1051: Blessed are the Peacemakers (Trump and Putin)

22:23Oh, that's good. I wonder what the fake guys are saying. Yeah, he's getting ideas. Trump also posted on Truth Social that he'll, quote, lead a movement to get rid of mail-in ballots and voting machines, which will begin with an executive order, which he then said was an executive order being drawn up right now by the best lawyers in the country. He also said that states are, quote, merely an agent for the federal government in counting and tabulating the votes and, quote, must do what the federal government, as represented by the president of the United States, tells them. That is, of course, not what the Constitution says, not what the Supreme Court has said.

22:59Not at all true with regard to fraud or America being the only country with mail-in voting. Plenty of countries have mail-in voting. Dozens. But between that threat and Trump's joke about postponing elections during war, what's your level of concern on this one? Is this just Trump being stupid or is this one that we should keep an eye on? So on this specific, specific threat, the Constitution is explicit. It's not just clear it is explicit. It says that legislatures are in charge of running federal elections. And actually what Trump is saying here is in conflict with another crackpot right wing legal theory, which is the independent legislature theory, which it says not only are legislatures responsible for the administration of federal elections, they can't be questioned by or their laws can't be adjudicated by the courts, maybe even the Supreme Court.

23:47Congress can. Congress is the only. Congress can. But that that that that courts ruling what those laws mean can't supersede with the legislature said that was their way of trying to get around some votes in 2020. And they'll probably try it again. But certainly the executive has no role. No, it's not. It's right. Congress can set certain rules to govern, to regulate elections, but the president is not mentioned anywhere and legislatures run their elections. But whatever the specifics of the of the order he was told about and is then describing, he's very bad at telephone. It is like it's our level of concern should be very high to answer your question, because whatever he does here, he is going to try wherever he can, like a rap protesting the fences to figure out the weaknesses that he can exploit before the midterms in 2026 and the general in 2028.

24:39and because everything with Trump is either, these worries feel too early and then our responses feel too late. That is up to and including him finding some pretense to not leave office in 2028. He's doing a lot of redecorating for a guy who's only supposed to be there for a short-term lease. And so all of this to me is sort of, these are red sirens, the scariest color for sirens going off. They're not blue. They're not white. And so like this, he's going to, you know, this plus, you know, the tabulating of votes he's always attacking. It has to be done super quickly. He wants paper ballots. Fine.

25:19But but he's but it's an agent of the federal government. So now we have federal agents coming in, what, to monitor elections. Like you can see this playing out in a dozen of very bad ways, whatever he can't get away with on mail-in ballots.

25:32Jon Favreau:I mean, Putin doesn't like mail-in ballots because it's just so much easier to physically stuff a ballot box. Or just bus people to multiple voting locations and have them vote a bunch of times. Or just, like, kill your opponents. You know what I mean? It's just an inefficient way to steal an election. Yeah. Killing your opponents is much easier. You just got to kill them off. Yeah. Or just change the numbers after. Right. I mean, there's a lot of ways. When you're Putin, there's a lot of ways to win an election. You just get 100 % in the regions where you want to get 100 % and then you're fine.

26:02Jon Favreau:Yeah, I have the same reaction you did. I'm like, Trump rails against mail-in ballots until it's time for him to vote himself. Then he does it. His campaign is opposed to mail-in ballots until they see a political advantage. And then they whip votes that way or try to get people to vote that way. But I'm more broadly worried, like you are, about Trump trying every way possible to take control over the voting process. Or just find ways to make it harder for Democrats to vote, especially in cities. That's the end game, I think. Yes. I think there's intimidation that we should worry about around election time.

26:34I think that post-election is still probably the more dangerous period because of Democrats. What makes you think that? Yeah, right. I don't know. A couple of years ago. And look, I think he can try to convince Republican governors and Republican legislatures to get rid of mail-in voting in red states. But like that, OK. First of all, I don't think they're going to do that because the Republican Party has realized that was the stupidest thing he tried to do in 2020. And that's why in 2024, they all decided to push mail-in voting. So I don't know if Republicans will want to do that. But even if they did, you know, you need the electoral votes of the blue states.

27:08And then, you know, he could try to get Republicans in Congress to introduce something. But that would run up against, you know, it would need 60 votes. So then maybe, yeah, you'd have to have a scenario where they get rid of the filibuster to pass some, you know, elimination of mail-in voting and the tabulation machines, which he's mad about. He wants watermarked paper ballots now, which is fucking ridiculous. Sure, they're not going to give any states money for that kind of transition either. So, yeah, I mean, it's not likely, but there are plenty of other things that can go wrong. Well, like stepping back, one of our great protections from when Russia tried to figure out if it could get into sort of the voter rolls.

27:49One of our great protections from Trump in 2020 when he was trying to overturn the election is the fact that our electoral system is incredibly complex. And it is disaggregated. It is run, forget the state level, it's run at the county level. It's run locally. And that makes stealing an election federally very, very difficult. That is very, very good. That is a really good thing. And this is like fascism. You look back on the terms they had for it. I can't remember it off the top of my head. There's a German word for it about a government that can flip like a switch. That was a term for it. And it was an exciting technological advance, And it's like electricity that you could just have a government where at the very top a person can flip the switch and change everything beneath it.

28:31That is very appealing to Trump. Forget the comparison. That idea of a government that runs that way is very appealing to him. It's very dangerous for a democracy. And any way he can undermine that independence, that disaggregation is dangerous. And that is what he will try to do. And he will probably for the most part fail, but only probably and only mostly. And that's what makes it so dangerous. Yeah, he continues to try to go for the maximalist positions and then he sees what he can get. Sometimes he gets it. but sometimes he doesn't.

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31:12Let's turn to what our government is doing to help support fascism here at home. The military occupation of our nation's capital could double in size thanks to Republican governors in West Virginia, Ohio, South Carolina, and late breaking, now Louisiana, deciding to deploy another 750 troops to join the 800 National Guard members currently patrolling the streets of D.C. And they may start carrying weapons because it's always good to have more guns on the streets. The Wall Street Journal reports that people living in the D.C. neighborhoods with the most crime are wondering why they're not seeing Trump's deployment fighting any crime on their streets, the streets that have the crime.

31:49The journal says, quote, the most visible show of force has centered on the city's upscale corridors and tourist hubs and focused on arresting immigrants, the homeless, quote, seatbelt violations and putting drunk revelers in Ubers. Unnamed FBI agents. That seems OK. Yeah. Yeah, it's just nice. Don't know if we need the National Guard for that. That's right. Unnamed FBI agents told the journal they are, quote, worried they're neglecting larger national security threats or their own cases. Yeah. Though, per usual, the stars of the show seem to be armed, masked, unidentified ICE agents who were filmed over the weekend tackling and tasing a delivery driver, complaining about liberals ruining the country and ripping down anti-ICE signs, a video which ICE proudly tweeted out.

