The War Sold On Lies

33:41So it's all stuff that's good for you, that supports sleep maintenance, that's going to make you feel better. It's not going to leave you groggy. You're not putting anything you don't want to into your system. And because these are pouches, it's the easiest thing in the world to use. You just place a pouch in your mouth before bed, and you'll be ready to sleep within 10 to 20 minutes. So just like their other pouches, they're guilt-free, they're tobacco-free, they're nicotine-free. It's just good stuff, and these ones are going to help you sleep. The Ultra Sleep Pouches deliver better, deeper sleep with properly dosed and natural ingredients, and new customers can use the promo code PROBLEM to get 15 % off at TakeUltra.com.

34:19That's TakeUltra.com, promo code PROBLEM for 15 % off. All right, let's get back into the show. Well, let's see. Let's go to the first clip. Pretty good. I mean, things are looking pretty good. I mean, the decapitation of the malocracy, if not the removal of the regime happening within hours of the wars beginning is almost unprecedented, I think, in the history of warfare and sets this on a very new kind of course. Obviously, reaching the guy in the bunker is what you do systematically after years of fighting. Hitler's in the bunker in 45, not in 39 or 41. And so who knows what the knock-on effects of that are going to be and the systematic ability, given the apparently amazing intelligence penetration, that we not only know where he was and where those leaders were on Saturday morning, but that we also know who's in the secondary tertiary levels of the leadership to eliminate them as well.

35:47and cut off their control, command, and communications capabilities so that they can't really systematically respond. You know, say it appears what they're doing is kind of spraying missiles around the Gulf and toward Israel, but there doesn't seem to be much rhyme or reason to it, And that's seems to be the result of the ability to make it impossible for them to make a plan and stick to it. So, you know, it's just just already or if you just if you just pause it here for a second, just already, man, they just like like again, just compare that to like what we were saying when the war first launched.

36:34And think about what's aged better, where he's come all the way around to what our position originally was. Well, he was this dumb to think that this was an indication that we had charted some new course. It wasn't a new course. Spoiler. It was the exact same course. And yeah, I'm sorry. Go ahead, Rob. Well, actually, what he's speaking to here is making negotiations tougher because you took out the head of the leadership and then you had diverging factions that you have to try and meet with. And the fact that they didn't actually need to have one cohesive government because they could give instructions to different people and just take the straight.

37:10So it's just kind of showcasing. This is him at the beginning of the war going, Hey, we're off to a great trajectory here. And overlooking, you know, the closing of the straights or any of the other risk factors and making it harder to get a deal when you took out the probably most moderate person to actually negotiate with about whether or not I ran should have nukes. Speaker 3 0 0 0 0 Yeah. And even like when he goes, look, man, like Hitler didn't get taken out in 1939 at the beginning of the war rob hitler got taken out in 1945 after the bloodiest war in human history and this didn't take nothing like that you know it's like well yeah it's almost like the enemy was nothing comparable like right there's there's another way to look at this like um but yeah uh yeah but just the the entire tone of it like no and no um if you notice with these guys with all of the neocons like dude even if you uh even if you're pro-war even if you're for a war you know you launch a war you don't have any kind of like you know there's no feeling of the weight of the risk of man this is the you never want to do this but you have to and there's always this huge risk of human suffering and but and uh you know there's probably this this might have been within hours of like 170 little girls getting blown up or little kids whatever maybe now they said it wasn't just a girl's school whatever but all these these little kids dying it's like that's happening as you're sitting here going looks good to me and and what's his comment it is this iranian response man it looks really disorganized looks like they really can't touch too much around here yeah that aged well oh shit we ran out of missiles firing them at all of their missiles okay um i believe that this this is from five months ago so it's either from uh march or april because uh youtube didn't give me oh it's from march 2nd 2026 um and now we're going to jump ahead because he's so sure that this war is going to work out even talks about how this is going to um spook china and we're going to be thwarting china with the success that we're having in the iran war so uh natalie we're going to jump ahead to the second time stamp in this video don i'm five years older than you so i make many more mistakes than you do jesus i want to zoom out to what habib reddig gore did today in his ask of eve anything podcast which is look at the great game the grand strategy so there's a chessboard over here at the middle east it's been turned over and we'll see what happens but over here there's china the united States, Russia, and Israel.

