The Death Episode! (And Lions-Cowboys Preview)

26:54I think talking about different rules and understanding them is important, especially for broadcasters. And some are terrible at it and some, like Mike Tirico and yourself, are great at it. But I'm always surprised anyone ever gets a call correct. It's impossible. Why do we have such a high standard that they're going to get everything correct? The players get everything, like a million things wrong on every play, and they're the best in the absolute world. And the refs aren't great, but when you're on a field, you've been on the field. It's so fast. How could they possibly get anything right?

27:26The game speed is so fast. The thing that annoys me is, yeah, when things should be reviewable are not reviewed, like the leg whip in the Texan Colts game, I believe it was. Or was that a different game where there was a trip that clearly happened on a play. And they... It was his thigh that hit? Yeah, they reviewed the play, but they couldn't review. Like they can't give the penalty after reviewing the play and it ended up hurting the wrong team. That's annoying. I found it fascinating on Sunday night when Tirico and Collinsworth were talking about what constitutes a pile in football and how many people does it take to have a pile because you can't pull someone off the pile, but it was just like two dudes or one dude.

28:12I don't know. But that was something that I was going to bring up to Walt Anderson this week. Good idea. Yeah. I'm going to go the other way on this Tush Push idea. Okay. Well, first of all, if it does die, did the first real sign of death happen in that Black Friday game? It did. because the Bears just had a good way to stop it. Yeah. And like, they like turn, if you can stop it, you basically, they, they had Jalen like turn or they turned him. They sort of sent, I, I can't explain enough. I would need to watch it from the side, but we talked about it on our, on our Thanksgiving Black Friday recap.

28:46They didn't have the sacrificial guy. That, um, like Brian Floyd. Kelvin Shepard from the Lions, I think came up with this plan against the Eagles. And now it's being copied. And you have this guy darting in from the side. There's more to the plan than that. And it's working to stop it. And then you see the tight ends. It's not working with the tight ends doing the tush push. It's like, this is why I never thought you should kill the tush push because the Eagles are good at it. Eventually someone's going to figure out how to stop it. No one else is really that good at it anyways. It's not working for the Bills as well as it did previously either.

29:18As with everything else, it's going to die naturally. That's it. I mean, that's sort of the history of the NFL. It is. let's talk about the Steelers okay first of all we have some news on Tuesday on Tuesday we found out that they have cut Darius Slay Adam Thielen on the other hand he's going to be busy he was cut by the Vikings he requested his release because he was not really playing much with the Vikings he was hoping can I sign on to a team that potentially matters and he got a gig with the Steelers And so that's our news of the day. They're actually going to activate Asante Samuel Jr. as well.

30:01They had signed him. He's a good player. He had a neck injury that prevented him from playing for most of this year. So he's basically replacing Darius Slay. And when you're making moves like this, going into the biggest game of the year against the Ravens, it makes me feel even more confident to say the Steelers' Super Bowl chances are dead. Now, I'm not saying that Mike Tomlin's career with the Steelers is on life support. I don't think it necessarily is. Let's actually listen to Colleen Wolfe at a previous time. Oh, no. On the Monday night show with Ian Rappaport. This is obviously a topic that is trending, but how valid of a topic is whether or not Mike Tomlin and the Steelers should move on from each other.

30:53Heavy sigh from Ian. If you're not watching, he's drinking some water. I know what you're trying to do, Colleen, and I'm not going to let you do it. I'm just not. You know, Mooch then, after I said goodbye to Ian and opened up the chat to Mooch and asked him if it was time for the Steelers to move on, he did the same exact thing to me that Ian did. I mean, as if Ian didn't know you were going to ask that, didn't he know? Come on. We have fun, don't we? Let's just see what happens. It's theater. ridiculous it would be the a very stealer's thing to go win this game in baltimore just at the moment where the vultures are circling in a way that i've never seen in pittsburgh for mike tomlin but what ian said later in that clip it was a good clip people should check it out and he basically said they would never ever they're not like there's no way art rooney is firing mike tomlin like there's 0.0 % chance.

31:53Now, if Mike Tomlin ever decided he just wanted to step away, it's just weird that Ian to me would, would say that, but there's no indications that that would happen. That, that maybe Tomlin would just be like, I'm kind of done here. Maybe do the Sean Payton thing where he's just like, I'm retiring or, you know, I'm, I'm out of here. And then like return a year later or something. Okay. Two things on that. One is related to Sean Payton, but this one, before I forget it, the Steelers, Mike Tomlin is their third coach in history since 1969. This is such a steady, patient organization that prides themselves on that very thing.

