Kushner meets Netanyahu after Hamas talks on peace plan

0:03Hello and welcome to the programme. This is NewsHour from the BBC World Service and we're coming to you live from London. I'm Paul Henley. Coming up a bit later, on the day that the trial for the murder of the rapper Tupac Shakur begins, we'll hear from his brother. The justice I would like, I would never get. I want my brother back. Period. I want my little brother back. The amount of pain, distress, heartache that the family has gone through and Pax fans have gone through is unmatched. And we'll hear more from Moprim Shakur in about 15 minutes time. First on the program today, President Trump's Middle East envoy Jared Kushner has been meeting Israel's Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu today following rare talks that he had with Hamas leaders yesterday.

0:55Mr Kushner is seeking to revive the US-backed Gaza peace proposals, plans that have been rejected soundly by Israel already. Israeli officials said this meeting had been focused on elements that could be agreed. Mr Kushner is reported to have pushed the Palestinian armed group Hamas for a disarmament that would be fully verifiable. Without that, few rate the chances of a meaningful agreement with Israel. Meanwhile, in Gaza itself, conditions remain grim. James Smith is a doctor from the UK, currently working in Deir al-Bala around the midpoint of the Strip. The hospitals are still received trauma-wounded patients because Israel's attacks continue throughout Gaza.

1:38We're still diagnosing and treating malnutrition in children. Patients are going without medication for prolonged periods of time. approximately 50 % of essential medicines per the World Health Organization are at zero or critically low stock within the Ministry of Health stores at the moment. Just before we came on air, I spoke to Ahmed Youssef, who's a former senior Hamas official. He was special advisor to Hamas's political leader, Ismail Haniyeh, before he was killed in Tehran in 2024. He's now with the House of Wisdom think tank and is a visiting professor at the Islamic University of Gaza.

2:17From Gaza, he gave me his reaction to yesterday's talks with Hamas. I think it's excellent. Actually, for the first time, they have met with a huge number of people from the Politburo of Hamas and that's giving impression how serious are Hamas regarding open discussion or open negotiation with the Americans and getting the commitment from the American side that the Israelis will abide with whatever they will decide as outcome of this negotiation between Hamas and the Americans. What do you think will be Hamas's main demands? What do they want first and foremost? All the time, everybody tried to blaming Hamas as hardening the negotiation because they were talking about the disarmament of Hamas.

3:09And at this time, they said that they're decommissioning weapons. But at the same time, they would like to get guarantees that there is a protection for the people inside Gaza. Because, you know, there were a lot of Israeli collaborators and the Israelis violating all the time the ceasefire. And they need somebody to guarantee them that when they surrender their weapons, there is going to be a protection for everybody living in Gaza. So once we have people like peacekeeping forces will enter in Gaza, the Egyptian forces, peace force to protect the law and order in Gaza, they make it a positive sign that everybody happy that in that time it's not Hamas to be blamed.

3:55It's supposed to be if anybody violating what has been discussed, it should be blamed. And we know, all of us know, that Netanyahu is the one who all the time tries to sabotage whatever has been decided between the negotiations. Can you be a bit more specific? Under what circumstances would Hamas disarm fully? If there is international forces, peace force, entering to Gaza and giving protection that Netanyahu is not continuing his series of massive killing in Gaza. He needs somebody like the United States to tell them that, OK, we will give our words and no more genocide, no more violating the ceasefire, and no more drones dropping bombs in the camps or anything like that.

4:50They need somebody to give them this kind of assurances. You'll be aware that the Israeli government says it will not withdraw from current lines in Gaza until Hamas is completely disarmed. If Israeli forces were still inside Gaza, but international peacekeeping forces were there too, keeping everything in line, keeping agreements in line, just to be clear, Hamas would disarm, would it, under those circumstances? No, but still, when they were negotiating things that Israeli withdraw from Gaza, because I don't think Gaza will have stability and security on 25 % of the land for like 2 million people living in this displacement.

