Introducing "Parker Gals": Meet Cass & Liz

0:00Well, at the end of that call, you told me, actually, I think I need to go get more experience. I need to go do cell size. I may have almost talked myself out of a job. You almost talked me out of moving you on to the next part of the process. I was like, she's doing amazing. This is great. And you were like, I don't think I'm ready, actually.

0:31Hi, everyone. I'm Cass Zeeble. And I'm Liz Hsu. And we are here in Parker Gale HQ in the podcast studio filming our first ever episode of Parker Gales. Woo! What is Parker Gales, Liz? Parker Gales, I think it's a little bit hard to distinguish when you say Gale. It is. And Gal because of the Midwestern accent. I know. You fix it for me. Yeah, Parker Gals is a segment where we plan to interview other women in private equity across the spectrum from associates to principals and beyond. And it hopefully is just a really fun way for us to uplift other women, get to know them, get to know their stories, and even meet people that neither of us have met before.

1:20How did this name come to be? so the name Parker Gal came from me not having an idea about what I could contribute to the podcast but I had a cool name idea because it was sitting right there it was too easy you know Parker Gals as a name and then Cass had this great idea of interviewing a bunch of women in private equity and she didn't have a name so we just combined the two together and that's how you do a group project, guys. That's how you do it. Yeah, I think Parker Gals is building on something that I think a lot of us here really believe in and do naturally. Here we have a couple of women at our firm, which is a whole separate thing, but we're perhaps, we have perhaps unique, amount of women for the size of our firm.

2:19And because of that, we continue to like seek out and build and be a place for community for women in the industry. We've hosted folks here, you know, every so often just to get women in the industry together to swap notes and to share war stories and to, you know, support each other. And I think this podcast for me was kind of a natural extension of the stuff that we are doing in real life. And my hope is to use this as a platform to extend that and to give women in their career also a chance to showcase and highlight the amazing stories that they have. And I think everybody kind of has some unique insight and value to bring.

3:07And I do believe in the win-win and this like abundance mindset of like, there is enough pie for everybody. So how can we uplift these voices? Our goal is to kind of test out some of our material and also give a bit more of our backgrounds. Hopefully you guys get to know a little bit about us and it'll be less scary for you guys to come on. So rude that we have to do it first. Somebody's got to do it. Might as well be us. So this will be a slightly different format than what we're hoping to do because we will do a little bit more introductory of us, of our roles, of how we got here. And then we're going to try to give people a flavor of what they should expect for the next few bits of the series that they'll see, which is kind of like the segments that we'd like to do, but we're going to test it out on ourselves, which is we call our segments Indications of Interest.

4:02We have a little bit of... Indication of Interest. Indication. Oh, yeah, sorry. I'm using the private equity term. You're using the real one. Indication of interests. Yes. To give people a flavor of our guests personally and their kind of personal lives before we get into the meat of kind of more career questions. And then we end with closing call. That's right. Closing call. Just some fun, fun tidbits. So we're going to, we're going to test this out. Cass, you're up first. Okay. This is, again, indication of interests. What is something that you can cook without looking at a recipe? Okay, so I will admit my husband does most of the dinner cooking in our home.

4:48I love that for us. I love that for us. I love that for us. He wasn't always this way. I will say here's a little tidbit for some women who might be in relationships with men who don't cook very much. Heavy encouragement, okay? Early on, it was like our second date. This man only cooked chicken, steak. He ate like Teddy Grahams, I think, and rice. Like that was it. Together? Maybe. I don't know. But he made us like fajitas on our second date. And I like, they were, he's not going to watch this. They were average at best. Okay. They weren't the best fajitas, but I was just like, this is one of the best meals I've ever had.

5:32And I really pumped the ego. And now he like cooks French food. Wow. Yeah. And is it good now? It's quite good now. Wow. I know. Good for you. Over a decade in the making. That's awesome. But heavy encouragement. I make eggs, as you know. I'm really good at making fast breakfast. So like I cook a lot of breakfast. I have a one and a four-year-old. So like weekends, it's like get that breakfast on the table very quickly. and the secret to the eggs is extra butter, more butter than you think. High butter to egg ratio. Yeah. It was on my first like three weeks into the job, I went on this company ski trip and it was like Nico, the other associate, hadn't started yet.

