Daboll out as Giants Coach and Burrow Practicing with Ian Rapoport

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3:07Welcome to NFL Daily, where fourth and goal at the half yard line is an automatic go for us. forever. I am Greg Rosenthal. I am here in my garage for a surprise podcast. It's not an emergency podcast. There's no emergency happening here, but there is some news. New York Giants have fired Brian Dable on Monday morning, and we are joined by none other than NFL Network Grand Puba insider Ian Rappaport to help us break down the news. Ian, were you surprised that it happened now? I was not surprised. No. I would say, you know, once the questions start, there's really only two ways to handle it. Right.

3:49And I think everyone, you look on the field, you can hear all this stuff, but really the product is what it is on the field. Right. And so we've, there's been rumors about Brian Dayball and a potential firing for quite a while. And then you see how the players react. And it was another lead. It was another game that they had in hand on the road. And then it was another inexplicable collapse plus Jackson Dart got hurt. So I think this is the kind of thing that, you know, for me was on my radar all morning, knowing that for sure it could be a possibility. It makes sense. And I think once you, you know, look, no one wants to do this during the season, right?

4:27It doesn't, doesn't help. It only makes the season just a lost season. Nobody wants to do it during the season. but once you know that you're going to fire him, just do it. Right. I mean, just there's timing's always bad. Everything's always bad. Just make it clean, break and move on. So, yeah, I mean, I would say it was not a surprise. And unfortunately, because Brian Day was a really good guy, probably what was necessary.

5:00he chose to kick a field goal. Like I mentioned, it was fourth and goal at the one. They were up seven in the fourth quarter. We talked about it on a recap show. It's just a sad way to go out. Unfortunately, their defense had been struggling overall, but they had had a great game through three quarters. They get a penalty on that potential field goal. They hit the field goal and decide not to take the penalty. Would have been from the half yard line. And then they blow the lead. And a few days later, it's gone. I did notice a beat writer, I think it was Pat Leonard, excuse me if I'm wrong, said, you know, one of the things that could get Dable fired before the bye week, let's say, because they have three tough games before their bye week, was getting Jackson Dart hurt.

5:37And I do wonder if the four concussion tests that he has done in his brief time as a starter and then being ruled out with a concussion in this game after running again and again and taking some big hits. Some of that is on Dart not protecting himself, but some of that is on Dable. How do you think like the Jackson dart equation played into this? Because, you know, one thing I think people said to make the case for Dable is you don't want to take away Jackson starts, you know, coach when he's good with quarterbacks and he's off to a good start in his career. How do you think that worked out when, when making this decision?

6:13Yeah. I mean, I don't think Brian Dable got Jackson dart hurt. I think he got hurt because football is a violent game and people, unfortunately sometimes get hurt. I mean, there's been plenty of really good coaches who have not been able to get quarterbacks to slide and stay out of harm's way. I don't know that that's Brian Dayball's fault. And I don't know that, I mean, whether or not Jackson Dart starts the next game, like to me, that wouldn't change the trajectory of the giant season. Like there's been so many games that have followed the same script that it's like, what could I have seen? um you know what could i have seen that would make me say like all right well now because he got dart injured therefore fire him it's like there no you know look the development of the quarterback is always the most important and yes jackson dart has looked very good in brian dayball system we are going to see what he looks like um with mike kafka because this is a little bit of a tryout to challenge but a little bit of a tryout i'm sure kafka will get interviews interim coaches always get interviews.

7:21And, you know, we'll kind of see what he looks like in the same system with a different head coach. I would also say that, you know, as we look at this thing, I mean, you have, you know, obviously the Titans and Giants is the only job that's open. There's a couple other possibilities in Miami, who seemed to put a lot better this week. That's a possibility. There's some other possibilities, but this is a really good job. I mean, Jackson Dart is someone who, with the right coach and system and, you know, infrastructure around him has proven that he can be a guy. And so if you're, you know, a young head coach, a retread head coach who wants another shot, really anyone, like this would be a job you want because you don't have to search for a quarterback.

8:06You have a quarterback. It's a great call in terms of Dax and Dart is such a great starting point. Like in that game yesterday in particular, although he's looked good overall, I was really impressed, and it's not just his running ability. And I do think you can get on Dable a little bit for running QB power a few times. It's like they're building their offense around him running the ball quite a bit. But he did more things throwing the ball in that game and has looked better than I would have ever expected. And to buttress your point, Ian, there's a great word, buttress. Got Jackson Dart, got a top five NFL left tackle in Andrew Thomas.