5:35I'm sure that things can go simultaneously, disarming Hamas, and at the same time withdrawing Israeli from the rest of Gaza. And this gives confidence for both sides, Jan, that the ceasefire should be respected from both sides. That's what will happen in the near future. There's supposed to be a peace agreement in force in Gaza now. What do you think of it? That's fine. That's fine. It's going to be something like this will take place. I think most of the people here in Gaza, they will agree and appreciate whoever trying to help both sides to ending the war. But the war is not finished yet. You're clear about that?

6:17I'm sure, because every day there's Israeli dropping bombs, killing, attacking, targeting different kind of peoples. And nobody here in the camps believes that the war has been stopped any time. There is clearly a problem of deep mistrust on both sides. What reassurances could you give the Israelis and the international community that Hamas had laid down its arms once it had said it had done so? We are the weakened one on the equation, and the Israelis, actually, they have all kinds of weapons and the capabilities to attack Gaza, and they have all the high-tech weapons that they are dominating all the Gaza airspace.

7:02So I don't think we are the one who should be dismantled or disciplined. Israelis also should be disciplined. And actually, everybody have the sense that Netanyahu will change his tactics. And we know that because the election in a couple of months in Israel, Netanyahu will continue attacking the Palestinians and killing them to convince the Israelis that he is the one who should be voted for. So you don't have much optimism about the talks happening today? I hope to keep my finger crossed, actually, and think that the people really, they are from my side, our side, the people are very serious about stopping the war and stopping the killing and showing the Palestinians in the camps.

7:49There is a chance for peace and truth. And for that, Hamas will do everything. But we need the guarantees from the Israeli side. and the only one who may be having the guarantees or can give the guarantees if there is a peaceful force here in Gaza and also the Americans. That was former senior Hamas official Ahmed Youssef speaking to me from Khan Yunus in Gaza. Let's talk now about the chances of success for today's talks in Jerusalem. Very little has emerged so far about what's actually been said. Let's talk live to our Middle East correspondent Yolande Nell, who joins us from the Israeli capital.

8:26Welcome, Yolande. And is anything concrete expected from talks between Benjamin Netanyahu and Jared Kushner today? So we've been told by the Israeli Prime Minister's office that a statement's coming. We're still waiting for that. Not a great deal has been said officially about these talks at all. We really were just kind of being confirmed so far that they're taking place, that Mr Netanyahu's been meeting Jared Kushner, both in his capacity, of course, as a senior representative of the US-led Board of Peace, but as also President Trump's Middle East envoy with Mr Trump being his father-in-law.

9:01And I think at the moment you really sense the Board of Peace wants so much to show that President Trump's peace plan for Gaza can still move forwards after it was announced with such great ceremony late last year and despite the fact that in the last week Benjamin Netanyahu has come out so strongly rejecting the roadmap that it's agreed with Hamas and that was being hailed by Mr. Trump as being sort of a major breakthrough. There have been some comments by the president to Fox News just a short time ago. He talks a lot about Iran and Oman, but he does move on to talking about what's happening here.

9:43And he said that Israel should not be carrying out strikes in Gaza. This is in line with Hamas demand as efforts continue to advance to the next phase of the peace plan. He said, we have our own relationship with Hamas. They are giving up their guns. So it's trying to make clear in his words that he doesn't see things at the moment as having reached an impasse. He still has faith in the deal that was agreed both most recently with Hamas and the Board of Peace, but also with his overall Gaza peace plan. He also sort of tantalisingly says something about how he may endorse somebody in the upcoming Israeli elections, which, of course, are so much in the background at the moment.

10:28Yes. And how hard will it be for the US, even as Israel's closest ally, to put meaningful pressure on Jerusalem in the run up to those Israeli elections? I mean, at the moment, the Israeli prime minister's Likud party is trailing in the polls. So he is really feeling a lot of pressure domestically going into this vote. And you also have far right ministers in particular within the governing coalition who would most likely be Mr. Netanyahu's partners if he were to get through the vote to be in that position to try to form a new government. And they are pushing at the moment very hard for actually a much harsher response in Gaza.

