‘DISGUSTING!’ Trump Scolds Rob Reiner + Bondi Beach Terror With Tony Abbott

24:17Piers Morgan:Yeah, someone did a great tweet. This was Dan Perlman on X. He said, Rob Reiner directed the best American rom-com, when I'm hearing about Sally, the best coming-of-age film, Stand By Me, the best fantasy comedy, Princess Bride, the best mockumentary, This Is Spinal Tap, and the best courtroom drama show Down A Few Good Men. He did all that and so much more. So, look, I want to move on, But I do think that that is how Rob Reiner should be remembered and not for Trump derangement syndrome, which I'm sad to say says more about the president for saying that than it does about Rob Reiner. Right, let's move on to what I wanted to start with before this blew up.

24:55Piers Morgan:And that's his appalling terror attack in Sydney on Bondi Beach. Emily, let me start with you on this. It's going to be a scary time to be Jewish right now. You know, let's park to one side and other members of the panel won't want to do this, but let's park the war in Gaza between Israel and Hamas to one side for a moment. There are 15 million Jews in the world and when you see the rising volume of attacks on Jewish people because they're Jewish, this has got to be a scary time and I think that should be recognised. What do you feel? It's a very familiar story when it comes to debt. the banks win, you pay.

25:38Piers Morgan:Fees and phone calls pile up every month unless you fight back. PDS Debt has helped hundreds of thousands of people cut debt and put money back in their pockets. If you're struggling with credit cards, personal loans and medical bills, PDS offers custom options to help you get out of debt fast. They'll go beyond the numbers to understand your unique situation and craft a personalised plan. There's no minimum credit score and they have an A-plus rating with the Better Business Bureau. Don't wait another month, Take back control in 30 seconds. Get your free personalized assessment and the best option for you at pds.com slash peers.

26:14Piers Morgan:That's pdsdeck.com slash peers. pdsdeck.com slash peers. First and foremost, I feel privileged as an American. Maybe call me ignorant, call me naive. I just still feel very safe as a Jew under Trump's administration. I don't have that privilege overseas. I'm very aware of my surroundings when I travel. Australia is a place of no travel for me because of the failure that we witnessed take fold yesterday. I feel like this could have been prevented. I feel that it was warned multiple times by multiple people. They begged the government at that point to do the one job they're supposed to do, which is to protect its citizens.

26:57But, yeah, the rise of anti-Semitism. And you mentioned to park the war in Gaza for a moment. let's park that for this whole conversation, because I don't care what you think of that war. There is no justification. There's no reason for mowing down Jews, gunning down Jews, murdering Jews at all because you don't agree with the war. Because you have to remember, there are people who have the opposing view from you on that war, and the violence is a two-way street. But it seems like the bullets, when it comes to persecution, really only go towards the Jews in this case. And I'd like to see all of the bullets stop as a whole.

27:29But what happened in Australia was so easily preventable. And it's so sad, Pierce, that we cannot even celebrate Hanukkah without spending tens of thousands of dollars on security, because we are scared that there's going to be someone who's likely an immigrant from another country gunning down Jews. The last point I'll make before we open it to the panel is Australia's biggest failure was the mass immigration from countries and the failure to vet them, because I'm not against immigration. I think immigrants contribute a lot to every society. But I just found out that the shooters were previously investigated for ties to ISIS.

28:06How about this? The fact that you needed to prompt the investigation was enough to turn them away as immigrants. But nope, they welcomed them. You saw on October 8th, the protests that they did in Sydney and all over Melbourne, October 8th, Pierce, Israel had not retaliated yet, chanting globalized the Intifada, death to die, whatever they were cheering, it doesn't even matter. They were calling for violence. And anyone who supports that should be a litmus test as to where your country stands in its safety.

28:33Piers Morgan:Okay, Cenk, let me bring you in here. This is complicated by one fact, but it's a salient fact to the whole debate about the narrative that many have, which is that, you know, the creeping Islamification, if you like, of the West has been the major problem here, that there are way too many Muslims living in Western countries with a different culture, that many are prone to violence, and that's what we've seen here. But the guy that saved so many lives, Ahmed Al-Akmed, turned out himself to be a Muslim immigrant from Syria. So by the yardstick of keep them all out, you would also have to keep out the guy who saved many lives and has become not just a national hero in Australia, where he's been a citizen since 2006, I think, but has become a global hero.

29:23Piers Morgan:I mean, several million dollars already been raised in a GoFundMe for him, including people like Bill Ackman, leading Jewish figures in the United States. So this is a complex story, because it's not easily dismissed as the way many would like it to be, which is you've got two obviously radicalised extremists, a father and son, who the father had legally six firearms, was a member of a hunting club. Australia, for those who don't know, had a terrible mass shooting back in the mid-90s in Hobart and Tasmania. 35 people were killed. As a result, they did some of the most draconian new gun laws anywhere in the world, and it had a dramatic effect on reducing gun violence in Australia.

30:12Piers Morgan:They also had nearly a million guns handed back in to the government under a buyback program that was very successful. So this has been a real shock to the system in Australia because they're simply, rather like my country, not used to gun violence. There is 580 times, I know this because Emily asked me about this statistic in relation to guns on X earlier when we were talking about this. I don't think you can ignore the gun part either. And I said, look, the bottom line is, you know, Australia's a population of 27 million, America, 340 million, but the amount of gun violence in America proportionate to Australia is 580 times worse.

