Prisoner 951, Watson, and Changing End

25:10But yeah, it is unbelievable. An unbelievable moment of shocking TV, which is even beyond the use of genitals, if you like, from The White Lotus. Remember, The White Lotus has been one of the most prominent, so to speak. You know, was he or wasn't he wearing a prosthetical of that? I mean... It's quite cock-heavy as a show. Yeah. Whereas this has not been at all cock-heavy until suddenly this moment occurs and then it it goes it's literally like blink and you miss it at the end of the episode and then it comes to right and then it cuts to the titles and you're like what just happened um and then if you if you uh and so i've been reading up on it and people are they haven't made i need to check but the last time i looked no one had made any comment about how they did it what the extent of how they got away with it where they had to check with hbo there's an extra when i think on sky when you when you play it there's an extra kind of announcement being saying scenes of a scene some viewers may find shocking you know there's a kind of apology in advance for it but it is wild that's a new take on Charles Dickens exactly indeed but it is absolutely fucking insane and honestly it has to be seen to be believed so yeah there's that the chair company shock TV moment what a tease for that show yeah I don't know quite how we follow on that that is why we've been watching I mean who knows like yeah should we have a listener question Let's do something to get away from that subject.

26:40Okay, we have a message from California Canary who says, question for the team. After watching the brilliant All Her Fall, couldn't help thinking Mr. Chips would have been a better title. I don't quite understand that. I'm not going to dwell on it in case it involves spoilers. He has put something in brackets. I'm not going to read it out. But the question he's asked is, have you ever thought a title wasn't good enough for a series and thought of something better? Yes, obviously. Nobody wants this, which is the worst title ever for anything. where Shiksa was a great title. Yes, that's the answer.

27:09That is the definitive answer. Yeah, you can totally understand. The conversation they're probably was, no one would know what that means. It's like, you could have explained it, wouldn't have been difficult. But yeah, nobody wants this, which it took me... Which no one can remember. Right, and that was the problem. It took me about a year to remember what that's... because it's so generic and so bland that you're just like, I don't remember what that is called. You know, the one with the podcast and the terrible mind technique, that one. Yeah. Yeah, I agree with that. That's my answer too. I mean are they implying that All Her Thought isn't a great title or am I reading too much into that you can kind of get away with that as a title because it's quite thematically poignant isn't it because it is as the whole point they're all saying it's her fault you know so I think you can get away with that there's a lot of the something shows but this is the other thing it's not just about bad times it's about proximity because All Her Thought came out the same week as All's Fair that's deeply unfortunate because then you end up conflating both of those all the time and you don't want to be confused with all's fair oh by the way my British obsession continues he was talking about all's fair and how it's actually is actually fun and he was kind of talking he was basically saying what I said last week which is that it's not as bad as everyone's saying and it's aware of itself it's aware of what it's doing I just wanted to what I'm hearing is you and Brett on the same page are excited about that yeah but all's well is kind of you can see where all's well in love and war that's the phrase isn't it that's where it's coming from but it's just all's fair all's fair It seems we've already forgotten what it's called.

28:33Shows that forgettable is. Yeah, that's true. Especially if you've got... So that's not a great title in itself. I guess all her thought is okay. I mean, then there was that, you know, the spate of all the shows on Apple beginning with S. I quite like that. But some of them were forgettable. I can't even remember some... Single word S's. Yeah. Except for shrinking, obviously. Yeah, of course. Of course, except for that one. Yeah, I know what you mean. I don't think... It sounds like when they first announced it, the Lord of the Rings, the Rings of Power. The proximity of the two rings words bothered me.

29:07I would have called that something. I'd have been like, no, repetition, that bothers me. I'd have called it something different. The Lord of the Rings, the Rings of the Lord. That's the one. Yeah, it's awful. Or when you had that, do you remember Feud on Five? Fayard. Yeah, Fayard. Apparently someone told me, because I think it's on Netflix now, Fayard. It's doing really well, apparently. Oh, I'm sure, yeah. someone told me that they've resolved the typographical issue oh good yeah and it looks okay now it's no longer failed probably after hearing you Boyd exactly Sophie Petzl's show Blood is also on Netflix did we mention that?

29:37it has moved to Netflix yeah yeah and it's also doing really well oh I haven't seen it yeah it was in the top 10 last time I looked yeah which channel was it on originally? 5 I think I think and it didn't have any issues so it wasn't Blowud no it wasn't Blowud no Blowod Blowod yeah I'm trying to think of more examples of bad titles. Do you remember that, the Kristen Ritter show, which was Don't Trust the Bitch in Apartment 23? Yeah. Except they X'd out Bitch. So when it was said, it was Don't Trust the B in Apartment 23. But it only rhymes if you know not to say the word that is asterisked, but you would because we're all adults.

30:16Yeah, that's true. And also, I'm still genuinely unclear whether Emily in Paris is deliberately supposed to be Emily in Paris because it rhymes or whether it's just Emily in Paris I'm unclear on that I thought it was just Emily in Paris right yeah but it strikes me that if you were to call it Emily in Paris yeah that's quite twee and that rhymes as well I think it's deliberate it does rhyme of course she's in Rome in the next bloody series so the whole thing Emily in Roma Emily in Roma it's not really the same is it gets around as Emily exactly I'm trying to think of other terrible titles I think we've given some good answers oh right so Kay's got bored of this question moving on are we is that what's happening because it's live live rumination wow yeah it's difficult it's difficult I think Episodes was a terrible name for a TV series I didn't mind Episodes no but but you've got you've got the same problem here it's like when you have a streaming service called Now like it just makes talking about it unnecessarily difficult it's on now no it's not it's on later and then oh it's Episodes no no but what's the series called Episodes no the series it all becomes very Abbott and Costello and you just don't really need that I also didn't love the whole not to rag on Ryan Murphy any more than I already do but American Horror Story American Crime Story all of those sort of things I'm like it's just why?

31:27Yeah and talking of Ryan Murphy titles if you go back to the Geoffrey Dharma monster story the actual title was Dharma dash monster colon the Geoffrey Dharma story two Dhammas in the same title that's ridiculous yeah that's not good at all faintly ridiculous so yeah iZombie was one I didn't like I will say Money Heist is a terrible title but of course that's not the real title because the actual title is Voidy Casa de Papel which is a great title and it's as much fun to say as it is to watch. Yes, that's true. Yes, that's good. Yeah, I think there we do. There we do. There we do. There we do. There we do.

