CoreWeave AI Rally, NVIDIA Scrutiny and Energy Shipping Risks

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1:01The tech trade, it is back and it is back in charge, at least for today. Welcome to Power Lunch, everybody. I am Brian along with Contessa Brewer. Kelly Evans off today and tomorrow. The AI ecosystem, it is rallying. Neocloud, memory, chips, they are all higher. The catalyst, probably CoreWeave. It is the best stock in the NASDAQ 100. That stock is soaring 25%. The CEO telling CNBC that demand is, quote, overwhelming. And speaking of tech, NVIDIA trying to find its footing with shares back in positive territory after two punishing sessions. The scrutiny on Jensen Wong is intensifying between the board calling for an independent review, potential subpoena, call from a Republican senator for Wong's removal as CEO.

1:45Look, this scandal is sparking worries for investors and raising questions about NVIDIA's role in the AI revolution. Noted Silicon Valley investor Roger McNamee joins us. All right, so we've got a lot to get through, but let's start with CoreWeave, because CoreWeave stock, as we just showed you, it is rocketing today. It's up 25 % right now after reporting earnings last night, on pace for its second best day ever. Its biggest daily gain since, well, not that long ago, April of 2025. But let's bring Seema Modi in to talk more about this. We had the CEO on earlier on CNBC. I don't know, Seema, is this like, are people saying this is like the all-clear for AI suddenly?

2:24Not the all clear, but it's certainly adding optimism, Brian. And it really came from CEO Mike Intrader of Courtweave, who acknowledged that the company is moving away from its strategy of purely relying on debt to finance its data center build out, pushing customers to pay up front, which then reduces its reliance on external financing. It's also been able to raise prices of the chips that it leases out to hyperscalers by 35 percent from the quarter from the past quarter. That's just a sign, right, of how demand remains really hot for GPUs. While Corey's message is resonating, some analysts, I should point out, are less convinced.

3:00There's Gilly Luria at DA Davidson, who says that interest expenses are still higher than its adjusted operating income. He also points out that another equity sale could be in the cards, which would be dilutive to existing shareholders. For now, Corey is resurrecting the AI trade. We're seeing semiconductor stocks, including NVIDIA, trading higher at the moment. hyperscalers, neoclouds, just up on this notion that they too can use creative options to fund their data center expansion plans. And Brian, I would also point out bond yields that for a lot of these companies, they've tightened in the last few hours.

3:35So the bond market, you know, and they'll tell you if you've listened to them that they're smarter than the stock market. The bond market is not giving you all clear, but it's maybe a little more clear than it was yesterday. Seema, is that for sure? Especially if you bring up Corweave's 10 year bond, That's a 2032 bond. It was well above 15 percent for many weeks. It's just come below that to around 14 percent, which, again, just tells you that fixed income investors, they like what the CEO had to say about their financing plans. All right, Seema, thank you for that. We did get some commentary here from the CoreWeave CEO earlier today on the type of demand that CoreWeave is seeing for Compute now.

4:11Listen. We are 10x oversubscribed to the existing capacity that we have left in 2027, and we are multiples oversubscribed on the capacity we have out in 2028. So between the future demand being oversubscribed and the numbers from the earnings print, is CoreWeave itself set up to run? Let's bring in Citi co-head of U.S. Software Equity Research, Tyler Radke. He has a buy. And Tyler, you have a$128 price target on CoreWeave. So more than double where it stands right now. What's going to fuel that run? Yeah, look, I think it's going to be consistent execution, right? What we saw last night from CoreWeave is a lot of positives.

4:53Obviously, they're standing at capacity faster than planned. Pricing margins are all coming better. But they've sort of graduated from needing to tap the unsecured debt market, which we think is a key milestone for them. You're certainly seeing the demand environment remain robust, which allows them to go out and get these prepayments to access these DDTL, these sort of much more favorable interest rate structures to fund their capacity. As we look out beyond 2027, that's when we really think the earnings power shows up. You're seeing significant growth in their cash flow next year, which helps them fund a lot of these obligations.

5:32But you start to really see that earnings trajectory improve post-2028, which is when we think investors will get even more confidence and will snap slag. The CEO also said that he doesn't see a particular political risk with the change in power in Washington, D.C. Why not? Are you discounting any impact here on the AI infrastructure build-out and what that could mean for a company like CoreWeave? Yeah, look, I think there's always political risks to monitor. These are physical sites, incredibly capital intensive. You have to do things the right way. I think the encouraging thing is, A, Corweave has stood up more capacity than many of these other neoclads combined.