30:51Piers Morgan:18 ,000 murders in 2023 in Australia in the same year-long period from June 23 to June 24, 31 gun murders. It's not even... There's no comparison to be made that makes any sense. So my point, I think, Cenk, is if you come from a school of you've got to kick all the Muslims out, then you've got to kick out Ahmed al-Akma when he tries to come in from Syria, yet he's the national hero here. And so it's not as simple as that. There are many good Muslims. There are bad, radicalised Muslims. You can take the same yardstick to every other religion. So this is my problem, and I think Emily and I, we agreed on something you posted earlier.

31:34Piers Morgan:I'm sorry, Cenk, for the rant here, but I do think it was really important. Emily recognised that it's always wrong in these situations to just blame a religion. It's just wrong. Whatever that religion is, you can't blame a billion people for the actions of two ISIS radicalised nutjobs on a beach in Sydney. Over to you, Cenk. Yeah. So there are two different issues here. The issue of violence is the relatively straightforward one. So everyone should condemn the violence. Everyone should condemn violent extremists. So I don't know anyone who hasn't, and they'd be monsters if they didn't. So those poor victims there, the 15 people who were killed and the others that were injured, and everyone who was traumatized by it, they didn't deserve that at all.

32:24They had nothing to do with any government policy. They were just innocent human beings. So now, our position has been very consistent for nonviolence and against killing on both sides. Now, the second issue is propaganda. So when any Muslim extremist, that's two guys out of 1.6 billion people, do it, there is a concerted effort by some, and yes, including Israelis, to say it's all Muslims, it's all Muslims, it's all Muslims. You should hate them. You should kick them out of your countries. They all think this way. And honestly, that kind of propaganda is disgusting. And if we did it to the other side, which we would never, and we said things like, it's all the Jews, all the Jews, that would be horrific, right?

33:12No one would tolerate that. But when the other side does it, and if you don't think they do it, just go on social media. There are thousands, maybe millions of comments. And yes, about three months ago, all of the Israel First pundits started changing, And they literally said there's I tweeted about it. One of their influencers was like, it's hard to get the Americans to like Israel. There really is no reason to like Israel and support Israel. But it is easier to get them to hate Muslims. So we should do a propaganda. Now, she didn't say propaganda, to be fair, but she said we should do a campaign to highlight how much Muslims are bad.

33:46And now when we talk about violence, we ask for the same kind of decency. Can we not kill 70 ,000 people in Gaza, 20 ,000 kids? But the Israelis say, no, we're allowed to kill 20 ,000 kids. And no one should be able to condemn that. But every Muslim on planet Earth have to condemn these lunatics as if these lunatics represent us. There's also lunatics in every religion and every race. and we lock them up because they are violent and we can't stand violence. And by the way, last thing, if you're on the left and you're part of the peace movement, our whole ethos is nonviolence. So if you do violence, you betray us all.

34:30It is immoral. It is unintelligent. It is deeply counterproductive. And it is used by our enemies to further discriminate against Muslims, Arabs, Palestinians, etc. So it is the single worst thing you could do, but mainly, obviously, because of the deep immorality of killing innocent people.

34:48Piers Morgan:Okay. Jillian, you know, let's... I think it's very immoral that you couldn't just take one conversation about a shooting in Australia without comparing it to a war in Gaza. There's a difference between celebrating a religious holiday on the beach and, thank God, Hamas losing a very nasty war in the Middle East. But if you want to start equivocating Middle Eastern violence... Yeah, there is a difference. 70 ,000 more dead. organizations practice. So you celebrate 70 ,000 dead. No, no, I find you deeply immoral. I've always found you immoral because you think that Palestinian Muslim lives don't matter.

35:23You said you said you said every Israeli says it's all the Muslims. Let me just correct one fact for you. Every time an Israeli is killed in Israel, it is at the hands of a Muslim. And nonetheless, I still don't blame the entire religion as a whole. But that's just the fact of the matter in Israel. So for once in your life, if you could just focus on the victims without equivocating, jealous of what exactly? Jealous of what? We all have our problems. But for five minutes of your life, you're so generous for not hating every single Muslim. You just are in favor of murdering 70 ,000 in Gaza and stealing their land.

35:58All right, let me bring it. All a spade a spade. You don't have to compare everything to the war in Gaza. It's very different. Do you mourn the 20 ,000 dead kids? Simple question. Simple question. Do you mourn the dead 20 ,000 A child that dies is a disaster. So why are you celebrating Israel doing it? 102 miles ago, the oil light came on. 100 miles ago, you noticed. Now, it's time to head to Take 5. This oil change, fall in love with your car all over again. In just 10 minutes, your dream technician will check your tire pressure, top off fluids, change your oil, and verify with Carfax exactly what your car really needs, all while keeping you in the driver's seat.

36:37Take five to stay in your car. Ten minute oil change. Save up to 30 % on your next oil change to take five. $15 value. Valid to participating locations. Terms and conditions apply. I said, I am celebrating Israel. Let me tell you. Israel is brutal terrorist killers. If Israel had lost the war, there would be a genocide of Jewish people as a whole. I'm happy Israel is winning this war. No, no, no. There is no genocide of the Israelis. Not that 20 ,000 kids are dead. There's only a genocide of the Palestinians. Again, it's still Hamas' fault. And you won't condemn it. Condemn the genocide. Are you condemning Israel for murdering 20 ,000 kids?

37:03Hang on, hang on, hang on. Hang on. Hang on. We have three other panelists. No, I'm condemning Hamas for starting the war. Guys, guys, guys. I'm condemning Hamas for starting the war.

