ALEX WARREN: The Hidden Battles Behind His Historic Rise - Overcoming Self-Doubt, Healing Childhood Wounds & Learning to Finally Feel Enough

29:35But yeah, I don't – when you go through the things that I go through, or at least – I can't speak for everyone. I have spent a lot of time not forgetting but putting it on a burner, letting it sit there when it's time to approach those feelings. And then when I do these things, I fully believe in being honest. And I like to take – I told you. before we started recording that these are my favorite parts of this job. And I think it's true because this is the time where I get to be human. I think in my career, a lot of people look at what we do and it's the same thing. I think they just, you know, they don't see the human behind the piece or the art or whatever they see the headline or they see whatever they want to see, whether I pass their favorite artists on a chart, or if I got picked to do something opposed to their favorite artists, it almost, I become a villain in their life without them actually understanding who I am behind it.

30:35So when it's time to do these things, I think it's great because I think you start to realize how messed up a lot of us are. Not even messed up. I wouldn't even say I'm messed up. I think just the things that you, you tend to separate the human from the art. And I think that's the hardest thing for me too, is, you know, everything I make in the music I write about is fully true to me. I don't, I'm not taking pitch records. I'm writing about my watching my parents die, which is so hard to then turn around and swipe on a TikTok and be like, Alex Warren sucks. You know? And so it's just separating, separating that is so difficult for me too.

31:13I just have to scroll now, whether it's good or bad, I don't look at it and it's hard. It's really hard because these mean, these songs mean so much to me. These songs helped me through all those things I'm talking about. And like, it's so strange to be able to be like, oh, wow, it's so strange not to take that personally, you know? So that's definitely been a challenge.

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34:45as i was listening to you i was just thinking i love that you have the capacity for grace for your mom and to sit there and say you know no one knows how to raise four kids watch their husband die deal with the challenges that come with life you know she's not a superhuman and yeah as i was to you say that i was like i hope you're able to develop that grace for yourself to be able to say you know no one knows how to come into the world and have their father pass away when they're nine years old and have a mom who's an addict and have three other siblings and because i'm looking and i think both coexisting is what grace really looks like because it's beautiful that you've been able to even have the glimpse of that perspective for your mother and to expand that out into yourself because I often feel that we do one or the other so we often feel oh yeah I give myself grace but I can't forgive that person and that doesn't feel fully healed yeah we do the opposite where we give that person grace but we don't for us and I can I can resonate with it because my I always think about my dad because he was he had such a complex childhood and when i look at it it gives me context and grace for who he became and if without that context in the same way as you just beautifully explained but yeah my dad like saw his mom die when he was four yeah um he grew up in the slums of india he had four siblings that you know were just trying to figure out what to do like it and And when I understand that context, I can have grace and compassion for him.

36:22And then at the same time, even though I didn't have those troubles or your troubles, there's compassion I have to have for myself. And so, yeah, I really hope this opens a doorway for that for you because it's beautiful that you have the capacity for that for her. Yeah. And had it in that moment. It's really special, actually. I've never had that perspective funny enough. Something so simple, yet so profound, you know? Yeah. I mean, you have it. You're the one saying it about your mother. Like, you know, it's, it's just, you know, saying the same about your nine-year-old self and 14 and 21. But when, when you were going through that, what was, what do you believe you needed most in your teenage years that you didn't have?

37:04Wow. I don't know. I mean, the obvious answer is obviously apparent. Yeah. Outside of that, yeah. I think I, I made do with what I had. I don't necessarily think I could have had anything more. You know, growing up and being a teenager, I think I had ambition. I had a dream. I had a goal. And every day, being a kid, I never thought of like, what am I going to do party-wise? I thought, what am I going to do so I can achieve those goals? I've always wanted to do this. So I don't know. I truly, every day, I just woke up and I thought, how do I make this dream and goal of mine possible? and I've never let go of it.

37:46How did you protect that and protect your self-esteem in an environment where you're being told you suck, where someone who's the only caregiver in your life doesn't love your art or doesn't encourage it? And of course you don't have the resources to, how did you protect that? I have no idea. I have no clue. I should have given up so long ago and that is something that I've questioned to this day of why it happened. I, for the longest time, had this gut feeling since I was a kid. And whether you, for me, I credit that to God. I'm a Christian and I have faith in that way. But for so many people, you know, I can't imagine.

38:26I, every day I woke up and I go, I'm going to do this. And I had so much confidence for being such an insecure guy, for not believing in myself talent-wise, for not believing in myself where my life was. and I would, I should have given up way before I did. And I never did. I just had this weird gut feeling that this was supposed to happen. And I followed it and here we are. Yeah, I love that. As in, I love hearing that too, because one of the most common things I hear a lot from my community is, Jay, my family doesn't believe in me. I'm in a toxic atmosphere. There are people around me who are just holding me back.

39:05People with negative energy, what do I do about it? and you're sitting here, you know, and we're looking at a snapshot of your life. Yeah. And yes, we're getting into some detail, but you know, there's so much more to it. Of course, it's your life. And you're sitting here going, well, actually that's all I had. Yeah. So I did all I had. That was basically not your escape, but that was your passion. It was your pursuit. It was where all your energy went. It's where all your focus went because what else would you give your focus to If you gave it to all the other things, you wouldn't have survived.

39:38Exactly. I never had a plan B. I would go to school and in classes, I was posting musical.ly. Like it was literally all I did. Every day I would go into class and I would just go on my phone and do social media or post my singing videos. And I was failing. I didn't graduate high school. Like, and nor would I ever recommend that to anyone. I do not know what that conviction was and why I thought that that was what I was supposed to do. And it just, I didn't fight it. I tuned everything else out. There was nothing else I was interested in. And I never had a backup plan. I was like, I'm going to be homeless.

40:16I'm going to do this. And I ended up being homeless. Did God have anything to do with the conviction? I like to think so. I think a lot of times when I watch podcasts and I hear people say that, though, it always throws me through a loop. you know and and i think like you know a lot of times when i've you know gone through this stuff and talked about my faith and things i just feel as if i have been put on this earth to do this you know and i feel as if i had to lose my parents to be the person i am today you know and the things that i've lost have shaped me into the the the man that i am and you know i've met everyone and I'm happy with myself after all this loss and whatnot.

