REMIX: The Body is Speaking

13:28Kate Berlant:And you say that with no hint of recognition of the meaning of what you're saying Well, of course, nine months, I understand, of course Gestation of a common baby So what were you? You know, I choose to live symbolically, okay?

13:42Jacqueline Novak:What were you gestating? Well, I wish that I woke up one day and I was like, my script, it's done That's what the pain was But, I mean, I'll reference my journals, but there was nothing I didn't feel there was any kind of material I didn't feel there was anything in my life That felt like I had given birth That there was some process I had undergone

14:05Kate Berlant:Well this is a big question, okay Because can something happen with the body That has another meaning without you knowing, okay I grew up with a mother with neck tension and migraines Okay, I'll use the common plural migraines You know, we all know it's migraine I suffer from migraine I know, yeah And we will do a migraine episode But my mother used to say I'll pay you a dollar Or maybe it was even ten I'm not sure If you will squeeze my neck right here Watching television, okay And it was always this idea of like No, go harder Like really get in it Really get in it Whoa, your tiny hands working overtime

14:46Jacqueline Novak:Where's daddy, she says

14:49Kate Berlant:Dads are the officers, okay This late? Okay okay okay not looking at me i'm the same begging my boyfriend for his elbows okay to dig to dig into my spine so i spent a lot of my time with a mental metaphor of my own body okay which is that it's a series of sort of pulleys and things and i decide in my mind what it feels like and therefore what the solution is so like i always feel this tension right here on i think what is the um trapezius okay and the trapezius is just like a as far as i can tell a big goddamn heavy thing all the way neck over the top a blanket of hell okay and if you go like this you can kind of hit at it so i always feel like it's so tense it's so tense and i start working it and then it takes on an obsessive quality where i start to believe that i have the solution and so like now i would never do this but this is what i want to do i start to think if i could just snip that muscle string with a scissor okay going the relief i would feel now do you have any bodily like do you do anything that's bodily harm in that way i mean even like chewing a fingernail you know like the ocd i have

16:00Jacqueline Novak:when i have migraines i have roll ice rollers you know things like to roll on my head and everything And I've gone so hard with those because the pain of the migraine is so intense that I am like a couple of times I've woke up in the morning and I have like a welt on my forehead because I've been pounding, like rolling so hard over my forehead with this thing.

16:23Kate Berlant:Well, my only my only thing I ever have to say about just massage in general, personally, in my experience has been my number one complaint in massage is too weak. Right. Swedish massage is a joke. It better be deep tissue, you know, or get out of here. Otherwise, I'm embarrassed that Swedish massage is even on the menu.

16:40Jacqueline Novak:I mean, honestly, it might be me because I scream when people give me massages. If someone I know gives me a massage, I scream. If a stranger does it, I'm fine. What do you think that means?

16:49Kate Berlant:You lack trust in your friends. Okay. And you've always been a sucker for a certificate on a wall.

16:58Jacqueline Novak:If there's a certificate on the wall, you can do anything you want to me. It's a real problem.

17:04Kate Berlant:And, you know, you can just print those out. But I think and I want to get into this with the with the well, so so my biggest complaint anytime massage comes up and anytime I consider shelling out for one is will it be strong enough? OK, now I find it personally embarrassing to be on the table and say harder. OK, that I find embarrassing. So I try to get it set up in advance. I try to choose the harshest thing on the menu. And sometimes you can't tell. Is it the deep tissue? Is the athletic one going to be harder? like my fear in life is recovery. Okay. Like I'm terrified. I'm accidentally pay for the pay for the recovery yoga class.

17:39Kate Berlant:Okay. Deep breathing. Okay. Why did I come out? Why did I haul ass down the street? Okay. Yeah. Come in here and prenatal yoga, nothing worse. Okay. I'm embarrassed for the babies. I know it's like the babies can take it. Yeah. Certainly take it. Okay. So what I, I inevitably get into creating my own devices, laying on things. I see when I'm going through a period of tension, I see objects around and I think that would really dig into my right corner of a table afraid corner of a table is huge. So anyway, I've done it all. But now it's time. Thanks to Pook to get the free shit.

18:20Jacqueline Novak:How are you today? Well, I actually am experiencing some pain in a new area, which is always immediately takes me to that I have six months to live some tenderness above my right hip bone it hurts it came out of nowhere is it my it's not I've had it's not my ovaries yeah I don't think an appendix can you believe how much we just don't know about our bodies like all I have is my body all literally all I am made up of is the flesh and the organs like it's it's it rules my every day my every moment it's it's gonna kill me one day i don't know anything i don't know what's inside my own body like like i'm pointing at this area like ow no i'm like where i don't i'm not

19:04Kate Berlant:even sure my stomach truly no i and i only hesitate because i i want to like i i am embarrassed to say like almost like i have a bit because it's the fear that later you'd hear it you know what i mean and think i'm and then i'm faking like the casual conversation you're famously hysterical

19:18Jacqueline Novak:bit i think about of just bodies of how like all the information's in the face oh my god i forgot

19:22Kate Berlant:about that it's so funny it's so that's wow that see it hurts but but specifically to what you were saying okay and actually i'm gonna make a note so i don't forget um i'll make a note because it's my goal my act honey so we might have competing acts oh yeah no but specifically what you're saying okay is one of my about not knowing what's going on inside of your body is one of my obsessions like my okay i wish that i could crack it open every day i would i would like one I'm always trying to feel my organs through my skin but like the quote-unquote bit is we're in our bodies right they're filled with organs and yet we're trapped via our eyes and our senses on merely the outside of of this container okay if if our body's a house it's like we're in an upper level staring out a window and we can't we can't turn around and look inside the house we're staring out of the house okay and then and then like it's like hey want to see inside your own house okay we'll send someone in with a camera like the fact that you can't turn your eyeballs around and look inside like we have no access to you know isn't that

20:41Jacqueline Novak:it's great thank you it's crazy it really is insane like here i am and even just to not have the knowledge like school should just be about your body my god like how is there not like it's like oh i'm in the fifth grade so now i understand like how is there not like i mean don't even get me started on the mystery of the vagina and how the vagina is literally just like talk about a house you can't see i mean that's the basement oh yeah that's facing and even the people that can see it they're like we don't really want to see it or talk about it no nothing but a hand mirror All school should be is learning about your organs.

21:18Jacqueline Novak:Like, I can't believe here I am 33 years old, basically 32 things. I just turned 33 and the year is deducted due to COVID. So I'm 32 years old and I, I don't even know where this pain's coming from.

