PLUS Fallout

0:07Welcome to Pilot Plus, your extended guide to every show that matters. And this week, we are here for the return of the Capital Wasteland, specifically Fallout, the TV series on Prime Video, based on the, I want to say, 1997 starting run of video games, RPG video games. This is a retro-futurist post-apocalyptic fable, which, as you will recall, stars Ella Purnell as Lucy McClain, who lived her life in a bunker, safe from the nuclear fallout, only to emerge after Raiders attacked, try and find her family, and ends up wrapped up with Walton Goggins the ghoul, who is, yes, you guessed it, a ghoul.

0:44And a lot happens. Now, this was quite a big hit for Prime Video. I am a big fan of video games. I watched all of season one of this yeah I didn't I didn't love it maybe as much as most people did and I don't know whether that's because I don't get on with the retro futurist aspect of it uh it's hard to say but I'm going to give it another chance but crucially I was not able to do so this morning because while Kay got screeners for Fallout season two my screeners never materialized wait why are you expressing surprise that I got them why did you I'm just saying that I was clamouring to watch more of this to see if I could kind of really get into it.

1:21Oh, I see. I'm going to go out on a limb and say you maybe weren't. Yeah, no, you're absolutely correct. All Kay wants for Christmas is Fallout Season 2. No. So instead, much as I would like to put Kay on the spot and say, Kay, take it away. Tell us all about what you thought of Fallout. I'm not going to do that because it is Christmas. It's a time of miracles. So instead, we turn to our festive Boyd. What did you think of Season 1 of this, El Boydo? I didn't with you I didn't I didn't get on with it particularly yeah it's weird isn't it because it was it was massively popular and yet I I found that a bit mystifying wait question when I was watching this we reviewed the first episode I believe wasn't this the one where the guy after the scene of intimacy it's the curtain yeah it's the curtain one I know exactly where you're going with this yes it is 100 % the one with the curtain I was watching it I was like I'm sure this is the show I think it was the curtain scene that did it for you know turned into such a phenomenon he cares about the cleanliness of his haberdashery yeah yes yeah um yeah no i didn't particularly get on with it i didn't find it um particularly compelling i certainly didn't come anywhere near to finishing it um so yeah but you know i always have an open mind so it was interesting to watch the first of the new season it begins with a new character played by Justin Theroux, who I love, you know, the man, the legend.

2:48Justin Theroux's Instagram profile, if you've never seen it, he's got his dog, Kuma, who is an absolutely adorable, I think it's a pit bull, whatever it is. It's so cute. And basically his Instagram is just him frolicking with his brilliant dog. And I love him for that. And this is going to sound really, I'm not being rude, but I'd rather watch that Instagram account with his lovely dog down. That doesn't sound rude at all, boys. No, but it did strike me. So there's a scene, it opens with him, this new character, right? And he engages in violent conduct, including, by the way, an exploding head.

3:30And yes, there's more than one exploding head in this episode. And yes, here's another show in the kind of fantasy horror sci-fi genre, post-apocalyptic, that's going to have exploding heads all over the place. Like the boys and the spinoff from the boys, etc. That I thought, what is the thing with exploding heads all of a sudden? It's weird. It's the new flashback. It's the new flashback, yeah. This type of show. And this show revels in being ultra-violent. There's one bit where someone's body's been cut in half, and the corpse is obviously on the ground. It's dead, by the way. His body has been cut, and someone walks through the body.

4:17Do you notice that bit, Kay? When he walks in between the two halves of this body, and it shows how daring and gory and violent we're going to be. and then it settles down and the Justin Theroux's character is totally forgotten about, by the way, unless I blinked and missed it for the rest of the episode. So he's introduced at the beginning and then he's dropped for the rest of the episode which I thought was a weird creative choice. And then we focus on Ella Purnell's character kind of ganging up with Walton Goggins' character and together they are continuing their mission to do whatever they're doing.