40:54And I, for me, I battled a lot because I've always been like, oh, well, like if God was real, he wouldn't have done that to me, you know? And I think that when you, when I look at a snapshot of my life, I look at every single mistake I've ever made and every single thing that's taken away and every single thing that has happened to me has been a lesson of some sort. I've learned from everything. And I understand it's, people probably disagree with that. I think that's fully fine. I just think for what I've lived through and the things that I've gone through and where I am today, the only thing to me makes sense is that.

41:24And that's the beautiful thing about faith. You got to believe it, you know? It's crazy. Yeah. Do you regret not telling your mom how you felt? Or do you wish you got to tell her that you forgive her and that you understand and share that compassion? Or do you feel it was shared in spirit and internally? No. I think the one thing that I regret is my mom, I look at this every time and it just kills me, is my mom died alone. You know? She didn't have friends. She didn't have family anymore. Everyone left her. Everyone left. Because they wanted to focus on themselves. I think that's the hardest thing that I've had to deal with is when I thought about that.

42:13I remember I was driving and I started thinking about my life and how I'm terrified to be alone. And I started to think about my mom and I realized that she was alone and I texted her and I wanted to check on her. And little did I know she was dying alone. And so for me, yeah, I mean, it's so easy when people are out of your life. And now that it's happened to me so many times to be like, wow, I wish I did this different. and you're never going to survive if you think that way. It's never going to – I have lost so many people in my life and every time it's so goddamn easy to be like, oh, I should have done this more.

42:58I should have walked with them every day. I should have cherished those moments in between. But now when I have friendships and I have relationships, nothing matters. To me at least, any issue is small because I'm able to – I'm able to put in perspective the things that I've lost and been able to now understand the gravity of what that means and losing someone. And so I feel like as a person, I'm much better of a emotional person with other people because of that as well. Yeah, of course, but I don't know. I can never think about that. I'm genuinely so in awe of your ability to process so much in so little time.

43:39And I don't say that as empty flattery at all. I say it with as much gravitas as you can probably say it with because, and it's so interesting to me because two people can go through the same thing and have completely different reactions and everyone's allowed to process it however they decide to process it. But it feels like the way you've been able to walk these footsteps is allowing you to continue to grow and heal but not crush yourself yeah under the responsibility that you shouldn't have had to carry as a kid anyway and i think that's what's so interesting is so many of us as young people carry weight that was too heavy that shouldn't have even ever come across even as an adult and you end up carrying that weight continuously and it feels like, I'm not saying it was easy or that's not my interpretation of it, but what I'm hearing is you've almost been able to put the weight down at the right time when you've needed to, in order to move forward.

44:43Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. Do you agree with that? Yeah, I do. I just have this outlook on life that, and it sounds so redundant and I keep saying it, but truly, I think that everything that has happened in my life is a lesson. Mm-hmm. where did that come from? How did you even get to that place? I don't even know. You just had to believe. It's a survival instinct. Like that's what I'm. I started thinking about what's the point. Yeah. I started thinking about my life and I think I had a moment where I had a reflection, but also had, I battled with depression a little while ago. And I started to think, what was the point?

45:23Why did all these things happen to me? Why is this my life and where am I supposed to be? And I think, you know, like you said, there are two ways of dealing with it. There's a lot of people, you know, and my family's full of it. My family's full of different ways that we have all endured what we went through because I'm not the only one. And we've all gone different routes of that. And for me, I just started to think, what is the point if I'm not treating this the way I can't control the fact that my parents are dead. I can't control the fact that, you know, life is fleeting and, you know, I've had friends die and all these different things.

45:54And, you know, or even like the mistakes that happen, getting cheated on or just random stuff that has happened in my life. And then I start to realize if everything in life is a way to another thing, you know, what happens to you is a byproduct of a decision that someone made and your reaction is what follows, right? And for me, if I lose someone, it teaches me something in some aspect of life. If I make a mistake on stage, I truly think that that's something because I need to learn. Mistakes are only important if you learn from And if you don't, it's a habit. And so I've just really stressed that aspect of my life every day of growing because what's the point of living if you can't grow?

46:35What's the point of living if you can't constantly try and become a better person? The one thing I know about my dad, and I don't know much because he died when I was a kid, everyone I ask says he was the nicest person ever, says he was the kindest person ever, says he was a light when he walked through a room. And I often think of when I die, what is someone going to say about me? You know? And so for me, you know, I've always just strived and chased that ability to be like my dad. And every day I'm constantly striving to be a better human. And the only way you do that is by growth. And the only way you grow is by learning from your mistakes.

47:13Why? Focus on the things you can't change. Focus on the reaction of what has happened. What do you hope people will say about you when you die? I feel like a lot of people have probably sat here and said something about their career. And I just want to be, I want someone to say that I was a great father. I want people to be like that. Say what you want about me. Say what you want about my music. But I cared a lot. And I just want to be a good father. That's what my entire life has set off to be, you know? Yeah. I love the videos you make. For my kids. Yeah, yeah, for your kids. Yeah. That was inspiring me.

47:52I was like, I need to start. I need to get on that train. My dad left us home videos. No way. Yeah. So that was the coolest part about. That he filmed for you. Everything. Everything. I have hours of footage of what my dad filmed. I get to hear his voice. And I think that's the other thing that no one teaches you about grief is you start to forget the smell of someone. You start to forget what they sound like. You forget what it's like to hold someone after having a bad day or confiding. You don't know how badly. The one thing I wish is I could call my dad and just ask for advice about marriage, about fatherhood, about just things you go through.

48:40That's the thing I take for granted is being able to call him. I called every day to hear that voicemail. every day until one day someone picked up the phone. And because my mom couldn't afford to keep paying the bill. And so that's the one thing is like, it's been so nice to be able to see those videos and humanize someone who I didn't know. I often hear about my dad and I've put him on this pedestal of just being this perfect guy. And I don't want him to be, I want him to have mistakes. I want him to have flaws because I have flaws. And I want to see that in my dad. And so my dad's best friend comes around all the time.