32:35Here's some sound from those incidents.

33:06Come on. We're taking America back, baby. Now, an NPR reporter did say that the residents of Mount Pleasant, where the sign was taken down, all saw that the sign was replaced afterwards with a dildo. I don't know if you guys saw that.

33:21Jon Favreau:There's been a lot of dildo action happening around the country. A lot of dildos being thrown on the courts at WNBA games. It's not like an old head thing, but there was a dildo thrown onto the end zone at a Bills game, I believe, a few years back. Dildos are flying. Tommy, I just want you to know that I think there's been a lot of dildo action in this country for some time. If you're just coming around to dildos, you should know that they've been in the mix for a lot of people. There was a third dildo incident recently that wasn't. Oh, another person who believes. Damn it. Who believes in the third dildo theory.

33:53Wasn't the WNBA games. It was something else. Anyway. A lot of dildos and dildos. Are you guys impressed with all the crime fighting that's been happening in D.C.?

34:01Jon Favreau:Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I think a lot of D.C. residents would say that there is a crime problem in D.C., but the issue is not the Lincoln Memorial getting carjacked. And I think you made the point that they're kind of giving up the game by sending troops to monuments. You've got Pete Hegseff tweeting about how Union Station has got some big deployment. It's like, are we protecting the Sparrow? What's happening? Yeah, they're running down the people taking the breadbasket from Le Diplomat. I mean, I will say that the men's room at Union Station is a crime. If somebody could do something about that fucking place, that place has been disgusting since we were there.

34:33It remains so.

34:34Jon Favreau:But obviously, I view this through the lens of you do too, the L.A. people who we had our own fake troop deployment to solve a non-existent problem with non-existent protesters. But like when I kind of squinted this, I see it one of two ways. The first is Trump is just doing whatever he can to highlight law and order as an issue and pick a fight with Democrats. and the unique way that DC is governed allows him this ability to send in federal agents and just, you know, create a narrative. And like, to be clear, he wants these fights. Like the sandwich guy throwing the sandwich at the ice agent, which is a very, very funny.

35:10Jon Favreau:It's a funny video. Expensive sandwich. That guy lost his job. Yeah, I feel bad for that guy. I don't think it, it wasn't. Look, the funniest part of that is he outruns all those agents running like a 5-8-4. At a Barry's beginner speed. I mean, just, it's not fast. That's a 5-0 jog. Did you see DHS brought cameras and filmed going into his apartment? I think there are 20 agents. And arresting him? 20 agents? Yes. This is like, well, let's all their dream. A deep state DOJ person. Sandwich. Who threw a sandwich and was running away. Like, that's owning the libs. That's what they're here for. For a sandwich at Stonewall.

35:45Jon Favreau:But so that's like the good version of this, I think. the bad version is like precedent for you know a takeover of dc if the time was right like january 6 2.0 or to deploy troops across the country uh in some sort of quasi martial law and that's where all these governors kind of just being so thirsty to get in the game and send troops to washington is really pretty weird and so i i don't know like the pretext here was i think i mean i was off last week but it was big balls this is all big god be not like to be clear i don't want to see anyone manhandling Mr. Balls in DuPont Circle. That is not cool and not something I'm for, but I feel confident the D.C.

36:22Jon Favreau:Police Department could have handled that on their own. This is big balls and dildos. This is what we're happening in D.C. What do you guys make of the response from a lot of elected Democrats over the weekend that Trump's deployment is a stunt and a distraction? So those are two different things. It is absolutely a stunt. We know it's a stunt. He saw it on Fox News. He thought, I'm going to do something about this. They cobbled together this plan. They bring Pam Bondi out. I always say Pam Bandy. Pam Bondi out to the telepromp, to the press conference to be like, crime is ending and it's ending now.

36:57Like, of course, it's a stunt. But that's how Trump governs. He governs with stunts, announcing tariffs on the whole world is a stunt. He's very good at getting a lot of attention on the stories that he wants attention on. But that doesn't make it a distraction, right? It doesn't mean that's something that you should ignore. Like, it's a big deal that he's doing it. You have to meet him where the attention is. He's gotten the attention. You have to respond to it. You have to have an argument about it. So that's first. Then you have to hold him accountable for the consequences of the stunt, whether it's the failure to deliver, because no, this will not solve crime in this country.

37:31National Guard doing traffic stops outside of Sweetgreen at the corner of 14th and R is not going to stop crime in D.C. And then there's just like the the sort of the other consequences of this. Trump today in the meeting with Zelensky made some point about how or was an answer to a question about how MTG and her boyfriend were able to go walk in the streets. So Trump made it safe again. And Trump then jumped out. Oh, I'm hearing from all kinds of friends saying that they haven't gone out to dinner in D.C. in years. And now they're going out and all the restaurants are full. I was like, that's a strange thing for Donald Trump to say.

38:04So I look, I was like, why is he saying that? Well, he's saying that because Open Table reported that the restaurant reservations plummeted after this takeover because, as we all know, criminals and homeless people use Open Table to book their reservations. But it's still hurting their businesses. And then the third part of it is we have to figure out ways to elevate the stories that are dramatic and interesting enough to compete with the stunts. Right. That means pulling the moments where ICE is manhandling people for no reason. It means telling the stories of immigrants or American citizens grabbed off the street for no reason.

38:38We have to compete with Trump and his stunts with a level of drama and human interest that gets people attention. And the good news is that I do think on social media, especially what spreads are these stories that make what Trump is doing feel real for people in the way we would hope that it does. So, like, yes, it's a stunt. No, it's not a distraction. I was wondering where all the distraction stuff came from, because it's really, really been kicked up lately on a whole bunch of issues. And then I saw some polling last week from Blue Rose Research. They did like a bunch of message testing. And they said, of the 16 Democratic messages tested about the Trump-DC takeover, just two tested above average.

39:19The first one is called Pivot to Tariffs. Trump's takeover of D.C.'s police is a stunt to distract from the pain his tariffs are causing families. Trump's tariffs are driving up prices on groceries, cars, and everyday goods, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then the next one, of course, Pivot to Medicaid. While Donald Trump is sending troops into D.C. in the name of safety, he just cut Medicaid for millions of Americans. And then it goes on about the Medicaid cuts. Okay, so I could see why when you read someone two statements that are mostly about tariffs and Medicaid cuts, they're like, oh, yeah, that's pretty fucked up.