4:50She's searching for her dad played by Carl McLaughlin who she thought was like a hero in season one, right? I think. Who's the no nose guy? That's Orton Goggins. That's the goal. Okay, fine. And there's also flashbacks to his past and what his role was. Yes, when he's got a nose. When he's got a nose. The fully nosed version of the character. And there's also stuff about how things led to the Great War of 2077, I think it is, when there's been a nuclear holocaust. And there's this whole idea that the nuclear holocaust was a good thing for certain corporate America institutions and people because they made money out of creating these massive vaults where people stay to survive the bleak post-nuclear holocaust.

5:37And that's explored in flashbacks a lot. And it's kind of flashy. There's lots of needle drops of incongruous 50s tunes and stuff like that. There's lots of ultraviolence, as I've said. but it's empty, I think that's my problem with it I can feel the machinations of the people, the creators of this show you know kind of not desperately but trying to keep us on board with shootouts and just kind of flashy moments that make I've got this I can sense everyone kind of trying their best to keep the thing going and keep the narrative going but it just isn't that i i it feels contrived to me and um i'm constantly feeling the creatives trying their best rather than getting involved in the characters in the story so that's the problem with it for me it's kind of entertaining on a surface level um but it's not it's just not compelling it's quite slow in a weird way i don't know what k thought but it's funny you say that that's how i felt about season one like i felt like it it didn't go very quickly and i i just i just at no point was i hooked and i watched the whole thing through waiting because everyone talked about how good it was i was waiting for the other shoe to drop and you know maybe it's the the just the illogic of it all because obviously it is retro futuristic there's all this sort of 50s music in it and yet the apocalypse from this show happened in 2077 not in 1957 so it's like the retro futurist aesthetic actually makes no sense within this internal chronology it was just me i think it was just me i was thinking that the retro a few interesting things which they really persevere with in all the design about everything's designed in that way like why what it's just well it's it's the whole livery of the of the game series which are famous for kind of the pit boy character and the brotherhood of steel there's there are certain sort of like uh sort of emblematic images that you just associate with that game and they've tried to have as much of that in in the show as possible and they do a really good job of capturing the aesthetic and the world of the games and also this this very kind of dog-eat-dog nihilistic post-apocalyptic mindset which i think everyone you run into is either trying to kill you or eat you all captured that right yeah it's it's quite bleak and so that is all very much in keeping with the game so you would you know if you're really into the games and there's certainly a lot here to lie i think my issue is i just the story never never sunk its teeth into me i was never swept along but i never really cared um which is why i'm hoping that this second season is going to change my view on that you're making me think it won't okay obviously this isn't really your bag but what did you make of it i watched it and i have the proof i watched it excellent well there we go no i think i was quite tired when i watched it as well i think my problem is i mean first i think it's like it looks visually you know expensive to me as a you know like sci-fi is not my bag but like it looks expensive and i think ella pennell is great and i didn't well i didn't find it too slow but then i don't think i had really a clue what the hell was going on because i hadn't really watched the first series so i was just letting the images bathe my eyes there's a there's like a 10 minute um recap yeah no it is useful no no i appreciated that um but even still for me i just need to do it you know i think i with this kind of genre i need to watch the whole series and get fully into it to be committed to wow the whole series yeah i'm not going to but i'm saying no i'm saying in order to really fully invest and understand what the hell's going on like the recap was good though yeah i'm not sure that it even would help that much i think also there's a there's a very specific thread of dark humor that they try and weave into this which is in the games as well to be fair and i'm not 100 sure it lands again while not being the adjudicator of all things comedic uh i i didn't find it very funny oh no it's not funny at all but it definitely tries to be like the humor is a strong part of this but it doesn't land with me so i'm definitely going to watch this episode and i will press on with season two for a period of time and see how it goes i will report back when i have finally seen it well i didn't think it was that slow so me you know maybe it's maybe it zips along i don't know no no it doesn't zip along but yeah i think my expectations were low as well so that's fair that is fair so do you like hey like obviously you don't like sci-fi generally but do you like does retro futurism ever um you know does that ever move the dial for you does that help at all she's constantly i mean in my ear going when will we get another retro futurist thing on tv you know what was the other one we reviewed it there was an apple one yeah what was that it was the one where billy cruder was trying to sell condominiums on the moon and i was like absolutely that was painful that came and went in like the batting of an island didn't yes that was that was wasn't it called hello tomorrow or something oh yeah that's right i did not enjoy that at all i like genuinely retrofuturism as a rule is something i don't get on with particularly well um but but just on the sci-fi i think i was curious do you like is there any division between sci-fi and fantasy for you like do you find one more palatable than the other because i've got a friend who happy with sci-fi because in theory it's based in reality because it's scientific therefore it could happen whereas fantasy magic things like that absolutely not i think if i had to plump for one it would be sci-fi okay okay noted so yeah came of thrones unlikely to go ahead then is what you're saying no well actually no can i be really honest and i'm gonna sound really dumb saying this you should always be really honest you're among friends this is a safe space oh my god you're using my own that's amazing james also you listen occasionally that is my christmas present if you had said to me like what what are the difference between those two genres i couldn't really tell you so when you just so um yeah so i i i wouldn't i didn't know the answer to it but when you explained it i was like okay sci-fi but then i think i would like game of thrones if i gave it um more of a chance and i am going to so well it's all i think it always comes down to character with speculative fiction doesn't it i think one of the reasons game of thrones is quite broad is because the characters are really good and there's lots of character interplay irrelevant to the other stuff character based dramas and and you know more grounded in reality the better but yeah i think i can make an exception for game of thrones because in some speculative shows the the concept the high concept whether that's sci-fi or fantasy takes center stay.

