Paradise, Vanished, and Dirty Business. With guest Jennifer Garner

5:31Jennifer Garner:It is completely. No, I'll tell you why, though. Because pretty much none of the 27 years of writing that I've done for Heat magazine is online. We've never put anything...

5:42Boydy:Didn't exist when boys started doing on Slate.

5:45Jennifer Garner:Exactly. Mobile phones in the internet did not exist back in 1999. But it's true. We don't put any of my stuff on, any of the stuff in the magazine online. Quite rightly, I think. You have to pay for the magazine to get to read our copy. And it just doesn't exist. So I can't get... And AI is all about, isn't it? The one thing I do know about AI, and I don't know much, is that it's just...

6:04Boydy:It trawls the internet and harvest.

6:06Jennifer Garner:It trawls everything for what is there on the internet. If something isn't on the internet and never has been, it's not going to see it. It's not going to find it.

6:11Boydy:Can I just say something? I would not put it past James to single-handedly go back to the archives and type up every one of your reviews. Do you think that's what he's been doing? Yeah. So when you think he's watching TV...

6:21Jennifer Garner:In between re-watches of the West Wing, he's digitizing my... Oh, maybe you're right. I call it the Boyd Bot 2000. Oh, God. It's my little AI Boyd companion. Oh, God. Instead of it's a boogle, it's a bay eye.

6:34Boydy:Oh, no.

6:35Jennifer Garner:Very good. Anyway, I think, yeah, so I feel misguidedly, maybe, but in my own mind, I'm fine, I'll be fine. They can't replace me. If they want to literally replicate how I write, then they can't replace me. Obviously, they can get a computer. Unless they transcribe this podcast.

6:49Boydy:But anyway. Exactly. Where were we at? What have you been watching? Yes, so AI Confidential with Hannah Fry. So I've been ignoring all these kind of shows, but I was reviewing it. And I have to say it's fascinating because she looks at the impact of chatbots. And both the positive and negative, so you see how it can help with people who are lonely and with people dealing with grief. but also the other side of things like the influence that chatbot especially like chatbot girlfriends in inverted commas can have on people so they use the example of um british Sikh Jaswan Singh um who basically was encouraged by his chatbot girlfriend in his plan to assassinate Queen Elizabeth um yeah and um it's just it's so it is informative but it's so deeply disturbing how far it can go it's also fascinating because um it was kind of like looking at people who aren't vulnerable necessarily but who are you know they for example one guy was um working with ai a chat to work on his thesis because it was about ai um and made him so sort of paranoid um that he had you know psychosis so it's really fascinating to watch um that is on monday 23rd of february bbc one and nine o 'clock and the second thing i've been watching james is we might regret this so that is on BBC2 10 o 'clock I handily haven't written down the day of the week but it's of this week that the pod comes out Boyd I'm sure will look it up while I talk and that's the comedy pull your finger out Boydo

8:19Jennifer Garner:it's a bay eye yeah

8:20Boydy:pull your finger out otherwise we'll replace you

8:22Jennifer Garner:Boyd Bot 2000 has in fact already come up with that information but I won't share it you carry on Boyd shut up

8:29Boydy:it's the comedy from Kyla is it Kyla Harris and Lee Getty and it's about the the tetraplegic Canadian artist Freya, played by Harris. And it's inspired by their friendship, Harris and Getty's friendship. And it's about how she negotiates life and love in London. I think we reviewed it, in fact. Yeah, we reviewed season one, series one. It's so funny, consistently funny and well-observed. In this series, the first episode, she is newly engaged to Darren Boyd's character and she's tellingly trying to, you know, like kind of elongate their engagement, kick that can down the road. But her managers, the Oliviers, who are so annoying and well, exactly, you know, you can see their inspiration in real life.

9:16Boydy:They're highly excitable and ridiculous. And they have decided she's going to have a collab with a bridal wear visionary, Beanie Elroy, played by Sophie Thompson, who is on excellent, excellent form as this kind of eccentric Mazda who, yeah, is going to design a dress for her. So anyway, get on board with that. We might regret this. BBC2, 10pm. Boyd? What day, Kate? Tell me. Do you know? No?

9:43Jennifer Garner:Wednesday. Wednesday at 10pm. Wonderful. I can reveal. 2026.

9:48Boydy:So, so funny. Get on it. We'd normally be in the also on section.

9:52Jennifer Garner:We can do it in both sections. That's the way we roll.

9:57Boydy:Boyd, what have you been watching?

9:58Jennifer Garner:I've got one that's also in the also on section, which is, you may remember a while ago, in fact, it was on my birthday, 2025, 9th of December. McCartney. Yes, exactly. Well remembered, Kay. Susie, you do listen, unlike some other people in this room. What was that? It's the Paul McCartney's solo years documentary, Man on the Run, which is not a new, it sounds like it's a new limited series crime thriller, but that's just a pun on Band on the Run of course his classic album and song that he did with Wings the band The Beatles could have been Alan Partridge, famous Alan Partridge which I wheel out every opportunity and it's a genuinely I absolutely loved it it takes you from the last days of The Beatles how they kind of split up by stealth they didn't really make a big announcement or anything he just kind of left the band really and it all kind of like dwindled out.

10:58Jennifer Garner:Is that a word? Anyway, it kind of petered out, if you like. Thank you. Pauled out, really. Yeah. Or beetled out. Beetled out. All of these things work. And then he created his first solo albums and which were kind of very different to the last days of the Beatles. They were kind of very more simple, kind of direct affairs. And then he created the band Wings, the aforementioned band Wings with his wife Linda and how controversial that was or how that was kind of like she was often patronised by critics and looked down upon by critics that she was part of the band, etc. But best of all, he still produced so much brilliant music after The Beatles.

11:36Jennifer Garner:I mean, I absolutely love and adore The Beatles, especially The Beatles from growing up onwards. But this is a really good reminder that he also, after The Beatles ended, did some absolutely brilliant solo stuff. Maybe I'm Amazed, one of the greatest songs ever written is a Paul McCartney solo classic, Band on the Run as well, that song. and they kind of the way they use that music there's quite long live performances they show sometimes in full they just utilise the music to the full whilst getting testimony from him and everyone who worked with him and it's brilliantly done very good what channel?

12:08Jennifer Garner:it is on Amazon it's on Prime Video

12:10Boydy:you keep on doing that Boydo I know but I still say

12:13Jennifer Garner:they've got to tell their talent working on all this stuff not to call it Amazon Prime Video

12:16Boydy:every email comes in bold with please do not say please just call it

12:19Jennifer Garner:Prime Video it's on Prime Video on Friday the 27th of February, 2026. Then I wanted to mention, and my weekly, this is a weekly slot, effectively, where I talk about how brilliant industry is. But I make no apologies about it because episode six just aired as we're speaking now. And episode six was the one I was waiting for people to catch up on because it has some absolutely outrageous Lord Muck, Kit Harington sex action that just arrives. And what I loved about it was, among many other things, is that the first 15 minutes builds up to this sequence that just kind of suddenly arrives. in this kind of like underground sex club type situation.

12:56Jennifer Garner:And then the titles kick in. So you kind of get, it gets that way, that far into the episode.

13:02Boydy:How many minutes, do you say?

13:03Jennifer Garner:I think it's 16, 15, 16 minutes in. Wow, that's a long time. It's a long time, yeah. And suddenly the credit arrives, industry. And it's so brilliantly done. I love a late credit anyway. It's going back to the O.I., of course, the all-time classic where the episode one title sequence arrives, I think 17 minutes in pretty much before the show ends.

13:19Boydy:I would appreciate if it came like, how long was it? An hour?

13:22Jennifer Garner:Yeah.

13:22Boydy:I want it on the 58th minute.

13:24Jennifer Garner:And I know what you mean. To show real kind of guts. Yeah, show real commitment to the late credit sequence ploy. But as an episode, it's got so much going on apart from that as well. Like incredible machinations with, and it just reaches peak industry. I think it might be the best episode, or at least my favourite episode, of the whole thing so far, including series one and two. There's so much going on. There's so many twists and turns and double crosses and people using what other people have done to kind of blackmail them. It's just brilliant. So, yeah, industry continues to be fantastic. I wanted to mention, would I lie to you, I mentioned last week, you know, the Graham Norton show.

14:06Jennifer Garner:So in the light entertainment world, which I know isn't core values of this podcast, but nevertheless, there was a classic episode, would I lie to you, the best panel show on TV, with Jason Isaacs and Richard Osman. But to see Jason Isaacs on a TV comedy panel show was just kind of weird. How did he do? He did really well. I mean, he did what he always does. He's a brilliant raconteur and anecdotalist. So he kind of told some brilliant classic Jason Isaacs anecdotes, which may or may not have been true in the Would I Like To You format. But he did very well. And he bounced. Richard Osman was really good on it as well.

14:38Jennifer Garner:So that was fun. And finally, Jonathan Ross's chat show. He's about talking of Jonathan Ross. You're about to host a thing with him. I'm furious and jealous. and he's back with his chat show and you remember I was talking about how with Graham Norton they had a brilliant line-up the other week with various people who turned out to have great chemistry together the people from Wuthering Heights Amanda Seyfried and others well Jonathan had a great line-up last week we had Nev Campbell from Scream the new Scream 7 Archie Madekwe who's a brilliant young actor who's been nominated for the BAFTA Young Person Award whatever that's called do you know what it's called?

15:14Jennifer Garner:is that the rising star award that's it the rising star which by the way by the time this is will have been decided yes this weekend this weekend upcoming so yeah but it was all great and they did like a scream competition between them so they all screamed and Alan Carr obviously Alan Carr and Jonathan Alan was on it yeah Alan was on it so Alan just phenomenal he's even better he's even more brilliant as himself than he was pre-celebrity traitors so to see these two celebrity traitors and genuine real life friends who have known him for 30 years Jonathan and Alan together on the show was brilliant and Alan was just in fantastic, tremendous form doing his own scream in front of Neve Campbell who is of course the expert.

