2025 Week 12 Recap: No One Takes the Points

26:08Patrick Claybon:to kind of stamp themselves and now they didn't do it you saw a flash of it where there was a play I believe in the second half where Quentin Nelson is pulling around gets a great block how they get a great seal on the edge as well and Jonathan Taylor goes down the sideline and you almost needed the Colts the Colts needed Jonathan Taylor to have that signature like huge home run hit a run where that's those are the big plays on the offense at this point where the chiefs were able to you know keep a lid on alec pierce and you you want like well maybe dimes gets involved in the run game he had a first down scramble uh but he's no he's not moving like prime dimes uh in the run game i know it's it's november and he just looked a little clunky uh moving around i'm sure he's you know the chiefs defense was beating him up uh as well i don't think he's 100 % because he was questionable on the injury report and he was moving around and he stuck in the pocket and made some really good throws to start this game out, including the first touchdown that he threw, which I thought was an incredible example of him staying in the pocket, but he did give the Chiefs a couple chances to pick the ball off in this game too.

27:14They just didn't take advantage. And then, look, if the Chiefs do turn this season around, circle back to about three minutes left in this game. They had a fourth down and it felt like not season to go but it was a big moment and Rasheed Rice if you're watching on YouTube you'll see Rasheed Rice makes a nice catch after Mahomes you know drops back to pass the throws like a little bit high and I've been getting on Rasheed Rice for not really making plays this year he did have a good game today after uh one misplay early then goes eight for 141 uh big time play by a big time player you could almost say it was a one-handed grab the

27:52Patrick Claybon:The way he had to reach up and stab that, where it would have been a nasty Mahomes miss if that goes to the turf. People would have said, hey, that would have been a tough catch for Rasheed Rice. Instead, first down, and now they can't be killed. They're the zombie Chiefs. They are, and that sets up a beautiful Thanksgiving matchup. They're 6-5. The Cowboys are 5-5-1, and both very intriguing. Meanwhile, this Colts loss. Somewhere, Texans fans were at home cheering for the Chiefs. somewhere Jaguars fans will get to them. We're cheering for the Chiefs and could make it very interesting atop the AFC South.

28:28All right, let's go from that Thanksgiving game and set up the next one. Yes, the Detroit Lions were hoping for an easy Sunday and they did not get one. Here come the Lions now. Opening possession of overtime. Goff up under center, turns, gives to Gibbs, Gibbs has to take the goal. What do you got, Gibbs? 45 to the 50. Great timeline, 40. Jets on. There he goes. 25. We know.

28:52Patrick Claybon:Touchdown, Detroit Lions. Fort Field. Stand up. Stand up. 65 yards. Jameer Gibbs to the house. We know. First play from scrimmage in overtime. If you know, you know that man can fly. He can fly. Wow. Oh, my goodness. this. Oh, put that on the call of the year list. I don't know if we've been doing one this year. We should now. Jameer Gibbs does it again. 219 yards on the ground on only 15 carries. He scores three touchdowns on the day. For you fantasy owners, he adds 11 catches. It's the Jameer Gibbs offense. He is the best pound for pound player in the NFL. Like Ollie Connelly was saying on our Saturday show.

29:46Check that out. The Lions survive an all-time Jameis Winston game in terms of entertainment value and win 34-27 in overtime. And yes, they had to stop Jameis Winston because of the overtime rules. That touchdown did not end the game on a drive. While we're here, let's actually listen to another Dan Miller call because it was another big-time player ending the game for the Lions. fourth and five with the lions get a stop here this game's over winston's gonna work out of the gun four across the front for detroit long count play clock at three there's the snap to winston he's back on fourth down looking pressure get him winston get him boom ball game ball game

30:35Patrick Claybon:ball game aiden hudgenson comes up with a sack get out of here boys go to the locker room this game's over. Oh, that's another great call. And I do love a Lomas Brown just screaming in the background. I believe that was him shook. Look, they needed this. You cannot slip up to the Giants the way things are crowded in that division. What did you think about how hard it was for the Lions to win this game? I think that the visceral nature of those two calls explains it all for the Lions today, because you're absolutely right. This is a game that they could not afford to slip up. They couldn't let this one get away.

31:14They couldn't afford falling to six and five. And they shouldn't because it's the Giants, a team that hasn't won in ages, a team that's playing Jameis Winston, a quarterback. You should be able to make him make a mistake or two because that's what he's known to do. Instead, Jameis has one of his best days that anybody's going to remember. He catches a touchdown pass and it wasn't just catching in the end zone. It's a catch and run. The Lions in the fourth quarter had to find themselves just wondering, how did we get here? And it took a great effort for them just to get into field goal range to send this to overtime.

31:41It was a tough game for them through all four quarters, despite Jameer Gibbs having such a great game. It felt like the rest of the offense really couldn't figure it out. Defense couldn't stop James who made a bunch of big plays until Jameer rips that one off in overtime, a 69 yard run to touchdown runs accounted for 118 yards of his 219 total yards. He was the guy for this team. And that's why once he got in the end zone, that was the first time lions fans could think, Oh my God, we may actually avoid disaster right now. And And it's all because of the guy in the backfield with Gibbs in the back of his jersey.

32:12Yeah, they were down 27-17 after Winston passed a Gunnar Olszewski. He passed from Gunnar Olszewski. And then immediately Gibbs responds. So they're down 10 points in the fourth quarter. Gibbs responds with a 49-yard touchdown run. That is epic, like all-time great Barry Sanders, like Hall of Fame type stuff, just putting the team on his back.

32:36Patrick Claybon:Yeah, and he's finishing those runs. He also almost had another long touchdown run in the second half where the Giants were able to get him out of bounds inside the five, and all that did was delay the Jameer Gibbs touchdown reception where he catches the ball and extends to get across the pylon. Just a great game from Gibbs where you wonder, you look at the numbers, and Jameer Gibbs is averaging 14 yards a carry, and it's like, how is this possible that the game goes to overtime when your best player on offense is averaging 14 yards a carry? that's because they couldn't stop Jameis in the first half.

33:10Patrick Claybon:He had 200 passing yards and two touchdowns in the first half. Like Wondell Robinson was almost a fantasy wide receiver one purely off of what he did in the first half. It was so much offensive success where it's like, why have we been keeping Jameis and Mike Kafka wrapped up? Every Giants game could have potentially been like this, but instead we got the 2025. Oh, it goes back to what I've been thinking ever since Dart came in and Winston. It's like Dable and this entire organization deserves everything they got for starting Russell Wilson in the first place. There was a lot of evidence that Jameis Winston was a much better quarterback entering 2025 than Russell Wilson.

33:51And in Wandale, yeah, had 135 before half day. You didn't like my Russell Wilson burial there?

33:57Patrick Claybon:No, I was reminded that there was another team that was up three in the fourth quarter late with a goal to go situation and eschewed the field goal, ultimately leading to the loss. And that was a decision by Mike Kafka. They were up twenty seven to twenty four. They had a fourth down and goal and they had an incomplete pass. So Detroit didn't have to use use their time out. Malik Neighbors is watching from home and sends out this. sometimes I think they'd be making us lose on purpose because there's no way you throw the ball instead of running it to make him burn two timeouts then you don't kick the field goal they have to go down and score football common sense am I missing something that's what Malik Nabors said during the game I love that he posted that and I appreciate you shortening it while reading it no but you left out the four slammers that he put behind football common sense exclamation point four times.

34:52Am I missing something? And you're right. That drive for the Giants ended with what under three minutes to go in the game. And it ends up being a Jake Bates. It took the Lions that long. Jake Bates, 59 yard field goal, or else they would have lost that game. And yeah, that was an unconventional decision. I do think the kickoff rule right or wrong is playing a pretty big role in the coaches decisions to do this because they're thinking okay if we hit the field goal we're up six but the the kickoff is probably coming out to the 30 the 35 that's like 30 yards of field position whereas in the past it would have been maybe 20 you don't like it I push back against that because you still have to force that team to go down and get a touchdown and what's the role the worst place to be is up six in a game because you can still lose and then you know they have to go get a touchdown that's fine because in this game the Lions were struggling to do anything outside side of Gibbs ripping one off.

35:52I would trust my defense in that scenario and, and, and kick the three, go up by six. So they don't run the risk of Jake Bates hitting the game tire, which by the way, the one he made to send it to overtime, just barely snuck in there. Imagine if you're up six and they had to fight just to get into position there. So I disagree with that, but I do, I agree with what you're saying overall, because field position, I think plays a big part in a lot of these decisions, but in this one specifically, you kick the field goal, you take the points every

36:15Patrick Claybon:time, and that's not with the benefit of hindsight, but it's also not just the fourth down decision on the incomplete pass. There was the second down decision to throw the ball at all that stopped the clock after the Lions had called a timeout. I think that's the one that bothers Malik Nabors and maybe me. Wait, the wide open throw that Jameis Winston missed? I mean, I can't kill that. That just, he missed the throw, which is a very, unfortunately, kind of like Jameis-y ending because he was incredible in this game. Yeah, he was good. Can we at least listen to the receiving touchdown. This is one of the plays of the year.

