“It's a DISASTER!” James Gunn Turns Superman Woke! | With Nerdrotic & Dean Cain

0:00Hey Chicago, class it up with Crocs. You know back to school is coming in fast. So why wait to find your new fave footwear? Step into a local Crocs store and step into your new look. Try it. Style it. Make it yours. Because the right pair doesn't just show up, it shows off. First day fits, handled. Walk out ready for whatever's next. Visit your nearest Crocs store today. Superman's actually a refugee. Isn't that an immigrant? They're trying to equate those things together, which I think is ridiculous because of the current politicization of that situation. James Gunn is not the kind of guy who's going to put an American flag in his front yard during Fourth of July.

0:44And that's the kind of guy you need to be to create Superman. I did not like this movie at all. Every man in this movie is weak and he cries. Chris, there is one silver lining here,

0:54Piers Morgan:which I think you touched on. Dresses, short skirts, high heels, cleavage. Thank you, James Gunn, for that. Hollywood's been trying to remove masculinity for it seems like the last decade. Once again, it needs to be white boy summer to bring people back to the box office. The new Superman movie has been the subject of intense debate and anticipation, which began more than a year before its release. It could be a make-or-break moment for the waning dominance of superhero movies and for cinematic blockbusters writ large. Some fans were energised by the prospect of a MAGA Superman when the first trailer was released.

1:31Piers Morgan:Director James Gunn's remarks that Superman is an immigrant, however, prompted Fox News to label it Super Woke. So is it going to be a classic or kryptonite? Joining me with their blistering whistle-stop verdict, Superman himself, actor Dean Cain, Gary Buchler, a.k.a. Nerdrotic from the Nerdrotic YouTube channel, Jeremy Griggs from Geeks and Games, and publisher at Film Threat, Chris Gore. Well, welcome to all of you. Right. Dean, let's start with you as the resident Superman expert. You played him. Your view of this new movie. Well, I'm excited for it. First of all, these guys all know more about Superman than I do.

2:07I promise you that right now.

2:08Piers Morgan:All geniuses. They've never been Superman. That's the key difference. Yeah. Except in their own mirrors. I'm sorry. I'm excited for this film. I was excited to see it. It looked like a lot of fun. James Gunn had a lot of humor in that original Guardians of the Galaxy. I was excited for it. I still am excited for it, but, you know, the idea of they start talking politics and Superman is an immigrant, Superman's actually a refugee and was adopted and assimilated into American culture tremendously well, and so that's a little bit different than I think. Isn't that an immigrant? No. No? It's a refugee.

2:44Piers Morgan:Refugees are immigrants, so are they, really? Yeah, but you've got to understand, Pierce, the United States is the most immigrant-friendly country on the planet by far. We take more than the next four countries, legal immigrants, every year, more than the next four countries combined every single year. Right, so why would you mind if a narrative is that Superman's an immigrant? Why wouldn't that be a thing to celebrate? No, I don't mind that narrative, but the truth is, he is a refugee. He is a child and a refugee. It's because they're trying to equate those things together, which I think is ridiculous because of the current politicization of that situation.

3:22So that's the part that makes me go, look, don't try and make it all woke and crazy. Keep that character as, you know, the way I like him is truth, justice and the American way. And I was hoping that would be the case in this film. And I hope it is the case. And I'm still looking forward to it.

3:37Piers Morgan:OK, let me bring in the Jotty. What do you feel about this? I mean, I've read quite a few reviews spinning around online. and the general view is it's not bad bordering on quite good that it's not as political as people are trying to frame it what's your view oh it's not woke at all uh uh what what variety was doing mark milken uh particularly because he's really good at his job is baiting adult pretenders into saying something stupid and they did uh and i overall despite what i felt about the trailers I thought the marketing was they at least tried to be fun and you didn't have like Rachel Zegler out there pissing people off for two years.

4:19And it was at that last minute.

4:20Piers Morgan:By the way, I have breaking news on her. I went to the first night of Evita in London's West End. She's the lead and she was absolutely brilliant. So even though she's very irritating in her public pronouncements of a woke nature and she basically bombed the Snow White movie because of it, she's actually an incredibly talented performer. Can you ask her to stay over into those do those plays? Yeah, I was going to say, that's great. Can you keep her? That will make us all happy. We're happy to hear that she was great. I tweeted her and sent it to her on X to say, look, just park the politics and the woke stuff and focus on your incredible talent.

4:58Piers Morgan:We'll all be very happy. Anyway, back to Superman. Back to Superman. Back to Superman. Yeah. Despite all of that last-minute trip where Fox News said it was woke and people were worried it's going to be political. No, that's not the problem with this movie. The problem with this movie is it's overwhelmingly whelming. It's just mid at best. I know some people are going to like it. Somebody here absolutely hates it. And we're going to get back to like a normal conversation with this, the kind I used to have in my comic shop where we'd be just fighting over plot points and story structure and adaption of character or interpretation of character in the comic shop.