6:17So it was just me, Cass, Devin, Nori. He was very brave of you. And Cass was like, do you want eggs? I was like, sure, yes, of course. I'm like, I have never had somebody make me eggs. eggs before, but sure. And then I saw the butter and I was like, I have never made eggs with butter until this moment. And now guess what? I only make eggs with butter. Yeah. There's no other way. There's no other way now. There's no other way. Once you try it, you can never go back. 100%. I'm sorry that you had to witness how much butter, but now you know. And how about you? What's something that you can cook without looking at a recipe?

6:53Um, I am still, you know, coming into my adult self. So my, one of my favorite go-tos is still a remnant from college days, but it's kimchi fried rice. It's pretty good for college days. Yeah. I mean, it makes a bunch. You can eat it for the next like four days. Yep. And you can put whatever you've got in your fridge in it and it tastes great. So full proof. Full proof. I love that. I will now you're going to have to make I made eggs for you. Yes. It's only fair. Yes. Next time on the show. No. And then speaking of shows, what's your go to comfort show? So my go to show hands down is Gilmore Girls.

7:36I feel like I put that in my resume. Like, you know, the interest section at the bottom of interest and skills. Yeah. I went I went heavy on the interest light on the skills. Yeah. But I think the last one there was Gilmore Girls. So I'm committed. I'm a serial rewatcher and it's the rewatch value is just so incredibly high because they firstly talk so fast that you probably miss. You miss so much. You have to watch it five times through to just catch everything because you only get a fifth of it really. Yeah. And I saw this interview with Lauren Graham, who's like, who plays Lorelai. And she said it was kind of like, there's this like lyrical quality to like the script.

8:15Like there's high re-listen value because It's like, it's very like melodic, but. Oh, I like that. I know. It sounds better than just like, I can't get out of my comfort zone. Well, I have the same answer, which is so funny. We span, I don't know, over a decade between us and we have the same comfort show. And I am not a serial rewatcher. I won't rewatch pretty much anything. Like, I actually feel bad when I watch a series too fast because I'm like, it's over and it will never happen again because I just like can't stomach watching something over again. I will re-watch Gilmore Girls. I've re-watched it over five times.

8:50Oh yeah. I don't want to count. I don't want to share how many times. Yeah. My friend would tape it for me on like an actual cassette. Not cassette. The VHS. The VHS tape for me. I know what that is. You know. You know. I would have a friend record it for me literally like the next day bring the VHS tape and hand it to me and I would put it in my backpack and I would go. Like I couldn't miss an episode. That's probably how I got this job. That might have been one of the reasons that I double emailed you. Was like, she's got Gilmore Girls on her resume, so there's like something here. This is where we're going to differ a little bit from the regular show, because we're going to go a little bit into our history.

9:30I think it'd be interesting to hear you retell the story of how you ended up at Parker Gale, how you ended up in private equity, what drew you to it, and just kind of tell us about that. Awesome. I will say how times have changed. So my first episode on the PE Funcast, again, probably a decade ago, was not in 4K video on YouTube, thankfully, probably. But we were experimenting with different ways to record podcasts. And Devin and I downloaded an app on our phones, and we just had a phone call conversation. I think I was in like my third week on the job, so I had no idea what I was doing. At the time, we weren't in this space.

10:12we were like subleasing an office space. I was like in a small conference room on a phone, talking on an app to Devin, who was in an office in another room. So I had no facial cues. I had no, like I, I like said something at one point. Now people are going to go listen to this. I said something at one point where I was like, oh no, like, can we cut that out? And he was like, nope, we're keeping it in. And I was just like, what did I sign myself up for? I joined when Parker Gale, right after Parker Gale had kind of spun out from Chicago Growth Partners. They were looking for their first associate and they had just done their first two deals of the fund and they were still fundraising.

11:01And it was just very serendipitous. They did two deals without an associate? They did two deals with an associate at the time. ATP, now Varian. Wow. And One Plus, which ended up being renamed to Contelligent. But they had done those in September and October, and I joined in November because I think by then they were like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Like, what are we doing? We need somebody to monitor these and put in the quarterly evaluation numbers and all that fun stuff. Yeah, it was a little wild. I came from a non-traditional background and what that looks like for me was I didn't do investment banking.

11:40I came from due diligence working at a big accounting firm. I was at KPMG. You work very closely with companies that are getting acquired by private equity firms. So I did a lot of income statement, quality of earnings work, balance sheet work, networking capital work on behalf of private equity firms that were going to buy these businesses. But definitely not your traditional investment banking experience. And I, the interview process, I'd like to believe that if I interviewed with the current process that I'd still get the job years later, but I am glad that I don't have to prove that. You would, you would.