37:13Piers Morgan:Guys, I think we can be crystal clear on the genocide point. There's no doubt that Hamas would love to be genocidal. They talk in a genocidal language. I don't think there's much doubt about that. Gillian, let me bring you in here. All right, so we're right into this. He was actually doing a genocide. Actually doing it. Not a theoretical one. Not a hypothetical one. Hamas killed as many Israelis as they could possibly kill on October the 7th in a genocidal rampage. So let's not compare genocide with genocide. I want to bring in Jillian. Israel's civilian kill ratio is worse than Hamas. All right.

37:50They're a bigger terrorist group than Hamas.

37:51Piers Morgan:Let me bring in Jillian, please. Let me bring in Jillian, please. Jillian, you've been waiting very patiently. Thank you. Let's focus back for a moment because there were many, many attacks going on on Jewish people before October the 7th, all right? So let's be clear about that. This has been a rising problem of anti-Semitism across the world, and there are not many Jewish people in the world. There are 1.6 billion Muslims. There are 15 million Jews, right? Let's just put the numbers on the table, okay? And like I said to Emily, it must be a scary time to be a Jewish person right now when even celebrating Hanukkah on a beach in Sydney.

38:34Piers Morgan:I've been to that beach, Bondi Beach. It's one of the most fun, positive, entertaining places to be anywhere in the world. The sun always shines, the families always play. And then suddenly utter carnage with a father and son dressed like paramilitaries, just using shotguns to cold-bloodedly murder a Holocaust survivor, a 10-year-old girl, and so on. So let's just start by calling out how despicable this was on every level, and yet how typical of ISIS and groups like it, the radicalised Islamist extremists who've been doing this for a long time. For the last 20 years they've been doing this stuff.

39:15Piers Morgan:And it's a horrible throwback to that. So, yes, we can talk about the war, and it's not irrelevant, but I do think we need to put this in some perspective, which is these kind of attacks on Jewish people were going on way before the war started. Can I address a few of the things that you said previously? Yeah. I don't think the alarm is about Muslims migrating to America. I think the alarm is about assimilation. I don't think that these two individuals in Bandai represent what I've been told is actually two billion Muslims. But when I talk to people, and I've really been trying to understand and explore this issue, whether it's Gadsat or it's Patrick Bet-David, when I talk to people, they'll tell you, yeah, let's say 90 percent.

40:05And I've looked at Pew Research. I've looked at the Global Terra database. That's a conservative number. 90 % of Muslims are peaceful and lovely and amazing. But if 10 % wants to bring down the West, you're looking at a heck of a lot of people. You're looking at like 200 million people. So what do you do about that? And yes, there are amazing heroes like the man who tried to stop them. But guys, when you look at the fact that there have been 64 ,000 terror attacks since 9-11 that were committed by radical Islam, 243 ,000 people died in those terror attacks. And you're saying all religions. I mean, not really.

40:51Not really. I've started to read the Koran, and there's a duality there, unquestionably. But there's a lot in there about, you know, kill and subjugate the infidels. So, Cenk, you're a good faith actor. Have you ever read the Old Testament? I'm being honest with you. Have you ever read the Old Testament? It's about slaughtering all the other tribes. And in fact, Netanyahu quotes it and says, do like we did to the Amalek's, kill their women and children. There are sick religious fundamentalists, and unfortunately, they're Jewish settlers and the Israeli government. They're the sickest extremists in religion on the whole planet.

41:30And I understand you. I understand Gaza. OK. And I see both sides of that. Absolutely. And you've made great points to me. And I've listened to you and I've changed my position on how I feel that the Israeli government has behaved over there. But what I'm trying to tell you simply is that when people are Islamophobic, as I've explored this, I do think they are. And what I think they're afraid of is an ideology that is not in alignment with the West. And it's not the vast majority of Muslims. But when it's, let's say, 10 percent, it's still a lot of people. These are statistics. Let me bring you.

42:07Hang on. That's an outrageous number. Let me bring you. I have to respond. Q research.

42:13Piers Morgan:Let me bring him a jar hat to respond to that. All right. Ahmadullah Ahmad is a 43-year-old Muslim fruit vendor who, unarmed, decided to bumrush one of the terrorists, disarmed him, took the gun while he was being shot at. He was shot twice. I didn't realize this at first when I saw that amazing video, but then I later saw that he was shot twice. He held off the other shooter, and he saved lives. In Germany, in March, there was a deranged Saudi national who, by the way, became radicalized by AFD and this type of white nationalism and ended up hating Islam. He rammed a truck in a terrorist attack through a crowd.

42:55You know who stopped him? A Pakistani Muslim cab driver in Germany stopped him. When there was an attack on Jews in France a couple of years ago, there was an African black immigrant who protected them. Uh, this is the story of an individual who decided to lean into empathy and decency and compassion and squared off against two individuals who were radicalized. We don't know how, and saw Jews as the target, uh, through their dehumanization. There are 1.7 billion Muslim people on earth. Jillian's talking points are from 2001, which is why I yawned. Uh, the DeLorean right now is in 2025. This is, listen, I've been in this for a long time, Jillian, I know you're discovering this.

43:39Congratulations. I think I've also... Let me just finish. I let you say a lot of hateful, stupid, reckless things about Muslim and Islam. Would you like to say one? Can I just say one? That's 20 million people. Jillian, Jillian, you are... You still have 16 dead, Wajahad. You, by your own admission, are a white nationalist. By your own admission, that's what you are, a white nationalist. You admitted it. I'm a white nationalist. You know I'm Arab, right? I'm Syrian and Lebanese and Turkish. Okay, you're the one who said it. I didn't say it. That's why I was shocked. When did I say I was a white nationalist?