36:52First and 10 at the Detroit 33. Pistol formation. Singletary's the back behind Winston. Winston pumps his right leg,

36:59Patrick Claybon:takes the snap, play fake. They run an end around for Oshesky, who's going to throw it. He does throw it down the left sideline for Winston. Oh, he's adjusting in there. Jameis reaching, fighting it is in for the touchdown. Holy cow. Oshesky with a touchdown pass. To the wall, people. Jameis Winston. Oh, my goodness. That's Bob Papa. Oh, my gosh. A WFAN in Carl Banks. The transition to the celebration in front of the camera. Put that on the Jameis Winston Hall of Fame reel. That's beautiful. The famous dual sport athlete at Florida State, who at quarterback is one of the more awkward movers in NFL history, somehow gets past the line of scrimmage shook and turns into an exciting athlete where Derek Barnes has the worst rep I've ever seen him have.

37:49Patrick Claybon:As Jameis not only adjusts to the football, but stiff arms Barnes steps out of it and goes into the end zone. I saw some shades of Plaxico burst there on that catch. I mean, just boxing out the defender and breaking the tackle, adjusting to it in midair. When Elshesky stepped up, by the way, because he had to step up into a pocket that just became a pocket in the middle of the play, I thought there's no way he's throwing it to Jameis downfield. And then he lets it go. And I'm like, oh my God, Jameis is there. And as soon as he boxed him out, that's when I was like, oh, this is amazing. The broken tackle was the cherry on top.

38:19Add the celebration. You're right. Hall of Fame reel right there. And that was the second trick play that worked for them. They had a throwback pass to Jameis earlier that he had for a touchdown to Wandale Robinson to open the scoring. Wild day. Yeah, that was a 39 yarder from Jameis. There was a third and 10 from his own end zone where he throws it totally under fire. A ball that I thought might have scraped the top of the dome. and it goes to Isaiah Hodgins complete down the field. Just amazing timing, chutzpah, everything, and talent out of Jameis and Hodgins there. And then he has a third and 17 later in that drive.

38:57So I disagree with you both. After hitting those plays, you know, Jameis didn't execute on the play on the goal line, but you have a guy open on the goal line. You could go win the game right there. And Nick used the phrase, trust your defense, with the 2025 Giants defense. I'm never trusting that defense. They just lost. They just lost. They can get after Jared Goff. You know, Brian Burns. Although on that last drive, Brian Burns did go take a breather. So maybe, maybe you're right. And yeah, it's crazy. The Gibbs day as great. Like they have really leaned into playing him more. 48 snaps to 22 for Montgomery.

39:32And I know he hit those two big plays and that's like most of his yard, but he had a 75 % success or 77 % success rate on his runs today. So it was not even just the long ones. put that man in whatever conversation you want. Offensive player of the year, I guess. And I'm glad because if the Lions had lost on that play to Jameis Wins, I think you just have to eliminate them from playoff contention. I just think your season's over. Wow. You just have to go home. So it's a good thing. Like a new rule? It's just a new rule. They're seven and four. And man, this NFC North, like all the teams are a little bit flawed and really have no idea who's going to go out on top.

40:11Let's talk about another one. After this break, we will go to Lambeau Field.

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44:35Visit Bahamar.com today. It is second down and goal to go inside the one-yard line. Love under center.

44:43Patrick Claybon:Wilson the loan back. They've got a wing set up on the right side. And Love takes. Hand off up the middle. It's Wilson to the end. It's a touchdown! And the Packers cash in and take a 16-6 lead. Emmanuel Wilson. Congratulations to that young man. Congratulations to the people who picked him up in fantasy and just played him right away. Congratulations to the Green Bay Packers, who are 7-3-1. They destroy the Minnesota Vikings 23-6 in a game where it felt like the Vikings were not getting into double digits, but it's shook if you gave them another 60 minutes of play. Yeah, you're absolutely right.

45:30In fact, it was so apparent that they weren't getting into double digits that Matt LaFleur, perhaps uncharacteristically, just leaned on the run in the second half, played as conservatively as possible, just run heavy, not taking any chances, settling for field goals, just slowly building that lead because he watched his defense dominate JJ McCarthy and the whole Vikings offense, especially in the second half. By the end of this game, the Vikings, they had 10 total net yards in the second half, 10. at one point in the fourth quarter, they were at negative 11. They were being outgained something like 140 to negative 11.

46:02Complete domination started with the Packers defense and the offense was able to just ride the ground game. Didn't need Jordan Love to be a hero. And they were able to ride the ground game without Josh Jacobs because of Emmanuel Wilson. Great day for him with a career high 107 and two touchdowns and a feel good win for the Packers who have to really like what they're seeing from their defense. Yeah, the defense has taken over against some lackluster offensive competition. and we'll get to the JJ McCarthy of it all. But what did you see out of the defense in terms of averaging or only allowing 2.2 yards per pass play on the Vikings and then picking them off a couple of times late?

46:38I saw a very consistently collapsed pocket and some of it had to do with JJ holding onto the ball for an extra beat, which we know that's typical of him so far in his pro career and dating back to when he was at Michigan as well. But it was a pass rush that came at you from every angle. It wasn't just Micah Parsons. It was Rashawn Gary. it was Devontae Wyatt they were game wreckers coming from all different directions and in especially after uh you know there's a bit of a shuffle in the offensive line like it just gets worse and worse for McCarthy and the entire offense but they just had no hope they were backed up inside their five at one point and McCarthy twice had to run forward just to avoid getting sacked for a safety it was complete dominance and it wasn't just one guy Parsons obviously does a big part of it but uh this is a a complete defensive unit just imposing their will in Minnesota.

47:22Before I move to the JJ of it all, actually, just how did Jordan Love look health-wise? Because I did not have eyes on this too much, and it just felt like maybe that was part of the decision making with all the running, too? That was, and there was actually a point in the broadcast where, I think it was Greg Olson on the call, who was consistently noting that he was handing it off with the wrong hand, oftentimes, which indicates that he might be dealing with something, and it was an unremarkable game from him by design. He finished his 14-21 for 139, but if you had to recap that game, he doesn't play much of a part in it.

47:52And I think a lot of it was just built around protecting and avoiding risk. And because their defense was so good, they were able to do that. So it's something that we have to, I think, continue to monitor, especially in what has been a very up and down season for Jordan Love overall. But on a day like today, it didn't really matter much, which is good for them. Yeah. And they're heading into just that monster Thanksgiving game against the Lions. This is one of the best Thanksgiving slates we've had just because the games are so meaningful. It's now that time, unfortunately, that we do have to talk about J.J.

48:21McCarthy, which at this point, it doesn't feel like fun. First, let's actually let Wayne Larravee from WRNW talk a little bit about J.J. McCarthy, at least his last pick of the day. Slot to the left side. Jefferson wide to the left. Valentine that way as well. Safeties are high. Coverage is soft. Here's the snap. McCarthy looks, fires left side, and it's intercepted on the overthrow. Intercepted on the his second game in a row with an interception and that will do it. Evan Williams delivers his second consecutive dagger. Love a second consecutive dagger. We, we thought about listening to Paul Allen on Minnesota, you know, just for the kind of disappointment of it all, but it just seemed mean.

49:13And like, he might be over at that point of the game. They're four and seven. Like he, He didn't even really have the juice to be that sad.

49:20Patrick Claybon:Yeah, we heard Paul on the downside last week. We had a chance to listen to it before the show. It's not a person who expected a different outcome at this point. The offense struggling. J.J. McCarthy with a big overstride on that overthrow to Jalen Naylor. You wanted that ball. Get it to us! A little bit on the inside. But, yeah, the emotions come through from Paul, one of the best in the game. but he's honest. He's honest in the way he feels about it. It's not a good feeling in Minnesota right now. I don't know if I've ever seen this. Like, JJ had a negative.65 EPA per play today. And before those last two interceptions, it was actually negative, like,.4 something.

50:00So it wasn't even just the turnovers. That means every time JJ McCarthy is dropping back to pass, like, they're giving up two-thirds of a point. It's just a crazy stat. Like, what did it look like when you're trying to isolate his play shook versus just the Packers defense playing well. Yeah. I mean, that's how ineffective they are as a passing offensive JJ quarterback. It's funny because I brought, I brought up the Matt LaFleur leaning on the run in the second half. Kevin O 'Connell tried to do that in the first half, like more than probably he's done the entire season and it kept them competitive, but it also felt intentional as if to not throw his quarterback to the wolves.

