Training Camp Takeaways for EVERY AFC Team

20:42Patrick Claybon:Yeah, and to see growth on both of their parts. And it's not necessarily going to be a linear thing. Guys can come up and step back. But just glad to see that Dimes is able to be out there. And hopefully when people start hitting, he's able to stay out there. I think one of the most important things that happened in the first week of training camp is all of this confirmation about where Daniel Jones is at. Because I guess I needed to see it. And I know it's going to be different when he's playing week one and everything, but he's going to be there. There was such a diminished version of him towards the end of the season that I think the bar for how good Daniel Jones can be, maybe we're viewing it differently because he was playing on a broken leg, which is insane still to even say.

21:20Yeah. His friends maybe not helping him out with making that brace for him or whatever that they get a lot of love.

21:26Patrick Claybon:Oh, my God. Didn't people like invest in that? Yeah. It's like there's a power balance bracelet or whatever. Like, what are we doing? The holocron crystal? I'm not trusting my friends for anything medical. Oh, it's a special bracelet. It's like the bracelet Batman had in the last Nolan movie, where his knee is all better and he kicks a wall. He kicks a hole in the stone wall. Anyway. That way you want. Sometimes I see or hear like a practice report of a particular play, and it really just catches my fancy. And one of them was Josh Downs, who I love. You know, they don't really have a great second outside receiver.

21:58It's mostly Nick Westbrook-Akina right now, but Josh Downs is really wide receiver too, mostly going to be playing out the slot. But there was like a couple reps where Daniel Jones tried to go to Josh Downs playing on the outside, and they said the five, how tall is Josh Downs, 5 '9"?

22:13Patrick Claybon:Yeah, I think listed at 5 '10". Right, so he's probably a little shorter. Just getting engulfed by like monster 6 '3", Sauce Gardner with those long arms, and just like Sauce Gardner giving him no chance. So he's like literally like six, seven inches taller and longer. And but that's just a reminder. Oh, Sauce Gardner on this team. So that's great to hear. A lot of their guys who were out last year. Charverius Ward, healthy, strong start to camp. CJ Allen missed a couple of days. Their rookie linebacker to camp. He's back and immediately starting. So just, yeah, I like having Sauce Gardner. Did you get the confirmation on the size?

22:47Patrick Claybon:Yeah. Combine measurement was five eighths and three quarters of an inch. Maybe he's come up since then. I doubt it. Also, a kicker battle, Spencer Schrader versus Blake Groupie, where I will predict both kickers are week one starters somewhere. That's a good kicker battle. That's better. So you've got them both starting somewhere. Who wins in Indy? Groupie. Groupie. Yeah. Unanimous on Groupie. Let's take a break. We're going to do the AFC West after the break. The Chiefs have had a lot of injuries. Maybe they aren't as bad as people think. And we'll hit the rest of the AFC West, AFC East in just a minute.

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24:53Back on NFL Daily. The pads are on. Big part of this year is guys coming off injury. Do they got it yet or they don't? Like with the Chiefs, Rasheed Rice, who had that surgery before he spent some time in jail. He's still working his way back from that knee injury. He's not really ready. He's doing some things at Chiefs camp, not all things, and they're working on him. Patrick Mahomes, on the other hand, it's all gas, no brakes, a lot of hype, and they seem to have the most videos of any team on the internet because they don't have any restrictions. Some teams put the restrictions on. It's a lot of Patrick Mahomes running around.

25:32I know he's got a little compression sleeve, but he looks good. I'm believing the hype. Are you believing the hype?

25:38Patrick Claybon:Yeah. The brace looks like it's more of the encumbrance, and I'm sure there's going to be some conversations about whether or not he plays in that brace. But I think, yeah, he's Patrick Mahomes. You know, 85 % Patrick Mahomes is going to be better than 99 % of the planet. There's something about the career arc of it all that for a guy to me that's an all-time great coming off the torn ACL and having like a really, and off of a down couple years statistically, It just makes sense in the career arc of it all. Like when we're in 10 years talking about, oh, yeah, I remember when Mahomes came back after the ACL and was like, you know, won the MVP.

26:22Like I can just see that.

26:23Patrick Claybon:So who's his Jimmy Garoppolo? And this is because it happened late. There's no Jimmy G. Because you're making a Brady parallel. No, not in that. Not in that way. Because Brady had his worst year coming off a torn ACL in 2009, if you wanted to say. But there were various Brady, you know, come ups after various scandals and whatnot. I'm just saying I'm just I think he's going to agree. Xavier Worthy hurt his shoulder again at practice. That's a recurring injury. He is expected back this week at some point. So it's not a long term injury, but he's also a guy who wasn't 100 percent during offseason OTAs and mini camps because he was still coming off that shoulder from a year ago.

27:01He hurt that shoulder like as season started. He dove for a play. I think he caught it on Saturday and immediately gets hurt again. that's tough. It's hard to count on him. It's hard to count on Rasheed Rice. Cyrus Allen is a fifth round pick. This is what training camp's all about. That was playing first team reps. Everyone's saying Patrick Mahomes loves this kid that he might be starting for this team. We'll see, but then left with a bone bruise. Fortunately, it's not more serious because that was one where he left on a cart. Jalen Royals, something to watch there. Then Ken Walker is there. That seems like the new fun toy that Andy Reid is talking about.

27:40He's talking a lot about Ken Walker's receiving ability and using him a lot in the screen game. Any thoughts on the Cyrus Allen, the pass catchers in the Chiefs orbit right now and how they're coming along?

27:51Patrick Claybon:Yeah, I think the Royals, you know, not necessarily making all the plays that people want, right? Some of it may be wish-casting because his name because his name is perfect for a Kansas City receiver. I think like Worthy, hopefully they're just being precautious with the shoulder injury because, you know, it's one thing I go on record, I say all the time, where if you re-aggravate an injury, it just means it was never healed in the first. Right. But he's, you know, he had surgery on in the offseason. He was very effusive about how he was never really back from it last year. So hopefully that is just.