39:51In real life, if someone was like, what's the deal with Trump's takeover of D.C.? And you said, it's a distraction from the tariffs. You sound like a fucking moron. And the person would think you sound like a fucking moron.

40:02Jon Favreau:It's kind of like the Swiss Army knife of pivots. You know what I mean? That's all anyone's saying. Trump is talking about this because he doesn't want you to talk about that. And you can just insert anything you want. And I think there were, look, there was a, the two weeks of Epstein, there was certainly a series of attempts to distract from that narrative, right? Like when you're hitting the Obama did treason button over and over again, right? That was a clear example of distraction. But I think like, I'm going to deploy the National Guard to DC to drive a message about law and order. is Trump like getting back to his core message and thing he wants to talk about.

40:38Yeah, which is an authoritarian takeover of the country. And like, it's pretty clear. The Epstein thing is very funny because if you guys remember at the beginning of the Epstein scandal, as many of us were talking about it, some elected Democrats were like, Epstein, this Epstein thing is just a distraction from the Medicaid cuts. Now they're all in on Epstein. And now the authoritarian takeover is a distraction from the Epstein file. And look, I think I can say what you think. You think about what's going on. The insurrection was a distraction from Medicare cuts as well, but still important and worth talking about.

41:15Yeah, I just the other thing about it, too, is like forget sounding stupid to people. This is a distraction. Like, who are you telling that to? Like, who is your who is hearing that from you? Is it someone watching MSNBC? Is it someone already following you on social media? it like when you say into some lens that it is a distraction, who's on the other side? Because it's not the person you're trying to reach with the most with the you're not getting the person who is the sort of the person you're hoping will receive the best poll tested message. You're reaching someone who's already very engaged on the topic, most likely.

41:49And you're trying to figure out how to how to combat what Donald Trump is doing by arming that audience and people beyond it with some sort of a story about why what he's doing is wrong. Because otherwise, what's out there is just Trump doing this and a bunch of Democrats saying, well, really, we should be talking about something else. And no one answers the actual thing of why it is wrong for Donald Trump to deploy troops in D.C. due to a kind of a manufactured crime wave. I mean, it's always over learning the lesson of the last election. And in 2024, it was like shouldn't talk about democracy.

42:21Should talk about kitchen table issues, which voters cared about more. And what these Democrats are saying by talking about distraction is the Medicaid cuts and the tariffs are more unpopular than Trump attempting to fight crime is unpopular. That's what they're trying to say, but instead use this distraction language, which just doesn't make sense.

42:38Jon Favreau:Yeah, I think it's a little different. I think it's more like Democrats not wanting to talk about immigration in the last election and pivoting to anything else. It's like, no, this is the thing people care about. It's happening in the world. Talk about it. Take it on. Make an argument. like first of all put forward your case for how you'd make things better but also make the point that like if you're worried about crime just deploying national guard guys with no law enforcement training to hang out at the lincoln memorial is not going to do anything yeah and again i like my my view on the the various federal agents and troops that are all over dc now is like national guard troops are like why the fuck are we here that's what they were like in la and you You know, that's why they, you know who they are by their uniform and they don't wear masks.

43:25And they're probably like, what are we, you know. They don't want to be there either. They don't want to be there either. The FBI agents that are running around are like, yeah, we have actual threats to go take care of. We don't know why we're here. But again, they're clearly identified as FBI. This is all about fucking letting the secret police force, ICE, just go wild and do whatever they want. Those are the people tackling people, tasing people, saying liberals ruin the country. Just like fucking, I was going to say mask off, but not. But just saying the quiet part out loud here, right? That like they just don't like liberals.

43:56They're politicized. That you can't identify them. The guy that, the people that tased the delivery driver on 14th Street, no one knew where they were coming from. It just said police on them, but like no identification whatsoever. I mean, that's what this is. And that's fucking dangerous. Yeah. And this is dangerous. And there is, I'm sure the problem, right, too, is that like for any any individual politician talking about this, right, like they would rather be talking about health care issues that they first of all, maybe have more knowledge or care about. That's why they're in politics. Right.

44:26And there is just less equity in talking about these issues where Trump has more purchase with the electorate on crime, on immigration, though he's lost a lot of ground there. And you may not fight to a win. You may not even fight to a draw on the issue. But we have to be making an argument collectively against what Trump is doing. You may not win there. You may wish we were having a debate about health care and Medicaid cuts and all the rest. I wish we were, too. But we're not. And when we cede those grounds completely, we lose we lose ground to Trump that we don't get back when we eventually do talk about the big, beautiful bill or whatever.

44:58The guy's underwater on immigration, which was his best issue. And the reason he is is because he took it to the extreme. And then a bunch of Democrats finally made the argument instead of avoiding talking about immigration. And now he's underwater on the issue.

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46:42Jon Favreau:Hey, so listen, whether you're in the States, across the pond, or somewhere on the other side of the world, we love that you tune into Crooked for US News. But did you know we also have a UK news show. Yes, that's right. It's called Pod Save the UK. Pod Save the UK is a no bullshit, unabashedly progressive conversation about politics focused on the issues that matter most to the people of Britain. With all the changes in our government, including the fun revolving door of prime ministers we have here, there's always lots to talk about. And there's lots of fabulous guests to talk to. Journalists, politicians, experts, comedians and activists.

47:16We've had great comedians on as well, like Rosie Jones, Stuart Lee Aisling B we've also had Tommy Vitor on who may be our boss we still don't know we're not quite clear on who our boss is I thought it might be Tommy Vitor I thought it might be Jon Favreau I don't know if it's Jon Lovett it's hard to say it's not clear to us who our bosses are

47:36Jon Favreau:some of our listeners call us irreverent but not stupid I object to that I'm deeply stupid it doesn't sound too bad so look come check us out come join us Pod Save the UK every Thursday wherever you get your podcasts

47:52All right, let's talk about the latest in the redistricting wars. On Monday, Texas Democrats ended their two-week walkout and returned to the state, clearing the way for Governor Abbott and Texas Republicans to pick up five Republican congressional seats at the request of President Trump. Democrats said their conditions to return were met after California Democrats, led by Governor Newsom last week, announced a redistricting plan that would offset any gains made in Texas. The California plan, which Newsom discussed with Dan in our last episode, would net Democrats five new House seats, but would only go into effect if other states redraw their maps first and only last for the 26, 28 and 30 election cycles before reverting to the nonpartisan redistricting commission.