50:35But if this is your starter and you want to contend with him, eventually you're going to have to test him. And in the second half, they had to test him because they were, the deficit was increasing incrementally. and ultimately he failed that test and what you see from him is inconsistent feet which o 'connell has talked about trying to marry the eyes and the feet and you see somebody who is not entirely confident in the decisions that he makes whether it's with timing hesitating for half a beat or a full beat whether he the pockets collapsing on him he doesn't sense the the rush which has been an issue he gets his arm hit on his first pick which sends it flying right into the hands of a defender for an interception um or it's just the fact that he doesn't seem like he's up to speed with the game.

51:14And then when he sails that pass, that's one of the few times that he throws it in rhythm with obviously a very big stride footwork again, not working very well, but he sails it to the point where you get the leap from Jalen Naylor as if he's like, I have no shot of getting that ball. This is just what we're dealing with right now. It's got to be so frustrating to be a Vikings receiver right now, knowing that the guy who's directing your offense can make some magic, but the quarterback just can't make it happen. Very difficult decision for Kevin O 'Connell, I think whether to keep playing him because he's at a like Zach Wilson, early Zach Wilson level right now, where it just feels like maybe you owe it to the team to, to give Rosmer a chance for a couple of weeks and just see it.

51:53If that's any better, let's listen to KOC after the game. I still believe, you know, he's, he's absolutely under control from a play call standpoint.

52:03Patrick Claybon:There's little things, you know, that happen like a quarterback getting tripped up, you know, on a play pass where you might have a look at something or, uh you know just maybe the dialogue and the huddle making sure all 11 are on the same page there's little things that come up here and there that just continue to limit your chances of having ultimate success enough against a good defense to go put points on the board but it is one of those things where I do believe wholeheartedly that you know it takes a drive or two of confidence building to uh to truly cement kind of what we want to be as an offense So if their season was not over before this week, it is now.

52:39And unfortunately, they had some major injuries in this game, too. Donovan Jackson, their first-round guard, goes out late. Christian Derrissaw, their left tackle, was hurt during the game, as you kind of heard alluded to in the call. And Josh Metellus, their great safety, was also hurt. So when it rains, it pours for the Vikings. But yeah, the Packers set up a really big one on Thanksgiving. We'll be talking about that on Tuesday will be our Thanksgiving preview. Let's wrap up the NFC North here with the team that was leading the division heading into Sunday. Fourth and six, 21 seconds. Snap back, Rudolph throw left.

53:15Incomplete. It was batting down. Bears are going to win this one. Batting down again. The Bears got their hands up on fourth down and six. And we got to fade to black. Oh, it's Jeff Jodiak. He's on this show every freaking week. 31-28. Bears survive another one this time over the Pittsburgh Steelers. So that's a win, what, by three points today. Two points last week. Four points a few weeks back before that. And five points against the Bengals. They are a team that finds a way to get it done. How did they get it done today, Patrick?

53:59Patrick Claybon:Well, I will call it, because I thought of a name, for Dennis Allen's defense. They are the bend and break their hearts defense from the Chicago Bears, where it works once again. The Steelers amassed 345 net yards. They outgained the Bears. They converted eight of 14 first downs. They got big chunk plays like Kenneth Gainwell on a fake tush push, where all the fake tush pushes are way more successful than the actual tush pushes going around the league. Kenny G had a 52-yarder, somehow didn't get in, but they don't let him score. They let Jalen Warren score, by the way, Greg. That's right. So Kenny G leads the Steelers in rushing, but you get another great Nashawn Wright interception where he almost does the same thing he did last week, where it's a great one hand essentially interception to rob DK Metcalf of a completion on the sideline.

54:43Patrick Claybon:And then late you get Montez Sweat getting the Bears an extra possession with a strip sack. He has six and a half sacks over his last six games. And yeah, they give up yards, but this team is going to get the ball from you, get an extra possession or two in this instance. and get enough to hold on and get a win in the fourth quarter against a Steelers team with Mason Rudolph that did move the ball. They lost DK Metcalf for a stretch in this game. He would eventually come back. Joey Porter Jr. also left this game, which had an impact on the defense. But you get three touchdowns from Caleb. Nice work with the ball.

55:18He did end up falling victim to TJ Watt.

55:23Patrick Claybon:Had another strip sack. Herbig jumped on top of it for a touchdown. 115 career sacks for TJ Watt. He passed JJ Watt. Yeah. Famously, Justin James Watt, who played for the Houston Texans. So, Greg, I'm going to ask you, how many sacks does TJ need to, in your mind, be a better player than JJ Watt? I don't think there's a number. Oh, I think what TJ would have to do is be the one of the best players ever for like a couple of seasons in a row. And I and and it's crazy to say that because you're making me you're the one that says, oh, you don't like to compare them. Yeah, I know. But they're brothers and the stat was there.

56:03So I was like, TJ Watt is a inner circle first ballot Hall of Famer. And yet I don't think there's anything he could do because I think JJ Watt is the best defensive player since I started covering football, which is like 20 something years now, which is crazy. 20 years. Yeah, I think he's the best. So I don't think I don't think I don't think TJ could get it. Number five, by the way, on our top 25 players of the last 25 years. You know what? TJ was on that list. Yeah. The credit to him. Just down because there's nothing he can do. He was like 21. He can climb that list. But getting into the top five would be tough.

56:37Patrick Claybon:There was nothing he could do on one of the biggest defensive possessions because the Steelers, again, had chances in the second half. There was a third down where the Steelers' secondary just releases DJ Moore to the grass. They were trying to pass DJ Moore on. Essentially, there was no defender there, and so Caleb Williams hits him for his third touchdown of the day. There's a chance, though, with Mason Rudolph in a comeback attempt. He hit Pat Friermuth for six and then got the ball back with a minute and 29 seconds to go, but there was Jaquan Brisker on fourth down. The call that you heard from Joniak as they fade to black and the Bears get another big one.

57:12Hell, let's listen to another call from Joniak. Could that play? Because to me, it was typical of what we've seen a little too often from the Steelers' defense this year. Third down and six. Shotgun snap. Caleb taps the ball. Blowing open down the seam end zone. Touchdown, DJ Moore. Touchdown, Bears, baby. Bears have taken the lead. I mean, there's nowhere, nobody on the screen. It just, you just see that more often. And in a game where the Steelers had a higher success rate passing the ball, a higher success rate running the ball, you just see these mistakes sometimes from the Steelers defense.

57:48And they're just not as complete as you want them to be. Ultimately, I guess we get Aaron Rodgers back next week, Mike Tomlin said, after the game. I thought it might look a little different with Mason Rudolph. and it ultimately didn't really we did not have a wide receiver top 36 yards in this game shook no and that's not surprising what infuriates me with the Steelers team is you just never get the complimentary football you get one week where the defense is really good like last week against Cincinnati you get this week where the offense isn't great but statistically they put up you know 345 yards they're in the game it's 31 28 the vinyl and the defense drops the ball and that is why I think that they perfectly represent their record at six and five now they are a near 500 team with the potential to, you know, put together a great performance against a good team and challenge them, but ultimately cannot be trusted to produce in big spots against red hot teams like the Bears, especially on the road, which is a bummer.

58:42And I don't think Aaron Rodgers makes that any better for them, unfortunately. Yeah, they Caleb Williams play was probably the worst sack that he's took this year in terms of not understanding he needed to get rid of the ball there and spinning back. But a Bears fan hit me up after that one was like, the difference is now the Bears have a Caleb Williams, a quarterback, and he's playing the way where immediately he responds with like a touchdown drive after that. So kudos to the Bears staying atop this division and kudos to Ben Johnson, proving all those people wrong who said that he just didn't have it as like a leader.

59:17Is he a leader of men or is he some sort of egghead? I mean, he might be the biggest star in the locker room this year. Hell yeah!

59:27Patrick Claybon:I tell you what, it takes a village. It takes a village. And I'm talking about players. I'm talking about coaches. I'm talking about training staff. I'm talking about everybody in this building. And here we are. We're back half the season, and our depth is being tested. All right? It would have been so easy to watch. Man, how are we going to win this game? We got no linebackers. I don't know what they're talking about. We got no linebackers. How are we going to win this game? Yes. You guys don't bat an eye. Jordan Jackson. Oh, I love that. They have fun in Chicago. They, they're doing that. When you make a point, I'm just going to go, uh-huh.

1:00:06They got ad-libs in the locker room. They're doing straight up Migos ad-libs for Ben Johnson. Uh-huh. That's how you know you got it, man. Go Bears. Eight and three. Mama.