12:00So Wheel of Time, I would say, is much more plot and concept-driven than it is character-driven. That's not to say I don't like the characters, and I actually do, and I think the characters in the book are great, but I would say it's very much about the events and the spectacle and the world. Whereas Game of Thrones I think is all character. Like, the world is vibrant and stuff, but it's led by the human drama, like that's the crux of it. So I wonder whether that's more... Give me the characters. We've had this discussion since argument before, but it's moot for me, because the reason Game of Thrones is superior to The Wheel of Time.

12:31It's because it's just better written, acted, and the story. I don't disagree on that point, to be fair. I do think Game of Thrones is better than The Wheel of Time. Yeah, my point is we give Cade... Cade may well like Game of Thrones because it's just really, really good. It's really, really good. Funnily enough, I found myself watching an episode the other night completely randomly. I was just flicking around, you know. The channels. Game of Thrones is constantly on Sky Atlantic, by the way. If you've got Sky Atlantic, if you click on it at any time between the hours of 6 a.m. and 3 a.m. You're bound to find a Game of Thrones episode.

13:03And sure enough, one popped up from season one. Ooh, which one? Yeah. It was one where Sean Bean's negotiating with someone else. I don't know. It was a Sean Bean-focused episode. Okay. And anyway, it was just instantly compelling. It was – and I honestly – that is down to the quality of the writing in it and the character development, et cetera. And the world is brilliantly realized as well. but if Fallout you know had that level of dialogue and character interest then I'd love Fallout no matter what genre is so the genre is a side issue for me it's just about the quality of the show yeah I mean I think Kay and I come from a slightly different way so you're kind of genre agnostic you're all about the characters Kay finds speculative stuff just puts her off it generally because you don't have an access point whereas for me I will give even even the most basic shit a second chance if it is speculative because that's my catnip that's why listen that's why we're so good we have different takes on it right we we appeal to all the listeners whoever you stand on it you'll find someone among the group who will be able to yeah relate to sci-fi in the way you do there we go we are we are a broad church yeah we'd rather watch fallout then which is on prime video as of i want to say yesterday as we go out i believe it started on tuesday yes they brought it forward by 24 hours i think for some reason but anyway yeah it's available now available now on prime video well not in its entirety i think it's dropping week by week but anyway yeah okay shall we have a look what's in the post bag ladies and gentlemen it's miss k versus the post bag

14:54Yes, and I'm going to deal with two that are hot off the press. And one is a little bit mortifying for me because I've made a little bit of a cock up, I'd say. And I'm going to start with that. Exciting. Yeah, I thought you'd rub your hands together with Cleve. Delightful. The message is from Matthew and he says, Dear Kay, your swipe at Jackie Woodburn's ability to take on accents other than her own during your deeply fair review of Impostor, I assume it's fair, I'm not going to watch it, as you said, don't, is demonstrated to be well wide of the mark as she has fooled you into thinking she was Australian.

