2025 NFL Week 18 Preview

18:27I think they'll enjoy it because they like to see what Tanner McKee can do. And I think they'll win with Tanner McKee. Talk about respect. I did not know. Ross Tucker is like in a fantasy camp this week doing a game with Kevin Harlan. They're showing Ross the respect that he's getting bumped up. I guess Trent Green maybe has a family thing or something. He's off this week. And that's big time. That's exciting for him. For the Eagles, to be clear, Nick Sirianni is being cagey. with the media, but I think it's very clear with the way that he's being cagey and the fact that last year they rested in week 18 and won the freaking Super Bowl and that the year before they did the opposite and A.J.

19:12Brown got hurt in that game with all of that in mind and the fact that they don't even can quote unquote control their destiny for the two seed or that they'd even particularly you know want the two seed that much anyways uh i feel pretty confident that a lot of eagles including jalen hurts aj brown players like that will be resting in this game yeah i

19:32Gregg Rosenthal:would say this is going to be as close to a preseason slash this version of the commanders game that we're going to see between the two teams because you would you would absolutely with the way that these eagles have totally burned out um on the seasons where they've had down seasons, it's been so apparent that the length of not just the season, but the postseason has affected them so significantly in the years that they've been bad or that they've fizzled out. And they have to go back. They have to go in and start prepping. This is a lot of people don't realize that this is the time of year for these playoff teams where they do start advancing two games ahead.

20:12Gregg Rosenthal:They start building analytics packets and strategy packets and tape packets two weeks in advance to make sure that they're almost treating this as a bye week in some ways. For sure. And, and then, and then going, just looking ahead to their next opponent and just hoping that everybody, even their depth guys stay as healthy as possible. Now they have to do some guesswork with who the next opponent will be, but you prepare for a couple of different guys. And oh, by the way, you can win the game anyways. They rested everyone last year and they beat the giants. Tanner McKee played well and they won by a touchdown anyway.

20:41So that, that happens when, when the backups win anyways.

20:45Patrick Claybon:And especially, And I don't know, you know, the variance in the game planning of the 2025 Philadelphia Eagles is going to be that significant.

20:52Gregg Rosenthal:Yeah, right. Depending on what are they going to do on offense?

20:55Patrick Claybon:They're going to do the same thing that they always do in which, you know, there's folks highly critical in the second half for Jalen Hurts. I think it was really a whole offense issue. Also, the Bills were out there playing pretty good football as well defensively that I think some time off would be very, very good for the defending Super Bowl champs. And they're going to get it. And guys like Lane Johnson, who they're expecting back for the playoffs. It's another week off. But maybe a guy like a Jordan Davis or a Jalen Carter, too, that just, like, you don't want to put any more tread on their tires.

21:25For the Commanders, it does sound like it's going to be Josh Johnson again at quarterback. I don't think Mariota is going to be available. And, yeah, so it's a last go for this Bobby Wagner, Vaughn Miller, Javon Kinlaw, Commanders team. I don't know if it'll be their last game in the NFL necessarily, but for some of them, it probably will be. And we'll see. It's a rare, really bad team where the coach is in place. The GM is in place. The G, you know, the coat, the quarterback is in place. There might be some coaching staff, you know, adjustments, but we've seen enough. We've talked enough about the commanders.

21:59I feel like this year. Bye.

22:02Gregg Rosenthal:Thanks for going to a new roster build model, please. For the love of God,

22:05Patrick Claybon:we'll get some great calls in 2026. Brown. Thank you for your contributions. It is the game. we'll all be watching on Saturday. Carolina at Tampa Bay, favored by two and a half at home. Wow. The over-under is 43 and a half. It's on ESPN and ABC because people will be able to watch this game on broadcast television, which I appreciate. Chris Fowler and Dan Orlovsky, along with Louis Riddick, on the call. Big spot. Do Baker and the Bucs stop this tragic slide and prevent him from having that look on his face that was on the sideline at the end of the game against the Dolphins?

22:42Gregg Rosenthal:I don't know. I, I, man, I've been watching these Bucks games and it's been depressing to be honest, because it's, it's painful clearly for him to be playing quarterback right now. Um, he's pressing too hard in some areas and making mistakes. I don't know if there's things that are clouding his judgment or if he can't move his body fully the way that he wants to. We don't know. He moved great last week. Really? See, I disagree. Some of the, some of the torque that he has to get in, in, Like, I just, I didn't think so. And I think some of the run, some of the scrambling, sure, was fine. And he looked like Baker on some of those pickups, but getting his full leverage and his full body into some of those throws and he was short on one and that was a really bad throw.

23:25Gregg Rosenthal:And it just, I don't know. He seems like he's just in a lot of pain to me. And I think this Panthers team, listen, I'm, I've given up trying to predict what they're going to do because they are so mercurial. If they get at least one good half out of these receivers went, which is usually the case when they do win these games. Cause, cause I haven't seen it consistently from these receiver, these Carolina receivers through the course of an entire game week to week. But if they get one good half out of these guys, then I think that they win this game. They just played, you know, two weeks ago and that game was pretty evenly played.

23:57I wonder if Todd Bowles watches that Seattle tape and be like, I know like he's not like the big press man type of type of guy, but man, they've got some good quarterbacks. We can, be physical against these wide receivers potentially. They have the people to potentially bully you. They benched Tykee Smith in the middle of that game. He was on the wrong end of a couple bad plays as a rookie against Miami, so maybe they make an adjustment there. And I did not know what to think about this game. And then the Falcons did it. They won on Monday Night Football. And then I realized I want mess. And the mess is the Buccaneers winning this game so that Saints-Falcons can decide the division.

24:41And so that the Buccaneers will just have this strange, awkward moment at the end where they didn't win the division, but they did win the game. But they just have to wait until tomorrow and start rooting on a Saints team that Jason Light was burying on Twitter not that long ago.

24:57Gregg Rosenthal:Kind of feels like a microcosm of their entire season. It just feels like the most NFC. I just want it for that. Sorry, Panthers fans. and I'll respect you if it happens the other way. Well, they have the personnel to do it.

25:11Patrick Claybon:I don't know that they will. The Seahawks just crowding the line of scrimmage and giving Bryce really no opportunity. They weren't threatened deep to the extent where you could see, even on the broadcast tape, like 10 guys there on the screen and it's like, okay, so there's zero respect for the Panthers to get anything deep. and maybe that's how you approach things, but I don't think the Bucs will come at it that way. But they've also given up so many big plays. Canales after the game, or on Monday rather, had some interesting quotes where he was like, Bryce had plenty of time in that game. Kind of put it on Bryce a little bit.

25:48He was like, offensive line was not an issue in that game, which, fair enough, he did take ownership of, I need to do a better job getting receivers open, McMillan specifically. They started in 13 personnel that game, so with the tight ends on the field, and Jadavion Sanders immediately got hurt. So maybe that messed with them. He's going on IR, so that's one less weapon. They are just short on weapons right now. And so, man, with the Buccaneers considering the personnel that they have and the experience that they have, the players throughout the roster, you should win this game. As bad as losing seven of eight is, to get swept by the Panthers in a three-week considering the rosters, That's bad.

26:33That's bad coaching.

26:34Gregg Rosenthal:Here's why I think I like what you said about walking up to the line of scrimmage and playing a little bit more press man, Greg, with these DBs. They can. And the three of them are playing well and they're healthy. And the thing is about these Panthers receivers is that Ted McMillan is having a great season. But the first half of that game two weeks ago, he was being bullied. Like he was just being bodied around. Until he'd made an incredible catch and really muscled the ball for this catch. Like that's when the tone shifted for this entire group. And so I think with, with these bucks, the thing that I think could convince Todd Bowles to break tendency a little bit is how visibly and audibly disappointed the offense and the rest of the defenses and how these games are going.

27:20Gregg Rosenthal:Mike Evans walking off the field and Mike Evans, the captain walking off the field and disappointment, these guys watching in disbelief as the defense just gets pushed backwards down the field at some of the end of these games. I think that Todd Bowles also watches that and is like, man, I got to get a spark back into this team. They seem a little out of ideas on either side. Because if they had them, they would have done it. And it's like the same things keep happening. They used to be a great run defense. They're not really that anymore. Levante David's getting picked on. They're playing JPP.

27:54Jason Pierre-Paul, we hadn't mentioned this on the show, is in the NFL right now playing for the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. He played 16 snaps last week. Did you know that Deion Jones is in the NFL and playing for the Tampa Bay Buccaneers? Granted, it was only two snaps. I think he's mostly specialty. But I was Googling. I was like, is that Deion Jones, Deion Jones? That's the same Deion Jones. It's the same guy. And yet, we'll see. Tristan Wirfs is expected to come back. I do think it comes down to Baker. I disagree with you guys a little bit because I think he has played pretty well the last couple weeks, except for just a handful of awful reps.

28:32And I thought he had some great throws last week, and he's scrambling around. I think it's possible for them to turn it around. If not, we have one of the worst division winners in a while. The Panthers have been outscored this season by 67 points. Unless they had a huge result here, it would be one of the worst division winners in terms of point differential. I think Baker and them can get it going for one game, and then they can watch on Sunday who goes to the playoffs.