5:36And the discourse is going to be crazy. I will say without a doubt, the Snyder bros out there are going to have a field day with this.

5:43Piers Morgan:Well, let's find a Snyder bro. Jeremy. I'm definitely not a Snyder bro. Zack Snyder does not like me, and I don't like his movies, but I liked his version of Superman better than this one. Now, I was looking forward to this movie. I like James Gunn's stuff. I've liked all of his Guardians movies. I even liked his movie that he didn't direct it, but Brightburn, it was like an evil take on Superman, and I enjoyed that one. I did not like this movie at all. This movie, it drove me crazy because Superman is very weak in the movie and he's always in a defensive state. Always. It's not overly political or anything like that.

6:21They're not beating you over the head with the immigration stuff. None of that is happening. But when you start to pick it apart, it actually has a lot of elements where every man in this movie is weak and he cries and they're all emotional.

6:34Piers Morgan:Is that true? They're all emotional. They're all emotional. This is what they did with James Bond. They turned him from a steely-eyed dealer of death, who, you know, romance woman after woman, who drank heavily, smoked, shot people, and they turned him into this blubbing critic. Yes. And I was like, why would you do that? And now they're doing Superman. Why are they all going to cry? He's never, like, stoic. He's never a person that commands the moment. This is Superman. when Superman is in your presence, you should be in awe of that moment at all times. And half the time they're treating him like he's the dumb jock in school, but we have to kind of respect him because he can throw the football far.

7:16That's kind of how they treat Superman in this, where they're kind of like, what do you do? And they second guess him. He always needs help. And I didn't like it. And again, I want to preface this. This is not against James Gunn. I hate James Gunn as a person, but I love him as a director. I think he's a phenomenal director. I think he's a great director and all of his stuff has been good, but none of it worked. The comedy was weird. Crypto made me like Baby Yoda. That's how annoying Crypto was in this. He was so aggravating.

7:44Piers Morgan:Let's bring Chris in because he loved it. Chris, why did you love it? Well, I can't say that I loved it. I enjoyed it more than Jeremy and Gary, I guess. But it is flawed. It is a movie for kids. This is kids and families will eat this up. it's a gen z tiktok generation superman absolutely for short attention spans it feels like the movie feels like a recap video of the first season of a superman tv series it moves so quickly and once it's like jangling keys every scene every scene jangling keys but the thing it gets right is the character of superman i think this is early in his heroic career so he's making more and more mistakes.

8:29I like David Cornswit. At the same time, they changed the lore about his Kryptonian heritage, and I despise that change. I hope they fix it at some point in the future. Crypto, I didn't mind. People love dogs. But this is so the polar opposite of what Zack Snyder did, a more adult vision of Superman, a more serious approach. And James Gunn took literally the opposite approach on almost every choice it's colorful it's goofy it's much more comedic and uh you know a lot of comedy doesn't land but some of it's very good you know so

9:08Piers Morgan:i feel i feel very proprietorial about superman because he's a he's a reporter right he's a journalist he's one of us so the fact that superman actually is a journalist is a big deal for the world of journalism. We get unfairly berated around the world. And here's one of our own who's actually Superman. So let me come back to you, Dean. A present company accepted. Who's been your favourite Superman? Who is to you the epitome on screen of what Superman should actually be? Mine would be Christopher Reeve. Mine is also Christopher Reeve. I just thought the first was the best. He was Superman. Yeah, no question about it.

9:50I remember the movie when it came out. I believed a man could fly. I had seen the George Reeves show, and I'd seen that. But when I saw Christopher Reeve on screen, when I saw him do that, he became the definitive Superman to me. And even as he went on, I didn't see the last couple of them, but the first few were outstanding. And even when I played Superman, because in my incarnation, Clark Kent was the character and Superman was the disguise. So I just sort of pretended I was Christopher Reeve. And he is my favorite Superman. He's my number one Superman. I thought he had that great combination of sincerity and strength at the same time, that little wink in the eye, that little twinkle in the eye.

10:34That's Superman to me, and that, to me, is the number one Superman. Well, not a Superman.

