‘Iran Has NO IDEA!’ Jocko Willink on Trump, War & Running For President + Bryan Johnson SHOCK

19:31Jocko Willink:Well, I guess thank you, but again, you're trying to put me... You're trying to voluntary me for a job that I don't particularly want, but thank you.

19:41Piers Morgan:Let's get straight into the one thing I was really wanting to talk to you about, the Iran war, because I can't think of many people better qualified from their own extraordinary experience of combat and warfare to try and work out what is happening here, whether you think it's a good thing, a bad thing, how long it may take before we can answer that question and so on. So just first of all, what is your view of where this war has got to four months in?

20:13Jocko Willink:Well, I think one of the most important things to remember, And I think this is where a lot of people, they really get caught up in going in the wrong direction. And that is war is completely and utterly unpredictable. And any time in the past that we have had this idea that the way the war is going to unfold is what we think it will. And we've got a plan. We'll go execute the plan. And that's the way things will work. That has never worked out for us in the past. And so I think the idea of trying to predict exactly what's going to happen with this particular war is also kind of a lost cause. I think you have to, well, from the military perspective, there's something called an OODA loop, which is you observe what is happening.

20:52Jocko Willink:You orient yourself to what is going on and how you fit into it. And then eventually you decide what you're going to do. You take an action. Once you take that action, the loop starts again because you have to see what unfolds based on what you just did. And you do this over and over again, and you make constant small adjustments to try and see where you're going and what adjustments you need to make. And eventually, hopefully, you get to a place where you want to be. And I think that's been interesting to see with this particular war. We've headed in one direction, stopped, gone back in another direction, stopped, gone back in another direction, gone to negotiations, had a ceasefire, started bombing again, another ceasefire, more negotiations.

21:34Jocko Willink:and it seems like we're trying to figure out where this is going to go. And again, I think that's actually the only thing you can do is make adjustments as to what you're seeing real time in front of you.

21:45Piers Morgan:But when your mission statement, and again, I can't think of anyone better qualified to answer this, when your mission statement and position seems to change on the whim of a day today, and when the original goals, which were supposed to be achieved very quickly, clearly weren't achieved, And when you get into a longer war of the kind that Donald Trump always vowed he wouldn't get into, you know, it looks to me, I've known him a long time, that he wants to get out of this, but doesn't quite know how to get out of it. Because the Iranian regime remains there. It hasn't been taken out. The IRGC remain in control.

22:24Piers Morgan:The people haven't risen up in the way people were led to believe would probably happen. The Strait of Hormuz has become this secondary asymmetric warfare, if you like, where the Iranians pretty much controlling it to this day. Then you have all the attacks on the Gulf states and the damage that's done. You know, I look at it all and I think there's no enriched uranium has been handed over. There was the 12-day war last summer, which we were assured had put back the Iranian nuclear program decades. Well, then why are we attacking them eight months later to do exactly the same thing? None of it is making much sense to me.

22:58Piers Morgan:Does it make sense to you? Or as somebody who I imagine, just from what I've read about you, had very clear mission goals when you had men serving under you, because you understood that in warfare in particular, you've got to have that. You've got to know exactly what you're doing, how you're going to do it, what the exit strategy is, and what victory looks like. I don't see any of that here.

23:22Jocko Willink:Yeah, and I think from Trump's perspective, I would say he looks at things more like a business of, hey, the market is changing. The competitors are doing this. We need to make some adjustments based on what we're seeing in the market real time. And that's what he's doing. And at least that's what it looks like to me. And making these adjustments, you know, again, entering negotiations and announcing that looks like we've got a deal. And then a couple days later, launching bombs. that's what you do when you're trying to adapt to a situation that you're not exactly sure how it's going to end up.

23:57Jocko Willink:If you were serving, if you were serving, Jocker,

23:59Piers Morgan:if you were serving and that was going on, and every single day the commander-in-chief was posting stuff on social media, often completely contradicting what he said the day before, is that not incredibly unsettling for the military? Now, my brother was an army colonel in the British army. I know he says it's just like it's the ultimate nightmare. when the guy at the top is out there telling everyone what he's going to do. Then he doesn't do it. Then he does some of it. Then he says, these guys are great. Then he says they're all going to be killed. Then he says he's going to blow up Iran. Next day he wants to do a deal.