48:32And the plan would have to be approved by California voters this November. Let's start with Texas. Tommy, I think the first time we talked about this, you called that there was no way the Democrats would be able to stay out of Texas until December. What do you make of them returning for this second session? Mission accomplished?

48:48Jon Favreau:I mean, I think their best and only card to play was to raise awareness about what was happening. And so to the extent that, I mean, they did a great job, I think. They got this on everyone's radar screen. They did a lot of media. This was just kind of like the Texas legislature. It's a part-time gig. Most of them have jobs. They have families. They had things they had to do in Texas. So just being on the lam forever was not an option. I'm very glad that Gavin Newsom has taken this on and has made this a cause. i think it's going to benefit him enormously politically and i think it's really meaningful i think his hope was probably that there could be some sort of mutually assured destruction approach where it's like he told texas don't redistrict or else we will too so it just sort of stopped everyone it seems like that's not going to be the case here because texas republicans are shameless but uh yeah it sucks it sucks what do you think yeah look i uh they're they're putting the best face on going back, having not been able to stop the gerrymander from happening.

49:44But would California be doing this had Texas not fled? I don't know. I think so. I think Newsom was talking about it before they ever left. Well, regardless, I think it sort of ignited something, ignited a conversation. Maybe it still would have had to get through the legislature, still would have had to go before voters. I do think it brought to the fore gerrymandering. Whether it would have happened regardless, us. I don't know whether Texas Democrats could have held out longer. Who knows? Seems like no, because they're going back now means they thought, well, maybe we can hang on a little while longer, but not all the way to December.

50:15So we might as well give up now. When I talked to James Tallarico and I asked, well, what is the plan to hold out? They were saying they weren't going to think past this session. And I was like, well, what's the hope? And the hope is that Texas Democrats back down from pressure from other states. Neither of those felt likely at the time. But if we end up in a situation where now Democrats are doing redistricting in California, at least to like partially stem the losses, I think that's a good outcome. How do you guys feel about the prospect of Newsom's election rigging response act getting approved by voters this November?

50:45I mean, I'm going to vote for it.

50:46Jon Favreau:We're going to have to fight. I mean, like hopefully this is, you know, it's an off year vote. Hopefully it'll be base turnout. A lot of Democrats who sort of understand what's happening here. I mean, it's really important that people understand that he is responding to a massive overreach by Trump to redistrict in the middle of the decade in something that's completely unprecedented and that he's doing so only as a response to Texas. And it's not a permanent thing. This is just a temporary fix to respond to what Texas is doing. I think that it's going to be challenging. I mean, it's tough that Schwarzeneggers out there are fighting this hard, but I think we have no other choice.

51:25Jon Favreau:I think Democrats generally have no other choice to fight against gerrymandering like this. Long-term, it really sucks. I think it really muddles any kind of semblance of a reform message from Democrats or in longer term, like more gerrymandered districts make politics more polarized and more extreme. And they help people like Donald Trump because when Trump has a bunch of Republicans in totally gerrymandered districts, he can fully control whoever represents that district because all they care about is a primary election and not a general election. But, you know, we're going to fight for this.

51:55Jon Favreau:I mean, I think, I don't know, I've seen just that one political story in the one set of polling that wasn't exactly what Gavita has put forward. Like, basically, they polled the approval in the state of getting rid of the independent commission, which is not at all what Gavin Newsom has proposed. Yeah, look, I think there's going to be a glut of ads that are going to be extremely deceptive of what this is that's going to claim, do you want to vote for partisan politics or for independence in a way that I think appeals to maybe lower engaged voters or people that are going to kind of clock in right towards the end.

52:28That's worrying. I hope that because it is a midterm and because I think people can be pretty fired up about this and explain why this is necessary, I hope it'll win the day. It does say something about our politics that Arnold Schwarzenegger, who very powerfully spoke out about why Trump is such a danger, is sort of pumping iron and getting ready to fight here, but not in Texas or not anywhere else. I mean, this is his state and it is his baby, but still just says something about also just about how redistricting has worked, right? Colorado has independent redistricting. We have independent redistricting.

52:58It's been pursued by some of the biggest names in Democratic politics. And now we've sort of caught on our asses because Republicans are willing to do this mid-decade. And it talks about some of the ways in which our politics are asymmetrical. But, yeah, I'm glad we're doing it. I hope we get it through. Yeah, I think, you know, polarization sort of rules everything around us these days. And I think you have a big Democratic voter registration in California. And I think if you ask California Democrats, would you rather Republicans have a lock on the House of Representatives in the midterms so they can continue to rubber stamp Donald Trump's agenda?

53:34Or do you care more about keeping independent redistricting and getting rid of gerrymandering? They're going to say they care more about the midterms if it's communicated well. I mean, it's still going to take some work. It's going to take a lot of money. And it's by no means a sure thing. But I just I feel like in this case, polarization is going to help us because it is a it's pretty clear that if California doesn't do it, they're going to start with a five to 10 seat head start on the midterms. Yeah. And in terms of the long term effect of what gerrymandering does, like I hear you, Tommy, on like the ways it makes kind of it draws people to the extremes in those districts.

54:09But you look at where we're at now with where the with with the vote on this big, beautiful bill. Right. There was like one or two super right wing holdouts. There are no Republican moderates left. There are a few Democratic moderates. But no matter how you draw the maps, there will still be swing districts all across the country. Already we're pretty polarized in Congress. So I'm less worried about the effects on how we govern and more just the brute partisan impact of gerrymandering and the fact that if we do this and this will be what we'll get to next. What is the Republican reaction? Because they have more they have more arrows in their quiver than we do.

54:38Yeah. Also, we spent a couple of years trying to pass a bill just a couple of years ago that would have outlawed gerrymandering all across the country. So I think Democrats can very easily say now we've gerrymandered, you've gerrymandered. We'll give up our gerrymandering if you give up your gerrymandering. And if they don't want to, then like, you know, I don't think they I don't I think the reform message is still strong.

54:58Jon Favreau:We can say that, but that just it sounds kind of childish. You know, I like I like you're right. Of course, we're all supported that bill. I just think it muddles it and it sucks. Yeah. It's like there are a lot of Democratic states that are gerrymandered to fuck already. It's not like Democrats are out there leading the charge, complaining about Maryland. You know, it's like no, but if we had passed the John Lewis voting rights bill, then none of them would have. We would support universal redistricting reform for the country, but there's a lot of hypocrisy here that I think is challenging. Yeah.

55:29I mean, look, I think every single Democrat in the country voted for that bill, voted to get rid of gerrymandering, including the senators from Maryland and from every other Democratic state.