15:50Jennifer Garner:So yeah, I just wanted to mention all of those things and I believe I have. James, all about you? I've been watching Broadchurch. Oh my gosh. I am, yes. I am wading through the first series. I'm right near the end now. Unsurprisingly, it's really good. Yes, it is. Yeah, it's very... But also, and we were talking about this when we discussed on Pilot Plus Olivia Collins' role in The Night Manager Season 2. she's just incredible absolutely incredible David Tennant gives spectacular Bellend as well it's just it's a lot of fun

16:20Boydy:did you take any notes?

16:21Jennifer Garner:thank you I could never never hope to reach those heights I'll just have to stick with where I am I know my level but yeah I'm really enjoying Broadchurch I finished How to Get to Heaven from Belfast and was not disappointed at all by the finale of that that was great and the other thing I did was you will recall that I didn't watch the first episode of Fallout Season 2 when we reviewed it on this podcast because I couldn't get access to it So I thought, look, I watched the whole of season one, I should go and watch Fallout season two. And a lot of, I don't know if it was from emails or the subreddit or even just social media generally, but several people have told me that it is ridiculous that I'm not watching Fallout because it's one of the best shows on TV.

16:55Jennifer Garner:It's right up my alley, it's sci-fi, it's all of these things. So fine, right, watched it. Watched the first episode of season two. Bored to death. Oh dear. And I had, this was season one as well, where I watched the whole thing, but I was low-level bored all the way through it. Like I just, for some reason, and the thought is almost certainly mine, but for some reason almost certainly yes like I just can't get on with it like I just I just it doesn't seize me at all and so I'm not entirely sure I'm going to watch the rest of season 2 of Fallout I think I'm maybe kind of done and given that I've played the games and I like the genre and I love the people in it I can't quite put my finger on what it is I think it's partly tonal I think there's a silliness to it which bothers me I don't like retro futurism I think that is definitely true but yeah I just I can't I can't get into it So yeah, I'm abandoning Fallout.

17:44Jennifer Garner:I believe that makes three of us. Yeah, a full house. Unless on the sly, you, Kay, have been diligently watching Fallout. Binging Fallout.

17:52Boydy:A lot has changed, but not that.

17:53Jennifer Garner:No. Here's my question to you about Broadchurch, though. You do know there's two more series. I do. So are you going to carry on, crack on with it? I'm certainly thinking about it, yes. Interesting. So this may be my watching for the foreseeable future. Yes. But yeah, I'm enjoying it enormously. Like initially, when I started watching it, it was almost homework. Like, it was almost like, oh, I've never watched this. I really should watch it. I should have seen it. And I watched the first episode, and I thought, oh, this is good. Like, it's really well put together. But I felt a little bit like, I'm not, you know, am I going to...

18:22Jennifer Garner:I mean, it's no foundation, is it? That's what I'm saying. But then, by the time I got to the end of episode two, I was like, okay, now I'm just obsessed with all of these people. Because it does a really good job of rounding out all of the residents of this sort of small West Country town, and just getting a feel... And obviously, you know it's leading you down the garden path with episodes early on. When you're like, oh, it's that person. You're like, no, it isn't. You're just making it look like it is. But you really enjoy the little journey. Which is what happens in the world who done it. Right.

18:49Jennifer Garner:So, there we go. I'm exploring the genre. But it is so, so well done. Which channel was it on?

18:55Boydy:ITV.

18:56Jennifer Garner:ITV.

18:56Boydy:This is what I thought. Yeah, I know. This is what I thought. When he was talking, I thought, first of all, I commend you for going back and watching something, even though it's 100 years old. And on ITV. Because I do that. Yeah. But the fact that it's on ITV, and suddenly you're waxing lyrical. I think you owe ITV an apology. A formal written apology. I want an oral one right now, please. Okay, yes.

19:13Jennifer Garner:I apologise, ITV, for Broadchurch and many of your other shows, including Unforgotten. Fabulous. Ah, well, thanks. All I would say, I think I remember doing a couple of Q &As about Broadchurch. Before Kay started taking them off you. Exactly. Back in the glory days. And it was definitely regarded as a step up for ITV. because it is beautifully shot and directed. James Strong, I think, directed who did the, I mean, done loads of award-winning things. He's a brilliant director. But it definitely felt like they were going for being more cinematic than you were used to in, I think it's fair to say, in ITV, peak primetime thriller.

19:53Jennifer Garner:That was part of its kind of unique appeal. You had these brilliant cast and a beautifully shot, very ambitious visually show.

20:02Boydy:Either way, James has apologised and all is well with that.

20:04Jennifer Garner:Yes. Of course, 100%. I have addressed the broad church-shaped hole in my back catalogue of things.

20:10Boydy:I'm wondering where that hole is going. Wow. Bloody hell, James. Sorry. What a thought.

20:15Jennifer Garner:Should we move hastily on to a listener question?

20:19Boydy:Do you know what I know? Please, God. But you're bored.

20:21Jennifer Garner:Okay, right. This week's listener question comes from Andrew. And Andrew Roche says, Just finished Steel on Amazon. No, it's Prime Video, Andrew. Oh, my God. And yes, James, the crooks did look like Klingons in episode two. The term warp speed was used as well. So someone is clearly a Star Trek fan. But this got me thinking about other shows that referenced another TV series in theirs. My one is the Cylons walking past Dirt Benedict in the opening credits of the A-Team. I remember that. Any other ideas? P.S. Boyd, thanks for organising my TV viewing for Christmas Day. You did a good job. Oh, good.

20:57Jennifer Garner:There you go. It's a question. does it take you out of a show if it references another show? How do you feel about it?

21:04Boydy:I feel okay.

21:05Jennifer Garner:Kay doesn't care. Right.

21:06Boydy:No, I feel okay because it's like when you're trying to believe in these characters they would be watching shows. Yes. You know what I mean? So it's like I love the authenticity of that.

21:14Jennifer Garner:I think the Dirk Benedict one is a slightly odd one, isn't it? Because that's like that's a bit of an oh look, I was in this. You know, that's...

21:20Boydy:Oh, I didn't even get the reference. I wasn't, yeah.

21:22Jennifer Garner:Right, okay. Because he was also in the original Battlestar Galactica. Yeah, sure. Right, okay. But you're right. If it's a believable contemporary set show, that they would be talking about things that are part of pop culture makes perfect sense.

21:34Boydy:It would be weird if they didn't. Right.

21:35Jennifer Garner:Yeah, absolutely. I agree.

21:37Boydy:Oh, wow.

21:38Jennifer Garner:Boyd, do you agree? Yeah, totally. Good. Excellent. Let's move on. This is a hard thing to answer, though. Go on, what have you come up with?

21:46Boydy:I've just Googled it. I Googled it before I came in, because I was very aware that otherwise I didn't have an answer, and James would wrap my knuckles.

21:52Jennifer Garner:Well, luckily I have asked BoydBot2000 to come up with some examples for me, and you've done a great job, Boydie, so I'll read those out in a second. But Kay, what did you come up with?

22:00Boydy:Well, I was just going to go with the top one because it was friends related and I thought you'd enjoy it for James, which is that the episode where they go to London for Ross's wedding, and apparently Joey is feeling homesick, when they get back to his hotel room, he gets really emotional when he catches an episode of Cheers and he hears the theme tune and he gets all the emotion stuff. So yeah, that is something I've just read on the internet right now.

22:25Jennifer Garner:Right, that is Kay's one answer that she has just got off Google. You know, it's... Where are you from, James? We go the extra mile for our... I told you, they're from BoydBot2000, who is working diligently to give me examples. Go on. So, did you ever watch Community? I mean, you would have watched Community, I'm sure. But Community, Danny Pudi's character, Abed, mentions in one episode, he talks about being an extra on Cougar Town. Once you remember Cougar Town? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then he literally is an extra on Cougar Town. So, it's just like, I can't remember which one comes first. I wonder whether the actual in my memory Boyd Bop may be wrong about this but in my memory he actually makes a reference and then is on Cougar Town

23:02Boydy:I would prefer it that way

23:03Jennifer Garner:enacting the scene that he talked about which is absolutely wild which actually and it really reminds me of and you will remember this remember Scrubs yes Neil Flynn who played the janitor there's a whole thing about the janitor was in The Fugitive the film The Fugitive with Harrison Ford because Neil Flynn is a cop in The Fugitive and they use the footage from The Fugitive in Scrubs really? To illustrate the point, it's really funny.

23:25Boydy:Oh, topical, since Scrubs is coming back.

23:27Jennifer Garner:Indeed it is, indeed it is. But it's very meta, but I thought that was quite funny. But apparently Cougar Town and Community kept referencing each other multiple times on it. And I mean, to be fair, Community is one of those shows. It references so many other shows during this run. But I thought that was quite a nice little back and forth, a little sharing of things.

23:42Boydy:Very good. Boydo, what about you?

23:45Jennifer Garner:I am going to apologise for using the example from Seinfeld. Oh my God. Oh, come on. I mean, it is... Go on. there was an episode in which it revolved around Jerry watching Melrose Place. So at the time, Melrose Place was kind of like a byword for a soapy, melodramatic, slightly kitschy show. And it kind of showed that a grown man, you know, it's kind of like aimed, let's face it, more at women than men. But the whole thing was, oh, Jerry, do you really watch Melrose Place? And he secretly watches it. He doesn't tell anyone, doesn't share it with Elaine. And she accuses him of watching it secretly on the slide.

24:20Jennifer Garner:and in the end he takes a lie detector test which is all about whether he watches Melrose Place or not

24:26Boydy:and was he?

