Jubilant scenes as Israeli FlyDubai passengers return home

0:00This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. It felt like everything I believed in was suddenly collapsing. This is the story of an Islamic boarding school in Indonesia with a dark secret. Of the school's head teacher. This was someone I respected above anyone else. And the investigation led by students he's trying to silence. If this is leaked to the media, I'll be destroyed. This is World of Secrets, catching my teacher. Listen on BBC.com, the BBC app or wherever you get your BBC podcasts.

0:43Hello and welcome to NewsHour live from the BBC World Service in London. I'm Rebecca Kesby.

0:58These were some of the jubilant sounds tonight at Ben Gurion Airport in Tel Aviv. People waving flags and singing as passengers emerged safely after a terrifying ordeal aboard a Fly Dubai flight en route to Israel earlier today. The plane made an emergency landing in Saudi Arabia after a violent altercation in the cockpit of the plane between the two pilots. One of the pilots was arrested on landing in Saudi Arabia. The other is receiving hospital treatment. We're about to get into all the detail, but in short, it seems passengers overpowered and restrained the attacker. Then luckily, two other Fly Dubai pilots were on board the plane and were able to take over.

1:42Well, for the passengers and crew, it's been a harrowing experience. Videos, widely circulating on social media, have been helping us piece together what happened. And this is said to be the moment the plane took a rapid plunge. You can just about hear a distressed woman saying in Hebrew, what is going on?

2:13Clearly a frightening moment. Well, survivors have been telling reporters just how frightening the whole experience has been, with people still celebrating in the background. We can hear now from Almog Itali and Chaim Nazarovitz describing what it was like to be on board. It was a regular flight until we got to the Jordanian border. suddenly the aircraft was dropping very sharply like a massive turbulence and we didn't understand why because we didn't get any alerts and we tried to buckle up and it got balanced after 20, 30 seconds and then started dropping again and balancing again and we saw that in front of the next to the cockpit people ran and we understood that one of the pilots stabbed the other one and the passenger and the crew member took over, got control and luckily we had another pilot who took control on the aircraft itself.

3:17It was very terrifying. You feel in a moment that you lose it. You lose it. You are not among the living people. You lose it in one second and you are not here. Well, earlier this afternoon, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu gave a TV address explaining what he understood had happened on board the plane. Citizens of Israel, this morning there was a very serious security incident on a flight from Dubai to Israel. Almost all the passengers on the flight were Israelis. During the flight, as they were approaching Israel, one of the pilots stabbed the other pilot and apparently tried to crash the plane with its passengers on board.

4:03I spoke with one of the Israeli passengers. He told me that the plane went into a spin and began to descend. He told me that somehow he managed to break into the cockpit with one of the crew members, and together they overpowered the pilot, who had carried out the stabbing, while he was attempting to sabotage the aircraft's systems.

4:23Another air crew who was on the plane entered the cockpit and managed to stabilize the aircraft. I salute these heroes who demonstrated extraordinary resourcefulness and courage. They saved many lives and prevented a major incident. Well, a short time ago, I spoke to our correspondent, John Donison, who's at Ben-Gurion Airport tonight, where there were emotional scenes as passengers arrived. Yeah, earlier this evening, the plane touched down, and there's obviously a huge scrum of journalists here waiting to speak to them, but also quite a lot of people chanting, waving Israeli flags and celebrating, really, that they have returned home safely after what must have been an absolutely terrifying ordeal.

5:07Absolutely. And all we know at this stage really is that it seems to have started with a fight in the cockpit. Is it any clearer now as to what happened and chiefly why it happened? It's not totally clear, to be honest, and I think a lot of the details of what happened have come from testimony from the passengers on board. So when they got off in Saudi Arabia, when they made an emergency landing, some of them spoke to the media, and it's them who've been giving the accounts. But I can tell you how my day unfolded. this morning first thing we heard rumors that a plane might have been hijacked and Israeli fighter jets Saudi fighter jets had been scrambled but what actually seems to have happened is this was an attempted hijacking not by a passenger but by a pilot so what it seems happened is midway through this flight from Dubai to Tel Aviv which was carrying roughly 170 people 100 of them Israelis was the plane began to plummet downwards.

6:10It fell some 17 ,000 feet, around 5 ,000 metres in two minutes. Something was clearly wrong. There was a fight in the cockpit between the two pilots. One of them ended up getting stabbed. And then, according to passengers, the crew asked passengers to help. And somehow, it isn't clear how, they got into the cockpit, passengers, and managed to wrestle one of the pilots to the ground and tie him down. And then there were two pilots travelling at the back of the plane and they were then able to fly it safely to Saudi Arabia for an emergency landing. I mean, was that just a coincidence that there happened to be those two pilots there?