28:26Well, the fact that the first time he hits the ground in a non-tackling practice that it happens. Yeah. Not great.

28:33Patrick Claybon:Well, you know, again, maybe just precautionary because they need him. They need him. Like, the whole plane can't be Travis Kelsey relying on rookies to do it. And with all that Kenneth Walker can do, maybe the biennium of it all, run game good. He's involved in the screen game. There's a whole lot of stuff that's just Patrick and Andy making things go, but they need guys to catch the ball. It's so early. You never know what to make of, like, defensive linemen getting pop and non-padded practices, but Peter Woods, R. Mason Thomas, were their, you know, first and second round picks, not counting Mansoor Delane, who, by the way, has been in a non-contact jersey coming off of his own injury, but has been out there.

29:11Yeah, reports that they look good and that they're getting a lot of first-team reps. So just something to watch as they're pass rushers. And then I found it interesting that a man named Khalil Benson is getting most of the reps as the starting right tackle. So this is something I wouldn't have expected. Andy Reid more or less said, like, we want to see him in the game. And if he keeps taking these steps, I think he's going to be their starting right tackle over a man named Jalen Moore, who they paid$15 million a year in free agency. And kind of telling me they don't think that's working out. Or maybe Khalil Benton is just awesome.

29:45I should I should. It just seems.

29:47Patrick Claybon:And they trust that they have a system that they can figure this out, but they just bargain hunt at that position. I mean, they paid$15 million a year for like a backup. It just it just hasn't worked. and maybe they really found something. They're good. They have been good at identifying some of their own guys. He was an undrafted player, and he might be the starting right tackle for the Chiefs. Pretty amazing if that happens. The Broncos are on the field. I enjoyed an interview between Bo Nix and our two great friends, Steve Weish and Cynthia Freeland, two of the biggest Bo leavers in all of media.

30:21Steve Weish has been pushing for Bo to make quarterback island, so check out that interview. He's been full practice, full go. He's out there. He's moving around a lot. You see him like he it's good that he took the offseason off to properly get better, that he's going to be handing the ball off to J.K. Dobbins, who wasn't the Broncos first choice at running back this offseason. They were in on Ken Walker. They may be in on Travis Etienne, but they end up signing J.K. Dobbins. They didn't want to go over a certain price. And now J.K. Dobbins is talking big, not about not just about being healthy, but being really productive.

30:55Patrick Claybon:A lot of people always say, oh, he's good for the first 10 weeks. Like, I'll be in the top three for the first 10 weeks, right? And they'll be like, oh, dude, he does this every time. Well, this year, forget a top three. I keep saying it. People think I'm crazy, but I'm going to be number one. And I'm going to keep it there for the whole year, you know, 17 games. A lot of people always get mad when I say, yeah, the injuries are over, because I said it last year, but that one was pretty fluky, right? This year there won't be any. And there won't be anything for anyone to say about my injuries because I'm going to play all 17 games.

31:33Patrick Claybon:And I'm going to give my team everything I got for all 17 games. And I will be there for all 17 games. We can, I'll pinky promise all of you right now about that. Yeah, that's a big promise to make. It's a very dangerous position. That's a lot of pinkies. Yeah, to go around. We're not social distancing anymore. So they'll take care of that. up there at the new Broncos facility. But I just, I hope, you know, that when we do talk about players and getting injured, I know there's some instances where, you know, team training staffs and, you know, they'll try to come out and say that the player didn't rehab properly or whatever.

32:10Patrick Claybon:This is a very dangerous game that guys play. And the injuries are not, nobody's going out there trying, J.K. Dobbins has not tried to get hurt. Not that many running backs play all 17 weeks. And I would wager, like, I would disagree with J.K. there. I think a lot of his injuries have been fluky. They all are because it's a dangerous game with a lot of variables. But I hope he is able to play 17 games because when he plays, he's very good. I love that he used the rhetorical device I didn't realize that I used so much until I started hosting a podcast and re-listening to it sometimes where you put sort of the imaginary in a gallery and be like, oh, and they say all the time that, oh, he's not going to do it through 10 he was the only healthy through 10 weeks and then he gets hurt i like that move yeah me and jk and it's it's almost always true because the attention economy drives so much of what everybody does now and being antagonistic is the way to get a whole bunch of energy and attention um it's also just a it's just a good way to attack them you don't have someone specific but then you put in a funny voice a little bit it's not you you're coming at him chef's kiss Jonathan Cooper is practicing for this team.

33:20He is facing domestic violence charges. And there was some real thought that they might cut him. I heard some whispers. We'll see. It didn't happen. He's out there. The team says they're essentially supporting him and going to see what happens in the process. They are talking up Jonah Ellis a little bit as kind of the next edge up if Cooper is suspended. Ben Powers is there as a starting guard, according to their coach, Sean Payton, who figures to be in Canton later this week with Drew Brees getting inducted. I'm sure he's going to make his way over. We know he's the one presenting him, which is usually on video, but he's going to be the guy probably to unveil that bust, which is really cool.

33:59Sean Payton said Ben Powers, he expects to be their starter, even though they made him take a massive pay cut to stay after he played through an injury that I think required surgery. That's what happens. like there's no right way to handle these injuries. And then I thought it was interesting in that interview that with NFL Network, Sean Payton kind of indicated maybe a Taysom Hill reunion with the Broncos.

34:22Patrick Claybon:Taysom Hill would have had the Broncos in the Super Bowl. Taysom Hill's had some crazy, serious injuries. So I get that they have a close relationship. I mean, Sean Payton helped make Taysom Hill a very rich man in New Orleans. And probably going to give him a shot, but his body looked like it had had enough football. We'll see. Let's go to the Raiders. First day of training camp, the takeaway was Fernando Mendoza just looked more comfortable under center. And in general, the people that have come through Raiders training camp have said, okay, he has looked like as advertised, according to Albert Breer was another guy that went through there.

