‘Eat Your Taco And LISTEN!’ Trump Tariffs - Who Was Right? With Kari Lake & Cenk Uygur

23:05And that's a disastrous place for the country.

23:08Piers Morgan:OK, Gillian, what's the reality here about this Bureau of Labour Statistics? The reality is that the American statistical system, like most Western statistical systems, has challenges and has had challenges for years. That's been well known. So nobody is saying that there can't be ways of improving the data. There definitely can be. And with the BLS, that's been known for a long time to have challenges, which go well beyond any individual person. But I strongly agree to start firing somebody because you don't like the numbers makes you look like an autocrat, banana republic, whatever word you want to use.

23:47If Trump was really concerned about the quality of statistics, what he should have done when he arrived is start investing more in the statistical service. On the contrary, he's been slashing the funding. He's been forcing them to take down all kinds of data pages and statistics. He's done more to smash apart the statistical system since he arrived in office by ripping down all these pages of data than any other president has done for a long time. So to turn around now and say he's removed the head of the BLS because he doesn't like the quality of statistics is beyond parody ironic laughter. If he cared about this, he should have not done what he did in the last four or five months, which have done more damage than anyone else.

24:27And this type of action, coupled with the attacks on the Fed are making investors in the markets increasingly concerned about the long-term credibility of the US. And the way to measure that is not with the stock market, which is being hyped up and pumped up right now by all kinds of taco trades and things like that. It's by looking at the bond market. And the bond market is where you can see the real signs of concern. Because the long-term cost of borrowing has shot up compared to the short-term cost of borrowing in spite of Treasury Secretary Besant doing every single trick in the book to try and keep rates down.

25:02And that's where you can really see the signs of investor concern. I'm strongly on the opinion that what Trump did with BLS head is a disaster.

25:11Piers Morgan:And in relation to Jerome Powell, is this now a time for him to reduce the rates? So normally when you have GDP data coming out stronger than expected, which is what we had last week, there's a time when you don't start slashing rates. Least of all, doing what Trump has suggested, which is slashing rates to 1%, which would be seriously negative rates. And it would be like throwing kerosene on a bonfire and creating a massive complication and a huge inflationary spike. In reality, there I personally think is a very strong chance we're heading towards stagflation, which is lower growth, higher inflation in the coming months, as the impact of the tariffs finally starts to bite.

25:54I do not think we've actually seen the feed through from the tariffs whatsoever yet in terms of the proper data. And in that situation, you have a very nasty choice and no central bank ever wants to be coping with stagflation. So I think it's entirely rational for them to sit in their hands and say, we're going to wait and see a bit longer. However, the critical point that everybody is missing is this. It's not just about short-term rates. That is what the Fed can control. It's about long-term rates, 10-year rates, which are set by market investors reflecting investor competence. And what's happened since January, the most important thing, is that it gapped out dramatically because investors are concerned about the long-term credibility of America.

26:36And if you start slashing rates on the say-so of the president, then you're going to see that gap increasing. And it's a 10-year rate, Carrie, that matters to mortgage holders and people like that. And that's determined by whether or not investors trust the American fiscal situation and the credibility for the long term. Okay.

26:58Piers Morgan:Carrie, your response to that? Yep. Well, the entire way that we are watching our economy work is being changed under President Trump. And what we're seeing happening right now is a return TO HIRING AMERICA. AND WE TALKED A LITTLE BIT ABOUT JOB NUMBERS. AND THESE NUMBERS REFLECT MOVING AWAY FROM BASICALLY A WORKFORCE BASED ON GOVERNMENT WORKERS. AND WE'RE SEEING IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR. ALL OF THE JOBS CREATED WERE IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR. ALL OF THE JOBS WENT TO AMERICAN WORKERS. CONVERSELY, UNDER BIDEN, WE SAW BOGUS NUMBERS FROM THE BLS. AND THEN ALL OF THE JOBS CREATED WERE FOR FOREIGN-BORN WORKERS OR FOREIGN workers and all of the job losses were for American workers.