1:00:21Let's just go. Let's go to Tennessee, Seattle. Oh, my gosh. Actually, let's not go. Let's just point out the fact that the Steelers fell to 6-5 today. And after having such a big lead in the AFC North, there was a risk, yes, that they gave up that division lead before Thanksgiving. The Ravens will go for it on fourth and goal. DeAndre Hopkins splits out wide to the right. Zay Flowers to the left. Derrick Henry alone in the backfield. Lamar under center on fourth and goal from the Jets, too. The give is to Henry. Right side. He's got a hole. He's in. Touchdown, Ravens. Easy peasy. Derrick Henry and that run.

1:01:04But it was not an easy game for Derrick Henry and this Ravens team. Trailed at halftime. Struggled with an opponent that they would seem to overmatch on paper again, but end up winning by a couple scores. Again, these games have been consistent, Patrick, 23 to 10. Does that make you feel any better?

1:01:27Patrick Claybon:No, it did not make me feel better because the concerns over the past few weeks of eight moving around more slowly and sluggish and looking like he's uncomfortable in the pocket. today was the biggest example of that in a game where it's rod taylor had more passing yards more completions and more touchdowns than lamar who was coming off a streak of 30 consecutive games with a touchdown pass and now there's no touchdowns in his last two games you have to go back to 2019 uh for that and other than literally the derrick henry touchdown run uh which pat ricard comes around and blows up that side of the field they get good blocking on that play and henry is able to walk in everything was a slog it was difficult uh Kyle Hamilton left the game multiple times comes back in which is something that you know you grow accustomed to to Kyle Hamilton doing at this point did he finish the game he did he didn't finish the he went into the locker room uh stayed in after the game coach Harbaugh said nothing major concerning at this point for Kyle Hamilton which is good news uh because the defense once again held the opponent under 20 points and the offense just scratched out enough in this sense but the way things are currently constructed and they're currently playing on offense where receivers aren't necessarily getting a ton of separation um the the time is a little you know lamar had a lot of time to throw which he typically does because he extends plays but his ability to be explosive back there is a big part of of holding the ball and clearly not 100 and the whole offense in general is not at 100 yeah they they were held under 250 yards against a Jets team.

1:03:07It's almost doing it perfectly in terms of they're competing every week, but there are probably some fans that wouldn't mind getting a higher traffic. They're not embarrassing themselves. They've definitely improved on defense, especially. They hold the Ravens under 250 yards. Now, the Ravens have held six straight opponents under 20 points. And one of them was the Rams. The rest of them, you know, and one of them was the Bears, who is a very good offense. they have found different formulas to win you're an AFC North expert Shook having lived in Ohio how are you feeling about the fact that everyone was right yeah the Ravens are going to catch the Steelers they've already caught them I mean it's a tie but they're winning the tiebreaker right now how do you feel about where this Ravens team is at though with the with these wins like Vikings this Browns game the Jets game they all even the even the Dolphins game they all feel pretty similar yeah i mean you can sound cliche and just say a win's a win right and that's really what matters most for them at this point i would like to think that they're a team that's going to peak at the right time and they're just kind of building that way it's just that it's it's so small in increments that there's not really like a case building that that's actually going to come to fruition and it starts with lamar but the the side that you have to be really confident in is this defense for what you just said holding a bunch of teams under 20 points ever since they acquired a lowy gilman they've been able to go to this three safety look that's allowed them to look you know present so many different defensive looks for opposing quarterbacks that they're just super effective in coverage they can do a number of different things with a personnel grouping that is unorthodox by today's standard even in the in the world that we live in where everybody's pretty much running nickel defense as their base defense and i think that that is what's going to carry them through this period and you hope that eventually lamar gets healthy enough or comfortable enough that their offense opens back up because it just hasn't and i think that when they played the Browns last week that did not do them a favor because they couldn't get in any rhythm in that game because that Browns defense was all over them and so it's not surprising to see them only put up 23 points and struggle in a game like this it was the perfect time for the Jets to turn to Tyrod as opposed to Justin Fields to give them a chance to be competitive which I think you know played a part in this game but ultimately when it when I look at the Ravens I'm still very confident that they're going to win the division they're going to be in the playoffs and you hope that they peak at the right time to so you can take them seriously as a team that can win in the playoffs I just you know I want to look at it closer but on a day where the Jets got like no pass rush their pressure rate is really low and the Ravens offense has like a very low success rate against the Jets a little surprising uh 35 percent uh compared to 50 percent for the Jets but they are in first place and they will be playing on Thanksgiving night against the Bengals and yes they'll have to try to win that game to stay atop the NFC or the AFC North.

1:05:51Let's now flip over to the NFC and see if the Seahawks could take care of business down in Tennessee.

1:05:58Patrick Claybon:Third down and six slot to the near side. Smith and Jigba now comes over from left to right. Four man rush. Darnold has time. Going to let it fly. Got a man. JSN makes the catch. Breaks the tackle. He's going to back into the end zone for a touchdown. Seahawks. 63 yards, single coverage. You guys know better than that, Tennessee. Do they? That was actually one of two different times on this day where they got Jackson Smith and Jigbutt singled up on a safety, and he took it to the house. Well, not each time. Eight for 167 and two touchdowns overall. Not only did he have that long one, And he also had a 56 yarder in the game that did not go for a score.

1:06:49Jackson Smith and Jigba has set the all time franchise record for yards by a Seahawks receiver in a season. In week 12? In week 12. You know how you always have to be like, well, you know, the season's like there was never a season that was shorter than 12 games. It's ridiculous. He is really incredible. and I'll just say it here, Patrick. Score this one for the Jackson Smith and Jigba MVP campaign.

1:07:19Patrick Claybon:I think at a certain point after the four INT game, perhaps we don't give these points to Sam Darnold anymore. If the Seahawks win, those points generally are going to JSN. And Darnold had an uneven game. I know the stats look great in those. I mean, every one of his deep throws to JSN is better than the last. It was really awesome. That particular throw, but the other deep one was great too. But he had a couple turnover-worthy plays in this game. He was lucky not to get picked off a couple different times. It didn't happen, and so they got away with it. And overall, 30-24 is the final score. And it was not as close as that would indicate because Chimera Dike, who might be making All-Pro as a return man, as a rookie, which is pretty great for the Titans.

1:08:11Returned another punt return. So that's one of the Titans touchdowns. And then they had a never-ending drive at the end of the game.

1:08:19Patrick Claybon:They ended their chance to win with a touchdown drive. They did. It really did feel like they were kind of just trying to score to make themselves feel better. But it took forever for them to score at the end of the game and essentially ended the game. And if you watch Mike McCoy, the interim head coach's press conference after it, you would have thought they won the game. They were so happy. And I think that was because Cam Ward played awesome in this game. It was his best game of the season. It was one of the best games any quarterback has had against the Seahawks. And if nothing else, he also led the team in rushing.

1:08:51That was one reason why they were not competitive in this game is they had their success rate was through the floor in terms of Tony Pollard and Ty's a Spears. But Cam Ward looked great. I'm not sure we can really draw much else from Titans games for the rest of the year. no and I think that's got to be the focus from here on out is how much progress does cam ward make him and chamira dk and like I am manner like the future of the team kind of worry about the running game I mean I have a lot of respect for tony pollard but I also know that the offensive line no matter how much they've invested in it is just not a good group and it's not good for run blocking so I don't hold that against tony pollard necessarily but it's got to be all about cam ward because that is obviously your franchise quarterback you spent the number one pick on him and you're also going to have a really high pick again and you don't have to spend it on quarterback as long as you keep him on that path so it's really encouraging to see him have you know the best game of his season because you know like when I do QB index he's always in that lower third but I kind of want to nudge him up he never has like a bad game it's just that the titans are so bad that he can only do so much and so to see him have a good game like this it gives me a lot of you know reason to bump him up because I think he's been fairly steady in most of his games this season.

1:09:58I was locked into this one and I was noting at halftime and even going into the third quarter, they had three points at that point. And then he missed a throw on a screen to Spears. And I was like, that's the first even minor mistake Cam Ward has made in this game. He was playing about a perfect game and yet they had three points on the board, which I think exactly goes to it.

1:10:21Patrick Claybon:And then they meant to what the Titans are, right? It really, but he hits a deep shot. He has another deep shot that hits his receiver in the hands. He has a play, a dime over the middle to James Prochet. They started Van Jefferson, Chimera Dike, and James Prochet at wide receiver. The leading receiver is Gunnar Helm on this day. And the coaches have been telling Ward to run more. And I think it was a coaching point in this game because there were many key important moments where he did run the ball and get first downs with his legs. And then, yeah, if you're watching this game on YouTube, you'll see this isn't a throw of the year candidate because if we had Cam Ward throwing the ball against his body, across his body while going out of bounds, like another one, I think we have seven of them this year, but there was a crazy third and nine that was just awesome to Xavier Restrepo, who Titans fans have been calling for all season and they got him.

1:11:18He had a lot more conventional throws in this game, but it was nice to see the Cam Ward special.