8:45You have Malik Neighbors coming off of an injury next year, but you have Malik Neighbors. And you have a defensive line where Brian Burns, Dexter Lawrence, and Abdul Carter are all signed through at least 2027. You even have Kevin Thibodeau next year still too. For a renovation project, that's pretty good, especially because of DART. Now, I will put to you, I have my own opinions on this, but I'm curious if you have a feeling of how the Giants want to operate. Do you think it's going to be a full rebuild with a new front office helping to choose a new head coach? Or do you think Joe Shane, who was brought in at the same time as Brian Dable, could potentially survive this or even is likely to survive this and still be running the team in 2026?

9:35Well, there's been no changes other than Brian Dayball now. Historically, when you have a major move, it's either one or both. It's rarely. You do see it sometime. We saw it with Jacksonville last year in what I would consider to be extenuating circumstances, but almost always the changes happen and then it's about the next. It's about moving on. It's about fixing and all that. So, you know, I'd be surprised if that was the case. I'd be surprised if they made a change at general manager. You know, they didn't come in as a package deal, but essentially they did come in together. You know, I would say allowing a GM to make more than one coaching hire is what most organizations do.

10:21Like rarely you bring in a guy, you package them together, and then you say, all right, you're done. You don't get the chance to hire a head coach. So generally you do. I would also say, you know, as a GM, like really what you want to do, it's not just about collecting talent because I think that's important. That's not the job. It's building a team. And I would say at least what Joe Shane has done is built enough talent to win. It has not been a cohesive team. So like they have not been, you know, they have not won a lot of games. But the people I've spoken with, like that defense should be a lot better.

11:00They got a lot of talent on the defense. I know there was a lot of discussion about moving on from their defensive coordinator this past offseason. I know Brian Dable didn't want to do it, and they ended up not doing it. Would they be better with a different D.C.? I think possibly.

11:16But based on the people I've spoken with, they believe there is more than enough talent on that roster to win. Certainly more than enough talent to be 2-8. it's really interesting having gotten a peek into the giants front office with that hard knocks. And I don't think personally, Joe Shane came off incredible in that, not just in terms of the decisions, letting Xavier McKinney and Saquon Barkley, but just you weren't watching that and feel like you were seeing, you know, 1960s red hour back or anything like that. And since, since January, I would say, let me just interrupt you. I would just say those conversations, like that feel was pretty normal.

11:57Like that's what it sounds like, you know, like, yes. I mean, I heard from some people in the league that were kind of like, these are the conversations. We're glad we're, we're competing against these guys. Yeah. I didn't, I didn't get that. And I talked to a lot of GMs. You talked to a lot more than me. Let's be real. So I didn't get that. Now the decisions like Saquon went on to be an MVP candidate, would he have been a candidate with the Giants? Like, I don't think so. The offensive line's a lot worse. Like they spent the money elsewhere. Like there are different arguments to be made, but I don't think that like the hard knocks maybe looked bad to the public because you let Seiko on go and then he plays so great, but I don't get the sense that really altered Joe Shane's actual job status.

12:43No, I, I hear that to me. Sometimes it was more about just like when they were talking about Brian burns and you know they pop in they're like hey he had a lot you know they're like counting up the quarterback hits and stuff and just like isn't there isn't there something more there here i'll just give you some record some numbers though okay uh you mentioned the four double digit losses on the road this year which is crazy and yeah dables giants have crazy by the way been it's just crazy really bad luck too but also just just crazy uh 29th in scoring since he arrived since the day they went to Philadelphia in it for the divisional round of the playoffs in January of 2023.

13:21Not that long ago, the giants have gone 11 and 34 since they hired Brian Dable and Joe Shane. They have the fourth worst record in football since they won the Superbowl against the Patriots. They have won the third least amount of games. So giants are 30th Browns and jets are two wins behind. And if you break it down, if you start like since they fired Coughlin, second worst, since McAdoo, fourth worst, since Shermer, second worst, since Judge, fourth worst. Like they have consistently been a bottom five franchise, which is crazy to say. Has felt like that. I guess so. But it's just like you, the Giants ownership has been getting a lot of, I think, benefit of the doubt for a long time for being good ownership because of what happened, you know, before the last 12 years.