28:57Patrick Claybon:And it would be easier for me to believe that if not for weeks of the consecutive same issues for the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, where I'm thinking unless there is some sort of Miyagi situation or like a sensu bean or just general alien healing for Baker Mayfield, whatever is causing the problem for the past several weeks. I don't know that it goes away, but they've been in all these games. They've actually lost four straight by, I think, four points or less. They're one of the first teams ever. So it's just been these late game vibes. And to be fair, the Panthers are the teams that has the late game.

29:32Gregg Rosenthal:But yeah, the late game vibes and also the swing, the luck, the swings have gone often in the Panthers direction for the positive. Yes. Through the season. And the Bucs have seemed to lose their luck. Bear, which is, I don't know what to think, but I know what I'm rooting for. I had Theo Weiss Jr.

29:47Patrick Claybon:running down the front of himself last week. I'm rooting for mess. I'm rooting for the ultimate NFC South moment, which we will talk about a little after the break and get to the rest of the NFC slate.

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34:32We need to play better football. So after resting starters in week 18, two years in a row, I believe, he says they will play. Now, just saying they're playing, especially in an emotional moment right after a game, is not necessarily the same thing as they're playing the entire game. So that could be maybe where they split the baby, as it were, against Arizona.

34:56Patrick Claybon:And giving us an opportunity to facilitate one of our favorite pastimes in the newsroom, asking why Matthew Stafford is still in. And if he were, he would be in the game against the Arizona Cardinals, who are at SoFi Stadium against the Rams, who are favored by seven and a half points. The over under is forty six and a half. Kenny Albert, Jonathan Vilma, Megan Levy on the call. It seems our friends in Vegas, Greg, are banking that the starters will not play us again for a good amount of time. considering the win. No, they're hedging. I mean, they're in between. This is not... It's never a week to really put down your hard-earned money because this stuff is unpredictable.

35:33Maybe any of them. We're not allowed to and that's made my life much more stress-free because, man, I don't know. I could see him having a change of thought during the week and playing a couple drives, feeling good about those couple drives and then making a change. But who knows? Maybe he will just play all the way to win because obviously they are not happy. They haven't played a complete game in too long. They did beat the Cardinals, though, 45 to 17 a month ago. So that was not too long.

36:03Gregg Rosenthal:Yeah. A little late stat padding happening in that one, too, by the Cardinals offense. OK, so here's the thing. This is the this is how Sean McVay walks up to the line of saying he's pissed at his players without actually ever saying he's pissed at his players like he will never The closest, the only time he ever walked over that line was the Jared Goff fiasco at the end of that 2020 season. So this is basically him telling us what he thinks without actually saying it. The other thing here is he can hedge quite a bit behind the fact that a lot of these guys are injured in the first place. So the Rob Havensteins, the Alrick Jacksons, the Kevin Dotsons, the Devontae Adams, who, quote unquote, according to the broadcast this week, was running the full route tree, but wasn't playing.

36:53I mean, you could see it when they showed that. He looked great.

36:56Gregg Rosenthal:He looks great. He looks also like there is no pain at all. Like he looks awesome. That's the thing is he knows he can say that because he can also hide behind the fact that the guys who need to be playing for them in the playoffs and win football games for them. and are part of the reason they win football games are actually going to be able, they're going to be able to hide behind the injury report and say, well, those guys probably weren't going to play. Stafford and Puka are kind of the guys that tell you. Yeah, and I would say, I doubt they're in the game for very long. Jimmy Garoppolo, I know, is like antsy to get a couple handoffs, you know?

37:32Gregg Rosenthal:And this, to me, is more him commenting on what he thinks about his defense. It's still a relatively young group, And there's been a couple of times this season where perhaps this defense is reading its own press a little bit too much, metaphorically speaking. Like this can be a dominant group. They can be coached really well, but it always seems like when the hype on them is at its highest and Chris Shula is being talked about for head coaching jobs and all of these things, that's when they take a step back and allow some big time breaks and explosive plays again. So that's where I think he wants them to play because he wants them to stay juiced up.

38:09Gregg Rosenthal:And I also, I know this team well, and I also think that they don't think that a bye week, even though it helps a lot of people get healthy who probably won't play this week anyway. I think they would prefer to, to not have time downtime, even a mini bye. They came out so flat. I just think they're wired as a group that they just need to not overthink things and just keep playing. That's really how I think they're all wired starting at the top. Patriots did that a lot and then they didn't do it. It kind of depended on what he thought the team needed in that season. So I do think it's different.

38:43They also, and this isn't playing into, I think that was all excellent. It's spot on.

38:48Gregg Rosenthal:Actually. The Sean McVay, I did not say actually, will know in this game, quote unquote, if they care about getting the five seed, they'll know before the game starts whether they have a chance at it or not. They should be rooting for the Seahawks to beat the 49ers. if the Seahawks beat the 49ers, the Rams have a chance to move up a spot. And I would think they'd rather be a five seed. It's just a higher seed. You have a chance of hosting an NFC championship game, potentially against the 49ers, if the two of them would make it. And you'd play the NFC South winner, which would be either the Bucks or the Panthers.

39:23Either way, that's going to be, I think, on paper, an easier matchup than the six seed has.

39:27Patrick Claybon:And to me, the most functional thing that you have, if you're playing guys in this game, is an opportunity to, once you know what you need, to game plan and evaluate how the guys were playing in the particular way that you want to deploy them when you get into the postseason. But I also think if doing all this to try to get a first round by has value because you don't have to play that game, then here's a game where you don't have to play. Right. Right. And Blake Quorum got banged up like in Quorum and Kyron Williams went crazy in the first game. That was the game where they had more yards in 13 personnel than any team in NFL history by like 100 plus yards or something.

40:04So they just got heavy and they do have plenty of tight ends. So they can play all of them, I guess, as much as they want. But yes, currently they are in the sixth seed, but they could move up to the five with a little help on Saturday from Seattle.

40:17Patrick Claybon:Another team that doesn't necessarily need the results to go a particular way would be the Green Bay Packers on the road at Brian Flores' defense, the Minnesota Vikings, not to limit KOC, Just want to highlight what the Vikings defense has done down the stretch here. They are six and a half point favorites. The over under is 36 and a half. It's a CBS game. Spiro Adidas, Adam Archuleta, and Adida Kikambuala are there on the call. Greg, how much is Matt LaFleur interested in being a part of this participation? Not at all. And he's made that clear. He's going to rest them. And that's why it's early in the week and these things will change.

40:56That's six and a half. I was pointing out, like, some of these games that stay away because they're unpredictable, I think there's a big enough chance that Clayton Toon is starting this game in terms of I kind of expect Clayton Toon to possibly start this game, that that's not enough against a Brian Flores defense. The crazy thing here, because I don't think this game really matters, unless you're holding Minnesota over eight and a half wins on the year, at the last second, they're going to sneak in for me. Let's go Vikings. games uh unless that's the case uh the most interesting thing about this game is that it

41:30Gregg Rosenthal:could be brian flores's last with minnesota getting spicy what is is i think probably not the way kevin o 'connell wanted or expected this to go would be to be answering questions about this in the last week of the season versus talking about a postseason run versus talking about all the things that they hoped they would be talking about instead they're talking about how brian Flores has no remaining years left on his contract with Minnesota. He will be a free agent. Sure. That was purposeful by him. And the thing, the thing that I find very, very interesting is this defense is also, uh, top heavy in terms of its age and experience partially by design, because you need to have players who have seen a lot of football in order to be able to run this quality and caliber of complex defense.

42:22Gregg Rosenthal:But I do think that this is really interesting to me because what if, say, Matt LaFleur loses Jeff Halfley to a head coaching job this season? Who do you think would be the most fun defensive coordinator for the Green Bay Packers with a healthy Micah Parsons next season, but the man who will be staring them down on the opposite sideline? He could get a head coaching job. And not to discount that either. To say, I do also think he'll be getting head coaching interviews. I think he might get a head coaching job. But if not, I think he has had a better free agent year than Alec Pierce. I mean, he could set new boundaries for what coordinators make in the NFL.

43:01He's going to be making Vic Fangio money. Because you can't tell me that Brian Flores isn't worth more than a lot of the lower tier head coaches. Like, it's just, it's so proven what he's going to bring. And the Cowboys have been mentioned, like reported as like a possible suitor. but I don't think they'd be the only one. In Minnesota, you would think the tie would go to Minnesota, but I don't know what the situation there is. And they would probably step up and match whatever crazy offers he's getting elsewhere, and it's great for Brian Flores if that happens.

43:30Patrick Claybon:Well, I think the personnel, and again, yeah, some of them are elevated in age, but you talk about a guy they drafted a couple years ago in Dallas Turner who can rush. People slight him for his ability to rush, but his ability to drop is a big part of being in this defense. And Andrew Van Ginkle, I think the tie, is with these guys that he's been able to coach and also with the Vikings hopefully poning up the money to make him the highest paid coordinator in football because he deserves it. And, you know, to see this whole thing work to the extent that it could, whereas, you know, you go other places, especially if we're talking about a place like Dallas, is Brian Flores going to be able to have the input to get the...

44:09Patrick Claybon:That doesn't seem like a great fit. No. Green Bay maybe.