15:25She was in fact born in Northern Ireland and speaks for that accent outside of neighbours. Wow. Yes, Sue. I feel mortified, embarrassed. Yeah, there's no getting around it. I messed up. I just, oh God. But then I think I've done this before as well with, do you remember with Piers Brosnan? Was it Mobland? And I was like, you know, his accent. I had an issue with that as well. And he's obviously Irish. Well, he doesn't sound like that, but yes, he is Irish. He puts on that incredibly extreme. Is it a cork accent he puts on? It's nowhere near his actual accent. Yeah, that was different because he is of Irish descent, but his normal accent was different.

16:05He definitely added a new Irish twang to his normal regular accent, which was weird. Yeah. I've never heard Jackie in real life. That's my excuse, but still. It could be the same. It could be the same. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. I'm hoping it, yeah. I think it's very common, I think, when someone does an incredibly good accent, which they then become known for. So when Millie Bobby Brown did Enola Holmes, I was on stage for Live Home Podcast and I literally said, God, her accent, her English accent is fantastic. And then it was a beat while everyone just looked at me and they went, you know who she's English, right?

16:38And I was like, Oh God, you're English. Oh, God. And I think I died on stage. But, of course, I should have just, you know, been like, I had no idea because I'd never heard her speak with her actual voice. And she does an incredibly compelling American accent. Well, I had that experience live with her when I went on set of, I think it was season, whatever it was, of Game of Thrones, of Stranger Things. Yeah. And I was watching her doing this big scene in her American accent. And then she comes off set to be interviewed. And she's like, oh, right, mate, yeah, from London. And you thought she was taking a piss.

17:10Yeah, I thought, oh my God, you forgot. I forgot completely. I think I knew that she was British at that point, but it's weird how she suddenly snapped into a very, very English accent and was relieved to have an English person to talk to. But yeah. Do you know what? I love you guys. You're making me feel better. So anyway, apologies to Jackie. Thank you, Matthew, for pointing that out. I genuinely mean that. That's it. Yeah, it's good to be corrected. And he continues and says, speaking of neighbours, the second last ever episode of the last few years was as disappointing as a supermarket jam sponge.

17:42The finale a couple of years ago treated us to all the old stars returning including Scott and Charlene and the Ghost of Match. This final final episode was like when you say goodbye to friends in a restaurant with hugs and promises and meeting up again soon and then accidentally bump into them 10 minutes later in a multi-story car park and awkwardly say bye in a high-pitched voice as you dive into your Datsun. Thanks for everything, Matt. did either of you watch it no i think they fucked up because the previous finale last ever episode was quite a lavish affair as that correspondent said and they you know they had all like famous actors who used to be and it came back and it was all charlene hello charlene yeah yeah exactly and then then to act again but to have another last ever episode so i mean sorry but you've had your chance yeah that's it it's done um okay the second message that is new to the inbox is from liz who says dear k boyd and james i've been a fan since the start of basic bingeness so already liz is my favorite person alive um and have been relying on your ramblings to plan my viewing since then one recommendation i particularly want to express thanks for was overcompensating the prime video drama about a gay student which would maybe never have been on my radar if Boyd hadn't talked about it and it was one of my faves so thank you so much.

19:04I've just seen the new trailer for the TV event Corrie Dale happening on the 5th of Jan. I know you don't do soaps but this is a real one-off. Kay is right that James and Boyd are too snobbish about soap. Only this evening a special episode of Corrie aired which was entirely shot from the view of security cameras and showcased a relationship experiencing domestic abuse, Todd and Theo. It was groundbreaking and I would suggest up there in quality with the best premium drama in terms of writing, acting and directing. Russell T. Davis, friend of the pod, talked a bit about soaps when he was on the live show and he's right.