11:14As an example, there's been a lot of media coverage of a podcast interview that the far-right National Security Minister Itamar Ben-Gavir came with a former hostage in Gaza, Ron Braslavsky. And he's saying to him that he wants targeted assassinations in Gaza, killing, he says, 30 to 40 people each night. He said it's not just those who pose an immediate threat. There are people there who are not worthy of life. They shouldn't live. They are not even people. Is there any way the Israeli elections could help the chances of a peace deal for Gaza soon? I mean, it will be part of the calculation that there could be a change in government and a new government could be more amenable to doing a deal.

12:01But at the same time, I think there is an acknowledgement here that there will be a lot of assurances have to be given in general to the Israeli public because people are very sceptical about Hamas's willingness to disarm. That has been a major sticking point up to now. But it's also because, you know, Hamas has always said that it has the right to, you know, armed struggle, that this is part of resisting Israel's occupation of Palestinian land, to use some of its terms. And, you know, when it comes to Israel's concerns, it's worried about Qatar and Turkey being involved in verification and showing that they can check Hamas is meeting its commitments.

12:44They're worried about the idea that there would be storage of weapons, not complete destruction. That's storage overseen by a Palestinian technocratic committee. Yolan Nell in Jerusalem. This is the BBC World Service and NewsHour.

13:00Coming up, a former army general from South Korea urges the US not to walk away from an alliance against his northern neighbours. Besides the semiconductors, K-pop and K-drama and the very important Korean washing machine, I would say that there's value in Northeast Asia and right at the center of Northeast Asia is South Korea. And South Korea is where, as many would put it, is the linchpin. If you lose South Korea, next is Japan and then it's the Northern Pacific. So take your choice. The main news headlines. President Trump's son-in-law has held talks with the Israeli Prime Minister as he seeks to advance a US-backed peace plan for Gaza.

13:44And the opposition in Zambia has dismissed claims it was plotting an insurrection at the time of last week's presidential elections.

14:00I'm Paul Henley with NewsHour, live from the BBC. The American rapper Tupac Shakur was gunned down on the Las Vegas Strip nearly 30 years ago, creating one of hip-hop's most infamous and enduring unsolved crime cases. Now Dwayne D. Davis, a self-described former gang leader, is standing trial for his murder with opening statements due to start today. The BBC's Shaima Khalil is following the case and she sent this report. In 1996, Tupac Shakur was everywhere. California Love was an anthem. All Eyes on Me was selling millions, and he was starring in films. At 25, Tupac was at the height of his career.

14:42At 25, he was gunned down. Because everybody still wants to know what happened. There's been no movement in 30 years, which is wild to me. I sat with Tupac's older brother, Moprim Shakur, who described receiving the news that his brother had been shot in Las Vegas. I know it's a long time ago, but what do you remember thinking? Worry. I was just worried how bad it was. All I had known, he got shot. So until I reached Vegas, I didn't know the status of things. And Pac was a tough little dude. He had already survived being shot five times. And I was just praying that it wasn't as worse as it was.

15:21He had already survived one near-fatal shooting, but he couldn't survive a second. Rap star Tupac Shakur died last night after a brief life in a rough business. He was 25. Tupac's murder has long been associated with the bitter East Coast-West Coast rap feud, but prosecutors say the shooting grew out of a confrontation involving rival Compton gangs. Nearly 30 years on, Dwayne Keefe D. Davis is on trial for murder. Have the right to have the jury sentenced you if they come back on a first-degree murder verdict, and you have decided to waive that right. Is that correct? No, it's not. And at the heart of the case are his own words, accounts he gave in interviews and his memoir about his alleged role in the killing.

16:03Legal analyst and attorney Sean Kent says it will be an uphill battle for the defense. This is what makes the case so fascinating. The two biggest pieces of evidence against Keefe D. came from Keefe D. However, this doesn't mean that they're going to be presented to the jury as admissions of guilt. Keefe D has the right to take the stand and say, I made all this up. I lied to sell copies of the book. I lied to the police. I'm a liar. But I did not murder Tupac. If he does decide to take the stand and give this kind of testimony, then he'll be cross-examined using his own words. I am Mike Tyson.

