US launches 'heavy' strikes on Iran

0:03Hello and welcome to NewsHour from the BBC World Service. We're coming to you live from London. I'm James Menendez. And we're going to begin once again today in the Middle East, because any hopes that a lull in the fighting between the US and Iran earlier in the week might lead to something more durable seem to have flown out of the window. Indeed, that's been the trajectory of the conflict ever since the ceasefire, agreed in the middle of June, collapsed at the beginning of this month, principally over control of the strategic Strait of Hormuz. Since then, it's been alternating rounds of US strikes on sites in Iran, and Iranian strikes aimed at US assets right across the region.

0:41Well, our Middle East correspondent Yola Nel is following developments from Jerusalem and she's been telling me more about the latest flare-up. So US forces are said to have bombed dozens of sites in Iran which they say are linked to the Revolutionary Guards. Military command centres, missile and drone sites, coastal surveillance sites, they say. Iranian state media say three Revolutionary Guards members were killed but also a couple and their child when a residential building on Kesham Island in the Strait of Hormuz was hit. Now, retaliation came fairly quickly. Kuwait said that one worker was killed in an Iranian attack on a Chinese firm in the north of the country.

1:19And then in Jordan, again, five missiles shot down. The armed forces there say no reports of casualties. But this US attack earlier on Iran was said to be a powerful response to Iranian attacks one day ago on US forces in Jordan, which are also said to have been unsuccessful. Does it feel like this war, certainly at the moment, is spreading geographically? Certainly, first of all, you know, the lull that we saw at the end of last week now seems to be over. It remains to be seen, though, if the pattern of, you know, nightly US strikes, Iranian retaliation against US forces and US allies in the region is going to resume.

2:01You've still got talks going on in the background via mediators. But, you know, in recent days, the war has widened and it has become more complicated. You know, Saudi Arabia launched those attacks with the US on Iran backed groups in Iraq. Although we are told from reports that when the Saudi defence minister was meeting President Trump last night, he was passing on a message that says that Saudi Arabia is calling for a de-escalation. But I don't think we've heard at the last of Iraq. Some 20 members of this pro-Iranian militia said to have been killed, as well as several Iranian advisers. And then, of course, you've had in the past week, a lot of attention switched as well to the Houthis in Yemen, their threats to Red Sea shipping.

2:45And the Egyptian authorities saying that a fire which broke out in a port yesterday, they're saying that was a drone attack. I mean, do we know where that drone came from? That has not been confirmed yet. No party said to have claimed responsibility. There was a big fire that started off the port of Damietta on Egypt's northern Mediterranean coast. And now we're looking at it as another possible new front in the US-Iran war, and that's causing jitters on the energy markets because, of course, of its proximity to the Suez Canal, which is really the last safe route out of the Middle East now for Saudi oil.

3:25You know, important to mention here that Egypt is a close ally of the US, of course, in the region. But we've had no reports of it coming under attack in the past five months since the Iran war started, unlike other US allies across the Middle East. And that is really because Egypt does have this long time national security policy of not allowing foreign troops to be based on its soil. But of course, Egypt does have significant US commercial interests based there. Our Middle East correspondent Yolan Nell, and we'll be hearing a bit more about that strike on Egypt in a moment. But first, let's hear from inside Iran now, something that's not that easy at the moment.

4:05Not, I should say, reaction to the latest strikes and counter-strikes, but how people are feeling at what is a pivotal moment in Iran's history. The BBC senior international investigations correspondent, Nawal al-Maghaffi, has travelled the length of the country, from north to south on a train travelling through its economic heartland. On board, Iranians from all walks of life, each with their own story and from parts of the country that foreign journalists aren't able to get to. Here's Nawal's report.