19:37They are often overlooked and can be brilliant. I'd love you to at least mention this historic television event of the 5th of January when the Corridale Cinematic Universe will be born, please. Thank you for my absolute favourite podcast of all time. listening to you lot wang on brings me a lot of pleasure Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to you all Liz yeah that Chromation Street episode is supposed to be amazing I haven't seen it I am going to watch it because Russell T. Davis was posted about it yesterday after it went out and it sounds amazing yeah using kind of like found footage and stuff to tell this this kind of important story yeah so I fully agree fully in agreeance yes and congrats on your suggestion Boyd for that was it over-commercating?

20:20yeah yeah Yeah, really good show. It's been recommissioned so I love you more. Yeah. Okay, now for the postbag proper and a query from Guy who says, Hello Kay, I recall that Boydie was recently up for a prize, but as there was no further mention of it, did he get beaten at the BDSM Awards? And then he said, for the year-round joy you'll bring, may you have the merriest of festive seasons. I would have thought the whole point of a BDSM Award would be to be beaten, but that's not a hit or a hit. Boydie, who did you lose to? Tell us. It was the B-S-M-E-O-Ws, just to be clear. This is nowhere near as much fun.

21:00No, no. Less latex. Yeah, well, I don't know. It's quite a few. I lost, indeed, to the New Statesman, which was the one I kept, when everyone kept saying to me, as people were very nice, and everyone kept saying, people in the office and, you know, going, oh, you're going to win. Wait, we were saying it. Yeah, you were saying, oh, you're definitely going to win. I was like, no, no, no. New Statesman is going to win because I just thought a finely honed few thousand words on the politics of the day stands more of a chance of winning than my driveling on about some stupid TV show. So I did not win and the New Statesman guy did win, I'm sure very deservedly.

21:37But it was incredible to be nominated. I know people say that, but genuinely, because it's the first time in my life I've been nominated for an award. So it was brilliant, yeah. Long overdue. We should say Nick Samlian, editor of Empire, won in his category. As did Chris Lupton, the creative director on Empire. The only awards that we won in the whole evening were the two for Empire. Yeah. I mean, look, what can I say? Yeah. And it richly deserved, of course. Yeah, brilliant. Of course, yeah. Empire cleaned up. Now, listen, I just want to say on that note. You definitely don't want to clean up at the BDSM Awards.

22:08I'm just saying. Good one. I remember being at the Big Boy screening and Boyd and I were in the audience and a moment that always stands out in my mind was Camille, now how do you say her surname? Kuduri. Yeah, came up to us. I say came up to us, specifically made a beeline for Boyd and was like said in that brilliant voice of hers, like how she has always read his column, how she always makes her choices according to what he said and then she's been reading his column for years. So what higher praise, in fact. You don't need the BDSM award. You've got that praise from her. Thank you. That was brilliant.

22:46And my counter to that is when I said Dawn French last week, which we'll hear on the podcast soon, she was brilliant. She was like, remember me? I could interview you years ago for heat and stuff. She's going, oh, you know, how's it going? Well, it's good to see you. She looked at me and she goes, Boyd, do you remember the days of heat?

23:08And I went, I said, Dawn, not only do I remember those days of heat, I'm still living those days of heat because it's still going. available at the newsagent. She was like, oh, that's brilliant. Oh, good. I'm so glad it's still going because it was really fun. Blah, blah, blah. So yeah. You remember the days of heat. Anyway, moving on to Bunions. Now. Okay. Keith says, Hi Kay. With reference to your recent mention of the Irish village of Bally Bunion, I stayed there on holiday for a week in 2007. It's a pleasant small coastal village in County Kerry with a golf course so well known that Bill Clinton played there.

23:44a statue was erected in his honour outside the police station as a result Bally Bunyan is also famously the railway station manned by Will Hay and his bumbling assistants in the classic 1937 film Oh Mr. Porter do you remember that Boydo? yeah

24:03I do remember genuinely watching that film growing up and watching Will Hay movies second known to Laurel and Hardy in my mind as anyway as some comedy classics of that era carry on sorry james well done um the last time i wrote in boyd made fun of my name but i've i'm a forgiving sort keep up the great work you'll be my favorite podcast since the start best keith right a message from billy the kid who says hi team just a passing missive um jonathan from this week's plus episode mentioned a dearth of podcasts dealing with genre books might i suggest realms unknown a comedic look at sci-fi and fantasy books including common hoary old tropes, but with suggestions and reviews too.