27:42We're watching a reset and we're getting things back on track for a very strong American economy. Is it going to happen overnight? No, but it's happening rather quickly. And now we're going to start seeing the investments pouring in. We're allowing manufacturing to build back up. That's going to take a little time to build these factories. But President Trump is setting everything up to make it easy to build these factories to build manufacturing and to actually be able to write off all the expenses to do that and then hire more Americans for those jobs. We are just seeing the tip of the iceberg and it's going to be amazing when we see the growth coming.

28:17America is the place to invest. American jobs are coming back and I know it upsets people like Cenk when things start turning the corner because then you can't complain about stuff on his show. But what we need to do is empower the American worker. President Trump is doing exactly that. Can I just really jump in and say... Okay, Jillian, do you want us to jump in there?

28:36Piers Morgan:Okay, I agree with... Briefly, very briefly, I agree with some of that, okay? I do believe that some of that's correct in terms of the job pattern. However, Carrie, you're citing the same data that you're saying, the jobs data that you say is so terrible that we can't rely on it. So one of my problems with what's going on right now is that if President Trump was so upset about the quality of statistics, why does he cite them when he likes them and ignore them when he doesn't? I'd say, for me, what's happening right now is we should be having a serious progressional overhaul of statistics and investment into statistics, put the data up, restore all those data pages that America's army of hidden statisticians have been saving, downloading on their own computers, because they were so appalled by wiping out all this public repository of data.

29:23But you can't cherry pick some statistics you like and ignore and decry the ones you don't. I would just say two things. Number one, the stock market may not be the greatest indicator of how the U.S. economy is going. But it's the primary indicator for millions of American investors like myself. And you cannot poo-poo. It's 44 ,000 odd again. It's in the green. heavily again that that's uh that is for real the other thing i would say is the fact that you have not seen a spike in inflation uh in the six months of trump uh despite the tariffs is because it is clear to me or maybe i surmise that these uh uh uh these uh sellers the the manufacturers have HAVE BEEN OVERPRISING AND THEY ARE EATING THESE TARIFF COSTS BECAUSE THEY KNOW THAT THEY ARE BEING WATCHED AND SO I THINK THEY ARE NOT RAISING THE PRICES OF THEIR PRODUCTS BECAUSE THERE IS PLENTY OF MARGIN FOR THEM AND THEY HAVE BEEN DOING QUITE WELL AS REFLECTED BY THEIR STOCKS.

30:39SO THAT'S JUST THE WAY I SEE IT.

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31:24Piers Morgan:Go to getjackedup.com to sign up for their free training program. And when you're ready to buy your own Jacked Up Power Rack Extreme, use the promo code Piers, that's P-I-E-R-S, to save 10%. That's getjackedup.com, code Piers. OK, I want to bring Chenkin and just slightly change the... We're having any tools right now. Can I just say, we're having earnings calls right now. And what's becoming clear is that most, we're literally, we're having the earnings calls at this very moment, this week. And if you listen to the earnings calls, what they're all saying is that they prepared for Armageddon after Liberation Day for 145%.

32:05They are more relieved that it's come right down. However, they've been stockpiling massively and they're still in a wait and see mode. Most of them don't yet know where they're going to actually pass on or not pass on the tariff increased costs.

32:21Piers Morgan:Yeah, I think that's right. We just don't know. Cenk, I want to just change the issue in relation to economy slightly. I want to talk about immigration because there's a lot going on here with immigration and the Trump administration. I saw yesterday that apparently net migration to the United States is at the lowest it's been for many decades right now, which is not entirely surprising, I think, given what's happened on the southern border, that's been a huge success in stopping the enormous number of people coming in illegally. But it also puts a big spotlight on what ICE has been doing. And it just seems to me, you know, I've had a few chats with a few Americans over the weekend, all different types of Americans, to gauge, I'm in California now, I was in New York, and, you know, I haven't been in the middle of America, so it may be that things are different.