39:50And it looks like China is the big loser this week. What do you think of that? I think that's true. And oddly enough, you see this weird, the world of people who are resistant to the idea of this war saying, we're somehow being distracted from China, or we are, you know, we're playing into their hands because we're getting tied up in Iran. China and Iran are very closely allied when Operation Midnight Hammer destroyed not only the nuclear program or most of the nuclear program, but the ballistic missile capabilities of Iran in the summer. Where did Iran turn to start rebuilding, which it chose to do.

40:34It didn't have to do, right? It turned to Iran to get more equipment to start reconstituting its ballistic missile threat. So taking out Iran not only takes out a customer for China, but it restricts China's projection of its own power beyond its borders to an ally in the Middle East. All right, let's pause it. Let's pause it there for a second, because I'd have to pose a question to John Putthard, who obviously is much smarter than any of us. I mean, he's a professional. We're just a couple of comics. Right. But I'd pose a question to him. You should be like, well, if if winning this war and taking out Iran, as you say, would have degraded China, then what is losing the war and transitioning China into a global power do?

41:25I mean, look, at this point, he would have to admit, right, that losing the war didn't hurt China, right? That that hurt America right now that he says we lost. so again rob like also apply your whole thing to geopolitics i guess you can't do that either i mean i don't know what to say you're sitting here going look at how clear cut is this he goes the detractors of the war are saying this will degrade us and and help china but i'm saying no they're wrong this will eliminate iran and degrade china now you're saying we lost okay so you were wrong again. And the critics of the war were right. Like, I don't know.

42:09You have to rub the thing that's infuriating about it. Right. The thing before that guy is that that's the conclusion, not, Oh, we didn't want this. We wanted the war, but with winning, like, no, the conclusion is you shouldn't have fought the thing. Cause you couldn't win it. All right. So now let's jump to the next clip where he more directly makes the pitch for that we're winning. And this is from April. and we got two clips where he pitches the fact that we're winning. It's a very important and interesting piece that obviously reflects the reality on the ground, which is the United States has, is, and will likely secure what is an astounding military victory over the regime in Iran that the regime in Iran simply will not acknowledge as a profound victory over it?

43:02And what does that mean, really? Does it matter whether they do? Does it matter whether they say we lost? Will we know that we won if they refuse to say that they lost? And I think actually the events of this week and a lot of things that have happened this week are increasingly making it clear that we are on the path to victory without question, but not a victory that is going to be universally acknowledged as such. We have on the side, which is what we should get to first, seemingly on the side. He just paused seemingly having been. So this is from April 17th. Does this sound like he was against this war?

43:46I mean, dude, this wasn't the war that he wanted. It is crazy, right, dude, that like, let's just say, I mean, honestly, like, I want to try to run this thought experiment for a second here. I want you to try to imagine that I'm going to come on the podcast right now and I'm going to say we won the war. Like, let's say this is the conclusion of the war and I'm going to go, wow, that worked out well. We won. That worked out well. I'm glad we did that. Like, let's just say that was my take on the show and I'm not going to acknowledge that I was wrong. I'm just going to come on the show say that worked out great was a great decision glad we did it we won and we're going to move on and I'm not going to like I don't know I just I don't know I cannot wrap my head around this and likewise Rob and I had not seen this until literally this moment you I mean I saw you had sent the list of here's let's look at their stuff but I had not seen this clip he literally was just saying that it's a it's clear we're on the path to victory and now he's saying we lost and he's not there's not an in-between part there where he goes I got it wrong you know like even when he was talking about I mean there's like implicit that like well it's because we didn't know that the stockpiles were low but regardless even it's if it's because of something you didn't know then that means you got it wrong because it's something you didn't know you're sitting here once again sitting here and and again as i've said many times this war it was just another it was another neocon classic it's it's just like a neocon war it had all the earmarks you know it was sold the same way it was conducted the same way the only difference is it was hypercharged it's been super fast it fell apart quicker than than most of them did but in the same way they always like even watching this through the whole thing they just bullshit you man until it's too beyond the point where no one can see anything except like catastrophe.