12:19Because the interview process for me was a definite, like, what it is for probably still a lot of firms, who you know. And I say serendipity and luck because I was just poking my head up to be like, what else can I do? I'm like three years into my role at KPMG. These are the types of jobs I'm interested in. And I happen to have some conversations with people who pointed me in the direction of like, oh, there's this firm that just is fundraising their first fund. And like, let me make an introduction. And I went out to lunch with two of the partners thinking that it was just like, oh, this is just like a networking lunch.

13:02It ended up being a two and a half hour lunch. Wow. Where at one point I was asked what my greatest weakness is, which I was not prepared for. Normal lunch behavior. Classic lunch behavior. And you know how it is. Like when you're early in your career, you're like not on your own timeline. And so thankfully, I was on a deal where my manager was on the 61st floor and I was on the 60th floor. Usually you're on the same floor as your manager. And he was too lazy to come down to my floor most of the time. So he would just email me instead of like swinging by and checking in on me, like blessed that this was the case.

13:49because like in any other deal environment, I probably would have been sitting next to or very close to my manager, but I still was like so stressed. I was trying to be so polite and I like put my phone down and I wasn't looking at my watch. But in my head, I was like, nobody's at a dentist appointment for two and a half hours. And luckily out of that came a lot of casual conversations. I met Ryan, I met Jim. And then I was actually at a, getting a beer with Ryan, with Jim and Devin. And Devin just was like, so you got the offer. And I was like, what do you, do you need me to do like a DCF? Like what?

14:29And he was just like, you could do that. It's fine. It's like, okay. And I was like shocked because that was just not the environment that I was expecting. I'm sure you probably have a similar feeling, but like, yeah, like you could just like do that. And I remember like calling my dad and being like, I got an offer to work for a private equity firm. And he was like, oh, well, why would you ever leave KPMG? My dad was a pretty hardcore accounting lifer for the first two decades of his career. And he was like, sorry, you are leaving a large employer, high reputation accounting firm to go hang out with these four partners who are maybe going to raise a first-time fund?

15:10And I'm like, they said they'd pay me. and like what I didn't realize at the time was we were probably a fourth of the way through the fundraise and uh I was I think the first employee technically on payroll but we made it baby we're on there you go um I mean did you know what private equity was when you were having lunch I did at that point okay I did at that point now I had interned in private equity um at another firm here in Chicago called Prairie Capital. And through this group that we could talk about, I could talk about at length, I'll try not to, called the Illinois Venture Capital Association, that like misnomer, it also covers private equity, not just venture capital.

15:56And they run an internship program every year where they are trying to fix the funnel problem. And they're specifically doing that by getting college undergraduates opportunities at PE and VC firms that are women and minorities. And so the year that I did that was 2011. And there were two of us. And now I think there's like classes of like 15, which is great. But on my way to that interview, I Googled what is private equity. Like I was on the Metro train coming into Chicago. Like, do I even know what this is that I'm interviewing for? And I literally like pulled it up like Google. Like, what is private equity again?

16:38And like, I'm just like reading it like, okay, this is, what is this? So when you were making the transition from KPMG into Parker Gale, like, was there like a particular reason why you ended up saying yes to Devin's like super casual job offer? I know, my dad was like, don't take that. I just, I trusted the vision. like and I felt at the time that it was different and I still do feel that that what Parker Gale has built culturally um I mean we're we're doing a podcast right now like that's a little bit different um it is different and it was like a just much more like values-led pitch it was exciting it was a chance to like kind of be at a startup and in tech yeah and in private equity all at once and I remember like they were asking me about like, we're setting our maternity leave policy.

17:37What do you think it should be? And I was 25 and I was like, this won't affect me. And I've had two kids since I've worked here. So it really did affect me. And so it was just like fun to be on the ground of something. I remember at the time thinking, hey, if this doesn't work out, what a fun ride it will be with like very people that like, I just really genuinely enjoyed working with. and I didn't obviously have the experience of working with them when I was interviewing, but just the sense that I got of what they were trying to do and build felt different. It just felt like a different pitch, and I was like, yeah, I'm in, but the long story short is I did the associate role for three years.

18:20I went to business school here in Chicago. I went to Booth, And then at Booth, I interned at other firms and tried to bifurcate the experience of what does it mean to just be an investing role and what does it mean to just be in an operations role? Because as an associate, you kind of get to see and do a little bit of both. Which I also think is actually unique to our firm. Like, as we'll probably uncover as I talk to other people, but like every firm does things so differently is what I've learned. And so, yeah, that totally makes sense. Like figuring out what even that is. Yes. When you're in lower middle market, like your companies, if you offer them help, are going to probably take it.