4:39We're on the overnight train from Tehran to Bender Abbas. It's a 22-hour journey that takes you from Iran's political heart in Tehran to its most strategic coastline. I've been taken aback by just how nice this train is. I mean, we're staying in a cabin with two beds and four plush chairs. I'm really looking forward to being on this train and speaking to Iranians about what life has been like as this war has gone on. It's in every Iranian's nature to adapt to the circumstances. It was hard, it was frightening, we were worried, we were anxious, but we still tried to live within those very conditions, to have a life, to keep our daily routine, to remain hopeful for the future.

5:31In the restaurant carriage, I met Azadeh, a lawyer, and Zepideh, a beautician. Although they were cautious to speak in public, they agreed to an interview in their cabin. Actually, I love Iran very much. I love it so, so much. But when I see my youth slipping away, and my goals, my dreams, and all my hope being lost, I have no choice but to leave. For the sake of progress, to reach my goals, I have no choice. You know, we saw before this war, a lot of young people, a lot of people across Iran, go out and protest. There were a lot of people that had hope that this war would mean a big change would happen in Iran.

6:12What do you think about that and how do you feel about how things have played out? I'll start with Azadeh first. Have a think about it. She doesn't want to answer. She doesn't want to answer this? No, that's fine. Years of crippling sanctions, soaring inflation and anger at Iran's leadership pushed hundreds of thousands of people onto the streets. Speaking out against the government can come at a heavy cost. So we gathered some anonymous testimony. Emir took part in the protests. When we got there, there was a very large crowd. People were throwing stones and the police and the Basij had weapons in their hands and were shooting.

6:53Mostly we saw tear gas. And then we clearly saw the police getting down on the ground, taking up a clash of the cuff and aiming at people. And we were completely shocked at how easily and how casually they were taking aim and firing at people. A few doors down, I meet a member of a football team. Abdullah's heading back home to Minab. On the first day of the war, the town became the scene of one of the conflict's defining tragedies. They attacked a school that was full of children. They were all seven, eight or nine year old students. I was really upset. Our whole country was upset. There really was a strange grief across the whole of Hormuzgan province.

7:35The day of their funeral was something else too. I don't know. Everyone who went there wept. It really was an extraordinary day. For some, this war has not achieved what they'd hoped for. Emir again. In my opinion, America has sort of lost the war. It's lost its way. This campaign became about oil and the Strait of Hormuz, and we want to save the strait. It's all about money. The people mean nothing. They are irrelevant. The people are no longer a consideration. Iran is no stranger to political friction. The tensions between Tehran, Tel Aviv and Washington have been decades in the making, but they are only now playing out on the battlefield.

8:19And as both sides compete to shape the legacy of this war, the impact is still being felt not just on this train but across the world. BBC's Nawal al-Maghaffi reporting there from Iran and I should say she's able to do so on condition that none of her material is used on the BBC's Persian service and similar restrictions do apply to all international media organisations operating in Iran. Well let's find out a bit more about that fire which broke out on two gas storage tankers docked in Damietta port on Egypt's Mediterranean coast. That was on Wednesday. Today, the authorities said that the fire was caused by a drone.

9:03Timothy Kaldas is a political economist and deputy director of the Tahrir Institute for Middle East Policy and joins us live. Thanks very much for being with us here on NewsHour. Is it becoming any clearer who fired the drone? Up until now, there isn't any. No one has claimed responsibility. The Egyptian authorities haven't pointed the finger towards anyone. So there isn't any kind of clarity in terms of the perpetrator. But certainly, given the escalating hostilities throughout the region, many suspect that this is part of the effort by Iran and its partners to demonstrate its capacity to disrupt international shipping and energy supplies.

9:50The New York Times has reported that Iranian sources said this was part of Iran's effort to send that message. However, they didn't get confirmation on whether Iran or its partners were involved in the attack. Is it also perhaps an attempt to draw Egypt into the war? What might be the consequences of that, do you think? It's unclear if that's the goal. I think that would be imprudent. I think that it's possible, given that the target was specifically an American-owned liquefied natural gas tanker, that they are hoping to isolate the response. But certainly there is kind of growing pressure on a number of countries in the region to join and participate in military action.