32:32And staying with the guys and their guys, it's like family. So, I mean, I just don't see them doing it unless it's some type of mutually parting of ways, which we hear a lot, but I feel like in this case could actually happen, which makes me think maybe it's a situation like Sean Payton where there's a trade. And what if the trade is Mike Tomlin to the Giants? Whoa. Because of the Roonies and the Maras. A lot of NFL history has gone down with cooperation and work by the Roonies and the Maras. Yeah. and not Rooney Mara but she is very much related she is literally yeah so I just I just could see maybe a scenario like that I I just don't see them parting ways with him and nothing else happening like I think that it could be mutually beneficial for both sides maybe to have a fresh start because we're hearing reports about players not showing up to meetings or coming in late and this is a team that is in playoff positioning right now this is important you would you would think that you wouldn't have to convince guys to show up like who is not listening to people in the room there well that's aaron rogers's comments you're talking about well it's that time of year you know for him to just start blaming everyone around him it's like, I feel like we're all in a relationship with Aaron Rogers.

34:09DK Metcalf is probably feeling that too. I mean, who is important enough even to be not showing up to these meetings that he's talking about and not on the same page. I mean, maybe it's John who Smith or maybe it is someone else who knows. I, because I only say John who Smith because he was the one that was running the route where Aaron Rogers just threw the ball where he wanted John who Smith to be, even though no one was clearly there. Rodgers was so pissed about that. It was punishing him. Okay, I want to point out a couple things here with Rodgers. Rodgers' career, to me, as an effective starter, has been dead.

34:42And I keep seeing this idea, and I saw it from my old boss, Florio, just Tuesday, of like, well, his stats are still pretty solid, and a website that covers the Steelers actually aggregated me a week ago where I said Aaron Rodgers is one of the worst starters in the league. And the article was about how this is preposterous. How could anyone possibly say that Aaron Rodgers is one of the worst starters in the league when you look at, okay, his touchdown interception ratio and his completion percentage and whatever. It's like, okay, let's dig a little deeper. First of all, use your eyes. Like, watch how limited he is.

35:24Second of all, if you go to EPA per play or you go to success rate, he is anywhere from the bottom five where it's like he's only ahead. I looked at this in success rate on the season. I think ahead of Dylan Gabriel, Cam Ward, and Joe Flacco, surprisingly, was down there. But Joe Flacco at least gives you big plays. Aaron Rodgers is low on these lists because he knows how to make his stats look good by throwing for seven yards on third and 11. and and like there's no incompletion but he's not effective I just don't get the the flash plays from him the fun plays so when you watch it just you can almost feel the stagnation of the offense and Aaron Rodgers's frustration it completely bleeds through the play of the offense so I feel like as just a watch it is tough in general it is tough and the defense hasn't hasn't helped they They are the most expensive defense in the league, and they have not lived up to that.

36:21And yet they could be in first place after Sunday. It would be very Mike Tomlin to win this game. A little perspective, though. Mike Sando of The Athletic had this stat of the longest coaching tenures in NFL history after winning their last Super Bowl in the same place without basically getting fired or retired. Current coaches? Are there current? All time. Oh, okay. Mike Tomlin is already four years clear of anyone else all time except for Don Shula. But I think Mike Tomlin's great. He's no Don Shula. Don Shula has the most wins of all time. Don Shula has one of the highest winning percentages of all time.

36:59He has multiple Super Bowls. They had a history of success. He was the Miami Dolphins in a way that it's not Mike Tomlin. It should be the Don Shula award, by the way, for the year. Sure. The second longest coach, by the way, without getting fired, tied for second, Chuck Noll. who was the last one before Bill Cowher. He 12 years, and they kind of forced him to retire at 12. Tomlin's at 16 years after his Super Bowl, and tied with him is John Harbaugh. John Harbaugh, yep. 12 years. So it might be a lot of careers ending. And I always think back to... For 10 years, I should say, because they would both get jobs quickly.

37:36Yeah, but before the Ravens drafted Lamar, John Harbaugh was on the hot seat, And that was the big topic. And that year, if he wasn't successful that year, he would have been fired. And then everything turned things around for John Harbaugh with Lamar. And to his credit, no one from the day they drafted Lamar to the second he was bringing him in as a backup, to they were losing some games at first. John Harbaugh just said from day one, Lamar Jackson's going to be one of the best quarterbacks in the NFL since day one. He was right to hit his wagon to that star. So, yeah, I'm killing the Steelers Super Bowl chances.