33:10Piers Morgan:I CAN ASK CARRIE ABOUT THAT SOON. BUT IN RELATION TO WHAT I THINK THE GUT FEELING OF MOST AVERAGE AMERICANS IS, I GET THE SENSE THAT IF TRUMP HAD FOCUSED ON UNDOCUMENTED PEOPLE IN THE UNITED STATES WHO COMMIT CRIMES AND DEPORTED ALL OF THOSE, INCLUDING ALL THOSE WHO HAVE BEEN WAITING TO BE DEPORTED WHO ARE IN THAT POSITION, THEN MOST AMERICANS WOULD COMPLETELY AGREE I DON'T AGREE WITH THAT. BUT THEY DO NOT AGREE, MOST AMERICANS, AND A POLL SUGGESTED THAT I'M RIGHT ABOUT THIS, A SIGNIFICANT MAJORITY DO NOT AGREE THAT THE SAME SHOULD APPLY TO PEOPLE WHO HAVE COME IN ILLEGALLY, WHO ARE UNDOCUMENTED, BUT WHO HAVE BUILT A LIFE IN THE UNITED STATES LIKE SO MANY MILLIONS BEFORE THEM, HAVE MAYBE GOT A JOB, THEY'RE PAYING TAXES, THEY'RE CONTRIBUTING TO THE ECONOMY, CONTRIBUTING TO SOCIETY, THEY MAYBE HAVE SOME CHILDREN.

34:02Piers Morgan:I DON'T GET THE SENSE THAT MOST AMERICANS ARE COMFORTABLE WITH THESE RAIDS ON PLACES LIKE HOME DEPOT THROWING PEOPLE LIKE THAT OUT OF THE COUNTRY. SO I UNDERSTAND THE ARGUMENT THAT TRUMP PUTS FORWARD AND HIS PEOPLE PUT FORWARD THAT IT'S A DETERRENT AND THAT IF YOU'RE HERE ILLEGALLY, YOU'RE HERE ILLEGALLY. BUT IT FEELS TO MOST AMERICANS UNAMERICAN TO BE DOING IT TO THOSE PEOPLE. WHAT'S YOUR ASSESSMENT? Yeah, as you know, I'm not a normal partisan here. So, for example, Trump did a good job of closing the border. So I live in the real world, and I don't mind saying that at all. I want good things for America.

34:40I'm going to connect these two topics. Look, guys, we've got to live in the reality-based world. So Japan, Trump is bragging that they gave$550 million in investments. No, they clarified, no, it's loans. That's because we borrowed so much to give more tax cuts for the rich, etc., right? So just be honest about it. They're loans. They're not investments. And so when you start playing around with, and by the way, manufacturing, guys, takes three to four years. So this fantasy land that manufacturing base is going to explode soon just doesn't make any sense. But he's doing everything to speed that up with getting rid of regulations, speeding through regulations.

35:18Okay. Now, I know that helps corporate rule. The corporations love it. Now, look, when you start juggling hand grenades, as Trump is doing both with the economy and on this inflation issue, at some point you're going to drop them. So you guys are super psyched that all your rich friends are doing well in the stock market, etc. So I want this noted. So when the stock market does poorly, I don't want you changing any of the goal, moving the goalposts and going, oh, no, no, now that's because of Biden or Jimmy Carter or something. So you can't have it both ways. he's going to drop a couple of these grenades and things are going to go poorly.

35:54That's my prediction. Thanks. I'm not worried about the rich folks like you. Hold on, hold on. Let me answer the immigration part, Carrie. Yeah, sure, sure. All right, so now the tie to immigration. Guys, if he appears 100 % right, if he just closed the border, he probably would have been at like 80 % approval on immigration. Right now, he's significantly negative in immigration. How could you close the border, which Americans really, really wanted, and still be negative on the issue of immigration? And the way that you do it is you become needlessly cruel. I know that some of the radical right love it, and they love the idea of people getting eaten by alligators, etc.

36:34But even most of Trump's voters, let alone the rest of the country, don't want that. They don't want needless cruelty. They just didn't want out-of-control, undocumented immigration in the country. And they definitely didn't want the undocumented immigrants who are criminals. so if he'd also done that which he was doing again he would have been super popular but when he says we're going to have meat by alligators and we're going to we're going to okay that's not cruel that's unbelievable that gives you your answer you mean taking rapists and murderers off the streets and locking them up and no i don't mean that i just said it i just said it i'll tell you what's needlessly cruel i just told you can riley can i finish the comment can i finish the Carrie, let me finish your comment.