14:09But the reality is they have not made a good decision. And personally, I do think it's cleaner when you have a full teardown and the GM and the coach are starting at the same time. But we'll see if you tend to think that they won't do that. Yeah, I don't. And I also am not sure that's true. And the reason why I would say that is because it's a hard job. And at the beginning, a lot of people are not good at it. It's just it's really hard. Like I'll give you another example. The commanders, right? Great offseason last year. Everything that Adam Peters did worked, right? I mean, they had the second pick of quarterback.

14:44Now, both of them, Caleb Williams and Jane Daniels are both looking good now, but they had the second pick of quarterback, and every veteran that Adam Peters brought in worked, and they went deep into the playoffs. This year, everything has been bad. Every move, it seems, like veterans are looking slower. Some of the high-priced additions they made have not worked. Like now, does that mean Adam Peters is bad at his job? No, it's like, these are hard jobs. These are huge decisions and people make mistakes. And I think the only way to really get better, unless you just have a Ferrari that you're just get behind the wheel of and you're like ready to roll, you know, which there's a couple of those.

15:28They're really hard. And my sense is considering that he's built a ton of a team with a lot of talent and considering he's has the experience of making mistakes over the last three years it feels like they will be better off with Joe Shane as GM than you know someone else who does not have this experience because historically there's almost no retread GMs just doesn't happen yeah and I think look if you look at some of the the drafts there with them they've had been pretty big swings and misses too they had Evan Neal was was their first draft pick and the middle step They had Deontay Banks, which is a pretty big miss.

16:06Last year's class, which looked really good last year, looks solid. But, you know, Tyler Neuben, Drew, who is it in the back end? Drew Phillips, you know, they've been okay. Like, not good, but not good. Neighbors, you know, injuries happen, but Neighbors doesn't get injured. That's looking like a win. So it's like, it's like, you know, not everyone can be like, like the Browns draft class, they're like all going to be good this year. Like that's, you know, but like they can't all be like that. But anyway, my general argument, not just as it pertains to Joe Shane is unless it's like two systems clashing where the guy's a total jerk and a head coach refuses to work with him, which is not the case here.

16:51Um, I think there'll be better off having a GM who's been through it. He's put enough talent on the field and will work with the next head coach that he will help hire. That is my general thought. Mike Kafka. And yeah, you mentioned it. I should have, but you know, you're the real newsman. I should have mentioned it right off the top. Mike Kafka is the interim head coach. They did not fire Shane Bowen who is their defensive coordinator. And Kafka has gotten a lot of head coaching interviews over the last three or four years. He had his time in Kansas city with Patrick Mahomes. It could be interesting to see what he does.

17:23Cause the number one thing that I would think they're looking for out of a head coach is who can maximize Jackson dart. And that's why I do compare it a little bit to the Drake May situation a year ago. I think Drake May physically was more obviously going to be a dude. That's my own personal bias. I thought that before the Patriots took him. But Jackson Dart has played to a level where he looks like a dude as well. So everything should be about maximizing Jackson Dart. We'll wrap at least on the Giants. Just with you think if he has a realistic chance to maybe be the dude. Mike Kafka. Yeah, I kind of do.

17:58and it's been interesting because like on one hand he's Brian Dayball's guy, Dayball hired him but he's not only Brian Dayball's guy he's been in a lot of different places he is a good enough leader he has sort of done it like the league has done a good job of putting guys in position to lead like he's done the senior bowl and coached the senior bowl and from what I was told got pretty good reviews doing it so like I think he does have a chance. Now, it'd be a surprise because it almost never happens. But he's well thought of as an offensive coordinator. He has had head coach interviews. I think in particular in Seattle, he did really well.

18:44Didn't get it, but did well. So I do think he has a chance and probably should. Before I let you go, since you're here, It's been a while, by the way. If you go back to like the early NFL daily days, I mean, Rap Sheet was on there all the time, but now he's on NFL Network. He's always, always been on NFL Network. He's on Pat McAfee probably right now. I always come on when I'm asked. You really do. You're the man. You broke the news that, or at least you were the first one I saw, that Joe Burrow is back at practice this week. Is there anything to, I mean, it's November 10th. They started his activation.