55:37Jon Favreau:It's just a tough sell. I think it's a tough sell. New York Times published a great analysis over the weekend that quantified the Republican Party's redistricting advantage. The gist is Republicans have the potential to pick up seats in 15 different states, while Democrats only have the potential to pick up seats in three to four, if you include California, after passage of its ballot measure. So we basically knew this. But after the California news, it does seem like a good reminder that Republicans can still rig the maps to start the midterms with a big advantage of the House. Yeah. Also, just part of the reason why Republicans are against independent redistricting is because it helps Democrats more than it helps Republicans, because the maps are inherently less fair to Democrats because of where Democrats live and how we're distributed.

56:18our protection here. We talked about this a little bit, but some of this is kind of old school politics and there are natural breaks on gerrymandering. One being that if you gerrymander too hard, you can lose your seats in a wave. The other being what you do when you gerrymander is you take seats from a safe Republican district and you put it in another district to make it more safe. But those are you're taking Republicans parts of you're taking Republican neighborhoods from Republican politicians and a lot of states and they're going to be fighting behind the scenes, never in public. Be like, hey, hey, that town of rich golfing assholes.

56:45They belong to me. Those are my people. Those are my people. You're not giving them to this other freak. Those are my people. It is wild that the California Republicans and the New York Republicans and everywhere else, they're probably going to lose their seats or just sort of, you know, maybe they put out a statement. Given up? Slightly. But it's like, you know, it's Donald Trump's party and he's the king and you don't piss him off. And so, oh, whatever. I guess I'll just lose my job. It's pathetic. It's truly pathetic. And just don't say anything. Yeah. Pretty fucking wild. Pretty wild. All right.

57:15Before we jump to the interview, we should talk now that we're on Newsom about his social media strategy. If you're no longer on Twitter, you may have missed the rollout of Newsom's new press office account where the governor's team has been posting aggressive parodies of Trump's all caps tweets and over the top memes like this one. Let's check it out. For those who are just listening, Lava, can you describe what we're seeing here? Yes, it's Gavin Newsom being supported by the angel of Hulk Hogan and a living Kid Rock and a living Tucker Carlson, I believe, with his hands on his shoulders. They're all laying hands on him.

57:50Which is interesting that only Hulk Hogan is dead because normally it's the kind of, it's the spirits behind them. Yeah, couple. But it's a beautiful moving AI portrait and I think speaks to the promise of AI itself and why we're all so excited about it. Yeah, I wonder if they could have used other MAGA stars who have passed, like Hulk Hogan, Herman Cain. Oh, that's good. Yeah, I'm trying to think of the recent. The Kaiser. I don't know what the Kaiser, I don't know where the Kaiser would have been at on MAGA. What do you guys think about the social media thing? I think it's great. I'll tell you something.

58:22I saw the first one, like the parody one, and it gave me a weird feeling at first. It was like - Oh yeah, that's right, you did say that. And it hit me in a strange way, But I love two things about it. One, I love the commitment to the bit. And the bit has only gotten stronger with commitment. And they are excellent. They're not like - It's real humor. It's not resistance lib version of a Trump tweet. They really are doing a good job of getting the voice. Yeah. And so the fact that it's being done so well is working for me. And it's annoying them. The fact that it's getting a rise out of them is making me like it more.

58:58Jon Favreau:It's breaking through. It's getting attention. People are talking about it. Republicans are mad about it. Democrats find it funny. I admit, like, I, too, when I first saw the kind of all caps Trump parody, sad exclamation, like, I just, I was like, oh, boy, where is this going to go? Because we've seen a lot of it done poorly. Yeah. Now, this is done well. And it's not just, like, Trump trolling. Like, you know, the libs of TikTok account tweeted an attack on Gavin Newsom. So they replied with a photo of her holding up the Epstein files phase one binder and said, great job, Chaya. So they're just like going after tons of people.

59:32Jon Favreau:And I think that pisses off the Republicans. It gets you attention. It also gets you some sort of like algorithmic juice, right? Because you're engaging in fights and people are looking at it and they're sharing it and they're commenting. And it's just like, you know, this, the J.D. Vance one of him. What was the name of the Australian breakdancer? Oh, what was her name? Fuck. Skeet shoot. Nope. What? No, it was something. You know what I mean? Skater 8. Gator skater. Ray Gunn. Ray Gunn. Close. You were so close. Almost there. You know, it's funny. I like it. You know, tweeting the video of J.D.

1:00:07Jon Favreau:Vance jogging like an idiot. Like, I like it. It's fun. It is wild to me. I mean, it's not surprising, but it's still wild that, you know, one of the deputy press secretaries in the White House was like, this is so lame and unserious that he's doing this. And Dana Perino, just on the five, was like, where is Gavin Newsom's wife in all this? How could she be letting him do this? It's so unserious. This is not what how did he thinks this is going to be successful. And I was like, I tweeted, I was like, what do you think of Donald Trump's social media strategy? Do you think that's a that's a thing?

1:00:42And she's like, well, I just I think that I don't think it's going to work. I don't think it's going to work. Everyone were down. So, oh, it's not going to work. Oh, this is a strategic impulse that you're feeding. What I also appreciate about this and what I appreciate about what Gavin Newsom has been doing with redistricting, with the way that he's doing press, the way that he's coming on our show is... And we talked about who's going to be the person that takes on MAGA. Maybe it's Gavin, maybe it's not. But the way we find out is by seeing how they take on like what the right person who's going to take on whoever replaces Trump or is Trump in 2028.

1:01:15How do we figure out who the right person is? Well, let's see what they're doing right now. How are they fighting back against MAGA now? How are they making making news and and taking attention now? And so I like I I view this as like a time where the people that are going to be the right people to lead this are going to be showing us what they Want to do and how they're gonna fight them And the people that are hanging back to wait for their moment to ride in a white horse

1:01:35Jon Favreau:I'm just less interested in it's like shamelessness and commitment really gets you a long way Donald trump has shown us that and Somewhere gavin news and most of that a meeting where he was like, you know what? I trust you guys Let rip have fun with this and it's working and and you could just watching Republicans flail in response has been very funny I think it was over the weekend. Some Republican account tweeted a photo of Gavin Newsom like 15 or 20 years ago, maybe at a wedding. Oh, yeah. Kind of looking like, you know, it was like 11 to 12 to 1 a.m. at a wedding next to a very attractive younger woman being like, you really going to vote for that guy?