37:15Let Shane finish his point, and then Carrie, you respond. Yeah. Yeah, eat your taco while I finish this point. So on immigration, when he starts snatching up people from in the middle of the country, when they're going to work, when they're at Home Depot, when they're picking up their kids from school, Americans hate it. I said that the independent podcasters like Joe Rogan, Tim Dillon, etc., would turn on that, and they did, and they did, and they're all now saying, brother, we didn't sign up for this. We signed up for you getting rid of the criminals and closing the border. But once you start taking our neighbors away and you send in, why do you need ICE agents with masks?

37:50If you're proud of what you're doing and what you're doing is right, you don't need to be masked up like some thugs. The fact that they're wearing the mask gives you a sign that what they're doing is stupid and wrong and immoral and people don't like it. That is why the American people are weighing in saying, stop. This is not what we asked for. And Carrie, you could say this fantasy land about how, oh my God, 80 % of Americans want alligator arbitrage and they want these. It's just not true. And he's also, by the way, grabbing legal residents. His day job is below me.

38:23Piers Morgan:Carrie, before you respond, Carrie, I just want to say that it was a Fox News poll because I was on Fox a lot last week and I was really struck by this poll. The Fox News poll was the one that said that I think three quarters of America, just under, opposed throwing out and deporting people who were in the country undocumented but hadn't broken laws. So do you not think on that that Trump has got so much of this right? The southern border has been effectively closed, and that's an amazing triumph in such a short period of time, particularly given what Biden allowed to happen on the border. But I do feel that it's just gone too far in picking people up in Home Depot, off the streets and throwing them out.

39:07Piers Morgan:I don't think that is playing well with the American people. I don't care if it's a Fox News poll or a CNN poll. To me, they're both the same. It doesn't matter. People want illegals brought out of this country, sent back to their homeland. We are creating millions of homecomings, repatriating people back to their country. It's not cruel. That's not true. It's not cruel. It's not cruel. We're paying for them to go back. We're sending them back. Not many other countries would do that. They came here illegally and they have to go home. And I won't be satisfied until every young American male has a job.

39:44When every young American male has a job, when every young American female who wants to work has a job. You get the young American males to work in the fields in California in 100 degree heat, give me a call. I think that it is absolutely important what they are doing. So you want to bring in slave labor. You want to take jobs like that and bring in people from other countries. When you have to wear masks to do your job, cops don't wear masks, FBI agents don't wear masks, judges don't wear masks, foreign officers don't wear masks. Why is it uniquely that these particular activities by law enforcement, they have to be anonymous because they are embarrassed to be.

40:32No, that's not true. I'm embarrassed for you right now. It is an embarrassment to every cop when they watch and see what's happening. There's no connection between these ICE agents and the communities they seek to serve. I'm embarrassed? There is isolation. I'M EMBARRASSED FOR YOU THAT YOU DON'T CARE ABOUT LAW ENFORCEMENT. AND I'M EMBARRASSED THAT YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND.

41:02Piers Morgan:OKAY, LET ME JUMP IN. LET ME JUMP IN. THIS IS IMPORTANT. LET ME JUMP IN. HANG ON. THIS IS IMPORTANT. CARRY, LET ME ASK YOU A QUESTION. BECAUSE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE LIFE OF THE LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER. AND EVERYONE ON THIS PAST DOESN'T SEEM TO CARE THAT THEY ARE TRACKING DOWN CARTEL MEMBERS, DANGEROUS PEOPLE. THEY HAVE TO GO ON TO THEIR THEY HAVE TO GO ON TO THEIR BUSINESSES. THEY ARE A RISKING PEOPLE. THEY ARE A RISKING PEOPLE. I HAVE NOT HEARD ANYBODY SAY NOBODY HAS SAID THAT CRIMINALS SHOULD NOT BE DEPORTED. THAT'S NOT THE POINT. I THINK MY QUESTION FOR YOU, CARRIE, IS THERE ARE ESTIMATED TO BE ANYWHERE BETWEEN 50 AND 100 MILLION PEOPLE IN THE UNITED STATES RIGHT NOW WHO ARE UNDOCUMENTED.