6:55And thank goodness there were, because otherwise this story could have had a very different ending. Yeah, and to be honest, I can't answer that question. the airline involved fly Dubai. They say they were on duty pilots. Maybe they were being transferred back to Tel Aviv for another flight. I just don't know the answer to that. Well, we've heard from one passenger. I think he's being called Yaniv. He's been greeted by the Prime Minister this evening, Mr Netanyahu, who's been calling him a hero. He apparently was one of those that broke into the cockpit and wrestled one of the pilots to the ground.

7:32any more details of what happened in that altercation? No, we don't know. I mean, that individual who the Prime Minister here at the airport was embracing a short while ago, he still had blood on his shirt. So we're not clear with what the pilot was stabbed. We're not sure how there was a sharp object in the cockpit. All this really is just speculation, and I think it's going to be in the next few days and weeks when we get a clear picture of what actually happened. You know, Prime Minister Netanyahu gave a statement where he said this was apparently an attempt to deliberately crash the plane by one of the pilots, and it was only the intervention of the other pilots and the passengers, who he called heroes, who stopped that from happening.

8:24Other Israeli ministers, the National Security Minister, Itamar Ben-Gavir, have gone further. They have called this a terrorist attack and said the plan was to bring this plane down and kill everyone on board, although he didn't present any evidence with that statement. And I think now, look, investigators are going to be looking into the background of this pilot and what any possible motive there might have been. And it's probably unwise to speculate too much about that at the moment. Just before you go, John, do we know any more about what's happened to the two pilots? because you mentioned there was this emergency stop in Saudi Arabia and we understand one of the pilots was being treated, the other arrested?

9:05Yes, that's right. So one of the pilots has been arrested and my understanding is that he is still in Saudi Arabia, although obviously Israeli security and intelligence officers will be very keen to speak to him too. And the other pilot, I believe, is receiving hospital treatment there. That's the BBC's John Donison at Ben-Gurion Airport. And in the past half an hour or so, it's been announced that Fly Dubai has suspended all flights to and from Israel while an investigation into the incident today is conducted. Of course, all this happens less than a month from Israel's elections and where security concerns are already very high.

9:48Only last night, Prime Minister Netanyahu held a meeting with the leader of the opposition, Yair Lapid, about security into the run-up to the vote. Tal Schneider is a journalist with the Times of Israel. So is it normal for such a meeting to take place? And do we know what was discussed? The reason for the meeting was that Netanyahu issued a warning statement yesterday around lunchtime. He went to an Air Force base and said there is an imminent threat coming in to Israel before the election. And that, you know, that took the opposition by surprise. They said, if you know of something, you need to brief us because that's according to the law.

10:31So, I mean, the opposition leader kind of forced Netanyahu to conduct this type of briefing. And then Mr. Lapid, the opposition leader, he went into the briefing. And when he came out, he said, I hear general statements. I don't hear any specifics. I mean, Israel is under threat anyhow, 24-7, you know, for many years. So, I mean, Lapid said, you know, we didn't hear any specifics. There's not like an Iranian, you know, lunch missiles coming in or anything like that. And when things took place today, when things happened, Netanyahu's spokesperson said, oh, yeah, we told you so, there was something coming in.

11:11But like it said, there was no specifics. You just said general things. So, I mean, you know, this disaster, almost disaster, became immediately a back and forth issue. Instead of being just security issue, it became a highly political issue. Right. So it's already becoming political. What's happened today? It's very political. Yeah. OK, that's that's interesting because obviously we're in the election campaign now. How might this affect that election? It's hard for me to predict because every day there is something big here. I mean, yesterday we had settler violence in the West Bank so bad that, you know, houses were torched.

11:50I mean, the violence came from the Jewish side. And every day there's like big news and it's all politicized. And obviously, next week we have the October 7th memorials and October 7th free years mark and a very somber situation where most of the Israelis will go to the graveyards and to events. So, I mean, it's really hectic. I mean, every day brings something else. And it's hard for me to predict, you know, what's going to take place. It's four weeks from now. Yes, I bet it is. Well, while we've got you, Tal, it's worth mentioning that this flight route is a fairly new thing, isn't it? It's only been in place since the signing of the Abraham Accords between Dubai and Tel Aviv.

12:31But it's been really popular. Do you think people will have second thoughts about using this flight now? I think they will. Now it's been suspended for six days, but the connection between Dubai, I mean, you know, Abu Dhabi and Dubai and Israel is very, very good. I mean, this is, you know, those airlines kept on flying to Israel even during days when we had missiles coming in from Iran. So they were very persistent and the connections were very good. And Israel, you know, they love this service. So I hope it will be back in place and they will put more security measures, I think, soon. You know, it's not new.