45:44And it cannot be, you know, you can't be the citizenry can't be gaslit anymore about what's going on. But up until that point, dude, the Afghan army that we're training up is awesome, man. They're going to hold down that country. No problem. No problem for years to come. This will be, you know, it's just the whole time. And now let's, let's jump ahead to the next timestamp so we can cover all this but this is where he says we're minutes away from victory and the blockade is working and that's the uh second time stamp on the sheet picture about whether or not whether or not trump is engaged in some kind of a weird gavotte with iran over over the strait that involves pakistan and china Okay, you know this way better than I do.

46:36It looks to me like the closure of the strait that is really the opening of the strait, that we call the blockade of the strait, that isn't the blockade of the strait, is working. has worked for the last 48 hours in the sense that the Iranians are getting nothing out, but other traffic is moving through the strait. So explain to me, if you can, why Trump wouldn't look at that and say, or I think Abe is actually asking that question also. They're on the ropes. Like we're, we're, we're, we're like, we're, we're, we're minutes away from crushing their hopes and dreams and leaving them a tattered husk of a, of a fourth rate power that can't even close the straight of hormones.

47:33I love the optimism. You can stop it there, but I just almost even one second. Cause I I'm sorry. Yeah. Yeah. You can stop it there. It's fine. I'm sorry. But there's something about I want to hear what that guy says in response, because he went, hey, you're more of the expert in this than I am. But like I could so easily have just answered those questions just from paying attention and happy. I know exactly where he is now. He's in the time period right after the blockade of the blockade. He's saying, oh, look, he's going, look, Iran's not getting anything out and ships are getting through. Why isn't Donald Trump looking at this and saying, hey, we're crushing them.

48:07They don't have time. And it's like the obvious reason we knew this at the time is because, yes, ships were getting through in the Vegas sense of the term. But the number of ships getting through actually bottomed down to their lowest. So at first, even in the first Iran immediately, you know, close the Strait of Hormuz, meaning they were demanding permission and fees for people to enter. OK, but the people who were getting permission and fees were still able to come through. So a certain amount of oil is still getting through. I forget the exact numbers, but there was really good reporting on this.

48:41In the Wall Street Journal, DropSite was all over this. So there was a certain amount getting through with Iranian permission. So it was down from the amount of oil that usually gets through the Strait of Hormuz, but a certain amount was still getting through. Then the U.S. came in and blockaded the blockade. And so they said, none of those ships are getting through with just Iranian permission. You can only get through with U.S. permission. and that number that was getting through nosedived. It was the lowest number going through the entire time was when we put the blockade of the blockade. So number one, it wasn't an opening.

49:13It didn't solve the problem. It actually squeezed the problem worse, which was the global economy. And number two, why didn't Donald Trump, it was blockading a lot of Iranian ships from getting out now, but why didn't Donald Trump think, well, ha ha, I'm blockading your ships. You're about to collapse. You can't outlast us. Well, because all of the intelligence said that they could. We were covering this at the time on the show, Rob, like the actual reports from the Pentagon said they could survive it. And guess what, Rob? We now know that is the case. We ran the experiment. The reason why Donald Trump wasn't thinking that, as we were saying at the time, was because that wasn't the case.

49:48They weren't about to collapse. But I'm sorry, you say what you want to say, but I do want to hear what this expert at the time said because he really should know. And the first thing he did say was, well, that's optimistic. well which is the detail the detail i'm picking up on and you can correct me if i'm wrong here uh but i believe we blockaded the straits while we were negotiating with them the first time that we are uh that this predates the mou and you would think if you were against this war because uh we didn't have the proper stockpiles for this war you would criticize donald trump for escalating the warfare environment and you would go well donald trump just blocked the straits but i know that this is a mistake because their missile capabilities are not reduced as much as what's being reported.

50:30And I've looked at the numbers of how many interceptors we've used. And so actually, I think we need to be stopping this war because we don't have the supplies to win the war, but he's not saying that is he? No, he's not. No, look, Rob, they're not even claiming that we knew that we didn't have the supplies. They're going, we were for the war, but we wouldn't have been for the war. Had we known this and somehow it's not our responsibility that we didn't know or something like that. But as you sit here and you listen to what they were saying throughout the whole war, it is just, this is why I said this whole thing.

51:02And look, Rob, the reason we're even doing this as a show, nobody really cares about John Podhoretz, but there is something just truly remarkable about all of this. It's remarkable that anyone is capable of this level of like cognitive dissonance or compartmentalization or something like that, but where you could just be getting it so wrong up to supporting a war and then every step of it through the whole thing, getting it wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, come to the conclusion that obviously it was all wrong and not have any, I don't know, even any type of process. I mean, my gosh, Rob, Like this war has been at the center of a massive political fight.