49:21He's in my life so much. He's like an uncle to me. And he brought these letters because back then they didn't have phones. And my dad used to, they used to write each other letters. And it's his bestest friend. And he gets tripped up talking about them all the time. And he showed me these letters and I write just like my dad. I say psyched for no reason. I don't know why I say it. I'm like, oh, I'm psyched. That's sick. And everyone's like, what are you talking about? And he wrote it in every letter. Someone I didn't know. Think about that. I did not know my dad. I was nine years old. I have memories of him the same way I have memories about my doctor.

49:54And that's hard. And there's so much of him in me. And that's the coolest part is being able to every day learn something new about him. And I say this, and I don't know where I heard it. And I never came up with this. But people die twice. They die when they die, and they die when you stop telling their story. And my whole goal with everything in my entire career, my entire life is just to keep him alive, which has been really cool. Yeah. I think you're doing a great job of that. I mean, I'm trying my damn best. Even I feel like when you're talking about your dad, I feel so close to him, even though I have no idea of who he was.

50:28And I couldn't agree with you more. I feel that you carry a part of the people that you lost, that you love. I had a spiritual mentor of mine, a father figure who passed away five years ago, who I love deeply. And he had stage four brain cancer. And so he started to lose his memory towards the last few years of his life. So he went from remembering my face and name to my name to towards the end, not even noticing me. And I can relate to that point of just he's the person I wish I could call to share anything that happens in my life because that's what he was. and all of this took off after he passed away really.

51:07And yeah, it's one of those things. But I fully agree with that. I talk about him a lot on the podcast. I talk about him a lot with friends and family because there was no one like him. And I almost wish more people got to experience him to know what was possible as a human and how someone could live with. So he had this, because he had stage four brain cancer and his memory started to break. When he'd meet people, all he'd do was thank them for their service to God. And so his brain was stuck on gratitude. Wow. So all he'd do is thank people. So he could forget their name, forget their face, but because he was a leader in our spiritual community, he would just, if he'd meet you, he'd just be like, thank you for your service to God.

51:46And he'd really mean it. Like, thank you for everything you've been doing. That's beautiful. And it was just, and I was like, wow, like, God, if my brain ever broke, I hope it breaks like that. Right. Because that just shows what's really, you know, in there. Yeah. But yeah, as I'm hearing you talk about this, it's almost like every phase of your life. I mean, when I was preparing for this, I was like, and now I'm getting to meet you, obviously, so I have a completely different perspective because I'm looking at how much resilience you have and strength you have and how much you're willing to open the wound as well and look at it from different angles, which is at 17, your mom kicks you out of the house and then you end up, as you said a few moments ago, you end up being homeless and living in a car.

52:29Talk to me about the day-to-day of living as living in a car as a 17 year old, because I mean, I had it, I had it pretty lucky. I'm not going to lie. Like I, I slept in cars. My friends would sneak me into their houses and I would sleep like, you know, on their floors with hiding, hoping no one walked in. Yeah. I'm not, I, there was only a few nights where I actually slept like on the road, like probably two, you know? And like, I think that's the biggest thing for me is, you know, I, my mom kicked me out because she wanted me to come back. She wanted me to, I think her whole thing and what I never realized was this insecurity of being a mother, you know?

53:07And for me, I would just, I had a point where she, that night she had pinned me on the ground and just started wailing, punching as hard as she could. My brother, who's a Marine, ended up pulling her off and I ran out of the house and I never came back. and that was something where then the next day she called the cops and the cops went looking for me saying that I hit her a whole thing and so I just hid I hid on the street uh hid in my friend's cars my mom then called all of her all of their friends parents and said I'm bad news and all these things and then they stopped letting me sleep in their house and so I would sleep in a car and then I ended up getting um shot by my friend's dad with a 177 which is like a BB it's It's like a – you hunt deer or rabbits or something with it.

53:58And it's the way it's shaped. It's supposed to do as much damage in the animal. And it was an accident. You didn't mean to or you didn't understand the scope of it. As in, why did you do it? Why did you even – I think a lot of the guys who grew up in the 70s and 80s would shoot each other with pellet guns. Like that was the thing, like I guess. And I don't think they realized this wasn't a pellet gun. It was like a hunting rifle. and uh he also i don't know if he knew it was loaded but uh we were filming a video and he said run i ran and uh zigzagged because i thought that would work and damn was he a good shot he nailed me right in the liver and it went up it missed my heart by a few centimeters and it's stuck in my lung today it's still there today yeah yeah it's so small that if you were to if you x-ray you can see it but if you were to pull it out you'd have to break my ribs and it'd be a chance I would die and it's just not worth it it's capsulized in my lung right now my right lung and talk to me about how it felt in the moment I mean that's excruciating have you ever seen those videos of paintballs hitting your body in slow motion yeah felt like that it hit a nerve I jumped up I broke my elbow or I fractured it or whatever and I just remember the worst pain you'll ever feel in your entire life I don't know what it's like to get shot with a nine mil but that was like it was burning in my body and I was scratching my chest trying to just get the pain I was like make it stop please and I remember when I was shot they didn't believe it was in me they thought I was looking around and so they were squeezing the wound trying to get the pellet out thinking it was at surface level not realizing I was bleeding internally and yeah I remember that was probably the worst pain I've ever felt my entire life is feeling the pellet burn or bullet technically it's a bullet burning in my body that was hard that one sucked did you go to the hospital yes yeah i went to the hospital they admitted me for a gunshot wound i had the cops come because every time you admit anyone to the to the hospital for a gsw the cops come this guy i he's funny enough he officiated my wedding the guy who shot you huge part of my life actually he's a huge part of my life he was a father figure to me when my dad passed away and He made a mistake.

56:15I'm also probably the most forgiving person you'll ever meet. You literally are. I'm like, wow. I think, Alex, we need to slow down here. No, he's amazing. He's truly like, his family has been such a crucial part of my life. And in my recovery, not recovery, but in my life of becoming who I am today, he's someone I still go back home and visit. And he officiated my wedding. His daughter is my best friend since I was 13. and he was letting me sleep on the floor of his house and sleep in his car. And when this happened, he obviously paid the hospital bills and he bought me a, he owns a Volvo dealership or he manages a Volvo dealership.