1:11:22Patrick Claybon:Yeah, they were calling for him because it's, you know, it's ineligible because we do have Cam Ward fadeaway out-of-bounds shots, but none to Xavier Restrepo because that's his first career catch on that great ball from Cam Ward where it was all day. He was pressured on 42 % of his dropbacks. In those dropbacks, he was 9 of 14 for 100 yards with a plus 11 completion percentage over-expected against a defense that has dogged everybody, including, you know, the Rams got the win, but Matthew Stafford a couple weeks ago. And you might have thought, okay, well, Cam Ward holds onto the ball. That's why the pressure rate's so high.

1:11:57No, in this game, he was getting rid of the ball for the most part. Derek Hall of the Seahawks had five quick pressures on his own. The Seahawks actually, you know, struggled other than really Derek Hall to get like a ton of quick pressure, but for the most part, like they were better. I thought Kim Ward, for one game, outplayed Sam Darnold by just a little bit. But we shouldn't give too much credit. Seattle had a big lead in this game. They did what good teams need to do. And they did give the ball to Kenneth Walker a little more. He played a higher percentage of snaps today, which I was interested to see.

1:12:31He had two-thirds of the snaps and two-thirds of the touches. And going into the week, they kind of said that that was what was going to happen. So they might be kind of riding Ken Walker. And they ran the ball quite well today against the Titans. And so they take care of business. Only three losses on the season, eight and three for the Seahawks. Let's take a break and we will be back on the other side. We have not checked in with the New England Patriots.

1:12:55Patrick Claybon:Nope.

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1:17:16Patrick Claybon:The Bengals in a 2-by-2 set. Second down and five. Black goes under center. The veteran quarterback with a play fake and a deep drop. Out of time. Double five. He throws a pick. Scott Goodbody, running left side, 15-10, turning around, back-pedaling into the end zone. It's Marcus Jones, another pick six against Cincinnati. Oh, boy, that'll make you up. It's amazing how much your team can turn. You needed the touchdown on offense, and you needed to get off on defense. Oh, that's Scott Zolek on WBZ, along with Bob Sochi. the Marcus Jones Pro Bowl season continues apace. He also had the game ceiling pass defense on the very last play of the game.

1:18:03Yes, the Cincinnati Bengals were in it until the last play of the game, but the Patriots escaped 26 to 20 and Joe Flacco and all the magic that he's brought is, you know, come back to earth. They don't want to pick on him too much, but on a day where the Bengals defense showed up, shook and got a lot of stops in the red zone, especially on the one yard line, the Bengals offense without Jamar chase. And then without T Higgins late in the game, wasn't up for the challenge. Yeah. There was even a bad sequence in the fourth quarter where, uh, Yoshivas goes down. Andre Yoshivas goes down the next play.

1:18:38T Higgins goes down and you're like, Oh man, what else do the Bengals have to deal with? It's already a rough day for them offensively, but it, you know, not to start negative and everything, but that's kind of the story of the game. is that their defense gave them chances. They made it tough for Drake May and the Patriots offense throughout most of the day. And the Bengals offense simply couldn't capitalize. Now that pick six that we just played was Joe Flacco's second pick six in as many weeks. And each of them are equally as ugly, which kind of just captures where the Bengals offense is right now.

1:19:05And in games in which their defense does show up and their offense fails to show up or at least do their part, that explains why they've lost both of those games and why they're three and eight right now. Now on the Patriots side, you give them credit because Drake may, they got enough done in the first half to be able to just kind of chip away with the field goals, but they need to look really inward here going forward at their red zone offense. Cause it was bad today. They had a sequence of nine plays, six of which were on the Bengals one and they didn't get any points out of it. They went back down there again, four plays, the last one field goal, because Mike Frabel learned from the earlier go for it attempt and decided let's just take the point.

1:19:43Three points counts, Patrick. It's a good thing. you took the points because that's what they won by six.

1:19:47Patrick Claybon:It was a rage field goal decision. You look over the camera cuts to Mike Vrabel to see what he's going to do. He's already got three fingers up in very frustrated fashion because it wasn't just a goal line stop on third down and goal on the previous goal line stand. They got a they got a holding penalty. They gave him first and goal again. And they still didn't get it. They had seven snaps total from the one because there was one other one on the ensuing drive that they got from the one. They didn't score one time. And that's why I worry for this Patriots team, which is 10 and two, but lost the left side of their offensive line to injuries today.

1:20:24Jared Wilson, their third round pick, who's been playing left guard for them and has had his share of struggles this year, is carted off today with an injury. And then Will Campbell is carted off with a knee injury. He had the towel over his head as he was carted off. It didn't look good. We're not going to speculate at this point, but obviously if they lose both those guys, especially Campbell, who has stabilized that left tackle and, and been playing really solid for them, they could be in trouble because I, I saw something written about this game. That's like, you know, the Patriots rookies have helped to change their offensive line from embarrassing to above average this season.

1:21:06And now they'll be tested. And I'm like, they're not above average. They've been bad. Will Campbell's probably been their best player. at left tackle, but they've just gone from by far the league's worst to like acceptable in parts, but their running game has been terrible for a reason. And it's their offensive line, the red zone offense you mentioned today and Drake may entering this week has faced the second most amount of quick pressures in the entire NFL. Only the chargers have been worse in terms of quick pressures. So these injuries, I think really calls into question how they're going to construct an offense moving forward.

1:21:41Yeah, absolutely. Especially when you can't consistently run the ball and now you've lost half of your offensive line. So you're definitely not going to be able to consistently run the ball. It's just going to put more on the shoulders of Drake May, which to this point, he's been able to handle it and you give him credit for that. But I think today was the first preview of what it might look like if he's not able to handle it, or if the road is just too bumpy for him to find, you know, a steady rhythm, because that's basically what this entire offense was in the second half, him missing throws him being pressured and rolling out and not having time to throw or find somebody people not getting open the one time he throws a touchdown pass in the end zone it's it's a product of an offensive pass interference because it's a pick play like these are challenges that they're going to encounter going forward if they are limited offensively too much is going to be on their quarterback and that is why you should be concerned about them but i'm not going to take away from the fact that the first team to 10 wins in the nfl all right i'll give that that credit no that's amazing and the bills lose earlier in the week they're up two and a half games in the standings a couple games in the last column Those games against the Bills and Ravens look even more interesting coming up, but I think they're going to have to have their defense step up.

1:22:43It's not just about one side of the ball. I think they could do it. They did get Keishon Booty back today and Ramondre Stevenson back today, and they made it work. And the Bengals, who might get Joe Burrow back on Thanksgiving, just to entertain us more. Booty is massive.

1:22:59Patrick Claybon:Yes. Nikoli Booty is massive, Greg. as his return helps as a team that has relied on explosive plays. Didn't get very many today. I thought there was going to be a great opportunity with the matchup, but as you mentioned, Al Golden's defense stood strong, and the gift basket may need to go from Foxborough to Jalen Ramsey for being involved in this situation where if Jamar Chase is in this game, because Shook pointed it out, Yoshi goes down, there's no Higgins, relying heavily on Mitch Tinsley in the fourth quarter who did have a touchdown catch where if Joe has more options that he's not looking, staring down the check down in the flat for Marcus Jones to take the other way.

1:23:41Patrick Claybon:This game is entirely different. Preseason superstar, Mitch Tinsley. That's why you watch the games in August. Man, yeah, and it's unfortunate. We almost certainly won't get to see T. Higgins on Thanksgiving. Jamar Chase will be eligible to be back. T. Higgins' mom did tweet out that she thought her son was okay. And by that, I think just like feeling okay. But it would be surprising if he goes through the protocol quick enough to play on Thursday night. So they'll have that game against the Ravens. Let's go to Arizona, the game that truly made Patrick lose his mind. They're not showing blitz.

1:24:20They sent four. Here we go. Percent off the throw. Looking, looking. Fires it deep downfield. That ball is going to be knocked away. Knocked away! Knocked away! The Jags winning it overtime with another terrific defensive play! All these cardiac cats, they win it again! A huge win on the road for the Jacksonville Jaguars! They're back to being fun. And it certainly was messy! 27-24 in just like a connoisseur's delight. To me, this was a delightful game. I can't wait to watch it a little closer. Frank Frangie on WJXL watched it extremely close. And yes, the Jaguars defense bails out Liam Cohen and Trevor Lawrence, who had four turnovers on the day, and they escaped the desert with a victory to get them to 7-4.

1:25:20but Patrick, I do want to hear about the decision-making process late in the game and what you thought of Liam Cohen and his fourth-and-one call.