24:45Hosted by Alice Fraser from The Bugle, an ex-lawyer like the sainted Helen O 'Hara. What? Wait, what? Wait, what? Helen's famous to train as a lawyer. She was a barrister. What? When I hired Helen, which was, God, over 20 years ago, she was a barrister, I believe in Chambers, and she jacked in the life of wealth and the law to work for me on Empire. Oh my God. Yeah, mad, wasn't it? I never knew that. Crazy decision on her part, but there you go. Is there nothing that Helen, the beloved Helen, cannot do? Apparently not. No one's a void subset. Yeah. Anyway, Billy continues and says, Also, might I request, oh, a pass on the use of himself, yourself, etc.

25:31for those of us of a folky highlands of Scotland persuasion, and I believe the Irish. Whilst the use, as described on the traitors, does and mad, up here the term is more reserved for elderly slash middle-aged countrified rubes like myself saying, ah, it's herself slash yourself, come away in. Or, oh Christ, it's himself, let's move paths, etc. Why aren't you doing the accent, Kay? Absolutely not. Because I like Billy and I don't want to insult him. Anyway, Billy's from up north, brackets properly. I absolutely agree with that, Billy. No, I'm never referring to it when it's like... Yeah, it is a good point.

26:07The Irish or Celtic kind of accent and languages and whatever vernacular. Yeah, yourself, herself. It's fine. It's different on the traitors, yeah. Traitors, footballers, people in our everyday lives. Okay. Now a message about side characters, and it's from Gavin, who says, DK, I just watched the four and a half hour bum-numbing documentary, Aliens Expanded. Oh, here we go. Here we go. We know what's coming. Is it bum-numbing or is it riveting, full of insightful commentary? I was surprised to see how much pilot's own James Dyer appears wanging on and on about his favourite film. So much so that his screen time seems to outdo that of both Sigourney Weaver and James Cameron.

26:53I mean, you're not wrong. Inspired by James' overlong cameo, can the panel think of TV shows where side characters have ended up dominating the plot? Can I take issue with the term cameo? I think I'm like eighth build in that documentary. Yeah, clearly you're not cameo. After the aforementioned James Cameron and Sigourney Weaver. James, you would be the reason why I would watch that, frankly. Thank you. It is literally four and a half hours. Really? Yeah, he's not exaggerating. We found something that's longer than the pod. Yeah, it's a monster, but it's great stuff. It's ridiculous, yeah. A four and a half hour documentary about the second best alien film.

27:30Yes, yes, yes. Boyd, have you watched it, this documentary? Boyd, no. I am shocked and appalled that you have not supported me by watching my documentary. Fair enough. We spend about three hours a week watching you in person. I think that should be... That's accurate. Yeah. Okay. So anyway, has anyone got an answer to Gavin's question? What was the question? I've forgotten it. Can you think of TV shows where side characters have ended up dominating the plot? Not dominating the plot necessarily. Often, sometimes dominating the conversation, I guess. Like you get like breakouts. psycho it's like it's like michael k williams omar little from the wire became like a cult favorite um as did a lot of the supporting characters but then it is an ensemble show so i guess it's you know it's not quite the same thing um but one that dominates the plot boydy can you think of anything i'm opting out just you know this is one demands research isn't it yes it is it is one that demands research i can't think of one off the top of my head where where one will will dominate the plot has to be said i mean in the in the american office it starts out you know like the British office where the focus is on, you know, the main two or three characters.

28:34And then in the American office, partly because of the nature of an ongoing network sitcom at the time, characters that were very much supporting characters came, did become, have their own crucial storylines. Yeah, but that's not a good example. That's slightly lame. Basically what I'm saying is it's a 23 episodes a season sitcom that had to have supporting characters getting their own storylines. Listen, we've said some words. I think that's fine. We've given an answer. That's really all we promise, I think, for people's monthly subscription, that we will just say some words. Will they make sense?