44:13Gregg Rosenthal:There are going to be some bad head coaching jobs available. And that's the thing. I don't want Brian Flores for all of his talent and ability. I don't, this is selfish. I don't want him to go somewhere that sets him up for failure. I would love to see him continue to cook these offenses up and down the field and make the most money possible. I personally would like to see it. If this team can get better quarterback play and healthier and a better offensive line, they're not far away. J.J. McCarthy, by the way, might be coming back for this game. I think they would like that to happen. Speaking of those Cowboys, I do not think we even need the full three minutes on this game.

44:51I don't know. Maybe we do.

44:52Patrick Claybon:The Cowboys are three and a half point favorites against Jackson Dart and the New York Giants. It's on Fox. Kevin Coogler, Moose Johnston calling the game for his old team and Allison Williams. Again, it's three minutes in parentheses. Okay, I said that and now there are some interesting things here. They cut Trevon Diggs today.

45:09Gregg Rosenthal:Oh, yeah. We have a little news. That was weird. Well, no, I mean, not weird that it happened, but weird that it happened And to do it before week 18 is kind of a shoving the player's nose in it. Well, I also think it makes it more difficult doing it now. It seems like it's been simmering or building toward this for a while. I think it makes it more difficult for a team to immediately claim him on waivers, for example. Nobody would. No, that's what I'm saying. Let's do it now because nobody's going to. But then, you know, you have an offloading period through the entire offseason. That's the thing.

45:42Gregg Rosenthal:This has been simmering for a while, since training camp, since before Since last year. Yeah. And, and that's, that's the thing is I think the timing element of is, is just to make it so he can't, you know, just immediately get scooped up by somebody else. And that's, again, to your point, it's a little bit of a, ha ha, we win.

46:00Patrick Claybon:What would, what would prevent somebody from, I just don't think they're going to like his contract. I'll look at it, but coming off of a, you know, he hasn't been able to show that he is a hundred percent healthy. And then you have to take on the contract, which, um, I don't think he has any guaranteed money into next year. So you're right. I mean, his base salary this year was only eight and a half million dollars.

46:20Gregg Rosenthal:It's hard. It's hard. Guaranteed money. What I think is hard. Yeah, I agree. But I think what I what's hard with a player who's coming off an injury is you you want to before you make a decision like that, you do want to see what the actual like physical return is like with how ready that player is. The only other little thing for this game is the Giants do have a path to having the number one overall pick. Here is what they need. They're at the two spot. Seven teams could get as high as two. So if they won, they could really mess themselves up. But here's what they need. They need to lose, of course.

46:52They need the Raiders to win against the Chiefs. And then they need two of the following teams to lose out of four. Seattle, or win out of four. Seattle, Atlanta, Cleveland, and Chicago. If two of those four teams won and the Raiders won, then the Giants have the number one overall pick. So all hope is not lost if that's what you're looking for. Looking for draft abolition. Yes. Do you want a lottery or what do you want? Just not this.

47:23Gregg Rosenthal:I wouldn't want to be claimed if I were Trayvon Diggs. I'd want to pick my next spot. Yeah.

47:29Patrick Claybon:Hopefully, you know, the capacity to choose that. maybe somebody will at least express some interest at this point. Abdul Carter, by the way, is publicly stumping for Defensive Rookie of the Year, which I applaud. Yeah, it's cool to want. Let's turn this into like an Oscars race. Is it not already?

47:47Gregg Rosenthal:Also, I just, this is very loose reporting here by me, but great reporting by ESPN. A team would still have to pay him about almost 500K just for this week if he's on their roster, regardless of whether or not he's active. That's it. I know, but right now teams are right down to the wire looking at special teams moves and guys who are going to be unhealthy, healthy, whatever. Just some context. That's all.

48:13Patrick Claybon:Let's get to a game that could really.

48:15Gregg Rosenthal:We used all three minutes.

48:16Patrick Claybon:We did it. There was stuff. There was stuff. I don't think anybody's like, oh, they went too long on this. Thank you, Steph. Well, except Eric, maybe. No. No. Eric famously just wants like a 25-minute show. Greg set these times. I didn't set the times, okay? I don't know.

48:31Gregg Rosenthal:You seem to. Did you pick the font and the color, though? You did. That's just so every kid can see them. They are synced up. There's three special seven-minute games and three three-minute games.

48:40Patrick Claybon:I'm going to lobby for this one to be five minutes because considering what could have taken place before this game, Jordan, the New Orleans Saints and the Atlanta Falcons could be playing to decide the division for other teams. The Falcons favored by three points off their Monday night football win. The over-under is 43 and a half. Chris Myers and Mark Slareth and Jen Hale are on the call. can the Jedi Council, the Monstars that are the Falcons once they are eliminated, stop the red hot New Orleans. These are the two best teams in the division.

49:11Gregg Rosenthal:This is so weird and disappointing, yet also equally fun because you see what they could be and they just never were until it was too late. I just love it. I think beating the Rams in an island game, the team that came into the game being talked about as the best team in football, I think that helped Raheem Morris quite a bit in terms of the job security. Now they may make moves still. He may make other moves as well. They may change their front office, all of those types of things, but winning like that, finishing the season like this and winning a game like that. You got to win this week though, then too, by that logic.

49:49If it's, I just, if you lose to the saints, 20,

49:52Gregg Rosenthal:it's not the same logic, Greg, cause it's not the same caliber and quality of team. This is a very red hot saints team. Sure. but it's, I hate to say it because I know the listeners are going to eye roll and they should. This is a really obnoxious statement I'm going to make. But if you beat a Sean McVay team in prime time with the MVP caliber quarterback, and a lot of it you do on defense at first to help start the offense off the right way, then yeah, I think you have a little bit more of a cushion than you had. I just think even the way that game flowed, you sort of saw the strengths, you saw the weaknesses.

50:22Like Raheem Morris is one of my least favorite guys to watch in terms of game management. They've had no clue what to do offensively and the way they handled that game. At the end, they were kind of lucky to escape.

50:32Gregg Rosenthal:Had a good challenge. Yeah. Hearing Matt Ryan is possibly involved in becoming part of the front office. That's obviously not a great sign. So I just think any owner that's capricious enough to change his mind based on these last four games, then this game is going to matter to big time rivalry. You got Kirk playing for his future. You got Tyler Shuck playing for the offensive rookie of the year. potentially. You got Raheem Morris coaching for his future. Like I love it. I need it. And they probably are the two best teams in the NFC South right now. I mean they've just beaten the other teams so I gotta give them credit.

51:08They're both on their winning streaks. You got the Staley sans. You got Honey Badger on Twitter giving Brandon Staley some side eye because saying that he wanted to bench like Cam Jordan and Demario Davis earlier in the year or something. He's like yeah these guys that he wanted to bench are the ones that are playing the best. I'm just like, give it all to me. This is what the South is all about.

51:30Gregg Rosenthal:I love mess. This is great.

51:32Patrick Claybon:Our season long science discussion. Who would have thought it was this daily song? The whole time. All along. The entire time.

51:39Gregg Rosenthal:This is some Scooby-Doo right here.

51:42Patrick Claybon:Well, honestly, because there were large stretches of Monday night where I felt not, not that because you have to give the ball to Bajon as much as if Bajon is within 75 % of himself being tired or not, you get him the ball. There were large stretches where Kirk Cousins, it wasn't just play call. They were hiding Kirk Cousins to not, to prevent what could have possibly happened to there. And it almost did a few times. He just threw it in the middle of the field.

52:07Gregg Rosenthal:They were masking Kirk Cousins.

52:08Patrick Claybon:Yeah, probably. Yeah. I would say that. And, you know, that's what makes it difficult within the Staley sons to be completely confident in this because the, the Shuck Olave situation is so hot right now. And I recognize what AJ Terrell did against Puka, you know, the, the past breakup of the year, preventing the past catch of the year where it's going to be great football. And I know we maligned the division, but I'm really looking forward to it. I really am too. And it's, I challenge anyone to come up with a different scenario. That's been ever like this, but I'm pretty sure. And this requires the bucks to win on Saturday.

52:48To be clear, bucks got to win that game. Panthers are in. If they beat the bucks, if the Bucs win that game, there's never been, I don't think, another situation like this in the history of the NFL where entering the game, the two teams are playing each other to decide the division championship and neither one of them can win the division. And the fact that it's the Falcon Saints, the best rivalry in the league that I've been stumping forever is the best rivalry and the dumbest rivalry, the rivalry that brought us Jameis Winston and Jamal Williams, you know, making Dennis Allen mad a couple years ago and so many other great moments.

53:26It's just, it's just perfect. I need it. I need the Bucs to win. Win that game, Tampa.

53:32Gregg Rosenthal:Happy for Saints fans. Yes. Saints fans. But you know what this, you know, what's great about it too is like, okay, the Saints are going to be the Bucs proxy because if the Saints win, then the Bucs, you know, win the division. And this all is assuming Bucs win on Saturday. And the Falcons are going to be the Panthers proxy and the Panthers fans will be rooting for the Falcons. The thing that's cool about it is this game still means a lot to the Saints and the Falcons fans, especially the Saints, who would love to go into the offseason with this big-time winning streak and Shuck playing well. I'll tell you what.