38:15We're running out of time here. We are going to do a TNF preview, so we're going to take a break. Do you want to do any, like, rapid fire or not? Well, one thing I would really love to do. To hear about. Okay, let's actually listen to Andy Reid. And we'll explain what context it is. This is from his press conference on Monday about how the Chiefs are going to attack the rest of the season. You know that you pretty much have to win the next five games. If you lose one, you're going to need a lot of help to get into playoffs. What's your level of confidence that things can start going your way and that you can win these next five games in a row?

38:57Yeah, well, I believe that. I mean, I believe if you're coming to me on this, Matt, I'm telling you, we're going to go after you every game. And, you know, that's how we roll. we're going to try to tickle your tonsils on every, every play, every game. And, uh, um, but that's, that's the attitude that we're, we're coming in with. Never have I ever heard that turn of phrase before. It's a good one. Is this new to you too? I've never heard a tickle your tonsils before. No, it feels like it's potentially not something we should be saying on the show. but no that feels like a phrase that should be dying it also doesn't seem like it really is in context of what with what we're talking about I'm because I'm I'm trying to figure out like why that was his go-to and why like when I I don't know it just it's just weird because I'm picturing the field and I'm like is this like a defensive thing like I don't know so they're gonna get down to the goal line we're we're listening to that in part because yeah the Chiefs would need some help if they lose one more game to make the playoffs.

40:08It might take 11 and six to make the playoffs, and they already have six losses. But I just think, like, parity this year in the AFC is unlike anything I've seen before. And I just, if you put the Chiefs on the field with whoever else you want to pick in the AFC right now, you can't tell me that game's not a toss-up. I think if you pick the first seven or eight teams in the AFC and put them on the field at the same time, You can't tell me that it's not a toss up. So whatever seven teams make it, you shake them all up. I feel like it could go any way. I really don't think there's any favorites, which, you know, by by logic means the Chiefs got a shot here.

40:48I have I had a premonition last night that the AFC championship game will be between the Patriots and Broncos. That would be great. Weirdly, that's going to happen. That would actually go to the seating. So Florio coming up a lot in this show. Wow. Had to know. I always want to give credit because this is from NBC Sports Research, that the most teams have been eliminated at this point in the season since divisional realignment happened. So what I was going to say is parity dead here in the NFL. Quietly this year, it's actually been, even though the AFC seems wide open at the top, the teams at the bottom are truly awful in a way that normally doesn't happen.

41:32The Giants were eliminated first. And then the Titans, Raiders, Saints, and Cardinals are already like mathematically eliminated with five weeks to go, which is kind of hard to do. And the Jets, the Browns, like the Commanders, they could be soon after that. So even though it feels like it is anyone's title in the AFC, it actually is going to be harder to get into the playoffs. So this is not what the decision makers wanted when they wanted parity. It is, you're going to have to have like a great record to make the playoffs. And there's just a lot of more dead teams than almost ever before. I guess just because there's such different teams at the top and the teams that we, a lot of the teams that we expected to be at the top are not even in the playoff picture right now.

42:19And the fact that the AFC South is super fascinating. This is not how the season started at all. So that's exciting. It is exciting. It's just the bottom is really at the bottom this year. It's a real fall off. You have no chance. Even some teams that aren't that bad, like the three and nine Cardinals. All right. We did it. We're not killing that segment. I don't even know what that segment was. We don't really either. It's a work in progress, and we'll have to revisit it. Let's take a quick break. We're going to come back on the other side, and we're going to preview. Is this the biggest TNF game of the season?

42:56It is. I think it is. Yeah.

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48:00Back on NFL Daily. I feel like I need a drum. Some of these TNFs, me and Shook are recapping it after the game. And I'm looking at the schedule. I'm just wanting a game like this. So juicy. Lions hosting the Cowboys. Lions favored by three. Narratively, I just think it's coming at such a fascinating point in the season because the Lions were that cool upstart team. And I always think back to that playoff game, the NFC Championship against the 49ers, where in the locker room afterwards, Dan Campbell got real and he said, hey, there's no guarantee we're ever going to get back here. But that was like the first year the Lions were really good.