51:53You know, he's calling the people who oppose it evil. You know, I mean, he's like, and you got the whole thing wrong. And man, that doesn't give you any pause. It's something these people really are. And I'm not even saying like in his personal life, I don't know who John Podharts is. I've heard some stories that are disturbing. but you're like, it's amazing. Like this is sociopathic to be this type of political commentator. It's like, I don't know. It's something to say. All right, guys, let's take a moment and thank our sponsor for today's show, which is CrowdHealth. I love this company and we've been promoting them for many years.

52:34You gotta check out CrowdHealth. It is the alternative to the broken health insurance system. And now they're introducing the Black Swan membership, the healthcare alternative for those who want autonomy over their care, their costs, and their lifestyles. For just$75 a month, you get a team of expert bill negotiators, access to low-cost prescriptions and lab testing, and a curated database of high-quality, low-cost doctors vetted by CrowdHealth. There's no insurance middleman and no networks dictating your care. It's you in the driver's seat. And what many of you are wondering is what happens if there's a major black swan event?

53:13Well, you cover the first$15 ,000 and the crowd steps up to help fund the rest. It's like the freedom we used to have before Obamacare turned healthcare into a bureaucratic nightmare. So get your healthcare on your terms. Use the promo code POTP at joincrowdhealth.com and you'll get your first three months for less than$80. CrowdHealth is not insurance. Opt out. Take your power back. This is how we win. Visit join crowd health dot com and use the promo code P O T P today. All right. Let's get back into the show. What do you think, Rob? Is there what should we go to? I mean, if you want to watch the response, we can.

53:51Oh, yeah, that's right. I wanted to watch this guy's here. Let's see. Let's see if this guy even gave him a little bit of something on that podcast. I love the optimism and it's probably actually not really a bad frame for this at all. I think Trump is trying to get out. And he wants to get out clean, right? And he's concerned about the regime fighting back and deciding that it wants to draw in American troops and American vessels. Wow, so he just, okay, so you just post that. I mean, it's just, again, you can post it there. It's just these hacks who they bring on. This is the expert that they have.

54:32You have more expertise than you do in me. Just, I mean, basic keeping up with what was going on. This was easy to see. He didn't point out any of the things. I love your optimism. And yeah, that's not a bad framework. Sure. We're crushing them. The straight is opened by our blockade. Okay. And then this is the last one from put our, it's, and then we're going to jump to the other guy and we've got even more damning stuff from him. But this is an article from February 28th, 2026. The title is first thoughts on the new Iran war. And I think the last two paragraphs are what's worth reading.

55:06Okay. Okay, so let's see these two paragraphs here. Okay, but regime change, war or not, I think my questions now have pretty clear answers. The six-week campaign of diplomatic dithering following the Iranian slaughter were in fact simply temporizing. We got our ducks in a row and presumably gave Israel time to help us locate the necessary targets inside Iran to strike the bad guys while leaving the general population largely unmolested. Today, February 28th, 2026, may be the most important day of the 21st century so far. May God bless our fighting force as they place themselves in harm's way to protect, defend, and save the West.

55:50And may we triumph over this remorseless, conscious-less, and evil enemy that has been at war with the great Satan for nearly half a century. Yeah. Truly against this war. Sounds like a man who, who knew we were going to lose. Yeah, it is something, man. You could cheerlead a goddamn war, have it be a disaster and not even feel like, I mean, we did not get a my bad. You don't even get that. And now let's let's move to Abe Greenwald and you know what, let's start with the tweet before the video. This is the co-host in the, in the video. There's Abe Greenwald. And when you see this, when you see this quote, oh my God.

56:44Oh, one second. We'll have it up. It is. All right. I'm bracing myself. How neocon delusiony are we talking here? I'd give this an 11. Okay. Wow. An 11. Ooh. Okay. Yeah. If, okay. This is a tweet from Abe Greenwald. Let me see the date here. April 7th. Okay. All right. If the U.S. were to walk away from this war at this very instant, it would still be the greatest American victory we've seen in decades. If we go further, there's no telling the extent of our triumph. I'm merely thankful for the obvious success that's been achieved thus far. Anything else is gravy. Jesus Christ, Abe. Yeah, dude.