29:08Will they string together in a grammatically coherent fashion? Nah. Listen, I've ensured that answer was less than four and a half hours like James' documentary. That is true. You're welcome, Gavin. I mean, it is called Aliens Expanded. I'm just saying. It's in the title. Right. Now, I'm calling this message. Oh, in fact, no, the message actually came in with the subject heading, James is a peddler of vampire smut. Right. Hello. On James's recommendation, I started reading Empire of the Vampire. With a title that bad, I figured it had to be good for him to recommend multiple times. He did not mention all the smut, though.

29:48There's an awful lot of straining leather and pansexual panspecies spice. That's right. They've even got funny little illustrations of sexy vampires like a gothic Mills and Pooncar. It's pure mum smut. Next thing, he'll be recommending Bear Shifter fan fiction. I've bought them for my sister for Christmas. She's a mum. She'll love it. Thanks for all the pods. Paddy. I suppose there is. Jay Kristoff, who's Australian. You'd like him, Kay. Who writes these books. I think he's won the Literary Bad Sex Award or at least been nominated for it in the past. or at least been in the conversation. Maybe he hasn't won it.

30:24I don't know. But he in Nevernight, I want to say, there's a particularly excruciating bad sex sequence. And yes, there are, I mean, there is vampire smut in here, but that's not, I should say, it's not a romantic. Like it's not smut based. There happens to be some smut in it, but that's not the crux of the book. I mean, a lot of characters do get exposed. It has to be said. But yeah, it's not quite as smutty as advertised. I believe Paddy he's not the fourth wing okay now for what I'm calling our listeners have cool jobs section and the message reads hi pod team firstly I wanted to say this is my favourite podcast and I've been a law listener since day one and a proud plus subscriber I love listening every week as it's like being in a room with friends who are the friends oh no we are we're discussing my favourite topic I'm very much looking forward to the much talked about end of year review to see who emerges triumphant and see if James gets his way.

31:26It's going to be fine, guys. It's going to be, there won't be, and to use the title of a program we've just reviewed, there won't be any fallout, will there? We're going to commit to not falling out. We'll see. We'll see. We haven't assembled the list as we record this particular episode yet, but it is imminent. Anyway, Daryl continues and says, now on the subject of lint versus Cadbury chocolate from a few pods ago. Oh my God. Listen to this. He's about to be wrong. I can tell. I have a direct interest in this. I'll start by saying that I do agree with James on many things. I know, this is not something to be shouting about.

31:59But on the subject of Cadbury's being the best chocolate, I wholeheartedly disagree. I worked at Lint for almost nine years and have now been working for Cadbury for four years. He's in the pocket of big Lint. I like chocolate, what can I say? And while I agree that Cadbury's is the best of the mainstream chocolate out there, Lint is far and above the best chocolate. I've done many taste tests over the years. It wasn't my job, but there was a lot of chocolate around the office at all times. And the taste, texture and quality beats Cadbury's every time. Love the pod and keep up the fantastic work.

32:33Oh, and a very Merry Christmas, Daryl. That is brilliant. What a job. Daryl worked at both. That's the dream, isn't it? Yeah. Literally proven my point that Lint is better than Cadbury. It's not even subjective anymore. What do you say, James? We're going to have an expert in the field. I mean, I will never be shaken from my dairy milk throne because it is genuinely one of my favourite things, dairy milk chocolate. Like, of any sweet, of anything. Yes, it can be your favourite, but crucially, as Daryl says, it's not the best in the world. What's the best for me? Okay. In the dire world. But Lind is fine.

33:08I don't know that I would necessarily call it top-tier chocolate, I've got to be honest with you. But then I have weird tastes, so I'm maybe not one to go by. I quite like Tony's chocolate only as well. I've developed quite a penchant for that. I like that. A bit expensive. It is. It's very expensive. But it's nice. I like it. I also, while we're just going through it, I quite like the shells. The shells? I really like the shells, in fact. What are they called? What, those little marbled ones? Yeah. I don't know who makes those. Yeah, see, they're a bit sort of truffly for me. They've got like a praline centre.