54:04If they lost this game to the Falcons and Shuck throws a couple interceptions, it's kind of like Ohio State-Michigan where it ruins a little bit of everything that happened over the last month. A little Ryan Day action. you know I'm assigning myself this game I didn't care like we were doing the Shook oh yeah I can totally tell the Shook assignments earlier I was like he can have whatever he wants just give me the McSaints Falcons that is the NFC we went through an order let's go and take a break but when we're back on the other side we're going to go through AFC seeding 1 through 7 biggest game of the week on Sunday night

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58:56Back on NFL Daily. Not as much drama in the AFC overall. They've got only one seven minute game. But that's going to be fourth up. That's the big AFC North battle. And frankly, the battle at the top for the top couple seeds. The drama has been kind of removed, I would say, over the last few days.

59:18Patrick Claybon:the Los Angeles Chargers at the Denver Broncos, who are favored by 12 and a half points. The over-under is 37 and a half. What? Jim and Tony and Tracy, it is CBS1. We spend five minutes discussing Greg. Maybe we won't. Why is it 12 and a half points? Well, because Trey Lance is starting. That's enough. Disrespect. Yeah, but it's not just about Trey Lance. The fact that Trey Lance is starting indicates Keenan Allen is probably sitting. And you can't sit everyone but Khalil Mack and Quintin Johnston. And I think it makes a lot of sense. I'm actually proud of Jim Harbaugh for doing it.

59:57Gregg Rosenthal:Yeah, he's not trying to just be the tough guy and get through it. And I really think it could help them. All that matters for them is winning the playoff game. And because the Patriots, who are their most likely opponent, are going to be playing to win on Sunday, I think that's a little bit of an advantage here. And most importantly, you're not even thinking about who their opponent. It's just an advantage for them because this is a team that has a lot of injuries and they they've done great this year. But there's no sense in fighting just to fight. And this was going to be a tough one anyways.

1:00:33And now you can get let poor Trey Lance step out there. We have another game here. It's just like these sacrificial lambs a little bit. Although Trey Lance looked good enough in the preseason that I'm curious to watch him. Yeah.

1:00:44Gregg Rosenthal:And really what I think will, they'll need to do a lot is, is move his spot. You've seen some of the Justin Herbert games were trying to mitigate pressure on Justin Herbert. A lot of the same principles will apply because Trey Lance can move and can run these like long bootlegs and all of these things that just help change the launch point and make it hard for defenses to really get after him the way that they want to the Broncos. Um, I mean, they're, they are out here trying to make statement after statement, and especially with the Texans surging the way that they are in the AFC and understanding the possible stakes, clinching the one seed in a first-round buy with a win here.

1:01:23Gregg Rosenthal:This is, it has Broncos put foot on gas, Chargers just say, okay, all right, you do you, everyone stay healthy, and kind of just ease on by. And it's great luck for them, Denver, that the Chargers aren't playing for the division. That's the outcome of losing to the Texans. It does set up a weird scenario that there's nothing they can do about. But by the time they play again, it'll be four weeks since they really played like another top-level team. Four weeks is a long time. They played the Jaguars. Jaguars won that game. Then you have a Chiefs game. That's a real football game, so I'm kind of diminishing the Chiefs here.

1:02:03But that's not a playoff-caliber opponent. Then you have this week where you're playing backups. Then you have a week off. It's just an interesting way that they'll approach the playoffs. And I think ultimately it's a good thing to just advance the divisional round. But they're just going to have to manage that and figure out how to start that divisional round game with guns blazing. Because it'll have been a little while between serious games.

1:02:31Patrick Claybon:And at least the fact that it is Trey Lance. And maybe we get to see some new and innovative things from Greg Roman and something else for the Broncos to hold their attention to because it's a really good team. Right. That's the thing is they're still professionals who are trying. So it's not like it's going to just be like a preseason game by any means.

1:02:49Gregg Rosenthal:They were. It was totally different scenario because they were trying to get into the playoffs last year. Wasn't that like a 38-0 butt kicking against the rest of the players in Kansas City? I know a different scenario, but like they. Not that different. They get up for these games is what I'm saying. Sean Payton has no problem. Yeah, pretty similar. I mean, yeah, I guess last time it was just to get in. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. You know, the Broncos, one thing I had an eye on in that last week was they lost their center. What's his name? Wattenberg for the season, who's been great. And it seemed like they didn't miss a thing for what it's worth.

1:03:24PFF graded his back, you know, the guy who came in, Forsyth, very high. and if Sean Payton has a secret sauce, it is identifying, coaching up,

1:03:36Gregg Rosenthal:one minute, interior offensive line. All-time great. Pick the Chargers when they're down. All-time great. Twist the knife. At that. So this guy's been in the program for two years and he has been great in his career at just replacing these guys on the offensive line and them being fantastic. Hey, so it's Greg. The show is about to get to the Patriots Dolphins talk, the week 18 preview talk, but we taped it before we knew that the Patriots defensive tackle Christian Barmore is facing a misdemeanor domestic assault charge. Also, we were looking for clarity at the time for how the team is going to address the criminal charges that Stefan Diggs is facing.

1:04:15I just want to make sure we got this into the show. So let's handle these two charges separately. The Patriots released a statement that they are aware of reports regarding a pending February arraignment involving Kristen Barmore, which stems from an alleged domestic incident that occurred in August. The Patriots were made aware at the time of the incident and informed the NFL in a timely manner. The matter remains part of an ongoing legal process. And it goes on from there. End quote, of course. Barmore has been practicing and playing, you know, when healthy throughout the course of the season.

1:04:54I don't know if that means you can assume that he will continue to based on the news becoming public. We will have to see how they address it. Stefan Diggs, their wide receiver, is facing strangulation and other criminal charges in connection with an incident that happened earlier in the month, according to police. The charges include felony strangulation or suffocation in misdemeanor, assault and battery. And the Patriots, again, released a similar statement the day previous that they're aware of the allegations. Stefan informed the organization that he categorically denies the allegations. Quote, we support Stefan.

1:05:36And they say from there that they're going to continue to gather information in both cases. The NFL confirmed through a statement that they were aware of the charges. Obviously, these are horrific allegations. They are bigger than football, and they're going to be taken seriously. We don't know how the Patriots or the league is going to address them in the short term when it comes to digs. and bar more again it's bigger than football and we're going to have to just follow the situation and and how they want to address it in the meantime we'll get back to to the football talk about the patriots and dolphins uh that's going to happen on the field this sunday the other half

1:06:26Patrick Claybon:of that number one seed in the afc equation um the odds maker is showing a little more respect to quen yours who got a win against the tampa bay buccaneers last week the miami dolphins at the New England Patriots, who were favored by 10 and a half points. The over-under is 45 and a half. Joe Davis, G-Reg, and Pam Oliver on the call. The two points of respect for Quinn Ewers. Can Quinn Ewers put the fear, Jordan, in Greg's New England Patriots?

1:06:54Gregg Rosenthal:Did you just hear Greg say, oh, I might have to take that game? Greg Olson on a Patriots call? That's a first. When you sit there and tell me every week, oh, you already picked this one as your game. I can't give you two of your top choices. They spread them around usually. So, hey, just saying double standard here. Maybe I want this. I serve at the behest of. I'm the Quinn Ewers correspondent, apparently.

1:07:14Patrick Claybon:NFL Daily host Greg Rosenthal.

1:07:16Gregg Rosenthal:Maybe I.

1:07:16Patrick Claybon:Thank you, Patrick.

1:07:17Gregg Rosenthal:Maybe I. You can have the first pick this week. Do you want this one? Probably not.

1:07:23Patrick Claybon:I just want you guys to be happy with your games.

1:07:26Gregg Rosenthal:I'm happy with all the games. They're all beautiful. Patrick watches in the two quad boxes, so he's got us all covered. I appreciate that. Everyone's got different strategies. I think for a lot of these teams, the most important thing about these week 18 games is the immediate aftermath of them. We're going to have a lot of questions answered about the future of Mike McDaniel and Anthony Weaver, who for weeks now we've heard are likely staying in place in Miami, but we'll just have to see. Meanwhile, it does look like they've found at minimum the backup quarterback, maybe a bridge quarterback in Quinn Ewers.

1:08:04Gregg Rosenthal:We're also going to get more clarity after and then the weeks beyond this game about Tua and his future. Just a lot of things that start to unfold immediately after the buzzer sounds on this one. Yours is a unique player just because he has a funky throwing motion. And he has a Ryan Tannehill like ability to be seemingly unaware that there's like a 300 pound man about to just absolutely crush him. Like where like his body doesn't even tense up. He just, and it's dangerous. Just naive, just blissfully unaware. Yeah, but I think most quarterbacks are never like that. You know what I mean? Because they're human.

1:08:46They react to something that's right in front of them. But he'll throw it, and there is someone that is about to absolutely level him. It makes you worried a little bit, because I think you need to be big to take those sort of hits.

1:08:59Gregg Rosenthal:He's not small. No, but he's not Ryan Tannehill, is he? I don't know. Or Cam Newton is another one that comes to mind that did that. Yeah, but you could argue Cam Newton over time should never have been taking those hits anyway. I mean, that's unfortunate injuries. I don't like that 10 and a half for the Patriots. I think it's a tricky game. You guys, you're making a face.

1:09:20Patrick Claybon:Well, I just, I understand that the litany of injuries for the Chargers, the situation where they don't necessarily have anything to play for, and then the Dolphins being, you know, the up-and-coming rising Quinn Ewers trying to save their job situation. But it's still a backup quarterback.

