because too many migrants were coming from Italy. And so they suspended the Schengen Treaty to face this huge mass of illegal migrants that were coming from Italy. There's nothing so strange. We also heard from Spain's interior minister today who says the situation in Ceuta has almost returned to normal now. Yeah, I read it. I read it, but at the same time, I read what the people from Ceuta are saying. And it is not exactly the same of the interior minister. But maybe they don't have the right information.

6:50Because if you look at what the Prime Minister Sanchez posted on Instagram a few minutes ago, posted his music playlist for the summer, staying in Lanzarote for his holiday. It's crazy. Sometimes I feel that the left is living in the clouds, in another world. It's unbelievable. Nicola Procaccini, their MEP for the Brothers of Italy policy. And just to clarify one contention in that interview, Ceuta does not fall under normal Schengen arrangements, as there are required border checks for people entering the Spanish mainland or wider Schengen area from there. Now, the celebrated British Nepali climber Nirmal Purja has died in the avalanche that struck Pakistan's Broad Peak on Thursday.

7:48His expedition company has confirmed that news. He was attempting to climb the world's 12th highest mountain, Broad Peak, with nine other climbers. Three other bodies have also been recovered. Broad Peak is located in the Pakistan-administered Gilgit-Baltistan region. And the authorities there have been carrying out rescue missions to try to locate other members on that expedition. I spoke to Naila Kiani shortly after news of Nirmal Purja's death broke. Naila is a Pakistani mountaineer who climbed Broad Peak back in 2023. She's the spokesperson for the Alpine Club of Pakistan, which is involved in those rescue efforts.

8:29And she gave us her reaction. Nirmal's petition company and his family agreed to announce his death officially from Alpine Club of Pakistan. We will only announce their death officially once the rescuers go to the body, recover the body, or if the body is not recoverable, maybe a couple of days later. However, obviously, we're fearing them all dead. It happened two days ago, so their chances of survival are very slim now. Ground rescue team is there right now. They've seen some bodies. They haven't reached them currently. We'll know more in the next few hours. Goodness me, it does sound as if that is a really tragic accident that happened there.

9:19I mean, you've climbed so many mountains with Nirmal, haven't you? And he's really experienced. I mean, what can you tell us about him he's a very experienced climber he's climbed 57 mountains if i am not wrong 57 or 58 and he was about to complete his um hat trick basically completing the 14 peaks the third time he had two mountains left he wasn't just an experienced and a very strong climber he led many of these expeditions i was on he was very fearless he made impossible happened. I was with him on Choyu when we were about to turn around, but he pushed through and he made some ride decisions and we were able to climb that mountain.

10:02It's very, very unfortunate that it was out of anybody's control and there was a massive avalanche. It is a tragic loss to the mountaineering community, isn't it? And yet people are still up there. The rescue teams are are really doing quite dangerous work, I think, to try to recover and find any survivors, if there are any. How are those rescue efforts going? What are the circumstances and the conditions they're working in? So Pakistani mountains are very different to Nepal. Our infrastructure is not as good as Nepal and we don't have a private heli-rescue. Military helicopters are supporting us.

10:46um the the area where the some of the bodies or climbers have been spotted some of those areas are still avalanche prone so a rescue team has to be very careful assess whether they are endangering their and the whole of the rescue team lives and and i think for we the latest news i have is that they nearly reached the four bodies or slash climbers because they haven't reached they can't really confirm what condition they're at but they're trying their best um heli um helicopter military helicopters are assisting them they cannot do much until the ground rescue team you know brings the body down um so so with the limited resources people are trying their best uh k2 expedition uh people want climbers voluntarily called it off to focus the effort on this search rescue mission.

11:47Very challenging conditions for the helicopter pilots as well. As you say, this was a huge avalanche, wasn't there? But there are some questions about the delay or possible delay in an alarm being sent. Can you tell us about that? So we're all shocked and everybody's questioning and some people are questioning Pakistani authorities that the delay was from their side. But usually base camp teams, the base camp manager, liaison officers they are meant to report this back to you know Skardu and to the authorities we unfortunately received the news almost 12 hours later and and we haven't actually investigated it once we are done with the rescue we'll investigate why that delay happened one thing that we've been told is that the teams were all going up and all the very very strong climber most of them most of them, not all, it was one of their last 14 peak.