21:34Kate Berlant:oh yeah i mean you know what i always wish relatedly that i could stick my hands in okay and then sort of massage the um the track the digestive track okay like uh like a sausage casing if you were trying to squeeze the sausage out of the casing but like pushing it out like but i'm like i feel like it needs manual manipulation you know like i want to do a episode on stomach massage oh yeah and i've gone over the top with it with you know rolling around on a soccer ball a small a child soccer ball laying on top of it you're like oh i heard this like medical intuitive talk about how like most women that's really all they need to cure the bloating what you know versus my ongoing prayers wait i have something to say about your appendix possibly i'm not saying it wait i know you know this and i don't it's lower right which is where you're hurting right or are you uh shit no let me let me look up where by the way i know it's every six months it's it's definitely lower right well we're right abdomen oh god but do you know a couple things one okay fuck do you know what the appendix is because and what appendicitis is you're gonna be you're gonna lose your mind when i tell you why is this about poop oh no i didn't mean that specifically although although it kind of is i guess oh okay but it's one of these things it's um and like if i'm wrong i'm wrong but i'm pretty sure i'm right okay if you look and you can look right now but if you look at a model of your organs sorry it says that appendicitis the

23:08Jacqueline Novak:pain gets worse if you cough wait yep well that's a positive yeah oh no wait i feel like though that the by the way if it's appendicitis i go in i get a little surgery yeah i'm fine

23:23Kate Berlant:it's so not it's not yet appendicitis okay um because i believe like people who are not in their body and ignore all manner of pain like like like i think you're really doubled over

23:37Jacqueline Novak:well that's the thing i think if in like you know six hours it's like way worse but here's here's

23:43Kate Berlant:what i understand about the appendix okay much like an appendix in a book wow an appended little section okay it's like attached basically and and if you if you google now the organs like which is also one of my do you know i'm googling internal anatomy near constantly okay i'm just like what does it look like inside my neck over here like because i'm massaging it and i'm just like i know this is the sternocleidomastoid muscle okay whoa okay and we'll do it oh we're doing and we're definitely gonna do a whole episode on trigger points um so the appendix is like this tiny little tiny little room off of the hallway that is the the digestive tract i guess i can't what is it large intestine small intestine i forget which one yeah but it's literally like it looks like a little curl if you google it connects the large intestine to the small intestine but and i think it might be near like the ileoceal valve wow jacqueline yeah i think it's by that valve there's like a tiny vestibule and basically i heard that appendicitis or red is like shit gets stuck in there stop like in fact oh well bitch we all know that must be me as the one as the woman who never shits right although i don't i never hear people saying avoid appendicitis like by making sure your digestion like i feel like it's very good point very good point yeah I've never once I don't have appendicitis.

25:12Kate Berlant:No, no, absolutely not. You jump to illnesses and like and I fanned the flames because I was so excited to give you the information because I just think it's really funny that like the appendix is not some interesting organ. It's just like a little room. It's like a little like storage under the stairs kind of thing. It's disgusting.

25:31Jacqueline Novak:It's a hall closet from hell. But I do think because I had a friend who had like a stomach. She was like, oh, and it was three days later. and she went to the doctor and they were like oh we need to completely operate on you like this afternoon it was appendicitis will you an emergency google the thing about if you press down on it and release does it hurt more well that i remember my dad always telling me that's when we feel better okay appendicitis test appendicitis test quick test appendicitis pushing test or something pain pressure most practitioners push on the lower left quadrant to see or the patient what complaints of pain like what and i'm dizzy okay um testing my medical intuition i don't feel like you have that i don't either i think it's just and that's the that's the other thing it's so insane about having a body is that it just hurts sometimes right like there are just pains and weird sensations like every now and then you're gonna get dizzy or you're gonna like feel the like all this stuff and that's just normal right

26:41Kate Berlant:right see i one of my pastimes is investigating any ailment even if it's not an ailment that is a problem because i just want to know why so it's like you know how sounds the wood settling or whatever the wood settling the pipes doing whatever they do and it's sort of like maybe it's almost like that with the body but i always want to know because i'm like there's a there's a reason and i'm curious so i'm like what's in it what's one of the ones i and i just yeah like this

27:11Jacqueline Novak:is an actual like there's something going on here right it's not severe pain localized something

27:15Kate Berlant:going on and it's going on right there and so it's like you know and it could be all manner of things but yeah i just you know i remember when i was a kid once in the doctor's office like a basic physical and i tried to remember like oh what are the things that are bothering me because I feel like you forget when you're actually there. And I said that like my eyebrow bone, basically kind of when I like pressed on it, I mean, and I don't mean like really, it was just like, I noticed like my eyebrow bone, there was like a place where it hurt and it felt like there was a bump. Okay. And, and I hate this.

27:46Kate Berlant:I was like, so when I press on my eyebrow, it hurts. And he's like, so don't press on your eyebrow. Like literally I'm like, you're a doctor. How dare you? Yeah, of course. How dare you give the like, so don't press on it thing. Like I just, I don't know like this down home like 50s kind of wisdom yeah I just think is rude because I actually think like the whole thing with the stigma the stigma of looking shit up on the internet and over researching and like patients today you know they come in with a list of illnesses they think they had from WebMD WebMD is the worst thing in the world fuck you like literally yeah like how dare you how dare you be a gatekeeper to knowledge and even more than a gatekeeper to knowledge, like insist that just that you're on the cutting edge when I have no reason to believe you're on the cutting edge.

28:33Kate Berlant:Exactly. You come home after a long day of tapping people on the knee with a rubber hammer. And I don't think you're reading up in the medical journals at night. They certainly are.

28:45Jacqueline Novak:You're watching House just like all of us. Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but we have to slip away for a commercial break. But don't worry, we'll be back.

28:57Jacqueline Novak:I have been loving Osea products for quite a while now, years in fact.

29:03Kate Berlant:Yeah, we are so excited that Osea is an advertiser for us because we were begging for Osea to send us products really since the early days of Pug.

29:14Jacqueline Novak:I love that Osea is clean and simple. Their products are beautiful. They smell amazing. They're often in glass. My favorite Osea product, the Algae Body Oil, is in glass. It's a beautiful vanity chopper, as we say. It smells so good and it feels so nourishing in your skin. You feel like you're really feeding your skin.

29:36Kate Berlant:It's a heavenly line inside heavenly packaging. I say packaging because as Kate said, the glass bottle, I mean, it's a game changer.

29:45Jacqueline Novak:I love to throw it all over my body after I get out of the shower. And I also love the body butter, which is clinically shown to hydrate for up to 72 hours.

29:54Kate Berlant:I am pretty excited about the Dream Bioretinol Body Serum. This is the kind of thing I take a night shower. I put it on right after. There's magnesium in it that's soothing. And then there's lavender. So you get that, okay, it's night, it's time to rest feeling and just, just lovely to go to bed in it.