1:25:31Patrick Claybon:Liam Cohen and the Jacksonville Jaguars late in the fourth quarter have an opportunity, fourth-and-one, to kick a field goal and go up six late. And the models, both models, both widely distributed models, had a slim margin, but still a margin in favor of going for it. Liam Cohen ultimately decides to have Trevor Lawrence throw the ball to Tim Patrick and it's incomplete with a minute and 43 seconds to go. So instead of a six-point lead with a minute 40, it is now a three-point lead and Jacoby Brissett promptly goes down the field. They get Chad Rylan on a kick and the game goes to overtime. Had a throw at the end zone.

1:26:14I loved that little game management. By the way, Jacoby Brissett does not spike the ball with about 15 seconds left. Instead, he runs the call there. I thought that was a veteran move and tries to get the defense not really ready for it. He gets a one-on-one on the side. It doesn't work out. But yeah, it was a little next level. I think you got to look at the game in front of you. And I think that was what's frustrating you because for the most part, the Jaguars defense was playing pretty well in this game. And all they had to do was stop the Cardinals from scoring a touchdown with no timeouts.

1:26:48Patrick Claybon:And we've seen the impact of having more of their guys. Of course, they're missing incredible amounts of pieces, including the guy they traded up for in the top 10 of the NFL draft, who we hope to get back. But Devin Lloyd back in this game, who actually knocked Jacoby Brissett out of the game briefly, but because he's Jacoby Brissett and has his jersey in Canton, Ohio, he summons the will to come back into the game and be very successful. Five QB hits for Devin Lloyd. He's all over the place. It does everything for this defense where I would understand trusting the defense where Josh Hines Allen is having a solid game, getting pressure.

1:27:28Patrick Claybon:The Cardinals dealing with injuries of their own on offense and the Jags have been getting off the field. And it's one of those very frustrating games on the Jags offense where you get both good Trevor and bad Trevor trading places during the game. There was one interception in the red zone. I understand Calais Campbell's been playing football for 250 years. He jumps up, tips the ball. It gets picked off. Those types of things happen. Yes. The other two Trevor Lawrence interceptions were downright nasty and kept the Cardinals in the game where it's a weird dichotomy because they had a whole lot of success running the ball early, including with Trevor Lawrence.

1:28:05Patrick Claybon:And late in the game, you get that interception. They come back. Trevor and Jacoby Myers hook up on back-to-back plays and get a touchdown. And it's like, yay, Jack's passing game. next possession is a turnover where you're just not sure how this passing game is going to operate i don't i don't know what to think of this jaguars team they had a design run success rate today of 20 their running game was awful so everyone's so mad at the play call on fourth and one rolling trevor lawrence out they did call a running play on third and one and basal tootin who i think's the better you know short yardage back gets stuff so their offensive line is just struggling but that's why you just kicked the field goal there.

1:28:43I think because of this situation, Trevor Lawrence has not shown you that he can be trusted. He doesn't even have an open receiver there. I mean, to watch that must've felt so helpless for a Jaguars team. And then you watch Jacoby Brissett do what Jacoby Brissett does and overcome the Zebras who gave them a terrible spot, which cost them about 40 seconds on the final drive because they didn't mark it as a first down and then they had to go for a fourth down. and instead of being able to spike the ball, it was a whole thing. And then he gets down and at least has a chance to go win the game. But when I watched this ending sequence too, Shook, I thought like Jonathan Gannon is a defense first coach and I know they forced some turnovers today, but they never get the stop that they need.

1:29:28It sucks because they keep losing close games, but they never get the stop that they need. It's the story of their season, the fourth quarter woes. And today was the fourth quarter in overtime woes. It was a really fun game because it was very back and forth in the final quarter. But that's not what you expect from your team when you have a defensive minded coach like Jonathan Gann. That's not what I expect. When I look at the Cardinals week by week and make my picks, I go, well, you know what? At least I trust their defense. And now it's Jacoby Brissett. So I trust him to give maximum effort and maybe throw them into situations in which they could potentially win.

1:29:55But then it's the fourth quarter problem. It's you can't trust them in the final period, which is what happened for them today. Although it was really nice to see Greg Dorch get loose and move them into field goal range. I thought I was kind of hoping they would spike it or something just to give himself maybe one more shot at the end zone before kicking the field goal, but it's fine. Okay. I see what you're saying. You could have maybe gotten two throws there and yes, lined up with like 16 seconds. So I was like, bike it. Come on. Okay. Okay. I think I get what he was thinking though. I think he saw like, they're a little frazzled trying to get set up, but I hear what you're saying.

1:30:28And Patrick and I had a long conversation about Greg Dortch in the newsroom where I said Greg Dortch is a championship level fourth receiver. Like if you get Dortch as your fourth receiver, you build everything out backwards from there. He can get you to the ship. So the Cardinals, at least they have that.

1:30:47Patrick Claybon:They have that foundational piece of a receiving group, which is Greg Dortch as the one. And who knows? Maybe the Cleveland Browns have a foundational quarterback. Okay, I'm just a little funny. Wind shot out. Samson in. You never know. It's possible. He's now pushing into the backfield here. It's a three-by-one. Shador on third down, throws it. Sampson to the flat. Sampson 35. Sampson 40. Sampson, first down. He's at the right of 35. It's a foot race, and he's gone. Dylan Sampson, touchdown. And that is the longest play of the year for your Cleveland Browns. 66 yards to the house. Dylan Sampson, second receiving touchdown.

1:31:28and for Shador Sanders, the first passing touchdown of his young NFL career. Oh, we haven't heard from Andrew Siciliano in too long. We love you, Andrew. Nathan Zagura also on the call for WKRK. Browns win easy, 24 to 10 in Vegas. Yes, Shador Sanders, the first rookie quarterback, or maybe it's debut quarterback for the Browns to win in the last 18 attempts. Wow. That's a wild stat. Do you know how old I was when they had a quarterback win his debut? How old? How old? I think I was two. Okay. No, Shadr didn't have to do a ton of the heavy lifting. Obviously, on that play, it's a lot of yak, but he did have a beautiful throw early in the game.

1:32:16Quinshaw Juggins with a couple rushing touchdowns, and more importantly, the defense just dominates the Raiders. What did you see out of Shadr, Nick? We'll start there. Well, I anticipated a nasty game between two, two and eight teams, and we got a bit of a nasty game, but what wasn't nasty was Shador. He looked better than he did in relief last week. You could tell that the week of preparation gave him more confidence. He got the ball out on time. He didn't hold onto it very long, except for maybe one or two plays, which is very encouraging because that was his biggest weak point. He showed off his arm.

1:32:47The throw he has, it's like a 52-yarded Isaiah Bond that sets up a Quinchon Judkins touchdown. rolling right away from pressure fires it on the run over the db perfectly puts it on bond for the big completion that was at that point their longest play of the season before the samson touchdown so i thought that he executed in spots it was uneven it was pretty inconsistent the offense is still a mess it's still dysfunctional they still are a low ceiling unit but ultimately he steadied them enough and did enough things made one bad mistake on an interception that's very typical of a rookie. So I say decent, solid, good thing to build on, not a nightmare, which is more than they could say about most of their season.

1:33:25Yeah. And more than you can say about this Raiders season. You don't want to go too crazy on a day. Their drop back success rate, the Browns was 23%. Like they weren't consistently do it, but he did have a 39 yarder to Judy. You mentioned that play to bond, which is almost a replay of the chance he had to tie the game late last week to Isaiah Bonnie. He missed it last week. He hits it. today, Miles Garrett is doing unspeakable things on the football field. A couple more sacks today. Was it two forced fumbles? What is it like watching Miles Garrett right now as a Browns fan? Well, it's interesting because, you know, Browns fans in the moment when they traded out of two back to five and took Mason Graham, a lot of them were upset because they wanted Travis Hunter.

1:34:09They wanted the new toy. But I think that they're all pretty happy with the decision that they made now because as Mason Graham, his arrival has brought this defensive line to a higher level, better than they were when they had Zedaria Smith and Myles Garrett, or when they had Jadavion Clowney and Myles Garrett, because now there's interior pressure that is consistent, and especially against an offensive line that's really bad in the Raiders. I mean, horrible, worse than you would ever imagine bad. And then you deploy Myles Garrett against that, and it's like watching a monster just feast. Just do whatever he wants.

1:34:37Just destroy a left tackle. Line up over the center and shoot the A-gap. cause all kinds of problems for Geno Smith, make his day awful. 10 total sacks for the Browns. Miles Garrett had three. He has 18, 18 with six games to play. Like he's going to break the record. He's had an incredible year. Don't, don't risk it. I'm saying it. I don't care. I don't care. I don't care. He's going to break it. So Reggie White once had 19 sacks through the first 11 games of the season. That was in 1987. The previous record holder, Mark Gastineau had 17 and a half sacks. And of course, yes, Garrett gets more games to play with to try to break Michael Strahan's record.