48:43Yeah. And everyone thought, OK. And then last year, all the injuries struck and they were like a little further away. And now they seem even further away. Not only do they have injuries, but they need to win this game against the Cowboys or they are in deep trouble, likely to miss the playoffs if they don't win this game. and they're playing a team in Dallas, which I hate to say it, Colleen, is kind of like those Lions from a few years ago. They're fun. They're upstarts. It's new. They're entertaining. How are they so likable? All right? That's what I want to know. It's like the Eagles are falling apart and the Cowboys have the inverse energy happening for them.

49:26It's they're fun. They have fun personalities. They're fun to watch. They're good. They have all of the vibes and momentum right now. And the Lions coming off a massive upset at home against the Packers in the division. That was a huge game for them. They absolutely needed it. And the fact that the Eagles are slipping right now makes me feel like this is a more important win for the Lions. Just because of this window that could potentially be closing with them. because it does seem like they are slipping. They're not as dominant as they obviously started the season or had been in the past. It's not a foregone conclusion that they're going to make the playoffs.

50:12And we knew that there was going to be a little bit of regression with both coordinators leaving, and we weren't sure how that was going to hit. And we've seen some issues with their run defense, and maybe that bodes well for Javante Williams in this game. But the stakes could not be any higher in this one. They couldn't. And I think multiple things can be true to Jordanism. I picked the Lions to make the Super Bowl this year. That's not happening. If they were in the AFC and like they had the same percentage chance to make the playoffs as they do in the NFC, had some work to do. Like, sure, they'd have a chance.

50:51It's not happening in the NFC. Like the Rams, the Seahawks and the Packers are all really freaking good. Yep. And it's just not going to happen. This is not going to be their year. But here's the multiple thing that's also true. Their window to me is not closing at all. I do believe in the organizational culture and their talent. They have a lot of players in their prime sign long term. They can improve in the offseason and come back at it next year. More momentum and not window. Yeah, because I'm really responding to Lions fans on socials who just feel like, well, it passed us. That was our chance.

51:26We were close. And now it's not coming back. And I don't see that at all. I think they are in a multiple-year window, but I do think this year is essentially over if they don't win this game because they are in L.A. playing the Rams next week. They could all but be eliminated by the end of Week 15, and so it's a great test of what Dan Campbell has built because I thought they were up for the fight against Green Bay. Watching that game, they had injuries. I just realized they're not as talented. They're not as good as Green Bay, and Goff was still battling. It's about the defense to me and the lack of size in their secondary.

51:59Terry and Arnold went on injured reserve this week, and that was a surprise to me. I did not know his injury was going to be nearly that serious. And so you have DJ Reed out there, and you have Amik Robertson and Rak Yasin and these cornerbacks who are all, they're like the Colleen and Greg of NFL cornerbacks. You know, we don't take up much of the frame, as Eric said before. We are petite. He was giving us scouting reports on how different people move and where they need to sit on their mark. And he said, we were easy because we're just so small. We have a lot of space to work with. Well, to your point with the lions.

52:35Patrick, meanwhile, is like all over the place. Moving around. He's like six foot whatever. Yeah, he just moves around. Yeah, he's moving around. He's a wiggler. Oh, he's a wiggler. And he's bigger to begin with. He's stoic. He's a statue. You guys are small. There's a lot of room to work. You guys could be up and down and left and right. That's great. And you would not be out of frame for one second. But it really, I think, showed up in that Chiefs game, too. Like, the Chiefs cornerbacks. Okay, yeah, maybe you can double CeeDee Lamb, but then you got George Pickens to worry about. You do. And just looking at the injury front for the Lions, this is a big deal with Sam Laporta still dealing with injuries.

53:12Ankle injury for Amon Ross St. Brown. These are two massive pieces of this offense, and this Cowboys defense is revitalized with what they did before the trade deadline. And now it just seems like the pieces are working so much better together. It's not like you're not going to have the same Micah Parsons effect without Micah Parsons there, but this is obviously a much better moving system altogether now. They're especially good stopping the run. That's what Jerry Jones said he wanted and Kenny Clark and all that. And Quinton Williams should get a lot of credit because he's having the best month of his career.

53:48But if you think about the players that they've gotten back or signed during this season. It's not just Quinton Williams. Jadeveon Clowney, who might not play in this game, but has made some plays for them. Donovan Wilson and Malik Hooker, their safety tandem, both missed a lot of time this year, especially Hooker. Suddenly they're back in the mix. DeMarvion Overshone, who is maybe the leader of that entire defense, back in the mix. Logan Wilson, they traded for from the Bengals. He's playing. Siobhan Ravel is a third-round cornerback who is playing. That was seven guys I just listed. That's an entire defense.