30:16Jacqueline Novak:It firms and smooths your skin while magnesium soothes and the lavender promotes just a nice relaxation vibe before bed.

30:26Kate Berlant:And then if you want to turn it all into kind of a routine, I feel like the Dream Bioretinol is the night solution. And then in the day, you can go with the Andaria Algae Body Oil.

30:37Jacqueline Novak:Osea is clinically shown to moisturize and instantly improve the look of your skin's elasticity. It makes your skin feel beautiful and youthful and hydrated. And also the smell of these products is so lovely and I'm very sensitive to smell. They're bottled at peak potency for a silky smooth full body glow. And you probably know that Osea is an award-winning bestseller for a reason. Their products are rich and lightweight, fast absorbing, and deeply moisturizing.

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31:39One of the great indignities of laundry is when you're taking your sweaty workout clothes, you're taking your towels, you're throwing it in there with a hope for a brand new day,

31:50Kate Berlant:a brand new day of freshness, and what do you get? No, they still don't smell fresh. Yeah, you need a laundry detergent that actually seems to have the intention of cleaning clothes. It shouldn't be the case that you have to choose between a laundry detergent that actually works and something heinous, something with horrible ingredients. No, that is becoming less of a trade-off. We're all trying to make little swaps around the house, just things that are better for the planet, better for us, and any option that involves reducing plastic waste, I'm interested. Yeah, we hear a lot about this, reducing single-use plastics, But I've been paying more attention to the products that I use every day.

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35:04Jacqueline Novak:You know we love cozy earth here on the pod and the bamboo stretch knit set. Ooh, it's unbelievable. I've been sleeping in the cozy earth bamboo stretch knit pajamas for a while. I'm dying for it to get chilly outside so I can finally put them on again. But the thing about these pajamas is they're so lightweight and they breathe, but they're great if you have company or you want to look a little pulled together because it's such a cute little set that you can go from bed to entering the front door with no shame. There is no real risk in trying cozy earth. So give it a try. You can return it. Head to CozyEarth.com and use our code POOG for 20 % off home and sleepwear.

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35:56Kate Berlant:We've both been under the care of practitioners in the last couple of days. Yes. Both facial and foot and dental. And I know I keep bringing up dental because I keep going back. So much. Did you have a facial or a beauty today? I had a facial today, Lori Hollingworth. Wow. My angel. You continue to say her name despite none of us being able to get an appointment, including me.

36:14Jacqueline Novak:You might be able to get an appointment. Also, she's talking about bringing in people to work for her. Okay. That she would expand. So, yeah. Yeah. Okay. But I went to her. You know, I got the full microcurrent. I got the industrial microcurrent. Okay. How did it feel? I got some lymphatic massage.

36:32Kate Berlant:All right. Tell me about the microcurrent. I'm wondering if it was so I recently went to face gym saw their marketing on Instagram right and so I went in they massaged the face it was heaven and then and they applied a microcurrent thing similar to the zip it felt more intense like perhaps it was you know professional grade

36:50Jacqueline Novak:I'm wondering how intense yours was she swears by this machine okay okay did you happen to clock the brand yeah it's called Casey oh my god thank god I really was expecting a no and I I don't

37:01Kate Berlant:know why i doubted you it's like a 25 000 machine well 12 50 if we share it i bet we could find a

37:09Jacqueline Novak:third friend who's interested it's huge it's like a refrigerator i mean it's not that big but it's quite large okay but you know it has like double prong and the one prong and she damn and she

37:20Kate Berlant:really takes her time god did she have any comments on your face she was the current status she just

37:26Jacqueline Novak:was like you look good my god she didn't say it like that she's like deeply loving and wonderful but she was just like i talked about doing the zip and she was like yeah that's great to just kind of you know maintain right keep it going she's like it's not going to give you what this

37:38Kate Berlant:gives you but of course not i mean is it and of course not i mean it is right it is it isn't of

37:42Jacqueline Novak:course not but she what i really value about her facials is it's not a bunch of bells and whistles okay she's not going in there with the here's this and that and you know it just feels like a real

37:53Kate Berlant:sorry i have to stop myself because this is boring i'm not though i'm like literally riveted i know So I feel like you have to trust it. I mean, maybe re-energize, but like, I'm dying to know. We've talked a lot about skincare on this show. Okay. You've talked about Lori Hollingworth since day one. Okay. Yeah. Now, this is the first time we're really hearing about a recent facial. I think it's pretty interesting.

38:15Jacqueline Novak:Okay.

38:15Kate Berlant:Okay. So she doesn't, I mean, if what you're saying feels false to you, that's fine. No, it just felt. If you just feel like you're just like trying to come up with shit to say or something. Yeah.

38:23Jacqueline Novak:Yeah. Yeah. I just was like, not. I'm trying to think if I have anything to actually fucking say. Were there extractions? There was, okay, so there were some extractions. There's something, there's been kind of a zit on my chin that I was brave enough to not tamper with. Wow. So I really let her have at it. Yeah. And she did something to a zit? Yeah, she just got it out.

38:40Kate Berlant:I didn't even know you could really do that with a zit. Like I thought a zit, you're too, like you're too far along. Like a blackhead, there's something to get out.

38:48Jacqueline Novak:What do you mean? Like a clogged pore. But a pimple itself is already like a pus filled. But this is almost like under my skin. I can't go in there myself. She has to go in there. And there's no needle. It's not like popping anything. I think there's a needle involved. My eyes are closed and I've surrendered

39:04Kate Berlant:fully. Yeah.

39:05Jacqueline Novak:I'm like, yeah.

39:07Kate Berlant:Okay. What about the nose? Did she do much around there? Yeah. Cause I had some clogged pores there. Cause that really kind of hurts when they go in with a tool.

39:14Jacqueline Novak:Yeah. Yeah. I mean, she, she cleaned me out.

39:16Kate Berlant:Exciting. But it really felt good. And did you ask her any questions? Like, were you like, what do I do about 11s? Do frownies work? Well, she doesn't like Fraxel.

39:24Jacqueline Novak:Okay, tell me everything. I didn't get into it, but I really, really trust her. She was like, no to Fraxel. I mentioned this laser that I'm curious in called, this is a laser, but I did mention Clear and Brilliant, which is another laser, and she said she likes that one. Oh my God.

39:40Kate Berlant:She doesn't perform any of them, right?

39:43Jacqueline Novak:No.

39:43Kate Berlant:Like, that's kind of the question.

39:45Jacqueline Novak:Yeah.