24:33Piers Morgan:And so on. This constant, contradictory stream of consciousness. If you're actually serving and you're risking your life during all this, it's going to be a nightmare, isn't it?

24:47Jocko Willink:I think it would definitely be challenging. And listen, you can talk to your brother that was in the army. The chain of command makes changes and it impacts at such a high level across the board. You know, one day you think you're doing something, the next day you think you're doing something else. The things changes all the time. In the military, we're used to that. But I'll tell you who I imagine is much more troubled by the seemingly erratic behavior of Donald Trump, and that is the Iranian leadership. I bet they are totally confused and have no idea what he's going to do next. And my guess is that's exactly where the president wants to keep them.

25:25Piers Morgan:I've argued that, you know, they haven't learned the lesson of history. I was editor of a big newspaper in the UK in 2003 when the Iraq war was started. I opposed that war very vociferously after on the front page for days and weeks. Tony Blair was the British prime minister. I took him on over it. I felt it was wrong at the time. I think it was wrong now. Interestingly, my understanding is that you think, on balance, the Iraq war was worth doing. A, is that correct? Is that what you think? And if so, why?

25:59Jocko Willink:Well, I mean, we'd have to break down all kinds of things to get into the conclusion of that argument. I think that there was a time in Iraq where we had really achieved something positive, and it looked like we were going to be able to eventually end up with an Iraqi state that is kind of moving in the right direction. Now, I will tell you, right before I came in here, I was watching President Trump and the new Prime Minister having a meeting in the White House. And it was a very positive meeting. Well, we have a clip. We have a clip. I'm going to play you, actually.

26:30Piers Morgan:Let's play that clip. Now you've mentioned it.

26:47Jocko Willink:We love Iraq. And they're well represented. This man just won a big election. They are very well represented, I can tell you that. Thank you very much.

26:59Piers Morgan:I can't imagine you reacting very well if that had been a US president in 2003, 4, 5, saying we love Iraq. But times change, times move on. We're 20 years plus on now from shock and awe. What do you feel about that? When you see President Trump greeting the Prime Minister of Iraq so warmly and saying, we love Iraq, what does that make you feel?

27:26Jocko Willink:Well, you've got to remember that even in 2004, 2005, 2006, we were fighting alongside Iraqi troops. We were supportive of their government. And to see this relationship grow is a very positive thing. That was the goal the whole time, was to form a good relationship and have a positive influence over Iraq and over the rest of the Persian Gulf. So I think this is great to see. I wish it would have happened earlier.

27:52Piers Morgan:I mean, my issue with the Iraq war was I never thought that there was conclusive evidence. It turned out there's a reason for that, that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction. And the similar rhetoric around Iran, that we've got to stop them developing weapons of mass destruction and so on. and I just felt like history was slightly repeating itself where you launch into an invasion, you commit a lot of forces and in the case of Iraq, ground forces. You were involved in some of the most brutal battles that America's ever seen. I'll come to that in a moment. And that Trump, I felt, got that.

28:29Piers Morgan:He always talked about, I didn't agree with the Iraq war. I wish it hadn't happened. If I'm president, we will not be doing these senseless wars in the Middle East. It's not going to happen. And yet here he is in the middle of, you know, arguably the biggest one imaginable, the biggest enemy in the Middle East, Iran, something that many presidents before him had been asked to join in an attack on and had always said no for quite solid reasons. You know, I just feel like he's taken a massive gamble here. Is it a gamble worth taking in your estimation?