1:02:08Jon Favreau:He was gawking a little bit. He was gawking at her, like judging by the angle of the photo or whatever. I was like, do you think this makes him look bad? It's like a young, attractive photo of this man next to an attractive person. I thought you guys were the, yeah, I thought you were the manosphere party. Yeah, I thought you guys got what voters like. This isn't a negative thing. We used to be the ones for fucking and sucking. Now you are. That sucks. What? I'm just saying. We got... Gen Z's not having sex. We got to... They're out there acting. We got to be... Listen. America's going to vote for fucking and sucking.

1:02:40All right? Am I wrong? Are we sick? He's having fun. That's why they put the dildo there.

1:02:45Jon Favreau:This is our lead-in to Bridget Brink. Yeah, she's going to be really excited about her decision. Ukraine's getting fucked okay okay I will just say that also like Gavin Newsom has separated himself just a little bit from his tweets are also punchy and great but they're not the same parody voice as the account which I think is it keeps his stature and it's doing his in his press office is doing it he's having fun, he likes it he's enjoying it but when he's giving interviews he's not acting like a fucking moron He's not doing the voice. And you know what? It's just like, hey, like there was a moment in 2024.

1:03:25It was called, I don't know if you remember it, Breath Summer. And there was like a brief, it was like a refreshing moment where people were just having fun. And the team on the social media accounts were having fun and it was exciting and it was generating enthusiasm. And did it work? Yes. Well, I do think there's like - But no, but I just think it's like great to have, like there were like, there's some fun in it. It's okay. It was good. It was good in that month. I'm joking, of course. It was awesome that that was happening. But it was exciting.

1:03:49Jon Favreau:There is like we do. Let's just define what success is. Like, because I saw some like self-serious chode tweet, like liberals think this is how you convince swing voters to like. No, this is not about swing voters. This is about the base and getting attention and breaking through the clutter and the crap on social media. So people know about you and what you're talking about and you're just making noise. That's all this is. Also, like so many people in my life who are not political junkies have recently been like, I don't even know that much about Newsom, but these are really funny. I've noticed these like attention is the most important currency.

1:04:21Yeah. The way that I think about it, too, is like we don't get attention anymore. You have to take it. You take attention. And this is taking attention. That's great. Yeah. It's a just I think it's a distraction from Gavin's other problems. Yeah. It's a distraction from the Epstein files from the takeover of D.C. from the Medicaid cuts. She's like, make some Epstein. All right. In a moment, you'll hear Tommy's conversation with former United States ambassador to Ukraine, Bridget Brink. Thank God for that, Riggs. Apologies. That apology is not from me. But before we jump to that, the new season of Shadow Kingdom is almost here.

1:05:01Shadow Kingdom Coal Survivor is the unbelievable true story of the deadly power struggle for control of the United Mine Workers of America and the son who took on a dangerous union boss to avenge his family's murder. At the center is Tony Boyle, the union president so powerful and corrupt he'd stop at nothing to keep control. and when a rival candidate threatened that, that man and his family ended up dead. Host Niccolo Mainoni investigates the rise and fall of a union built to protect workers and the moment it became their greatest threat. With never-before-heard tapes, exclusive reporting and interviews with those who lived it, including Chip Yablonski, the surviving son of Toadie's murdered rival, this season tells the story of a movement that turned deadly.

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1:07:52Jon Favreau:Joining me now is the former U.S. ambassador to Ukraine, Bridget Brink. She is now running to represent Michigan's 7th Congressional District. Ambassador, thank you so much for joining the show. Thanks so much for having me, Tommy. So we all saw this press conference today between Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky and President Trump. The good news is it was not nearly as bad as the one we all watched in February. The bad news is I feel like a lot of the big kind of ticket issues are not resolved. What were your takeaways from what we saw and what you've read since? Well, first of all, I think it's very good that it was better than the meeting in February.

1:08:30That's for sure. I think there were some critical things that needed to come out of it. And I think it's yet to be seen if they did. And I think first and foremost, it's security for Ukraine. The starting point to ending this war is focusing on how do Ukrainians have security? And if that problem can be solved, the other pieces, whether it's territory, whether it's assistance, whether it's other things, those can all follow. But the starting point is security. And it does sound like that was a topic of conversation, both in the bilateral meeting, but also critically in the meeting with European leaders.

1:09:06Jon Favreau:Yeah, so there has been a lot of focus on this question of what a security guarantee for Ukraine could look like if the war were to end. The contours of the kind of broader deal could be Ukraine gives up a lot of territory to Russia. Putin agrees to end the war and not evade again. I guess we kind of pretend to believe him because he's a liar and we should not believe him on the front. But that pledge is also backed up by a European and potentially U.S.-Ukrainian security guarantee, maybe some sort of force in Ukraine that says, you know, if Putin does this again, we'll protect you. President Trump didn't rule out the U.S.

1:09:42Jon Favreau:playing a role in like whatever the security force might look like. But I'm a little skeptical that you might see U.S. troops on the ground in Ukraine. But what kind of security guarantee do you think could actually deter Putin? Well, I think first and foremost, any diplomatic negotiation needs with Russia, certainly with Vladimir Putin, needs to do two things. And this is where I think we need to start. Number one, has to make sure that we don't give away things in advance. And that's already happened, whether that is a meeting, which for someone maybe not in diplomacy doesn't sound like a big deal, but that is a very big deal to have a meeting with the president of the United States.

1:10:26Or maybe even more fundamentally, NATO membership. That is a decision for the members of NATO and those members alone. Those things have already been, well, the meeting has happened, and NATO membership has at least, in earlier conversations, been taken off the table. That's one thing that I think is problematic in the way this is being approached. The second, though, is trust but verify. I mean, this is something that has to be done with a leader like Vladimir Putin, who, as you said, he lies. He agrees to things and then violates those agreements over and over and over again. So we can't trust anything that he is going to agree to.

1:11:09Instead, what we need to do and what Europe needs to do is come together with Ukraine on an agreement of what would make Ukrainians feel secure, secure so people come home and they can contribute to their own economy, secure so that the U.S. and Europeans can work together with Ukraine to invest for the benefit of both the countries. And that would happen only with maybe one option is NATO membership. It's not clear that this is something NATO members are yet ready to do. I actually think this would be a smart option. But if not NATO, it could be something else. It could be a coalition of the willing that provides some kind of security guarantee so that essentially, if Putin violates the agreement, there will be a consequence.

1:11:56And that consequence will be not just Ukraine responding. It will be Ukraine plus other Democratic partners responding.

1:12:03Jon Favreau:Trump and Zelensky were joined today, as you mentioned, by a collection of European heads of state and officials, leaders from France, Germany, Italy, Finland, the UK, EU, NATO. Obviously, these countries, these entities have a huge interest in the outcome from today's talks. But what did you make of the strategy of having them all in Washington with Zelensky at the same time as part of this bilateral meeting? Well, I would have preferred that it happened before a meeting with Vladimir Putin. But I think it's a good idea. I think and believe that our allies and partners are part of what increases U.S.