16:38On the night of September the 7th, 1996, Tupac and Death Row Records boss Suge Knight watched Mike Tyson fight at the MGM Grand in Las Vegas. Afterwards, security cameras captured Tupac and members of his entourage, attacking Kifidi's nephew. Later that night, Tupac left with Suge Knight in a black BMW. At a junction near the Las Vegas Strip, a white Cadillac pulled alongside them. Tupac was shot four times. He died six days later. Tupac was just a fascinating character. I mean, every aspect of him. He was talented, he was complex, he was complicated. Santi Elijah-Holy is the author of An American Family, the Shakurs and the Nation They Created.

17:21He provides good just dance tracks, just make you feel just like you want to just, you know, cruise with your windows down. But he also makes you want to stop and think about, you know, social justice issues and sit down and actually parse his lyrics. Hey, Keith, Metro Police, come over here. For decades, the murder investigation barely moved. No arrest, no trial. Then, in 2023, Keefe D was arrested. He's now charged with first-degree murder, accused of helping organize the attack, although prosecutors don't claim he fired the gun. He's pleaded not guilty. Mupreem Shakur says he's cautiously optimistic about the trial, but after nearly 30 years, he says no verdict can give him what he truly wants.

18:06The justice I would like, I would never get. I want my brother back, period, dot. I want my little brother back. The amount of pain, distress, heartache that the family has gone through and Pac's fans have gone through is unmatched. The trial may finally provide some answers about what happened that night, But no verdict can fill the years of silence or fully explain why after all this time, all eyes are still on Tupac Shakur. The BBC's Shaima Khalil reporting. The American actress Hayden Panettiere has died at the age of 36. She was best known for her roles in Heroes and Nashville. Ms Panettiere had lived almost all her life in front of the cameras, having first appeared in a TV commercial before she was a year old.

19:04She'd twice been nominated for Golden Globe Awards. She had spoken openly about her struggles with substance abuse and mental health issues. No cause of death has been confirmed, and her family's called for privacy to process what they say is their unimaginable loss. The actress previously spoke to BBC Breakfast back in 2013. I still grew up a young person in the spotlight, dealing with a lot of scrutiny and a lot of judgement. and as long as you have people who are willing to tell you the truth and who are not afraid to tell you the truth and who are there to yank you back when you need it and give you a reality check, you know.

19:44TV critic and broadcaster Scott Bryan joins me now in the studio. Welcome, Scott. Hi. Hayden Panettiere was a star. It looked like she could have gone on to become a very big star, didn't it? Yeah, I mean, I think she was already a big star already. I mean, she was a part of some of the biggest TV shows and film franchises of the late noughties, early 2010s. She was in the Scream franchise. She got a lot of applauded for her role in Nashville. I think for many people, she'll be remembered for her role in Heroes. I mean, cheerleader saved the world and was the catchphrase of that show. It was all about her character that she was fantastic at playing.

20:21and I think she throughout her career had a consistency not only in the roles she ended up playing and that were incredibly popular but also I think had a quality to her acting which made it look effortless I mean she was incredibly distinctive in all of these characters that she portrayed but also had great range in terms of the the backstories of these characters as well and I think this is the thing I think about nostalgia is that you always remember where you were when you were growing up when you see these people on TV. So of course it's very sad to hear the news that she's no longer with us.

20:58Earlier this year she released a very candid memoir where she discussed her struggles away from the screen. Can you tell me a bit about some of those? Yes so it received a lot of critical acclaim this memoir. She talks about growing up in the public eye. She had her first role in a commercial when she was about 10 months old. she then had a bigger platform when she was a character voice in A Bug's Life which of course was a huge film in in the late 90s early noughties and in her memoir she talks about the difficulties of growing up in that public eye she talks about exploitation her experiences of depression her experiences of addiction and domestic abuse I think the memoir had received a lot of praise only released three months ago.