10:38Piers Morgan:It's how James Bond should always have remained as well. Well, I agree with you there. Now, Nodrotik, this issue of the political side of it, there is a fictitious, militarised nation of Baravia, which has, with US backing, been planning to invade the poor and illiquid country of Jahanpur. Many people, a kid in Jahanpur calls out Superman, he knows that help isn't coming from other countries on Earth, he needs something divine, something stupid to save him. Many people are saying this is clearly Israel-Palestine, Jahanpur is Palestine, and that therefore it's an anti-Israel movie because it portrays the invaders as the bad guys etc i mean did you get that feeling from it not at all uh i i think this the screen screenplay was done before october 7th and i think you can put that allegory i mean you could also look at it as uh like uh russia versus brown ukraine too minus the u.s backing uh but it was all manipulated by lex it was so comical and it wouldn't really be a great representation because the uh country of brown people just sat around in the desert the whole time waiting for superman to show up in the movie it's done very comic book uh so yeah i i'm sure people will try to impress that impression put that impression on it but it it wasn't there it was just there i had a gag i had a major moment last night because my daughter suddenly is 13 nearly 14 going on 34 and she said to me let's have a movie night as it was just me and her on last night.

12:16Piers Morgan:I said, great. And then thinking hopefully it won't be one of those 13-year-old girl movies. And she went, why don't we watch Top Gun Maverick? Which I think, Nandronic, you certainly know, is one of my favourite movies ever. And we sat and watched it and she absolutely loved Top Gun Maverick, which for me is a massive breakthrough moment as a father. But it means I can now segue her into Rocky, I can segue her into The Godfather. There's no limit now. Once we've crossed the Rubicon of Top Gun Maverick. Will she like the drossy, do you think, this Superman, if she likes Top Gun Maverick, or is he going to be too young?

12:53Piers Morgan:I don't think she will. Hey, Chicago, class it up with Crocs. You know back to school is coming in fast. So why wait to find your new fave footwear? Step into a local Crocs store and step into your new look. Try it. Style it. Make it yours. because the right pair doesn't just show up. It shows off. First day fits handled. Walk out ready for whatever's next. Visit your nearest Croc store today. Top Gun Maverick is one of the best films of the last decade easily. And this is at very best forgettable. It's absolutely forgettable. There's no through line. The characters are paper thin. and ultimately James Gunn was not the right guy for the job.

13:43We all, in the nerd sphere, we all questioned if this guy who was really good at taking quirky characters, including a raccoon and making them relatable, could he do something with a traditional character? Is James Gunn the kind of, he admitted himself that he couldn't crack Superman until a couple of years ago. James Gunn is not the kind of guy who's going to put an American flag in his front yard during 4th of July. And that's the kind of guy you need to be to create Superman, to direct a Superman, to write a Superman.

14:10Piers Morgan:OK, so Jeremy, there's been some pretty snippy reviews. Even The Guardian didn't like it. The Man of Steel, played with square-faced soullessness by David Corrensweat, has an uninteresting crisis of confidence in Gunn's clattered, pointless franchise restarts. The Times said James Gunn's turn the ninth big-screen film into an indigestible mush. Empire's Take, The Biggest Saving Grace, Crypto, but cheeky cape-wearing, canine psychic, mate, Superman may not be a great movie, but crypto's a very good dog. But then Time Out says David Corenswit is the best man of steel since Christopher Reeve. So what's your view of what they're saying there?

14:52Well, the best man of steel since Christopher Reeve, of course, would be the man on the panel with this. Right there. I mean, so... Thank you. Oh, you meant Dave. Oh, yeah, definitely not Jim Pierce. But anyway, but no, I mean, this is the problem with this movie and i think with chris bringing up the tiktok mindset is that's the the mindset this this movie moves so fast and it ultimately is it's just a bad mix james gunn works perfectly with the marvel cinematic universe but the marvel cinematic universe doesn't work perfectly with dc characters who are more you know darker and a little more grounded at times and need a more serious tone and that's really what happened here i'm not against the mcu i recently one of the few people in my sphere that liked thunderbolts and most people gary hated that movie um and so it's not about that i'm against the mcu tone it's that it doesn't work for superman superman needs to be taken seriously it doesn't mean it can't be fun you go back to the christopher reeve movies there's some whimsical goofy stuff in those movies as well but superman is taken seriously when Superman needs to be taken seriously.

16:00And none of those moments happen in this. He is on the defense. The majority of this movie. Yeah. I don't like the sound of that. Yes. He is always needing someone else's help. Yeah. Always. Not only that, it's my pocket are stupid, dumb rednecks. And I'm from Alabama. So I get allowed to say that. Okay. It's like my family is my pocket. They're stupid and they're dumb in this movie. And you are a stupid, dumb redneck, Jeremy. That is true. I'm thinking if you're going to cast some dumb rednecks, call my family. I mean, come on. What are we doing? But Ma and Pa Kent are very stupid to the point where you're like, okay, how did you raise this guy if you're this stupid?

16:43And I don't want to give a mega spoiler, but there's a huge, huge twist to Superman's story with his other parents, his real parents, that cancels out this whole movie. Okay. It's a disaster. It's a disaster what they did. It bothers me. It's worse than Pa... Sorry, Dean. Apologies. It's worse than Pa Kent getting sucked up into a tornado. It's actually worse than that scene. It's worse than that. We need to get the words out. I was so pissed. It must be horrific. Which bothers me, though.