1:35:16He also had four TFLs today. So he is on an insane tackle for loss rate, too. And it was three total sacks. I only saw the two forced fumbles, but he had another one. And yeah, this season just can't end fast enough for the Raiders. They're getting worse, Greg. Yeah, they're the worst team in the NFL. They're worse than the Titans.

1:35:35Patrick Claybon:It's not even close where I was. my thoughts because I know everybody was excited about the opportunity to see Shadour play. To see Myles Garrett play against the worst offensive line that I have ever seen. I truly believe at this point in the NFL. I have not seen an offensive line worse than this and Myles' average get-off is still 29 years old, 0-7-1 today. Still getting off the line of scrimmage faster than anybody. And this line is overmatched everywhere, but definitely overmatched with the the best defensive player that, you know, since, since JJ Watt was doing things and since Aaron Donald was wrecking things, it's, it's not even close.

1:36:15Miles is shouldn't be on the same field as these guys. That's absolutely fair. So the Browns three and eight, but they are two and oh in Kevin Stefanski hot seat matchups. He had that one against Mike McDaniel, where I thought maybe the loser gets fired and they blew out the dolphins, but they didn't fire McDaniel. And then beats Pete Carroll, who is not having much fun in Vegas. Let's go to New Orleans where no one who was rooting for the home team was having any fun.

1:36:44Patrick Claybon:Here is Cousins looking. He's going to sail it for Mooney. Darnell Mooney, touchdown Atlanta. Oh, my goodness. There were two black shirts back there. Thought they had good position. And Cousins dropped it in a bucket to Darnell Mooney. Big time throw from Kirk Cousins. Oh, you can't keep Kirk Cousins down for too long, Patrick. No matter what you want to do, that's Wes Durham on WZGC. The Falcons win 24-10 on a day where, yes, their defense was the best unit on the field. The Saints offense only scores three points. They get their only touchdown on a pick six, right, by Kirk Cousins. Wasn't there a pick six in this game, or am I crazy?

1:37:28Patrick Claybon:Yeah, no, Cousins threw a pick six. Thank you. They got the score. They had chances, Greg. but they elected to not score and do other things. That's true. They elected to kick a field goal late, but there was a fourth down that they went for where Taysom Hill threw the ball instead of kicking a field goal. That didn't work. Look, we pick a lot of games throughout the course of the season and we're going to be wrong so often. But for some reason, I feel like you picking the Saints to win this game, Patrick, drove you more crazy than any pick you made all season. You were chugging Haterade as Kirk Cousins was piloting a two-play sequence where they got 81 yards off of a second and 24.

1:38:11That touchdown to Mooney was preceded by like a 40-yard screen to Bajon Robinson.

1:38:16Patrick Claybon:Yeah, the screen came on second and 21 because the Saints get pressure on Kirk Cousins, and it looked like typical 2025 Kirk Cousins where he wasn't sure what to do. The pressure came. He threw the ball to absolutely nobody. buddy the saints lobbying brian brisey arms out to the stripes where the referees do that thing where they have the long discussion and then they drop the flag out and you're thinking the saints got a chance they got a chance they get off the field here they'll go back down and they're going to score this time no it's a screen to bajon and then immediately darnell mooney and kurt cousins like dust off it looks like prime darnell mooney and prime kurt cousins where it's like what are you doing saints what are the saints doing it i love i love kirk was kind of like gearing back to get everything into that.

1:38:59He put his heart and soul on that throw. And they get a win, which for the season they had, any win is going to feel good. Four and seven for the Saints. I mean, for the Falcons and the Saints fans after that touchdown, they all just left. If you're watching that late in the game and when they hit that touchdown to go up two touchdowns, there's about 10 minutes left. And it's not like you're really trying to beat traffic in New Orleans. You're walking out of there or just the traffic's not that bad. It's fine. but people are just like, no, I've had enough of the New Orleans Saints. And just a sad performance.

1:39:33Tyler Shuck, Shooky, was the leading rusher on the day where Alvin Kamara left the game pretty early to injury. They had nothing going whatsoever on the ground. Taysom went 10 carries for 17 yards. Yeah, can we end this already? I'm pretty sure we've graduated from the Taysom Hill experience as a ball carrier. I think we've proven that in previous weeks. Whenever Tyler Shuck, a guy who can improvise, is your leading rusher, but is not the leading rusher that you want to run. Like the Titans want cam reward to run, you know, you're in a bad place. But when I look at this team defensively and I think, well, how do you give up 24 points to Kirk cousins and Darnell Mooney and the Atlanta Falcons and B John Robinson held a player.

1:40:13But here's how, because I look at this group of players and all I see is the 2010, 2011 Cleveland Cavaliers, where it's Baron Davis and Luke hair and gody and Sean Livingston getting his last shot at the NBA, which ends up getting him a spot with the Warriors. Like it's a bunch of no names. This is a Saints team that is very clearly in a transition period right now.

1:40:33Patrick Claybon:Shout out to Luke Arangote. I didn't think I would ever hear about if you had not said his name, I would have never thought about Luke Arangote ever again. My issue with the Taysom experience today is it was all the highest leverage plays in the game. It was fourth and one in the red zone in a goal to go situation. And then, yeah, let's get Shuck out of here. Let's get Taysom to come in and throw a pass. He's 0 for 2 through the air in this game where it's not sneaking up on anybody at this point. When Taysom Hill comes in, it's not, oh, no, what are the Saints going to do? It's the Taysom Hill package in the same Taysom Hill package now under three different coaching regimes where it's the same Taysom Hill package.

1:41:13Patrick Claybon:And let's get rid of it. I don't want to see Taysom Hill package anymore. No, I don't. It's, I don't know. Kellen Moore has got that special connection. He's got that loyalty to his brother. and he just keeps giving him the ball. Man, Kellen Moore just not inspiring in his first Saints season. Let's take one final break and we'll get to a team that's been pretty inspiring all season. Yes, it's the Los Angeles Rams. We're going to say goodbye to Patrick. Bye, everybody. Go say hello to the children. I shall.

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1:46:03and so much more. Visit Bahamar.com today. Stafford in the pistol has to go up and over his left shoulder to catch the snap. Logs on end zone. It's a touchdown! Devontae Adams racing underneath another. Matthew Stafford got 24 yards, and you can let those MVP chants ring out again. One, two, three for Matthew Stafford, and Devontae's got two. It's back to a three-score lead. Matthew to Devontae. They are sizzling. They are sizzling. You know who else is sizzling? J.B. Long on KSBN. In that grunting in the background, our friend Maurice Jones-Drew. The Rams make it a laugher on Sunday Night Football.

1:46:5434-7. Yes, if it's a day that ends in Y, Devontae Adams is scoring a touchdown. Off and two. And this thing not only was over at halftime, 31-7 at halftime, there was not much more to play. We just got a field goal in the second half and we were killing time, Chuck, because Baker Mayfield was out with a left shoulder injury. More on that in a second, but this was a night I don't think it would have mattered if Baker was healthy or not. In fact, he was healthy until they were down three touchdowns. Man, when the Rams offense is looking good and they've looked great in the first quarter of these games for over a month now, it just seems like no one can stop them.

1:47:40Yeah, and then you add in a pick six of 50 yards and it's like, oh, now you just put that on the board as well. They do feel unstoppable at times, especially, you know, against opponents that struggle to give them resistance. Like this is not the Seahawks game, but it is. i mean it's a another example of how good this offense can be like it it honestly feels vindicating it feels like justice has been served to davante adams for the time that he spent in vegas with the raiders because now he is in the perfect he's in football heaven with matthew stafford they're just making beautiful music art every weekend and we all get to sit back and watch it and sometimes it's in blowout fashion like this yeah and maybe the best catch he made all Knight was actually called back by a penalty, a leaping grab he made in the second half.

1:48:26He did have one drop. I swear he said more drops with the Rams than any other time in his career, but he keeps getting it done. And the MVP conversation, put it on the board, Patrick Claiborne, wherever you are, tonight is only going to help with Stafford getting those three touchdowns in the first half. And that drive, that touchdown that we just heard, Shook, it just shows you how they can do anything they want to do the Rams because the Bucs are trailing 21-0. You mentioned the pick six that's on a play where K-Dotten essentially drops the ball as he's going to his knees and Kobe Durant steals it from him.

1:49:04Looked like he might have been down, but by the letter of the law, I guess he got to do a football move and Durant returns it the other way. And so it looks like a blowout early, but the Bucs finally get a touchdown on the drive where Mayfield actually hurt his left shoulder, but they get it to 21-7. And then literally just four plays later, it's like a three-yard run, and then it's Puka up the seam for like 24 yards. It's Mumfield for 14, and then a dime to Devontae Adams. So they can be explosive, or they can turn the running game, and their success rate was through the roof. And I think that gets lost a little bit, that the run for me, for the Rams, sets up the pass.