24:26Jennifer Garner:yeah he was and they incorporate the theme tune and everything and it's absolutely hilarious there's loads of examples in the office both the UK and US office obviously David Brent had loads of references one of the things that was brilliant about it at the time because it was a faux documentary was that obviously someone in his position who's obsessed with himself and saw himself as being a comedian you know an all round entertainer so references is the Lenny Henry abound in comic relief and Monkey remember Monkey the PG Tips is always there in the background the knitted monkey yeah and they talk about that

24:59Boydy:I used to have one of those sounds lovely yeah

25:02Jennifer Garner:so that and then the American officer was all full of it oh they battled the Galactica they took a Game of Thrones yes all the way through I think when it's in that mockumentary format it allows that to happen and it does make it seem more real I think because what more do people talk about anything in the world than TV I mean everyone talks about TV hello

25:18Boydy:what do you think we're doing right now

25:19Jennifer Garner:exactly hello So yes, those were my examples. Yeah, so I recall Stargate SG-1 used to reference Star Trek quite a lot. And Farscape mentioned all sorts of stuff, because the whole point was he was a guy from Earth in space. And so he would reference lots of sort of 20th, 21st century popular stuff. Well, 20th mainly. And actually, what I've just remembered is that I watched Vladimir. This could have been in the What Were You Watching section, although obviously I'd driveled on for an extended period anyway. But I'd been watching Vladimir, which we will be reviewing soon, the forthcoming Netflix show with Rachel Weisz and Leo Wardour.

25:52Jennifer Garner:What was that? Expression, face, expression, Kay? Remember, cameras are on. We'll catch you all the time. So this is something that came up before the show started. That Kay realised that when Boyd is talking, she pulls faces. I pull... And they're now captured on camera. I don't really know what it was. Yes, because I was referencing...

26:06Boydy:You did a...

26:07Jennifer Garner:Go on.

26:08Boydy:I was referencing the fact that I said before the pod that when you talk, I'm not going to show any emotion in my face. I was just clearing my emotion from my face.

26:14Jennifer Garner:So you were doing a gesture. Yes. I didn't realise you were going to stop

26:17Boydy:though mid-floating. I was trying to yeah when Boyd talks I pull faces and then if James says something bell-endy to me then I'll pull a face at Boyd and I didn't realise you know I didn't quite remember that it's getting captured

26:28Jennifer Garner:anyway yeah in Vladimir there are quite a lot of pop culture references which I thought were really were really smart yeah and I won't I'm not reviewing it yet obviously because it's heavily embargoed but it is coming up on Netflix soon Thumbs up

26:40Boydy:Thumbs up

26:40Jennifer Garner:Can't say Can't possibly say He's not He's getting his thumb out It's embargoed The other things I wanted to mention in this is there was the crossover between Friends and Paul Reiser, Helen Hunt's called Mad About You. Do you remember this? Yeah. Because Lisa Kudrow plays a character in both and that's when they decided that it was actually her twin sister was the character in Mad About You. So you had the crossover episodes essentially. Yeah, so Ursula who was a character in Mad About You then was a character in Friends as well and Helen Hunt and the actress who plays her sister in Mad About You appear in one of the pre-credit sequences of Friends as well and they think Phoebe is Ursula.

27:12Jennifer Garner:I've just remembered what the pop culture reference I was thinking of in Vladimir is which is Sex and the City. There's a Sex and the City kind of joke which is quite clever that's all I'll say okay you'd be spotted when it arrives

27:22Boydy:very excited for that boy day

27:23Jennifer Garner:boy did you just breaking embargoes left him right there I think it's all within I think the best reference though it does involve a film no and it is Isaiah Whitlock Jr the late Isaiah Whitlock Jr who played Senator Clay Davis in The Wire famous for his shit you know like you say you have the extended which apparently was a hymn it's you doing it that's giving me the right okay well he used to go shit like that and he that was apparently an Isaiah Whitlock thing rather than a Clay Davis thing but it became a part of the fabric of The Wire they actually reference it in The Wire but it was the actor's thing and he's done that in other things so he did a film called Cedar Rapids where he references that he does a great impression of Omar from The Wire and he was in The Wire and he's talking about The Wire so that's pretty meta but it is a film I'm so sorry we probably can't talk about Cedar Rapids The Wire is not a film though No but Cedar Rapids It's valid I know but I think it still works It's got a toe in both worlds I would say But yeah, I quite like it.

28:18Jennifer Garner:I think it adds a dose of realism for exactly the reason that you said that we all talk about TV so much. It's weird when characters in fiction don't talk about popular culture. As I said originally. Someone once said the only problem with EastEnders was they didn't talk about EastEnders.

28:34Boydy:Actually, true. That's quite funny.

28:36Jennifer Garner:Okay, should we have a guest?

28:38Boydy:Yes, let's.

28:39Jennifer Garner:Let's have a guest. And this week's guest is Jennifer Garner who returns to her role as Hannah Hall, a woman whose husband vanished only for an entire mystery to unravel to its whereabouts in season one of The Last Thing He Told Me. Now, season two just arrived on Apple TV. And suffice it to say, things are not exactly back to normal, as we all know, because we watched it for last week's podcast before realising it was embargoed. Now, as we record this, she has not yet come into the studio to do this.

29:05Boydy:Yes, which is why I held my cross fingers at Boyd.

29:07Jennifer Garner:So we really hope that she turns up tomorrow in this studio to talk to Boyd. Otherwise, lots of egg on James's face. Well, you two abandoning me, leaving me to my own devices with Jennifer Garner. Yeah, let's just hope it's all fine.

29:19Boydy:I don't want to get involved in between that chemistry, right? Yeah. You can handle it.

29:23Jennifer Garner:Exactly. The tension, you could cut it with a knife, so we don't want to get them. I'm sure she'll remember the time when I visited her on the set of the Ricky Gervais film that she starred in, The Invention of Lying, I think. Yes. Yes. Yes. Which I did.

29:34Boydy:Did you ever chat with her then?

29:35Jennifer Garner:Absolutely, yeah.

29:36Boydy:Oh, so you're just two buddies catching up.

29:38Jennifer Garner:Effectively, yeah. Obviously, because I'm me, I am not going to mention it, but it will be a test of her.

29:44Boydy:Oh, hello. If you don't clang in an interview, like, what's the point?

29:47Jennifer Garner:If she doesn't wrap her arms around you and go, Boyd! I'll be very disappointed. And because it happens in the studio, we will catch it on camera.

29:54Boydy:Yes.

29:54Jennifer Garner:Oh, is it all being filmed as well? Oh, yes, Boydy. Yeah, Boydy. It's all being filmed. Jesus Christ.

29:59Boydy:You're like catnip for the camera, it's fine. You are.

30:01Jennifer Garner:It's great. It's going to be wonderful. Can't wait. So here is Boyd, we hope, talking to Jennifer Garner. I hope it went well. Hello, Jennifer. Welcome to the Pilot TV Podcast.

30:09Boydy:Thank you. Thanks for having me.

30:11Jennifer Garner:It's an absolute pleasure.

30:14Boydy:Love it always. I'm so thrilled to be here.

30:16Jennifer Garner:I must say, I was lucky enough to be in Santa Monica for the Apple Press Day when they revealed that there's Slate and you were there on stage with your colleagues talking about the new series.

30:27Boydy:You mean just a week or two ago? Just a week or two ago, yeah.

30:29Jennifer Garner:Oh my goodness. Two weeks ago, yeah. So I feel like I know you anyway already from that.

30:33Boydy:Well, we do, yes.

30:33Jennifer Garner:How was that event for you? And you got to kind of talk with your co-stars and your colleagues about the new season of The Last Thing You Told Me?

30:41Boydy:Well, I mean, there were so many people there. It was a little bit chaotic. But what was odd about it is that it was very dark backstage. And so you would be scuttling by and I would say, wait a minute, was that Amy Adams? Amy, you know. So there were all of these colleagues backstage that I was kind of seeing them in a shadowy outline and hunting down so I could give them a proper hello.

31:02Jennifer Garner:It was probably star-studded, wasn't it?

31:03Boydy:It was quite star-studded, wasn't it? Yeah, it was lovely.

31:06Jennifer Garner:So you're talking about the new season of The Last Thing I Told You. And at the end of season one, there was a five-year time jump.

31:12Boydy:Yes.

31:12Jennifer Garner:Which now is this fully established as season two begins. How would you, that's quite a bold thing to do, a big time jump like that. How does that leave the characters at the beginning of season two?

31:21Boydy:Well, all you see at the end of season one, there's this jump where you see that, oh, they have been living safely. Okay, so they're in quite a bit of danger. This woman, Hannah Hall, and her stepdaughter, Bailey, played by wonderful Aunt Gowrie Rice. Hannah's husband Bailey's father disappears they spend the whole first season trying to figure out why and then realizing that they're in quite a bit of danger themselves and they don't see him and they only see him in memory they make a deal to keep themselves safe, there's a five year jump cut and suddenly the husband appears and as we begin that's it, season one done at the beginning of season two we overlap that scene and then we follow Owen and see a bit the husband and see a bit of what his life has been like which is really interesting, why he's been on the run how he's stayed hidden and meanwhile, you realize that the reason he showed back up is that Hannah and Bailey are again in even more danger than they've been in before and you realize in the past five years what you didn't see is Hannah preparing for this inevitability and it's kind of incredible to watch how skillfully she has put their lives quietly in order to get themselves out of danger, although danger follows very closely.

32:48Jennifer Garner:Yeah, you use the word, the phrase competence porn.

32:50Boydy:Yes.

32:51Jennifer Garner:Which I think is so accurate, isn't it? Because she is in charge. She's facing this really difficult situation, but she's planning as much as she can. She's looking after a stepdaughter. She's extremely competent at what she's doing.

33:02Boydy:She's extremely competent, and she's fought really hard to become competent. She's a woodturner by trade, so she's not someone who has ever had to get herself out of danger before, but she's a quick thinker, and she's a very meticulous person, and she's got them completely organized. And yes, this idea that watching somebody so good at what they're doing is actually very relieving in this day and age. It's why we love the pit. it's why we love you know and so she has that that the first couple of episodes you really see all of it go into play and into action and it's very soothing i think and very satisfying now

33:41Jennifer Garner:what's not quite so soothing there is a brilliant scene where you have a fight with a big guy in the season premiere and you told the story of the after event extraordinary story you met that guy

33:52Boydy:before you were with him before yes years ago yeah salah we we fought on a film called the kingdom which was directed by Peter Berg. Pete Berg is a bit of a, like, he's a kind of director. And so Pete had this thing where he wanted it to be such a real scrappy fight. And Pete knew that I didn't mind fighting. I liked to fight. And so he told Salah, first of all, Salah is, I believe, from New Zealand. So he had Salah do the haka before we began fighting. Just to me, I was on the ground, and he had him perform looking down at me. And it was just like, I'd never seen it before and certainly never live.