35:02He did reportedly have a bad day Sunday. I think it was ESPN's beat writer said it was probably his worst day of camp. You know, you're going to have your ups and your downs. You don't need to be tracking it each day. But I think so far, so good with Fernando Mendoza. Did you happen to see the Kirk Cousins video of him doing suicide? Did they call him suicides?

35:23Patrick Claybon:Yeah. Yeah, I did. I don't know. That made me think maybe Mendoza's starting earlier. I think Kirk got got on that because he's not selling out there. I know he's not selling out, but even then. Yeah, it's warm-ups. Maybe he got there a little bit late. Like, he had breakfast or picked the kids up from school or something. Like, who knows? He looked like it's so rare that you see a professional athlete just look like a normal guy. But he just looked like a normal 40-year-old guy right there. Like, if I'm out there, sometimes we go to the local middle school and we'll just, like, throw the football a little bit.

35:57They have a nice, like, football field that's kind of, like, open sometimes. and there's people playing soccer or whatever. Like, if I saw just, like, another guy doing, you know, warming up doing that, that would make sense to me. It's just, like, an average guy. That's what Kirk Cousins looked like. And you got to try to beat out Mendoza? I don't know.

36:16Patrick Claybon:I just, I don't think there's enough evidence to indicate that that. Okay. Okay. 12-second video is Kirk Cousins. Fair. Maybe it is. Training camp is all about learning about guys you never heard of. Like when you're talking draft and Jermod McCoy is a huge story and I'm looking forward to see what kind of career he has. The fourth round pick from Tennessee right now, he's still working his way back practicing, but not taking all the reps and he's with the second or third team. No surprise there. But one of the guys taken after him by this Raiders front office is not only battling for a starting job is getting like the first, first team reps most days.

36:58A fifth round pick by the name of Hezekiah Masses battling last year's pick, Darian Porter. But the fact that they put him out there first, I think on a couple of the first days of camp as like the first guy, it's like, okay, that's the thing. Sometimes you get these day three guys and they just impress the hell out of you in the offseason. The coaches are like, all right, let's give this guy a shot. Like that might be their starting cornerback. Just a note I wanted to throw out there.

37:24Patrick Claybon:Yeah, and that's the thing where you have a different staff come in. The evaluations are not going to be hindered by any sort of sunk cost fallacy. And it's like, alright, who are the best guys for us to get in there? They do have a thin secondary, especially at cornerbacks. So that is an area where I think Bo Nix and Patrick Mahomes and Justin Herbert in this division are going to be looking at that position and thinking, can we take advantage of these guys? You know who you can't take advantage of? The Tokyo Toe. Kensei Matsuzawa, who's out there trying to become a week one starting kicker. Was a sensation in college at Hawaii.

38:03One of the best kickers in all of college football last year. He's battling Matt Gay. That's just a fun kicker battle. I just wanted to point it out. He missed like a 50-something yarder, the Tokyo Toe on Sunday. But yeah, that's a battle. That's a cool battle. That's all. I don't have any take. It's nice to have a new name.

38:23Patrick Claybon:in these kicker battles between the guys that are going to be on three or four different teams over the course of the next few years. Matt Gay's bounced around in recent years. Yeah, it's good to have a new addition to the kicker battle lineup. And you know what we can confirm is that both those guys, not turds. And that's because the Raiders are a turd-free facility. Is there anything that you're pleasantly surprised by, something maybe you didn't expect to be as far as you are? I think we just have a professional group of players. They care about getting better. you know we don't have any turds we got guys that want to be here that want to win that want to change this place and so I'm really really happy with that turds being the leftover undiagnosed undiagnosed undigested material from a previous regime I was trying to think about it where it's like what what what could he mean by that and maybe like there's some there's some parts uh left over that that weren't bad no this this this roster is better than I thought Ashton Gentry talking up that he wants to make a second year leap.

39:24He has to become more of a leader for this team. You know, some reports about the offensive line, maybe not great, you know, in terms of the run blocking. It's so early. I'm not going to have any takeaways from like running games in the first week of camp. Let's go to the Chargers where Justin Herbert reportedly taking those coaching points about the quick release. I thought it was interesting. Ladd McConkie, when they asked him about Justin, he's just like, well, you guys have seen it. Like that ball is coming out fast. has to do a bit with his footwork and his release. And he's reportedly looked more comfortable playing in the Mike McDaniel style to start camp.

39:59Herbert had some time in front of the microphone and he mentioned Brennan Thompson, their fourth round pick, is going to make a lot of big plays for them. And what supports that is that he's been out there mostly taking first team reps, a fourth round rookie stepping in. maybe already ahead of a guy like Keandre Lambert Smith, maybe going to be in the mix with, with Trey Harris behind lad McConkey and Quentin Johnston, who you figure are going to be the top two guys, but that's a guy who was a four to six guy in college and just kind of playing maybe that, that speed role for Mike McDaniel. He likes them fast.

40:34Patrick Claybon:And we've seen some, like at this point we've seen enough people in this role to know, well, that's a real thing. It's not a creation. It's just a question of, it takes more than being fast. Like Devon, is clearly more than just fast and uh to have you know tyree kill and jaylen lottl it's big shoes to fill but thus far that's good yeah and just the fact that he's making plays consistently early is is a really great sign because because that doesn't happen with every young receiver tuli tuli pelotu has not been participating fully not doing any team drills it appears by all accounts it is contract related but the players and the coaches around the league are called kind of all on the same page of these holden situations i don't know if you noticed this patrick where they're trying to say it's not about the contract when kind of everyone knows it is about the contract so we'll see how that goes uh five different offensive linemen have played first team left guard in just four days i've never seen a battle quite like this a five-person battle.