29:06listen i think that it's interesting to think that perhaps trump is looking at the strategic

29:14Jocko Willink:situation long term for america and the world and he decided that what was most important in the long term for our kids and our kids kids is that iran does not have a nuclear weapon and if that's what he is trying to accomplish, it seems like he is doing a good job of ensuring that Iran does not have a nuclear weapon now or in the future. And if that's the gamble, if that's what he's putting on the table and he's trying to stop, it certainly looks like he is going to pull that off. Obviously, there's been some American casualties, and that's always horrible. But on the whole, it's been a relatively small number of casualties, and we're still making progress.

30:00Jocko Willink:I think this is sort of a new form of siege warfare. You know, like we saw in the past, you'd surround a castle and just wait them out. And it certainly seems like that is on a big picture what we are looking to do to Iran. It's a siege warfare, shut them down economically, continue to do damage to their infrastructure, and eventually, will they have the will to continue? I think that's the big question. When will their will break? And the only thing that's going to tell us that is time.

30:30Piers Morgan:Would you be comfortable about a commitment of a large number of ground forces going into Iran?

30:43Jocko Willink:I don't think that's going to be necessary. I don't think they have any capability to require a large number of ground forces going into Iran. I don't see it happening. I would have to see what situation unfolded that would demand that. But, you know, let me be clear. I'm not a big pro-war guy over here that wants us to run around invading countries. No.

31:11Piers Morgan:I mentioned earlier that you've been in some of the most ferocious battles imaginable. Your most famous, arguably, was the task unit bruiser. You were commanding task unit bruiser. during the Battle of Ramadi in Iraq in 2006. You led very iconic military figures like Chris Kyle, the American sniper. Ramadi was the epicentre of the Iraqi insurgency, one of the most dangerous places in the world at the time. And under your command, the task unit suffered heavy losses but achieved incredible tactical success. It became the most decorated special operations unit of the Iraq war, which is an extraordinary achievement.

31:53Piers Morgan:When you go through something like that, Jocko, what does that do to a man? What does it do to you?

32:05Jocko Willink:Well, interestingly, I think that combat like that and war in general and really military service, I think it makes people better. I think it makes you appreciate life more, appreciate freedom more, appreciate the opportunities that we have every single day. especially in America. And I think that going to war and seeing combat and seeing the sacrifices that get made strengthen all those feelings of patriotism and of really not wanting to waste any of this precious life and freedom that we have.

32:40Piers Morgan:What was the closest you personally came to death?

32:47Jocko Willink:I had, you know, rounds going overhead, had mortars land in my vicinity, but I was relatively lucky and never got wounded or anything like that. But there was obviously the Battle of Ramadi. The soldiers and Marines that we fought alongside suffered immense casualties. And that is, again, every day why I think about what we can do as individuals to make sure we live the best life we possibly can to honor those sacrifices.

33:22Piers Morgan:You, for the 250th anniversary of American independence, obviously we don't quite share your joy over here in the UK about that. We look at it slightly differently. And you made a little joke in your speech, Jocko, which I intend to have out with you. So let's listen to this.

33:39Jocko Willink:When we declared independence from Great Britain, the world's most powerful empire. And then we had to fight them. Now, the British had more men, more guns, more ships. But we had something the British did not have. You see, the British soldiers and officers, they were subjects of the king. But we would bow to no man. Our forefathers knew that there was something more important than king and crown. Something more important than safety or substance. An ideal more important than life itself. the founders of our country, for them, the most important thing was freedom.

34:47Piers Morgan:Now, my quibble with that would be that our royal family is pretty unique now around the world. There aren't many royal families, monarchies left. But they bring something a little different. I mean, they're not elected. That's obviously true. They don't have any actual democratic power as such in the sense that we have a working parliament and members of parliament. They do all that kind of stuff. The elected officials do that kind of thing. But they provide a kind of constancy and stability, which many people here find very reassuring. I'm thinking particularly of the reign of Queen Elizabeth II and now King Charles.

35:22Piers Morgan:When King Charles went to Washington recently, I thought it was great, the whole thing. And, you know, we don't feel like we're kind of subjects who are being ruled over in the old sense. They're just there now as figureheads. Do you not miss a bit of that, Jocko? Wouldn't you like the continuity of one family rising above all the political fray who could just be like your little standard bearers? Wouldn't you just... Isn't a little part of you slightly jealous of our monarchy, Jocko?