39:45Kate Berlant:You know, what does the woman who's not selling it believe in of the products that she doesn't sell?

39:50Jacqueline Novak:Right, right. That you can trust. Yeah, absolutely.

39:53Kate Berlant:So Fraxel is some form of a laser where you're really shedding. You're really burning off your face. It's the fantasy we have of burning off the face and starting fresh.

40:01Jacqueline Novak:I remember there were two girls in my... They burn it off and then it scabs and you walk around with a full scab mask for like a week, I think.

40:10Kate Berlant:What a dream. Oh, but I was going to say there were two girls in my high school who I remember, I think they both like shaved their heads together, like best friends. So they were like, so they're going to start their hair care fresh. Like they're going to take such good care of their hair. In high school? They're going to start from zero. Yeah. I mean, it can't be. It can't be. What occurred, but it did. I mean, I might as well stand by the tail. I went to get foot help today. Tell me about the foot help. Okay. I, you know, I went in desperate for the answer to be some kind of plasma or platelets or ground up bone meal or some kind of injection, right?

40:47Kate Berlant:Oh my God. To heal the the navicular accessory area that I have the trouble with. And I was sort of given the same diagnosis I'd gotten previously. But this time I got it. And I trusted him more.

41:00Jacqueline Novak:You know, I'm saying sometimes that helps. Sometimes you have to hear it again. Yeah. Second time, third time in a fresh office.

41:06Kate Berlant:And I raised up my courage to not just go with the flow while it's happening, because sometimes they'll be like, so it doesn't hurt in the arch, right? And I'm like, no. And then like later, I'm like, but it does hurt in the arch. Why did I Like, why did I fulfill his narrative out of desperation? That's that's what that's so real. So I was like and so I sort of spoke up being like he starts to say basically like I already have these orthotic inserts. And he's like, those are over the counter. And look, they're a little weak. Our guy is going to firm it up in the back. It takes my inserts in my shoe, firms it up in the back, brings it up.

41:38Kate Berlant:And he's sort of saying like, you know, these these help. The only other option would be surgery. But you're not you're not a candidate for surgery. It's not needed. You know, so it's orthotics. And it's like, but I did the orthotics last year and they, you know, I'm still in pain. Right. So it's boring. But I'm like, but there's like this pan and I just like, I felt like he was kind of trying to get out of the room at this point. And so I was kind of like, no, it's just, I'm concerned that they're not going to work, you know, and I'll be doing my show and I'll be, you know, whatever. Right. I'll be in pain and I'll be trying to email you guys.

42:09Kate Berlant:First of all, try to get good luck. Try to get in touch with the doctor. Try to get a doctor's email. I mean, I'm sure you have them. I demand them. cultivated those kinds of relationships no right but it's like so i sort of pushed so i was like so there's nothing literally he's he's on his way out the room i'm like so there's no magic serum and this this is here here's what upsets me right yeah i'm not a fool i don't think it's magic serum okay i read on the website about six different therapies okay but then i become self-conscious in the room like showing all having the knowledge yeah yeah because i think it's gonna like hurt their ego right right you know so i'm like it's like navicular accessory right that that word has been rolling off my tongue are they stuck in my home when you drop it two years now and i sort of dropped it in there and it was like oh but not talking about so i'm like you mean there's not some kind of serum like why can't i just ask for what i want i mean as i did though i did i was like what he knew he knew you know he knows what i'm there for with the regenerative sports medicine the website promise welcome to your 30s folks yeah he's like and he just goes not for what you have and i was like and i like really heard him i was like he's saying like that's not gonna help you yeah i don't know it's it's not exciting but i and then the and then i had this guy making me a new a mold of my foot for like a new orthotic whatever and i asked him but so boring jesus okay no but the thing is it's like it's a funny thing because talking about one's own medical issues yeah could there be anything more interesting i know than your own medical

43:47Jacqueline Novak:issues wouldn't it be fun to do a complete scan of your like imagine if you could just do a scan of your entire body and talk about every sensation you've ever had in like like i want to start the toe and go yeah sometimes my yes right toe in the corner there's a pain that happens if i wear this certain pair of boots no no like like go through totally every question oh on his way out the door

44:09Kate Berlant:okay like on his literally as we had to post you know the other the other thing that brought him back in yeah he's out at the door again and i like yell do i need to do yoga to spray my feet like this again i like turned my feet in because my feet naturally go out and he was like no and i kind of loved that too like i don't know that pleased me oh i love when i love when a

44:28Jacqueline Novak:doctor puts you at ease like that yeah through dismissal i'm thrilled because i've developed a very close relationship with my new gynecologist who i love right i think you and i don't know if

44:38Kate Berlant:that came up last week but i think it may have and i'm excited for you and i want to appreciate

44:41Jacqueline Novak:and yeah because i'm in on the texts i'm in i have direct access shit he's great and it's like text the doctor and that's what i want i want that closeness with a general practitioner is that the right word general practitioner well internal medicine it's funny you say that because

44:55Kate Berlant:I was screaming about that to you maybe last week on Poog. How do you find a GP? Right. Oh, my God. How? I've been. I don't know whether it was. Somebody listens to Poog.

45:06Jacqueline Novak:You're telling me there's not someone who listens to Poog who who either is a top shelf GP, lives with one, has a friend, somebody who wants to be on the text thread with and

45:19Kate Berlant:be bombarded constantly with medical questions. Imagine being the internist. And that's so after the after this, my mother, I said GP at her a bunch of times. She's like, I believe it's an internist. Oh, you're looking for an internist.

45:31Jacqueline Novak:And I was like, OK, you can understand the benefits of marrying a doctor. Being a doctor sounds so stressful because can you give yourself medical advice? No. I mean, of course, but bad news. All right. See you in a minute.

45:51Kate Berlant:And we're back, baby.

45:52Jacqueline Novak:okay um doctors oh scanning of your foot okay from every just scanning the entire body and just like because we talk a lot about body horror on this show but it's like just the terror the terror of being embodied wait but turn it towards you so you don't have to turn your head when you're

46:12Kate Berlant:talking to me do you see what i'm saying what's wrong with this i'm looking right at you okay i just you kind of look like that so i'm like there's no way it's you're gonna slip I don't know how to describe it.

46:22Jacqueline Novak:If you're comfortable, you're comfortable. All right. Just we talk about the terror of being embodied, of having a body. Here's what I wish. I wish everyone had a log. I wish this for two days. Maybe it's called a week. Everyone has a log and every single sensation they feel that doesn't feel that could even be considered slightly abnormal. They log. Right. So it's like waking up, slight sharp pain and jaw. So like I want everyone's log. I want to see what everyone's dealing with. Right. Because, yeah, because you don't know because it's like what pain is abnormal, what pain is just because it's always amazing.