1:09:40Gregg Rosenthal:Yeah, that's what we're saying. For sure. But the other side of the ball, like I know it was against the Bucs, but you saw the vision. Bradley Chubb's having a monster game. Jordan Brooks is having a monster season. The two young rookie defensive tackles are making some plays. Like this was a game that went down to the buzzer the first time they played. And you can say, okay, well, the Patriots are a different team now. The Dolphins are relatively a different team early too. It reminds me of a couple Patriots losses to Miami. I know historically it doesn't mean anything, but they're division opponents.

1:10:14The Patriots are quite banged up. I think they're in a tough spot because they want to get that one seed in theory, but they know it's very unlikely. Do they really care about the two seed? They have a lot of injuries. And so I think they'll be conservative with guys like Will Campbell and Milton Williams who are trying to come back for the playoffs. Robert Spillane is another one. But they also have a lot of players. They are the most injured they've been all season right now. And so I don't know if Mike Rabel is going to go all out. Maybe he'll take a McVay approach. Maybe he'll accept even backing up to the three seed if they have to.

1:10:50I'm not sure because they need... One minute. I mean, they would need the Chargers backups to win to get that one seed. I don't know. It's just a weird situation.

1:11:00Gregg Rosenthal:and happy bake miss to everybody. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Tom Brady lost to a week 18 Dolphins team, and they'd lost the one seed in that game. He lost to a week 18 Dolphins team on the way to, you know, ending his career in New England the next week to Mike Vrabel. So it happened. He once lost to Nick Saban, I remember, in the final week of this. So there's so many parallels.

1:11:27Patrick Claybon:Yes. Where if this does happen, Drake May is Tom Brady. There you go.

1:11:32Gregg Rosenthal:The transitive property of equality.

1:11:35Patrick Claybon:Speaking of equality, unfortunate that the nature of the shifting importance of games left this run by Trevor Lawrence and the Jaguars off of the conversation. Because the Tennessee Titans are on the road in Duval taking on the Jacksonville Jaguars, who are 12 and a half point favorites. The over under 47 and a half. If Adam Amin, Drew Brees and Christina Pink are on the call where the Jacks are just one of the hottest teams in football right now. What are we doing? You know what? When are we going to start respecting the Jacksonville Jaguars?

1:12:12Gregg Rosenthal:I think this game could be a banger. I think this game has banger. It's yours. It's yours. I've had Drew Brees for five straight weeks. He's fine. He actually is fine. He's doing better. He's fine. He's fine. He has some interesting quarterback points. It's he, the personality is not like, you know, a hundred percent there. Thanks, Greg. Yeah. I listen. Yes. Uh, Jacksonville is a wagon and, and offensive defensive special teams. Everything is rolling. It's great. Tennessee has been frisky for the entire second half of the season. They're, they're a difficult matchup just because you don't really quite know what they are and how they're going to play you.

1:12:57Gregg Rosenthal:Quarterback can play. I do think this has banger potential. Watching Jacksonville approach last week's game where, yes, they still won and they did what good teams do and they won a game they're supposed to win, but they tried. They got a little too cute with some of the strategy. They tried some stuff at times that maybe they just are seeing if it works and want to throw it away. Obviously, they're getting big production out of their receiving core. Trevor Lawrence is having an incredible season as well. This defense is, is awesome, especially, um, their front seven. But I do think, I mean, Tennessee has just been frisky and it's Jeffrey Simmons doing random stuff.

1:13:39That sounds like you're taking that 12 and a half.

1:13:41Gregg Rosenthal:I mean, I don't even know what that means to be honest with you, but I feel like what does that mean? I take it. They keep it closer than that. Does that mean I take, I pick a team or does that Yeah, it means the Titans keep it closer than 12 and a half points. Okay. I don't know what this... I'm famously unaware of what all of these things are.

1:14:00Patrick Claybon:And it's a good place to be because Greg is in it.

1:14:03Gregg Rosenthal:Yeah.

1:14:04Patrick Claybon:I mean, it's not that hard to figure out. It just says minus 12. You know, you have the 12.

1:14:08Gregg Rosenthal:Listen, I have had people have to explain what a push is to me before. Yes, that's sort of... The lingo is tricky. Yeah. Here's lingo that Patrick will understand. Trevor Lawrence is the newest first time member of quarterback Island. And that's despite it being more exclusive than it's ever been. It came down to eight, eight quarterbacks and Trevor Lawrence not only made it, but like made it with some room to spare. Everyone agreed. He wasn't even the last guy on. So there's some respect. And you'll notice Greg hit us with the famous passive voice. Greg shrunk it to eight.

1:14:43Patrick Claybon:And I was, I was glad to have, you know, briefly been involved. in the experience. It felt like I walked into a prayer group. Appeared as if an angel on the horizon. You know what? I want to point out with this game, which is very important.

1:14:57Gregg Rosenthal:We all had connected pinkies. The reason this number is so big is because this game, unquestionably, is really important to the Jaguars. There's no vagueness about their motivation. It's a big deal for the Jaguars to win a division. They need to win this game to win a division. to get a home game. Big game. Yeah, like to get a home game. They have a chance, if they win and the Patriots lose, to move up. They would move up to the two seed, which potentially would be Jags' chargers in that scenario. The Bills are probably the sixth seed, so who knows if the Patriots would care enough to try to avoid the Bills.

1:15:37I don't know. But either way, they really, the Jaguars being they, I don't think want to go on the road in the playoffs. They want to have a home game and make all that extra playoff money for their owner.

1:15:51Patrick Claybon:And they deserve, I think, considering the way they've played, they deserve that home game. Yeah. I would not be surprised if that 12 and a half hits because it's exciting as Cam Ward and the Titans are. It seems like it's freelancing that's done it almost exclusively down the stretch. Chaos potential. Like chaos is how the Titans operate. difficult to operate chaotically when the Jags, to your point, Jordan, are just trying stuff because the plans have been working to the extent where they're just trying stuff late. A guy that's gotten on my radar lately, not just Trevon Walker, who's playing outstanding.

1:16:27Van Langen. What is it? Is it Cole Van Langen for the Jacksonville Jaguars who came in at some point this season and has started, I believe, at four different offensive line positions. and is their left tackle heading into the playoffs. It seems like it's permanent now and it's played pretty well. Walker Little, who was there and got a huge contract as like a bridge, you know, swing tackle is now at guard and gave up a lot of pressures. Granted, it was against, you know, good competition last week, but he's now at guard. And so that's like a sneaky plot.

1:17:00Gregg Rosenthal:I had that game a few weeks ago talking about Colvin Lainey coming in and looked great right from the end. Fabalized it. Yeah. Yeah.

1:17:10Patrick Claybon:It's time for the Sunday Drive presented by Toyota. Let's go places. On Sunday Night Football, the Baltimore Ravens are three and a half point favorites, Greg, over the Pittsburgh Steelers. The over under is 41 and a half. Mike Tirico, Chris Collinsworth, Melissa Stark football night in America will happen before the game. They'll have the weird thing where they just abbreviate football night in America and it says FNIA. And you're like, does that say final? I don't know. It's weird to look at the screen. But then the game happens. Yes. what happens in the football game? I my head says Steelers.

1:17:48It just feels like what they're going to do. They're just going to win this game when they just look so bad. But my heart is rooting for the Ravens because I think that makes for the best playoffs. It makes for the best story. A world in which Patrick Claibon is happy and that the Ravens at the very last second get their stuff together and go on a playoff run would be very intriguing to me. A Texans-Ravens first round matchup, which would be very interesting. And it's been a good matchup for the Ravens in recent years, but obviously different teams. The whole thing is great. And yet it all seems impossible to analyze because we don't know if Lamar Jackson is playing or not.

1:18:31And I asked around and nobody knows. I don't think the Ravens know, to be fair, at this point in the week. they're just gonna wait and see I can see a world where Tyler Huntley helps them win this game but it's much less likely I think we can recognize that right please

1:18:49Patrick Claybon:yeah no yes despite the you know again how about not even acknowledge that idea and that concept and talk about the injuries that also the Pittsburgh Steel are dealing with in this game because Darnell Washington literally huge for this team and the way that they would like to approach things and granted it was a unique situation where I think slightly preventing the sack record was one thing but also preventing Myles Garrett from hitting Aaron Rodgers was another thing and there's no Myles Garrett on the Baltimore Ravens but they do need to be able to get the ball down the field there will be no DK Metcalf in this game and yeah I would probably know TJ Watt according to Pro Football Talk Mike Tomlin said he was more optimistic this week than recent weeks but Pro Football Talk had sources that thought TJ Watt was not going to be ready to be back for this game.

1:19:41So, yeah, some of the most important players.

1:19:43Gregg Rosenthal:I wonder if you see if Lamar is coming back first and then you decide whether TJ Watt is coming back. I think TJ Watt's playing if TJ Watt has any chance at playing, but they can't let him do that. The thing that strikes me is like, Greg, you said that this game feels like a Steelers win. Like it just feels in your head like it. I don't think that to me, this feels like a Baltimore Ravens. the Steelers without Darnell Washington, who dictates a significant portion of their blocking surface, not just because he is a massive human, but because of the concepts that they run. And then also no deep threat.