44:12You're not a white nationalist? There was a... Okay, wasn't there a clip that said you were a white nationalist? You're not a white nationalist. No. Okay, interesting. Interesting to know. Where's the clip that I said I was a white nationalist? I'm under the mistaken impression. I thought you were a white nationalist. I'm glad you're not. But let me just finish. Since 2001, Pierce, you and I on this panel... I'm a white nationalist. You and I on this panel, Pierce. How about a little homework, Wajahat? How about just a little? All right, let's do homework. Let's do homework. Since 2001, Pierce, since 2001, you and me, we were against the war on terror.

44:46We said that the war on terror would be disastrous. We said that the war on terror, America's response to 19 foreign hijackers bringing down the two towers would be, would cause immense chaos, dissension. What happened? America went to war with Iraq and Afghanistan off of terrible evidence, off of the same type of bullshit that Jillian's saying right now. if even 1 % of Muslims, yada, yada, yada, what happened? It's all fact-based. Do you want me to cite the resources? Where would you like me to start? Just Jillian, let me finish. Over 1 million Iraqis were killed. Afghans were killed in torture.

45:20And it led to the radicalization of ISIS. The European Court of Human Rights. It brought nothing but pain and misery. Are you kidding? In division. Muslims, Jews aren't going anywhere, folks. We're in this together. And what we have to realize is that there are hate mongers who seek to divide us right now, like Jillian, who want to bring up Islamophobia and anti-Semitism. Actually, I'm not trying to divide us at all. Pat, you're the one, actually, who has tried to divide us. We have to make a future together. We have to call out the hate. We have to call out the white supremacy, the Islamic extremism, the Jewish supremacy.

45:50How do you address the people that want to destroy the West? We have to call out Israel's occupation and genocide. How do you address the percentage of radical Islam Islam that wants to destroy the West.

46:07Piers Morgan:Let me bring in Roland. Just tell me how to address that, Roger Hots. Let me bring in Roland. You don't have an answer, do you? Jillian, I've had to sit here and listen to y 'all go back and forth. Can I please make this point? Please. Thank you. Absolutely. Pierce, Pierce, last week I was in Montgomery, Alabama for the seventh anniversary of the Montgomery bus boycott. And there is a National Memorial for Peace and Justice and Legacy Museum there. The documents that commemorates the documented 4 ,400 lynchings in this country, and there were more that took place. As an African-American, I understand what it means when you have a people who have a bullseye on their back who are being targeted.

46:54I understand that. And so it is absolutely shameful that you cannot be at a Hanukkah celebration. And it gets interrupted by mass violence because of two evil individuals. But I'm saying two evil individuals for a reason. Because under the legitimate FBI leadership of Christopher Wray, they said that the greatest threat in America is white domestic terrorism. So when I listen to people like Senator Tommy Tuberville talk about, you know, getting rid of all Muslims in this country, as an African-American, I then say, what about white Christians? Because when we look at violence in this country, mass shootings in this country, who typically commits them?

47:38And so I think anybody has to be very careful to not go down this path of, oh, my God, all of them. When I, as an African-American, who's also Jillian, please allow me to finish. When I, as an African-American, who's also a Christian, can literally look at the history of white Christians committing violence. And so what we cannot do is say, oh, it is the religion that's driving it, as opposed to it is these evil individuals. Piers, you properly talked about guns and how Australia, after that mass shooting, you said in the 90s, how they targeted. But the fact that they were successful should be a lesson to America.

48:24How about you also try that to deal with mass shootings in this country? And so it is wrong for us to go down this path of condemning an entire religion, condemning an entire group of people, whether they are Muslim, whether they are Jewish, whether they are Christian. We have to recognize is there are evil people in this world and our job is to root out evil and how they impact people. But it's crazy to attack an entire religion. I agree.

48:53Piers Morgan:All those people. I agree with that. And look, Emily made the same point earlier because we were talking about it. Sinner Tommy Tuberville. Yeah, but Emily... Randy Fine. Emily, here's the reality about... Guys, guys. Here's the reality about the United States, for example. You have roughly the same number of Jews and Muslims in the United States. It's about four or five million of each, right? In the UK, by comparison, there are as many Muslims in the UK as there are in the whole of America, but there are only 250 ,000 Jews. is a massively disproportionate scenario in my country. Yes. Which is why I think Jews in the UK, and in London in particular, feel particularly threatened when they see these large marches every weekend with people often brazenly taunting the Jewish community, you know, or supporting Hamas, or talking about a global intifada, whatever it may be.

49:48Piers Morgan:And we saw the same thing happening in Australia, And I do think it's really incumbent on governments that they have to clamp down on this openly threatening stuff in the streets towards Jewish people.

50:20Piers Morgan:and get deep refreshing sleep. They have countless success stories, including from some very familiar faces. England legend Michael Owen, who lost£40. AFTV's Robbie, who lost more than£100. To watch their full stories and many more, scan the QR code on your screen or visit OxfordNatural.com slash peers. And here's the best part. Use the code peers and get 70 % off your first order. You're 70 % off with the code peers. Yeah, Pierce, first of all, I want to thank you for your empathy. But I also, I hate this whole narrative. Like, I don't view myself as a Jew, as a this, as a Black, as a Muslim.

51:03That's all identity politics. I don't want to be looked at like the victim. Jews are not the victims. We're actually a very successful, thriving demographic. Okay, if you want to be a victim, you're entitled to do so. I'm going to speak for myself. I don't like being looked at like the victim. I'm actually an African American. I'm going to speak. Good for you. Play the victim. Go ahead. I don't care. It's not. You can actually see.