41:36They've been spreading it around. Jim Harbaugh said Trey Pipkin specifically. It's hard to say that he's not one of our five best. And so maybe he is the guy that's going to move inside from tackle to guard, which would mean their second round pick, very high pick, Jake Slaughter might just be a backup at center and guard, but that's a good problem for the Chargers to have, to have some depth. I love the McDaniel, Jim Harbaugh content. that's of it all coming out just the whole thing of it let's let's just take a quick look at uh them early in camp coach you feel the juice you feel the juice you just got too many ball guys

42:14Patrick Claybon:you can't you can't help yourself it's awesome man it's awesome look at us run to the line of skirmage i think of it like all the investment that's been made right it's like putting money in the bank now it's time to start withdrawing i've never wanted training camp to start more I love that from the Chargers. Do you think they play it up at all, knowing they're mic'd up or not, or they're not thinking about that? No, I think that that probably was one of the more tame interactions that they've had in a similar circumstance. I'm really interested in this team. There's not as many questions coming into the season.

42:50I think I know who this team is for the most part. We will be there as a podcast in a couple weeks. So I'm looking forward to that. I think Jordan Rodrigo will be joining us on that show, talking to the Chargers. Let's go to the AFC East, where the Bills had an injury scare. Chauncey Gardner-Johnson was carted off with an injury. It turns out it's a calf strain, which doesn't sound great, but it's not a long-term injury. Even if it's like a multi-week injury, it doesn't sound like it's something that's going to keep them out going into the season. So that is great to see. At safety behind Chauncey Gardner-Johnson, right now it's Cole Bishop and Geno Stone, who was with the Bengals and has had some tough moments there who's taken over.

43:30Damar Hamlin even behind them and a rookie Jalen Kilgore. So Damar probably not going to be a starter anymore. Here's another omen for you. First play of training camp. A Keon Coleman drop. That's not what you want.

43:46Patrick Claybon:But the Keon problems haven't necessarily been drops. They've been drops. He had one in the in the divisional round of the playoffs that I know it wouldn't have counted because it was called back by penalty was one of the worst jobs I've ever seen. Yeah. I just think the total sumnation of whether or not Keon is performing as to, you know, they have him out there, I guess, if anybody needs to have things to blame on Keon in the future. You want a better omen? Very next play, second play at training camp, back to Keon Coleman, Josh Allen building up that confidence. He makes the grab. What, you don't think he purposely went back to him after the first play as it drops so that it wouldn't linger.

44:26That's Josh Allen being a leader.

44:28Patrick Claybon:I think sometimes people drop the ball. Sometimes people catch the ball. I think we're going to need more. I get that, but I think the second play going back to him, that's purposeful. You won't convince me otherwise. It's real leadership. That's right. Maybe he was open. No surprise the top four receivers have been DJ Moore, Keon Coleman, Khalil Shakir, Josh Palmer. I think they're pretty established actually. And I think Coleman's going to play a lot for this team. The starting defensive line, Ed Oliver, Dan Walker, TJ Sanders. I got to admit, I couldn't find a lot of good Bills notes. Hit me up, Bills fans and reporters.

45:02I don't know if you have anything you've been doing inside training camp live. I didn't know what to say about the Bills. Sometimes that happens early in training camp.

45:08Patrick Claybon:No. Josh was... Usually a good problem. He's asked a lot about the differences in the McDermott and now Brady regimes. And he was like, there's change. But a lot of things that we needed, that we were doing weren't working. So, you know, very honest to Josh Allen. One of the offensive linemen was talking about the difference between Joe Brady and Sean McDermott and was kind of comparing him to like a cool uncle or something. And like, you know, you can like, it wasn't like a, it almost didn't, it's not how the player I think wanted it to come across where it almost sounded like a kid who knows he can get away with more now that you have a substitute teacher vibe.

45:53Patrick Claybon:And also when you say somebody's the cool uncle, it means they're not your dad. Right? Because the implication there is that there's somebody who is mainly in charge of taking care of, and then this person only shows up on special occasions. Being a cool uncle is important, though. Yeah. My brother, Dean. What a role he is playing in the lives of my children. If you, because I'm leading off here so often, if you had any takeaway, anything you wanted to say about what's happened at the New England Patriots training camp so far, what would stand out to you? Booty always stands out, Greg. I mean, we had a little bit of this discussion.

46:40Patrick Claybon:I think maybe they're trying to drive the price up. No, that's ridiculous. I don't think it's that silly. But it's such a deep receiver group. I think there is a clear top four that has been established to me in the first week of training camp that does not include Matt Collins, who is almost certainly going to make the team. It does not include my guy Kyle Williams, which is disappointing to me. Demario Douglas is a receiver I think Josh McDaniels really likes. And look, he was the guy in the Super Bowl that's still out there catching some passes. I think Drake may trust him. So the clear one, two, three is A.J.

47:10Brown, Romeo Dobbs, Booty, and Douglas are kind of the top four. Booty is rocking. That's a new one. After a slow start, when the pads came on, A.J. Brown and Romeo Dobbs, a lot of action over the weekend. So people were kind of concerned that it wasn't happening in the first week of camp. Dobbs especially was silent. Jake May looks good. I'm a little worried about the pass rush. I think that's probably a big part of it. They don't really have much. Harold Landry seems to have a pretty serious injury. And it doesn't sound like he's going to be back anytime soon. Gabe Ackes. And I found out that is the pronunciation.

47:48Oh, there's no yacht? There's no yacht. Just Gabe Ackes. Signed a very strange contract. Because it sounds without the player, without the team wanting to put it out there publicly, that they believe Akis or his agent willfully misled the public about the existence of an injury that they didn't know about, that the entire NFL didn't know about when they drafted him, and they put crazy conditions into his contract where things are not guaranteed through the first three years. There's all this injury stuff. It would sound ugly, but Mike Vrabel's trying to build him up, and he has started to practice.

48:29and for what it's worth, Greg Bedard, who's out there at practice, is like, this guy has definitely not been taking time off. He might have the best coming off the bus body on the entire team. So Gabe Ackes, we're all rooting for you.