56:52And so I had a car and I slept in it, which was awesome. So the car that I had, it was a stick shift 1994 wagon. It was great, Volvo wagon. How long did that recovery take? Recovery? I was in the hospital for two months. maybe a month and a half. And you said it just missed your heart. Yeah. Yeah. And it's still in your lung. Yeah. But it can't do any damage in there. If I fall from a certain height, is what they said. If I like fall to my body at 10 feet, maybe. So no flips. I still flip. Like, but it's not something you think about. Like it's, it doesn't cause any pain. Like you don't. Sometimes.

57:29Oh. Sometimes. What about for singing? And like. I don't know. I need to get my lungs checked out, especially because I just, I quit smoking three years ago. When I was homeless, that was something I really got into was smoking cigarettes. And then I went to vaping. And so I really want to get my lungs checked out, especially having cancer running my family. Yeah, yeah. But yeah, I need to get that checked out. I have no idea. Yeah, yeah. All I know is I sing my little took a shout. That's crazy. Yeah. I mean, it's just almost like, I mean, I'm in shock right now because it's just thing after thing after thing after thing.

58:05I mean, it's, you know. Sounds fake. No, no, I didn't feel that. I just feel like it's hard. And it's just like, it doesn't sound fake to me. It just sounds. Oh, I say it all the time. It doesn't sound real. It doesn't sound real in the sense of just like, you can't believe someone survived it all. That's the hard part. It's like, how did someone survive it all and not end up? you know it's almost like how did someone survive it all and have the approach you have to it yeah that's what like sitting with you here today yeah knowing all of this and then hearing about it from you in detail and i'm like how do you not how do you not you know have a vice how do i not have a vice of sorts no no it's not even no i guess it's how are you just gone in a fully different hundred percent i could also have a huge different outlook that's what i mean it's it's the outlook that is the most profound to me.

59:00And I'm really grateful for that. Like it's quite, it's beautiful to sit with that because I'm always looking for, I was on tour this year, earlier this year, and I met this young girl who, her story's just stayed with me ever since. And it was like, she's from here. She was a world champion cheerleader, winning all these competitions, traveling across the country, performing, et cetera. you know, everything that cheerleaders do. And then she had a freak accident, um, broke her, you know, broke her back spine. She's a quadriplegic now. She is paralyzed, um, from her hands down. I met her in her wheelchair that she'd come to my event.

59:46She's 19 years old. She was 16 when it happened. Wow. And she was just bright and beaming and like the light in And like, she was just, you know, brought so much light into the room. Yeah. And I just couldn't believe like someone had been through that. She was telling me a story could be that, like, you know, that powerful and vibrant and everything else. And I tell her story and I'm so grateful I get to share yours on the platform because these are the kind of stories that inspire me and make me look for the lesson and make me look for the gift and make me look. because it's stories like yours and stories like hers and stories like so many others that I've had the fortune of talking to or people I look forward to meeting in the future that inspire me in my darkest moments, um, which are not as dark as that, not to compare, but they're not.

1:00:37And so, or as yours and yeah, it's, it's, it's beautiful to think that you can find beauty and create beauty through so much. Yeah. It's, it's, it's inspiration for me just to be able to do growing up. I, I wanted an outlet and music and I didn't know it. I didn't find it. I didn't see it, you know, until I heard Lewis Capaldi when I was like 18. I think I was 18 when I heard Lewis and he started writing about loss. And that was something that was hugely inspirational for me. Like I write about that now. And that was a lot of, that got me through a lot of stuff, you know? And so I think that was the biggest thing was like, I wanted to be that for someone else.

1:01:19I wanted to help other people whom, I think the one thing that I did that was super selfish was assume that this was all me. I assumed that this only happens to me and I'm the only one who has lost his parents and I'm the only one who goes through these feelings. And as I started to play these shows and as I started to write these songs, I've realized that it's way more than you think. No matter who you are, no matter what you do, no matter how much you make or what your skin color is, you go through loss. You understand that. You have things that you lose every day, your family members, your friends, your loved ones, your dog.

1:01:52And that's the one thing that's universally, I think, can connect everyone is understanding that piece of you that's gone. And everyone tries not to talk about it. And so it's been the most beautiful thing about making music has been able to be a – it's one thing you can't articulate. When you lose someone and going through grief, it's something you cannot articulate. You don't know how to go through it. And everyone has a different vice on how to. And I think that's the biggest thing is making music that sounds like it. making music that allows you to articulate that feeling, you know? And so I've just been really focusing on that.

1:02:21Yeah. I think that's, I mean, especially for things that can't be put into words, it feels like that's exactly where music comes to heal because you feel seen, you feel heard, you feel understood without having to say anything. You can just put it on. And it's, it's amazing to hear that Lewis was doing that. Was there any other artists that you feel have opened that up and gone there to that extent that impacted you probably sean mendes i think we were talking about sean earlier too and sean is um when i first wrote my first song. I've fully, I'm so sorry, Sean, I've ripped off Stitches fully.

1:03:00I stole the four chords that he did and I would just move the capo around. And that's obviously a version before, but that was a huge thing. I, songwriting, my first four years of my life, songwriting was just Shawn Mendes, Stitches, Chords, moving around a capo and because I didn't know how to play guitar. And it was a huge inspiration just listening to songwriting too and understanding, understanding, you know, his, you know, understanding different ways people grow up and different things they go through. And his songwriting was a huge inspiration for mine. So yeah, probably him. We love Sean.

1:03:31He's been a guest on the show too. And he's, yeah, he's a special man. So wait, all of your music knowledge is fully self-taught. Yeah. Yeah, not until I was about 20, 21, I really put out my first song. Yes. And I was like, I need to take this. I need to do this and throw my whole, my everything into it. I wanted to do it right. I wanted to obviously, cause music, I had such a weird relationship with it my entire life that I, I definitely have really bad imposter syndrome. So I started taking music theory lessons. I started taking piano lessons. I take vocal lessons three times a week, if not more still to this day for the last four years of my life, I started taking guitar lessons and, you know, asking how to produce and like, you know, when I'm in the studio, how, what do you do to my voice?