1:20:16Gregg Rosenthal:You cannot trust that they can run the ball the way that they had been when they were at their best. I think you could say probably the same for the Ravens in terms of the run game, but I would trust a Ravens team starting to pick itself up right now more than I would trust the Pittsburgh Steelers winning this game. Oh, that's all the reasons why my head says Steelers, because I've just been through this so many times that this team... Is there lunch on the line? This team has no chance to go on a long run. Like, this is not a good team. And they've just... Like, nobody is surprised that they lost to the Browns last week.

1:20:53Like, that's what they do. And this is also what they do, is just, like, find a way to sneak in somehow. But no, it doesn't make sense logically. I think the players are better for Baltimore. I think getting to see Derek Henry play like that last week was incredible. I think Baltimore should have a coaching advantage.

1:21:11Gregg Rosenthal:And yet saying my head and my heart. Yeah. The Steelers lose this game. Yeah. And, and look, we only have to look to a couple of weeks ago to this matchup. Now, now this one goes to Pittsburgh and it's tough to beat a team twice in a row. Baltimore just recently did it. everything's upside down. Chris Boswell is coming up short for the Steelers.

1:21:33Patrick Claybon:That's the most wild part about this is seeing Boswell spray them around the goalposts and also seeing Falele have the game of his career against the Green Bay Packers.

1:21:45Gregg Rosenthal:Up is down, down is up.

1:21:46Patrick Claybon:Where I think the fact that the Packers are a non-common opponent who are generally beat up right now and everything going in the opposite direction there where I don't know if we can extrapolate like a similar performance up front against the Steelers team. That's very familiar with what they're trying to do, where they really targeted him in the past protection game. The fact that if it's clearly, if it's, if it's five back there and not eight, yeah, my feelings are significant. And I don't even know what to think about that first matchup. So to be clear, it wasn't how I talked, you know, that the Steelers won that game allegedly, but, But it was so strange because it was a big time Ravens rushing performance.

1:22:32Lamar was part of that, but they put up over, what, 200 yards on the ground in that game. And the Steelers, who totally went away from the run game last week, despite being pretty effective doing it, only had 34 yards rushing against the Ravens the first time around. Like, I just don't think you can win that way with Scotty Miller and Aaron Rodgers throwing hero shots.

1:22:54Patrick Claybon:Well, that's, it was the Rogers sons. It was all these passes. I know, but there's no DK. Yeah, that's what I mean. I don't think you can do it to Scotty Miller. I mean, there was a, the sequence in that game feels disrespected right now. The sequence in that game where Rogers slid before he set up, remember the fourth and one where he throws it deep to Scotty Miller and everyone is like, what are you doing, man? What are you doing, Aaron Rogers? He set that up by sliding right before it, you know, for the first down instead of like diving head because he's Aaron Rodgers at this point. And it's like, I'm just enough of it.

1:23:27Wouldn't it be, it would be quite a terrible ending if they lose this game for this, this season.

1:23:31Gregg Rosenthal:And that's, that's what I'm saying. Cause don't you feel that the universal context where I think you could argue change has to be made at both of these organizations in spots. Don't you think that the Steelers laying an egg in this game might be the thing that universally pushes it's not just Aaron Rodgers on his way out but perhaps they make changes in other parts perhaps Mike Tomlin decides because that's all the reporting hey I you know if he decides he wants to walk away maybe go coach another team whatever don't you just feel that stuck in middle stuck in medium all of this time that a game like this losing a game like this would push you over the edge.

1:24:15Yes. And I think that points out the stakes in this game for both sides. And I've tried to talk to people. I'm just guessing that I think it could be the end for John Harbaugh. There's certainly, I think most people would disagree, like even if they lost this game. But I think that is a fascinating subplot that maybe the loser of this game, like more changes happen in the off season, partly because of that. It's delicious.

1:24:39Patrick Claybon:Get everybody something they want. And my apologies to the fire Tomlin contingency. Some folks had reached out and, you know, because I had said, I didn't know if they, if all of the chanters were capable of introspection, the jury, the jury is still out there, but I think there's a solution for everybody to get what they want. And that's the Baltimore Ravens to win this game. Yeah. I do have to admit, cause I'm going to, I don't know. The Ravens are favored. I'm going to pick the Ravens cause I'll be real. And that's what I want to happen. And Derrick Henry having that game, you know, just a few days before Christmas, it did make me believe.

1:25:15Gregg Rosenthal:Yeah. That just in the power of something greater than myself or even than football in general. And that is Derrick Henry. And that is Derrick freaking Henry. Take it home. Let's take one more break. And then we will run through the rest of the AFC before we wrap up this week 18 preview show.

1:25:36Oh, that's so good.

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1:30:49I hate to do this to Patrick Claibon, but you're going to have to get on the air and react to your team, either winning or having a heartbreaking loss. And that's some real television professionalism that's going to be tested

1:31:05Patrick Claybon:for you. You don't have to be, that's the good thing about a podcast. You don't have to pretend like you're completely unbiased or anything like that. The shroud has been dropped on that for a good long time. little while okay but come join us uh we will be uh trying something new and so that's going to be really fun we'll be reacting to that game and setting up the afc and the entire playoffs speaking of the the afc how great was the start for the indianapolis colts things things went absolutely south in the afc south they are at the houston texans who were favored by 10 now the over under is 39 and a half you can believe your ears this time it's not baby birds Big Bird.

1:31:48Patrick Claybon:Ian Eagle is on the call to the folks who heard Noah and were very surprised to see

1:31:52Gregg Rosenthal:Ian Eagle fresh off a spicy week of broadcasting. Yes.

1:31:57Patrick Claybon:A lot has happened. JJ Watt, Evan Washburn also on the call. Jordan, we get to see what we haven't seen from the Indianapolis Colts these last few weeks. Riley Leonard. Yeah. After not playing the entire game and coming in and throw a Hail Mary interception finally gets a chance to play. Congratulations. It's one of the best pass rushes we've seen in the NFL.

1:32:17Gregg Rosenthal:So yeah, best of luck. Yeah, I thought first and foremost, I thought Riley Leonard. I had his game, the game that he came in. I thought he played well. I think he made smart decisions. I think he can work out a structure. He doesn't make a lot of mistakes. He doesn't take a ton of negative plays in a very limited sample size that we're seeing. I thought he placed the ball well. He has great skill players. However, you are going up against the surface of the sun. That is the Houston Texans defense, AKA my favorite defense in the NFL in absolute joy. I was extremely fortunate to be able to cover that game last week at SoFi stadium against the chargers.

1:32:58Gregg Rosenthal:And then to go be able to be in the Texans locker room and meet some of these guys that I actually have either, you know, not covered in person or covered remotely for the last season or two. what a great group of people that genuinely care about each other, that are playing like on a rope together and believe in themselves and are confident to the point of their quarterback slash offense overall has not been good enough all season. The play calling hasn't been good enough. Often the offensive line started out not good enough. The run game has not been consistent enough. The efficiency down to down is not there.

1:33:38Gregg Rosenthal:And yet there is no finger pointing because this defense is so confident that it can be the group that lifts the floor of this entire team. It was a beautiful thing to watch. It was a great thing to experience. And I love that the Texans are so back, baby. They've had a little bit of bad luck if you think about not just how they lost games early in the season, but if they win this game and they're heavily favored to do so, they're going to be a 12 win wildcard. And then if you dip underneath the numbers even a little more, over at FTN, like the number three and four teams right now in weighted DVOA, which gives more weight to the end of the season than the first month or two.

1:34:14The number three and four teams in the entire NFL, but behind my big two, which has been Seattle and LA all year, and it's still Seattle and LA. They're pretty far ahead of the pack. It's Jacksonville and Houston. And it kind of makes sense to me. I'm like, yeah. And right now, if I had to pick a third and a fourth team, it really might be Jacksonville and Houston. So they're trying to win this game. I think they'll be able to do it against Riley Leonard, but you know, unless the Jaguars get upset, they, they will be, you know, doing that wildcard path and probably be, you know, on the road at Pittsburgh or Baltimore, which, which would be fascinating.

1:34:49But yeah, it's just been an awesome season watching them.

1:34:52Patrick Claybon:Yeah. The way that, and again, I say it every time because if, if folks are on NFL pro, if they're on next gen stats and they're seeing the pressures, the pressures for will Anderson and Daniel Hunter are different than the pressures for other people because they don't have to get as close the closing speed is so high when they get to a certain range it's lights out for a lot of these guys and we've seen um to make these plays over and over again where it's it's it's a rough go like riley leonard legitimately has a case for for malpractice for how remember when drake may made his first start against the texans last year and it was like a week-long conversation how could how could you bring him in.

1:35:29Like this is irresponsible by the Patriots to start his career against this Texans defense, which I thought was ridiculous. Hey, how about Riley Leonard? Why don't you, why don't you do it in week 18 with like a banged up offensive line that's not playing as well as it was, man. Yeah.