12:41Avalanche hit them at 9am. They were meant to report back to base camp at 5pm. However, what we are not sure is how does the base camp team, how did they not see the avalanche and try to contact them? So that's still something we'll have to investigate. Coming up later in the programme, how one woman's obsession with seaweed has paid off because she's discovered a whole new species. It's got clear bands, translucent, light transmitting bands that then are interspersed with red ones, which are not transparent. And that was how it was described in the 19th century as a bit like a jewel because of the way the bands glisten.

13:26More on that to come later this hour. Our headlines from the BBC newsroom this hour. The FIFA boss Gianni Infantino is under sustained pressure after being forced to scrap his investment plan, with UEFA saying it had lost confidence in his leadership of world football. More on that story to come. And the EU has convened a meeting to discuss the migrant crisis in the Spanish territory of Ceuta after tense exchanges between Spain and other member state.

13:59This is Rebecca Kesby with NewsHour live from the BBC. Now it is six months since 84-year-old Nancy Guthrie was abducted from her home in Tucson, Arizona in the middle of the night. Her daughter is the American TV anchor Savannah Guthrie and the family has released another appeal for information as to what happened to Nancy saying that their hearts are in ruins. The police have also released two ransom notes in full for the first time, hoping that someone might be able to identify the kidnapper. Well, I've been speaking to KJ Matthews, Los Angeles-based entertainment reporter, who gave us more background on the case.

14:39Savannah Guthrie is one of the most famous TV presenters here in the United States. She is a news anchor for the NBC Today show in the morning. She's very well respected and very well liked. And before this incident, she actually had her mother on the show quite a bit. You know, people really kind of fell in love with her mother. So this was quite shocking when it happened. But basically on January 31st of this year, her mother went missing. The night before, she had dinner with Savannah Guthrie's other sister and her son-in-law. And they dropped her off around 9 p.m. And sometime overnight, she was abducted.

15:22And we still aren't any closer to knowing what happened. There have been a number of news conferences. There were two men who were arrested, detained and then released. We've seen surveillance of a video camera outside of Nancy Guthrie's home showing a gentleman with a mask over his face. Police have not been able to nail down exactly when that video was shot. And this week, there was a little bit more movement on the case. Number one, two of the gentlemen who actually had been arrested have announced that they are banding together and filing a$3.2 million lawsuit against the Pima County Sheriff's Department because they said that they were unlawfully detained and arrested.

16:10Also, there was a hair sample found inside Nancy Guthrie's bedroom that was sent away to a lab to be tested. And we're told now that has come back as inconclusive. It doesn't lead to any suspect. And then the biggest news this week is that the Pima County Sheriff's Department has released the full text of two redacted ransom notes sent to a local Tucson, Arizona TV station. The first demands$4 million in Bitcoin and said that the family had seven days to get that Bitcoin to them. That particular ransom note was specifically written to Savannah Guthrie. The second ransom note, which was sent a few days later, was actually attention to the entire Guthrie family.

17:00And that one basically said that they're sorry that she died of a heart-related condition shortly after being taken. and was buried in nature. So the investigators and law enforcement are hoping that by publishing the letters that perhaps somebody close to these kidnappers or one kidnapper would recognize the writer's word choices and syntax and be able to call in and identify the suspects. Yeah, they're saying that the phrasing has distinctive linguistic characteristics. I mean, at one point there was even suspicion that perhaps whoever wrote it didn't speak English as a first language, I think, at some point.

17:41It's interesting because it depends on who you talk to. I've seen certain law enforcement saying that they think that the first letter and the second letter seem to be written by different people. The first letter is very demanding, very specific. The second letter seemed to be almost apologizing, saying that they did not fully grasp the seriousness of her physical condition. and they never intended to hurt her. Depends on who you talk to. But they do think that there seems to be some legitimacy with it, just because the first note, they describe her white smartwatch on the floor of the bed. And they also describe the white floodlight in her backyard, knowing that it was already destroyed.