1:49:43Obviously, the pass is the most important thing, but they are in favorable situations so often because of the run. Yeah, absolutely. And it all goes back to Kyron Williams and the role that he plays in this offense, but it's not just that it's the offensive line and how they've been very cohesive this year, whether it's protecting Matthew Stafford or opening running lanes, really allowing Sean McVeigh to get creative with how they want to run the ball. And then beyond Kyron Williams, it's been Blake Corum. And we've enjoyed a little bit of a difference in style where Corum's more of a North South, less vision type of runner.

1:50:10Kyron, obviously more dynamic, able to, you know, find lanes and run through them. And I think it just fills out this offense. Like you bring in Devante Adams and you put them next to Puka Nakua. You have a very good one to receiver time. Kyron Williams and Blake Corham, solid one, two running tandem. And when it all marries together under Sean McVay's vision, this is what it looks like. Right. And the difference this year, more than any year, I feel like it's a difference making defense. So the Rams get six quarterback hits, four sacks, seven tackles for loss and 10 passes defense against Baker Mayfield and Teddy Bridgewater, who, you know, was not Jameis Winston coming off the bench in the second half.

1:50:50But Baker Mayfield in the first half goes nine for 19 for 41 yards. He has the two interceptions, one obviously not his fault. But what shouldn't get lost is, you know, on plays, you know, other than that interception, they were still averaging about two and a half yards per pass. And against the pressure, I believe he was 0 for 4. When they blitzed him, he was like 1 for 5 and took a sack. The pass rush was just awesome, whether it was Vers or Kobe Turner. And then Baker hurts his shoulder, and he didn't really show it at first on a run. And he follows it up with a couple nice passes, but you see him wincing after they get a touchdown.

1:51:33and you remember i believe i guess i'll put you on the spot you remember how baker's career ended in cleveland right yeah yeah it was uh it was it was the 2021 season it was after he'd led them to the playoffs in their first playoff win since they'd returned in 99 and he was playing through multiple injuries that year and the first one was the left shoulder which ended up being a torn labrum that didn't require surgery but as somebody who's torn both of his labrums and had surgery on one of them that surgery is not super successful anyway and it's not an injury that you can just like rehab away and it gets annoying and it gets painful and bothersome even when you're not actively using it as your throwing shoulder now we don't know what happened to him this time but he's got a history of having injuries with that shoulder and that's what contributed to his downfall with the browns it was that it was a knee he struggled that year while playing through those injuries and it and it bums me out for him because this team is so banged up already they're missing multiple receivers their offensive line has been a shuffling act all year they haven't had Bucky Irving for a considerable stretch of time now.

1:52:30And then your quarterback, the guy who has been basically carrying you in most weeks and propelling your offense forward through scenarios in which most quarterbacks wouldn't get you to the other side. Now he's banged up and what, and you saw what happened tonight. You take him out of the equation when he's already banged up and, and they're just a non-competitive offense. Yeah. And look, they were without Jamel Dean, their best cornerback tonight, Bucky Irving, how you, who you mentioned Hassan Reddick was out and you know, the Rams start a new right tackle Warren McClendon. They put Rob Havenstein on injured reserve.

1:52:59You didn't notice any difference. That's one area where like Hassan Reddick could possibly help. You're missing your two starting guards from week one. I kind of forgot during the week when I said they're only missing one guard. I forget Cody Mock's already out for the season. So yeah, just a lot of issues and they're falling to six and five and we're right back to where we tend to be, which is the NFC South winner is probably going to be the four seed. And yes, Yes, the Bucs schedule gets much easier the rest of the way, but they're at a point, especially if Baker's not 100%, where no win is going to be assured.

1:53:30Meanwhile, the Rams are the one seed, and in a week where they put Havenstein, Quinton Lake, and Tyler Higbee on injured reserve, look, they look so deep. Their tight ends were so important in this game. You know, you get Colby Parkinson for a touchdown. Davis Allen gets loose for three catches, and this is just a really complete team. And to me, for the Rams, it's all going to be about weeks 15 and 16 in a five-day period. They will play the Lions, and then they'll play the Seahawks on a Thursday night. And that's going to, to me, really decide whether they are the one seed or who knows. Seattle might be able to run this table, too, and it could all come down to that week 16 game.

1:54:14That's in the future. This team is maybe the best Sean McVay team we have seen yet. to the point where him and Stafford are getting into it and McVay's getting mad at like 31 to seven. Did you see that? Where like Stafford missed a couple of throws and they're like yelling at each other. At which point that Matthew Stafford probably shouldn't even be in the game. Like just take him out. Because the biggest key for me is once they get to that week 15, 16 point, how healthy can you be when you get there? That's what's most important. All right, so they're nine and two. Before we leave for the day, we did have some breaking news as we were watching this game.

1:54:50Chip Kelly is out as the Las Vegas Raiders offensive coordinator. So Patrick Claiborne has been just killing Chip Kelly week after week, all season long. I feel like he was first. Maybe Pete Carroll was first, but Patrick Claiborne was second. And it felt weird that he is not on the show for this. So we're going to do an NFL Daily first, Chuck. We're going to call Claiborne right now, just on my phone. I mean, he's not going to pop up. I never call him on the phone, so he might not answer. We'll see if this works. Maybe we'll even edit it out. I got to put this thing on speaker, and we'll see how this goes.

1:55:29Is this the first time you've called somebody while you're not driving? Patrick, this is Greg. You are on NFL Daily right now. Are you free to talk? You are on NFL Daily. Are you aware that the Raiders have been watching the show and that they have fired Chip Kelly?

1:55:46Patrick Claybon:tonight you know what greg i appreciate uh not just tom brady's commitment to being an nfl list an nfl daily note listener uh but p carroll uh clearly the um it had nothing to do with the output the ability uh to all uh to be watchable to be fun um this was purely reaction to our continued conversation regarding chip kelly which comes to a sad and empty ending tonight You are such a pro. I mean, you had that answer ready. I'm fumbling around trying to put it on speaker. You have this thing answered before I even get there. What did you think I was possibly calling you about right now? Well, when you started the conversation with I am on NFL Daily right now, my brain went to any number of places where it's like recording.

1:56:36Patrick Claybon:We finished recording the show. I'm watching Vampirina with my kids because, you know, another circumstance that was concluded while we left the podcast studio. And so, yeah, this is this is big news. Very important. It's marquee news right now in November of 2025. Is doing something else for the remainder of the season, which congratulations to him because his previous thing was not going well. Yeah, honestly, it might not be the worst thing for him. He's the highest paid offensive coordinator in the league. That money is guaranteed. It goes on into future years. And I now feel bad for interrupting your family time.

1:57:14Thank you, Patrick, for chipping in, as always.

1:57:18Patrick Claybon:No, thank you, Greg. And thanks to Chip Kelly for truly providing us with something unique in 2025. It was great. Thanks. See you, man. Unique in the form of 10 sacks given up to the Browns today. The first time in my memory that I can see the Browns firing, getting someone fired on the same day. the Raiders just keep cycling through head coaches so quickly and you got to think Pete Carroll you know is maybe on the way out too he had not fired a coordinator Pat uh Chuck in 14 seasons during a season when he was with Seattle and now he's fired too he's fired too to Patrick Graham keep an eye over your shoulder.

1:58:01Patrick Graham's doing the best that he can. All right. Fun Sunday. I think we really crystallize what's going on here in both conferences. It's really coming down in both conferences, if you look at it, to 10 teams for seven spots. And it's fascinating that the three teams out right now in the AFC are Pittsburgh, Houston, and Kansas City, all at six and five while the Chargers, Jags, and Bills have the last three spots at seven and four. We talked about the AFC North before. And then I think the same is basically the case in the NFC, 10 teams for seven spots. I'm including the Cowboys in that mix at five, five, and one.

1:58:43And we kind of have the Panthers and the Bucs playing the roles of Raven Steelers in the NFC where just one team is getting that spot and it's probably gonna be the four seed. It's all shaping up, Shooky. It's all gonna change. It's going to change. I'm telling you, we're going to get a lot of movement in these next six weeks. Okay. Looking forward to it. Let's get out of here because we got another show to do soon enough. Monday Night Football. As we do each and every week. My parents are arriving on a plane during Monday Night Football. I was like, can we go live after Panthers 49ers when the parents are arriving?

1:59:20Some things are more important than family. Panthers 49ers live on YouTube. Me and Shook. See you then. killI just Are you looking for support in your weight management journey? ZepBound Terzepatide may be able to help. ZepBound is a prescription medicine used with a reduced calorie diet and increased physical activity to help adults with obesity. Or some adults with overweight who also have weight-related medical problems to lose excess body weight and keep the weight off. ZepBound is approved as a 2.5, 5, 7.5, 10, 12.5, or 15 milligram injection. ZepBound contains terzepatide and should not be used with other terzepatide-containing products or any GLP-1 receptor agonist medicines.

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