10:46But the Egyptians have been very reluctant to do so, even before this war, in other conflicts that were targeting groups that were aligned with Iran, such as the Houthis in Yemen. When the Gulf states, such as Saudi Arabia, the UAE and Qatar launched a war in Yemen, the Egyptians really refused to play a meaningful role in that conflict. And is that the same now, that Egypt's just trying to stay out of it as far as it can? I mean, Egypt has been trying to promote diplomatic tracks and de-escalation from the outset. And to the frustration of some of its partners in the Gulf, such as the United Arab Emirates and reportedly Kuwait, they felt that there was too much kind of engagement with the Iranians and not enough solidarity with them as Iran was attacking them earlier in the war, of course.

11:38So Egypt's very much been focused on supporting the diplomatic efforts towards ending the war. And it makes sense for them. I mean, the war has been extremely disruptive, damaging for its economy, creating growing risks. And frankly, there isn't much domestic support for the U.S.-Israeli side when it comes to this conflict. Yeah. And just in the sort of 40 seconds we've got or so left, I mean, how damaging for the economy? And is that because of the sort of slowing of traffic through the Suez Canal that it controls? Yeah, I mean, the attacks inside the Red Sea and now the Mediterranean, so both sides of the Suez Canal, are going to drive up the cost of transiting the Suez Canal as well as reluctance to do so altogether.

12:19But more broadly, the rising cost of energy and disruption of supply in a country that imports a huge amount of natural gas is going to also place additional pressure on the hard currency reserves of Egypt that have already been a major challenge for them for quite a long time. Timothy, thank you very much indeed. Timothy Caldus is Deputy Director of the Tahrir Institute for Middle East Policy on that drone attack on that port on Egypt's Mediterranean coast. You're listening to News Out.

12:59Coming up later on the programme, we'll hear from a pilot who has just flown from Australia to France non-stop as the airline Qantas prepares for a regular non-stop London to Sydney flight. It was just amazing. We experienced all along this flight many, many, many things, like to sunset, to sunrise. The crew were super excited to do that. We were all along the flight quite awake and focused on this flight. More on that epic test flight coming up in half an hour. Our main headlines from the newsroom at the moment. Thousands of migrants are entering the Spanish North African enclave of Ceuta from Morocco after overwhelming border controls.

13:44And Poland's prime minister says a missile that landed deep inside the country was most likely Russian, but there's no reason, he said, to think Poland was the target.

14:00This is James Menendez with NewsHour live from the BBC. Now for Ukrainians, Russian barrages of missiles and drones, generally fired overnight when people are at home, have become a tragic fact of life. Last night was no exception. The government says that eight people were killed and many others injured in attacks on cities across the country. The authorities were able to warn people, though, prompting tens of thousands to pack up and head for shelters underground. It is something Ukrainians have been doing for a long time. But what are these shelters like? And why do some people stay at home while others run to safety?

14:36And what is the atmosphere down there like? I've been talking to Kiev resident Marina Hontarok, who spent last night in an underground car park where, as you'll hear, she didn't get much rest at all. It's much closer to me. That's why I decided to go there, because it's usually not much time before strikes. So we have this air raid alarms and then in a couple of minutes we get the strike. So it's not enough time for me to go to the metro station. And usually metro stations are overcrowded. There are lots of people there. So I decided to go in the parking lot. Just on how much time you get, you get the alert that strikes are imminent and it is just a few minutes, is it, that everybody has to try and rush and find somewhere to shelter?

15:27Now we have 24, 48 hour notice before the airstrikes so we can prepare. So we just check if it's going to happen or not. And usually I call even before air raid alarms now because these strikes happen just in a couple of minutes and it's not possible to leave house and get there in a couple of minutes. And what's it like in the car park? I mean, what are conditions like for people down there? We have the lights there and it's a little bit cold, but we bring blankets and all the stuff that can make us feel more comfortable there. people come with dogs, with their pets and children and all the families.