6:17B, for all of their Texas and some of these states where there's been more focus from a political perspective, they already have all the power rights approved. They have the permits. They have all the regulatory conditions sort of settled. And God forbid we get to a scenario where data center growth meaningfully slows down. That's only going to exacerbate the supply-demand gap and drives a price for Corweave's existing capacity higher. So, you know, it's something to monitor. But again, we think they're among the better positioned within this group. All right. Those shares right now at 6 ,105, up 25 % on the day.

6:54Tyler Radke of Citi, thank you so much for your time and perspective. Thank you. All right. Your next guest called part of the big recent downturn in tech. About two weeks ago, right here on Power Lunch, Piper Stanley's Craig Johnson cut his recommended waiting in tech from 40 percent to 18 percent and said it had more room to fall. Now, since that day and prior to the market rally today, the S &B tech sector dropped nearly 10 percent is still down about six and a half percent. So does today's thinking, today's move change his thinking at all? Let's find out. Craig is head of technical research, Piper Sandler, and joins us now.

7:30I don't need to—well, I screwed up the question anyway, Craig, but it's good to have you on. So does this rally change your thinking about tech at all? Brian, not at all. We're not out of the woods at all when you look at the charts and the technicals of what we're seeing. The AI and the semiconductor stocks entered a bear market back—well, it's in a bear market now, but the sell-off really started back in the June timeframe. And at this point in time, this is just a relief rally. And this happens, right? And this is critical. And I want people, especially those that might be watching or listening that are newer to the market, some of the biggest up days will occur when things, maybe in tech, are in bear markets, correct?

8:13That is correct. You'll have these huge rallies. That is correct. Why? Why? You'll get that because investors will start to short some of those positions, and then they see this news come out, maybe a little bit better than they expected, They got to cover that, lead to this kind of very violent, quick, but brief, short covering rally and pushes the stock up very quick. Again, I come back and I look at the semiconductor stocks. You can't have, and let me repeat, you cannot have leadership in the market in a bear market like we've got for semiconductors and expect this not to carry through for the rest of the market, Brian, and for the technology sector.

8:49As you said, we're 18 % weight in tech. We've actually lowered that a little bit more since we've been on the show. We're about 14%. And we're just looking at tech being very selective at this point in time, fully knowing that you're in this bear market in semiconductor stocks and you want to use days like today to sell, to reduce positions. So let me just ask you, how do you distinguish where there might be healthy rotation into energy or financials or health care from investors taking a really defensive position? I think that's exactly what they are doing. The market is rotating. You're taking money out of tech.

9:29You're rotating into health care. You're rotating into energy at this point in time. There's some rotation into financials happening. But when you look at how this rotation is playing out with some of the research we just published, there is no question that this is a defensive rotation. And the number one question I've been getting from investors is, is it done? Has it gone too far? And the answer, in my opinion, is no, it's not. There's still more room to go. Last week, I was in Italy, and we were talking about Europe's energy crisis that they're entering this winter with the lowest level of natural gas in more than five years.

10:05Not a new story, been on it for about five years. One of the stocks that we mentioned, one of the companies that we mentioned, and I'm not offering up advice, but it was Chenier, ticker as LNG. They are one of the biggest exporters of American gas to Asia, to Europe, and more. It is also a stock that you like the chart of. What are you seeing? I'm looking at sort of just this macro fundamental story. What do the charts look like? So Brian, full story on all these energy names. We upgraded energy in February. Nobody wanted to get on board with energy. They thought this was going to be a quick conflict in the Middle East.

10:40It's played out, been much longer. Specifically for LNG, what we're seeing is on the technical side, a very big base has formed and we just broke out. We like stocks that make new highs. That's what we technicians do. We buy stocks that are breaking out. And that's exactly what you're seeing happening there and in other parts of the energy sector too. And what about Roper Technologies? This is another name that you're looking at. So Roper is interesting. It's going to sort of play in the services, play in the technology side of things, kind of a combination of both. But great price action. But it's very different than what you have with the AI trade, which to me, again, I'm not questioning AI.