1:04:17How do you do that what do you do this instrument how do you compress that how do you eq that and when i'm doing my in-ear monitors how much what's the frequency you're taking out what is auto-tuned tuned at is it 440 432 and um i think it's really interesting um just learning about it and kind of starting from scratch and re-evaluating what you understand about music so yeah a long i was self taught for a very long time and then i really wanted to understand it all yeah it's a i love hearing the balance of both of just this pure passion and then mastery. It sounds like where you're actually trying to put in the hours and the work and the, you know, the reps in a more formal capacity at the same time as having this years of just singing or musically or posting a video when there wasn't any training or structure around.

1:05:04Yeah. Yeah. I had to do it all myself. And I realized that I was fortunate enough to be able to, um, have an arsenal of, of help. And so I I just took it. Yeah. What did it feel like? You talked about, you mentioned it earlier and I'm kind of looping back to it, but you talked about like how when you met your now wife, Kova, like that, there was something special about that connection. And I believe you met on Snapchat. Yeah. Yeah. Which is amazing. Talk to me about how that happens. New Age, it's the New Age Romeo and Juliet. No, my friend had moved to Hawaii. She's from Hawaii and my friend had moved in with her and they were friends.

1:05:43And so she would throw my wife cover on her story a lot. And there was this photo and it's so funny because I tell the story at the time and she's like, I hate that photo. My wife can sleep anywhere at any time in any position, anytime. Like she comes surfing with me in the morning and she'll fall asleep on the rock. Like I'm not kidding. There's photos of her sleeping on rocks. There's a photo of her. The first photo I ever saw of her was her sleeping in a weird position like this. And I texted my friend and I said, that's the most beautiful girl I've ever seen. And we started talking on Snapchat, yeah.

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1:09:02what part of you did you share with kova that you think was hidden until then like was there something that kova brought out of you that you didn't even know you had within yourself seems like you have such a special relationship yeah i i don't know a single girl who would find out that i'm homeless and go cool let's do it she dropped out of college she had 500 bucks saved up that's it she found out i was sleeping in a car and immediately was like all right cool like let's do it that is that is the crazy i am like i i i cannot believe she's amazing i know yeah she's she's i i'm have you asked her like why she said yes to that like why no actually i should i should i should examine that you're right next time i want her on the podcast with you i I didn't expect when she said yes to go, why?

1:09:53I was like, yeah, dude, I'm not going to question this. You were dating, things were going good. Did you ask her to move in with you? Was it that kind? No, she did it. It was straight up like I was sleeping in my car. She was staying with a friend because she lived in Hawaii, but she came out to California just to visit. And then she was like, oh, cool. Yeah, and moved out of her friend's house, moved into my car. She had options. she she picked probably the one that no one would have picked and i think that's the thing it taught me for me like that's something i probably would have done you know as i've said all these stories now i feel like i'm one of those people who i trust my gut and it seemed like her gut was that and she didn't question it and i i feel like that was kind of the indication of like wow this isn't a normal person this is my person how were your relationship before that did you have time for relationships what did they look like through your teens i was notoriously cheated on i was well i think i i think i looked for what i was missing in my home life and and girls i mean i met my wife when i was 18 so like you gotta think uh all everything before that was probably not real but we're not real but just not necessarily i would say mature i i was a clingy guy like i was a super clingy guy who needed, you know, who didn't trust anyone.

1:11:13I got cheated on every relationship. I was not a catch by any means, you know? So I think relationships before were just me trying to figure out who I was, but also what I wanted in a partner, you know? Was it difficult accepting love from Cova because you'd not had consistent love before? Yeah, it was definitely. It took me a second to be secure with my relationship. Probably took me a year or two to be frank with you man i i i don't think i was secure at all i think i just had so much baggage i had so much shit in my life i my mom was alive at the time and my mom made it a mission to make my life hell so my mom said some pretty choice words to my girlfriend or now wife at the time what did she say she sent her a whole message pretty much being like you know calling her a whore and saying all these things my mom was probably the most my mom was amazing person But when she was drunk, she was probably the most racist, homophobic, rude person I ever grew up with, which kind of showed me.

1:12:14My mom, I will say this, and again, I love my mother, but she showed me exactly who I didn't want to be, you know? And hence why I go by Alex Warren. It's my mom. I didn't want anything my mom did ever reflect on me because I am not that person. I never want to be that person. And so I started going by my not real name because I never wanted that part of that to be associated with me. But my mom was not a kind person when she was drunk. And she made it a mission to attack anyone in her life, which is probably an insecurity thing in herself. Was the name change and identity shift unsettling or did it just feel?

1:12:52It felt right. It felt normal. It gave me so much easement. You know, my mom was just very vocal about things that I didn't agree with, which I feel like everyone has that. I don't think Thanksgivings are necessarily everyone's favorite thing, you know. Who did you celebrate Thanksgiving with? Family. Yeah, my older sister and my brother. Yeah. And yeah, so we went to their house for Thanksgiving, which was nice. Yeah. How cathartic was it to have your music career take off in the same year as your mom passed away? like did that mean something to you did that have certain emotions attached to it for you i've never thought of the correlation uh

1:13:40wow yeah i didn't even realize that was the same years i never thought about it like that um i think i'm right you are you are i put my first song out in june of 2021 and she died in October of 2021. That's crazy. I don't know. I've never thought about that. That's cool. I don't know how to react to that. I think it's something that I'd have to probably process. Yeah, of course. No, of course. Please. Didn't mean to shock you. No, no, no. I mean, it's not that. Yeah, no, no, no. No, no, no. I appreciate it. this revolutionary thing. It's more of a, it's more of like, it's, it's, I, I definitely feel like my, what has now spewed of my music career is something that, you know, has been dealing with those things.