16:22So it's also a little bit noisy, but in general, it's fine. I mean, are you able to get any sleep when you're down there? Yes, I'm doing my best to get some sleep, but sometimes it's really hard because it's noisy. Yeah, and this is sort of a slightly sort of basic question, I suppose, But what about toilets? I mean, are there toilets down there? No, there are no toilets, unfortunately. So, yeah, there are no toilets. So you can go back home. We usually track everything that happens on different channels. So if we get some time between strikes, we can go home, for example, to the toilet. How long were you down there last night?

17:10Four hours. Four hours, right. Right. Marina, what can you hear from down there? I mean, presumably you can hear when the airstrikes hit the city. Yes, I could hear the explosions, for example, from my parking lot. But still, it feels much safer than staying at home. Marina, what is the atmosphere like down there? I mean, are people friendly or do people argue sometimes? I mean, obviously, it's a time of great, great stress, isn't it? And tension. Yes, but mostly people are friendly. Sometimes it's not enough space for everyone. But mostly people are friendly and just trying to be friendly and helpful.

17:52I mean, this is what been going on for years now. People must be getting very, very tired of having to keep up this routine of leaving their homes and going to the shelters. Yes, it's true. It's quite tiresome. I don't know. has it become has it become normal in a way yeah it's we we don't get emotional about it anymore we just know that we have to do that to feel safe and yeah it just it became kind of normal to us but still it's very thysome i'll say so do some people just not go to the shelters yes A lot of people stay at their homes. Sometimes I stay at home. Oh, really? Why do you sometimes decide to stay at home and other times decide to go to the shelter?

18:48When we have warnings about massive attacks, I usually go to the shelter. But when it's just a couple of ballistics, I can stay home just to hide in my closet. That was Kiev resident Marina Hontarok speaking to me a little earlier.

19:18The sound of the South Korean pop sensation BTS have announced they won't be submitting their music for consideration at next year's Grammy Awards. The news came in a coordinated Instagram post with all seven members of the band uploading an identical statement saying they hoped, quote, their music can be heard and loved for what it is rather than being divided by region or language. Let's talk to Ben Beaumont Thomas, music editor at The Guardian newspaper, who joins us live. Ben, very good to have you with us on the programme. What do you make of this move? Yeah, it's a finely balanced debate, I think, because on the one hand, the Grammys is a US-based awards show that is rooted in the American recording industry.

20:04And, you know, they've created this new award for best Asian pop performance, which will be given to artists who are predominantly singing in Asian languages. And I think that's quite a sort of well-meaning gesture on one level. It's trying to expand out the types of music that it champions. It's trying to kind of diversify the breadth of what they cover. but at the same time you can understand that bts who are one of arguably the biggest pop group in the world um who are who are every bit as accomplished as various american pop stars both creatively and commercially you know they they don't necessarily want to be thought of as an asian pop act they want to be thought of as a pop act and and they don't want to be kind of ring fenced and siloed away in this way so you can you can sort of see it from both sides yeah and the The Grammy's president, I mean, he's talked about celebrating different and new genres of music.

21:03I mean, no offence to BTS, but I mean, they don't sound that different and they're definitely not new, are they? That's it. I thought that was poorly worded when that statement was put out, because it seems to suggest that Asian pop is somehow a sort of new phenomenon. Well, Asia is a vastly populous and diverse continent with huge numbers of different pop scenes within it, from South Asia to Japan's very sophisticated pop market to the K-pop industry, which is one of the most powerful on Earth. So to have one award that sort of collects all those together is slightly meaningless almost. And also, yeah, the way it was announced didn't really honour the richness of that heritage in pop music.

21:54And just a brief, we've got about 30 seconds left. What does it mean for BTS, though? I mean, does it mean that they're not going to be up for any Grammys next year? Or can they still take part in the sort of bigger categories, if you like? i mean they would have been eligible for those but they've decided to withdraw their music from the grammys as a whole so they won't be appearing anymore and it'll be interesting to see if there's perhaps a bit of a domino effect whether other asian artists will think we don't want to be in this new category because it feels tainted by the fact that bts the the flagship group of asian pop has decided to pull out yeah ben thank you very much indeed ben beaumont thomas who's the music editor at The Guardian.