46:56Jacqueline Novak:I was really freed when I think just through my episodes of hypochondria, like, yeah, sometimes like you don't feel well or sometimes like there is a pain or shooting pain. And that doesn't mean anything necessarily.

47:06Kate Berlant:You have a body. It's just having a body. You have a physical body. There's going to be things going on. There's going to be sensations. Right. Yeah. Not everything. I mean, it would be weird if the body, if normalcy was just feeling absolutely nothing. Yeah, just pristine. I mean, you feel pleasure. You're probably going to feel some pain too.

47:21Jacqueline Novak:I think that's the truth.

47:22Kate Berlant:Isn't that how we move towards and away things, you know, through the senses in that way? So just so there's going to, I don't know. You know what I was thinking about? I was meditating earlier, okay. And started trying to figure things out. I took a deep breath and I was like, does it feel good? Like, what does it feel like?

47:40Jacqueline Novak:Sometimes breathing hurts and it feels scary, actually. Well, sometimes I don't like the sensation of feeling the chest cavity. it actually gives me an anxiety that feels like I'm going to either breathe too deeply and shatter the chest.

47:59Jacqueline Novak:I was texting you. I had a full blown, not full blown, but I had an anxiety. Oh yeah. Can't wait to get into it. I went to get, by the way, the optometrist hasn't texted me back i have a very kind of how'd you get that number not very intimate but i have a strong relationship with a local optometrist yeah we're no eavesdroppers are not surprised um i know how

48:21Kate Berlant:do you get the direct numbers because i'm in my scs link okay i'm in my seat of sinai i by the way you're gonna think i'm exaggerating jacqueline i'm actually king of my cs link now

48:33Jacqueline Novak:i'm king of my cs link now i love it my login is saved i broke i broke through but jacqueline and I texted you this. I was like, it is medical. It is impossible to get appointments. It took me, this is no exaggeration, three weeks to get referred to a new neurologist. The whole thing, they go, Oh, we don't have the referral. I'm talking to my doctor. My doctor goes, that's not, that's impossible. I'm looking right here. I sent it last Thursday. They, we don't have any, sometimes it takes a second. Was it facts because, and then yeah, facts or emails. And then, and then the guy on the line, I had, this was my third call in to confirm that they got it.

49:07Jacqueline Novak:He goes, yeah we still don't have it and I go god you know I'm just really frustrated I don't understand because she says you sent it last Thursday he goes well there's one person take a take a second with this well there's one person who receives all the referrals so it can take a few days and you see a medical for them to get I go are you kidding me they're kept in a clock tower yeah exactly the fact goes up the tower they also are the ones ringing the bell yeah and so I'm like and I kind of laughed i go one person i go okay okay it took three weeks for the referral to hit them so then i finally get okay and now you can make the appointment and they go yeah she's booking in march i go great okay let's just keep waiting waiting waiting so me too by the way so i got a

49:54Kate Berlant:zoom appointment for january yeah yeah i too am in the world because my fucking aim of a booking Zooms okay booking Zooms four months out now I will say I got a physical or I got sort of a physical found a doc I tried to connect wait why am I hearing like music by the way literally it

50:14Jacqueline Novak:was so funny to tell them it's Naomi's at the dining room table at the other end headphones on

50:19Kate Berlant:making music can you believe it yes it's hysterical no I know I had a feeling and I go so okay careful now because someone could could release that i know i know i know it's true well it's not moving i wish there was a way i wish there was a way i wait no no don't do anything i'm gonna text okay a text let's see what goes in they're so locked in though i know i know but let's at least try it but i love it i love it it's it's it's quiet enough that okay hold on i'm writing i can hear your music okay and then i'm going i want to see not in my mind Okay meaning like You know around texts like Like I'm sitting here and just I can hear any music Yeah they don't see it Wait wait wait A few might break through They just looked up at me and smiled Look at your phone Okay do this do this do the sign of looking at your phone What is it?

51:12Jacqueline Novak:No I'm so sorry

51:15Kate Berlant:No

51:16Jacqueline Novak:There's no apology We were laughing because we were like we gotta be careful because it could be released I'll move No Oh my God. I know. I have to. I'm sorry. No, you don't have to be sorry.

51:31Kate Berlant:BTS. Oh my God. No. BTS.

51:40Okay.

51:41Kate Berlant:Wait. Are you looking at your nails? Your phone? It's okay. Either answer's fine. My phone. My phone. Okay. Hi. Okay. Wait. Wait. Wait. Take me back. Cause I was really into. I know. Oh, Oh, telehealth. Oh, right. My doctor, my doctor. Point is. No, three weeks, three weeks, three weeks. You know, I emailed him. I tried to charge Charmin. Remember I tried to Charmin? Okay. Okay. I tried to charm his ass via email being like, I'm having anxiety because I'm trying to get in for this appointment, blah, blah. And, you know, about when London, can I get a mammogram in London? Whatever. Who cares? Yeah.

52:15Kate Berlant:So stressful. Well, well. He's like, no. And I go, this man's not for me. Okay. I tried to be a little like you. like like i'm gonna look for more anyway i found i found a doctor good woman she rocks okay anyway we do telehealth what does that mean she can order the blood work okay without me having to go in first so i get the blood work and that's what happened to me i'm getting blood work today and then and then if i do have the real physical with her you know then i can go in for a real physical with her she's got it it's all in one anyway my levels my levels it's funny it's like the levels all within range okay great right kind of wild actually for me you mean you were you thought something would be out of oh well yeah i was out of range order the b12 order the d yeah you know like i was like yeah yeah whatever because because of you know whatever issues and i'm getting my

53:07Jacqueline Novak:full i'm getting my full panel i've been putting it off for weeks jacqueline i'm gonna get like

53:12Kate Berlant:seven vials of blood i think my cholesterol dropped by like 4 000 points since wow you know

53:18Jacqueline Novak:sorry okay it's no keto yeah well yeah yeah it's vegan yeah yeah of course it's no animal protein but jacqueline i'm gonna text you i'm scared i'm going to get my blood work today and they're gonna take like seven vials because i'm doing my allergy test finally because i had another

53:33Kate Berlant:mouth allergy from tomato happen wait a second i could have gotten that done because i'm due for

53:41Jacqueline Novak:an upgrade yeah but no it's a different doctor though it's a different doctor i had to get i I did a telehealth appointment with an allergist. When you do one eye, it is so funny and specific. I didn't even feel it.

53:51Kate Berlant:It's like a way that you, you emphasize you. Yes. You underscore you. You're like, it's, it's like, it's like a way of saying I'm really, I really know what I'm saying. I've got two eyes on this. It's almost like you're holding up a, you know, a monocle. All right.