57:33Oh, so this is the guy who starts by saying, oh, and people say the neocons wanted the war. No, no, this isn't the war we wanted. You motherfucking liar. Dude, the ability of neocons to lie you into war. What is it about you people with lying and war? Did no one ever tell you that they're both bad? Jesus, that's unbelievable. Oh, absolutely. This is the war you wanted in the war you got. You already said it's a victory. Anything else is gravy. Okay. So you didn't get the gravy. Where's that victory you were talking about? Oh, Jesus Christ. I mean, that is, wow. That is damning Rob. Okay. So he straight out said that it had already been won, that he had already been proven right.

58:23And now he's got to say, I mean, and, and even think about it, right? Just how childish. And he says even there that the victory is obvious. You know what I mean? At the very least, if you were just not such a liar, you'd go, the victory may not be obvious, but here's what you know what I mean? He's like, oh, it's obvious. Yeah, it's totally obvious, dude. Some kids died and hundreds of billions of dollars was squandered and were in the exact same place with Iran having more control. what wow rob what can you say about that dude and uh i got one you were right 11. yeah and then i got one last clip from uh abe greenwald which is uh along the same lines and theme i mean is any of this going to happen probably not um but that's what the iranians are saying this seems like oh if you thought from a neoconservative uh perspective that the iraq war was a very difficult thing to argue against to sort of propagate your ideas about foreign policy.

59:29Trump looks like he's in a place to make it even worse by saying, well, we got kind of nothing out of this. The regime stays in place. You know, if, like, if we say, okay, we're going to keep the straits open, but under these very onerous conditions, like, what do we win from this beyond the very short-term thing that people don't think about, by the way, of the degradation of missiles, of killing how many members of the RGC, those are all victories those are all very positive things if you hate the iranian regime but in the long run i don't know is this kind of damaging to god i'm sorry just pause it for a second i'm sorry i shouldn't say it about him but the we the fifth guys are just so painful dude just the way they just sit there and go like oh but you know it's a little some could say that your seventh catastrophic war in a row could perhaps hurt your credibility with the general public who literally might lynch you if you were to walk into a mob of them right now who already hate you so much that they like you better pray anyway i don't know they just sit there hmm do you think maybe that would be inappropriate maybe that could go bad if we launched as well i mean it really is so good that we killed some bad people there if you overlook all the innocent people we killed so okay that's a victory that like what talks about launching the most disgusting fucking Pearl Harbor style sneak attack started war of aggression and choice this way.

1:00:52Like I know they have something where they think like they're being the grownups in the room because we approach everything with like a khaki pants flavor, but it's not. It's just like moral cowardice, whatever. Sorry. Anyway, here we can get to the part you wanted to play. Foreign policy that should be reflected in the kind of neoconservative way? uh i don't think so at all actually uh i mean and you know i should say off the bat one of the things about neoconservatism is that it's it is not a sort of code of of beliefs you know there's always been a great deal of disagreement among neoconservatives it's a it's a kind of an of an impulse her up and you know today it's arguable that there is no such thing as neoconservatism that it's sort of elements in conservatism.

1:01:40But setting all that aside, I think the achievements that the U.S. and Israel have been able to carry out in this unbelievably short period of time speak for themselves. I don't, without a, an anti-war media, an anti-war movement, it's not much of a movement, but a sort of social media mob, no one objectively would look at what has gone on in Iran for six weeks at the hands of the U.S. and Israel and say, oh, this, this, this was a, this was a bad move for the U S and Israel. And this is, this is great for Iran. I mean, you talked about, wait, pause. You mean you right now? Oh, nobody would possibly say that flash forward six months later.

1:02:45Oh man. I would never have agreed to this war. I mean, it's just again, Rob, like I said before, how many times dude, have we watched this happen? Isn't it just, isn't it wacky? How many times dude? Have we watched this happen with different topics, different things? Nobody serious thinks this. Oh, these are just such clowns. Few months later, saying exactly the thing that was obvious at the time. It's like, all you got to do is like have a room temperature IQ, fucking pay attention and tell the truth. I don't know. It's really not that. It's not rocket science, man. But it is. I got to say again, just, you know, I, I like Matt.