1:14:32And the fact that that happened the same year I pursued music. I feel like it's just another one of those things that have just happened that you kind of have to wonder what the hell is happening in my life. Yeah. Yeah. It's, yeah, it's, yeah, life is just, there's so many moments like that, that, uh, yeah you can't explain them because you go how is it possible yeah that these two things coincide in a matter of months so many so many things in my life you know to the point where it's like you know i i'm baffled by it every time so many sliding doors moments in your life too i'm almost like well what if you and your mom didn't have that fight where you were pinned and you didn't run away yeah and what would happen if you didn't get shot and become really close to you know your friend's dad who you know was the officiant of your like there's and everyone has that everyone has those yeah yours seem quite um there's just there's just really high tension moments of just figuring that out talk to me about the wedding with kova yeah how long were you together before you got married five years okay yeah yeah five years until i proposed six years until we got married and where did you get married what where did you get married we got married in Temecula.

1:15:46Okay. Yeah. So I'm from San Diego. Yes. So it was something cool. We got married at a garden. Temecula is beautiful. Yeah. I was terrified. Of the wedding or Temecula? The wedding. Temecula is a great place. No, the wedding. I wanted it to be perfect. And it's so crazy when you have family and everyone. You invite a bunch of people. And I wanted this big wedding because I think that there was so many people that were a huge part of my life. you know like so many people are the byproducts of who i am today and so i invited everyone in my life i think there was 300 people at my wedding um looking back at that i probably would have shrunk it a little bit but yeah i think everyone just wanted it to be a particular way because they wanted it to be like their wedding and i think you know that rehearsal dinner was terrifying it was nothing went to plan nothing went to plan at the rehearsal dinner or the rehearsal in general and the minute the wedding actually happened it was perfect it was perfection it was i could not have dreamed of a better wedding and it was it was amazing it was so cool to be able to i mean even like my vows i i don't think i'll ever write a piece of work better than those and you sing no okay i i didn't want to work on my wedding and i with the vows i also just wanted to make sure that i said everything i wanted to you know and i think that's the biggest regret in my life as i never got to say the things i wanted to in the time that i had and the wedding was something for me where I thought that would be the perfect time to say everything I've ever wanted to to her.

1:17:16And so I spent, you know, the better half of that night prior, just perfecting those vows. And I remember before I even went out, I read it over again and I was like, do I want to do a grammar change? Would it like, it was so funny. And I, it just, it came from the heart and it was so special. Yeah. That's, that's beautiful. Yeah. I'm a big, I'm a sucker for love and I've officiated few weddings and um whenever i'm officiating a wedding my my voice in my head is don't cry don't cry don't cry because i love love so much that i can just like fully break down and i'm like tearing over like you know the bride walking down the aisle and then look at the husband's husband-to-be's eyes and the groom's eyes and it's just yeah it's it's a magical moment and vows are probably my favorite part oh that's the part where i really have to hold it together and it's it's um yeah wedding weddings are a beautiful thing i remember i broke down saying my own vows to my wife when I gave my speech.

1:18:09And it was just like, she was laughing. She was cracking up, which is so indicative of our relationship. Right. Yeah. What are the parts of your, what are the parts of your, I find this, and I'm intrigued to hear what you say about this. You said that you learned from your mom who you didn't want to be. Yeah. What are the parts of your mom that you sometimes see in yourself when you're dealing with COVID or anyone? I'm stubborn. I'm really stubborn, man. I mean, oh, that's difficult. I think I spent so much time arguing with my mom that I just became so argumentative, you know? And I think that's like my biggest thing and my biggest struggle is I think I just want to win every argument now, you know?

1:18:55Growing up with my mom, my entire relationship with her was trying to prove that she had a problem and trying to spin my words a certain way to articulate to her that she had a problem. You know, if I said it one way, she would tell me that she didn't have a problem and shut it down. So every time I had that, I had to articulate it a different way, try to give her a perspective, big metaphor guy, because I always tried to correlate to someone who's, I always wondered how someone's brain worked that they couldn't admit that they had a problem or couldn't understand that if you're getting drunk at 5am and driving your kids drunk to school, right?

1:19:25So I'd find different ways to try and communicate with that, with her. So I always thought it was a communication error and it was never that. And that was my problem is it was never a communication error. It was not wanting to admit you had a problem, but you knowing it did. So for me, you know, now that I'm, that's a better half of my entire life. You know, I catch myself arguing with my wife, trying to win opposed to trying to understand where they're coming from. You know, it's like you hear something and that's the biggest thing is the last two years of my life have been me just trying to put myself in other people's shoes because that's the one thing I carried away from it was whenever someone would argue with me I didn't care about how they felt I cared about winning the argument and I had to take a step back and I think once I started music especially and just really writing records it really kind of changed who I am now and I've been able to really emotionally be present in a lot of things and understand that you know how someone feels is important you know and i i know that and after i remember after every argument i'd be like wow i'm a piece of shit i didn't like i obviously care i obviously care but during that moment it just it was instinct of just to be combative and so i remember it would be an hour-long conversation just for it to end with i'm sorry like that's not i can relate that i'm with you i can relate you know and so it's just that's been definitely one of the things I've carried from my mom.

1:20:51It's just truly like, you know, that relationship where there was just so that, you know. What are the cycles you and Kova want to break for your kids? I know you said the goal is to become a dad and... The cycles, I think, wow, I don't know. I think more about how I'm terrified to be a parent because I don't want to do it wrong, you know, especially with the way I grew up. I grew up without a dad. How am I supposed to understand what that's like if I never had it, you know? And so what I've really thought about is just the fact that I'm, I want to be a girl dad so bad. Like, I don't know what it is.

1:21:23I just think I would thrive with a girl. And I think the biggest thing is, you know, the only thing you can do, right, is love them unconditionally and try your best to raise them. You know, there is no right way. There is no proper thing. It's just going to be me trying to be the best father I can be. I think with things that we're trying to break, I'm not sure. I haven't given that much thought. I haven't necessarily thought about what that might look like yet, you know, which is going to be an interesting conversation or at least interesting thought process when I go into it. Yeah, definitely.

1:21:58I'm excited to see what you both come out with. I feel like there's, you have so many great reflections and pinpoints and like almost, you know. I've really battled with not, when she gets pregnant, I don't want to tell anyone. I don't want to post about it. I don't want to, that's been the one thing I really, everything in my life is private or is not private. Granted, I tell you everything. And I love that aspect of my life. And I think I battle, the one thing I battle with is I'm so insecure now. I'm so, I have the worst imposter syndrome. I care about what everyone thinks about me. Really?