1:35:44Gregg Rosenthal:And I think too, the Texans specifically were one of their strengths that many other teams in the league struggle to find a strength here is at inside linebacker where they will not only use the players that they have who are playing at a super high level, but they'll also send Jalen Petrie down into the slot quite a bit. Um, and he sort of puts a cap around the quarterback, wherever the quarterback is. You saw it a couple of times. One time, Justin Herbert broke loose for a big third down conversion along the sideline, but Jalen Petrie, he is covering up the quick game, um, with the way that he's playing coverage close to the line of scrimmage and then moving out of structure and making plays happen out of structure against particularly this front seven and then the addition of Jalen Petrie when he does play close to the line of scrimmage, that is a nightmare because they're dictating every throw you make, even when you try to create more space for yourself with those play action or bootlegs.

1:36:39So before we move on from this game, I want to hear a little bit about your feature on The Athletic this week about the CEO slash owner of the Colts, Carly Ursae-Gordon, who is notable for many things. But one would be that like Kyle Shanahan, she's around my age and is wearing a flat brim hat consistently, really making it happen. So that's, that's the thing I've recognized her most for what, what did you learn about her?

1:37:06Gregg Rosenthal:Yeah, well, obviously, you know, that I went to Indianapolis and I spent a week inside the organization for the beginning of December at the time we not nobody in the state, let alone the organization knew that their season was about to completely turn on its head. There were injury concerns with Daniel Jones. Obviously at the time, the, the, the defense and the offense, both were playing a little under how they started the year, but that really was after that was when he tore Daniel Jones, tore the Achilles and then the entire chaos and truly kind of a mess of the, of the last month of the season happened.

1:37:42Gregg Rosenthal:And they became eliminated from playoff contention after starting the season so strong. What I learned about Carly is that she doesn't, I think when people see her on the sideline with the headset and they see her taking notes as diligently and they hear that she meets with Shane Steichen and Chris Ballard once a week, every week, and has for years, I think people think that she's involved in the decision-making in terms of smothering over decisions or trying to sway people to her thinking or influencing decisions. That's actually not the case at all. I think she will have more influence in whatever changes they do or do not make in the, in terms of their entire organization and at quarterback over the next couple of weeks.

1:38:24Gregg Rosenthal:And the stakes are very high in that regard. But in terms of the day-to-day and in terms of the decision-making process, she is more of a question asker and a student and someone who is learning about the organization and asking questions in a way to sort of foster conversation and encourage conversation that she hopes leads people to the correct conclusion. It's not somebody who's coming in over the top and basically swinging her title around and saying, like, we're going to do this. So I think that when you see somebody that involved on the sideline, you do have a little bit of that. Oh, is this an interfering owner kind of thing?

1:39:03Gregg Rosenthal:This could not be further from the case. And I will also say this. I was in the locker room for a couple of days, talked to a lot of players. two things she has that locker room the way a coach a beloved coach would have a locker room and that was so i've been in a lot of locker rooms and a lot of buildings and that was striking to me as that in common with her dad as the owner to have the building the way the the the locker room the way that she does is significant and i think a very subtle yet very important power dynamic here The other thing is I was absolutely impressed, blown away, and just moved by the way that the emotional intelligence person to person of that locker room.

1:39:50Gregg Rosenthal:Because you talk to these players about extremely nuanced and complex issues, including mental health. It's all in the story, mental health, in terms of the spotlight that's on her and some of the commentary that's being made, not always with appropriate framing, especially because she is one of the very few women who are on the sidelines of NFL games and one of the even fewer women who's wearing a headset headset the way that they spoke not for her not in a way that softened her or patronized her or even like maternalized her they didn't turn her into anything other than who she is and that is one of them and I thought it was the most advanced like the EQ is off the charts in that building and I think that's special and if they can make the right decisions moving forward.

1:40:35Gregg Rosenthal:They have something special there. They just need to go out and do it on the field. And I think that is maybe the best legacy that she got from her dad because there's probably few owners in the last handful of years that have the sort of buy-in and loyalty like her dad did and bring back a little more ball knowers to be NFL owners. I do think it's a little bit of a problem with like the money that's come into the league that it's a lot of like billionaires fifth thing that they're doing and a lot of people are assigned out and she shows whereas like she shows up when the coaches show up in the morning and she stays until after they're gone it's one of the reasons why this building exists and we have the jobs that we have is like that the the men who did own these teams were so like intimately involved to the point where they would share all the profits with with everyone else it's like let's i wouldn't mind And if she was super involved, let's I want some more Al Davises and even even.

1:41:33OK, Mike Brown. I don't know if we need more Mike Brown. But Paul Brown's at least back in the day, like the the owner being that involved in Jim Ursa, you know, learned the hard way. But through a lot of mistakes early on, it doesn't seem like she's going to be doing that. And I'm really looking forward to everyone. Check out that piece. Still got three more games to get to, but these ones not as not as impactful.

1:41:55Patrick Claybon:Yeah, but still a parenthetical five minutes for the Buffalo Bills at the New York Chats. That's fair. We might not need it. It's 38 and a half. Andrew Catalan, Charles Davis, and Jason McCordy and AJ Ross. They're on the call. Mitchell Trubisky. Yeah, Greg. Probably. It's not confirmed. Sean McDermott said this game is really important to him and to the organization. It's the last game at Ralph Wilson Stadium. I don't even know what the sponsor is at this point. It'll be the Ralph to me forever. And it's going away. So we should call it the Ralph. They're really lucky the schedule makers set up the Jets and the Brady Cook Jets and this version of the Jets right now because I think they really do want to win, but they really do need to rest key players like Josh Allen.

1:42:42And I think they can accomplish both of those goals. But I don't know if it might be a situation where they play some of the high level starters like a James Cook even for a while and get a lead before pulling them. I don't think they really care about the seed, but I do think they really care about winning the game. I don't think they want to lose to the Jets in the final game of Ralph Wilson Stadium. It would really be a bummer. Thankfully, it's one of the worst teams I've ever seen is this Jets team down the stretch, right? I mean, they had the worst four-game stretch in Jets history, I think, since it says it all.

1:43:18Gregg Rosenthal:It's dark days over there. I will say this, and I know that a lot of this game, we're just kind of going to be talking about vibes because it's going to be a lot of backups for Buffalo playing. But that's a place where I remember, like, you want to go out with a good aura, like with good energy, right? Because I remember even when that stadium was being built and, like, people were making, quote-unquote, sacrifices to the pit that it was. To the new stadium. The landfill that it was being, that was being dug in order to facilitate the ground of the, the floor, the cement. I don't even know what I'm trying to say.

1:43:51Gregg Rosenthal:The cement building blocks of that stadium, people were jumping into it or like leaving gifts for the pit, right? This is a superstitious football town and they're going to come out in, in like droves for this. It's going to be a good crowd, no matter who the hell is on the field out there. Like, I just think the, the bills want to send this out the right way with a total butt kicking. Sadly for the Jets, they're sort of primed to be the victims of it. Eric, you have spent a lot of games, your childhood, flying back here like you did here to watch this latest one. Give us a little perspective and what you think it's going to be like there and what your thoughts are here.

1:44:33It's going to be a great game. I mean, I went because it's the last year. I've never been to a game. Got a snow game, check it off the bucket list. at the Ralph. Correct, Greg. People call it the Ralph. They don't call it Highmark, New Era, whatever it is. But no, they will want to win this game. Josh Allen loves his Ironman streak, so I definitely think he will start maybe a drive or two. But they need to win this game. The fans need them to win this game. If they stub their toe against the Jets on the way out of the stadium, you think the fans want McDermott fired now.

1:45:05Gregg Rosenthal:If they lose this game, dude. But no, it's Yeah, it's interesting. They're not going to, though. No, they won't. They're going to feel the spirit. It's interesting. Like the stadium, the new stadium is right next door, walking into Highmark a couple weeks ago, a month ago, whenever it was. It's right there. It's overshadowing. It's looking. It's like a... Like an omen, yeah. Souped up high school stadium is what I would describe Highmark, the Ralph now. And then you got this big future of what is there looking at you dead in the eye every time you walk in. They need to win this game. I mean, think of some of those...

1:45:35Vibes game. They need to win this game for so many reasons. Think of some of those games in the 90s that were played there and stuff. It is special. Yeah, McDermott had a quote. He's like, we have a future, but let's not jump out of this just yet. I mean, he's been around for a while. He got him out of the drought. I mean, the playoffs, I think he's only missed one of his time being there. He's like, I know we got a bright future with this thing, but let's not get over next door too quick.

1:46:01Gregg Rosenthal:I really like that. Win the game, please. I really, really like that. Can't be losing the Brady Cook. And they are always the team I think about the most. I don't know if this will pop in your head right away, Eric, of a famous you-never-know-what's-going-to-happen against backups Week 18 game, which is when Drew Bledsoe was playing the Steelers, and they needed to beat the Steelers' backups to make the playoffs. And the Steelers' backups beat them. I was at an ESPN zone in Anaheim, California, celebrating my birthday. It was the Willie Parker breakout game. He was like a fourth stringer, and they were like, hmm, this guy might be pretty good.

1:46:36Shout out to Fast Willie.