1:12:39power and that we should first and foremost be close with countries that align with our values. And that's democracy. That's rule of law. That's protection of human rights. And all of those countries that came to Washington represent that. So I think it's a great thing. I think that it's good if we're working together. It also shares the burden with Europe that we should do. And Europe is stepping up in a way that I think is very positive, including buying U.S. weapons that will then be given to Ukraine. But I think working with partners and allies is vitally important. And it's a change. And I think it should continue.

1:13:17Jon Favreau:Last week, Putin and Trump met in Alaska for this, whatever you want to call it, historic mess. They failed to broker a ceasefire. Trump kind of tried to yada, yada, yada away the value and importance of a ceasefire today. But going into that meeting, he said basically that that was the line of success or failure. You also heard Putin continue to outline pretty maximalist views. He kind of codes it as dealing with the root causes of the conflict, which I'd love for you to explain to our listeners. But what was your takeaway from this summit, such as it was in Alaska, and what maybe was achieved or not?

1:13:55Well, I mean, I thought it was a win for Putin. And this is exactly why I resigned from my position as U.S. ambassador, because I could see this also back in April when I left my position and also left the State Department, that the instinct of President Trump and the administration is to appease Putin and to take what Putin says at face value and respond on his terms, not on our terms. And I believe we should be using the levers of American power to achieve a result, not just that's good for Ukraine, because it matters for Ukraine, obviously, but it also really deeply matters for Europe and it matters for the United States.

1:14:33And that result needs to be one that, again, starts with security, puts more sanctions on Russia. The economy is already hurting. There's more that can be done, and we should be doing it. And third, that gets the Russian sovereign assets that are in Europe. It's about$300 billion. Those could be used to buy weapons in America and potentially in Europe and in Ukraine so that Ukraine can defend itself. There are many ways we can do this without an endless amount of American taxpayer money flowing to Ukraine, but that secure our interests.

1:15:05Jon Favreau:Do you really think that any kind of like security guarantee that doesn't include the backing of NATO or the United States can deter Putin? I mean, imagine, you know, we're talking about giving up. The Russians are demanding that the Ukrainians give up parts of the Donetsk province that are the most heavily fortified. Obviously, the U.S. is sort of the biggest military force within NATO. If we are not part of a security guarantee that is Article 5-like that says, you know, an attack on Ukraine will be responded to militarily by the U.S., will that deter Putin? Well, my belief is that NATO has already deterred Putin.

1:15:44So I believe that that optimally would be an option we should go down. conditions based for Ukraine, but to make clear that Putin has no business and no right and no ability to stop NATO from deciding as NATO which countries will be a part of this alliance. It's a defensive alliance. It's an offensive alliance. And we should not accept any of Putin's historical justifications for why he started this war in Ukraine in a sovereign country. So yes, ideally, it would be something as ironclad as NATO. But it could be something lesser than that. If that's not an immediate possibility, which I actually don't think it is immediately, then the question would be, what would?

1:16:28And I think that's a question that the Ukrainians can answer. And I'm confident that between us and the Europeans, and I believe we would need to be a part of it, we could answer that question. But again, because the promise that President Trump made to end this war is not happening. This is exactly the problem. We're six months into this administration. And the claim that, you know, the war, as I hear many times, would never have started under President Trump. I mean, the fact of the matter is the war has escalated since President Trump has taken office. Just in July, more civilians have been killed in that month than any month since May of 2022.

1:17:10That's when I first arrived in Kyiv. Additionally, more missiles and drones have been sent to Ukraine from Putin and Russia in July than any time since the beginning of the war, over 6 ,000. I mean, imagine that. Imagine if that was America. I know this because I lived under these night after night. I know exactly what it's like for the people of Ukraine. And we should not be okay with this. And we should be very clear to Putin and not welcoming him back with red carpet in Alaska so that we can hear out his rationale for starting the biggest land war in Europe since World War II. In my mind, this is crazy.

1:17:50And this is not what we want to be representing. This is not using American power in a way that advances our values, advances our interests.

1:17:58Jon Favreau:Yeah, I mean, two-part question. I mean, And can you sort of tell us what you've heard from folks you still talk to back in Ukraine about how they felt about seeing Trump literally roll out the red carpet for Putin? And then second, I mean, you were, I believe, in the State Department for nearly 30 years. We actually overlapped at one point during the Obama administration when you were detailed to the NSC. I mean, back in my day, staffers like you, I was a little lower level than you, but like worked really, really hard to get all the details done in advance of the meeting so that the leaders could agree to it and have a big thing to announce.

1:18:30Jon Favreau:It seemed like this was just thrown together. And the whole point of the Trump-Putin meeting was just kind of the optics of the Putin meeting. I sort of wondered what you made of that kind of slapdash method. Yeah, well, you're exactly right. So it's great to see you again. But the meetings like this summit meetings are ordinarily prepared weeks, if not months in advance. And so the outcomes of the meeting, they're always outcome focused. So we only agree to such a meeting after many meetings before happen and after we know what will come out of that meeting. And as you know, during the time when we were both in the White House under President Obama, these were just incredibly detailed and stage managed in a way so that the outcome met our needs and our interests.

1:19:19And in this case, I actually think it's more about a distraction. It's a distraction from, well, most importantly, I think what's going on at home and promises not kept with regard to the economy. So promises to lower prices and make life more affordable are not, it's not happening. And I can tell you that from Michigan, where I am now, because I talk to people all over my district and they are very frustrated because prices are going up, their insurance costs are going up, their kids can't afford to buy their own houses. This is happening today in America. And we see this with the indicators that came out in just the last couple of weeks, the jobs report, the inflation report.

1:20:03I think this is more about distracting attention to something. And as you can see, everyone's paying close attention to in a slapdash way so that the main issue that people are unhappy about is no longer the focus in the media. And I think we have to be really clear about this and show when promises that have been made by President Trump are not being kept. And I can tell you from Michigan that this is happening right here and right now.

1:20:32Jon Favreau:Including the promise to end this war in 24 hours. Exactly. Zelensky's last Oval Office meeting was an unmitigated disaster. And on some level, like, this was better than that. So I think there was a sigh of relief. But then we saw, you know, Trump and J.D. Vance dressing down Zelensky. There were random reporters insulting Zelensky based on the clothing he was wearing. What was the reaction like in Ukraine after that meeting? And what do you think Zelensky learned from it? And how did he adjust going forward? I think the reaction in Ukraine about the whole positioning of the United States after that meeting, but also during a number of key moments in the last few months, has been one of just shock and incomprehension.