13:05It's like six or seven years since the signing of the Abraham Accord. So we got used to it. Let's hope, you know, it will continue. And that was Tal Schneider, the journalist with the Times of Israel. We'll be coming back to this story later this hour. More witness testimony of what happened today. And there's lots of detail on the BBC Live page with a minute-by-minute account of what happened today. Lots of videos on there and also comments from Israel as the day unfolded.

13:40Coming up in the next few minutes. Zero friction, remarkable speed. And it can be paid for like it's 1919 with your energy savings. That's a new advert by movie star Greta Garbo, advertising ball bearings decades after her death. It was all made with the help of AI. But would she approve of the use of her image for such a thing? The ethics of reanimating dead stars using AI coming up. And our top story, as we've been hearing, the Israeli prime minister says a co-pilot attempted to crash an Israeli-bound flight from Dubai before being overcome by passengers and crew.

14:39This is Rebecca Kesby with NewsHour, live from the BBC. Krista Pike was due to be executed by lethal injection today in the US state of Tennessee for a murder she committed when she was 18 years old back in 1996. She and her then-boyfriend beat, tortured and murdered another teenager, 19-year-old Colleen Slemmer, who they met at a job training camp for troubled teens. Just before an hour before the execution was due to take place today, news came through from Tennessee's Federal Court of Appeal saying it had issued a stay of execution following Pike's last-minute plea for the case to be re-examined.

15:21The case has attracted lots of press attention, not least because if it goes ahead, it would be the first time a woman was executed in Tennessee in more than 200 years. Well, earlier I spoke to Professor Sandra Babcock. She's an expert on gender and the death penalty at Cornell Law School in New York State. She's also worked on Krista Pike's defence. And it was while Professor Babcock was on our earlier edition of NewsHour this afternoon that she heard about this stay of execution. She told us what happened. Well, about 9.30 this morning, Eastern Time, the Federal Court of Appeals issued a stay of execution so that it could examine issues surrounding Krista Pike's history of sexual abuse and rape.

16:08These are facts that were never considered by the jury that sentenced her to die. and the state of Tennessee very recently conceded that she is indeed the victim of serial sexual abuse and rape, that these were documented crimes against Krista and this is a change in the state's position. It had previously called her a liar and tried to minimize her claims of abuse saying that she had fabricated them. So the state, the Court of Appeals issued a stay of execution so that it could take a closer look at that legal issue. And do we know the timing of how long that might take and what may happen next?

16:53The torturous thing is that we actually don't know. The state of Tennessee is still trying to execute Krista. They have asked the Supreme Court of the United States, which as you know, is a very conservative court, to vacate the stay of execution so that the execution can go forward. If that happened, it would foreclose the ability of this Court of Appeals from examining these issues that are so important to understanding why it is Krista Pike is on death row today. And she's been on death row for 30 years. I don't know whether you've had a chance to speak to her since that stay of execution happened.

17:31But I mean, it was only about an hour or so before she was due to die. How does she process that? It's really impossible to process something like that. It is absolutely psychological torture. It is, in my mind, akin to a mock execution. And this is the nature, the barbaric nature of the death penalty in this country. And we, instead of looking at whether this is the kind of person that the state should be coldly and in a calculating and deliberate way, um, executing for a crime that she committed at the age of 18. Um, this, the state is determined to go forward, uh, at, at any cost. Um, and you know, we shouldn't be in such a rush to, to exterminate human life.

18:27If we have a death penalty, we should make sure that the people that we are killing are the most irredeemable and depraved killers. That is not the case with Krista Pike. That's Professor Sandra Babcock there. She's an expert on gender and the death penalty at Cornell Law School in New York State. And she's also been working on Krista Pike's defence. Well? I want to be alone. Where have you been? I suppose I can cancel the Vienna contract. I just want to be alone. You're going to be very much alone, my dear madame. This is the end. That, of course, was Greta Garbo uttering the famous line from the 1932 film Grand Hotel.

19:15Now, 36 years after she died and 85 years after she retired completely from acting, the Swedish-born actress is making a return to our screens, this time in AI form as an advertisement for ball bearings manufacturer SKF. Zero friction, remarkable speed, and it can be paid for like it's 1919 with your energy savings. Now, if you don't mind, I want to be alone. That's the artificial intelligence generated version of Greta Garbo there. Well, the rationale behind the AI resurrection is that Garbo's second ever onscreen role was in a promotional film for the Swedish industrial giant. And her appearance has raised questions about the use of AI to resurrect the dead and over who gets the right to choose what to do with a dead actor's image.