32:02There we do. We've answered the question. Yeah. I'd be curious if anyone else has any terrible title TV shows they wish to share, do send them in to the post bag, pilotTV at empiremagazine.com. We're in a rare joyous moment here because Kay has just put a chocolate in her mouth, therefore he's unable to speak. So I can really say absolutely anything at this point and she has no right of reply. Boydie, what should we say? We're going to miss the opportunity. hurry up. He's got nothing. No, I've got nothing. She's too late now. Look, she's gone. See, because Boyd is kind. No, he's not. He just couldn't think of anything.

32:29I mean, it is sadly the latter, yeah. Oh, Boyd! I'm getting married myself together for news, for the news section. Okay, fine, yeah. Yes, Boyd was composing himself. Shall we move on to news? Yes. There's quite a bit that's actually happened this week. Big news. One big news involving a lift. Yeah, the biggest news. This is something that if you were listening to this podcast regularly, you'd have thought. I thought it was a mount. James thought this was announced months ago. Maybe I just had the inside scoop. Maybe not. Maybe. But yeah, James thought months and months ago that it had officially been confirmed that Line of Duty was coming back.

33:02Turns out it hadn't. But it hadn't at all. Hence, the huge big production of this announcement that was embargoed and it's coming out and they had made a little video of them chatting about it in the lift of three main characters and they all joined in with their own version of the announcement. Vicky McClure, Martin Compton, Agent Dunbar. And yeah, they confirmed the fact that a brand new season 7 of Line of Duty is in the works. They're going to start filming it in the spring in Belfast next year. So we'll have to wait, I'm afraid. But at least it's all written. Jed's written it all. That's what he's been doing.

33:34He's been a busy man. Cannot wait. And it is one of the most exciting, properly exciting announcements. That's pretty exciting. So imagine the scene, right? I'm hosting a live Q &A for Red Eye Series 2. Which stars? Which stars? Martin Compton, right? so I'm doing this at five o 'clock with the writer Peter A. Dowling who by the way listens to the podcast so hello Hi Peter and yeah and the rest of the brilliant cast anyway we're talking about it I get off the call at 5.40 because it was a Zoom interview and then check my emails and it's been announced midway through and I've got Martin online I mean obviously I couldn't have brought it up because it's you know I'm there to promote an ITV show what to say ITV won't have minded I think they would have done I think they would have done yes in fact ITV studios are one of the producers of it.

34:18So, you know, maybe... I mean, there's no connection between ITV... Well, I mean, they're owned by the same company, but... So there's some connection. ITV1, the press office, might have been askance if you'd mentioned it, shall we say. Yes, exactly. But it was quite thrilling to be on a call with him while it was... Didn't get any kind of signs from him that there's big bombshells going to be dropped. It must have been weird for him, yeah, because obviously it was dropped at four o 'clock, right? No, I think it came... It was definitely four o 'clock. Okay, we got the... Well, I received the email at 5.20, so I was like, oh, God, that's really close.

34:46Yeah. Yeah, but it's properly, you know, that's one of the most exciting announcements of the year. I mean, look, it was one of, but arguably not the biggest announcement this week. Oh, here we go. Because the biggest announcement is that Stargate is coming back to our screens with an all-new series that will crucially not be a reboot, but a continuation of the Stargate mythology. For those of you who are not okay with Stargate, looking at you, Kay, obviously this is based on the Roland Emmerich movie, but there was Stargate SG-1, which was a series that played in the 90s and ran for I want to say something like 10 years and I watched every single episode of it.

35:20It's had two spinoffs in live action. It had Stargate Atlantis, which was good. It had Jason Momoa in it. It's the first time people saw Jason Momoa. And Stargate Universe with Robert Carlyle, which was really good, but I think it only ran for one season, so that was disappointing. There was also an animated show as well. Do you know how... Wait, can I just drop? Because I was speaking really quickly. This is how I know he's exciting because he's sped up. I'm speeding up. I can barely understand what he's saying. I genuinely... Slow down. I have a real affection for... Check your pulse. I do have a real affection It's only Stargate Stargate I love it I love it So I'm very excited Anyway back to Lana Juicy Unbelievable Well actually some other exciting news From BBC as well That's what it involves Stargate I was going to talk about the storyline Of Lana Juicy by the way Oh okay Because you know How do you know the storyline Yes This is the thing I can't believe This is the most interesting Was it in the press release Yes Oh see I didn't see the press release I just saw the little video Of course you don't read on No Unless it's Stargate 1 Yeah what about Stargate every other person is just top line a Paloja Boyd count this is the main point and people as you mentioned before when we talk about news stories we often don't talk about them in any depth we just kind of like gloss over and move on like we're about to do but one of the most interesting things about the announcement was what's happening with the characters in series 7 AC12 has been disbanded and rebranded the Inspectorate of Police Standards no anti-corruption work has never been more difficult and in this challenging climate Arnot, Fleming and Hastings are assigned their most sensitive case so far.

36:44Detective Inspector Dominic Goff, a charismatic officer winning plaudits for a string of takedowns of organised crime, is accused of abusing his position of trust to act as a sexual predator. Stealing with sexual predators. And Goff's case is a deliberate distraction from a bigger threat still operating in the shadows. Nice and topical. It's topical. Jed, as ever, tapping into what's going on in the world right now. and this will be, I guarantee you, a no holds barred look at this whole issue and of what goes on with senior police officers, etc. So adding to the excitement is that storyline. I think it's really interesting.

37:21All I needed from that announcement was that one piano key being pressed over and over again and that's all I need. That does it for me. So yeah, it's fantastically thrilling news. And the other one more thing I want to say about it is because the press release emphasized how many people watched the finale of season six 17 million people making it like the biggest drama um since like records began and i think potentially even more people will watch the new season i imagine it will either go out like beginning of autumn or make that may even wait until the new year's day thing how many years between the series off the top of my head uh five years so it'll be five years lasted in 2021 so when they so it'll be at least five years whenever whenever it comes out next year.

38:06But the final thing I want to say about it is that it is yet further proof that this whole idea that linear, old-fashioned TV channels are over and no one's bothered about the communal experience of watching stuff live anymore is bullshit because when something comes along that people are excited about, they will, this will be massive, I tell you. It will be absolutely gigantic. It will be Gavin and Stacey levels of people watching it. And there's so many examples now of people, of shows that do manage to capture that kind of thing, the traitors recently for example there's no point in banging on about it because every now and then there are enough of these things to disprove that whole theory that's my final comment on this issue are you sure it's your final comment on it?