51:25Piers Morgan:Let him finish the point. Oh, my God, Roland. You're a victim. Are you happy? You're a victim. Great. So, secondly, I actually never thought I would say this. It's hard to agree with Chank and Wajahat when they utter so much BS, but they made really great points, and I wrote them down. Chank calls out the Old Testament for commanding to slaughter your enemies. That's why when anyone says the Koran or the word Muslim, I swap it with Torah or Jew. argument failed, it doesn't work. The same way where the chosen people argument doesn't work. So we need to get better arguments than that. You cannot say because the Quran says it, all Muslims are bad.

51:59If you feel that way, go to the UAE, go to Riyadh, go to Saudi Arabia, any place in Saudi Arabia, you will come home and you will understand that there is mainly peaceful, secular, intelligent Muslims. And I know that wasn't your point, Jillian. You were not saying all Muslims are bad. You were saying there's 10%. The vast majority are peaceful, amazing people. What I'm trying to explain is when you're seeing— Jillian, I'm getting there. To bring this point home, the point is, good or bad, it doesn't matter. Take the religion out of it. I'm with Roland on this point. I could agree with everyone on this panel that we judge people by people.

52:40And it sounds so simple, right? But here's where we can take actionable measures to prevent this from happening again. This is an immigration problem. I don't care if you're a Jew, a Christian, a Muslim, or an atheist. If you're coming to a country and you will not contribute slash assimilate to this society, slap whatever religion you want onto it, that is the government's job to ensure that you will not come to this country and ruin it. If it happens to be Muslim, so be it. If that's a Jew, so be it. By the way, I'll point out, it's usually not the Jews that have the problem with assimilating.

53:13But that's my point. But the problem... Watch your hearts that beautifully.

53:15Piers Morgan:The problem with this... Nobody's going anywhere. The problem with this is this. If you look at this father and son, for example, that's the early reports coming out about them. The father had been there many years in Australia. He was a member of a shooting club. He seems to have assimilated perfectly fine, right? His son's... He's missed out on detail. His son had... He missed the detail. Wait a minute. No, no, I'm... He missed the detail. Sorry. Here's the reality. And the son had had some dealings with some bad people, the government has phrased it. Enough. Hang on. Not to the degree that caused an undue concern.

53:51Piers Morgan:Now, it may be in the proper investigation that now ensues that that will be seen to be a mistake. It may also be that if that's viewed a mistake, to then allow his father to have six legally owned firearms in a country where that's very unusual was also a mistake. So there may well be an expose here of some serious failures of the process, because it seems on the face of it, madness. If you've got the kid hanging out with some people who may be potentially radicalizing him, and you've got the father with six guns, that's not a good cocktail. I agree, and Pierce, you present your question also to the other panelists.

54:28You present it as two extremes. It's either, well, you could ban all the Muslims, but then you won't get Ahmed al-Akhmad, or why is it this or that? It doesn't have to be.

54:39Piers Morgan:I'm just saying to you that examining the assimilation of people is not as easy as it sounds, right? If it was, nobody would slip through the net. Emily, you're speaking from both sides of your mouth. You talk about you want a middle. You say no one's going back, but you also are perfectly fine with blaming immigrants and sending them back. Listen, I have to defend immigrants here, all right? And let me use Emily's own logic. And let me use Jill's own logic. Number one domestic terror threat in America consistently, and this is a fact, has been radical right and white supremacist terrorism. That's a fact.

55:14We do not, and I have not, Roland has it, Chank hasn't said, you know what, radicalize all white people. But what statistics are you offering? Jillian, it came from the FBI director Christopher Wray. I believe that figure. I believe that figure.

55:32Piers Morgan:I'm going to get that checked in real time. Hang on. I'm going to check it in real time. I'm asking honestly. My understanding of that claim is that it's true. But I will get it double checked while we're talking. I'll get it double checked, but my understanding is that that is a true statement of fact. But then why don't you have those people who go to jail? But then Wajah finish his point. Please don't talk over each other. Yeah, so let me just finish, Jillian, and then you can come in and interfere and do what you want. All right. Neither me Any Cenk or Rowland has ever, ever said, do onto white men what was done onto Muslims and black people and what's being done into Somalis, the racial profiling, the excessive demonization, kicking them all out, blaming all white people for the sins of white Christian nationalists or neo-Nazis or white supremacists.

56:21All right. The person who tried to assassinate Donald Trump twice, two people did it. White men. The person who killed Charlie Kirk, allegedly a white man. The number one identity of mass shooters in America. Want to take a guess? White men. Number one identity of child pedophiles, white men. I have never said, I have never said kick out all white people, racially profile white people, dehumanize white people. What you are doing is saying, if it's a Muslim, let's engage in Islamophobia. Let's demonize them. Let's hate them. That's not what I'm saying, Wajahat. This has been happening for 25 years.

56:55Wajahat, let me ask you a question. It has increased anti-Americanism. Wajahat, let me ask you a question.

56:59Piers Morgan:Wait a minute. Wait a minute, Wajahat. But Jahat, a serious question. There are a lot of Muslim extremists. You'd accept that? Of course. And I've condemned it on your show. I don't know the exact number. You don't. Jillian doesn't, right? It's not even close when it comes to American terrorism. It's not even close. The point she's making is in comparison to the total number of Jews on the planet, there are 1.6 to 2 billion Muslims, right? You only need a small number of those to be radicalized, to be extremist, and you will start to see a lot of bad stuff happening. And what I'm trying to say is if you use that same logic here...