41:42Piers Morgan:If you take your argument to its logical extension, then you would destroy the American economy. If you deported every undocumented person in America right now, the American economy would collapse. Is that what you really think is a good move? I don't want the American economy to collapse. I want to deport people who are here illegally, and the American people want that as well. But they don't. The polls show that they don't. They want undocumented criminals deported. From a moral perspective, I think snatching people off the street in this way, if they have not committed crimes and deporting them using deliberate cruelty through things like alligator Alcatraz is appalling.

42:28However, on the economic perspective, which I'm sure is what people expect me to talk about... And, by the way, Kerry, I'm not disputing for a millisecond the need to deport people who are criminals. But on the economic point of perspective, I do not think the American public understands the potential economic cost of deporting, as you say, all of the undocumented workers or even part of them, because it's going to create a real impact on the American economy, both in terms of slowing growth, but also in terms of raising wages and essentially contributing more to inflation, both of which are stagflationary on top of the terrace.

43:04We have not seen the impact of that yet. And yes, automation, yes, AI can help with some of that. But the modeling that's out there right now about the potential impact of a mass deportation is really very significant. And in some ways, the medium to long-term impact of that will be more significant than tariffs in terms of tipping America towards stagflation. If I can finish my thought just for one second, what we've established here is that CHENK WANTS OUR ICE OFFICERS TO HAVE THEIR ENTIRE LIVES IN TURMOIL, POTENTIALLY HURT OR MURDERED BY A BUNCH OF GANG BANGERS AND CARTEL MEMBERS THAT THEY ARE ROUNDING UP BECAUSE HE DOESN'T WANT THEIR FACE COVERED.

43:46WE HAVE NOT ESTABLISHED THAT. AND HEROLDO HAS SAID HE WANTS TO BRING IN SLAVE LABOR TO PICK CROPS. IS THAT WHAT I'M GATHERING HERE? I DO AGREE WITH CARRIE. I DO AGREE WITH CARRIE.

44:00Piers Morgan:HANG ON, HANG ON, HANG ON. I DO AGREE WITH CARRIE ABOUT THAT POINT. I THINK THEY WEAR MASKS BECAUSE THEY ARE ACTUALLY DEPORTING AND CATCHING A LOT OF CRIMINALS AS WELL. CARTEL MEMBERS. TWO TYPES OF PEOPLE. YEAH. SO, YOU KNOW, IF I WAS AN ICE MEN, I WOULD WANT TO PROTECT MYSELF. WHAT ABOUT A COP ON THE BEAT? WHAT ABOUT A DETECTIVE? WHAT ABOUT A CAUGHT OFFICER? WHAT ABOUT AN FBI AGENT? AREN'T THEY DISRUPTING THE LIVES OF THE PEOPLE THEY ARE APPREHENDING? OF COURSE THEY ARE. THEY ARE LAW ENFORCEMENT. They're the good guys. Geraldo, you know how dangerous the cartels are. You know how dangerous the cartels are.

44:38I know how dangerous the mafia is. They're disrupting their human trafficking operation. I think that the - Harry, would you put all over the - Masks are symbolic of this whole issue. Masks are symbolic. It is the exact barometer of how America feels about this activity, the fact that they have to be anonymous, They have to cover their faces to do their jobs. It is absolutely... The hypocrisy. The hypocrisy. Humiliated... It's the left who wanted us all masked. Remember, the left wanted us all masked up. They wanted us to be masked up, and now you don't want an officer who's rounding up gang members to wear a mask.

45:19Very medical mask. I don't like masks of any kind. I don't like masks. I think the criminals wear masks. If you had to go arrest cartel members, THE PEOPLE WHO WANT TO GO TO THE HOME DEPOT AND STEAL STUFF, THOSE ARE THE PEOPLE WHO WEAR MASKS. MASKS ARE. IF YOU HAD TO GO OUT AND ARREST THEM, YOU WOULD WANT TO WEAR A MASK.