34:29Boydy:So I was...

34:30Jennifer Garner:Like he wasn't scary enough already.

34:31Boydy:It was quite intimidating. And I felt like, screw you, Pete Berg. And so then he said to me, I want you to do anything you can to survive. And he said to Salah, get her. Do anything you want to do. She can take it. Don't like actually put her in the hospital, but fight her. Like restrain her. And so I climbed up on Salah's back. and I was, I mean, my mouth was so dry. It was like a real, my brain thought I was in a real fight and I bit his ear. And there's a picture somewhere, it's a Polaroid, of, you know, a scab on his ear the next day. I was like, well, sorry.

35:06Jennifer Garner:You are the Mike Tyson of your generation.

35:08Boydy:People don't know that I actually, Mike Tyson and I have that in common.

35:12Jennifer Garner:Yeah. And what was brilliant was the event, Nicola Costo Aldo was genuinely astonished by this story, wasn't he? He was like, kind of like a poor, should you be arrested? I think he said at one point.

35:20Boydy:He was a little horrified, yes. A little horrified. Yeah, but Nikolai knows what to do. He can fight as well. He doesn't mind having a sword, does he? And he would use it if he needed to.

35:30Jennifer Garner:Now, I've met Nikolai, and he's incredible fun. He seems to be incredible fun. Yeah. But, I mean, you don't have that many, so far, you don't have that many scenes with him for obvious reasons, because the whole storyline is his left behind. Yes. But he must be incredible fun to work with, right?

35:43Boydy:I will say that we do end up having to deal with each other in this second season in a way that's actually, You would think these people have been apart for five years, and here they come back together, and they run into each other's arms, and it's this love story. It's interesting because how does that actually play out? It was the source of many, many conversations on set, and I think it's kind of cool to watch it. Their relationship, they have to reorganize themselves. And also with the stepdaughter, with whom Hannah has now become very, very bonded and close. That changes everything. You know, Nicola, or the Owen reappearing changes everything between the two of them as well.

36:28Jennifer Garner:And he has a spectacular amount of facial hair, I have to say.

36:31Boydy:He does.

36:32Jennifer Garner:How did he find that?

36:33Boydy:He did not appreciate that beard. He was not a fan of that beard.

36:37Jennifer Garner:But it's realism. I think it's fair enough, isn't it?

36:39Boydy:Well, he was in disguise.

36:40Jennifer Garner:Yeah, yeah. You also got new cast members, Judy Greer, Rita Wilson. You worked with Judy before. Rita Wilson is a legend. That must have been great getting them involved.

36:49Boydy:Rita Wilson is a legend and for good reason. She is in one episode. She plays Hannah's mother. And I think Rita would have had to have been 10 or something to actually be my mother. But, you know, we play with women's ages on screen. She's so magnificent and real and heartbreaking. She's heartbreaking in the show. And then we also have Luke Kirby and John Noble and really wonderful cast.

37:15Jennifer Garner:I have to mention to you, I have met you before. You're not going to remember this. 17 years ago on the set of The Invention of Lying.

37:22Boydy:Oh, my goodness. Remember that? Of course. Yeah.

37:24Jennifer Garner:Ricky Gervais' film.

37:25Boydy:Oh, do you? Yeah.

37:26Jennifer Garner:How was that for you at the time? And have you followed Ricky's career since then? Oh, yeah.

37:30Boydy:Oh, my gosh. I'm such a huge fan. I went to see him do his stand-up after that at some point. He's just, he's hilarious. I mean, obviously, he's hilarious. But he's brilliant and irreverent. And, yeah, I'm always cheering him on.

37:43Jennifer Garner:Yeah, yeah. Now, the last thing you told me, you could, it's the kind of thing, even though it's based on two novels, right? So there's a sequel to the original novel. You could take it further. Do you want it to be a returning show, kind of like comeback? Or do you think it's kind of, it feels it should end after two seasons? Do you have a strong feeling about that?

37:59Boydy:Well, the audience will decide that. I mean, it was meant to just be one season. And if you haven't watched it and if you haven't read the books, the books are, the amazing thing about Laura Dave's writing is that she writes with this energy that is like there's a twist at the end of every chapter that keeps you turning the pages and it makes you stay up later than you mean to and that really translates well onto screen but we don't care if there's just action what she's equally brilliant at are the relationships and the people and the depth of relationships between the people and so that is what everyone loves to play that's brilliant in The Last Thing You Told Me and in the sequel, the first time I saw him.

38:39Boydy:And it feels to me, if the audience is so inclined, it feels to me that there's one more natural season. And I would love to play it, especially now that Judy's involved. And I never want to leave Angauri Rice. I want to work with her every day of my life. I love her so much.

38:55Jennifer Garner:She's fantastic. It does feel like the segment is even more action-packed and thrilling. And you've ratcheted up, I feel like. Without a doubt.

39:02Boydy:Yeah, no, without a doubt. And the fun thing is that so far the journalists we've spoken to who enjoyed the first season are like, oh, I like the second season even more. And I hope that is true for the audience. But I don't know. You never know. Journalists, you can never tell. Are you guys telling us the truth?

39:18Jennifer Garner:I'm totally telling you the truth. I wouldn't even mention it if I didn't like it yet, but it's definitely ramped up. It's very exciting. Yes, it's a thrill ride, isn't it? And finally, you managed to go to Paris, or at least it's the same place. Now, that's not green screen, right? you are really actually embarrassed. Oh no, we went to Paris and Marseille.

39:33Boydy:Yes.

39:33Jennifer Garner:Did you say to the producers, I would quite like to go to somewhere really nice in Europe to film some of season two?

39:38Boydy:I couldn't believe that we got so lucky. It was incredible to be there. It did add so much just to the, obviously to the scope of the show. But also there's just nothing like being on location. And I really only work in LA. So to have those couple of weeks leaving and going to Paris and to Marseille where I'd never been before. I'd been to Paris, not Marseille. added so much to the drama underneath.

40:04Jennifer Garner:Yeah, it does feel like it's a bigger boulder. Yes, yeah. Absolutely. Jennifer Garner, thank you so much. Great to see you again. Thank you so much.

40:11Boydy:I love being here. Thank you. Thanks, Boyd. Yeah, cheers.

40:14Jennifer Garner:That was Jennifer Garner, and time now for this week's news. Boyd, what do you have for me? Well, what struck me recently was that there have been quite a few cast announcements for the White Lotus new season, and we haven't really helped them. I've missed them. Yes, I've missed them. Yeah, well, now the cast is taking shape. It looks absolutely fantastic. It could be Sandra Bernhardt was recently confirmed. I love Sandra Bernhardt. She was in the glory days of Roseanne, when Roseanne was the biggest show on TV.

40:38Boydy:Who did she play? What, the sister? No.

40:39Jennifer Garner:No, she was kind of in it as Roseanne's mate, basically. Oh, okay. And she's a fantastic... I've seen her doing stand-up, Sandra Bernhardt. She's a fantastic actress and stand-up and comedian, and she's anyway going to be in it. There's Chris Messina, who's really good in... You recognise her from the Mindy Project, and air the Nike film that Ben Affleck directed. Did he? I'm imagining he directed it. I believe he did, yes. Alexander Ludwig, who's in Vikings and Hunger Games, and you'll recognize him. He's very much clearly like... Bjorn Ironside. Yeah, you'll see he's a hunky guy, the kind of guy there's always one or two of them in.

41:16Jennifer Garner:Yeah, in The White Lotus. Steve Coogan, which was announced. What? Yes, Steve Coogan, incredible. Shut up. Yeah, see, someone else wrote, we didn't know that the casting was so right until you see it and you see Steve Coogan yes in The White Lotus it's going to be Partridge on Holiday Partridge on Holiday exactly wouldn't it be incredible if you actually did Alan Partridge in The White Lotus crossover so tempting and Helena Bonham Carter oh wow

41:41Boydy:she'll be glorious again like you're like

41:42Jennifer Garner:of course of course Helena Bonham Carter should be in The White Lotus and it's set and they seem to have been confirmed it's set in France on the French Riviera but in fact different bits of the French Riviera so it seems to be a little, I mean, I don't know if this is true, but it's been reported that it'll be in different locales rather than one set hotel or whatever. I assume there will be a hotel in it, but it seems to be more freewheeling anyway from what people are saying.

42:06Boydy:It's a little bit like that last series. Yeah, that's true. That's a good observation.

42:11Jennifer Garner:So maybe it's not such a big format change. But yeah, Bonham Carter, Coogan, Ludwig, Messina, Bernhardt, it's all adding up to a fantastic season four of The White Letters. And if they could just get their fingers out Film it now. Get it edited. All wrapped by, I don't know, Christmas? It'd be good if we could see it. I am weirdly quite looking forward to this, given that I've never watched seasons one and two. Because you're a bellend, yeah. I mean, yes, Babs.

42:37Boydy:Oh, my God, say what you say.

42:39Jennifer Garner:But I'm quite excited about this. I have no intention of going back to watch seasons one and two, but I'm quite excited about this full season.

42:45Boydy:Yes. We did a spoiler special last year, didn't we? Which James wouldn't contribute to. No, no.

42:51Jennifer Garner:A point of order, Your Honour. I think you're fine. Not only did I contribute, I watched every single episode.

42:57Boydy:Oh. Oh, no, do you know what? I'm sorry. I'm thinking of Only Murders. Yes. Only Murders and the Boring, which I had nothing to do with.

43:02Jennifer Garner:Oh, so you did watch in the end? Yes, I watched all of season three. Three. I just haven't gone back and watched one of those. Fine, fine. Because it's, you know, an anthology, so it's all good. Yeah, yeah. Although it does feature characters across, as we discussed, in previous shows, yes.