57:36Piers Morgan:So my question is, what do you... My question, my question would I have for you, is what does the Muslim community do to root out these extremists in their midst? Right. Well, okay, I'm going to flip it up. And not an understanding... No. By the way, everything you said, any white person who's committed such an atrocity should obviously go to jail for the rest of their life. What has Jillian done to root out white mass shooters in America? Jillian, what have you done to root out and de-radicalize the white men in your community who are responsible for the number one mass shooting in this country?

58:12I would condemn and call it out. And I would, if I was on a jury, I would absolutely vote for them to go to prison. I'm also not doing anything to go after radical Muslims. I'm trying to condemn all violence and form some common ground with you here where radicalism across the board should be condemned. But I think what you're not understanding is when people are concerned, they're concerned as far as I can tell about assimilation. And in all the conversations that I have had about this, they are worried like, hey, if it's two radical Muslims and one good guy, how are we going to keep the two radicals out?

58:57And if you've got, let's say, 1 percent of two billion people that want to bring down the West, like, what do you do about chance of death to America in Dearborn? Like, this is what I'm saying. Like, what do you say about that? Piers, I keep hearing assimilation. Piers, I keep hearing assimilation. And again, this is the point we're sitting here making. You keep saying assimilation, that is the answer. Again, what happens when people who are born here, who were brought here in chains, and their ancestors and their folks are here, and you still are dealing with white domestic terrorism? Is that assimilation?

59:34See, this is the problem. Y 'all somehow think that assimilation, oh, that's going to be the answer. That's not. It is not the answer. And so it's nonsensical to think so. Well, immigrants generally thrive in America. Yeah, let them define assimilation.

59:50Piers Morgan:Let me bring in Cenk here. I'll define it. Let me bring in Cenk. Look, my... I'll define it. It's not chanting death to America. It's loving America. Hang on, Cenk. It's also not participating in a highly insurrection. That's kind of the answer, in my opinion. Can I say something, please, to Cenk? So, Cenk, this word assimilation, What it really means to me, at its purest, is that if you come to, say, the United States or the UK or Australia from another country, particularly another country which has a very different culture, so say you come from the Middle East and you come to live in America, live in London, live in Sydney, whatever, the word assimilate means that you do your best to be part of the new culture you're joining.

1:00:32Piers Morgan:What you don't do is put a drawbridge up and start your own culture within the culture of the country you go to at the expense of that nation's culture. I mean, at its purest. That's not true. Well, that is true. Okay, what you just described is the case. Then the Italians, the Jewish, the Polish, every group that came to the United States did exactly what you just said. They had own communities, own culture. So, like, do you understand the history of America? Yes. And I also understand that in the U.K. And what you described? Well, I don't remember the Italians in America setting up their own rival court system, for example, unless I mistake.

1:01:19Piers Morgan:Muslims haven't either. Do they? No. Because in the U.K., we now have nearly 100 Sharia courts have been set up, okay? So I don't remember that happening with any of the polls or the Italians in the United States. That's what I'm talking about. Cenk. Okay. All right. So what I can't stand is the double standards. So if, for example, Jillian said, what if 10 % Muslims are violent? Okay. If you said that about Jewish people and you said, look, I'm not worried about most Jews, but if 10 % of Jews are treacherous and serve Israel first and betray their country, Hold on. Hold on. No, no, no, no, Jillian.

1:02:00Now you let me talk. OK, no, you let me talk. No. OK, so now if you said 10 percent of Jews are the real problem, everyone would be outraged and rightfully so. That's not the right thing to say. But people say it blithely about Muslims like like we don't count and it's no big deal to discriminate against us. Now let's talk about immigration. You fill out forms. If some idiot fills out a form and says, I'm for ISIS, I'm for Muslim extremism. And you don't want to let them into the country? Of course! Of course you don't let them into the country. But now we're talking about Muslims at large. Wait, that's a totally different thing.

1:02:35By the way, are we doing the same thing for Israelis? Are we having them fill it? Hold on! Hold on! Are we allowing them to... Are we asking them to fill out a form? Are you against murdering 20 ,000 Palestinian kids? And if they say, no, I am for it, and I like what Israel did, are we banning them because they're sick, violent extremists who don't mind the murder of 20 ,000 children. No, of course not. In fact, when you look at the forums right now, what we're asking in entering our country is, what are your views about Israel? Who gives a damn what their views about Israel are when they're coming to America?

1:03:12Why are we asking about a different country? What I care most about is American sovereignty. Now, Roland is right. Muslims come here, Jews come here, Italians, et cetera. We all assimilate to some degree. I love the Pittsburgh Steelers. My favorite food is subs, et cetera. And I'm sure that's true of Jews, Christians, everyone, right? But we also keep a part of our culture. And if we said to, again, Jewish people, like we're saying to Muslims, how dare you not assimilate? What's with the silly hat and the stupid little things and the things coming out of your pockets? Why don't you assimilate?

1:03:44The real problem is the Jews. And they're too—hold on, hold on. And they're too loyal to Israel. We're not talking about food. And that's the real problem. they will not assimilate. All they care about is Israel. Everyone would say you're an unacceptable anti-Semite and you should be cancelled forever. But when people say it's Muslim, they consider it a legitimate debate. I've got to wrap the debate. What I would say, though, is there should be lines

1:04:08Piers Morgan:that we can all agree to draw. One is if you chant global intifada, everybody knows what that means. There have been two intifadas in the last 30-odd years, and they were both extremely violent. So when people call for that and chant about it... How about the violence of the occupation? They are uprising against a brutal fascist occupation for 58 brutal terrorist years. But you never talk about the Israeli violence in the same way. When Israelis get together, you're like, yes, occupy the Palestinians, enslave them. I've regularly criticized it. I've regularly criticized it, but when you allow...