35:56Jocko Willink:Yeah, and I don't know if you know this, Pierce, but I'm actually married to a Brit. I did not know that. Not only do I have a, yes, I'm married to a Brit. And so I've spent many, I've spent a lot of time in England and I've always appreciated British history. I was also an English major in, when I went to college, I had to read Shakespeare and enjoyed reading Shakespeare and have been through that whole thing. So yes, I do have a great appreciation for England and British history. And of course, obviously, with my wife and her family and my kids, we are 100 % on board for England in the World Cup.

36:34Piers Morgan:So let's go. Well, I have a little plan here where if England do beat Argentina in the semifinal and then win the final, win the World Cup, of course, it would be an extraordinary moment where just literally days after you celebrate your 250th anniversary of independence, England returning glory to win the World Cup in New York, in New Jersey, the epicentre of the United States. And, you know, I have suggested to Donald Trump, this could be a moment, I was texting him on the 250th day, actually, this could be a moment to bring back the British monarchy. You know, clearly, if we're world champions of the most popular sport on earth and we win it in your backyard, it just feels like a natural evolution.

37:18Piers Morgan:and if you're looking for a first king to preside over you Jocko I'm willing to serve

37:25Jocko Willink:well I wouldn't hold your breath on that one but we have enjoyed great you know great partnership with with with the Brits and I was lucky enough to work with the Brits overseas and nothing but respect just absolute professional soldiers across the board they were outstanding to work with and we always appreciate our allies in the Brits.

37:47Piers Morgan:You have, I think, you've got four teenage kids, three girls and a son, is that right?

37:55Jocko Willink:That is, they're not really teenagers anymore. They're a little older now.

37:59Piers Morgan:Right. So there's an ongoing debate, isn't there, about masculinity. You know, people like to brand it toxic. We've had all the Me Too and Time's Up campaigns and so on. A lot of young men feeling sort of under siege, under attack, not quite sure how to behave anymore. They're gravitating to, you know, quite misogynist figures like Andrew Tate and people like this, which has been very unhealthy, I think. But they gravitate to them because they also see some positive things, getting fit, getting healthy, getting strong, getting mentally strong and so on. What do you feel about this? And what do you say to your son, and I'll come to your daughters, but what do you say to your son about how to navigate this new world we live in and how to be a man in an environment, an era, where a lot of masculine traits have been branded toxic?

38:53Jocko Willink:Yeah, I think if you take any human trait of any kind and you take it to an extreme, it will become toxic. If you take competitiveness and you take it to an extreme where now you're cheating or trying to maneuver and destroy people in order to win, that's problematic. If you take being assertive, which is a positive trait, but if you take it to extreme, you don't listen to anybody else. Even something very positive like generosity. Well, if you take generosity to an extreme, now you're going to be giving everything away and you're going to be taken advantage of. So you take any human characteristic and you take it to an extreme and it's going to become a negative, whether that's a positive, a masculine trait or a traditionally masculine trait or traditionally feminine trait.

39:36Jocko Willink:So what we have to do is teach people to be balanced and not take any of these traits that they have or characteristics to an extreme because when you take them to an extreme, they do become toxic. And, you know, I ended up writing a bunch of kids' books called Way of the Warrior Kid. It's a whole series, and it guides kids on how to navigate the world and be better people. And actually those are, those have been made into a movie and a movie that's coming out in November. So I think we're going to be able to spread the message, a good positive message about how to be good people in the world.

40:10Jocko Willink:And that's going to, I think it's really going to help out a lot of kids. And I think it's going to help their parents too.

40:15Piers Morgan:I'm trying to think what it must have been like for your daughter's boyfriends to turn up on your doorstep to take out one of your girls on a date. And I was reminded of when I interviewed Arnold Schwarzenegger. and his daughter, I think, was 15 at the time and had just started dating. And I said, well, how did you handle this? He said, well, when this young man turned up, I answered the door, raised myself to the biggest possible size I could and said, if you upset my daughter, I will terminate you. What does Jocko Willink do in that scenario?