1:46:38Patrick Claybon:Oh, that's amazing. And shout out to teams getting other teams in the postseason like the Cleveland Browns did, like the Cincinnati Bengals and Andy Dalton did the Buffalo Bills when he beat the Baltimore Ravens back in the day. It is the Cincinnati Bengals taking on the Cleveland Browns. The Bengals are seven and a half point favorites. The over under is 44 and a half. Tom McCarthy, Logan Ryan, and Amanda Balionis, friend of the show, on the call. But the only number anyone cares about in this football game, Jordan, is one does that one happen against joe burrow yeah i think it does and i also i also think it's

1:47:12Gregg Rosenthal:kind of fitting for joe burrow if it happens to him if he's the one based on how his career has gone so far why he takes a lot of sacks he does take a lot of sacks no i'm saying like he can't he can't win for losing and to be on the wrong side of this history before winning a super bowl like it sucks that would suck a guy who's thinking we talk about vibes a guy who's constantly thinking about vibes about uh clearly um universal powers and and and history big fossil guy like this sucks for him if he if this happens to him it's fine i think it's fine who cares who takes the final sack the only reason we remember brett farve is because he slid for it and just gave it to him.

1:47:57Gregg Rosenthal:I just think, you know, these quarterbacks, the way that they're wired, Greg, and the stuff that he's been through to have it be on the receiving end of this. And sure, he says he's having fun, whatever. Like, this leaves a sour taste in your mouth, win or lose. Again, to have this much potential just be wasted year over year over year, it all connects to each other. To me, it all comes down to whether they have a good offensive performance. I don't think he'll care at all if he takes a sack and they win 25 to seven and he plays well in a lost season. Yeah. I think, I think that part is going to be important to him.

1:48:36But one thing we've learned about Joe Burrow over there is he is not afraid to take a sack. That man has, it's taken too many. It's something he could, he could probably improve on here in the second half of this.

1:48:47Patrick Claybon:And I think there's a positive way to spend it. If the, if the Bengals get the win, especially after what was, we can say an interesting Aaron Rodgers performance that prevented Miles Garrett from getting that sack. For Joe Burrow, who does hold on to the ball because he's got two generationally gifted receivers and he likes to attack defenses down the field, is going to continue to do that against the Browns. So he's going to get sacked, but they're also going to get buckets because that's what Joe Burrow does. Listen, all I'm saying, Greg, is that I think you might be glossing over a little of what I believe.

1:49:19Gregg Rosenthal:and, you know, there are whispers out there. The depths of frustration. Sure. I just don't think Miles Garrett's sack would make one big difference or another. I do think winning on this winning streak and having them develop some young players down the stretch, which they have, Amarius Mims and Dylan Fairchild on the offensive line have been playing well. Miles Murphy and Dax Hill have been playing well. I think that's all good things for them to feel better about. Get Cody Ford a touchdown. And while you're mentioning Andy Dalton and Marvin Lewis, I wanted to point out the one thing that annoyed me this week.

1:49:48Everyone was so mad they put the Ravens-Steelers on Sunday night. How could you do that? That game's not as good. This is disrespectful to the 49ers and the Seahawks. It's stupid that that's playing Saturday night. The teams aren't as good. They're just doing it for ratings. No, NBC has been consistent. From day one, they will always and only put in a win-and-in scenario if they have it, including a Bengals-Jets game back in the day where they knew one of the teams was resting the starters, even though there were better slots. And they were like, no, we will always do a win-and-in game. And that was a Marvin Lewis versus the Jets.

1:50:18Just a terrible game in week 18 where now I forget who was even resting their starters. I think it was the Jets.

1:50:24Gregg Rosenthal:I think that's the fastest I've ever heard a human. Had to get it. Had to get it in. If I was if you're on 1.5 speed. Sorry. You're on. You're in for a ride. I used to get mad about those people, but now I am one of those people. Depending on. Oh, yes. Yeah. Wow.

1:50:40Patrick Claybon:Well, inside info regarding Greg Rosenthal, the defender of the peacock itself. Shout out to Greg. I'm just saying that is the rule. They've been consistent. They do that every year. So it wasn't anything unique. The Kansas City Chiefs have been in the playoffs every year. Not this year. They are five and a half point favors against a woeful Las Vegas Raiders team. 36 and a half points. Chris Lewis, Kyle Long, Tiffany Blackman. Kyle Long. They're on the call. Shout out to Kyle Long, who was in our newsroom the other day getting ready for the Netflix game. He goes over to see Puma, who's our stage manager extraordinaire here.

1:51:14Patrick Claybon:Puma introduces himself and he's like, no, I know who you are. You used to do research for my dad on the Fox pregame show when he was a tiny human and he sees Puma for the first time in decades and remembers him. And that was a cool moment before Christmas in the newsroom.

1:51:30Gregg Rosenthal:That's beautiful.

1:51:31Patrick Claybon:That I'm glad I got to share. But we'll also share the fact that he gets to call this game in this moment. And yes, not a lot to talk about. I mean, the Raiders can only hope that if they take Fernando Mendoza, number one overall, and they lose this game, that he could have as legendary a career as Puma, who is one of the legends inside this building. The one real news item, other than obviously the Raiders clinched the first pick if they lose this game, to me was Andy Reid just making it as clear as humanly possible this week, I am back, I'm going to be back, as long as they have me, I am back.

1:52:08And they said it in no ifs, ands, or buts. So to me, that was kind of my big takeaway. Other than the fact that the offensive coordinator of the Raiders, your guy, Chip Kelly, is back in the biz. He just loves ball. Did you see where he got a job? No, where's Chip back? It is almost too hard to believe. He is the offensive coordinator of the Northwestern Wildcats.

1:52:30Gregg Rosenthal:And that's another win for the Walter Cronkite School of Journalism at Arizona State. What a career he has had. I mean, he's collected a lot of money from Mark Davis. That's a man that loves ball. I'm sure he's making plenty of money from Northwestern too, but he's not the coach. He's the coordinator.

1:52:49Patrick Claybon:No, I was just making sure Pat Fitzgerald's still there so they can bust unions together. Look at that. Chip Kelly and Pat Fitzgerald. What a great coaching staff for my rooting interest. Go Wildcat. I don't know. Man, I got to find three games to pick with Cynthia. I don't think I can do it. Taking the Raiders in week 18, but five and a half points for Chris Oladokun.

1:53:13Gregg Rosenthal:I have a sneaky suspicion. I know the Chiefs played their hearts out at Arrowhead, but I saw that Titans game. I have a sneaky suspicion like the Raiders are going to be making their fans sweat at the very least and might just like win this game to blow the pick. It's happened so many times in NFL history. Yeah, I did think that Chris Oladokun played well. Like I thought he moved well. He saw the field well. Well, it's, you know, I have no, I would have no doubt that they could win this game, but you never know. The Raiders might do something Raider-y. Five and a half points is just a lot for the Kansas City Chiefs.

1:53:51Patrick Claybon:And also David Braun is coaching Northwestern now. Pat Fitzgerald has gone to Michigan State. Right. I was going to say that, yeah, that was a strange hire, and I think it's going to be ineffective, but this is a pro football podcast. Well, it's important to know because Chip Kelly will be back, Greg.

1:54:06Gregg Rosenthal:Well, after he's invented a new type of offense. I don't think he's coming back to the NFL, but if you think of his career and UNH and the Eagles, someone could write a good book, I feel like, about a Chip Kelly. That would be interesting to me. Oh. I feel like a Chip Kelly book. I mean, he has seen and done a lot of things. It's why that stupid phrase for the Hall of Fame, well, you can't tell the story of football without him. He's got to be a Hall of Famer. That's true of a lot of people that shouldn't be Hall of Famers, and Chip Kelly's one of them. He's sneaky been a big part of football the last 25 years.

1:54:37I'm going to get Wickersham on line one. We're going to get that book.

1:54:40Gregg Rosenthal:That reminds me, Greg, I wanted to ask you this earlier and I kept forgetting. So we were talking about the Hall of Fame with Steve Weiss, who obviously he's got an inside track on a lot of stuff over there. Greg, on your avid reader, you talk about like the New York Times book list and stuff. Would you rather be the person that builds like the definitive reading list every year or would you rather be a Hall of Fame voter? Like a reading list of what? Like, you know, what's the one? The New York Times annual... Like best books? Am I writing the New York Times best books of the year or am I a Hall of Fame voter?

1:55:16Greg Rosenthal column at the end of every single year, best books.

1:55:19Gregg Rosenthal:Yeah, that's... Fully contextualized. But it is the one. Do I have like healthcare and benefits? Because that's a full-time job. If you give me that, yeah, maybe I'll make that transition. Although then you're taking your passion and turning it into your career. I don't know. But I would argue your passion is also arguing for and against Hall of Fame candidacies. Right. That sounds attractive. And my current skill set is definitely more well-suited for that particular job. I would have to give up all this. And so it was a trick question. I'm taking the Hall of Fame one because I got to respect those readers.

1:55:54I would have to quit and say goodbye in NFL Daily. And I wouldn't get to work with.

1:55:58Gregg Rosenthal:Well, then we'd get Walker in your chair. It's fine. Give me like a decade. We got to prime the pump. We got to get them ready. Maybe 15 years. That's a long time, especially in media. All right. We've done it. We've gotten to the end of the year. We finished our Week 18 preview. We'll be back, though, as a trio next week to preview the wildcard games. I cannot wait for that. We did it. This is my first regular season on the preview show, guys. Happy New Year to everyone. Hope you have an absolutely great night and New Year's Day. and we'll be back. I got Ali Connelly talking all pro. We got our pick show coming up.

1:56:36So much more to come. Happy New Year.

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