1:04:45That's not the debate we have in America.

1:04:47Piers Morgan:When you allow, as Australia and England have done, to allow mass demonstrations, pro-Palestinian, where people chant global intifada or death to Yadier or wave the Hamas insignia, that to me all crosses a line. That's an incitement to violence. Can we be like the Australian Jewish community? Israeli flag crosses the line. Wait, wait, can I just say this to end on a positive note? Yeah. Like the Australian Jewish community, when they were given the opportunity to dehumanize Muslims and Palestinians, did you see what they did? They said, we're not going to do that. We're only going to blame the two shooters.

1:05:19and we're in this together. Be like that, folks. Don't be like Jillian and Emily and try to go against Muslims and immigrants and all this nonsense and divide and conquer. We're all in this together. I'm just going to be condensed. Immigrants are all in this together. And this is how you can be. The fact that you have to straw man arguments and put words in people's mouths shows that you have no case. This entire panel has been blaming other religions. You call me a one-nationalist. You have no idea what you're asking about. I must say, I must say,

1:05:49Piers Morgan:I've heard of some curious ways of ending on a positive note. That was not one of them. But, no, I said Amadol Amadol Amadol. I've got to leave it there. It's hard to think of a less positive note you left, than hammering two of your co-panelists. But we'll leave it there. I actually think what they said in Australia was a good thing, and we should all strive to be unifying forces and not polarising forces. We started this with Donald Trump's comments on Rob Reiner. How nice it would have been if Donald Trump had come out and paid tribute to Rob Reiner, the filmmaker, because I bet he's loved his films, rather than trashing him on a human level, which I just thought crossed the line.

1:06:24Piers Morgan:We all, I think, know where... We know where a lot of lines are that shouldn't be crossed. And we've got to come together and make sure nobody crosses them. Then life will slowly start to improve from this toxic hell we're currently infested with. Anyway, thank you all very much. Christmas is peak time for online shopping sprees, but that also means it's peak time for hackers and data brokers who steal your information online. The solution is very simple. Use ExpressVPN to shut them down. Top-tier encryption keeps your activity hidden, even on dodgy public Wi-Fi, which is perfect for holiday travel.

1:06:56Piers Morgan:You can set your location to 105 different countries, which lets you access content from all over the world. Users save hundreds on streaming and even plane tickets with ExpressVPN, all for$3.49 a month. It's a no-brainer. I use it, and you should too. Right now, you can get an extra four months of ExpressVPN if you go to expressvpn.com slash peers. That's ExpressVPN's lowest price ever, plus four extra months of service. Just scan the QR code on the screen or go to expressvpn.com slash peers. Well, joining me now for more on the Bondi beach attack is the former Australian Prime Minister, Tony Abbott.

1:07:36Piers Morgan:Mr Abbott, thank you very much indeed for joining me on Uncensored. Thanks for having me, Piers. This has been, as you observed, the worst atrocity against Jews anywhere in the world since October 7th, and it's happened in your country. How do you feel about that? Well, I think I feel numbed and I feel slightly ashamed, and I am embarrassed that there hasn't been sufficient leadership in our country to crack down on the manifest examples of Jew hate that we've had over and over again for the last couple of years, since the October 7th atrocity. We haven't had hate preachers deported. We haven't had hate marches banned.

1:08:24Instead, we've had all levels of government engaging in displays of hand-wringing impotence in the face of multiple, multiple displays of extreme Jew hatred, and I just think that it's got to stop.

1:08:40Piers Morgan:What is the best way to tackle radical Islamist extremism? We've seen a lot of it since the turn of the century, a lot of it fuelled perhaps by the war on terror and all the repercussions from that. But this has been going on now for nearly 30 years, and it's been horrific. And what we saw in Bondi was very similar to the stuff we saw from ISIS over the years. So it's not gone away. You know, you ran Australia for nearly three years. What do you believe is the most effective way to tackle this? Well, I think we've got to be absolutely blunt that people who live in countries like Australia, Britain, America, free, democratic, pluralist countries, have got to accept that people have a right to live their own lives, that freedom of speech, freedom of expression, freedom of conscience, freedom of religion are a reality.

1:09:45And people who stand up and insist that Jews should be killed or that Israel has no right to exist, that the IDF should be killed and that there should be a globalised intifada, these people are gravely at odds with our liberal democratic values. And sure, it's all very well to say free speech, but sometimes free speech verges on intimidation. And that's what we've seen. We've seen attempts to intimidate Jewish people, I think attempts to intimidate society at large by militant Islamists in our midst. And it's time for all of this to stop.

1:10:29Piers Morgan:There was, of course, an extraordinary irony that the hero who risked his life to save potentially many, many people by taking down one of these terrorists and disarming him, was himself a Muslim, was an immigrant from Syria in, I think, 2006 to Australia, clearly not just contributing to society as a fruit seller, but also now as a national hero. So for those who say we can't let Muslims in anymore, you've got right there a shining example of the very best of a Muslim. I completely agree with you, Piers, and the last thing we should be doing is discriminating on the basis of religion itself. But I think we should be discriminating on the basis of values.