43:17Boydy:Okay, I want to tell you some casting news now from Michaela Cole's new upcoming drama. so we know that joining her will be Tandway Newton who will play Anya Maxine Peake as Helen Danny Sapani is that how you say it Sapani? I think so okay as Ernest and Shuti Gatwa as Darren Darren!

43:36Jennifer Garner:sorry it's Pavlovian at this point isn't it?

43:39Boydy:oh gosh

43:40Jennifer Garner:we should explain because no one wouldn't necessarily know this it's like whenever so this is the thing we do on this podcast this is going to be very hard now to not cut out whenever we make a mistake on the podcast whenever there's an error every 30 seconds Yeah, which is every 30 seconds. One of us will shout, Darren! And that is the key word, which means that there's something that needs to be cutting out.

43:57Boydy:Because our editor's called Darren, and he probably hates his name now because we shout it so much.

44:00Jennifer Garner:Exactly that. So whenever he says his name, you're probably like, oh, God, I've got to cut something out. It's become Pavlovian.

44:05Boydy:Well, I can confirm. Don't worry, it's just shooty this time. Anyway, so Cole will play a British Ghanaian novelist who's on the run, both from herself, her life, her partner, and that weird guy at her book talk. When she ends up in Ghana, her ancestral homeland, she finds herself submerged in an altogether different world amidst new friends, fresh joy and many different and nuanced relationships she also discovers secrets, lies and difficulties as well as denial and it leads her to question everything about herself and her heritage and family Would you say that was very well read, Boyd?

44:37Jennifer Garner:That was very well read

44:38Boydy:I would say it wasn't because so many times I put the intonation in the wrong place and I just tried to style it out

44:42Jennifer Garner:I think you did a good job of styling it Thanks The interesting, wasn't this a... Yes, cast announcements

44:48Boydy:and I haven't told you who they are in the synopsis.

44:51Jennifer Garner:Oh, that's fine. I mean, it's most interesting that they're in it, like the fact that, you know, Shuti Gawa's in it, et cetera. Maxine Peake. Oh, Maxine Peake. You didn't mention Peake before?

45:01Boydy:Yeah, I did.

45:01Jennifer Garner:Oh, okay.

45:01Boydy:You just forgot to mention it.

45:03Jennifer Garner:This is so much fun. Yeah, this is.

45:04Boydy:Yeah, sorry, sorry.

45:05Jennifer Garner:But what's interesting is I think that was a press release, that was a start of filming press release, wasn't it? Yes. That's what it was.

45:11Boydy:Absolutely. And actually, do you know what? The first sentence last that I'd written on my thing is filming is underway, but I ignored that.

45:18Jennifer Garner:For me, this is a bit of a blow because I thought this film had been underway already for this show. I thought this was quite imminent because it was in the, you know, like all of the channels have their own slate announcements, you know, and I'm sure I saw it in the BBC slate for this year. So maybe it's still going to be this year. Maybe they're filming it now, you know, they can finish it and get it all sorted by...

45:40Boydy:Listen, I think Michaela Cole has earned the right to take her sweet time. so oh yeah

45:45Jennifer Garner:100 % but no way would I dare to suggest anything but that yeah stop trying to rush Michaela boy yeah greedy greedy in a similar vein though in fact I believe it's the same was Various Artists Limited the production company made I May Destroy You Mechanical's previous masterpiece their new show is I'm genuinely excited about this called Two Weeks in August have you seen this line up

46:13Boydy:no No, but I remember discussing this news story last year. It's the Friends That Go on Holiday, right?

46:19Jennifer Garner:Yeah, it's this friendship group that goes on holiday. I'm so excited about this. It's written and created by Catherine Sheppard, who worked on Sally Forever, the amazingly rude Julia Davis series, and The Shrink Next Door. And it's about a group of friends who connect and go on this holiday together. And obviously, bad stuff happens as well. It's got Jessica Rain, Damien Maloney, your favourite. Yes, Bergerac. I've got an invite to a Bergerac screening. Are you hosting that one, Kay?

46:40Boydy:I actually am. Oh, my God. I'm actually joking. No, can I just tell you something really funny? It's that I mentioned watching the trailer last week on, I think it was Plus or something. And then that evening, I got back, so they hadn't heard it. And they were like, oh, are you free? And I was like, yes, and this is really weird. But anyway.

46:54Jennifer Garner:Just to say, you've got to give me a list of the things you are hosting so I can avoid them. And listeners, this isn't, I would happily go and see these things, but Kay doesn't like it.

47:01Boydy:We've got a gentle women's agreement. Yes. Carry on, Boydo, sorry.

47:04Jennifer Garner:Anyway, Leila Farzad, the brilliant Leila Farzad from I Hate Susie. And most recently, How to Get to Heaven from Belfast. she's the spoiled actress remember in the beginning of that show absolutely brilliant cameo or even you know supporting role Hugh Skinner the great Hugh Skinner from Fleabag and Mamma Mia and who'll be soon in 2026 the comedy from the people who gave us 2012 he's in it and Dolly Wells who's just brilliant in everything from Dracula she was in I cannot wait

47:32Boydy:for this show

47:32Jennifer Garner:Tom Goodman Hill Baby Reindeer she's got a brilliant cast and there's

47:36Boydy:do we have a date yet?

47:37Jennifer Garner:Nicholas Pinnock I haven't finished sorry

47:39Boydy:sorry it just felt like what's going on.

47:42Jennifer Garner:It's fine. I am going on. I mean, you know, some less of a short casting announcement than your one for McKay Lee Cole. I'll be honest, the thing that the Boyd bot came up with was much more concise. Yeah, I bet it was. Do we have a release date? I think it's going to be soon on television, but no specific date. Put it in your diaries, gang.

47:58Boydy:Yeah. Soon.

47:59Jennifer Garner:Soon.

47:59Boydy:Well, you know,

48:01Jennifer Garner:you may be sarcastic, Kay, but...

48:03Boydy:Can I just tell you also about a trailer I watched for Women of Substance? Did anyone see that?

48:10Jennifer Garner:I haven't seen it, but I'm excited about this show. I am as well.

48:13Boydy:My mum gave me the book last year, which I still haven't read. It's massive, but she said I would enjoy it and I think I will. It's basically, from what I can tell from the trailer, revenge-filled upstairs-downstairs period drama and it's based on the best-selling novel by Barbara Taylor Bradford. It stars Brenda Blethen and Jessica Reynolds as the two versions of the same character, Emma Hart, who is a housemaid turned mogul, a daughter, a mother, a lover, a fighter and a 20th century feminist icon who refused to know her place. I will be like worshipping out that altar. I'm very excited about it.

48:48Boydy:It's basically Downton in Overdrive and it will be coming up, hopefully, I think this year, right? And Channel 4.

48:53Jennifer Garner:I think so. The interesting thing about that project is there's an original version of this book, adaptation of this book, which was 40 years ago on Channel 4. It was one of Channel 4's first ever dramas and it was a massive phenomenon. it was like partly kind of almost what made the channel back in the day I remember very clearly it being this absolute phenomenon and everyone watched it because it is quite soapy is it quite daring quite daring exactly yeah so I'm very interested to see what they do and in fact it's been adapted by Catherine Jakeweights who's a very funny talented person who I've met many times

49:27Boydy:very good

49:28Jennifer Garner:did either of you let's be honest Boyd see the Spider Noir trailer or trailers no plural so this is a show that's coming to Prime Video soon and it is spun off the kind of Into the Spider-Verse, Across the Spider-Verse films in which Nick Cage voices Spider-Noir and in this it's live action he's going to be playing Spider-Noir but these are available in black and white and colour so you can choose to watch it in black and white or colour and the trailer is available in either black and white or colour. Oh, I didn't know that. That's clever. I mean, is it clever? It's like, and call me cynical but I feel a little bit cynical.

50:01Jennifer Garner:Thank you. I feel like it is supposed to be a noir and if you watch the black and white trailer it really captures that sort of genre feeling. The colourised version feels a lot like we're going to put this out in colour so that younger audiences who are 100 % not want something in black and white will be prepared to sit through this. Oh, yes. 100%. Yeah, yeah. But it's true though, because yeah. It is true. It's hard to fault them. It's a bit of a generalisation, but I think some younger people, a lot of younger people in fact, are sophisticated enough to be able to deal with a black and white film or a TV show.

50:30Jennifer Garner:But yeah, I get it. Yeah. So yeah.

50:32Boydy:Some of them are still really magazines as well, paper print.

50:35Jennifer Garner:in the very very early days of heat very very very very early days so none of these people are working for it apart from me the then editor in chief or editor was so against black and white films he thought it would put people off our young readers off that he wouldn't let us give five stars to any black and white films so Citizen Kane you weren't allowed to give it five stars because it was a black and white Casablanca you know like literally the greatest films of all time I don't even know what to do with that information it was extraordinary I had to do with that this is 28 years ago to be fair but yeah it was extraordinary wow that's quite the bombshell Boynie I think we have to end news there I don't know how we can top that fair enough that certainly is a bit of news yeah let's move on to this week's reviews and first up this week we have the return of Dan Fogelman's Paradise on Disney Plus and this is a show that is predicated on a big twist a very very big twist in fact and honestly, it's going to be impossible for us to talk about this without touching on the big twist from season one.

51:37Jennifer Garner:So if you have not watched season one of Paradise and have any inkling that you might possibly one day do so and you don't know the twist that happened at the end of, and I cannot emphasize this enough, the first episode of season one, then you are probably going to want to skip this review. I strongly suggest that you do. So maybe look at the show notes, look at the timings and skip forward to the second review. Still with us? Great! So this second season picks up where the first season ended, except it doesn't. Instead, it goes all the way back to before the incident and introduces a new character in the form of Shailene Woodley's Annie.