48:41Patrick Claybon:Yeah, rooting for Gabe Ackes. I do wonder with the Clowney signing in Houston, obviously. Yeah. He lives in Houston, but there's familiarity between Mike Farible and Jadeveon Clowney with the need there. Do we think because this wasn't in play that there's confidence? Maybe. In the group? Or are we thinking that maybe... And they weren't one of the teams that was even mentioned. It was, I think, Clowney going to visit the Browns to get his price up a little bit, as Clowney is expert at doing, let's be real. Because he does not like Andrew Barry. Well, that's good. It is funny to think back that he literally went to Cleveland just to get the Texans to go up a million or two or whatever it was.

49:23And the Seahawks were also interested in bringing him.

49:24Patrick Claybon:Maybe he just wanted them to debase themselves to have the discussion just to be like, I'm out. I mean, if you're choosing between the Seahawks, the Texans and the Browns in the year 2026, you live in Houston. There's a clear number three in that list. Free dinner. But yeah, their their pass rush. It could be a problem. They got Draymond Jones. It's not great. Christian Gonzalez continues to fully practice, even with the pads on. So he's not holding out or doing anything waiting for that contract. The run blocking has reportedly been pretty bad at practice. Something to watch. I've been talking about Caleb Lomu as a potential left tackle, their first round pick he's reportedly struggled a little bit at camp getting beaten a lot, kind of the only offensive lineman maybe getting beaten a lot so I think it's Will Campbell's job there, not that it wasn't in the first place at left tackle I feel like we need a scale to grade, training camp run game I don't know that we're getting all of it the pads being on there at least gave me license I feel like to make that no, early You have all license, Bob.

50:25Right, but that it's not trying to make something out of nothing. Just multiple reports of just guys in the backfield, Trayvon Henderson having no chance whatsoever because I think Ramondre had a rest day, which reminds me of last year when their running game had terrible blocking too. The Jets have practiced less than anyone. I kind of know this. They had more days off. They gave a day off after day three and day four, or day five, I think. So not as many practices. Everyone's getting into pads on Monday, like I mentioned. A lot of David Bailey sacks in the first couple days of practice. Geno Smith had a 15 for 15 day.

51:02Just wanted to point that out.

51:03Patrick Claybon:You are well within your rights to point that out. We're getting everybody else's passing numbers. Geno lightened it up. Are you more concerned if you're in this situation, this is a classic training camp dilemma, of like, oh, we might have a common quarterback now, or that our defense is allowing Geno to go 15 for 15? I think any situation where Gino is not in serious threat to get blasted. Yeah, he could still he could still spin it. I agree. The number one test of if you're an NFL quarterback, which not everyone passes, that's in the NFL. But in terms of having a long career, it seems obvious enough.

51:35Literally NFL, every NFL quarterback that has a long career. If you give them time, they will dice you up like in different ways and different flair. But they will dice you up like they're just that good. K. Clubnik, not sure if he's going to be that type of guy or not, but he's kind of clearly the QB, too, there at Jets camp. So that is a Gino injury away, and I know Gino's been durable, but I don't think there's even really a battle there for QB. Who's he battling against? Like Zappi? Brady, yeah. Brady Cook is there, Zappi's there, but Clubnik's getting all the reps as QB. As he should. I guess so, but just, okay.

52:11A.D. Mitchell reportedly having a fast start to camp and some injuries there. Joseph Asai, the edge rusher, and D 'Angelo Pons, who we're keeping an eye on in the back end, have been out with injuries. The Dolphins are a team that aren't getting a lot of national attention. I often mention the podcast Three Yards Per Carry. I checked them out, especially during training camp. They noted that Malik Willis just absolutely on fire, killing the Dolphins' defense on day three after just like a so-so start to camp, but just like looking great. dotting people up. And it's a lot of Caleb Douglas. Their third round receiver is kind of the first guy that Malik Willis is looking at.

52:52Malik Washington, according to the reporters there, I believe it's Al Fortega who hosts the show. He thinks he's probably the odds-on favorite to lead that team in targets. But that's probably your one-two right now. Caleb Douglas, just curious, or Malik Washington as a late-round flyer in Fantasy League. It's not that crazy.

53:08Patrick Claybon:No, not crazy at all. Malik Washington should be the target leader based on And like the numbers for the guys that are coming back, like career, it's Malik Washington and everybody else. Quinn Ewers reportedly looked awful. It's worth noting, like he was drafted to be in Mike McDaniel's system. That's not the system anymore for the first three days of camp. So they're pretty thin behind Malik Willis. Ewers reportedly looked better on Sunday. Had a little bit of a bounce back. At cornerback, it sounds like the top three cornerbacks right now, the rookie Chris Johnson, Juju Brents, who's got an impressive specimen, but just hasn't been able to stay healthy.

53:43And then Ethan Bonner. They got a million guys there. I've heard some Chop Robinson pop, which is nice to hear again after a down year. It sounds like Jacob Rodriguez, their second round linebacker. I think he's going to be starting next to Jordan Brooks. And then for fantasy, Devon Achan, Jalen Wright, and then Ollie Gordon appears to be the running back order of the depth chart. So Ollie Gordon got some verbal pop from Jeff Halfley, but he's like been coming up third in terms of the depth chart. That matters more to me. What do you think about the verbal pop? Were you ever a waiter? And are you aware of the phenomenon of the verbal tip?

54:17Patrick Claybon:No, I've never delved into those. Okay. Yard maintenance was my area of expertise. But I think for fantasy purposes, obviously, if you're going to handcuff the running backs, I think you need to weigh who would actually play in the event that Devon H. And isn't out there long term, who would have the majority of the snaps. And I think that verbal pop may mean like the order may not necessarily reflect who gets the play time in this situation. Yeah. And I think especially at running back, that's going to change when you're in real live action, not even pads practice, but the preseason and then into the regular season.