1:11:23And obviously there are some Muslims who are more than happy to join Team Australia and who are more than happy to commit themselves wholeheartedly to our country. There are others who seem to be more interested in a very strict, exclusionary, exclusive version of Islam, and that's where the problem lies. So what I'd like to hope is that over time, in countries like Australia and Britain, which are free countries, a different and more genial version of Islam might develop, which is perfectly consistent with living in liberal plural democracies. But at the moment, there seems to be this struggle inside the soul of Islam between those who believe in live and let live and those who believe in death to the infidels.

1:12:15And obviously, there can be no such thing as death to the infidels in a society such as ours, which are full of infidels.

1:12:24Piers Morgan:There is no justification, of course, for this appalling terror attack and no defence for it. Separate to this, though, there is a belief that the Israeli government's actions and the way they've prosecuted the war on Gaza, by destroying so much of it, by killing so many people, including over 20 ,000 children, that this has made life for Jews around the world less safe. Do you think that is a possibility? Well, Piers, I can understand the dismay that some people obviously have looking at the devastation in Gaza. But let's not forget who's responsible for this. It's Hamas. I mean, it was Hamas that unleashed terror against Israel on October the 7th.

1:13:14It's Hamas that use their own people as human shields, hid their, I suppose, their weapon stores and their terror cells in hospitals and schools and so on. And a country has a right to self-defence. I think that the Israeli armed forces, notwithstanding some terrible mistakes, have been fastidious to try to minimise civilian casualties in a way that, let's face it, the Bomber Command didn't always back in the Second World War. So I guess I make two points. First, I think we have to be understanding of the predicament that Israel, the Middle East, only liberal democracy, finds itself in. And second, you can disagree, if you like, with the Israeli government's tactics, but that hardly justifies wanting to see the whole state of Israel and some 9 million Jewish peoples effectively subjected to a new Holocaust.

1:14:19And that's implicit in this whole Palestine must be free from the river to the sea hate-filled rhetoric that we've seen in abundance in the big cities of the West for the last two years.

1:14:32Piers Morgan:Yeah, I mean, I agree with that. But I also have been very disturbed by the rhetoric coming from the likes of Smodrich and Ben-Gavir in the Israeli government who have been talking in language that can really only be described as ethnic cleansing, a desire to get rid of all the Palestinians from Gaza and so on. I don't like that either. But that is not the policy of the Israeli government, although it may indeed be the view of a small handful of people in the Nasser. So, again, by all means, Piers, let's disagree, let's argue, let's practice free speech, but free speech that involves calls for the destruction of a whole country, free speech that involves calls for death to Jewish people on a mass scale, that's really not free speech.

1:15:30That's incitement to violence. That's kind of rhetorical intimidation. and I just think that there's been far too much of it which has been officially tolerated by government for far too long.

1:15:44Piers Morgan:One of the other issues that's been raised as a result of the mass shooting is guns and gun control. You know, I remember in 1996, I was editor of the Daily Mirror in the UK when Dunblane happened and 16 young children were killed and there was a dramatic change in gun laws driven by Conservative John Major and then Labour, Tony Blair. Blair finished off what Major started and had a profoundly effective impact on gun violence in the UK. And almost at the same time, you had the massacre in Hobart and Tasmania with 35 people killed and, again, very draconian new gun laws brought in, which over time have proven to be very effective, I think, in stemming gun violence, to the extent I was telling an American panel earlier that you had in 2023 in Australia, in a country of 27 million people, 31 gun murders from June 23 to June 24.

1:16:44Piers Morgan:And in 2023 in America, by contrast, with 12 times as many people, you had 18 ,000 gun murders, which is a gun rate of 580 times as big. So Australia has done very well in curbing gun violence. This has prompted a lot of calls for new gun laws. And I guess, look, I was involved at the sharp end of debating this for years in America and didn't get very far with him, if I'm honest. But, you know, as I look at the Prime Minister of Australia now, Anthony Albanese, considering what to do, it is odd to me that this guy, whose son had already been flagged up as potentially problematic, potentially getting radicalised in some way, it seems, that his father, who he lived with, had six guns.

1:17:32Piers Morgan:in a country where that's not easy to do. For that alone, do you think it is worth looking at the gun laws again? Well, he is sure. I am amazed and surprised that this individual was able to have six military-grade long arms in his possession legally. But I do think that it's a bit of a smokescreen from the Prime Minister. Sure, I think there's been an error somewhere for this guy to have had so many guns, but in the end it's the mindset behind the trigger, so to speak, that's the problem, not the trigger itself. I mean, it's this rampant Jew hatred. It's this sense that somehow it's OK if you're a Muslim to say, oh, Jews should be killed.

1:18:25That's what needs to change, And that's why I would love to see in countries like ours some more genial Muslim leaders emerge who can say, as indeed President al-Sisi did some years ago, when he said, look, for too long, we Muslims have done things in the name of Islam which are wrong. And we have to develop a better mindset if the world is to go forward in peace. And I just think that we need much more of that. We need, if you like, a renaissance, a reformation, some kind of an enlightenment inside Islam. And the sooner it comes, the better for all of us.

1:19:12Piers Morgan:Tony Abbott, I really appreciate you coming on Oncensor. Thank you very much. Thank you, Piers. Piers Morgan Oncensor is proudly independent. The only boss around here is me. If you enjoy our show, we ask for only one simple thing. hit subscribe on YouTube, and follow Piers Morgan Uncensored on Spotify and Apple Podcasts. And in return, we will continue our mission to inform, irritate and entertain. And we'll do it all for free. Independent, uncensored media has never been more critical, and we couldn't do it without you.