1:03:28Like I, I don't know him. I've never known him super well, but I always liked him enough. I always thought he was a nice guy and I don't know the other guy Moynihan well, other than us, like responding to him one time. And I think I'm just being unimpressed with it, but it's just like, there is something about, I just always kind of can't believe those guys where they do this show where they just sit there and just let this neocon bullshit them with the dumbest most insane shit ever and go huh yeah hmm well that's a good point yeah are there the the success is obvious at what point in this thing was the success obvious and this is just so i mean it's so unbelievable that like you know it's like their whole goddamn thing it's like they have like uh they have like three modes okay here's the neoconservative modes.

1:04:17It's like, um, they, some poor third world country over there that doesn't have an air force capable of, you know, touching your continent, doesn't have a Navy capable of blockading their own, you know, country doesn't have, you know, an army that could invade their neighbor is working on weapons of mass destruction. They're a huge threat to the world. That's okay. That's one phase. There's three phases of neocon. Okay. One phase is this, this puny third world country that just happens to be an enemy of Israel located in the middle East happens to be a threat to world conquest. And they're working on weapons of mass destruction, which they never end up being that, that part never ends up being true.

1:05:03That's one phase. Number two is, um, just like permanent mission accomplished, you know, just like the mission an accomplished banner of George W. Bush, but just forever in all of this form that we just watched. And number three is the clip we started with. Well, that was a big fat failure. Not our fault. Moving on. Hey, I think Turkey's the new Iran, you know, whatever the next, whatever the next one is. That's literally it. Those are the phases. It is unbelievable. It really is unbelievable to see people who have a track record like that. Rob final thought to you. Well, and it's fun with AI because you can track it down.

1:05:44Actually, I think you should say as a closing statement, that hilarious Mark Levin tweet that you shared. Oh, oh yeah. Natalie, can you pull this up? I sent it to the group here. Yeah, why not pull it up? Because the visual of it might be fun too. Oh yeah. How about it? It really is just as, you know, as I was saying, these guys are just, there's something. It truly is remarkable to watch this arc. it goes all the way back I've been uh um yeah follow me on social I've been posting some of my old uh COVID jokes that have come very true uh and luckily also with AI it's easier to like clip things up but in my first uh end of year recap I was working on at the time but I was talking about that we need to create like almost baseball style scorecards for people so that you could see how many things they've gotten wrong in the past and uh I wasn't I've tried twice I wasn't able to get it off the ground but it is kind of uh interesting that with AI it is a lot easier to actually, I could not have found these moments a year ago.

1:06:42And it's not that it didn't take me time and I didn't have to read through things, but like I could not have found all these moments. And it's going to be interesting to see if people have to start being more honest moving forward or actually can't get, can't get like away from their terrible track records. Cause when you see it laid out like this, or this Mark Levin tweet that we're about to see these people just don't know really how to contend with the reality in which they have to actually be responsible for what they said a week or even just a few days earlier. Yep. You're making claims with certainty about what's happening or what's going to happen or what policy is wise.

1:07:15And yeah, you should be held responsible. So here, let's pull up the Mark Levin tweet. This is real. Mark Levin, which quote neocons are calling for ground troops in Iran? I heard it mentioned again last evening, and it's thrown around by the woke Reich isolationists. It must be a long list. So let's see it and man if this isn't a great community note mark levin seems to have forgotten he personally called for ground troops in iran and a link to the article yeah and now open the article it's worth just seeing the headline mark levin calls for troops in iran it was the night that donald trump plugged his show it was the night donald trump plugged his show he said what look out for a big Mark Levin show tonight.

1:08:05That night, Mark Levin said we should send troops to Iran. We all thought it was a tactic to try to scare the Iranians to be like, oh, it's a signal he's going to send troops in. Now, Mark Levin, I mean, it's just it's amazing that these guys can get away with this shit. War after war after war. All right. We got to wrap on that. Chicago, come see Rob. And then, of course, Appleton, Wisconsin will be there all weekend. Come on out and then Austin, Texas porch, tour.com comic, Dave Smith.com. Any other dates that I missed of yours, Rob? Now I'll plug next week's gigs next week. There you go. Port store.com comic, Dave Smith.com part of the problem.com catch you next time.

1:08:46Peace.

1:09:00that makes sense