38:46yes for now anyway back to Stargate thank you right so Stargate SG1 no I'm kidding I want to tell you the exciting news that Riot Women is getting an encore so another BBC big announcement which is that Sally Wainwright's hit BBC drama is coming back for a second series which is brilliant news now I still need to catch up so I'm still stuck on series 3 I've been very busy recently but also because I know something big have you though? big in yes boy I have been very busy something big is happening in episode 4 I know it's been like everyone's been talking about it so I've kind of been dragging my heels but I've still not watched that episode 4?

39:23it's because of what you said oh we put you off well I mean we put him off I know it's a hard episode but yeah I can't wait to finish it and then yeah exciting news for it to come back Ricky Gervais Netflix special of his most recent stand-up show has been confirmed for December 30th release, Kay? Is that the one we It's his mortality Mortality We went to one of the earliest versions of this You took me as a present Yeah, I did take you as a present That's just how great I am Didn't take me Well, yeah But yeah So this is his huge big show that he's been doing for the last year or so He's been touring on it since 2024 or 2025 The show they're picking out to show is filmed at the London Palladium.

40:05Oh, so it wasn't our one? No, it wasn't our one, no. No, our one was still a work in progress. We saw it at very early stages. I think it would have changed quite a lot. Yeah. Were you just about to say that London Palladium's your stomping ground? Yeah, yeah, my stomping ground, yeah. Exactly. Because of the Gavin and Stacey tour. Indeed. That's what, many things, but Ricky and I haven't gone. We both performed at the London Palladium. Yeah, that is true. Oh my God, talking of monsters. Yeah. but the logline is Gervais takes on his own mortality in a brutally honest and darkly funny stand up special about his life death and state of the world so that's exciting full on Gervais treat for new year okay we didn't discuss this last week because it broke just after we recorded but Ryan Johnson's poker face with Natasha Lyonne has been cancelled yeah after two seasons I'm sorry I'm not shocked by that I'm not yeah I think you liked it more than I did both of you two I really liked it yeah I think it's good it's not for me because you know I don't like those kind of episodic series but you made an exception for this though I made an exception in that I watched the first episode and said it was quite good but I did not make the exception in that I watched any more of it or ever planned to oh I watched quite a few of it and I really enjoyed it but I think it must I did we'll keep watching it and thinking this must be exhausting for Rian Johnson because every episode he has to come up with an ingenious whodunit of knives out levels of complexity often and it must be just almost impossible to pull it off for those of you upset that you're not going to eat more of this.

41:28But speaking of Knives Out, there is a new one imminent. There is, yeah. So, Wake Up Dead Man. It arrives, I think it's in cinemas on the 26th of November, and then it comes to Netflix on the 12th of December. I have seen it. So have I. But it's embargoed. So we cannot say what we think of it. I saw it with a Q &A with the whole cast. Did you? No, no, no, no. Including Danielle Craig. I don't know why I called him Danielle. It's funny, I went to the Royal Opening, which wasn't a... I said Royal Opening, but King wasn't there. I was there, so I've got to call it Rod. The Royal Opening of the London Film Festival.

41:55I don't want to hear about your Royal Opening. Which was the opening gala. Yeah, of course. Which, of course, was the premiere. And I was there with the cast. That was nice. You were with the cast? Yeah, I went to the after party with them afterwards. Oh, okay. So it was good, yeah. Did you call Daniel Craig and ask him about what you thought of Scarga SG? I did, actually. It's funny. He was a big driving force in getting it green, actually. I bet you didn't know that. The thought of it. He's a big gator. Oh, my God. Is that what they're called? I think so, yeah. You'd never say that to his face.

42:18Wow. Yeah. Okay.

42:24Okay, we're done with news. Let's move on to this. No, that was a funny, I want to give you a funny news story. Boyd is literally, he's like the, the can is open, the worms are everywhere. Well, this is a very used, both of you really, but particularly you. Oh, okay, carry on. Did you see, did you see this? I think this was just announced today or, you know, yesterday. Friends spin-off Joey. Yes. Did you read the story? No. Friends spin-off Joey finally releases its final eight unaired episodes nearly 20 years later. Wow. Did they never air anywhere? Not even in the US? No, they didn't air anywhere.

42:53I'm not sure if this is a good idea. Well, I mean, it's funny, because it was such a disaster, Joey. I remember in the very early, it was like Channel 5 bought it, and it was the whole big adult, big dramatic launch of it, and it was like a massive flop. No one liked it. It was pretty terrible. So it completely flopped, and they didn't show the final eight episodes on it. But yeah, they're going to put them all on the official Friends YouTube channel, along with 38 other episodes that comprise. There were 38 episodes there. 38 episodes. And they aired 30 of them. Exactly. and then just randomly didn't put up the last name so you know for friends die hard completists shall we say they might as well get some money from the advertising on YouTube yeah exactly and absolutely massive Matt LeBlanc fans then yeah tune in to their YouTube channel and you'll see it so that was a funny story isn't it that's not a bad story to end you thank you Boydie pleasure let's move on to this week's reviews and first up this week we have Prisoner 951 on BBC1 which dramatises the true story of Naznin Zagari Ratcliffe here played by Nagas Rashidi.

43:53And she's a British citizen, as you will know from the news headlines, who was detained by the Iranian regime while she was in Tehran, visiting her parents and her brother. Joseph Fiennes here plays her husband, Richard, who campaigned tirelessly for her release. Now, crucially, this is the dramatization of this story and not, in fact, the similarly named documentary on this subject. Isn't that right, Kay? Yes. Yes, that is right. Yeah. Okay, so the reason why he's bringing that up is because I could not... I kept on getting it wrong and I kept on thinking we were doing the documentary and I thought it was odd that we were doing a documentary because we never do and then Boyd had to point out no no there's a drama don't watch the wrong thing you bloody idiot so yeah anyway I didn't I watched the right one and I'm glad I did because it's incredibly powerful I mean I think as you say most people know about Nazneen and what she's gone through but to see it play out it's just devastating to realise you know how she was treated how it all panned out and the fact that not least because she was separated from her her baby who's only 22 months old and was still breastfeeding and everything so it was very traumatic for her to be separated from Gabriella and yeah it's just it's so shocking to see how it all how it all happened and the fact that Richard was in the UK didn't know what was going on the family also were being kept in the dark and couldn't say too much as well because they were worried about they were being spied on I just think this is an extraordinary it's a very powerful watch I think it's an important one and also you know the fact that It's not just Nazneen this has happened to, it's many other people which they also mention in this.