11:18I like AI. I use a lot of AI for various workflow processes and stuff. But that chart looks great, breaking out, very constructive. You know, how do you factor in, for instance, CoreWeave, though, and what they announced for earnings, what the CEO had to say on the call about the future and about overscribed demand. How do you factor that in when you're saying, no, we still have more room to fall when it comes to the AI and the tech trade? Well, from the big picture perspective on all this, and it's a terrific question, is when you think about the growth that we've had for AI, and even think about the earnings growth that you got for the market for next year, the second derivative rate of change is starting to slow.

11:55AI is here. It's not going away by any means, but the growth rate, the build-out, the pace, and all those other parts of this, it's going to slow. Can you explain this? How you see sentiment shifting from FOMO, the fear of missing out, to JOMO? Absolutely. Brian, you've heard this term from me before, too. Yes. The fear of missing out to the joy of missing out. And the joy of missing out is where you've cut back on your position, and the stocks are all coming in, and you feel a little bit of, well, joy. It's like you didn't go to a party that the cops ultimately bust up. Not that I would know anything about that, but you have the joy of missing out.

12:32I'm very disappointed in you, by the way. Speaking of missing out, we just said Roper Industries, and there was no three's company commentary. There's three of us here. We talk Roper. I just dated myself with that. Chenier, Roper, Craig Johnson, safe travels back to Minneapolis. Thank you, Brian. Like I said, we're going to bring the show to Minneapolis, just not in the winter. I agree. We got a perfect spot for you, so come on out. Thanks, Craig. Thank you. All right. Thank you very much. All right, folks, we are just getting started here on Power Lunch and still ahead, we'll give you a double dose of energy tensions with Iran and the Houthis flaring again.

13:09Halima Croft is here to talk the macro and then a really interesting guest, International Seaway CEO Lois Zabrocki, who runs a super tanker company, but grew up in Iowa on a farm and never saw the ocean. We'll talk more about all of that and more. But first, NVIDIA's key man risk. That stock down 6 % since reports of Jensen Wong's affair. What does Roger Bactamey think should happen now? He's always outspoken, and you'll hear from him next.

13:54podcast from Charles Schwab provides an information packed daily market preview on stock updates, U.S. and global economic news, monetary policy decisions, and key results and statistics that may impact your trading. Download the latest episode and subscribe at schwab.com slash market update podcast or find Schwab market update wherever you get your podcasts. There's a fire inside you you can't ignore. Stand still, not a chance. You're a lifelong learner who's come this far. Now we're here to help you keep going further. Capella University. What can't you do? Visit capella.edu to learn more. Great meeting.

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15:04NVIDIA is rebounding today, as you can see, up 4 percent, but still down more than 5 percent since reports of CEO Jensen Wang's relationship with an alleged Chinese spy. Megan Costella has the latest developments. What are you hearing, Megan? Contessa, we are starting to see more lawmakers from both parties clamoring for more accountability from Jensen Huang. Republican Senator Kevin Kramer this morning called for Huang to resign, telling CNBC, it's like, my God, this is a guy that's right now so vulnerable to extortion, to blackmail. I just don't think as a national security matter, we can run the risk.

15:39Now, Kramer also said that Huang had been arrogant and dismissive in meetings with lawmakers about the potential national security risks of sending China advanced chips. He said the chances of some form of export control bill for chips being passed before the end of this year as pretty high. And that's indicative, guys, of what could be one big near-term impact of this scandal. It has reignited support on the Hill for legislation tightening chip sales, which would have impacts far beyond NVIDIA alone. And separately, three House Republicans who have called on Fong to testify next week say they're giving him until the end of the day today to respond to their request.

16:14And if he doesn't reply, they say they're prepared to issue a subpoena. Guys. All right, Megan, thank you for the reporting. All right, so your next guest says that regardless of what happens with Jensen Wong, this investigation already a huge problem for NVIDIA stockholders. Joining us now is Roger McNamee. He is co-founder of Elevation Partners, early Facebook and Google investor, and a man who, dare I say, knows stuff. So, Roger, we're glad to have you on. what should happen with Jensen Wong? Should the board whack him? I don't think so, Brian. In fact, I think there is something going on here that is not as it is being represented.

16:54So let's just review the facts. Whatever this relationship is, the White House has known about it for a year. And NVIDIA has known for a year that the White House knew about it. During that year, the White House has had, as a strategy the desire to sell NVIDIA processors into China in order to have NVIDIA be a globally dominant firm. They want that revenue coming into America. They want American technology to be globally dominant. That is a completely logical strategy, and it apparently has gotten to perhaps 20 % of the revenue of NVIDIA. So you look at that piece of it, and you're going, wait a minute, Why did this story break now?