1:22:31I care so much. If I have a thousand comments and one of them is someone saying I suck, I walk around all day asking people if I suck. Wait, but this person said I suck. Like, do I actually suck? Like, wait, was this fine? Was I off here? And like, I, I could never put my kid through that unless they wanted to, but I wouldn't, I don't know if I could ever, do you know how distraught I'd be if I decided to share a photo with my kid and someone's like, that kid's ugly. Are you kidding? I'm not going to put them through that. I'm going to put myself through that knowing my genes. No, but I don't know.

1:23:06But my wife is like, she loves talking about the things. She loves like posting about stuff. So it's definitely been a thing where like, that's been a huge conversation is posting about that. And I don't think, I don't think I will. Has that been the, because you know, when you look at your life and you think you've been through so much hardship. Yeah. And it's fascinating that a comment saying you suck still hurts. It just shows us as humans, we're all wired so similarly. It's like, it doesn't matter that you've dealt with way harder things in your life. Yeah. Having a doubt, having a doubt, like having you said with a one out of thousand comment that says you suck, it still hurts because we all don't want to be hated on.

1:23:39And like, has that been the hardest thing about this rise and the music getting so much love and affection, of course, across the world comes with it naturally proportionately comes, you know, people who don't like it or whatever it may be. Yeah. Has that been the hardest thing about it? Yeah, I think so. I think, again, like I said, like the music I make is so real to me about my personal life. It's hard not to take it personal. So many people are like, oh, it's art. Don't take it personal. They're judging your art. They're not judging you. And it's my art is me, you know? When you're writing one more I love you.

1:24:11Yeah, like that was, you know, I'm not thinking about the song and how you don't like it. I'm thinking about the fact that there's a 15-year-old kid who wrote that in his bedroom, trying to get over loss, you know? And that's the hardest part for it. And I also think it's like, you know, I think it's probably my mom's voice. When I look for that comment, I'm looking for my mom in some random way. If I had a therapist, I bet she would say that. But yeah, it's just been like one of those situations in my life, especially I've just really kind of, it's the hardest thing, dude. I am the most insecure mother f***er you ever meet, which most of us are.

1:24:40What I've learned is most people in this industry are the most insecure people where you think they have it all together and everything's being held together by tape and nails. What are you insecure about? Everything. I am everything. I think it's so easy for me to say all these different things because it's true and I believe it. But at the same time, I look in the mirror and I, you know, not even the way I look. look, I just wish I, these songs are so true. These songs are so real. And I want them to be perfect every time. And that's not humanly possible. I want, I want, I've worked so hard and I just want people to think I'm good enough, you know, because like, I think that'll convince me I'm good enough.

1:25:24And so when I see comments that, you know, are hateful, I think that's the truth. And I think everyone who's being nice is just gaslighting me, which is a perception thing that I need to work on. Yeah. do you feel enough today yeah i had a really good show last night and you know i like it's funny it fluctuates but like i don't know i've been feeling the love recently i think the hardest part about being nominated for the grammys and all these different things is it opens people up who do not like you to fully just shit on you and that's been the one thing i've really had to like critics or online everyone i think like you know more now than ever it's percept like i think because I'm a Christian who writes songs about my wife, people think they know who I am or they assume I'm some thing, you know, whether it's political or what they think that I believe in this.

1:26:11And like, I've seen the most outlandish things said about me on the internet. And it's the biggest things like, I just don't comment on it because it's like those people, I'm not going to change their mind. You know, if you think I'm some racist or whatever this thing, because you think, because I'm a Christian. I think that's the craziest thing in the world, you know? And my faith is, is, has to do with, you know, with my parents passing away and, and who I am today, you know? And it's just been, it's been such a struggle to kind of watch people say things about me that is not true, you know?

1:26:42And all of a sudden I just have to be okay with it and not say anything because that's the right play. You know, you, you, you fight for yourself. These, these people aren't going to believe you, you know, they're just gonna be like, oh, you're just saying that because you sold your soul. And it's like, what? what? Yeah, I came up with a rule a few years ago that really helped me process stuff. I was like, the closer you get to the top 1 % or whatever industry you're in, the more likely it is that 50 % of people disagree with you. Yeah. And that math helped it make sense because I remember when my comment section was just like the nicest place on earth.

1:27:18Yeah. Like when it was cute and cozy and everything else. And then you just realize, you're like, okay, scale means disagreement. It means disconnection. It means debate, whatever it means. And you realize that it's not a reflection of you, me, or anyone else. It's normally just a reflection of too many opinions. And one thing that's really helped me a lot is recognizing that hate is loud and love is usually soft and quiet. And that hate is so aggressive and direct, but love is so indirect and subtle in how we share it. Yeah. And I've tried really hard over the last couple of years to take. So before I used to be indifferent to both.

1:28:02And what's really helped me recently is to be as gracious in receiving love as I was serious about reading hate. So when I used to read the hateful comments, you read them and you take them seriously. I get that feeling. You read one bad comment, you're like, I must suck. And you're checking with everyone. So you're taking it so seriously. So if I'm going to take it that seriously, I need to take the love as graciously as I took that. And so now if someone says to me, Jay, I listened to this episode with, which I'm sure people were with Alex and like, I couldn't believe Alex was, you know, it's like, I would try and take that in far more graciously and presently than I ever would.

1:28:41Because I recognize that I have to rewire my brain, not to only listen to the good stuff or only think positive, that's not the goal, but to truly let my heart and soul feel the impact because I definitely let my heart and soul feel the impact of someone, you know, trying to hurt me. A hundred and ten percent. It's such a strange thing to like, I think that was the one part that was really hard for me to turn off was the fact that I want to defend myself every second. You know, I see so many things about me on the internet that are not true. And everyone just assumes these things because of who I am or how I'm perceived on the internet.

1:29:12And so it's just like a weird thing of just like, you want to bet so badly to be like, no, no, I'm not like that. Look, like I'm this. And it's like, it doesn't matter. Like people are going to believe whatever the hell they want to believe anyway. But that's the hardest thing is shutting the f*** up. Yeah. Yeah. I remember once I said, I wish I could sit down one-on-one with every single person. Yes. Who doesn't understand me. If I could just hold their hands for a moment and look in their eyes and explain my intention and what I was going through and what I was struggling, you know, whatever it may be.