45:25And the fact that the Foreign Office were very slow to act and were just, you know, they were all trying to calm the family down. They didn't want Richard to publicise it as he did because they said it was jeopardising her. But actually it's because behind the scenes, it was all about, you know, later it came to light, it was all linked to a debt that the UK had with Iran. I believe 393.8 million yeah so just a small loan a small loan I mean something to do with tanks wasn't it yeah something to do with tanks that weren't delivered in the 70s and yeah so I just overall I would just say they've done a great job it's so immersive you you absolutely feel like you're there with her and you you run the gamut of emotions that she goes through from being like shocked confused she doesn't know what she's being detained for and she thinks it's just a simple mistake because they say you know she's going to be released the next day so she's hopeful and then as the days turn into months turn into years obviously the full horrifying um reality dawns upon her and and it's completely devastating but yeah i thought it's really well done and um enjoyable seems like the wrong word to use it's definitely not enjoyable it's not enjoyable but i think it's worth everyone's time it's as i think boyd has already guessed i found this exceptionally difficult to watch because it's really really stressful although i will say only the second most upsetting show I watched this week.

46:45But, Boydie, what did you think of it? I thought it was excellent. And I think we've reviewed a lot of shows, you know, in recent times, which are like true crime type shows. This isn't really, it's not true crime. I mean, it kind of is. It's just an international crime, a political crime. Certainly what the Iranians were doing was criminal, that's for sure, yeah. But where the tone is like a bit askew and they try and be a bit clever, clever, and they try and employ gimmicks, you know, to kind of dramatize the story and it all becomes a bit queasy and well I think this is brilliantly judged all the way through I think and there are moments where you know you see an insight to her mind she's dreaming of her husband she's put in this tiny cell on her own it feels very real because that's what to get her through this yeah of course exactly so even those moments which are almost little flights of fantasy if you like are very well judged and very well handled and it is like you're experiencing this whole nightmare I mean the word Kafkaesque is overused this is the ultimate Kafkaesque relentless nightmare where she doesn't know what's happening to her she doesn't she just was arriving to have a holiday to see her family she keeps being lied to by the by the people who are kind of interrogating her they keep being accused of being a spy right yes that's yeah but even then they don't really tell her that for ages and ages you know she can't she just she's blindfolded everywhere she goes so she can't see where they're taking her there's no they keep kind of they keep dropping hints that she might be set free you know five days in next week in the week after and it's all just playing tricks on her it's a form of torture basically they induce various forms of torture on her and it's just incredibly powerful and even though it isn't enjoyable I'm telling you it's so well done and it's so gripping and I have to say she is phenomenal Narges Rashidi she's completely believable 100 % of the time.

48:43I mean, so is Joseph Fiennes, but I think his role is, you know, not as hard. What she's doing is really difficult, right? She's kind of playing someone terrified all the way through. And then there's a scene in the first episode where she gets to see the baby again, tantalisingly, again, cruelly, really, for kind of minutes. And when she's playing with the kids, she's so, so natural. It's almost like, it is like watching a documentary. It's like a documentary, yeah. Exactly, ironically, yeah. It's not. We watch the documentary separate the following week. So there is actually a documentary on BBC Two about the whole case.

49:12But I just thought the acting was brilliant. I think the way it's written, Stephen Buchard wrote it, who wrote This City is Ours. He's a very experienced drama writer. Did you say this, James? It's based on her book. It's a forthcoming book. It hasn't come out yet. Oh, has it not come out yet? Books written by the two of them. Oh, I thought it was already out. No, it's called A Yard of a Sky. It's coming out soon, apparently, yeah. So it is based on that. You're right, yes. And directed by Philippa Lothar, we directed episodes of The Crown. She's brilliant. she does a brilliant job as well so it's one of those things that reminded me a bit of like those the films some of the films about you know the World Trade Center 9-11 United 93 Paul Greengrass films right it's got a Paul Greengrass quality to it actually in fact that's that shaky camera yeah in that and even though it isn't you know even though it's telling an incredibly depressing distressing story it's really gripping like the way he he makes United 93 I remember watching like two or three times, weirdly, because it was so intensely gripping and fascinating.

50:10I kind of wanted to see how it... And the other thing that I think is incredible about this type of show is, what an undertaking. They have to dramatize this really complex situation. They have to find, first of all, a location where, standing for the prison where she was kept, they have to find locations like the airport in Iran, and it's a really ambitious, big thing, because any... Because I think if you drop the ball in this thing and you try and do it cheaply, on the cheap, or you don't put in incredible levels of time and effort to getting it all right, it will come across as inauthentic.

50:42Whereas this is so authentic every single step of the way. I just think it's a real achievement. And all the support cast as well. Everyone, the parents. And the whole thing with the Foreign Office, I thought was really, because yeah, the Foreign Office is dragging. Everyone knows the British Foreign Office, it's almost more than any other, is all about, oh no, we can't ruffle feathers. but actually the more feathers he ruffles and the more her supporters do stuff whether it's hunger strikes and all of the stuff Petitions so within the first morning of him the husband putting an online petition 15 ,000 people signed and that really scared But that real kind of conflict if you like between the actual family who are trying to do that and within the families because her dad and her brother have conflict about what the best thing is to do Because they're living in Iraq and they're obviously in peril themselves.

51:33Exactly. And then the conflict between the Foreign Office and him, the husband... The first meeting between the husband and the minister is extraordinary. It is really extraordinary. So stuff like that is really dramatic. I wouldn't want people... I guess what I'm trying to say is don't be put off by the fact that this is a distressing story because it is very dramatic and it's very interesting as well. And the way it's done will grip you all the way through. It's interesting, I think, because this gives you an amount of nuance because it's recent enough that we all kind of know the facts of this case to greater or lesser extent.

52:06It's only four episodes, so it's four hours in total. I think that's merciful. No, and also necessary, I think, because again, you've got this element because there's not a lot of overarching drama for the simple reason that we all know how this ends. And we largely speak and we know the beats of how it plays out. We may not know the minutiae and some of the discussions that we had and that's very interesting stuff. Yeah, that detail is really dramatic. But we do know how it ends. Yeah, sure. And we know where it's going. So I think the early episodes where she's discombobulated, well, not early episodes, I mean sort of almost the early scenes in the first episode, where she doesn't know what's happening.