18:22And perhaps the person that did do the kidnapping, they would be the only person that would know where a smartwatch would be located inside her bedroom. The Guthrie family is saying they've all been heartbroken. I think they do accept that Nancy is probably dead, but obviously they want to recover her body and also find out what happened and get some sort of justice. They just want to know what happened, why, and they would like to recover her remains so that they can have a celebration of life. That's the reason why I savannah guthrie continues to go on instagram and social media trying to appeal to either the kidnappers or someone who knows the kidnappers to come forward and do the right thing as journalist kj matthews speaking to us from la now who knows what parkour is if you don't know it's the moving across obstacles in an urban environment rather than going around them leaping over a park bench for example.

19:21It's actually considered quite a good exercise as well as being fun, if slightly dangerous. Lots of younger people around the world are into it. But now in Singapore, a plucky group of over 50s are getting in on the craze as a way to stay fit. Gabriel O 'Regan caught up with them. Awesome. Wow.

19:46A parkour class in the suburbs of Singapore. Barefooted On the drain, look at that. OK, let's go. One, two, three, row. But it's not your usual teenagers vaulting across rooftops. Instead, it's a group of seniors around the ages of 50 to 70 jumping over barriers, hurling themselves over playground equipment, balancing on walls, and all of them navigating Singapore's urban landscape with a confidence and agility so often perceived as the preserve of younger generations. I'm Shi Boon. I am the founder of Movement Singapore and I teach seniors parkour to prevent dangerous falls. 2026 was the year that Singapore officially became what the UN calls a super-aged society, where more than one in five people are over 65.

20:35By 2030, it will be one in four. Shi Boon's solution was to adapt the principles of parkour, the art of moving efficiently through an environment, for older bodies. But if you ask him to describe what his classes actually entail, his answers are a lot simpler. Urban monkey. You're learning how to be a monkey in an urban environment. It started in 2017. One coach, one 64-year-old student and plenty of people questioning his approach. The general impression of parkour is young boys recklessly jumping from rooftops to rooftops. And so when they see seniors doing it, they will go like, yeah, you must be crazy because seniors are already on the risk of getting injured easily.

21:20Nine years later, though, the sceptics seem to have gone quiet. Most of his students are Singaporean women in their 60s and 70s, but not all of them. My name is Barry Clark. I was born in the UK. And upon retirement, looking out for something to get more active in, I found parkour. And it's been a great experience. kept me healthy, both in terms of my body, but also I think in terms of my happiness and my mental activities also improved as well, I believe. So what does a senior parkour class look like? So I would basically ask you to put your hands on the floor and just crawl forward. So I'll be extremely realistic.

21:59Your mum is going to fall. She's just trying to make a mistake. She's going to fall. There's no doubt. But what matters is you hone your judgments. You try to make good decisions that protect your body while you get stronger. That's the only way to become more alert, not to ignore the danger, but to come face to face a little bit. For Barry, the benefits go beyond just core strength and agility. It's about the camaraderie of a shared challenge and proving that ageing doesn't have to mean slowing down. Growing old together is better than growing old alone. The key thing is that it's good for me, it's good for the community, and it's something that I think could easily be replicated in other societies.

22:35So I hope it is. Barry Clark, ending that report from Gabriel O 'Regan there. And if you are tempted to try parkour, just be careful. I think that's the message, however old or young you may be.

22:59Welcome back to NewsHour. There are reports of fresh fighting between the Ethiopian army and rebels in the country's northern Tigray region. There's been a fragile ceasefire in place since a peace deal was reached in 2022, ending a three-year war that killed more than half a million people. But there have been tensions and various conflicts over the region for decades. For more on the latest fighting and the background to all of this, I've been speaking to Martin Plout, fellow at the Institute of Commonwealth Studies and King's College, both here in London. The Tigrayan Defence Force, which is actually responsible to the Tigrayan government, but is at loggerheads with the Ethiopian government.

23:40And the reports are, and this has been from multiple sources, that they have been involved in some fierce fighting along the border with Sudan at a place called Sherina. Now, this is not a major town, but it's very important because if it's accurate, then it would suggest that the Ethiopian army are trying to block the Tigrayans from making a link through to Sudan, which would be very important for them to getting supplies into Tigray itself. Was this latest outbreak in violence expected? And I mean, could it see a return to the conflict that ended in 2022? It could indeed. It could just blow over.