17:16Piers Morgan:I want to ask Chris, though. Because, Chris, there is one silver lining here, which I think you touched on. You said it's also refreshing to see women allowed to be sexy in a modern Hollywood movie. heels, skirts, cleavage, and so on. It's shocking. So you notice it when you see it. I mean, heterosexual or normal relationships are under attack in Hollywood movies. And seeing women allowed to be women, dresses, short skirts, high heels, cleavage, much cleavage. Thank you, James Gunn, for that. It's weird to see because it's absent from all the Marvel fare. All the women are desexualized. They're not allowed to truly be women.

17:58They're kind of like, they have that Florence Pugh kind of nothing body.

18:03Piers Morgan:It's like the Bond girls have all basically gone non-binary. They've got to get them back. I'm hoping that Amazon are going to reverse this trend. They've got to bring the glam back. Make Bond what he was originally and bring the glam Bond girls back. He needs his mojo back. Yes. It is to stop crying and start, you know, just being shagging. Dean, I want to play you a clip. This is from you and Terry Hatcher in Superman, of course, the TV series. Let's take a look. Hey, you got to play stay tonight, son. He can stay with me. Don't you think all the mirrors above the bed would keep him awake? Count on it.

18:41Piers Morgan:How hard can it be? Handsome, hot Superman, hot woman on his arm, another hot woman trailing after him. That's what you want of the movies. Was Dean Cain in that scene? I didn't see him anywhere. I saw Terry Hatcher. I saw Terry Hatcher. I didn't see Dean Cain anywhere. As you should. As you should. I think a lot of women saw Dean Cain in that clip, trust me. But Dean, I mean, it seemed like happier, simpler times for Superman. Less complicated. Which I love. But here's the thing that Jeremy said that really caught my attention was that Ma and Pa Kent were really stupid, which drives me crazy because him being raised by Ma and Pa Kent are those small town American values that makes him who he is.

19:26And that just kills me because we had that in our show. We also had beautiful women. And I think Terry Hatcher was the best Lois Lane of all time. So we were we were very blessed. But I thought that was so important because in my own life, my dad is a small town farmer from South Dakota. and by my most difficult times, I could go to him and he would give me great advice with great morals and great values. And that's so much of what I thought Superman was and why he was uniquely American, which is why I love truth, justice, and the American way.

19:54Piers Morgan:You know, it's interesting. I mean, it's been a massive debate about whether the Formula One Brad Pitt movie was going to be a hit because the narrative was Americans don't care about Formula One, even though Drive to Survive, the TV series, the streamer series, had done surprisingly well in America. Anyway, it's now turned out it's been a hit, certainly exceeded expectation. And I guess in the end, Adrotic, in the end, money and success will talk, right? If this movie is a big hit, a big commercial success, then all the narrative about, well, he's too weepy, he's too this, he's too comedic, it's all going to disappear and it'll be Superman's back better than ever.

20:38yeah unfortunately uh superman isn't very super in his own film as opposed to f1 where bad brad hit is great and what f1 did right was make a it didn't try to reinvent the wheel uh for lack of a better analogy but it it made a sports movie a racing movie yeah and i don't know anything about f1 and i loved it right i absolutely loved it i heard it was like days of thunder but for formula one yep yes yes in other words i know i'm gonna love it already

21:06Piers Morgan:It's like, of course, Route 1. Just give us what we want. Stop overthinking movies. Top Gun Maverick was the most, like, brilliant sequel ever because they just, everything was a nod to the first one. It was exciting. It was dramatic. It was the perfect length. And I think the same with this Formula 1. I haven't seen it yet. I can't wait to see it from the reviews I've read, many of which were like, eh, it's not this, it's not that. You know what? In that case, I'm going to love it. It doesn't overthink what's on the tin. It turns out people still want to see the traditional male lead. They do.

21:40Something that Hollywood has been trying to remove masculinity for it seems like the last decade. And now, once again, it needs to be white boy summer to bring people back to the box office.

21:52Piers Morgan:I don't know if I've told you this, but I bumped into Barbara Broccoli recently at a dinner. I was actually sitting with Dame Judi Dench. So imagine the dynamic, right? And Barbara Broccoli comes over. I've never met her. And I said, I know you're looking for a new Bond. I said, I think it's time you went a little bit older, a little bit suave-er, a little bit of grey in the hair, and bring him back as a steelier-eyed dealer of death with a little twinkle in his eye. And she said, what are you thinking, Piers? I said, well, it's not a massive leap from Piers Brosnan to Piers Morgan. And she said, it may not be to you, Piers, but to me, it's Grand Canyon-sized.