52:37Oh, I'm going to be released on Sunday. Oh, it's all going to be fine. Obviously, we're all watching this. We know it's not going to be fine, and we know she's not going to be released on Sunday. So I almost think that if you had gone into this cold and you knew nothing about the actual situation, that would have been incredible edge-of-your-seat stuff because you're not, oh my God, what is going to happen? Except there will be another three episodes, so you know it's not going to get resolved that quickly. This is why I think it's so good. because again I'm making the comparison to United 93 again obviously we all know we know how that is it's the detail that makes it dramatic it's about the human drama it's like Lockerbie when we watched it but particularly this one seeing it through her eyes and literally being shown what she was put through hour on hour day by day that makes it really dramatic and interesting even though you think you know the story but actually this is showing you in its detail something that you don't know I don't think any of us do know her and her family and people close to her But I don't think the rest of us know the detail of it, and that's what makes it special.

53:32And it's chilling because it's still happening, that's the thing. Oh, yeah, absolutely, painfully so. I'm going to make a political point. Oh, here we go. I warn you now. But I genuinely think it won't be long before we see a similar drama about the people that are being taken off the streets by ICE people in Trump's America. And you can cut that if you want, James, but I think it's a valid comparison because people are being snatched off the street without any due process in the United States of America right now. and I think that deserves to be dramatised in a similar way. What would you just call it?

54:02Ice? Yes. Yes. There we go. Boyd is pitching TV shows to the BBC so if you would like to make that show please make the checkout to Pilot TV Podcast. Keep us in Lindt chocolates. And we'll split it between us or just send in Lindt vouchers. That's fine too. We will accept that. I mean, inappropriate but... Fair enough. Prisoner 951 then airs on BBC One. Yes. So it started yesterday, Sunday the 23rd. Carries on today, Monday the 24th and then next Sunday and Monday, as we've said, it'll all be on the iPlayer as well. Next up this week, we have Watson on Sky Witness. Season one of Watson, we should say, aired back in January on CBS in the US and I think the second season started last month over there as well.

54:41So we are quite a way behind. But this show, which we already talked about a little bit last week, this stars Maurice Chesna as Dr. John Watson, Sherlock Holmes' famous sidekick, who kind of after Sherlock is apparently killed by Moriarty at Reichenbach Falls, retires from the whole investigation game. sets up a hospital in Pittsburgh where he essentially becomes House MD. The setup for this show is wild. Boydie. Yes. Now, I famously, famously didn't watch all of House. No. But this is basically a House reboot. Oh. But with... Wash your mouth out. It is. No, it is. It is. It's not as good as House.

55:17Of course. You can't compare it. But it is Diet House. But also, this is what's wild to me. This is basically the setup. The fact that he has a load of kind of like student-type underling doctors, and he has those little sort of Socratic discussions. Is it lupus? You know, a lot of that goes on. But also, so you've got that on the one hand, and then randomly, they use this incredible, incredibly cynical musical leitmotif from the BBC Sherlock to remind you that it's Sherlock-connected, even though it's not that Sherlock-connected. And I thought that was so fucking cheeky. Yeah, insane. Absolutely insane.

55:50It opens quite spectacularly spectacularly with the Reichenbach Falls kind of incidents. There's a big waterfall. It's all you think, oh, this is quite a lavish, you know, Sherlockian thing. And then you go, hospital procedural. And then it does do an incredible, kind of incredibly unthrilling, becomes an unthrilling procedure, as you say, in the house style. But so close to the house style. But I'll tell you the difference, though, is the tone. So house, right from the start, the genius of house, and I've watched every single episode, some of them multiple times. It's fun because you've got Hugh Laurie showing off as Dr.

56:30House, being smug and smart and cantankerous, but genius. You've got him bouncing off his own Wilson, right? You know, the Dr. Watson character, who's a lovely guy, decent guy, and they're constantly bickering about stuff. He's bickering with the rest of his team. The mysteries are really interesting. You know, they're smart. They're smart. There is a mystery every week. They're running jokes about lupus. you know it's funny it's funny and clever and gripping and dramatic when he wants to be dramatic blah blah blah this is like has very no sense of humour about it like every now and then there's twins there's characters who are twins in it and one of them starts dating the other's ex-girlfriend and that's a funny kind of a funny little moment well I'm trying to be generous I'm trying to find the humour in what is otherwise a dour a weirdly dour take on Sherlock and on House again Sherlock itself you know the coming back it's fucking hilarious you know Stephen Moffat bringing and Mark Gatis bringing the comedy to that character and that story this is so there's a miserable case it starts with with this oh with a woman yeah with the young mother it's a kind of it's just kind of depressing rather than rather than kind of fascinating and the whole tone of it is quite self-serious as well as if like you know, apart from, randomly, this British character.

57:53Oh, please do not. Yes. Shinwell, who's a former criminal from London, who's an acquaintance of Watson, who kind of like rescues him from the Reichenbach thing and kind of tells him what's going on. And he's like a real cockney, he's just a real like... He's a cockney teacher. He's from a Guy Ritchie show, yeah. He literally says, welcome home, gov. Yeah. He's wandered in from the Gentleman, the Guy Ritchie series, and there's just a real weird clash of like, it's just, I think it's just, his accent is so cockney. in this, it might be his actual real accent, I think it probably is, you know, he's a British guy, Richie Costa plays him, but it just feels all askew, it doesn't hold together, and yeah, so it's trying to be like House, but failing miserably, mixed with Sherlock and failing even more miserably, it does signal the death knell of mainstream network, primetime TV.

58:44This is so networked, like it's almost excruciatingly networked. Well that's the problem, you know, and it's like, I watched it thinking you haven't learned you've taken such clear inspiration from these brilliant shows that went before it that told the Sherlock Holmes story and the Watson story as well but you've learned nothing because what you've made is just this boring dour unfunny miserable thing there's obviously an audience for it that's the thing well kind of yeah I mean it shows you how incredibly common adaptations of Holmes and Watson stories are I mean Arthur Conan Doyle I think he said Arthur C.

59:15Clarke Arthur Conan Doyle that's a Sherlock I'd watch I think it's out of what's the word there's no restrictions anyone can do their Sherlock because it's out of copyright out of copyright that's the word I was looking for copyright so these keep happening again and again and again but the music yes the music so I can't remember what that little warbling instrument is that they use because it has a very distinctive sound hasn't it like the BBC Sherlock and at two points in this episode they all but lift and it's one of those things where oh my god it's literally the music except they changed like one note.

59:49So it's slightly different. I wanted to text David Arnold, I kind of know, who wrote the theme song, co-wrote the theme song. Do you know they've ripped off you? Yeah, absolutely. Because you're right, it's comical. Yeah, but it's so like, hey, look, you love Sherlock, this is Sherlock. And one final thing, sorry. I mean, spoiler alert, but I mean, you know, who cares? No, all right. Moriarty, Moriarty pops up. He does. At the end, and I'm like, oh, this is, I mean. That was the final nail in the corner. I mean, you've got, you're following the footsteps of Andrew Scott one of the most powerful and impactful and legendary arrivals of a character in TV history did you miss him?