20:19Earlier, I spoke to Dr Dominic Lees. He's an associate professor of filmmaking at Reading University who specialises in the use of generative AI in the screen industries. and I asked him what he made of using AI to bring back dead actors to life. It's in a very murky legal zone. The big questions are who controls us after we're dead and law internationally is to kind of work out those questions. Who controls our voice? Who controls our faces and our images? Both while we're alive and after our death post-mortem. So we don't know the specifics of this, but I mean, we do know that Garbo retired decades ago, didn't want to do any more acting and was famously a recluse.

21:11I mean, we don't know whether legally, I suppose, her estate does have ownership over this. Have you managed to read into that? Well, we've got a new situation in which the estate of a celebrity no longer just handles the financial affairs and so on after their death, but now controls their likeness and can deploy that for financial gain. And that would not have been something that Greta Garbo was aware of when her executives were appointed. So this is a new situation we're encountering. In terms of artistically, I mean, obviously, AI is being used in all sorts of areas of film in many different ways, in special effects and in music as well.

22:03But ethically, there are so many questions around the use of AI in the creative industries. This is a huge question for the creative industries and for performers. We found that in the UK, voice actors have lost 70 or 80 percent of their income in the last couple of years because of the advent of voice cloning. So companies are able to sell voice clones to perform audio performances rather than hiring actors to do that work. And now we're moving on to the point where an actor's likeness can be reproduced visually. So that danger moves on from voice actors to screen actors. And briefly, of course, famously, James Earl Jones, the voice of Darth Vader, he did allow his likeness and his voice to be used for that character, I think.

23:00Yes, and there's other examples as well. Back in 2021, Bruce Willis allowed himself to be faked for a Russian cell phone advert. So it's not unprecedented what Greta Garbo is doing today. That's Dr Dominic Lees there, Associate Professor of Filmmaking at Reading, speaking to us earlier. And as I was listening to that, I just see this from the AFP news agency reporting that Google is restricting access to a new AI model over safety concerns. It looks as if it's the Gemini 4 model, but we'll bring you more details as we get there.

23:41It felt like everything I believed in was suddenly collapsing. This is the story of an Islamic boarding school in Indonesia with a dark secret. Of the school's head teacher. This was someone I respected above anyone else. And the investigation led by students he's trying to silence. If this is leaked to the media, I'll be destroyed. This is World of Secrets, catching my teacher. Listen on BBC.com, the BBC app or wherever you get your BBC podcasts.

24:16Welcome back to NewsHour. 50 years ago, a relationship began in a BBC studio. A young cellist called Stephen Isserlis heard a performance on a very special cello, a Stradivarius known as the Marquise de Corde-Béran. Little did he know that years later, he would become its custodian when Stephen was loaned that cello to care for it and share it with the rest of us. To mark the 300th year since it was built, he's issued a special collection of 10 discs to which it tells the story of their partnership. He and the Marquise came into another BBC studio earlier and he's been speaking to my colleague, Chloe Tilley.

25:00This is the Marquis de Couperon Stradivarius of 1726, 300 years ago. And the Marquis was apparently a French aristocrat who got guillotined in the revolution. So my poor cello is probably still suffering from post-traumatic stress. But he seems OK now. I heard this cello when I was a little boy. and then much later I was sitting next to my best friend and after one moment he turned to me and said, that's the cello for you. I mean, that was years ago and I had no idea I'd be playing it then. How did it find its way to you or you to it? Well, it belongs to the Royal Academy of Music and so they offered it to me, which was very kind of them.

25:42Of course, it has to roll over. It's not a loan for life. Well, I think it's a loan for life. I put this to them that if they ever take it away from me, I'll kill myself, but they don't quite agree with that.

25:56Obviously we're on the radio, so people aren't able to see it. Just explain to us the beauty of what I see before me. Well, it's a rich, sort of quite dark brown, with the sort of beautiful stripes down it from, of course, the original tree, which apparently may have been, it may really be true, that it was cut down at midnight on a full moon. And a beautiful scroll. I don't think it affects the sound, but it's just Stradivarius sort of showing what he can do.

26:28Talk to us, if you would, about the music that you're releasing to mark the 300th birthday, 300-year birthday of your cello. Talk to us about the choices that you made. I suppose the most important music there are the Bach Suites. I never felt I'd be ready to record the Bach Suites, and then my father said, look, I'm 90, I want you to record the Bach Suites. It was very nice because he particularly loved the sixth, the last of the Bach Suites, and he came the day I recorded that and sat in the box.

27:04I do believe, and this is entirely my feeling, I may be completely wrong, that it represents, in the Bachs Vies, the resurrection. It's full of joy, that piece, and I can see why he loved it.

27:30What a treat for the ears that was. That was Stephen Isselis and my colleague Chloe Tilley. And we also heard from Marquise de Corberon, of course.