19:22that even if he joins the team and plays at the end of that activation, which I would think is possible, that's earlier than I expected. What, what can you tell us about Joe Burrow before you go off into wherever the insiders hide during the day? Yeah. Pretty cool news. I have to say for the Cincinnati Bengals, you know, it's, it really, I'm not there. And they're about to go on the practice field in a couple of minutes as we're taping this now, but you know, you talk about a dude, like that guy's a dude. And for him to be out on the practice field, like that is going to give them the kind of balance that you can't manufacture, manufacture.

19:58They have been, you know, they've won some games. They are not out of it. They are, I think three and six, right. Isn't that the record? Three and three and six. Yes. They are. They're in Pittsburgh this week. If they can, you know, come out and play well enough, maybe win a game or two, God forbid they go two and one over the next three games. Like Joe Burrow could be back with a chance to help this team get to the playoffs. Like it's crazy, but it's not that crazy. And like, I would also say this three and six, like you it's uphill battle, but you got a chance. I think he would probably be back almost anyway.

20:35Like, I just, I don't know that it was ever a decision. I think it was like, as soon as I can come back, I'm coming back. And that is pretty cool. Yeah. by, by all accounts in terms of how they run the offense, maybe even how they're deciding to sign people. I mean, he's kind of the boss and he should be, I mean, he's the most important person in the organization. And if he wants to play, they're not going to stop. You don't think there's any chance of like him playing Sunday. Do you? It's not, not Sunday. No. I have to look at the schedule. It's the Patriots the week after the problem is, and it makes it Sunday, Sunday.

21:10Yeah. They're all Sundays coming up. And then a Thursday, sorry. on Thanksgiving. That would be interesting. Wait a minute. Thanksgiving night. I mean, that's how many days? 18 days from now? Yes. Possible. That's crazy. Possible. It kind of breaks my heart, though, that they blew the Jets game and the Bears game because Flacco played so well. And if they had just won one of those two, hell, if they had won both, though, they'd be five and four. And Joe Burrow coming back in a few weeks, like they, they could afford to lose cause their schedule gets tougher now. And it really, it bums me out that they could be three and eight.

21:50But we'll see because, you know, he comes back again, like say they go two and one. So let's say they're five and seven. Sure. Five and six in that scenario. Yeah. You got a chance, but you're also playing the Steelers, the Patriots, the Ravens, the bills, the Ravens in the next five weeks. So they kind of just got through the easy part of their schedule. Unfortunately, they got some tough ones but they could take out Pittsburgh appreciate you making the time on a busy day Ian you're more than just an insider you're a man you're a husband you're a father and you're a friend we've known each other a long time now we've been through a lot appreciate you and we will be back tonight by the way this is a surprise episode so we would be back join us YouTube live after Eagles and Packers me and Nick Shook.

22:42We will see you then.

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23:47Severe side effects may include inflamed pancreas or gallbladder problems. Tell your doctor if you experience vision changes before scheduled procedures with anesthesia, if you're nursing, pregnant, plan to be, or taking birth control pills. Taking ZepBound with a sulfonylurea or insulin may cause low blood sugar. Side effects include nausea, diarrhea, and vomiting, which can cause dehydration and worsen kidney problems. Talk to your doctor. Call 1-800-545-5979 or visit zepbounce.lily.com.

24:18Ian Rapoport:Wasabi is purpose-built to free your business from skyrocketing storage costs and fees. Wasabi is the go-to provider for professional and collegiate sports teams around the world. Check out Wasabi's AI-enabled intelligent media storage, Wasabi Air, to the industry's only cloud storage service with triple protection against cyber criminals. Wasabi, driving innovation in data storage for up to 80 % less than market competition. Try for free at wasabi.com. Wasabi, hot cloud storage, proud partner of iHeart Podcast Network. Lowe's knows Sundays are for football. So tackle your home improvement projects by Saturday and earn your Sunday with great deals on LG and Bosch appliances, select Bounty and Swiffer cleaning products, and more.

25:04Then once your to-do list is done, get ready to kick back, relax, and enjoy the game. Shop in store or online now and earn your Sunday with help from Lowe's, official partner of the NFL. Hi, it's Karen in Georgia from My Favorite Murder. We cruised around LA in the Hyundai Ioniq 5 and dove into the fascinating life of actress and inventor Hedy Lamarr. Want the full story? Take a listen. She starts dating Howard Hughes. And in fact, she helps him design a faster plane. So she finds the fastest bird and the fastest fish and sketches out a drawing of what the two would look like as a plane. And that becomes the plane that we know today.

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