1:00:24he is so brilliant right as Moriarty in the BBC Sherlock this arrival of the Sherlock could not be less underwhelming don't you come for Randall Park if it's right oh my god I'm talking about miscasting Randall Park is he's the least threatening he is least scary but I love Randall Park he might cuddle him to death I mean right it almost does you'll never see him come in it's embarrassing so that's all I'm going to say you've managed to find someone whose version of Moriarty is literally could be like the bloke next door he's so unscary hiding in plain sight yes well I think you've been a touch harsh I agree with everything you've said broadly except you randomly like Randall Park apart from I like Randall Park but also it's not a bad show it's not a great show it's not great it's fine it's fine I agree it's exactly like the medical mystery is quite interesting they go through a few like red herrings not actual red herrings you know oh it's going to be this oh it's not lupus it's going to be that and the actual you know when they finally I must admit I found the final payoff of what it was quite like alright I don't know what any of that means but sure whatever you like but I and you know there's a bit of revelation about it ooh interesting so I didn't mind that it wasn't as clever as the few episodes of House that I have seen but I think you're right it's while I think Maurice Chestnut is perfectly fine and charismatic and all these things and there is a where the doctor takes off his shirt so you can see the unbelievably chiseled abs and pecs that he has.

1:01:52It's like, okay, that is a doctor with enough time to go to the gym four times a day. But all of that is fine, but it's just like, it's not enough. It's not quite enough. So it's perfectly fine. And I think if you love House and you re-watch House all the time and you go, oh God, I wish I made more House. I mean, you might as well watch it because if you like that formula, it is similar. It's just not as good. I think all of House is on Netflix. It's now handily. Or just re-watch House on Netflix. I'm pretty sure. Yeah, no, I agree. It sounded more damning than I meant to be. It is fine. And in fact, it's not as bad as some of the other...

1:02:23We've done a couple of big network prime championships recently, which have been worse. And it has the slightly, perhaps you'll conceive, like villainous Moriarty thread running through the episodes in the background. Like that's your story arc for you there. Yeah, indeed. But it's absolutely wild, though, that if they wanted to do a House-esque kind of investigative medical procedural why they decided to sort of like blend it with the Sherlock franchise kind of blows my mind like it's such an odd fit because we had elementary as well by the way which is also CBS it's a CBS show and that ran for years so I guess that's you know I guess that's why and I kind of thought I wondered whether this was in the same universe but I don't think it is because they had a completely different Moriarty and also I believe I believe Sherlock there's been an announcement of the casting of Sherlock in this show oh right yes yes I thought you were going to say Sherlock's coming back I thought this was another line of duty yes that's it Benedict Cumberbatch will return as Sherlock in Watson it was unexpected but it's happening can you imagine can you imagine I have absolutely nothing to add to both your announcers other than to say when I was watching this my only overriding thought was I really want to watch House so I'm going to do that rather than watch what you're saying is if you eliminate the impossible whatever remains however improbable must be this show well done Yes.

1:03:41Okay. What's and then? Which is on Sky Witness. It's on Sky Witness. And now, on Monday the 24th of November, today if you're listening to this as the podcast comes out, 9pm 2025. Nearly at 2026, by the way. It's exciting. Bring it on. Finally this week, we have Series 3 of Changing Ends on ITV. I did say it was a slow week. This continues the story of a young Alan Carr, who apparently, after Celebrity Traitors, is beloved by all, and I'm not allowed to say a bad word about him. This series is not beloved by me. It has to be said, I strongly suspect the two of you feel differently. I turned this off after 12 minutes and 44 seconds because I just couldn't handle it.

1:04:24Oh my God. I did, however, give myself a day to recover and then watch the remaining 15 minutes of it. But it was a struggle. I think that's banana crack. So that is crazy. What? You could sit through Watson. Yes. He's a monster. I found this excruciating. Oh my God. I really did. I think it's just like, it's definitely not my sense of humour. I find it quite aggressively unfunny to the point of cringe where it triggers my cringe reflex. I'm like, oh my God, oh my God, I can't, I just can't watch this. It's just, yeah. It's just not my sense of humour at all. And so I find it a bit of a struggle to watch.

1:05:03Okay. Sorry. I think that does. So I know a number of people, including Lizzie in the Empire Office, who's a massive fan of the show and really, really enjoys it. So I'm prepared to concede that it may be me. Oh, it's definitely you. I mean, there's no... It's definitely you. There's no... Really? Of course. Are you sure? Absolutely. 100%. I love it. It's great. Because, and I don't... I'm surprised you could take against it. It doesn't strike me as the kind of show that many people... You might not love it as much as, you know... I love Alan. I think he's fantastic. I find the... the Alan Carr impersonation quite great.

1:05:37and the comedy is very broad and weirdly the Alan character I actually found less the cringe stuff a lot of it came from the parental storylines which I did not enjoy either because again very broad and I was just like to my let's say finally miscalibrated sense of humour it was just like bum note after bum note I'm just like oh my god this is just killing me I find it so unfunny so I just yeah I couldn't I think part of the whole joy of the show is the fact that they found someone, Oliver Savelle particularly, to play the young Alan who has... But this wasn't the old young Alan, was it? Yeah, yeah.

1:06:16So he's just got older. Yeah, yeah. So fine, because I'm just trying to work out because... That's the ageing process. Yes. Thank you for explaining the passage of time. I just wanted to be sure. You thought he might be a new actor. Yeah, I thought it was a new actor because he's older. It's the same actor. Right, okay. And I have to say, part of the whole success of the show is that he is brilliant actually at doing the young Alan. because it's a hard task because Alan has got a really unique voice, a unique delivery of what he says, which is partly why he's in National Treasure and partly why he won the Celebrity Traitors spoiler alert.

1:06:49Oh my God. I mean, I wouldn't put it past people. Yeah, Boyd, he just spoiled Celebrity Traitors. Yeah. So yeah, he does a brilliant job playing him. And obviously, that is, Alan speaks in this particular way that clearly you find great. No, no, No, weirdly, it's not his voice I find great. It's the imitation of his voice. It's just, I don't know, I can't be dealing with it. Okay, yeah. It's quite, it's a lot. Well, yeah, I just think he's brilliantly cast and it does a fantastic job in the role. And in this news, it's in 1989, it's got the 80s nostalgia thing. Athena. Athena, right? What a throwback.