17:40And then you look at the China part. And China's got a very clear strategy of building its own semiconductor industry in competition with NVIDIA. And it's trying to prohibit its own companies from using NVIDIA processors. I believe there's 750 ,000 NVIDIA processors in warehouses in Hong Kong that China has refused to accept. So I'm looking at this going, I don't get the whole spy thing. I mean, among other things, that relationship was taking place in plain sight. And so I'm looking at this going, it really looks like it's a hit job on NVIDIA and on Jensen in particular. But Roger, Roger, okay, fair enough.

18:18We've seen a lot of CEOs who've been dismissed, fired from their companies for making bad personal judgments. Okay, let's be clear. This was a personal issue. I have no idea what he's like. I've never met him. Don't know what his marriage is like, whatever. But I'm sure you're on a lot of boards or have been. If they found out he lied to the board, if they found that out, is that something that should force termination? Well, if he lied to the board, then I think that's a conversation you should have. It's just that NVIDIA hasn't known about this issue for a year. I don't think this has been held back from the board at all.

18:58I mean, there's tons of video of this woman with Jensen and his whole family. So I don't think he's been hiding it. So to me, I want to make sure we ask the right question. What is, from a stock market point of view, what matters here? So the first is, it's pretty clear that China's trying to prevent NVIDIA from selling its processors into China. Well, that's bad news for NVIDIA shareholders. Secondly, there's this story out that's threatening Jensen as CEO in a company where I think he has 60 direct reports and there's no second in command. So from the point of view of the shareholder, you don't want to lose Jensen Long.

19:40He's very much the company. And then lastly, you have to ask the question about the rest of the industry. I think NVIDIA represents roughly half the cost structure of the AI industry in the United States. And quite clearly, if you could bring the price of NVIDIA processors down, that would be huge for the margins at OpenAI, Anthropik, Google, Microsoft, and the rest. So you can see that maybe Jensen doesn't have a lot of friends right now. And if I'm an NVIDIA shareholder, I think you have to look at that and go, why are these people ganging up on it? I mean, this doesn't appear to be the White House doing it.

20:17This appears to be perhaps China Hawks and the rest of the industry. You're raising that flag, that specter about whether this is an end result for China. But I'm curious, if the end result is that our Congress puts new restrictions in place on selling chips to China, then don't those end results align? What China wants and what some representatives of Congress want align? Contessa, that's exactly the point. that we would effectively, if we block sales to China, we're doing exactly what China appears to want. And weirdly, we're doing this at the cost to an American company that is a global market leader.

21:02Then how do you factor in other questions over whether NVIDIA was bypassing some of the blocks that were in place, that whether this company, Megaspeed, was set up literally to be able to sell chips for undisclosed purposes. Well, to be clear, I think what was going on there is that China was preventing Chinese companies from buying the parts directly so that Megaspeed and other companies like it were setting up offshore data centers in Singapore and other places. And then the Chinese companies that wanted to have that capacity would go and source it there. And so they were just, it was an indirect workaround.

21:45So it looks to me as though this woman in all probability was an entrepreneur trying to take advantage of the friction created by the Chinese policy and the business opportunity because Chinese processors today are nowhere near as good as NVIDIA processors. And so you look at this, and my only point here is the only loser in this whole thing that I can see is NVIDIA. And therefore the United States, because to some extent, we benefit enormously every time one of our companies dominates the global market. And this is the big one. So let me ask you, when we're looking at all of this and how things could shake out, is NVIDIA too big to fail?

22:27I don't think there is such a thing as a company that's too big to fail. I do think that the issue we face in the country is that our economy is slipping relative to China. And so we're in this position where we're trying to maintain global dominance in the markets where we still have it. And technology is one of the last places. And I have argued on different shows on this network that the way we've gone about AI is dumb. We've invested too much money too early in a technology that doesn't scale to the opportunity we need it to deliver. But that's not NVIDIA's fault. NVIDIA has been the bright shining light through all of this.

23:10And so, and obviously the memory guys as well. But I look at this and I'm just going, if you hurt NVIDIA, you hurt the whole industry. So for those who are bulls on the industry, I think reducing the scope of the market opportunity at NVIDIA is not a good thing for anybody who's long these stocks. We always appreciate hearing your perspective, Roger. Thank you very much. Roger McNamee, the co-founder of Elevation Partners. All right. So coming up, we've got Corweave leading a big rebound in tech, the rally's biggest movers after the break.