1:21:15People don't understand what happened. I mean, I had a meeting with the foreign minister, one of my last meetings, and there's just not an understanding there. All he could say is, you know, what what happened? You know, you were our closest ally. And I think the challenge we have in this instance is that we have turned our positioning 180 degrees, which, you know, any new administration gets to make the policy. And of course, that is goes to the president. But in this case, it doesn't meet our interest. It does not meet U.S. interests. And as you said, it also isn't achieving the promise that was made, end the war in 24 hours or end the war in 100 days.

1:22:01I mean, in either case, we're well past that point. And as I said, it's gotten worse. So what I think people feel is just they don't understand. And it's hard to believe not just that the position has changed, but that instead there's an appeasing or a capitulation to the demands of the aggressor of Putin, who essentially changing the borders of Europe at a time when this has not happened in 80 years. After 80 years of peace on the European continent, we are now facing the biggest threat to European security since that time, since World War II. Now, why should we care about it? We should care about it because Europe is our biggest trading partner.

1:22:44It's the home of some of our most important allies who are working with us on any number of issues and problems and crises around the world. So it makes no sense for us to side with the aggressor on a moral plane. But even more than that, in terms of our interests and our values, it makes no sense. And the danger we have is that China's stepping in, our adversaries are stepping in, because we are stepping back and siding with dictators and siding with autocrats. It's unthinkable. And it's, again, the reason why I spent my entire almost 30 years in the parts of Europe that are contested space, the young democracies of Europe.

1:23:27And the reason that I left the State Department, the reason that I left that job that I love so much and that I had done since I was in my 20s, was that I saw us becoming what some of these young countries are, which are weaker democracies. And I couldn't believe that that could be the situation with the United States. And the only way I thought to change it, I could not change it from the inside, was to step out and try to change it in a different way. And so just, you know, so people know where I'm coming from. I'm running for Congress in mid-Michigan for the 7th District to try to help flip a critical seat and also to help flip the House.

1:24:05because I think we need to have principled leaders in Washington who are solely focused on American interests, solely focused on delivering for the people of, well, for me, my district, but also our state and our country in a way that helps make America the strongest country in the world, which I believe deeply that's our tradition. And we need to keep building on it, not destroying it. And this is what I see is happening right now.

1:24:32Jon Favreau:Yeah, I mean, look, you were an ambassador. You had very senior jobs throughout the State Department, an extraordinary tenure of service, and you resigned because you couldn't in good conscience carry out this administration's foreign policy. And I think you could be, I would understand if you decided to take some time off or go into the private sector or write white papers for a think tank, but instead you decided to run for Congress. Why? And what do you hope to accomplish in this next iteration of public service? Like, why did why was it this running for this seat, the thing that inspired you to be your next step?

1:25:07Yeah, well, thanks. I mean, I felt compelled to do something because I had spent my life, you know, trying to build up the young democracies on the fringes of Europe and create better partners, stronger partners and allies for the United States and fighting essentially for freedom and democracy. That's what I spent almost 30 years doing and very proud to do it. I was proud every single day that I represented our country working for five presidents and over a lifetime and a career. But it just seemed that I needed to find a way to do that. I feel like it's such a critical moment for us because the problems that I saw overseas in terms of broken promises or doing things that did not reflect or advance our interests is exactly what I see happening at home.

1:25:57I'm a really proud Michigander. My family goes back in Michigan for six generations, and I decided to come home with my family. I have a husband and two kids and to run for Congress. And I think that that is a way to change the situation and change it in a way that advances U.S. interests, that actually helps to do what we promise to do. And in my district, it's all about the economy. It's all about how do you help make life more affordable? And what Trump is doing right now with regard to the reckless tariffs, it's making everything more expensive. With regard to the big, ugly bill, it's threatening to take away health insurance from 25 ,000 people in my district, but also will increase the cost of life insurance for everybody else.

1:26:46So the actions that are being taken on the domestic front are also equally bad for the people of Michigan, the people of my district. And so I feel like we need truthfulness. We need correct facts. We need to make policy based on what actually is true and happening and ensure that we deliver. We need government to deliver so that people feel that government and have confidence in their political leadership, which must also be held accountable no matter who it is, whether it's the president of the United States, the House leadership for any district or local representation. Everyone needs to be accountable for how they deal with taxpayer money and how they deliver.

1:27:31Jon Favreau:Well, Ambassador Brink, thank you for your decades of service in the State Department. Thank you for joining us today and providing insight on this cluster of a policy towards Ukraine. And best of luck in your campaign. And really appreciate you doing the show. Thank you. You can find me on BridgetBrink.com. Thanks a lot, Tommy. It's great to see you. Thanks for having me on.

1:27:54That's our show for today. Thanks to Bridget Brink for coming on. Dan and I will be back with a new show on Friday. We didn't even talk about the Melania letter.

1:28:01Jon Favreau:I think she's a force for good in this. I really do. I also didn't. I think Chad B. Chad GPT is a force for business. I think Chad GPT wrote the letter, but I think, I kind of think Melania is pushing Trump in a good direction on Ukraine. Oh yeah, yeah, I'm not going to. We also forgot to talk about the flyover, but that's fine. Which part? The B-2 bomber and how that was just a massive show. Yeah, they're a MAGA dude just like losing their minds, just rock hard over it in that video. I was like, guys, do you think Putin's intimidated by that? I don't think he is. They're fucking talking over that.

1:28:27Jon Favreau:Yeah, they are. Do you guys think Putin thinks that Trump's going to bomb him and kill himself? Gotta be the party of fucking talking. This is a great coda. We should just put all this up.

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1:30:02focused on the issues that matter most to the people of Britain. With all the changes in our government, including the fun revolving door of prime ministers we have here, there's always lots to talk about.

1:30:10Jon Favreau:And there's lots of fabulous guests to talk to. Journalists, politicians, experts, comedians and activists. We've had great comedians on as well, like Rosie Jones, Stuart Lee, Aisling B. We've also had Tommy Vitor on, who may be our boss. We still don't know. We're not quite clear on who our boss is. I thought it might be Tommy Vitor. I thought it might be Jon Favreau. I don't know if it's John Lovett it's hard to say it's not clear to us who our bosses are some of our listeners call us irreverent but not stupid I object to that I'm deeply stupid it doesn't sound too bad so look come check us out come join us Pod Save the UK every Thursday wherever you get your podcasts