54:56The verbal tip phenomenon, I believe, to be real as a waiter. Very often you would find that the customers who would go out of their way to be nice enough about what a good experience they have and thank you and maybe talk to you more, they would like tip less. They would feel almost like subconsciously they either felt bad about not giving you a good tip or that they gave you the tip by just saying nice things to you, but then they're giving you like 12 % or something. I feel like it happened all the time. It was a phenomenon among waiters.

55:32Patrick Claybon:I think waiters and their analyses of phenomenon are probably not necessarily trustworthy sources. Oh, come on. We're doing it every day. I think confirmation bias is huge. I think tipping evolved as a solution to avoid paying the formerly enslaved. I wish everybody was compensated. If I could raise up the entire restaurant to obtain their due pay, I would. I would like to tell everybody, hey, I'm tipping 25 % at the start, so I don't so frequently get forgotten about. That's about me and my wife. That's actually a good move. Eat at the bar. But I do hate that it's like, hey, I would like to be treated the same as everybody else.

56:10Patrick Claybon:So I need to let you know that you pay because of whatever weird analysis has caused you to think that I'm not going to tip properly. I would just like to do without the entire process, personally. I totally agree. And I have enjoyed. I don't know if this is a phenomenon that's happening across the country. There is an increasing amount of Los Angeles restaurants, which the tips included. They're presumably paying more of a living wage. And I mean, it's not even a tip that's included. They just it's like a charge. No, you don't like that. No, the last person that I trust in this is the restaurant owners and operators who have been underpaying people in the first place and forcing the public to serve that portion of their wages.

56:48Patrick Claybon:I think the overall restaurant industry takes advantage of its workers to a more extent than almost anything else. But there's a better way than us doing like societal analysis by looking at a person and trying to figure out how much they're going to do because that doesn't go so great for everybody. No, it's a tough business. you do like the other countries where it's not as much like the tipping isn't as much of an issue and they do pay their waiters more of a living wage but I still believe in the verbal tip is a phenomenon that exists I don't, you know I haven't run the analytics on it we will do that during the break we're going to take one more and we're going to finish our roundup of all 32 teams in two days with the AFC North

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59:12More omens. Omens. The Bengals. First play of a training camp. That was a positive omens. Oh. Under center. Motion. Two tight ends on the field. So exact same was the case with the first play of pads on Monday. Again, under center, motion, completely different type of offense than Joe Burrow has been running for his entire career, which I've always thought of as the Joe Burrow offense. It does sound like the change that they've long kind of threatened to, like, diversify things and not just be back there and let Joe do everything 95 % of the time. Hopefully it helps out the running game. That's a big part of it.

1:00:01It really does look different day after day after day according to the people on the scene there. They're working on it.

1:00:07Patrick Claybon:Are you taking from this, if Zach Taylor says, if it's going to be my fault, if I'm out, I'm going to have it actually be my fault. Wow. And the calls, the structure, everything is going to run through me if I'm going to be gone. And whether or not you're happy about it, whether or not you're having fun, this is me. I haven't thought of it that way. That's a great way to frame it. I love it. I think that's right. I think that's him trying to graduate from the generic polo to maybe like one that's a little more tightly cut, showing off the muscles, get some stripes. Extra medium. Something like, or you got an NFL network, like a better polo.

1:00:45I love that theory. Thank you. And maybe they were able to point out the running game and the effectiveness of the offense with Joe Flacco last year. And there's a little proof of concept for Joe Burrow to just like see it like, oh, OK. But yeah, the under center is every day. Eric All is a third year tight end who I think is going to be really important to this equation as an almost every down player who is that kind of versatile tight end. And also on that first day of practice was a big fight. DJ Turner and Jamar Chase getting into a fight where Chase wound up throwing his helmet. And then the thing I like about Joe Burrow is he just repeatedly started throwing to DJ Turner after that with Jamar Chase.

1:01:26Chase loved it, by the way. It wasn't even a thing that happened after a play. The fight started as they called them onto the field. So they likely were chirping on the sideline about something. I don't know if I've ever seen that, where the fight started. It wasn't after a play. It was like the third team just finished up, and they're like, all right, first team, back out on the field. And then they just start fighting. But reportedly, this kind of goes with a larger theme, the defense fighting back in Bengals camp. The defensive line really dominated. Yeah. I like it.

1:01:56Patrick Claybon:It's a new era. Mafia, Jonathan Allen there, Dexter Lawrence. Might be a sign, though, that the Bengals offensive line not playing that well. But, you know, let's look at the positive, at least, in camp. Uh, their secondary seems pretty established for, for those who are tracking the draft. Sicario Davis was a guy they took in the second round. He seems pretty clearly like a backup corner. They're established. They like to bring her along their guys slowly. DJ Ivy, also a backup. Jasir Taylor is getting some work as the first team nickel, but it's mostly Jalen Davis there. And then I wanted to mention the name of a guy, Dante Myers, who is a, uh, a CFL player who played at Presbyterian.

1:02:38I don't know if that's the full name of the college. And then Delta State in college. Apparently, like, wound up at Delta State because, like, some old high school coach of his recognized his name. He spells his name Dante a little differently. Like, no attention whatsoever. To go from Presbyterian to Delta State to an Atlanta Falcons tryout that you didn't ever get anywhere with to the CFL giving you a tryout to then making the CFL and becoming one of the best players in the CFL to now, according to Bengals reporters like Paul Daner, who's there thinking like this guy might make the team. A little Andrew Hawkins vibes about this guy.

1:03:19Patrick Claybon:Got to the Rough Riders and had eight catches for 101 yards his very first game in the CFL. It's weird how you get guys like Rashid Shahid, two saints here, but the beer man, like people that fall through the cracks. and could be good football players. And it makes sense. Well, he's a smaller guy, so he didn't get attention. But also maybe just different guys develop at different times. The Ravens are hoping Lamar Jackson develops playing more under center, kind of like Joe Burrow. Sounds a lot like normal. I think we talked about their good omen last week, actually. I think it was like a deep cross to Zay Flowers on the very first play of camp.