22:35You're listening to NewsHour from the BBC World Service. Do stay with us. We have got lots more coming up in the second half of the programme. Don't go away.

23:00Welcome back to NewsHour. Poland's Prime Minister Donald Tuska said the fate of the war in Ukraine may be decided in the next 100 days. It comes after another very heavy night of attacks by Russia on Ukraine that killed at least eight people, including two children. One of the missiles landed in Poland, creating a 10-metre-wide crater deep inside the country. Radek Sikorsky is Poland's foreign minister, and he's been talking to my colleague Sarah Montague about his prime minister's comments. The Russians may be counting that they might break Ukraine's resistance by attacks on heating and power generation.

23:39They've destroyed 80 % of Ukraine's electricity generating capacity, which of course affects not only civilians, but also production capabilities in the defense sector and so on. So Putin seems to be desperate in throwing his all at Ukraine. And what we've also seen is a missile land in Poland. How significant is that? Because obviously it's a violation of Polish airspace and so NATO airspace. Do you imagine that it was done deliberately? We don't know. But we've had these incidents before. At the beginning of the war, a similar missile landed 10 kilometers from my house, which is in Western Poland.

24:24It traversed two thirds of my country. But you have no doubt that it was a Russian missile. It seems to have been tracked across the territory of Ukraine and into Poland. And if it's the type of missile that our military thinks it's likely, judging by the speed and so on, only Russia owns and launches such missiles. So what should the response be, both to the idea that you're setting up that Ukraine is at a particular point where Russia is going to apply pressure, but also that there has been this violation of Polish airspace? Well, we need to stick to our plan of assistance to Ukraine. What's particularly needed is effectors to the patriot system, the latest PAC-3s.

25:17As allies, we have rallied around Ukraine with supplies, but clearly there are shortages. Right. Shortages that make Ukraine much more vulnerable. Indeed. And is that something that European nations should be addressing immediately? It's something that is being coordinated by NATO in Brussels with American leadership. These are weapons that are not in oversupplies, you know, as well as I do, that there is another war in them at least as well. Right. So there just aren't enough to go around, particularly given what's going on with America's war in Iran. why we need to rebuild our defence industry base, and why I welcome the announcement by President Trump in Ankara, I was there, that licences will be granted to make some of this equipment in Europe.

26:12That was Radek Sikorski, Poland's foreign minister, talking there to Sarah Montagu.

26:30This is the BBC in London. You're listening to NewsHour and I'm James Menendez. We're going to turn now to a court case that concluded on Wednesday here in London. It may not have received much attention outside the UK, but it has shed a light both on the ruthless operations and tactics of some gangs in Sweden and the sinister links of one of them to the Iranian regime and its activities abroad. Well, the case in London concerns Johannes Natland, a Norwegian teenager who was found guilty of travelling to England to carry out a murder on behalf of the Foxtrot Network, a Swedish organised crime group.

27:04He was caught before the killing took place. Footage of Natland's arrest released by police shows him opening his hotel room door to armed officers. As he comes out of his room, he sees the green targeting dots on his chest and mimes shooting at one of them.

27:24I'm with me in the studio Daniel Sanford the BBC's UK correspondent um Natlin hardly the the professional hitman of the movies he was a rank amateur how did how was he recruited yeah he was just 18 years old when he was arrested in that hotel in northern England with two hand guns and ammunition hidden under his bed he'd been recruited just a few days earlier by another Norwegian teenager, essentially using social media. What the Foxtrot Network had done is set up a system whereby this younger Norwegian teenager was recruiting people to carry out acts of violence for them. When Natland was recruited, he was told that he'd be paid about $28 ,000 to carry out a hit in England.