54:20Yeah, they look different because, like, it's a totally different group of players. And they're going to have a tough matchup. I think the Lions can score a lot. The bigger question to me is, is the Lions defense up for the fight? Because they have not played that well the last couple weeks. Like, they were getting a lot of love. And the last couple weeks, they've looked a little overmatched against elite offenses. And that's what the Cowboys have. They have. And I'm just looking at the Cowboys' schedule after the Lions. They have the Vikings, which they could win. Win. Chargers. toss up commanders win win giants win you never know because it's the cowboys and they always get your hope up they already won their first matchup so i don't know if they'll sweep but i think the chargers vikings i think the loser of this game is in deep trouble but i actually think it's it's it's equally big for both teams i think it's more likely if one of these teams was going to lose a game and actually make the playoffs, that it would be the Cowboys.

55:20Because if the Cowboys lose this game and get a sixth loss, they have that tie. It's in between. And then they would have to run the table after that. But I think they have a chance to run the table against that schedule. If the Lions lose this game, I just think because of the injuries and everything that's happened, and then, yeah, they have the Rams next week, that would be very difficult. So either way, I think each of these teams can probably afford one more loss and it's just coming at the perfect time. And something we were talking about in the newsroom. What? I don't think it's too late to have Dak Prescott go on a little MVP conversation type of run.

56:01People don't realize there's so much left of the season. There's more than 25 % left of the season. If Dak Prescott balls out and they win out, he's played awesome this year. He's got a shot, depending on what happens with Stafford and May and whoever else is in the mix. He's got a shot. I tend to look at how many primetime games the candidates have at the end of the year. It's important. And we know that this is the last one for Dak Prescott, I think. No, he's got the Vikings the next week as well, somehow. And then he's also got a Christmas Day game, which is in primetime. Oh, my gosh. Basically.

56:37That's right. I'm looking at the Lions schedule still. But what about Matthew Stafford and the Rams? They're going to be in the mix, too. They will absolutely have a chance. I think Stafford and May at this point are the favorites. My point is more that a lot of craziness is coming up. That's right. Brace yourselves. Did we do it? We did something. You know how you feel alive is you have a show and you're not really sure what you're going to talk about or what's going to happen. Yeah. And then you make it happen. Yeah. And all of you were, listener, all of you were along for the ride. And honestly, we didn't get that dark and we didn't get that existential.

57:14I'm almost disappointed. Maybe we need to do another one right now. We'll just talk. Start over. We'll just talk afterwards about the fact that. Our biggest regrets in life. Yeah. When my parents left on their plane this week back, I was like, is that the last time? Oh, my God, Greg. Don't say it. Not because they're going to die. I'm not saying that. Not because anything is going to happen. Because they're in their 80s, it's asking a lot for them to take a long cab to the airport and then fly seven hours by themselves. at some point seasons you know there's a cycle for everything and it just might mean more trips uh for my family going to massachusetts get yourself on that plane it's okay to think about all this stuff don't make me cry be the change that you want oh by the way if you guys would like to send christmas cards to us yes i would love to accept them and we will read some fun ones on the air so get those in because for some reason it takes a really long time to finally get to me once it goes through the mailroom.

58:13So send me your family Christmas cards. I kept all the ones from last year. They're downstairs. Yeah. For listeners that don't know, we had a lot of listeners send in Christmas cards to Colleen because she was not getting enough Christmas cards. So if you want to possibly be part of our Christmas episode this year, send them to 900 District Drive in Englewood, California, 90303, Care of Colleen Wolf. Yes. You can say NFL Network, care of Colleen Wolfe, again, to 900 District Drive, Inglewood, California, 90303. We want your family Christmas card. Listener, I was crying last year with some of the cards.

58:55Downstairs, in the little locker room, just reading your cards. They were so sweet and so fun, and some of them were super funny. So please send them. It's all in front of us. You know what else is in front of us? Our preview show. Patrick Claiborne will be with me. Could have some special guests. We'll see who else is there this week. It's all happening. I'm getting my Christmas tree tonight. Yes. I am. What about pictures with Santa? A bad Jew. Let's take a little break. What a note. We'll see you.

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