40:49Jocko Willink:You know, my daughters are all great, great people and they have their own personalities. and they can completely handle themselves and don't need their dad to be looking over their shoulders. You know, they all train jujitsu. They're all good fighters. They all have good, strong minds, and their dad doesn't need to be looking over their shoulder. And even when they were younger, I told them, you know, I'm not always going to be here. You need to learn how to take care of yourself. You need to learn how to stand up for yourself. And my daughters all absolutely can stand up for themselves and look out for themselves, and they don't need their dad looking over their shoulders.

41:23Piers Morgan:Are you familiar with looks maxing, Jocker?

41:29Jocko Willink:Yeah, yeah, well, I mentioned that my kids are not teenagers, but they're still young enough to keep me filled in on all the internet drama that's going on. So, yes, I'm familiar with looks maxing.

41:40Piers Morgan:So I interviewed this kid, Clavicula, and a huge number of people watched the interview, and it was amazing the number of people in London, right, who knew about this 20-year-old American kid and looks maxing and so on, where you max out your looks. I mean, you're a handsome guy, Jocko. I know you've given up drinking, you're very fit, you keep very strong and healthy and so on. But are you tempted to veer into the full looks-maxing world? Smashing your bones up in your jaw with a tighter line?

42:11Jocko Willink:No, I think I'm perfectly fine the way I am. I was never the best-looking guy in the world. I'm doing okay. I married up. Like I said, I married up, so I'm doing all right. And what's really interesting about that clavicular character is what the internet did behind the scenes to get him so popular. There was something like 1 ,600 individual people that were making clips of him and producing hundreds of thousands of clips a month that were getting pushed out. And so it kind of artificially took over the algorithm, and that's how he became so popular. So you've got to be careful with that algorithm, people, especially kids.

42:50Jocko Willink:Just because you see something doesn't mean it's good for you, doesn't mean it's healthy, it doesn't mean it's right.

42:55Piers Morgan:Last time we chatted, you talked a lot about, you know, your personal sort of regime, how you like to start your day at 4.30. And we got some hilarious responses to this from viewers. One was Jocker started waking up at 4.30 a.m. when he was three so he could drop his parents off at work before kindergarten. Another said, when Jocko left the house at 18, he said to his dad, OK, you're the man now. And then someone said, wish Jocko had run for president. This is who we need. And then someone else said, you look like a male version of Matt Damon, which is a little bit harsh on Matt Damon. But a lot of reaction.

43:32Piers Morgan:A lot of people really fascinated by your personal self-discipline. Because I think the problem most people have in life is a failure to be self-disciplined enough. and it takes a lot of self-discipline, right? How do you... I mean, I feel very strongly... I'm a father of four kids, three sons and a girl, so the other way around to you. But the thing I've really detected is there's a whole generational thing going on with young kids, particularly since the advent of smartphones in 2010, where they just seem to be much more anxious about normal stuff in life, you know, grief, losing a job, You know, buying a car, buying a home, spitting up from a girlfriend, good, bad, whatever it may be.

44:16Piers Morgan:Normal life stuff seems to make young people much more anxious than it used to, for whatever reason. Have you seen this? And what is the best sort of mental strength toolkit to apply to...? Because I don't think we help these kids develop a mental strength toolkit enough to deal with life, because they obviously are struggling with it, for whatever reason.

44:40Jocko Willink:Well, they're struggling with it because life is hard. And it's not just hard for them, it's hard for everybody. You know, a couple years ago I was at a restaurant. And I'm at this restaurant, and a guy comes up to me, and he says, hey, can you come meet my buddy over here? And I end up in this conversation with these two individuals. They were both police officers, and one of them had been involved in an officer-involved shooting. It was a hostage situation. People had been wounded. People had been killed. He had been put on administrative leave from work. And obviously, he's having a hard time.