52:13Jennifer Garner:Boydie, tell us more about the show, which has been described as The West Wing meets Fallout, one of which, Things I Like. It's more The West Wing meets... Wasn't there a Stephen King adaptation called Under the Dome or something like that? There was, I've seen it. Would you say this is like that? Well, I mean, to the extent that spoiler alert, the big spoiler is that the powers that be in America have dealt with the cataclysmic, world-ending apocalyptic weather incidents by building a massive... Fallout shelter. Fallout shelter slash dome. I think it is a dome, isn't it? Well, it's a cave, yeah.

52:48Jennifer Garner:Bunker. Bunker. It's a gigantic town. It's a giant bunker. It's a town inside a mountain. Yeah, that's the big... But you don't know that that's what it is until the end of the first episode. You think it's a regular town, and then you realise, you don't realise that this is all for Kay's benefit, really. They suckered her in with, like, a political drama and then dropped the sci-fi on her. It worked. Yeah. It worked. I have to say that the first two episodes, I watched the first two episodes, the first episode is all about Shailene Woodley's character, a brand new character who holds up in Graceland, Elvis Presley's old home.

53:21Jennifer Garner:Yes, which is where I'd go during the apocalypse. You would.

53:23Boydy:To be fair, she was working there.

53:25Jennifer Garner:We should say that. I'm about to say, she is not that outrageous an idea because her character worked there and was a tour guide basically in Graceland. So it's a nice, fun idea in theory. And initially I was like, oh, this is fun. Yeah, you know, just start your new series by not even referring to anything that occurred in series one, really. There's not even, interesting, there's not a recap. I don't know whether there's... There is a recap, but it's at the beginning of episode two. Exactly, that's what I'm saying. That's my point. So there's no recap of the beginning of episode one, but there is one for episode two, which is, again, underlining the fact that it almost feels like it's a sudden stand-alone episode.

54:04Jennifer Garner:It's exactly what it is, yeah. Yeah. As your first episode of your new season, and then, to compound my, shall we say, doubts about what they've done with this second season, episode two is all about what happens to our main character who was the bodyguard to the late president of the United States, and it goes off at the end of season one to find his wife. Southern Kev Brown, yes. Southern Kev Brown, yes. So he goes off to find his wife and literally season one ended with him climbing aboard a jet, going into the cockpit and going, right, I'm coming to get you, kind of thing. And then in episode three, he's crashed, basically.

54:40Jennifer Garner:Spoiler alert. This is one big spoiler alert, listeners. And episode two shows you all about what happens to him. So they utilize the fucking flashback, flashforward, sideways, jumping time thing. constantly throughout the first two episodes, but they're both, in a way, like, kind of big, quite daring ways of dealing with the fact that we're starting a second season of this show. Neither of them are like, oh, right, we're going to ease you back into what happened with last season. Instead, we're going to hit you with these two kind of, two standalone episodes, albeit the second one does tell the story of what happened to him after we saw him climb aboard that plane.

55:17Jennifer Garner:Anyway, this is a long-winded way of saying I felt like both of these hours were initially, I was like, yeah, okay, show us what happened with this woman who ends up, how she ends up connected to the guy she finds in the forest. Be what happens to him with this gang of kids, etc. in episode two. But I also thought it was slightly indulgent, slightly irritating, and definitely too long. They both felt like they could have told the stories they wanted to tell in episodes one and two of season two of the show in about half the time. They could have even, I wouldn't even go as far as to say, they could have done them in like, you know, like a five minute flashback if they really wanted to.

55:55Jennifer Garner:Yeah, they could have done. Come on. They could have done. How much actual story is there? This is my question. How much actual story is there in episodes one and two of this second season that they could have easily dispensed with another way? I enjoyed them. I'm not completely negative about them. As they were going on, I enjoyed them. And the Shady and Woodley one's interesting. And it's a bit like, it reminded me of the Last of Us famous episode with the two guys. But it wasn't as good though. And the relationship that forms in this first episode isn't as kind of interesting and intriguing and well-drawn as the one in The Last of Us.

56:31Jennifer Garner:Oh, see, I just agree with you. Yeah, I didn't... I almost wondered whether it's a reaction to The Last of Us. It felt so inspired by it. You've got PTSD. Yeah. Sorry?

56:40Boydy:PTSD. PTSD.

56:42Jennifer Garner:Oh, me.

56:42Boydy:No, it's not supposed to... Like, your reaction to this is because it reminds you of that.

56:45Jennifer Garner:Oh, no, no, no. It does remind me of that. But I wonder whether, you know, they were genuinely influenced by that episode in making this episode. it felt like possibly to me it felt so similar tonally and on what it was trying to do but not as good as I say but I enjoyed them don't get me wrong I enjoyed them but I think on balance I would have preferred just to go straight in and pick up where we left off and have a normal episode of this show so would you go in straight on too

57:09Boydy:because that is sort of dealing with it

57:10Jennifer Garner:yeah but even two annoyed me a bit as well like again they showed the present day and then they flashed back to explain what happened to him and it became very extended slightly claustrophobic this is what's happened to his character after the plane crashed I just when something is 8 episodes long 8 hours or 10 hours or whatever I am now on guard for like are they really milking this story are they stretching this narrative and it did feel to me just like they were stretching it already in episodes 1 and 2 of the show it is really brilliantly made don't get me wrong everyone's great in it Shay Woodley, brilliant addition to the cast she's fantastic but I do have my doubt I just have doubts about the way they've started this second season.

57:52Boydy:Doubting Thomas over there. I've got to be completely transparent. So I think I watched one and two of the first series and then I just didn't go back to it, not for any reason other than we watched 9 ,000 shows a week. And so I was quite relieved that it went on this standalone story, although I was half thinking, wait, was she in that first series? And particularly was Link, I don't know, was Link in the first series? No, none of them were. In which case, just as a standalone, I really enjoyed it. I really thought her character was interesting. I think she's really strong in this. And I really, so she's in Graceland and she works there.

58:28Boydy:And then there's this sort of like the super volcano. I don't know what it actually is. Super volcano? And she hunkers down. And then there's this sort of these bikers who come to Graceland. One of them is played by Thomas Doherty's name's Link in this. And what I really liked about that is that it sort of confounds your expectation because I thought they'd be acting a certain way, their behaviour would be a certain way, they'd treat her a certain way, this or the other. They really didn't. And I actually enjoyed that because I was like, oh, okay.

58:56Jennifer Garner:Well, so does she. She's surprised, but she's expected them to be violent. Presumably because she's watched The Walking Dead. But yes, something like that.

59:03Boydy:I really like the fact, the way that Link and Annie sort of communicated in their dynamic. I found it, in fact, really moving. So yeah, and I think she was wonderful in this. And she conveys so much with her face. I know that sounds a stupid thing to say but she does she's like

59:19Jennifer Garner:face acting

59:20Boydy:good face acting she's like oh she's always great

59:22Jennifer Garner:she's tortured

59:23Boydy:you don't exactly know why but it just feels like it's very layered I agree with all of that

59:29Jennifer Garner:I just yeah

59:29Boydy:I'm not trying to change your mind I'm just saying as a standalone episode I really liked it I obviously do need to catch up on the first series and I yeah I'll do that

59:38Jennifer Garner:the most interesting thing for me was seeing inside Graceland I thought it was really interesting to see what it actually is like because you mean they've completely recreated it or maybe even, I don't know, film there, find out. But I was fascinated by that because I always wanted to go to Grace Lane because I'm a big Oversh-Presley fan. Thank you very much. Yeah. You're Oversh-Presley. I strenuously disagree with you, buddy. I thought that first episode was fantastic. And I also thought it was a masterclass in how to introduce a new character because they take that entire episode and just give you a capsule episode backstory for that character.

1:00:13Jennifer Garner:So by the time she interacts with Xavier, in episode two, you know so much about her and you're so invested in her that suddenly you care about what's happening. And I think the reason why that matters is it's been a while since season one. And it's really hard to top season one because season one is a very specific little contained mystery where the plot gradually unfolds as the series goes on and you start to understand more and more what's happened and then that fantastic episode where it goes back and it shows you how the apocalypse happened is amazing. It would have been really hard to top that and actually I think going straight from the end of that and picking up where we left Xavier, I'm not sure it would have had the right impact.

1:00:50Jennifer Garner:I actually think I needed this little palette cleanser episode and I thought it was wonderful. And actually, when we went back to Xavier, I was disappointed because I was so invested in Annie's character and where she was going. I was like, I want to watch this show. This show, I'm much more into this. And it takes until, because I've seen the first three, it takes until the third episode for you to go back to the bunker and see, you know, pick up where we left off. But I really, really like this new kind of like wasteland thread, which is, I guess, this, we're going to have a split narrative, I guess, in season two.

1:01:15Jennifer Garner:We've got the Wasteland thread and we got the bunker thread. But I thought that Graceland episode was genuinely wonderful. I loved it. Absolutely loved it.

1:01:23Boydy:The only bit I didn't like, can I just say, is that the very end, I'm not going to spoil anything, there's a moment with her and the last couple of scenes, I felt that was quite cheesy. I have to say. Do you agree?

1:01:36Jennifer Garner:Yeah, a little bit. Do you know, I actually, to be fair, I enjoyed it. I'm sounding more critical of it than I really intended. I really enjoyed it while it was on. I just kind of like, at the end, the second episode actually annoyed me more than the first, to be fair. Okay, fair enough. Because I really did want to go back to the, what's it called? The bunker. The bunker. And I didn't think his, I really thought his story, that hour could have been really much shorter. And it felt very extended to me to get to the place it needed to get to by the beginning of episode three. I see what you're saying about episode two.

1:02:10Jennifer Garner:From a narrative point of view, it doesn't cover a lot of ground. No. whereas it's 45 minutes, whereas the first episode is an hour long, but it covers an incredible amount of ground, because you essentially relive the entire apocalypse from Charlie Woodley's perspective. Yeah. I mean, I'm kind of completely conflicted about it, to be honest, because on the one hand, when I first saw it, I was thinking, oh, this is a classic example of bold, you know, peak TV, because they're completely forgetting everything that happened in season one to give us this standalone thing, and it is a brilliantly bold thing to do.