19:07So as an associate, you get pulled into a lot of stuff. I got pulled into plenty of stuff. So I was trying to figure out, I'm like, I kind of like that stuff. And so I did two internships that were very different flavors to try to understand during my time at business school what I liked. And I loved some of the operations stuff, actually. And I call it like I dated around at other firms. And then I, like, came back to see my ex-boyfriend. To see how he was doing, you know. And I actually went back to where we originally got lunch. I got drinks with two of the partners, you know, a year and a half into business school.

19:49And it was just like, it was kind of like this posturing of like, should I ask if I could do a role like that? Or like, maybe they'll ask me or like, are we, are we getting back together? Where's this going? Where's this going? So we were, you know, a drink or two deep feeling it. And I was about to get the liquid courage to be like, I really like the op stuff. and I think there's a role at Parker Gale that makes sense. And Ryan beat me to it. He was like— Always does. Always does. He's just— Ryan's thinking like— Like 20 steps ahead. I was going to say 10, but 20 is more accurate. He's always thinking like 20 steps ahead.

20:25So he— Until this past month, I also thought it was 10, and then I realized it was 20. It was 20. Well, now he's got AI under him, and he's just like— Yes. Could be 50 by the end of the month. Oh, man. Yeah. Yeah. So he made the first move, and he was like, Like, we were really thinking that you'd be really well suited to this, like, finance ops role. And I was like, I was thinking the same thing. And he, I didn't even realize it. Like, he came with, like, paper, like, my, like, job performance profile. And he, like, pulled it out. And he was like, we can just, we can talk about it later. But, like, here's what we were thinking.

21:00I was like, this isn't, I know. Prepared. Prepared. Printed. Printed. Always, always prepared. So I've been doing that for six years now. It is not what was originally on that performance profile. I mean, some of the things were. And I remember hilariously debating what was on that piece of paper because, like, over the years, it's just changed a lot, which is an episode for another time. Yes. We need to pull out that JD. We do. Point-by-point comparison. And just inspect, like, oh, Cass, you've never done that, actually. But, yeah. And so it's been a wild ride and adventure. and I still get to do all sorts of firm, fun things like recruiting.

21:43Yeah. Which leads to how we met. Yes. For recruiting, we're very formal, as you may guess. As you can tell from the story of how I got recruited, we've upped the formality a bit. And sometimes we actually do have a recruiter for the associate process. But the year that you and Nico were hired, we did not. And so from your perspective, what did it feel like to be bothered by us? I mean, yeah, I mean, similar to you, like I when I first started before this, I was at J.P. Morgan in the leverage finance team in Chicago. And it's very typical, at least like at this point in time for people who start in a banking role to like start recruiting the minute before they hit the desk.

22:29Like the minute day one, they're like recruiting and like looking around for other opportunities. And that was just never something that appealed to me. I just like, one, I just was like, I don't even know how to do this job. Like, how would I recruit for my next one? Which is a reasonable thing to think. Yes. But yeah, so I was, I kind of let that process pass me by. And I was like, let me just figure out if I can do this job that I have. And if I like it, if I don't like it. And I think with all jobs, it's kind of like, there's probably parts you like. and there's probably parts you don't like.

23:05So my goal in that, you know, two years was to figure out like, okay, which parts of finance do I enjoy? Which ones do I not like? And then kind of tailor my options from there. So I was similar to you just kind of coming up and starting to look around at that point in time. And I was kind of looking into a couple of different avenues, like based on just what other people in my group have done. And a few common exits were private credit, which is like the most directly applicable, you know, route, which is doing the exact same job, just at a different firm. And then second would be kind of like, you know, corporate finance type of roles within like a company.

23:48And then third, there were a few people who transitioned into private equity. And that jump always felt a little bit unintuitive to me. So that's where I started first because I was like, that's a little bit weird. Like it's not actually, you know, a lot of people go straight from sell side banking to the other side, which is why they're like, oh, I'm on the buy side now. I'm like, I was never involved on either side of this table. But yeah, so I think I was a little bit curious, like how they even made that transition and like, what kind of gaps you need to fill in terms of skill set and experience.