45:15Jocko Willink:And as I'm talking to him, I look at him and I said, oh, so do you have some regret over the way things went down? And he said, yeah. And I said, do you wish you would have done some things different? And he said, yeah. Do you feel like you're thinking about it all the time? And he said, yeah. I said, are you having some bad dreams about it? And he said, yeah. And I said, hey, all that is totally normal. This is normal. You went through a really traumatic situation. People got hurt. People got killed. You saw people get killed. That's a terrible thing to go through. And the fact that you're thinking about it and having some nightmares, that's normal.

45:54Jocko Willink:It's okay. And that's so many kids these days. They think that because they got dumped by their girlfriend or dumped by their boyfriend. And it hurts really bad. Guess what? We all went through that. That's part of life. You didn't get into the college you wanted. Okay, you're going to figure it out. So I think, and even with my youngest kids, when my kids were younger, I remember something happened at school. You know, one of them got called a name or something like that and was really distraught about it. And I kind of, you know, had the attitude of, well, who cares? But I realized in her world, that was a massive deal.

46:30Jocko Willink:You know, she's in a school, she's got a class, where there's only 50 kids in there and she's getting called some name by one of those kids, that's a terrible situation in her world. And so everybody's world, you're in it. It seems terrible, but you got to remember, you're not alone. Everybody's been called names. Everybody's been dumped. And everyone has lost family. They've lost their grandparents, their brothers, their sisters, their mothers, fathers. People die. These things happen. And so I think one of the best things we can do for kids and adults when they're going through tough times and they feel a certain way, instead of feeling like, oh, I get sad when I think about my friend that I lost.

47:14Jocko Willink:What's wrong with me? There's nothing wrong with you. You lost one of your friends. I mean, I lost some of my best friends. And, of course, when I think about them, do I get sad? Absolutely. Does that mean that there's something wrong with me? No, there's nothing wrong with me. I'm a human being. I had friends. I had connections. And those connections are gone. And I miss them. Does that mean there's something wrong with me? No. Actually, the opposite is true. That's totally normal. And you're doing okay. So let the kids know that you're going to have ups and downs in life. Life is really hard.

47:48Jocko Willink:Sometimes you're going to feel like you're getting knocked down. You don't feel like you can get up again. And everybody has felt that way. Well, I always read the... Stand back up.

47:57Piers Morgan:Get back to your feet. I always quote the Rocky Balboa speech to his son, you know, the famous one about life's not how hard you can hit, it's how hard you get hit, get back up and keep moving forward. That's how winning is done in life. That is so true, right? It just is true. It's how you deal with adversity. It determines how happy your life is. Because we're all going to have to deal with it. You don't get a pass from life's difficult stuff. It's going to come, often when you least want it to. There's an interesting debate went on recently with a guy called Stephen Bartlett. I don't know if you know Stephen, but he does the Diary of a CEO podcast.

48:31Piers Morgan:Very, very popular. And he's a good friend of mine. I like him very much. He's very successful. But he sparked a big debate on wellness culture when he revealed that drinking three glasses of wine ruined the next three days of his life. He attributed the multi-day fallout to disrupted sleep, cortisol and dopamine imbalances, skipping the gym, lower performance on his podcast, all of which he monitored via his Whoop wearable. and he got kind of mercilessly mocked for this, right? And even I was like, come off it, Bartlett, three glasses of wine. I mean, this is not going to have three cataclysmic days of impact on your life the way you're telling it.

49:10Piers Morgan:But, you know, you used to drink heavily when you were a Navy SEAL and then you gave up completely. Did you know what he was getting at here, that he's not really a big drinker and he just was making the point that when he does, it just throws him off and he doesn't like that feeling? Would you empathize with that?

49:30Jocko Willink:Yeah, I think he's making a good point. I mean, he's making a little bit too of an extreme. And I know him as well. He's a great guy, super nice guy. And I think he was probably breaking it down to the nth degree. And maybe it sounds a little bit extraordinary when he explains it. But let's face it, drinking is not good for you. It's not going to help any aspect of your life. And, you know, when I got out of the military, you know, like you said, I drank while I was in the military. It's part of the culture inside the military. And I just kind of went along with it, didn't think much of it at the time.