1:03:59So I like that 20-yard completion. a lot of Lamar just talking about how much he likes under center and that they're, they're trying to work that into the mix. It's like Lamar 3.0. It is a totally different system to watch him running. So it'd be fun.

1:04:13Patrick Claybon:And the sample sizes are small, but you get Lamar on those play actions, especially like full back turn play action plays last year that we talked about where he, he had 20, 24 numbers in play action last year. They just kind of got away from it. So the, the idea that they could fully invest and utilize the personnel is that the real omen is having Matt Abike play football. Matt Abike out there practicing and he's got the neck roll, which I don't know if that's reflected, you know, cause he's had those neck injuries. It just feels more comfortable, but it looks cool. You just don't see that. Yeah.

1:04:45Patrick Claybon:It's back. We're bringing back the neck roll in terms of the receiver group. This is one where I'm maybe like slightly concerned, like no one's popping up as camp stories. Like the reports are, it's a lot of Zay flowers. Bateman's kind of up and down and then, and I don't know what else it sounds like the Baltimore Ravens receiver that's what I'm saying, but I would love to just hear Elijah Surratt's killing it but he is coming back from an injury it reportedly doesn't look 100 % early Jacoby Lane is another rookie they drafted who's like uneven but, you know, had a couple flashy contested catches, that sounds like how he was at college you know, I just, I want some I want one of those teams, either the Ravens or the commanders to sign Stefan Diggs.

1:05:28I think he would help fill out that room. The pass rush reportedly looking a little deeper. Mike Green, according to The Athletic, quote, far more confident, assertive, powerful. Tabius Robinson is starting there. They feel a little bit better about their pass rush depth, especially with Kaleas Campbell also on the field as pads came on on Monday. Not doing everything, but he's out there for the first time, so that is good to see. Travis Jones been out. How are you feeling about the defense?

1:05:55Patrick Claybon:defense uh well the you have to consider the fact that jesse minner took a player that wasn't productive at all with the baltimore ravens and he had production a lot of production towards the end of of the season for the chargers uh in a dafeo way and and so what can he do with the group uh that remains uh that's the the place of confidence and you know calais campbell providing that depth uh you know he his mother passed away uh this summer he was away from the team there so condolences to calais campbell for joining what i feel like is one of the worst clubs in the world and it feels like that for a long time and to go through that late in his career hopefully he's able to navigate that process but it's different for everybody and when you were talking about helping out a raven former raven jesse minner like last year and could he do that again i thought you were going to say tony jefferson was tony jefferson was on the raven yeah tony jefferson very much very much a ball sport right i'm like he bounced around i'm not I'm not crazy.

1:06:51That was main lore. Tony Jefferson. The Cleveland Browns have an over-under win total of five and a half in Vegas. Their team owner jumping into the fray without being asked. This was not one where context would add to. He was just kind of freestyling and just brought that up. And he said, I would take the over.

1:07:17Patrick Claybon:And I would take it that NFL ownership doesn't do the extensive amount of PowerPoint presentations that we do regarding discussions about gaming. Because it seems like that would be if Jimmy Haslam had like a 15 year NBA career, this would be enough for the current FBI to invest. The schedule is favorable. There are really talented players on this roster. There's a route to it happening. But they need better quarterback play. and Zach Jackson, who I listened to in terms of his podcast and at The Athletic has just noted that, you know, Watson's bad days have just been awful. Six interceptions so far, some alarmingly bad days, some better days too, but I just continue to be confused why they are trotting him out there on NFL Network.

1:08:05Maybe we replaced, maybe we requested him. Just why? Like, cause - No idea. Cause there's some reporting that, you know, So depending on the day, like Taylor Green is a rookie. That's kind of frisky that they might want to hold on to on their actual roster. And then, you know, you got Gabriel, like some days has looked like the best quarterback, supposedly. It sounds to me reading between the lines that Shutter Sanders on balance has been the best quarterback there. And then, so you add that all up and I see a realistic possibility that Deshaun Watson is just not on the roster.

1:08:40Patrick Claybon:It would, that would make total sense. Right. But then there's aspects like him being him still being on the roster and this still being a possibility. This was like the one last chance. Let's see if he comes out and looks any better in camp. He's fully healthy, blah, blah, blah. Yeah, he's just not that guy as a player. Put everything else aside. Quinchot Jenkins is out there just doing everything. Love it. Reportedly looking really strong, positive injury recovery news there. And then I texted our friend Andrew Siciliano. know if he had any takes and a lot of it was like you know jared versa as advertised a lot of things you'd expect the quarterbacks you know some good day some bad uh but he said something i've seen elsewhere too which is both rookie receivers especially denzel boston but also casey conceptio and speed really showing up but just that denzel boston catching everything in his zip code and that has been the case throughout the entire offseason program and he's lined up against some good players like Denzel Ward making catches.

1:09:39Keep an eye on that rookie Denzel Boston. That's it. They got some fun players. It's fun.

1:09:44Patrick Claybon:It's fun. It's fun to think about other than the one thing that's decidedly not fun. But Shadr will give them a chance. Like Shadr holds onto the ball. Like I can see where the ceiling seems a little limited for Shadr unless he just locks in at some point mentally at like another level because like he's not that athletic. He's not that big. You know what I mean? So you got to get your advantages in other ways. But I do think he will be aggressive. Like he'll take his chances. Let's wrap up with the Steelers. We got to get Patrick to his regular job. Is that the case right now? No, I just checked the meeting is being.

1:10:22Patrick Claybon:They're holding it for this right now. No, I don't want to get in trouble. They're holding it because there's inside training camp. We're good. There's a lot of moving parts. So we're holding. I do not want to get in trouble with the mouse. our last team, 16th team, the Steelers, Jalen Warren, 1A in the backfield with Rico Datal and Caleb Johnson behind him. Are you ready to buy in on Jalen Warren? I'm ready. I am ready to buy in on Jalen Warren, and I would like to issue a full apology to Jalen Warren and Greg Rosen. Wow. Any sort of thing, because I don't want Greg to keep leaning into this.