24:23So I was kind of just starting to, you know, coffee chat my friends and like other people at other firms. And I wasn't like specifically targeting like any particular city or firm or anything like that. I was kind of, again, playing a little bit of a broad process. I was like, maybe I'll apply for some sell-side banking jobs. Maybe I apply for some like internal JP Morgan jobs. And I got an inbound from Cass who was like sent this I think it was a six paragraph long email that was like feels true to me yes this is before AI I really committed to no it was it was like long yeah I remember it was long because it's longer than most emails that I get yeah and I was like oh this looks kind of like templatized like I feel like this is maybe just like a mass like blast or something that like I'm not even gonna bother like responding to because like I'm not qualified or whatever and then like a week later or something Cass replies like to herself and she's like we just had our Monday meeting like we really think you might be a good fit like totally understand if you don't want to talk but like just wanted to make sure you like actually don't want to talk and then I was like oh this is a person this is a person they had a Monday meeting this is a person and I was like, oh, let me reply because now I feel like a jerk.

25:49So I reply. I don't know if you even know this. Now without you doing your diligence because I had somebody reach out to me and say, Liz reached out to me to see if you were a real person. Somebody who was like a U Chicago undergrad who I went to school with was just like. I don't remember that. I did that. Yeah, you did that. You were like, let's just double check, which is good. I don't want to get scammed. Yeah, no, that's honestly solid intuition. on email. Try something else. But yeah, so Cass, you know, I responded to Cass' second email, and then we took like probably like an hour, a pretty long like intro call as well.

26:29I think I snuck into a little conference room or something. Just like they have these small little, you know, phone booth type rooms. Yeah, I was just like. Clearly there is something with Parker Gallen, initial conversations taking way too long. Yes. Yeah, and that first call ended up being, essentially an interview. And then, you know, you guys put me through to. Well, at the end of that call, you told me, actually, I think I need to go get more experience. I need to go do cell size. I may have almost talked myself out of a job. You almost talked me out of moving you on to the next part of the process.

27:02I was like, she's doing amazing. This is great. And you were like, I don't think I'm ready, actually. I was playing some kind of mind games, I guess. I think you were playing mind games with yourself. But it worked on me a little bit. That's so funny. Yeah. No, I don't know. I was like really feeling not ready because I was like doing like research and like learning how to model and do all this stuff on the side. And then I was like, well, I wouldn't be ready for like an interview. Like, so I was like, oh, maybe not. So we were talking, I think I was talking to Devin or Nori about you and the conversation we had.

27:38And I was like, you know, she was like thinking about going sell side. She wasn't really sure. She didn't think she was ready. I thought she seems like she has the experience. And I was like starting to discount you. And then I like stopped mid-sentence. I was like, oh, she's doing that thing that women do. I was like, oh, no, move around. It like hit me in the middle of like explaining it to somebody else. And I was like, oh, no, she's just not giving herself enough credit. Like she wants to be like 100 % match the job description in order to apply. and you were going to be there. So, but I literally remember like out loud and then being like, like this moment of like, oh no, like I know she's ready.

28:20We're moving her on. And then you killed it. And then Liz, for the folks at home, Liz, we have like a kind of, again, a little bit more rigorous. They learned their lesson from hiring me. Kind of take home model test, a, you know, a customer cleanup exercise. size with yes yeah uh and liz was like perfect score like just absolutely rocked it and this was before ai could do it uh the way that it probably could help now so if you have suggestions on how to tailor this let us know but you were able to even if somebody else did it for you like the way you just explained everything like you knew your stuff yeah i mean i think it was like you guys were the only of the interview processes i was in this was the only one that was like more than a couple hours.

29:09They were like, you have two days. I was like, two days? Two whole days? Two whole business days? What am I supposed to do with two days? I'm like, okay, that's like plenty of time, I think, to like somehow figure it out. It was just a more realistic, like we also realize that you all have day jobs and are busy and like you can cram this out from, you know, 7 p.m. to 11 p.m. maybe or whatever you need. But that's also just like a more realistic timeline of like what we would expect. Yes. I think like that was one of the signals, honestly, that I was like, okay, this is a place with like reasonable people who have reasonable expectations.

29:49And I was like, bar cleared. Like, you know, I just wanted to, I think like for, you know, people who are going through that process now, like how the interview process unfolds is actually like a huge indicator of like how you will actually feel when you're working there. Yeah, that's a hot tip. Yeah, and I think, like, throughout my interview process, like, it just felt very, like, reasonable the whole time. And, like, it was not, like, very high highs, very low lows. Like, it was just kind of like, okay, like, this is a task. I have a reasonable amount of time to do the task. And then you made a PowerPoint on top of everything else.