45:42Piers Morgan:TIME OUT. BEFORE WE FINISH, I WANT TO ASK CARRIE THIS AND THEN GO TO THE OTHERS ABOUT THIS. VERY INTERESTING INTERVIEW WITH CHARLOMAINE THE GOD, THE BREAKFAST CLUB HOST. HE WAS PREDICTING THAT DONALD TRUMP'S HANDLING OF THE JEFFREY THE REPUBLICAN PARTY IS GOING TO TAKE THEIR PARTY BACK. THE REPUBLICAN PARTY IS GOING TO TAKE THEIR PARTY BACK. TAKE A LOOK. I THINK THAT CONSERVATIVE, TRADITIONAL CONSERVATIVES ARE GOING TO TAKE THE REPUBLICAN PARTY BACK. I THINK THERE IS A POLITICAL COOL GOING ON RIGHT NOW IN THE REPUBLICAN PARTY THAT PEOPLE AREN'T PAYING ATTENTION TO. INTERESTING. I THINK THAT THIS THIS IS A WAY FOR TRADITIONAL CONSERVATIVES TO TAKE THEIR PARTY BACK.

46:27Piers Morgan:MY FIRST QUESTION IS, DO YOU AGREE IT'S BEEN HANDLED VERY BADLY? YOU KNOW, I'M GOING TO BE HONEST, I HAVE BEEN SO ENGROSSED IN WHAT I'M DOING WHICH IS WORKING ON THE AGENCY I'M OVERSEEING. I FOLLOWED EPSTEIN NOT AS MUCH AS SOME PEOPLE. WHAT I'M PARTICULARLY PLEASED WITH THAT'S HAPPENING WITH THIS ADMINISTRATION. LET ME FINISH, CHENK. LET ME FINISH. THE EPSTEIN, YOU KNOW, WE WERE TALKING ABOUT YOUNG, UNDERAGE GIRLS AND BOYS BEING ABUSED, RIGHT? PRESIDENT TRUMP IS ACTUALLY HELPING TO FIND YOUNG PEOPLE WHO ARE CURRENTLY INVOLVED IN SEX ABUSE, SEX TRAFFICKING, AND HE'S SAVING THEM RIGHT NOW. THE PEOPLE WHO ARE CURRENTLY INVOLVED, WHILE THEY MIGHT NOT HAVE BEEN INVOLVED IN THE EPSTEIN SCANDAL, THEY ARE INVOLVED IN THIS HORRENDOUS BIDEN'S WORLD IN THE SEX TRADE, THE UNDERAGE SEX TRADE, AND THEY ARE RESCUING THOSE KIDS.

47:20AS A MOTHER, I'M CONCERNED ABOUT THE KIDS WHO ARE ACTUALLY IN TRACKING THAT WAY.

47:26Piers Morgan:THAT'S A BIT DIFFERENT. CHENK, LET ME BRING YOU IN. I THINK WE 'LL GET TO THE BOTTOM OF IT. I THINK WE 'LL GET TO THE BOTTOM OF IT. I THINK EVENTUALLY EVERYTHING WILL COME OUT. OK, well, it should do. And, Cenk, my issue with the way it's been handled is that the Trump administration took everybody to the water's edge very deliberately. I had some of the administration on this show saying it's all going to come out. We're going to reveal everything. It's going to be full accountability. And then two things happened. Elon Musk, when he fell out with Trump, suddenly posts on his X platform, the biggest bombshell is that Trump's in the Epstein files.