54:07Jacqueline Novak:Yeah. Wait. Okay. I, but just the medical anxiety I had yesterday and I texted you. i i'm in this thing with my optometrist it's really funny so an eye doctor i wanted to get a comprehensive eye exam like to check i help sure i've never done that and i i go in there i call head time they go yeah you're we might dilate your eyes and you'll be dilated for three to four hours i go excuse me so this appointment's my whole day i get there and i'm driving there and i go kate you can turn around you can get there and just cancel you know 25 dollars my copay thank God. I go, what's the worst thing they charge you?

54:44Jacqueline Novak:Five bucks. Like you don't have to do it. You don't have to do it. I go in there. I go, hi, can you please, is there a way to avoid the dilation? And basically the answer was yes. They're like, yeah, we'll do like the preliminary test. And if we see something we don't like, we'll go in deeper, but they didn't say go in deeper. That's my own language. But yeah. And then of course, but I fucking hate eye shit. It's a fucking nightmare stuff in your eyes. I'm touching your eyes. She goes, I'm going to put these numbing drops in your eyeballs. I go, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. I don't like the sound of that i go how long does it last she goes maybe 10 minutes i go okay and i literally said to her i'm scared she kind of laughs she puts in the drops and then she takes this fucking thing and she's touching my eyeball i'm impressed she laughed she understood your tone yeah good like

55:25Kate Berlant:no i kept it light like because sometimes they don't laugh on that when you kind of like do that like i'll do that kind of shit to them a little bit sometimes like no or something yeah and they're almost right to like they come to that like oh i it's very rare okay i gotta be in a certain kind of mood but a lot of them will not laugh because they will not assume that we're all being funny

55:45Jacqueline Novak:yeah anyway go on well no but she numbs the eye she's touching this pen you know the the blow thing where they blow your eye that's not what she's doing she's doing a different pressure test which is involving touching the surface of my eye with this instrument bop bop bop ew ew ew i don't like bounce bounce bounce yeah she's doing it i have my hands up on my head my like this i have my hands through my hair like this and she's doing it yeah and then i'm doing deep breathing i hate it they take me to other place the guy photographs my eyeball brightest light i've ever seen in my goddamn life the point is the doctor then looks at them she's like yeah your eyes look your eyes look totally fine like she goes and then she's like why were you wait just realized

56:25Kate Berlant:something why were you getting an eye exam based on nothing you don't wear glasses you don't have any like right yeah i'm not questioning it i'm just trying to understand you just levels of of anxiety and like um wait wait so so so just just because you you don't you don't wear contacts you don't have glasses right we know i have glasses i have glasses i have distance glasses but i'm due for a new oh right i can see them i remember you picking me up driving them it was like it felt very like i don't know why like julia louis dreyfus like in curb your enthusiasm you like in a car sometimes like los angeles you know yeah wait that reminds me there was something i was dying to tell you about whole foods oh no i know i know what it was why go to the doctor when you can just get a photograph blown up of your iris at the grove in the farm you know like that whole thing now like you can get a you can get a 18 by 36 framed portrait of

57:16Jacqueline Novak:your iris they've been popping up it's like family it's like finally portraits of like the eyes it's very odd but um the the point is oh but then she goes the doctor she goes do you ever see you do you ever see floaters i go well this is the classic thing i'm like well i mean in my life sure i've seen a floater like what i'm like not constantly not every day she goes yeah yeah that's okay you know certain amount of floaters is normal she goes you ever seen do you ever see bright flashing lights i go uh no i go to the movies of course i go well now i'm gonna sweetheart she's like she and she's like yeah it's this thing of doctors just sometimes i'm like what are you doing why are you talking like you mean like get a get a psych degree before you become a gp you get a fucking psych degree well a hundred percent how like and she's like and then she's like yeah if you ever see bright flashing lights go to like the doctor immediately i was like well sure again based on i go and i go bright flashing light i was like i would know if i saw bright flashing light i was like i assume it's dramatic she was she was like yeah like almost like fireworks on the periphery she goes that could mean your rightness detached i go okay

58:26Kate Berlant:wait wait wait i feel like something's being left out here okay and i like and it's fine right but it's like like for for absolute clarity yes yes yes how do you get into a situation of well that means your retina is detached okay when you are you am are you hiding something no no why did you go to the eye doctor just the standard checkup but you said i want you to go deeper do you understand what's confusing?

58:53Jacqueline Novak:A few standard checkups. Well, wait, what do you mean? No, she didn't go deeper. She didn't go deeper. She did the most preliminary.

59:00Kate Berlant:This wasn't like my, okay. I don't know anything about, I don't wear glasses, whatever. Right. So I don't know how it works. Wow. You have 2020. I guess so. Okay. So my idea is that these people, you're not in phone, right? You're just thinking? No, no.

59:15Jacqueline Novak:I literally was looking at literally detritus on the table. Yeah.

59:18Kate Berlant:Oh yeah. That's what it is. Sometimes. Okay. Okay. So, so I'm not frozen. You're not frozen. Okay. Oh, I think I need some new glasses or, Oh, I got to get my eyes, check it again, check check the vision, whatever. Okay. Yeah. Um, you go, I even thought they kind of did that maybe at the glasses store or something. And then, but, but to just go say, I should get my eyes checked. Oh, okay. Okay. I guess, I guess this is what I'm not understanding.

59:44Jacqueline Novak:okay no you're right i'm concealing something because it's too devastating because i've never talked about in the podcast that my dad lost his vision last summer okay here we go because it's like alzheimer's yeah how much worse could it get well you could go blind right right right within a week so it's like and so i even though that's pre-existing conditions whatever we don't know

1:00:03Kate Berlant:what happened he couldn't really thank you for sharing sorry yes but for him it's different

1:00:08Jacqueline Novak:because he has alzheimer's he can communicate the way if you and i if something was going on with our vision we would be like what the fuck is this shit but he you know yeah didn't talk about it and so um but that of course has and even though pre-existing conditions we don't know and it kind of remains a mystery but it's like optic nerve failure and so i of course am sitting here going great well am i going to go blind in a week or whatever so i i wanted to quell medical anxiety here we go got it got it so i went in and then it's strange because i and then i remember yeah So I just wanted, I needed someone to look at my optic nerve and go, you're okay.