30:28Yeah, because I had two days. It was two whole days. Yeah. So it's, I think also, like, when you're coming from an analyst role, like your brain is like in deck mode. You're like, if I don't make a deck, I didn't finish the assignment. It doesn't exist. It doesn't exist unless there's a deck. Yeah. So yeah, I went a little overboard. I like pulled the Parker Gale logo from like, you know, that's because again, that's all you know how to do as an analyst, you know, PNG logos. Very good logo pulling skills. Logo pulling, yeah. And then, you know, did the color matching. I was a little bit extra.

31:00I like went to the website. You know. the eyedropper feature to like grab the official Parker Gale green. It was fun. So yeah. Has it lived up to expectations? Are we still, are we reasonable? I think very reasonable. And I think that's a good like goal to have in life. As things get crazy, like you need, yes, you know, breathe. It's very easy to get like very caught up in the emotions of a deal and the emotions of like, there's so many things that you're, even if a deal isn't going on, there's so many things going on in our companies at any given time. Not saying that there's often something on fire, but like, there's a chance that there's something on fire, but there are so many things that are out of our control too.

31:45Yeah. I think like that has continued to ring true. Like as I've worked here, I think like there will be moments where I'm like, you know, spinning my wheels at night and like especially early on, I would just like work until the late hours and like be like beating myself up that I couldn't figure something out. Then the next day I would come into the office. I would talk to Caroline or KG for literally two minutes and I would be like, oh, resolved. That was the thing. Oh, that's why. And then like move on. And they're always so just like, oh yeah, it's because of this. And I'm like, they are so reasonable.

32:23Oh, duh. But, like, you know, I didn't need to be doing all that, you know? Maybe you did. Maybe you did. Maybe I did. It's just a process, you know? But I think, like, there are still moments where it'll feel like things are very crazy and whatever. But, like, I think part of, you know, working for a team that you enjoy working with and who are reasonable is, like, when you actually get working on it together, it just kind of, like, resolves itself. You know, it doesn't require you to spin your wheels at night to, like, come up with the final wrapped in a bow, like, product before you can move on.

33:00So, yeah, I would say it's lived up. And in many other ways, which I think we can talk about as well at a later time. When the public cries for us to do this again. Exactly. Because they will be clamoring. So Liz, when people find out that you work in private equity, when you're out and about in the real world, what are the common reactions? That's a great question. I think it's kind of a range and it depends on what answer I've given them. So if they ask me, like, what do I do? Depending on, like, how long I want that conversation to go, I will sometimes just say, like, I work in finance. And then they're like, oh, okay, cool.

33:47And then we move on. If you really don't want them to talk to you, you say you work in accounting. That's my experience. Just, I work in accounting. And then they're like, oh, bye. Yeah, but then they're going to, like, quiz me. Yeah, okay. I tend to just say finance, and then they get bored, and then we move on. If it's somebody who like works in like consulting or banking or finance, then I feel like I give a more specific answer. And I'll be like, oh, I work at a small private equity firm in Chicago, like software, founder-owned businesses. I kind of give a lot of color generally because like the impression of private equity is that like you work at KKR or Apollo or whatever.

34:29And I'm like, there's no way I would last a day there. You would, but…

35:02stuff. We're not the same private equity that you read about on the New York Times that is making your Reformation dresses lower quality. Can't speak of that. We cannot speak of that. We just spoke of it. That's what people who know, they're like, Reformation is a tough one. It's a tough one. It's like, I'm not paying$300 for this anymore. You guys cuts costs. No, like, you know how they do sales, right? Like they used to not do sales. Now they do a bunch of sales. And then you're browsing the sales and I'm like, you just keep scrolling. And I'm like, the SKUs just keep going. They keep going.

35:33They keep going. So, no. Not environmentally friendly. We don't work on Reformation-type deals. No. Probably our businesses create software that you've never, you will never see or use or touch. And I kind of like that. Yes. And then people tend to get bored when you say B2B enterprise. Yes. Technology. Yes. Like, oh, okay. Oh, this is a good, This is a good place for me to put in my surprise that you're going to love. Surprise. So an example of one of our businesses that Devin and Jim have talked about before is HiBid, which Liz doesn't work on. No, I don't. But she should be on the website because I'm on the website.