48:04Piers Morgan:AND IN THEIR OWNERS, THE ADMINISTRATION ANNOUNCES THE WHOLE EPSTEIN SCANDAL IS BEING SHUT DOWN. THAT'S WHAT CALLS THE FUROERY OF CONSPIRACY THEORIES RUNNING RIOT AND EVERYTHING ELSE. IT WAS VERY BADLY HANDLED. I HAVE NOT SEEN ANY EVIDENCE THAT DONALD TRUMP DID ANYTHING WRONG WITH JEFFREY EPSTEIN, OTHER THAN HE WAS HIS FRIEND, LIKE A LOT OF RICH, FAMOUS PEOPLE THAT EPSTEIN COLLECTED OVER THE YEARS. AND THEN HE DISOWNED HIM. HOWEVER, THE WAY THEY 'VE HANDLED THIS HAS BEEN VERY DAMAGING. AND CHARLOMAINE THE GOB RAISES AN INTERESTING POINT. IT'S THE FIRST TIME REALLY WE 'VE SEEN WHERE A LOT OF PEOPLE ON THE MAGA SIDE HAVE FELT SO LET DOWN THEY 'VE BEEN PREPARED TO OPENLY CRITICIZE THE PRESIDENT.

48:46Piers Morgan:I THINK THAT'S QUITE SIGNIFICANT. I, YEAH, LOOK, AS YOU KNOW, I 'VE BEEN TRYING TO UNITE DEMOCRATS AND REPUBLICANS IN TERMS OF THE VOTERS. I MEAN, I JUST DID A JUBILEE WHERE I TOOK ON DEMOCRATS AND REPUBLICANS DEFENDING POLITICIANS, RIGHT? And on this issue, a lot of MAGA and certainly independent voters have been really good. They're holding their own leader accountable. And I wish the Democrats had done that with Joe Biden and his age, etc. And so I give them a lot of credit for that. And this is a place where you can tell the difference between politicians and partisans and actual voters. Because the partisans will try to defend the indefensible, which is what Trump is doing now.

49:27So when Trump was talking about releasing the Epstein files, I was in favor of that. So now he turns around and goes, not only am I not releasing them, there were no clients at all. We're not going to prosecute a single person. Then on top of that, he layers in Ghislaine Maxwell, the only other person who was prosecuted, is now going to a minimum security prison. Why? You normally need an exceptional exemption to be able to transfer a child rapist to a minimum security prison. But they just did it willy-nilly. I mean, if he lets her go, this country is going to explode. So and it's not it. Look, I wish the left was more powerful and and I think that people should go populist left.

50:07Right. But when you have the left and the right, then it becomes super powerful. And so if he thinks he's going to just cover this up and he's going to have people like Kerry come on here and make excuses, it's never going to work. It's not even working with his own voters, which I give them a ton of credit for. We need to actually. So don't tell me that the girls were raped, but nobody raped them. That's a preposterous thing to say. And look, is Trump in the files? Look, his name is all over. Hold on. This is really important. His name is all over. But I get it because he was really, really good friends with Jeffrey Epstein.

50:40They were nearly best friends for about 15 years, and both have said that. But that doesn't mean that he did the crimes. So a great—and if he's innocent, a great way to show that is to fully release all the files, including the tapes, by the way, because we know there's tapes. And my guess is that that's not going to happen, not because of Trump, but because under both Biden, Trump, Democrat and Republicans, they cover this up. Why? Very likely because it's an intelligence agency and they're both getting orders under no circumstances are you to release this. Because think about it. If an intelligence agency did it, how mad would the American people be if they authorized the rape of American children to get blackmail to use and manipulate our politicians?

51:23THAT WOULD BE A FURY LIKE YOU 'VE NEVER SEEN BEFORE. THAT'S WHY NEITHER SIDE IS EVER GOING TO RELEASE IT. I DO THINK THIS WILL COME OUT, THOUGH, CHENK. I THINK IT WILL COME OUT WHATEVER THERE IS THERE.

51:34Piers Morgan:WELL, IT HASN'T SO FAR. A FINAL WORD. GERALDO, YOU COVERED A LOT OF STORIES OVER THE YEARS. THIS EPSTEIN SCANDAL ISN'T GOING AWAY, AND I THINK THE WAY THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION HAS HANDLED IT HAS BEEN VERY SELF-HARMING. WHAT'S YOUR TAKE? I BELIEVE THAT TRUMP HAS BLUNDERED IN IT, AND I ALSO think that you're absolutely right in terms of the friendship between Epstein and the president over the years. And it is embarrassing. There's lots of pictures, lots of videos. Even on tape, you hear Trump extolling the virtue of Epstein's pursuit of very young girls. So I think all of that is very embarrassing.