23:48This episode is brought to you by Schwab Market Update, an original podcast from Charles Schwab. Schwab Market Update, an original podcast from Charles Schwab, provides an information-packed daily market preview on stock updates, U.S. and global economic news, monetary policy decisions, and key results and statistics that may impact your trading. Download the latest episode and subscribe at schwab.com slash market update podcast or find Schwab Market Update wherever you get your podcasts. There's a fire inside you you can't ignore. Stand still, not a chance. You're a lifelong learner who's come this far.

24:26Now we're here to help you keep going further, Capella University. What can't you do? Visit capella.edu to learn more. You know that feeling when too many things fall through the cracks? Monday.com was built for that gap. The AI work platform where people and agents work side by side to deliver more together. Create your first Monday agent today at monday.com. Okay, there's a lot of green on your screen. Dow and S &P 500 are higher. The big winner here is NASDAQ, soaring as CoreWeave leads the tech rebound. You've got the NASDAQ up almost 2%, rising today on pace to snap a four-week losing streak, the longest slide since March.

25:10You're seeing there in the NASDAQ 100, trading back above its 200-day moving. And I would say for the markets, to go to the West Virginia theme, it's almost heaven today. I mean, it's wild and wonderful. It is almost heaven. But you heard Craig Johnson earlier who said, be careful these big moves because everybody gets short. They're betting against the stock market. You get a little taste of good news, Corweave. You got to cover the stock. Hey, look at Apple here, up almost 2%. Stones throw away from an all-time high. Anything above$3.5538 would be a new record, and we're at$3.5495. So that's like$0.46.

25:46Don't ask me to do math on the fly. Crypto showing some signs of life. Bitcoin trading back above 74 ,000 following this week's volatility up a percent or so. And crypto, we have the CEO of the largest Bitcoin holding company, Strategies, Feng Li, exclusively tomorrow at 2 p.m. Eastern. You don't want to miss that. All right, let's get now to Frank Collin with a CNBC News update. Frank. Good afternoon, Brian and Contessa. Republican Senator Josh Hawley is joining Democrats in calling for a nationwide moratorium on the construction of data centers. He's the first Senate Republican to back that effort.

26:16According to Politico, an anonymous Hawley spokesperson said he wants a ban in place until Congress can ensure taxpayers will not face higher utility bills because of data centers. Iran's security chief said today not even a single particle of enriched nuclear material will leave the country. He also said any new U.S. attacks will be met with targeting U.S. bases far away, including in Europe. He made those comments during a televised speech today after U.S. officials downplayed the need for additional military action against Iran. And the historic ocean liner, SS United States, is headed to its new home on the ocean floor.

26:50The 20th century ship, which holds an all-time transatlantic speed record for a passenger ship, is being sunk today and will become the world's largest artificial reef. It will double as a major diving attraction off the coast of the Florida panhandle. Brian, back over to you. I used to drive in Philadelphia, Frank. I don't know if you've been to Philadelphia, right? I've been to Philadelphia quite a few times, even the Navy Yard. And that's where it was sitting for like, what, 30 years? Just kind of rusting away. Now it'll be finding Nemo. Yeah, Navy are changing a lot. Speaking of things going on in Philadelphia, America's the best city.

27:21It's gotten fancy. So coming up, we're going to talk some oil, some energy, talking about big ships, shipping with RBC's Halima Croft and International Seaways. Lois Obrachie, that's next. You said ship?

27:37All right, big energy block here. Now, after dropping by nearly$20 per barrel, oil is back a bit higher right now. It's up just a touch. The Houthi terror group in Yemen continues to hit targets inside Saudi Arabia, even as the U.S. and Iran potentially get closer to a real peace deal. And we really sort of kind of mean it this time. Let's talk about all this with our friend Halima Croft, global head of commodity strategy, RBC Capital Markets, CNBC contributor. I don't, Halima, at this point, I don't know where we are because things seem to sort of kind of getting better with Iran, but now you've got Houthis continuing to attack Saudi Arabia, even as more oil flows.

28:14Where are we? I mean, Brian, are we sort of kind of near a deal, or are we basically stuck in the same stalemate? I mean, we don't seem yet to have resolution on the core issues, like uranium enrichment. The Iranians keep saying, like, they're not going to ship out the high-level uranium. They continue to say, you must pay us first before we stop firing on the ships. You pay us, you lift the blockade, and then we'll start allowing more ships through without firing on them. They keep saying essentially they want the June MOU fully enforced before they are reciprocal in terms of easing off the straits.