36:17I like to do my diligence. Every week, Cass is like, I'm like, oh, that's a cute ring. Where'd you get that? HiBid. HiBid. I like to do my diligence post-close and just make sure that we're doing the product improvements and searchability improvements. So, HiBid, for those who have not frequented the website from the 1990s, it is steadily improving, is a portfolio company that we have that we've invested in that's a marketplace for auctioneers. So, think of eBay, but instead of me buying from a person, I'm buying on an auction online. They also have a software solution for auctions to run in person.

36:56And I am not a bidding power user. However, I like to test it out from time to time. And last week, I tested it out. And I was like, if I win this, I'm going to give it to Liz. And I won it. And I don't know if you told me about this. Tell me about, do you have any nice sunglasses? No. You don't. I don't. Why don't you have nice sunglasses? Because I keep losing my cheap ones, and I don't feel I deserve nice ones. So it's, you know, I got it for a really good price. Oh, my God. But I think they're pretty good. Ooh. I know. Damn. So we're going to have to get a try on. Damn. I know. I'm, like, always on Facebook Marketplace.

37:51you should be on high bid you gotta be on high bid oh my gosh I have tips and tricks for those shoot me an email although I don't want competition so I'll be doing the rest of the podcast like this naturally they're perfect alright done so we invest in businesses like high bid thank you very much I won't lose these I got a good deal. You can lose them. Back to you, Cass. What is something you figured out recently that you wish you had learned earlier? Recently, I don't know why this has been a recent discovery, but it has. I feel like coming back from my first maternity leave, I learned a lot in the first few years in this role afterwards words about how to prioritize and things that I can and cannot control.

38:52And I kind of probably over-indexed on like letting go of things that I could not control. And I think in 2026, what I've started to realize is that like, there are actually a lot of things that I could put into my control. And I don't mean to completely like over-correct from that learning. I think it was healthy. but I also think there are instances where in my life I'm like waiting and especially in my career when I'm waiting for somebody to just do something I don't know who this mystical person is but I'm like oh it would be really nice if this happened I'll give you an example so in our portfolio we used to have somebody who spearheaded leadership and development across our companies and I loved it because it was, we help companies often run a nine box process where you're kind of going through an organization and you're seeing who you have and who's really high performing talent.

39:50And what we used to be able to say is like, oh, we have this leadership and development program for people who are rock stars at your companies. And I'll, the last like year or two, I've been helping with doing nine boxes and I'm like, yeah, we, we used to do that. And I don't know what I I was waiting for somebody to come in one day in the office and say, like, yeah, we're going to reboot it. And then I realized, like, no one's going to do that except for me if I want it to be done. And so I, you know, recently went into Devin's office and talked to a couple other people about it here. Like, we should reboot that.

40:27And it was like, yeah, absolutely. Go do it. And so I think there are things like that. I mean, I think this podcast is also a great example. Like I would love it if more women were on podcasts in general. I would love it if more private equity women were on podcasts. I would love it if we featured more women. Oh, wait, like that's something that we can control. And time is a limited and scarce resource. But if there's something that you want, I've kind of like rebalanced towards, I'm just going to do it. I'm going to like prioritize those things. And even if it's out of like core normal day job, like why can't I add that to my repertoire?

41:08Nike said that. Just do it. I'm the first one to come up with it. Nike once said. Nike once said. Just do it. Yeah. Said Cass. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Well, we could talk forever, which we will when people are clamoring for us to come back. Of course. but instead of telling all of our life stories and all of our tales I think we're gonna end on our closing call segment yes so Cass what is your go-to karaoke song? I love karaoke it's like a dirty little secret that it's not so secret because I tell everybody because I want to convince people to do it with me so let me just set the record straight what do you mean by karaoke also?

41:53because karaoke in Asia is like a whole different, what do you mean by karaoke? I have never done karaoke in that kind of way. And I love, and I would love that. I would love, so. Yes. Is it like a bar? I mean a bar. Okay, okay. And I mean like questionable like atmosphere. Right, okay. There's usually like two or three people who like are frequenters who are really good. I, for being somebody who loves karaoke, am horrible. But I love it. I'm not a good singer. I don't have a great voice. I just— Fake news. I enjoy— I enjoy— You like getting up there and singing for people? Well, I like the, like, community of, like, picking a good song and, like, people joining you in it.