1:00:45Jacqueline Novak:Or, oh, actually there's something here that's genetic and we need to keep an eye on it, whatever. So that's why, that's why I'm going. Because by the way, I'm the youngest person at the eye, when I went into the eye clinic, which is gorgeous in Pasadena, it is a huge, it's a community college. It's on a beautiful campus. It's like, this is a gorgeous campus. Doheny Eye Center. I took a picture because I was like, this is unbelievable. And I go in there, everyone's 160. 60 and there's me in there even so the technician i actually found this to be a little bit like maybe you shouldn't say that because i told him i was nervous oh i didn't take a picture i thought i had and he goes he goes yeah who likes being at the doctor or whatever and then he's taking the picture of my eyes and then he says are you what what was the language he used like are you having symptoms like he asked me like basically like is something wrong with your vision and i was like no i'm just getting a checkup and he was like oh okay good and i was like but then here's what this anything a technician says in a medical setting can be read so because i go well does he see something weird they're wondering why the hell you're there kate

1:01:50Kate Berlant:it's like it's so obvious like you're like it's like in the same way that i'm going something's missing here what's going on okay yeah yeah yeah are you having symptoms they're waiting for why the fuck you're in for that kind of appointment why someone's got an instrument okay most people I don't get checked. I mean, it's hysterical, first of all, because medical anxiety go in and then don't like the procedure and say, can we not?

1:02:14Jacqueline Novak:Can we not? I think I'm okay. Which, you know, great. I was relieved. I didn't have to go. But by the way, I was laughing because I was like, I go in there, the nurse, she's like, so what's going on? I'm like, well, nothing. I was like, I have distance glasses, reading glasses, but I don't need them, need them. But yes, I wear glasses. Did you say I'm here because technically I'm freaked out because. So then I said, so then I go, yes, I go, my dad, you know, and then I kind of was like, no one's giving me any sympathy. The doctor too. Nothing. I go, how about a, God, that sounds hard. How about a, holy shit, I'm sorry.

1:02:47Jacqueline Novak:You know, how about a, you know, how about a hand to the chest? You fucking animals. People are worried.

1:02:53Kate Berlant:They were just, they were, they were too focused on. They're just staring at me. Yeah. It was just staring. No, no, no. Like they were too focused on whether or not you're up. you're they're still trying to hunt for why does she think did there's still i believe they're still

1:03:08Jacqueline Novak:asking why is she here totally totally they're still searching okay that's what's crazy is that the medical setting nothing gives me more anxiety and nothing makes me feel safer so much so that then last night i'm you know i'm in laundry looking up my childhood pediatrician office going oh my god there it is i remember the those are the toys i played with right loving it yes So anyway, but I walk out so happy because I go, my optic nerves. Okay. And then I, but then I'm in this thing with my optometrist, a local optometrist and silver leg lover, Cindy, shout out. And, but I go to Warby Parker cause I want blue light blocking glasses.

1:03:45Jacqueline Novak:Okay. Of course. And then I, and then they go, Warby Parker is like, well, we can give you an eye test or they go, well, can you call in? We can get the blue light with your distance prescription in these. I go, well, that's great. they go well let's call over your prescription i start to get oh no cindy's gonna think i'm being a traitor because i get my glasses through her small mom pa shop optometrist suddenly warby parker's calling we need to get this transferred over here yeah this is like this is um you know

1:04:09Kate Berlant:life uh life uh this is six feet under the the big corporation calling this is um oh my god i can't

1:04:16Jacqueline Novak:think of cromer not cromer i know i'm humiliated um yeah uh yeah no no cromer cromer it's cromer yeah yeah so then yeah they go i'm selling a cromer and then and then uh on the jet with the margaritas yeah and um best show ever made and then so then i say to the woman at warby parker and she thinks i'm being i'm kooky at this point because i go can you tell her that this is just a one-time thing that i'm just getting the warby parker walkers and she kind of laughs she's like oh i mean i'm sure it's fine this happens all the time i go yeah yeah but you know it's a small mom, posh shop. So then the point is, so I'm worried about, she's going to think I'm a traitor.

1:04:54Jacqueline Novak:And then I get, I get a text from her and she's like, Hey, where we Parker just called, like you're actually due for a new eye test. So that's what I go. Okay. I need to get my vision because my vision is unfortunately degrading, not in a horrifying way, but just meaning like, yeah, isn't that what it does? Faces are a little blurry. Yeah. Like I'm looking across the room, kind of swinting at a restaurant. Who's that? Are they looking at me? Like, I think it's, I think it's also made me be rude a couple of times. I don't recognize someone because they're across the room. I see a shot. I see like they're pixelated as usual, so to speak.

1:05:25Jacqueline Novak:Yeah, they're pixelated. And billboards. Like, I think I'm anyway.

1:05:31Kate Berlant:Whatever. The point is. Well, I just had that moment where billboards. I didn't hear it. You know, OK. I was like, billboards.

1:05:39Jacqueline Novak:I see billboards across the room. I don't recognize him. He boards the airplane. He goes, it's me, Bill. Billboards.

1:05:46Kate Berlant:No, because this is actually relevant because distance, your glasses are distance glasses.

1:05:51Jacqueline Novak:So are they only needed when, what, driving? Correct. Or socializing? Movies, seeing the play. No, I wear them when I'm seeing plays, when I'm seeing movies, when I'm driving, but not always, but driving at night for sure. I like to make sure I have them. I can drive without them. See, this is what's interesting.

1:06:06Kate Berlant:It's almost like not the blue light scenarios that you need to protect from. No, these are blue light with prescription. No, I know. I mean, like, okay, you know, like blue light, good and natural during the day, you know, at night, you know, the rhythm, right? Sure. Circadian. So if your glasses that you were using while on your phone, computer at home, watching TV were blue, blue blocking.

1:06:34Jacqueline Novak:Never happening. I only, I never, I, the blue blockers, I was.

1:06:38Kate Berlant:So why do you need the, it's almost like, why do you need blue light protection in your distance glasses? For watching TV. In your distance glasses?

1:06:46Jacqueline Novak:No, no, no, no. That's a real... Oh, my God. She did it. She did it. You're right. Fuck. You're right. If I'm watching TV... Which you're not doing. With the blue blockers on, or I'm scrolling on my phone, you're right. They only need to be blue block. It's kind of interesting. Too late? No, it's not too late because I haven't done it yet.

1:07:05Kate Berlant:You start going to the drive-in movie theater to legitimize your purchase? Well, by the way... I've always wanted to do this.

1:07:15Jacqueline Novak:I mean, I've, you know, tried two hours to. Well, the, the, the, I, well, I'm going to go in for the vision. And cause even yesterday they did a little vision test, like, you know, read the letters and I'm like, I think I got them. I think I nailed them. But you're afraid you cheated. I'm like F P R T Q. I'm like, was it, was it a Q or was it an O? Huge question.

1:07:32Kate Berlant:Was it a Q or was it an O?