21:44She'd recently been on a tour where she was talking about it. So, of course, to have this memoir followed by her death has been a real shock, obviously. She had a daughter. She does, yeah, she did, yeah. And the daughter is with her father, is that right? He'd been granted custody. Yes, which she had opened up in interviews about as well previously. I mean, I think she will be remembered a lot about the roles that she had played. There's been tributes by Viola Davis calling her an amazing talent, as well as, quote, being an old wise soul with such a deep heart. I think, you know, there will obviously over the next few days, a lot of talk about her personal life.

22:24I think she'll be remembered and celebrated as a fantastic actor. Thank you very much, TV critic and broadcaster Scott Bryan. Remembering Hayden Panettiere, whose death has been announced today. She was just 36. BBC World Service. This is News Hour.

22:48Welcome back now to NewsHour, with economic uncertainty still hanging over the jobs market in many countries across the world. Some of the workers are deciding it's safer to stay put rather than make their next career move. It's a phenomenon known as job-hugging. Vishala Sripathma finds out who's doing it and why. I'm on my way to an art studio in London to meet an artist I'll call Rachel it's not her real name but her story certainly is until very recently she worked somewhere very different she was an architect but after staying in a job for a long time that she didn't really like she finally decided to take the plunge and leave that instinct now has a name it's called job hugging I'm a mum, I needed a job.

23:39I couldn't risk it and I didn't know what was waiting for me if I quit. But I was holding on to it because of all the memories, because I kept thinking it could change and because I needed a job, of course. In many ways, it's the opposite of what we saw during the pandemic, when workers quit jobs in record numbers in search of better pay or greater flexibility. Some employers say it comes at a cost. Gene Marks is a small business owner and columnist based in the United States. So they are going to be doing at least the bare minimum to make sure that they are keeping their jobs. They're going to shy away from doing things that are innovative or creative or risk taking.

24:23I'm thinking particularly of one client of mine that I was just out to see this week. So they're a manufacturer. they have a salesperson working for them who has been working for them for like 20 years. That guy clocks in at 8.59 every morning and leaves at 4.59 every day. But you know what? He generates his numbers. And although that employer in particular looks at that salesperson and says, all right, could we be getting somebody more productive? We've had that conversation a hundred times over the past 10 years. And each time we come to the conclusion that it's not worth it. He's doing good enough.

24:57So he may be a job hugger, but he is a pretty good example of at least he's taking care of what he needs to take care of. So is job hugging simply a sensible response to uncertain economic times? Or does it tell us something about how attitudes to work are changing? Jimmy McLaughlin hosts the podcast Jimmy's Jobs of the Future, and is a former advisor to the UK government. So I think the first thing you have to do is that you have to go out and see people for coffee. You need to kind of get out there. And I think also one of the big trends is how you're kind of building your personal brand within your industry.

25:33Just keeping yourself in people's minds. For Rachel, taking that leap meant leaving architecture behind and starting again as an artist. Thanks, Scott. I have a lovely partner who encouraged me and kept asking me, what are you doing? You don't need this. For many others, the choice is less clear cut. Stay with the security of the job you know or risk the uncertainty of something new. Vishala Sripathma reporting. You can hear more about job hugging at bbc.com or by searching for Business Daily wherever you get your podcasts.

26:17You're listening to NewsHour here on the BBC World Service. I'm Paul Henley. President Trump says he is dramatically scaling back joint military exercises with South Korea. Those exercises are due to begin today. The US president described them as costly, inappropriate and hostile to North Korea. He said he had a very good relationship with North Korea's leader, Kim Jong-un. South Korea's defence ministry said the joint drills had begun and would proceed as scheduled over the coming days. I've been speaking to In-bum Chun, who is a retired South Korean army general. He gave me his reaction first to Mr.

26:57Trump's comments. Well, first, he's sending a message to North Korea that he wants to talk to them. Secondly, he's clearly showing his displeasure with the current South Korean government and the policies that this current South Korean government has been pursuing towards various US policies in the Middle East and trade. So it's a warning and a olive branch to the North Koreans. What do you think of President Trump feeling cordial towards the North Korean leader? Well, I know that President Trump has a habit of exaggerating. So I can understand that this is an extension of his way of communicating.