1:07:28What a throwback, because you're suddenly reminded of. And those exact posters. Yes, exactly. I like the Athena bit, I did like that. that. Finally. I like the Athena style. Because that's the best, this show has the best kind of nostalgia because it reminds you of stuff you'd forgotten about or the minutiae. And I think that's down to Alan. Alan's very clever at remembering stuff and pinpointing stuff that has that, I'm going to say, Proustian, no less. Yes, indeed. Wow. Yes. Proustian. I'm sticking with it. Just the little things that remind you of your youth of times gone past. Even just like, you know, the swimming classes and stuff like that.

1:08:07All the detail is actually great. But particularly Athena, just, I thought that brought it back. And to recreate that, where the fuck they found just the front of the store. Filing the posters is less difficult. But just the whole storefront. Because Athena doesn't exist anymore as far as I'm aware. It hasn't existed for decades. It hasn't existed for decades. But I remember going into the, because they'd have books, they'd have... Mainly posters and cards and things. It's already been difficult. Did they sell books? I don't know. I guarantee you, maybe the bigger branches. The one I went in. The flagship Athena store.

1:08:39It's a weird detail for you to get quite a lot on. It is a really useless detail. But it's just great to see those things, particularly that example. And of course, the other element of why it works for me is because a lot of the adult stuff is about football because his dad is a football manager. Another reason it has to be said that I did not enjoy it. Indeed. Sean Dooley as his dad. Sean Dooley does a brilliant job. I love Sean Dooley. Sean Dooley is great in everything he does. he was in It's a Sin he's always brilliant but he does such a good job playing the manager because he just captures what football managers were like back then and some of them still are like that today kind of unreconstructed but he's a decent guy he's not caricatured I think interestingly because I know that eyebrow has been raised by James listeners but he's not caricatured I think particularly the dad because you might think the dad is like a disapproving you know and he has elements of that and he is embarrassed quite a lot by it Alan, which I think rings totally true.

1:09:34But at the end of the day, he's a good guy. He's a decent guy. And in his dealings in the football world, you see that come out as well. And, you know, being fascinated by football, to have that recreation of what football was like back there. And we're talking lower division football. This is not like Premier League or Division I. Or Division I, as we used to call it. This is kind of lower level in the football pyramid. So all of that, I find interesting. Alan popping up every now and then that device I think works really well do you know what I used to hate that when we watched I remember you mentioning that I was like oh no I didn't need that I don't like that fourth wall being broken I mean like Fleabag obviously did it very well but even in do you remember the show about the phone hacking recently with David Tennant yeah I just do not yeah I just do not like it but I have to say and I can't tell if my enjoyment of this has increased because of the celebrity traitors and like just oh probably and everyone appreciating Alan more but I really enjoyed those cameos now I thought they added extra dimension to it but it's also a bit like things that everybody hates Chris remember the show the Chris Rock one yeah where Chris Rock narrated it so it has that there's another example which I can't remember at the moment right now obviously of a show about a kid the life of a young celebrity where the older version pops up as well so it is a device that's been used before I think it works really well I've always liked I thought wasn't it the Rock one that was that that's right you're right the rock yeah young rock yes exactly thank you so I've always loved the Alan popping up elements to it and I think actually they've got better as it's got on I agree with that actually I didn't because I seem to quite didn't love those in the first season but actually here I actually thought they were quite funny yeah yeah he's just got he's just got he's just got funny bones I've said it before some people do some people don't and I think and I think with the casting and I think the story by the way the storyline in the first episode is that young Alan gets a crush on the handsome boy who works in Athena Erks in Athena and that's a lot you know it's not long ago I don't know maybe even 10 you'd never have got this storyline you know a young guy you know kind of teen he's like 15 talking about his you know how he fancies this other boy we've moved on and I think this is testament to that culturally I think it's significant to be celebrated yeah totally celebrated and they do it very and actually again to fly in the face of what James says they do that quite very cleverly and kind of tenderly is tenderly a word?

1:11:55no I was going to say it's very sweet and funny and tender in places and I appreciate that. Yeah, 100%. And tone is everything in this kind of show. So I think you're horrendously wrong. Fair enough. You should repent. I think it does lack a certain verisimilitude, but it is a sitcom, so, you know, that's fine. But just certainly the interaction in the pool. There is an incident in the pool with a chocolate bar, which very nearly, I was like, no, just absolutely not. I can't be having this. But I should say, I have nothing against Alan Carr at all. He may be a national treasure to you. He's not so much for me.

1:12:25I don't watch Celebrity Traders. But, you know, I've met him. he gave me an award once so you know what for? I can't remember one of my many awards that I've won okay for a new show called Changing Bellin very good very good yes that's right oh wow it's tickled him yeah that's good it's good I like it but yeah it's just not for me as to be fair on most sitcoms not for me but this is another one Changing Ends then which enters it's third series on ITV when? this is quite interesting scheduling wise as well actually it starts on it started yesterday Sunday the 23rd at 10.05 and it runs all week on ITV after I'm a Celebrity.

1:13:01I think that it's kind of like yeah I think it's a treat I think it has a big it's inheriting yeah I'm a Celebrity every night so yeah I think it's I think it's a good thing. Yeah. Runs all week and carries on probably the beginning of the following week. Okay. Other things are out this week there's a little show called Stranger Things which drops on Netflix on Thursday which obviously is heavily impacted. We will cover that not on Plus but on the regular show next Monday on the reg so fear not we'll get to talk about that then there's also the Beatles Anthology which is the Disney Plus Peter Jackson restored documentary which we also couldn't see for this podcast so that's great that's on Wednesday by the way it is on Wednesday on the Disney Blue on the Disney Blue what else we've got Bay of Fire Series 2 on ITVX that comes on Sunday should you wish to watch it have we missed anything else?

1:13:49Prehistoric Planet I'd say just the apples kind of lavish which you're shilling for currently I did shill for yeah I did host a thing about does have mammoths I do love a mammoth amazing mammoth I love a mammoth very very good mammoth action there's a crims crims see you know we should ask Kay a question Quay what do you think of mammoths tell us tell us right now this second what do you think of mammoths go what's that what did you say talking around your chocolate what was that okay I might have just had a chocolate for sustenance we've been going on for about four hours fair fair enough there's a Chris Hemsworth documentary about mammoths which was unexpected no I've watched it it's about oh there you go Yes, he's gone on a road trip to remember with his dad, who was diagnosed with Alzheimer's.