28:52So I don't know how much progress they've really made. There are lots of soundbites that get leaked to obscure publications in the Middle East saying we're close to a new deal. And then the Iranians come out and say, We're not even talking to you. Stop reporting this. So, again, I kind of feel like we're stuck in the same loop of basically, you know, I don't think I don't know if we're making any progress. I think we are. I think we are. Because to your point, Alima, what I'm hearing is the same as maybe some of the stuff you're hearing and reading, which is that Iran just keeps submitting the same series of demands.

29:24They're not negotiating. They're just saying the same thing over and over again. And I'm going to say this. The U.S. screwed up with that MOU. Did we? I mean, we screwed up. We put it in writing. And now Iran's like, well, put it in writing. It's your thing. They're basically saying you signed this. We want these terms enforced. And they're basically saying, like, we don't want cash on delivery. We want cash up front. And so they are sticking to their same position. So every time we get a report about a deal is close. The question I want to ask is, are there any signs that the Iranians have made any concessions?

29:58If they're sticking to their same line, it's really a question of, is President Trump going to capitulate to the Iranian demands? It doesn't look like he's prepared to do that. So we're in the kind of status quo. They fire on ships. We escort tankers. We wait for the blockade to do the work. And so I feel like we're just stuck in this status quo, which means that it's still you're going to have attacks on tankers. Saudi Arabia is going to continue to be targeted. And we don't have a diplomatic off-ramp. We may not have a hot war like we feared last week, but we're not in a normal situation. All right.

30:33What does that mean for investors? Well, again, I think part of the reason why we ran up so much in oil prices is there was a real genuine fear that we were going to have renewed kinetic hostilities between the U.S. and Iran. That's why you had the CEO of Exxon pull out of ADIPEC. and some news agencies pulled out of ADIPEC. There was real concern that we were going to see something after the midterms. When you didn't have missiles flying, people were like, OK, we're going to get a deal. If you're in this muddle through a situation, are we talking about sort of staying in the 90s or low 100s for Brent?

31:06Like, I think that is where you could land if we don't really have a tangible deal on the horizon. Well, quickly, you went to ADIPEC. I did not. I'm getting really tired of canceling flights to the Middle East, by the way. You think there's a chance the UAE is going to build a third pipeline? They're building a second one right now. Could they build a third? Well, I mean, that was the big talk of the whole Audi pack was investing in the just-in-case infrastructure. And the UAE and Saudi really talk about the fact that they built the pipelines that are being used now that are getting the crude to the market.

31:37So that's the big focus on new infrastructure projects. Halima Croft, look forward to seeing you on set next time, Halima. Thank you very much. All right. Speaking of oil and fuel, remember that ship filled with Russian diesel fuel that was supposed to unload in New York City four days ago? Well, that ship still no closer to New York. In fact, as we've been updating you nearly daily, the ship is just kind of floating, unmoving in the Atlantic Ocean now for a couple of days. And our friends at Kipler say the ship appears to no longer be heading to New York or maybe anywhere else in the United States.

32:08It is unclear, Contessa, what the final destination may be. The Russian diesel fuel ghost ship just floating in the Atlantic Ocean is kind of a cool story. The ship to nowhere. That's it. Yeah. Ship. That is bizarre. All right. Meanwhile, a lot of ships are still avoiding the Strait of Hormuz. Lois Zebrowski is president and CEO of International Seaways, ticker INSW. It owns or controls 73 ships across the globe, some of them super tankers. Lois, why aren't any of your ships traversing the Strait? So, you know, it's a daily assessment. And what I will say is that our ships have been earning more money than ever in the midst of all of this inefficiency in the world.

32:53And the situation we're in is just highlighting how important oil tankers are worldwide. More than 60 million barrels a day of oil on the water, and our ships are fully employed. Do those impressive profits change if the strait reopens? You know, interestingly, today, probably not as much as pre-war, but you probably have 14, 15 million barrels a day getting out of Straits of Hormuz. And you had 36 hits during October. So the Iranians are hitting basically a ship a day. Not that that's really being highlighted by, quite frankly, any of the parties. So your ships are not going through the Strait of Hormuz.