1:02:39Jennifer Garner:To start a new season with a capsule episode is wild. So I salute it for that boldness, to use that word that I use constantly. I just... It was more fun thinking at the end, I was like, okay, and yet is it slightly self-indulgent? So it's just... I suppose they've earned that right. I did, but it's episode two I have more issues with, yeah, in general. But it's still, yeah, it's a really good thing to do in theory, and half in practice, I just had some slight doubts. It has to be said, I love this show. I really do. I think it's just, it keeps you guessing, It moves really quickly. It's got great characters in it.

1:03:14Jennifer Garner:This is a gourmet burger sci-fi for me. Yeah, I'm not sure if episode two moved that quickly. Episode two, yeah, but episode two does need to do some heavy character. Yeah. But I know what you mean. Episode two, if I'm honest with you, episode two has a touch of The Walking Dead's about it, where you've got them in a slightly bad post-apocalyptic scenario, and it just, I mean, shambles along, if you will. But there is an element of that. And I think having sat through 100 million hours of The Walking Dead, I think I'm kind of immune to it at this point but there really was a hint of that in two and three I'm glad it picks up again whether this series works or not I still couldn't tell you because it ultimately depends on where these kind of kind of conspiracy and they've already there's already another conspiracy starting like how those resolve how satisfying that is remains to be seen but based on the strength of that capsule episode and the introduction of Sharlene Woodley's character I'm very very excited to see where this goes and I'm looking forward to watching the rest of it and they have provided me with every episode except the finale which is maddening But there you go.

1:04:11Jennifer Garner:I'm definitely going to watch the whole thing as well. Yeah, I just, yeah.

1:04:14Boydy:You've got your doubts. I have my doubts. We've got it.

1:04:15Jennifer Garner:Yeah, doubting Boydy.

1:04:16Boydy:Doubting Boydy.

1:04:17Jennifer Garner:BoydBot2000 says, A star. Very excited. So, you know, it's weird that you don't agree. No, it's bizarre. Okay. Paradise then, Disney Plus? Monday, the 23rd of February, 2026. Fabulous. Next up, we have Dirty Business. A factual drama on Channel 4 that is less a dramatization of events than it is a kind of dramatic re-enactment used to better convey information. And I've got to be honest, it's shit. Literally, of course, because it concerns the fact that since the privatisation of the UK's water, we've had illegal sewage discharge dumped into the rivers. We've had corporate negligence, we've had cover-ups and other fun things like that.

1:04:53Jennifer Garner:And this show has David Thewlis and Jason Watkins leading the charge in a kind of Mr. Bates versus the post office with more E. coli, if you will. This is based on 10 years of investigation. It also stars Aseem Chowdhury, Charlotte Ritchie, and, you know, it's quite topical at the moment, obviously looking into how the water companies have been behaving since Thatcher privatised them and why that was a terrible idea. This is, I would argue, less an entertaining bit of TV drama than basically a series just designed to make you furious. So who better to be furious than our resident angry ferret, Kay Ribeiro?

1:05:27Boydy:Yeah, James is absolutely right. I mean, this will make your blood boil. David Thewlis and Jason Watkins play Ash and Peter. One is a retired detective and the other is a Oxford professor who basically start investigating why their local river, the river Windrush, is being polluted. They notice the difference and they start piecing it together. And it's like kind of these amateur sleuths. It's really interesting. Well, one is a detective, of course, but like, you know, first of all, the dynamic between them, I think it's quite interesting, but also how they go about figuring it out and then holding these companies to account.

1:06:02Boydy:It's a dual timeline. So we kind of see that all happening in 2016. And then we go back in time to, I think it's 1999, when a family, the Preen's, they're down from Birmingham, they're on their holidays, they're having a fun time on the beach, and unbeknownst to them, their eight-year-old daughter contracts E. coli 0157, the most deadly strand of it, apparently, and it doesn't end well. Aside from that, we also meet Asim Chowdhury's character, who is a whistleblowing sewage worker, and he works with that duo to kind of show them that actually there's you know these old Victorian waterworks aren't fit for purpose they are run down broken the sensors don't work and then when the sewage builds up and they can't do anything about it because everything's broken not working then unfortunately they just press the button that lets it all out into the the rivers which is so shocking and I have to say like at first what this does is it melds news footage with with dramatized parts and at first i actually found that jarring and as well as the you know the flip between the two timelines but actually it's really impactful because when you see real life footage slash photos of the water before and after um and even the dramatized like with assim like you walk it he's walking through the sewage and i mean i have to say make sure you're not eating at this when you're watching this because it is awful i mean it's reality but is like obviously quite gross to see yeah but when you then put piece that all together and you're sort of seeing all that footage and then you're seeing the like a dramatized version of like what is happening to this family and the impact on the cost of human life and the environment and the kind of excuses and rationale of the water companies and the environmental agency i have to say which i was so shocked at because as i think um thulis's character says they are the sewage police and they are the ones that are above you know they can bring cases they don't have to go through the police they can just bring those cases and actually and so you're thinking okay great what do they do and then you see a moment where basically um because of like cost cutting or like trying to you know um cut the red tape or whatever they they give the power to the um water companies to police themselves and like the workers at the environmental agency are rightly aghast and just being like what and they're like yeah yeah no it's fine it's fine it's fine it's Charlotte Ritchie yeah Charlotte Ritchie's character yeah it's genuinely funny yeah yeah because she's like yep yep okay cool and it just walks off you're like how can that be um and like yeah it's an amusing moment but actually the reality of that is shocking and to see that this is happening in United Kingdom is unbelievable so I would say this is a really impactful powerful factual drama that everyone should watch, everyone should get really fucking angry about, and everyone should, I don't know what to do, like write to your politician, I don't know.

1:09:03Jennifer Garner:Not quite.

1:09:03Boydy:Yeah, because this is unacceptable.

1:09:06Jennifer Garner:Because it's a Mr. Bates type thing in the, obviously what they did with that show is they took something that was factual and a huge injustice, and then through drama they communicated not only the facts, but the outrage to the public, and obviously it had an effect. And I think, you know, probably unabashedly, they are trying to do the same thing here. They're trying to educate the public, but also show them why they should be annoyed. And switching back to 1999, I think is important because this isn't just, they're shit in our rivers. This is like, this girl died. You know, like there has been a cost in human life as well.

1:09:35Jennifer Garner:And I think that really makes you, it makes you pay attention in a way that, you know, oh, isn't it funny? There's poo in the rivers. Like, it's not funny. And I think that's important. But I think it's interesting the way they've done it because it isn't really what you'd call a drama. It's not like Mr. Bates, where it is, you know, if someone told you it wasn't based on a true story, you'd accept it as a television show, just a piece of drama. This really is information dump. Like, it's like, you have title cards interspersed with almost vignettes of dramatic reenactment. And some of them are deliberately funny with Aseem Chowdhury, Charlotte Ritchie.

1:10:05Jennifer Garner:They've chosen these people deliberately. And some of them are just like, here is information. We are packaging it for you in a way that it is entertaining and easy to digest. But this is what we want you to know. It's like a documentary without the documentary bits. Yes, exactly that. It's a really weird, It has a very weird vibe to it, but I do think it's effective. And I think because of the nature and the time period and the drawn-out way in which they get this information, I think trying to fully dramatize it, like Mr Bates, for example, I think it would have moved too slowly and it would have been too boring.

1:10:33Jennifer Garner:I actually think getting to the heart of it means that it sort of tickles the part of your brain that's looking for factual information like a documentary, but it's also entertaining like a drama. So it actually works on both levels. But I think it's smart. I think it's very well put together.

1:10:46Boydy:I also think, like, you know, obviously the impact of Mr. Bates, I just think, and we were all rightly outraged for the postmaster's mistresses, I think the fact that this applies to everyone, right? Right. Everyone's like, you know...

1:11:00Jennifer Garner:Well, not least of all, because this specifically talks about the sewage treatment plant which affects Burford and Boughton on the water, which is where my mum used to live. So it's just like, I was like, oh, I know that place. And it is genuinely shocking what went on, the cover-ups, the lies, is the fact that they're essentially routinely just dumping sewage into the rivers. Because ultimately, and, you know, who'd have thought with privatisation, when you make profit, the primary motivating factor for a utility, they are going to cut corners to, I don't know, make profit. And that's basically what's happened here.

1:11:29Jennifer Garner:So it is set up to go this way.

1:11:31Boydy:But shit in Warsaw, we are a first world country. This is outrageous.

1:11:33Jennifer Garner:Yeah, it's not ideal. It's not ideal.

1:11:35Boydy:Anyway, Boyder, what do you think?

1:11:37Jennifer Garner:It was very interesting. Yeah, you're right. It's definitely, like, if you compare it to, it's difficult not to compare it to to the Mr. Bates, Mr. Bates, I suppose, to the post office which was a very traditional bit of storytelling and a kind of reason why it was the biggest show of that year and it had a life-changing effect on although, of course, they're still waiting unbelievably, still waiting to get proper compensation, hundreds of those postmasters, but I think the reason it had such an impact was it was a very traditional bit of storytelling. It established the characters. It took you chronologically, pretty much straightforwardly, through the ups and downs of the campaign and the climax of the campaign and their eventual court triumph, etc.

1:12:21Jennifer Garner:Whereas this is, as you say, it switches back and forth. I mean, talk about tonal shifts. I mean, the 1999 stuff with the kid, the poor kid who gets E. coli and dies, is devastating. And you get her parents in tears and dealing with that tragedy. and then it literally jumps to, as the years go by on screen, back to more recent times when you get Asim Chowdhury, as you say deliberately, a comedic actor by and large, telling them how the fuck this all happened in the first place and how the impact that the billionaire company, American company that took over the thing and what happened since then, etc.