1:14:27Oh, right. And they've gone on a road trip in Australia, hoping that this sort of reminiscence therapy will help him because it can halt the speed at which and the dementia decline. He's become quite the unscripted hero, hasn't he? He's done loads of these things. He has, yes. This one particularly, sorry, boys, this one is particularly poignant because obviously it's with his family and with his dad. And it's really quite sweet. And also for anyone who's got family members or it's quite useful. He's got a lot of useful information from doctors. Interesting, yeah. So that's Chris Evansworth, The Road Trip to Remember on National Geographic and Disney Plus today, Monday the 24th of November, nine o 'clock.

1:15:03Doc is another procedural. I think it might even be from the same team as Watson, but it's on Sky Witness now from Wednesday at nine o 'clock and that's the second season of that show which we've previously entirely ignored. I think that's about it, yeah. Okay, fabulous. what is our pick of the week Prisoner 951 yeah yes has to be agreed not Watson sorry okay that's it for this week's show we hope you enjoyed it as ever please do leave us a review we would love a 5 star rating on whatever platform you should so choose and also follow us on the socials Kate was about to say something yes I was going to say we had a new review in and I just wanted to give oh god no don't worry about it it's fine it's never good news when you read out a review well no I'm not going to read it out I just wanted to flag I wanted to give a shout out to Robert Frost who actually wrote in the style of Robert.

1:15:55He did a little kind of, yeah, poem me type thing. So you should look at that at your lecture. We got a review from Robert Frost. Yes. This is amazing. This is Slow Horse's editor, Robert Frost. Yes. Oh, actual Robert Frost. It's not the poet. No, I knew it wasn't the poet, but I didn't realise it was actually the poet. Yes. I forgot that Robert Frost was our Slow Horse's editor. Yes, absolutely. I just remember him writing in and I was joking about Sir Robert Frost. Yeah, our new favourite editor. Absolutely. Sorry, Darren. Legend. Poor Darren. Not only did he not get chocolates, but now he's not our favourite editor.

1:16:27I mean, we're terrible, aren't we? Yeah, we are. Sorry. But crucially, so this is Robert Frost, the editor, but he has written a poem in the manner of Robert Frost, the poet. This is what you're telling me. Well, he's written... I want you to read it because I think you'll do it justice. I will mess it up. So one of two things has happened here. Either Robert Frost, the editor, who is clearly a very funny guy, has decided to write us a Robert Frost the Poet-esque review on Apple Podcasts or someone else being extremely meta has decided to just review it as Robert Frost oh I didn't even think of that no I think it's our Sir Robert Frost I'm gonna I'm gonna agree we're gonna read this poem out go on James I'm gonna do it you ready?

1:17:06best reading voice okay this is the latest review on Apple Podcasts for the podcast three voices gathered when new shows begin James Charting Strotcher pace and theme Kay gauging tone beneath the din and Boyd ever sly would softly beam, as he alluded to truths untold. They roamed through slow horses, muddy and sharp, then vaulted into the expanse's flight, picking apart each scene, each spark, what lands, what drags, what just feels right, their craft to judge what stories hold. And I strolled with them episode by episode, hearing debates on which paths thrive. They walked the road where pilots load, their promise hoping to survive, a weekly wander through the bold.

1:17:45Very good. That's pretty good. That's amazing. A lot of effort's gone into that. The actual original Robert Frost couldn't have done better. No. Do you know what? I'm going to go out on a limb and say that's better than anything actual Robert Frost has ever written. I'm giving that five stars. Five stars for the poem. Five stars for the review. Thank you very much for the time. Very happy with that. Love it. We welcome all reviews. They don't have to be poems. But yes, that gets... Do you know what? I think they should all be poems. From now on. Don't put people off. Leave us reviews. Frankly, if you're not going to talk about us in iambic pentameter, I don't want to hear about it.

1:18:12Stop alienating the listeners, James. Fair enough. if you want to follow us on social media we are at PilotTVPod we are at K.Ribera we are at Boyd Hilson and I am at James E. Dyer on next week's show I mean there's a lot to talk about we're going to be doing Stranger Things which is exciting but what else is out next week I mean you know how much I love a mammoth but mammoth is back for a second series not actually about mammoths Talamaska comes to Netflix which is the Anne Rice Dark Universe spin-off show it is the glue that sort of sticks Interview with the Vampire and the Mayfair which is together point doesn't think it is I didn't know about that It may not be.

1:18:44It's in the calendar. I may have put it there. Who knows? I mean, you did put a couple of things in the calendar for November, which weren't actually on until December. Don't need to talk about that. See, this is why we don't bother with the bloody calendar. Exactly. Don't need to talk about that. The Hunt. The Hunt comes to Apple TV on Wednesday. The Abandons, which is the new Kurt Sutter show. That comes to Netflix. Very excited about that one. Spartacus, How of Asher, comes to MGM+. I'm also excited about that one. There's a lot going on. But you've left the best to last. The War Between the Land and the Sea lands on BBC One on Sunday.

1:19:10Almost all of these, I'm sure, will be embargoed. so I have literally no idea which ones we will or will not cover next week, but we will do Stranger Things next week. On this week's Pilot Plus, we will do something. I know not what. And guys, guys, you know, it's that time of year. We are coming up in December. It's creeping up on us. We're going to have to talk our list of the shows of the year and we're going to have to talk the Review of the Year podcast. Cue the office punch-up. Yeah. So I don't know quite how we're going to attack this this year. Well, attack is a key word there. I mean, we could take a battle royale approach to it.

1:19:41Why not? Except me and Boyd would probably end up dead, so I'm not sure that's a good idea. I was going to say, I don't know who I'd back in that scenario. Indeed, yes. So let's maybe not do that. So, I don't know, we'll work that out. But yes, keep your eyes and ears peeled for our review of the special, which will probably go out between Christmas and New Year during that time when Boyd would like us to be working, but we're actually not. Well, again, we have to deal with the fact that the biggest shows are going to be on New Year's Day, and what do we do about that? And I've personally said I'm committed to doing it if you can get us screeners, Boyd, but have you pulled your finger out?

1:20:06I seem to recall you said Boyd had to get us screeners and buy us lunch. Oh, yes. Yes. Yes, James. I think that was... Well, you can say what you like. Well, listeners, let's just see how committed Boyd is to you. You don't have to make yourself... Just get your chef to whip something up for us. We don't need you to actually cook it. It's fine. I think it's almost... It's definitely going to happen. It's going to happen. I feel it. It's definitely going to happen. Jesus Christ. Round of Boyds for Christmas Day. Excellent. That's it. We're done. See you next time. Pilot out.

1:20:36you