1:07:34Jacqueline Novak:Yeah.

1:07:34Kate Berlant:Tell me now. Was it, here's a huge question. Do they mix those up so that different dentists, I mean, sorry, different doctor's office, Because you can memorize in a second. You can cheat. Absolutely. Or what if you're subconscious remembers?

1:07:46Jacqueline Novak:Well, that's what's so scary about so many of these medical tests. Because like I saw the O and I think I see a hint at the bottom. I go, is it a Q? There it is. Did I see a Q? No. I just, I saw an O.

1:08:04Kate Berlant:I get a text. I have COVID. Okay. Okay. Let's skip ahead. Okay. I see it. No, no. You know, I'm doing whatever. I pull up my text. Okay. So I have COVID. Sorry. I've missed a few texts from Kate, right? I pick up my phone. I have COVID. And then next text, all caps, I have COVID. So the two. So there's a, you know, okay. So it's like, it's essentially, hello? Yeah, yeah. Right? Yeah. And then, oh, wait, I don't have COVID. Okay. Or whatever, right? Yeah. Now, you know, you had been confused. Okay, so here's what happened. Oh, no. And then regardless. Okay. So then you share with me also your text exchange with Naomi.

1:08:47Kate Berlant:I just want to bring it back. And I ask like how quickly between test results did both me and Naomi, the tribunal, and anyone else, I'm curious, get texted? The alerts, the announce, the, you sounded the bell, right? How quick did you sound the bell? Very quickly. To how many?

1:09:07Jacqueline Novak:I would say I texted immediately Naomi you my mom I have COVID okay so wait fuck wait I'm trying to find this because it really is I'm trying to find the original regardless COVID

1:09:22Kate Berlant:oh you're so funny okay what do you see you are a wild wild woman because there's a couple threads to fuck with here okay I have it

1:09:35Jacqueline Novak:so I say to you I have COVID lowercase all caps I have COVID and then oh my god I read it wrong all caps I don't have it and then you said are you sure I said yes oh no that was wait so it's confusing okay okay

1:09:49Kate Berlant:so are you sure was a joke okay I know this is funny right because you've got I have COVID I have COVID and then I don't have COVID I go are you sure yeah yeah okay okay because like and you I am sure the rapid test I You reading it straight is actually really funny. You read it straight.

1:10:07Jacqueline Novak:The rapid test was confusing. It was a COVID. So I'm looking. So I text my partner who just landed. I have COVID. I'm so sorry. I don't know how to tell you this. She sees this, right? And then I start going, but then I start going, wait, wait, wait. I go, well, there's no bottom line. The point is that the instructions are confusing for people like me who couldn't do standardized tests, who got such a low test on the SATs that it was like broke the system. Yeah. Like they'd never seen a score so low. So I started seeing this. I start panicking and I go, well, what? So then I say, well, it's confusing.

1:10:37Jacqueline Novak:And then Naomi, God bless, goes, that's the control line. So then I see this later. Actually, Naomi actually even.

1:10:45Kate Berlant:So I go, send me what you saw because I wanted to diagnose too. Okay. And I got excited. You're like, it's confusing. And I got excited to like play the game and see. I argue that it is confusing. And started to read. No, right. And I, did I disempower you? No, no, I didn't. I said, it's confusing because, you know, some would argue the control shouldn't, look just like another of five things, right? There's five letters, one of them C, and you're wondering if you have COVID, you know what I mean? So, cause this was COVID and flu. Yeah. And I don't know if there's a third thing there. No, just those two.

1:11:15Kate Berlant:Okay. And so I studied those, those, those pictures trying to understand, right? And go, would I read this? Whatever. It's very confusing. Now you shared with me, cause I wanted to investigate. You shared with me immediately a text that you had sent, I think. Naomi. To Naomi or Naomi, whatever. I forget who sent it, right? Poor Naomi tells me. Because I go, I don't have COVID. Because the original was like, can you wait? Like, there was something Naomi said that was like.

1:11:41Jacqueline Novak:I don't understand. They said, I don't understand what I'm being sent because I was sending them pictures of the instructions. And they said, please just figure it out. I love you.

1:11:48Kate Berlant:Yes, that's what made me laugh.

1:11:51Jacqueline Novak:And they said, Kate, one line is control. Yes. And they said, please just read the instructions. C means control. okay and then i said i said regardless it's bad because i thought so so let me let me let me let

1:12:06Kate Berlant:me deliver this to the people so katie said naomi's case i have covid or maybe flu okay or something right regardless it's bad okay yeah is one of the funniest things to me that i've ever read in my life yeah okay it's like i have covid wait no i don't wait before i lose my audience here of witnessing my illness this is bad okay and even to your own partner right yeah careful right like like regardless it's bad right so so it's like don't for don't for a second anyone think I mean regardless it's bad is a commitment to having well I thought because I was like oh

1:12:47Jacqueline Novak:if it's not yeah I just didn't understand unreal yeah meanwhile meanwhile negative neither okay

1:12:55Kate Berlant:Well, then, because then what happens? Oh, and so then this is why. Yeah. So I had to act quick when I saw the funniest thing I've ever had and ran the Canva to make t-shirts. All right. We'll share these. Yeah. And the front is, I can't tell. Okay. Regardless is bad. I was screaming laughing. Is a new you. Okay. Yeah. And I mean, to me, it's like, it was the mushrooms all the time. Regardless, it's bad. No, no. And then this, and then there's a future.

1:13:20Jacqueline Novak:And then what happened was, because this is something that, so I sit there and I think I have COVID. right i'm texting my mother i'm texting i go oh no and then i realize i don't have covid by the way when i saw it i go control the sea lion i go oh no i have covid and i go i fucking knew it

1:13:38Kate Berlant:because that's what this has to be that's the thing the speed okay because oh no i go i knew it two nights before okay you were also doing the like the one time i don't wear a mask i don't wear a play it's a staged play okay it's a greek tragedy of the one time okay you don't understand the context jacqueline i've worn a mask for two years i know i know so that but then i realized

1:14:09Jacqueline Novak:i don't have it the freedom i feel the gratitude the joy i mean that is a high unlike anything else anything else i go i have covet and then i go i don't have covet and then i'm so happy now now that's the key word I write I'm so happy now which is exactly the human right the condition of hell I'm so happy now because happiness as we know right is transient happiness is temporary that's why it's not something to be chased because it comes and it goes and it's fucking chase happiness yeah yeah bottom of the gin bottle that's where it is for you so so I'm so happy now that was Pooh If you enjoyed POOG, please subscribe, rate, and review.

1:14:56Jacqueline Novak:If not, we will press charges.