52:14But to me, the real story with Epstein is how did he become so rich? What did he do to become a billionaire and get this influence over all of these people? You know, you can't, as rich as the markets may be or bright as, you know, he was, wasn't he a teacher at Dalton School in New York? You know, and then all of a sudden he's a multi-trillionaire. I want to follow the money. I just follow the money. And I believe that that's where you'll see real embarrassment and heads will fall. when we find out exactly how he got so rich.

52:55Piers Morgan:OK, Gillian, final, final word to you, given Gerardo teed you up with money. Would you agree with that? I would say follow the money is always a very, very good way to proceed. And I think there are many questions around the Epstein story. I do think the question of how he got so rich is absolutely at the heart of it, because to go from being a Dalton teacher to supposedly being a brilliant money manager simply does not make sense. I think there's a whole shady aspect to it which has not been revealed publicly yet. And boy, it's ironic that a MAGA movement that was fuelled by conspiracy theories is now essentially turning itself inside out around new conspiracy theories against the chief conspiracy theory magician of all.

53:42Can we all agree on one thing, though? CAN WE ALL AGREE ON ONE THING? WE HAVE TO ADMIT THAT WE'RE HAPPY THAT PRESIDENT TRUMP IS WORKING WITH THE CHILDREN WHO HAVE BEEN TRAFFICKED INTO THIS COUNTRY ILLEGALLY AND SENT INTO EITHER FORCED LABOR BECAUSE THEY'RE MAKING CHILDREN WORK. I THINK WE CAN ALL AGREE ON THAT. AND ALSO THE SEX TRADE. HE IS SAVING TENS OF THOUSANDS OF CHILDREN FROM THAT. AS WE SPEAK, THIS OTHER STUFF WILL SORT ITSELF OUT AND EVENTUALLY WILL COME OUT.

54:10Piers Morgan:YEAH, I THINK WE CAN AGREE ON THAT. BUT I DO THINK THE EPSTEIN SCANDAL HAS A LONG WAY TO RUN YET. THE BOTTOM LINE IS, GILAINE MAXWELL IS A WOMAN AND SHE'S BEEN THE ONLY PERSON SO FAR PUT IN PRISON AND HELD ACCOUNTABLE FOR WHAT EPSTEIN DID WITH ALL HIS MALE FRIENDS, TWO YOUNG WOMEN. I THINK WE SHOULD AGREE THAT THAT IS ABSOLUTELY IMPORTANT. YEAH. THAT ONE SPACTS IS JUST COMPLETELY DROPPING. YEAH. I'M AFRAGING WE 'VE RUN OUT OF TIME. I TELL YOU WHAT. VERY QUICKLY, VERY QUICKLY, CHENK. OTHERWISE WE 'LL DO AND FINALLY for the next two hours. Yeah, one last amazing fact for everybody to think about.

54:49Ghislaine Maxwell's dad was Robert Maxwell, legendary Mossad spy that stole Americans' nuclear secrets and gave them to Israel. So that legendary Israeli spy's daughter just happened to be involved in the Epstein case, and the U.S. government can't tell us who did it under Democrats or Republicans. That is very curious.

55:13Piers Morgan:Well, there's a lot of very curious unanswered questions here. And actually, I'm looking forward to Ghislaine Maxwell and what she's been saying, because I imagine the reason they've put her into a less high-security prison is that she's been singing like a canary. So we will find out. But anyway, it's been great to get the panel back. I feel like getting the old band back together was great. Let's do it again in four more months and see how all your predictions are fair then. Thank you all very much. Piers Morgan Uncensored is proudly independent. The only boss around here is me. If you enjoy our show, we ask for only one simple thing.

55:49Piers Morgan:Hit subscribe on YouTube and follow Piers Morgan Uncensored on Spotify and Apple Podcasts. And in return, we will continue our mission to inform, irritate and entertain. And we'll do it all for free. Independent, uncensored media has never been more critical and we couldn't do it without you.

56:09Thank you.