33:34Just too dangerous. You will not put them there. And a lot of companies will not put them there. But there are companies that will. Absolutely. Who's putting their ships and their crews at risk? Who's doing that? Well, you know, what I will say is, you know, we just stick to our knitting at Seaways. And, you know, we're doing a daily risk assessment. So, you know, we're looking at going out of Yenbu. We're looking at Fujaira, you know, some of the ports that are near. And of course, the Western Hemisphere has proven to be incredibly valuable with both North and South America putting out more oil than ever.

34:07So, you know, you have a lot of third parties that are willing to go inside. Yeah, it's kind of creaky old ships run by sketchy dudes that are willing to pay their cruise bonuses to make the run. That's not you guys. So kind of to contest this point, how much is this? It was kind of a sector of the economy that people didn't really pay attention to. How much of this is a good thing in terms of people realizing how important your ships, your crews, your captains are to keeping the global economy moving? No ships, no oil, no oil, no economy. So, you know, the world consumes over 100 million barrels per day of oil, including, you know, 60 million barrels moving on, you know, via the sea.

34:57Right. So we're like the silent pipeline of keeping the economy healthy. And you really see this is highlighted how critical we are to the, you know, to the world economy and to the resilience of your consumer. How are you navigating other geopolitical pressured areas, Ukraine with Russia, around Taiwan? Are you seeing other areas of the world where running a ship or not running a ship becomes dicey day by day? Absolutely. I mean, we made a decision as a publicly traded company that's located in New York City in the very beginning of the Russian war to not call Russia. And it's interesting. You talk about the diesel floating off the East Coast.

35:40to you. We understand two vessels have gone to Brazil. One has gone to the Med and the other one is just kind of floating around. Right. So you have a lot of people that are including the states that are angsty around. Hey, you know, we haven't imported a barrel of Russian oil in this country since the war started April, you know, 22. So, you know, these are very, which is probably why that ship is sitting there floating, because I said, and you don't have to answer this. Look, If you're the who wants to buy that oil, like if you're a U.S. company, are you going to buy Russian diesel fuel? The PR night?

36:14No way. You're going to cancel it. The ship's just there. It is just a flashing dot in the middle of the ocean. You know, I was looking up some of your ships because I'm a dork and I like to do that, Lois. They're all over the world. Like how much of do you think there's a permanent shift in some of the global oil supply chains? I saw one of your ships was in Angola. Right. It is right now in Angola. I think it's your biggest ship, actually. Yeah, well, I mean, we have 14 VLCCs, so 2 million barrels each, right? So those vessels are in high demand today. And, you know, you look at it and you say, okay, you know, the world is producing over 100 million barrels of oil today.

36:52And you really look at it and, okay, energy security is of paramount importance. And we're going to see, you know, a restoration of inventories once we have a cessation of hostilities. One more thing, and maybe I'm in the weeds because I cover the insurance part of this and the marine insurance. I was waiting for this. But one thing that strikes me about the Arabian Sea and these other ships that are traversing the Strait of Hormuz is that if they're a tanker and they get hit by Iran, there could be a massive oil leak, which causes a real climate fallout. Is that something that, you know, even around other areas that you think about, what are the risks in terms of not just the ship itself, but the cargo that you have on board?

37:40Absolutely. I mean, off of the UAE right now, there's an oil spill, right? So there's a slick exactly from a tanker that has been hit. So, you know, there's been over 25 seafarers killed. We think that there's about 35 tankers that have been disabled. I mean, you're talking about, you know, an industry where, you know, we don't have weapons on board. You know, we're just trying to move energy to the markets. And, you know, we're still it's still a situation of heightened hostility right now. Lois, it's great of you to join us. We really appreciate your insight. Thank you. Thank you so much. From an Iowa farm to running a giant oil tank.

38:20It's really interesting. When's the first time you saw an ocean? Yeah, when I took my first airplane ride to the Merchant Marine Academy when I was 17. You had never seen an ocean? No. You saw a river? Correct. I live near the Mississippi, so I say, well, there's a lot of barging there. But yeah, no. Your ships wouldn't fit on them, I don't think. You can't get up too far past New Orleans. New Orleans. Lois, thank you. Thank you so much, Brian. Still ahead. Don't give me the side eye, Brewer. All right, still ahead. AI stocks on the rebound. We just spoke with a number of CEOs of major utilities powering the data center build out.

38:58You're going to hear some of their takeaways next.