24:21It could be one spat, although it really sounds pretty heavy with artillery and drones and various other armaments used. It could blow over, but it is a very dangerous situation. This has been predicted for weeks, if not months, because the tension has been rising between Tigray and the authorities in Addis Ababa. And the Tigrayans are now allied with a whole range of other people. And that makes it a very different situation from the last time there was a war. It could become a regional war, but we just can't be sure whether it's going to be something that's snuffed out or becomes a much wider conflict.

25:01The original route to this conflict between the rebels and Ethiopia, can you just sort of tell us a bit more about that? The tension really is between a regional power and the centre. I mean, you can trace it back two, three hundred years. This is nothing new. But the current problem is with Eritrea, which is the coastal land which lies just to the north of Ethiopia, and the Tigrayans who are also in the north. Now, if they ally themselves against Addis Ababa, then it's very dangerous for Addis Ababa because they are powerful and Prime Minister Abiy is running out of allies. We know that the last war led to about 5 million people being displaced and many of them ended up in Sudan.

25:47There were all sorts of reports of ethnic cleansing, war crimes as well. it's really been devastating this conflict in terms of its impact on civilians. I mean the impact particularly on women has been unbelievable. I have seen videos and evidence of women being abused in ways which are indescribable. That is the one thing that is the common fact in all that happens in these kind of conflicts in the Horn of Africa is the level of brutality and the level of suffering is immense. That's Martin Plout speaking to us earlier today.

26:29You're listening to News Hour live from the BBC. I'm Rebecca Kesby. Now, can FIFA boss Gianni Infantino survive in his post as president of the global governing body of football as pressure increases for his resignation? Earlier this week, he gave regional governing bodies until September to agree to sell a stake in the World Cup and other FIFA tournaments to private investors. If they backed the plan, he said, football associations would be given a cash reward. Well, that sparked outrage, with some critics saying it was effectively buying votes. And by the early hours of this morning, Mr Infantino performed a complete U-turn and withdrew that proposal.

27:13Earlier today, the governing body of European football, UEFA, issued a strongly worded statement saying it had lost confidence in Infantino's leadership. Con Cacav, the governing body of North and Central American Caribbean football, said his plan was a unilateral and egregious act. We're going to hear from the vice president of UEFA in just a moment. First, though, here's a clip of Mr Infantino back in 2016. It's from his final speech ahead of the vote to choose the next president of FIFA. and he made a very clear pitch on the subject of money to member nations. The money of FIFA is your money.

27:49It's not the money of the FIFA president. It's your money, you are the national associations, and the money of FIFA has to serve for the development of football and not for anything else. UEFA's statement reads, the current FIFA leadership has not only lost UEFA's confidence, but also that of many other members of the football family. So I asked a vice president of UEFA, Laura McAllister, should Gianni Infantino now resign? I think we've made it clear in the statement that the football community has lost confidence in the leadership of FIFA, particularly in the president, Gianni Infantino. And I think after events of the past week, then the statements that we've seen from the football stakeholders make it clear that it would be appropriate for him to consider his position.

28:42I just feel that all of us have been through a lot of anguish. We've been through a lot of concern about the future of the game. And none of that was of our making. The proposal that dropped on us a few days ago was something that was potentially catastrophic to the game and really shouldn't have been given the airtime it has. So that's a yes, then. He should step down. I mean, look, it's his decision, isn't it? I mean, we can't force anyone's hand from the point of view of resignation. But if momentum gathers and other confederations issue statements similar to ours, then I think it would make his position untenable.

29:20But let's see how the next 24 hours or so goes. Our responsibility always is to look after European football interests. And we've made that very clear in the statement that the events not just of this week, but of previous weeks as well in the World Cup over the overturning of the Balogun red card due to political interference. the use of hydration breaks in the way they were. And of course, various other events have accumulated to give us a sense that the leadership of FIFA doesn't have the best interests of football at heart. You say you can't force his hand, but UEFA has really, hasn't it, over the past few days.