1:13:02Jennifer Garner:So it couldn't be more different in a way. It's a bit of agitprop kind of political activism thing. this feels more like that they had to find a different way of telling the story and I think it is really effective I think it really hits home it's interesting because Channel 4 I don't know about you, I watched it on the Channel 4's portal and there's long disclaimers that they're including almost like there's some kind of legal they've been told legally

1:13:27Boydy:so they have one on screen which you guys will see when you're watching but also on our portal they had a whole

1:13:35Jennifer Garner:a long paragraph from the Environmental Agency kind of denying the kind of what went on in the show we've just watched. So it's interesting that they're having to make these... Although when you read, you know, the Environmental Agency quotes, it's interesting that it's all a bit vague. So they say stuff like, recently we've done this, you know, how recently, you know. They don't seem to be saying, or they don't seem to be saying in these long explanations that Channel 4 have included for legal reasons. that the events depicted in the drama didn't happen. They're kind of saying, this is out, this is kind of what we're saying.

1:14:15Jennifer Garner:It's different now, if you like, and we're dealing with it. Yeah, so it's a legal mind field, but it absolutely is, it makes for, it is an unusual way of telling the story, but it's still gripping and infuriating is the point. Absolutely, unbelievably infuriating.

1:14:29Boydy:I hope it gets as many eyeballs as Mr. Bates on it. I don't think it will. I know it won't, so please listeners, please watch it and spread the word.

1:14:35Jennifer Garner:Listeners, yeah. The only thing I will say that did bother me is one of the scenes when they're talking about, when the girl's in hospital, they're talking about E. coli, and the doctor says, and then the virus is doing that. And I was sitting there biting my tongue because, of course, E. coli is not a virus, it's a bacteria. And I just felt like, and then they correctly say that later on. So unless I missed something and there was a secondary infection, that really, really annoyed me.

1:14:56Boydy:Okay. I think you're losing focus on the important stuff. I'm just saying.

1:15:00Jennifer Garner:Maybe, I think, also, isn't he just explaining it to the parents? What, by being wrong? That's a non-traditional medical tactic. Okay. Let's not get caught up because we've only got seven minutes to go apparently. That's true. We're running out of time. Dirty business then. Channel 4, when, Boydie? Monday, today. If you're listening to this on Monday, the 23rd of February, Channel 4, 9pm. Please watch it. Fabulous. Finally this week, we have Vanished on Prime Video which stars Kayleigh Cuoco as an archaeologist whose boyfriend, played by Sam Cleflin, vanishes on a train through the south of France leading to an international espionage conspiracy and what probably qualifies as the worst holiday ever.

1:15:35Jennifer Garner:Boydie, does Kayleigh Cuoco do for trains here what she did for planes in the flight attendant. Almost. Let's just say this boldly and in massive levels of originality and kind of fantastic invention begins with this kind of like motorbike chase, this motorbike arrives to kind of go and, the guy on the motorbike to go and kind of have a fight with Kelly Cuoco who's in hold up in some...

1:16:00Boydy:Washing blood off her hands.

1:16:01Jennifer Garner:Yeah, washing blood off her hands. It's all very exciting and interesting. We're plunged into the middle of the story and then, wouldn't you know it, On the screen, it says, one week earlier. A device I've never seen used before. Here we go. Do you know what happens now is that when I saw that,

1:16:14Boydy:I found it jarring and I instantly think of you now.

1:16:16Jennifer Garner:Well, I instantly think of Russell T. Davis, who was the one who pointed it out to me years ago when he first, when he made It's a Sin, he was asked by the companies to get it commissioned. They want him to agree to start in the middle of the story and then go back to the beginning. He insisted on not doing that. And that's why I keep going on about it because he's like, he was the one who pointed it out. And once it's pointed out to you, every single fucking program certainly on the streamers as this is a Prime Video show has to happen begin with the beginning the middle or end of the story and then flashback to one week earlier and I like the way in this one I'm sorry to pick on this show but it just brought it all home to me they do it in that way so the screen goes to black that she's about to be attacked this is the very first scene listeners and watchers on YouTube Kelly Groove's about to be attacked by the motorbike dude because she means it's a dude and then it cuts to black and then it goes one beat weak beat early as if it's a brilliantly inventive thing we've invented this new device you know you weren't expecting this were you yes I fucking was anyway so there's that to deal with then you get to meet this couple and then it's another beautiful couple it's a little bit like 56 days I mean Sam Claflin and Kelly Cook are much bigger stars than the Frankie Anders and have better chemistry and they do have better chemistry yeah they do and there is it's a bit like we're going to have them shagging to show you what great chemistry they've got.

1:17:37Jennifer Garner:They're not husband and wife. They're kind of boyfriend and girlfriend, if you like. But you get to see them. So he's establishing their relationship. And then the whole trick of the whole premise of the show is that they're going on a lovely train trip to Paris. Is that where they're going? Yes. No, it's South of France. It's South of France. I think they go through Paris but they end up in South of France. And then they go to South of France. He takes a call in the quiet carriage and he's told in uncertain terms by this elderly lady that he should not be you speaking of quite right in the quiet coach he goes off to take this phone call and then fucking disappears which is a great to be fair to the show it's a good premise I'm fully on board with the premise it's the kind of premise I like

1:18:14Boydy:it felt plausible as well at some point

1:18:16Jennifer Garner:that someone would kill him for using a phone in the quiet coach absolutely 100 %

1:18:21Boydy:and I would be that murderer no I felt like I felt like I really enjoyed it up until because I thought oh my god yeah you see how this would happen he suddenly disappears and I mean there are a couple of bits where after that you're kind of hmm yeah obviously would that happen however can I just say I really still enjoyed watching Kayleigh trying to piece it together there's some she's very she's very watchable she like you know as she was piecing it together I was like oh yeah because I would do that I was thinking actually it's quite authentic the things that she does largely I mean apart from a bit where she happens to out of a whole massive like landscape find a footprint I mean insane but yeah I would say it's very entertaining

1:19:00Jennifer Garner:oh it's 100 % elevated by the fact you've got Kayleigh Quoker and Sam Claflin and she particularly she is brilliant in everything she does

1:19:07Boydy:and Claflin's cheekbones I mean they deserve their own credit

1:19:09Jennifer Garner:Claflin's still very handsome and main role we're sitting in that advert what's the advert for that he's in you know he's driving the car and it's like yeah to the woman and it's all very exciting he's very good in that but I did enjoy it it's only four episodes so it feels very kind of brief and almost a bit you know like four episodes these days is nothing but last time you were like

1:19:30Boydy:eight episodes too long I'm about to say no no no I'm about to say

1:19:32Jennifer Garner:having watched episode two I'm fully in favour of the pace this really is pacing yeah it has to be it has to be and I'm fully in favour of its four episodes limit well done for the restraint in not making this eight hours long and good locations as well

1:19:46Boydy:yes

1:19:47Jennifer Garner:lush locations good locations a lot of it's shared with that Leo Wood Apple show as well I thought so yeah the mathematics one right it really looked very very similar prime something prime target prime target yeah James what did you think I thought it was fine in the next three minutes I thought it was absolutely fine I didn't love it. Thought it was interesting. It's very similar to The Flight Attendant, but isn't quite as good. And also very similar to a lot of train set stuff. I wanted it more to be... You do love a train. I do love a train. Yeah, not enough on the train, you were thinking.

1:20:12Jennifer Garner:No, exactly. But I did enjoy all the stuff about The Quiet Carriage. But yeah, it's quite fun. I don't know that I'm going to watch any more of it, but it was all right. I think I will watch the rest of it. But you know what I did think is, it's so generic, a little bit, like the whole storyline, that it's a bit like the butterfly of this genre, of disappearing people. Yeah, you're right. If you missed the butterfly discussion, the legendary Russell T. Davis butterfly segment of our live podcast, do try it. That's such a good way of describing it. It's a little bit butterfly-esque. Synonym, yeah.

1:20:38Jennifer Garner:We have two minutes left before we get thrown out of the studio, so we will end that there. What else is on this week? Let's have a quick look. Bridgerton's back on Thursday, part two, the second chunk of the current season four of Bridgerton. There's a Danny Dyer thing. I've watched that, yeah.

1:20:54Boydy:Caravan Park, Sky.

1:20:55Jennifer Garner:Caravan Park, Sky. Scrubs. back on Thursday. The Scrubs, and we'll probably be covering that on Pilot Plus. The aforementioned, we might regret this, Wednesday, BBC Two.

1:21:05Boydy:Very funny, check it out.

1:21:06Jennifer Garner:Very funny. Oh, Monarch Legacy of Monsters. I know all about that, having attended the Apple Santa Monica launch event. And Monarch Legacy of Monsters season two, Apple TV, Friday, the 27th of February, with Kurt, Russell, and Wyatt, his actual son. And not to mention King Kong and Godzilla. Exactly. The Stolen Girl, you know, the disappearing people storylines do you remember that one with the kid going on the play date and then disappearing that's going on ITV1 from Wednesday because that was originally on Disney Plus so if you haven't got a subscriber to this you can see it on and that's really gripping I would say that's an above average person disappearing thriller in the annals of all of those shows okay marvellous what's our pick of the week

1:21:47Boydy:okay so I really enjoyed Paradise that first episode but I have to go Dirty Business

1:21:51Jennifer Garner:Dirty Business Paradise for me but Dirty Business was well worth your time that is it for this week's podcast we hope you enjoyed it if you would like to send us your messages your letters feel free to send them in it is pilot tv at empire magazine dot com follow us on the social medias and of course review this podcast only if you're going to give it five stars if you want to give it less than five stars then please review another podcast it's goodbye from me it's goodbye from Kay it's goodbye from BoydBot2000 we will see you next week for more fun when oh god let's see what's happening next week Marshalls which is another Yellowstone spin-off that comes to Paramount Plus Young Sherlock comes to Prime Vladimir as Boyd mentioned comes to Netflix Ted is back and so is Outlander.

1:22:26Jennifer Garner:I don't know what we're going to do, but you'll find out. We're definitely not doing TED. We're definitely not doing TED. It's not happening. It's exciting. Sorry, TED.

1:22:34Boydy:Let's see what you're going to review.

1:22:35Jennifer Garner:Yeah, let's see. BoydBot out.