39:10All right. The big market story today is around CoreWeave and AI. Their results putting some calm back into investors around data center demand. So why are we running the power insider animation? because this is exactly what we spoke about with a number of utility CEOs at Monday's big EEI conference in Arizona. And I asked every single CEO the same simple question. Since Tuesday's election, do you, Mr. and Mrs. CEO, see any sign of power demand growth slowing? No, it doesn't. Exalign, because of where we operate, we've typically operated in blue states, some purple, but mostly blue. All of our governors were expected to win, and they did.

39:52We had one changeover in Pennsylvania where that state Senate went from Republican to Democrat. But at the end of the day, it doesn't change how we show up for our customers every day. And we've been advocating for the past several years. We need more supply. We need affordable pricing. And we're part of the solution. So we look forward to working with them. I know it's only been a week or so since the election. any change at all to Entergy's power demand estimates based on any election results? Certainly not at this point. Nothing? Nothing. Do you expect that to change? We're seeing incredible demand for traditional industrial growth as well as data centers.

40:35Those conversations are continuing on. The needs for the economy are no different. So the data center boom is not over? We don't believe it is, not in our service territory. Excellent. And Entergy are two of the biggest utilities in America. And the comments from Entergy are particularly important because Entergy is based in Louisiana. And that CEO, Drew Marsh, also told us that if there is any slowdown in power demand or data center growth in Texas, he would expect other states like Louisiana or Arkansas to welcome the new growth, the data centers and the tax revenues. meaning if Texas does slow down, some other states around it, including Oklahoma, will not.

41:14In other words, it's not all about Texas. This, by the way, the subject of this week's Power Insider newsletter. I also explain in detail why the governor of Texas may not have much power at all to stop or slow data center development. Yeah, controversial, maybe. Read about it when it's done. Katessa, I hope it's done tomorrow. I got to write it tonight. I've written a bunch. Wi-Fi on the plane was sketchy on the way back. So anyway, there's your QR code. Sign up today. All right. Coming up, why prediction markets could face CFTC problems, a real crackdown, what that means for the industry.

41:56Prediction markets under pressure and scrutiny intensifying in the wake of the midterm elections. Democratic Senator Elizabeth Warren and Representative Maxine Waters want more oversight, Congressman Ro Khanna is calling for a ban on sports prediction markets, calling it sports betting disguised as financial trading. Today at B20, the Chamber of Commerce Conference in Washington, D.C., Kalshi co-founder and CEO Tarek Mansoor worked to make the distinction between his platform and sportsbooks. One is a market that rewards information, the same way the stock market rewards information, and that information is useful for a lot of people.

42:31And another is a house that bans information. If you're a smart trader, if a card counter, if you're someone that's doing research, you get banned. And if you're someone that probably has like issues on addiction and so on and so forth, you get like, you know, fed predatory incentives and so on and so forth to keep going. And that different structure is really what drives the difference in regulatory framework. Meanwhile, the regulator, the CFTC, investigating whether Calci offered event contracts without proper approval, which Calci told us was basically a minor administrative oversight. CNBC and Calci, of course, do have a commercial relationship.

43:03But you're going to see, because of this groundswell and political change in Washington, D.C., a different kind of scrutiny. The head of American Gaming Association, who's been fighting against prediction markets and coaching on sports betting, says this is a huge opportunity for gambling and those industries. And I think it's worth watching at the state level, a state like Utah, which does not permit any kind of gambling going in and taking aim at Calci. Because you can use a prediction market in Utah, but not FanDuel or Daskings. That's exactly right. They're not subject to the same oversight.

43:40And there's big court cases probably heading to the Supreme Court about whether all of these parlays, these combos, is there really a financial hedge to unrelated athletic contracts? I just want someone to have a contract that says how many people are going to run for Democratic presidential candidate in 2028. Yeah. Maybe that already exists. How many do you think it's going to be? You'll have to go. Definitely Ro Khanna. Maybe 20. You know, we've seen dozens before, so we'll wait and see. Let's get a quick check on Bloom Energy. Bloom Energy, that stock up 15%. It's among the leaders in the S &P 500, AI, infrastructure, power stocks.

44:16They're all rebounding. I will say Bloom, of course, down 40 % from its recent highs. But at least today, on this Veterans Day, remember the bond market is closed. And a big thank you, by the way, to all of our veterans, including my father, out there. At least today, all these stocks are up and some up big. We're back right after this.

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