1:29:40And I know I can't do that physically. So, you know. It's crazy. Yeah. But I get, yeah. I hope one day, I hope one day that some people just realize my intentions. my intention is just to make music that can help people everything past that it doesn't matter like i think that's the problem is like everyone looks at these things so much and they view it as arbitrary and they just want to hate on things that they may not like and i think if you give everything a chance like i there's so much music that i may not like love right but i respect the fact that they're trying i think that's the biggest thing in life right now it's like there's so many popular musicians right now where their fandoms are like oh galix because this this this and it's like, dude, do you not realize all of us are friends behind the scene?

1:30:21All of us are rooting each other on, you know? And like, that's the one thing is like, I feel like you're, it's just such a strange, and obviously it's the job. It's so the job, but coming from being a fan to then doing it, it's the craziest thing. It's the craziest thing being in it and like understanding it and being like, wow, like I understand why people don't say anything. It sucks that you can't, you know? Yeah. And it's so hard because we're also living in a time where I think everyone's like, let's be sensitive about each other's mental health and let's really be thoughtful about how we make people feel.

1:30:54And then over nothing, like just over almost like a, it's almost like treating music and art like a sports team, you know? But Alex, it's been such a joy talking to you. And I've truly hoped this at the beginning of getting to know you better and getting to know you more. I've loved every moment of your openness, your vulnerability. And I really appreciate just how, truly transparent you're willing to be in order to help people and help people understand your music better. And I think that's why your music has resonated so strongly and deeply with me and billions of people around the world, because I believe that everything you shared today is exactly what we're hearing and feeling in your music.

1:31:36And I felt this as deeply as we do the chords and the singing and all the work that comes through with you. So thank you so much. Thank you. I don't feel like you realize how much I needed this, obviously. This was really, really important for me. Well, that means a lot to me. We end every episode of On Purpose with a final five. These questions have to be answered in one sentence each. Cool. So Alex Warren, these are your final five. Okay. The first question is, and we ask this to every guest. The first question is, what is the best advice you've ever heard or received? I've actually never received any advice I think I've used, but I would say the best advice would be, wait, I forgot, this is one sentence.

1:32:15No, no, that's fine. That's fine. You can do that. I'm going to let you do that anyway. Everything happens for a reason. Everything happens for a reason. Whatever happens in your life, run with it. Okay. Second question. What is the worst advice you've ever heard or received? Give up. Who said that to you? My mom. How many times? Too many. To the point where I stopped believing it. So that was definitely the thing. And I think it fueled me to even keep going more. So sometimes it's great when someone repeats bad advice because you get desensitized from it is what I'm taking away from your brain and how it works.

1:32:49I want to scan your brain one day. Me too. Yeah, we should do that. That would be so interesting. Yeah, I would love to do that. All the colors? Yeah, yeah. I have a lot of neuroscientists on the show, so we'll have to figure that out. That'd be really special to do. We'll arrange that. Question number three, I'd love for you to leave a video for your kids here on the podcast. Really? Yeah, that would make my day. All right, cool. Which camera do I look in? That one, yeah. All right. Hey, kids, it's your dad. I'm sitting here right now with probably your uncle at this point or I don't know he's around a lot and I don't know if he's eating out of our fridge or what he's doing but I just want you to know that I love you so much and I pretty much talked about you this entire podcast and if you want to learn more about me watch it I love that that's beautiful thank you thank you for letting me do that I do that all the time I love that you do it all the time you're inspiring me to want to do it Like I'm going to start doing it because of you.

1:33:44It's the best. And I got it from my dad. And I think it's the most special thing, especially when they're born. I'm going to have a camera everywhere. So they know that like, so they just have that moments. You're so young, but did you watch that show, How I Met Your Mother? Yes. Yeah. It's like that to me is just, you know, I love that show and I never thought of it. So you inspired it. I love it. Question number four. If you could talk to your father today, what would you say to him?

1:34:12Am I everything you wanted me to be?

1:34:17I care more about what my dad thinks than anything. So as I live life, and I think you asked me this so many times today, and I didn't have an answer. And as I'm saying this, I think I know it, is you ask why I have this outlook on life and how I do based on the things I've gone through. I think it's really easy to when you have a person or you believe someone's looking down at you. and I like to think that my dad's proud of me. And so that's the thing is, you know, everything I do, I try to be moral and I try to do the right thing because I truly believe that my dad is watching. I hope one day we get to see those videos in some capacity.

1:34:59I would show you anytime. Yeah, that's it. I can't, if he was able to infuse that much morality, love, kindness, empathy. You'd love them. I know just after this conversation, You would love those videos. Really special. Yeah, genuinely so powerful. Fifth and final question. We ask this to every guest who's ever been on the show. Alex, if you could create one law that everyone in the world had to follow, what would it be? Be nice to your neighbor. Treat your neighbor the way you want to be treated. I think that's one we've lost so much is everyone now more than ever needs it. Where we are today, there's so much hate and there's so much judgment.

1:35:34And that's now more than ever, I just think that everyone needs to be treated the way that they would like to be treated. Alex Warren, I'm so excited to see you at the Grammys. I'm excited to see you. I'm going to be there. I'm really looking forward to seeing you, you know, hopefully win, putting it out there, manifesting right now. It would be wonderful to be there and see you get that award that you so deeply deserve. I can't wait to watch Leon Thomas win it.

1:36:03I appreciate you. Thank you so much. I mean it, I mean it. Alex, such a pleasure, truly. Thank you. Thank you. You're awesome, man. Dude. Such a great guy. That was so needed. If you love this episode, you'll really enjoy my episode with Selena Gomez on befriending your inner critic and how to speak to yourself with more compassion. My fears are only going to continue to show me what I'm capable of. The more that I face my fears, the more that I feel I'm gaining strength, I'm gaining wisdom, and I just want to keep doing that. This episode of On Purpose is brought to you by Chase Sapphire Reserve.

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