42:41And, like— So I usually do Dolly Parton 9 to 5 because it gets people excited. Yes. That's great. I love that one. Yeah. How about you? What's yours? Mine is Before He Cheats by Carrie Underwood. That's a great one. Do you get involved? Like, do you get animated? So the reason why it's my favorite is because one time I hosted a karaoke birthday party in college at my apartment. Wow. And then one of my friends, Angie, if you're out there, like, did this crazy rendition. Yes. It was like— All over. All over. Hair flipping. Yes. You know, it was quite the performance. That's what should be done. And then ever since then, I'm like, I can't not.

43:23That's my go-to. I can't. And that's a good crowd pleaser. And like people get into it with you. It's in the perfect belting range. Oh. You know? Yeah. You know? Wow. Anyways. Probably not a good theme song. Probably not. But we can also ask Carrie. We'll have our people ask Carrie's people. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. We'll be in touch, Carrie. Amazing. And then if you weren't in private equity, what would you be doing? there's like the fun answer and then there's like the realistic answer realistically I'd probably be in another corporate job uh doing something very similar yeah um like corp dev I don't know I don't know what I can do you know like the joke is that like Liz is not a flight risk is what I'm hearing like we've not we've all like not done real jobs you You know what I mean?

44:18Like, I—so I don't know. I don't know what I would do yet. I'm taking ideas. Yeah. What's your fun answer? I like bifurcating with a fun answer. That's nice. Yeah. Fun answer, I think I would just, like— this is going to be a basic Gen Z answer, but, like, I'd have a little cafe that's also a bookshop. Oh, yeah. That's also on the side of a, you know, tea farm. That's—that's—that was my answer when I was in my 20s. Dude, running cafes is hard freaking work. Yeah. So that's why it's like my fake answer because I know I'm never going to do that. If you actually did it, you would be like, oh. They're up there at like 5 a.m., 4 a.m.

44:57Yeah. You know, I've watched these like vlogs of like bakers. Yeah. Oh, my God. I can't. Yeah. I know. Kudos. And like I would go out of business because I'd be like, it opens at 9. They're up at 2 a.m. Yeah. It opens at 9 and everybody's already at work. We open at 1 p.m. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. I had the same. I lived with two girls in my 20s and we would, somebody would come home after a really hard day and we'd be like, well, one day we're just going to all quit our jobs. I'll run the cafe. You do the yoga studio next door. And like you do this part. We had like the whole thing and we never did it.

45:36We'll see. We'll see. But yeah, I agree. Like if you actually play it out, you're like, oh. If I play it out and I run the math, I'm like, oh, I don't know if, I don't know if I want to do that. I would rather frequent the cafe. We're nine to five. We're nine to five. Yeah. And what about you? For me, actually, when I came back into this role with the, you know, like boyfriend, you know, ex-boyfriend visit, will she, won't she, part of negotiating, coming back to the role or not negotiating, but like my discussion was like, if I didn't do this, I probably wouldn't do this at another private equity firm.

46:11And so I probably would either go do something search fundy or I'd go work for a company that is private equity backed because apparently I don't want to work a nine to five. No, I like and like see that flavor from the inside. And, you know, maybe I'd have less imposter syndrome of me constantly working with CFOs, telling them how to do their jobs if I attempted to do their jobs. But I kind of like just where I'm at. But I definitely would probably try my hand at that or running a really small business would be very. I can see that. Yeah, I think. And then I think my fun answer would be, I like the idea of writing a novel.

46:55But to actually do it, it's one of those things. You also got to lock in. You got to lock in. Yeah. So I think I'd be one of the people who just like goes to a cafe to pretend to write. and like I'm just constantly talking about my book for about a decade. I need like some trust fund money in order to do this. Oh, all the answers change if there's a trust fund involved. Right. So this was really fun today. Yes. I hope you had fun. I had fun. I had fun. I think our hope for this whole series and whole podcast is to like have a good time, have fun, get to showcase people and their careers. and we got to, you know, try a little bit out on ourselves, probably more to come.

47:42So I guess our ask for people is, hey, if you know any women in private equity who would be, who would love to come on, we'd love to chat with you. Yes. Liz, what do you think? Who are you looking for? I'm looking for other early career associates, primarily maybe senior associates who work at private equity firms along any, anywhere in the, you know. And you don't have to be in Chicago. Yes, we have a lovely remote recording setup. We can do it from wherever you are. But yeah, I think it would be really cool. I mean, I was looking through my own like list of people and I'm like, I don't, I think this is a pretty like sad little list I've got here.

48:27Like we need to, we need to do better. It would be, I think I'm excited at the idea of building the network more and like. It's like as we do it. meeting people and hearing their stories and people that I've never met before. So yeah, we'd love to hear from you.