50:03Jocko Willink:When I got out of the military and I just slowly stopped drinking and eventually I looked around and I saw too many people that I know that had completely destroyed their lives from alcohol, completely destroyed their lives. and when I started weighing that complete destruction of people's lives versus maybe you have a nice night with your friends, it just didn't add up anymore. And so now I'm very anti-alcohol, anti-drugs at this point in my life, for sure. I love a drink, that's the problem.

50:39Piers Morgan:I don't like getting drunk drunk very often, but I like a nice glass of wine, a nice pint of beer. I couldn't imagine suddenly just never dealing with that. I mean, do you ever have a little hankering, a little devil on your shoulder? Say, come on, Jocko, one isn't going to hurt.

50:56Jocko Willink:The last time I had a pint of Guinness was at the England game World Cup four years ago. So I don't know. Tomorrow could be my lucky day for another pint.

51:06Piers Morgan:Just final question for you, Jocko. I'd love talking to you. Thank you so much for coming back on. I was always struck by a speech that Admiral McRaven made at a commencement ceremony when he talked about if you want to succeed in life, just sort out the basic small stuff first. And he famously talked about get up and make your bed. What's the thing that you would say if it's not making a bed? What do you do? What should people do with that kind of mindset to get their lives in the right way?

51:39Jocko Willink:Yeah, so people always ask me, do you make your bed when you wake up in the morning? And I always say no because my wife's still in my bed when I wake up in the morning. I would say the most important thing that I think will have the biggest impact is when you wake up in the morning, go and do some kind of physical activity. I don't care if you go for a jog, go for a walk, do some push-ups, do some yoga, but waking up in the morning and starting off with some kind of physical activity improves every aspect of your life. And furthermore, I heard a quote from RFK Jr. who said, if you find a healthy person, They have a thousand problems and a sick person only has one.

52:19Jocko Willink:And I think we really, everyone needs to prioritize their health every single day. And it's one of those things where, listen, if I don't work out today or I don't go to the gym today, is it going to ruin my life? Nope. It's not really going to be even noticeable. But that day turns into another day, turns into another day, turns into another day. And all of a sudden your health is at risk. So if I would encourage anybody to do anything to help square away their life, wake up in the morning and do some kind of physical activity first thing, and it will make your entire life a little bit better.

52:52Piers Morgan:You know, it's interesting because I broke my hip a few months ago. And as I was doing the rehab, it's obviously torturous. But, you know, I began to walk every day more and more each day. And it was very painful to start with and very slow and very laborious. but I actually got to really like just getting up quite early and going for an hour-long walk and it really cleared my head. So I was actually feeling increasingly healthy despite the fact I was physically a bit battered and it just reminded me, I mean, I had the same thing in the pandemic when all you could do was walk around, that actually just going for a walk, actually, clearing your head, you know, it's actually, it's free exercise.

53:29Piers Morgan:You haven't got to pay anyone. Just get out there and do a bit of walking. Final question, this is coming from one of my producers.

53:34Jocko Willink:Free exercise, and that's a great place to start.

53:36Piers Morgan:Yeah. Final question for one of my producers. He's a combat movie nutjob, which explains some of his behavioral pattern. If you could only watch one combat movie, what would it be? It would be the HBO series The Pacific. Ah, great series. Great series. Good call. Very good call. And of all the combat heroes, who's most like you?

54:04Jocko Willink:Well, I don't know who's most like me, but the person I learned the most from and looked up to the most is a guy named Colonel David Hackworth, who wrote a book called About Face, which is my favourite book of all time. And he had the biggest impact on me and the way I tried to lead, trying to emulate his example.

54:21Piers Morgan:How would you like to be remembered?

54:25Jocko Willink:I just hope my kids think I was a decent dad.

54:30Piers Morgan:You know what? You actually, in the end, if you don't get that, You failed in life, I think. Jocko Willink, what a pleasure to talk to you. Thank you very much indeed for sparing the time.

54:41Jocko Willink:Thanks for having me. Good seeing you.

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