1:10:55Patrick Claybon:I hate Jalen Warren thing. No, it's just the fun bit that only me and you really care about. So, you know, he just thought he was okay. Roman Wilson has been getting most of the third receiver reps over the rookie Jeremy Bernard. Mike McCarthy is a coach who generally makes you kind of earn it as a rookie. But according to Mark Caboli, who covers the team for the Pat McAfee show, Max Ihanachor taking third team reps and, you know, kind of looking like a rookie. He was thought of as a bit of a project potentially. And at least Caboli thinks it's going to be an uphill battle for their first round pick to start.

1:11:32Similar to their mid-round rookie, Jennings Dunker, who might be really far away from making an impact there at guard. So maybe slow goings with the rookie offensive lineman, which to me would be a little disappointing, but it's early in camp. Asante Samuel, Jr., according to The Athletic, has been the standout of training camp. Kind of forgot he's on this team.

1:11:57Patrick Claybon:Yeah, love an older veteran being a standout in camp, you know, showing that it's going to be different. I think that was the overall comfort. Like we talked with Max Starks, just not only is it different from the previous regime, but it's different from some of the things that Mike McCarthy has done. Like everything, it feels like if people think that things got trenched in and they were too same for the Pittsburgh Steelers, at the very least. It's different. Yeah, they're moving their players around on defense more. But Samuel, who was good enough to be ranked quite high on my 2024 free agents list when he was available, I didn't really realize the severity of his neck injury that he was coming off.

1:12:39But I had him in like a top 40 player in terms of free agents. Like, he came back from that injury last year. Mike McCarthy said he's like, no lie. I can't, I can't, like, lie. Like, Asante Samuels Jr. is one of my favorite players. And he used the word physical bringing him up. And like this, the guy who's maybe seen his career flash before his eyes. If they get a plus starter out of him, that is kind of found money. Cause he's on a, I think a one-year$4 million contract. Very cheap for a player of his ability. They signed a guy, Malik Harrison from the Ravens. That was supposed to potentially be a starter and who's been buried in the linebacker rotation.

1:13:14So it doesn't sound like he's going to be starting. There reportedly haven't been a lot of snaps for Drew Aller and Will Howard because just Aaron Rogers gets everything. Don't love that. it's the last dance man it's the last dance you gotta develop these young guys you gotta figure out I hope Mason Rudolph's not getting much Rayshon Jenkins is a NFL veteran who plays safety who the Steelers signed recently while cutting Darnell Savage who's a guy who's played a lot of football in the NFL so again different coaching staff has different kind of types of guys that they like and they're moving out with some guys that they have played a decent amount and I thought was going to have a decent role So let's wrap up our sound with Mike McCarthy talking about our man, Aaron Rodgers.

1:13:58Patrick Claybon:Yeah, he'd like to play. I would like to see him play. But we won't make a decision until we get all the way up to it because there's more that goes into that just having one player play. It's the culmination of players. Aaron Rodgers had mentioned McCarthy told him he was going to play 30 to 40 snaps in the preseason, and McCarthy sounded like they didn't want that cat out of the bag because he could change his mind. Like if he's just not feeling that he wants the whole offense to be out there, he might change his mind. Yeah, it's an honest evaluation of the entire offense, and some of that's going to require Aaron.

1:14:28Patrick Claybon:It doesn't always have to happen in a game. There was a piece by Mike Silver about Aaron Rodgers where I'm not going to say Aaron Rodgers took credit for the Mike McCarthy hire, but he did say that on his exit interview with ownership that, hey, most, you know, most ownership, they're always looking at, like, the new thing, the new thing. and I think Mike McCarthy would be great with another chance at coaching and then they interviewed Mike McCarthy maybe it was on maybe Aaron Rodgers is responsible for Mike McCarthy having this job he also said that he wouldn't have come back he would have retired if it wasn't Mike McCarthy so I'm old enough to remember that they didn't leave on good terms no they literally didn't speak for like years afterwards but he's this is offseason all about healing relationships his wife yeah forgetting her name I don't think it's out there I don't know her name Brandy with an I perhaps you know has helped him heal his relationships with his family maybe Mike McCarthy maybe medicine medicine is important medicine will be used I'm sure on the Bears safety Kobe Bryant I know it's an AFC show but as we're taping their big free agent signing who is going to start for them is expected to be sidelined for eight to ten weeks so that would take him into you know a good portion of the regular season might be starting on the pup list something like that he had a three-year 40 million dollar contract was really good for the the super bowl winning seahawks last year so that's unfortunate news and you know the latest in 49ers injury news is mike evans is now out of practice i'm not gonna panic It's just a training camp practice.

1:16:14Patrick Claybon:Mike Evans isn't going to forget how to play football. Everyone's out of practice there that can catch a football, so you get a little worried. Thank you, Patrick. Thank you. For filling in, for jumping in. We have Patrick at least once a week lately, and you've got your regular day job. Where can people see you? Yeah, we've got the insiders coming up at 4 o 'clock Pacific. That was the 7 o 'clock Eastern, but I hope we don't see it as filling in. I don't know why I said that I've said a lot of things that were poor in this match in this game I called Aaron Rodgers our guy leading into the sound I was like not our guy but yeah in the event that it ever is getting a chance to do this podcast Greg I'm just saying thank you to you and Eric to be perfectly honest who knows Kyle Shanahan said we don't know where anybody's going to be And so passing out flowers to you guys, the viewers as well.

1:17:13Patrick Claybon:I'm not going anywhere. I love that we have started this week so strong, back-to-back, hitting all 32 teams and what's going on at training camp. We're going to try to do that at different points during the regular season. We will be back on Tuesday with a news show, just kind of like a news catch-up. But we're also going to have a special new guest for the show to preview the AFC South I'll let it be a surprise. Oh, it's a tease! It's a tease. We'll see you then.

1:17:48This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed human.