Scooter Braun: "I Let It Burn"

31:34And right down the street in the townhouse is where I put Justin and his mom. And it was like this makeshift crew of like us trying to make it. Okay, so I'm sorry. It was my mistake. You're right. I will forgive you. Justin was not your first client, but I want to talk about your ride with him. I don't think we've seen fandom like that since the Beatles. That was really wild. Why are you laughing? I'm laughing because of Paul McCartney. Yeah. I think it was like the first or second Grammys we ever went to. He like saw me in the hallway. I'll never forget this. And he goes, you're Scooter, right?

32:01And I was like, yeah. And he goes, I'm one of the only people in the world who knows what you're going through right now. And for me, I was so excited because I share a birthday with Paul McCartney. And when I got to tell him we share a birthday, for me, that's incredibly exciting to share a birthday with Paul McCartney. Turns out, didn't really excite him that he shared a birthday with me. He kind of was like, that's nice. I can't imagine why. I don't think he's walking around like, I want to tell Scooter we share a birthday. So I was like, oh, yeah, I guess the other way it's not really as exciting.

32:26But I think that's great because that was your second Grammy. So it was still all new and exciting to you. By the way, as long as I'm seeing it through the eyes of someone who's experiencing it the first time, it's always fun for me. There's videos all over the Internet of you guys running around giving out tickets to people who either couldn't get tickets, couldn't afford tickets. And you hand them front row seats. They're crying. You guys donated a dollar from every ticket sold on Justin's Believe Tour to support Pencils of Promise. During the Justice World Tour, Bieber launched the Justice in Action initiative.

32:59He's the top recording artist for granting wishes for Make-A-Wish. Correct. When I think of philanthropic musicians, I always think of Dolly Parton. But I'm not sure I've seen a young person do it on that scale. What about the giveback was so important to you guys? I don't think you get the rest without it. You know, my grandparents who say, if your cup is being filled with water by God, you better start pouring it out of the cups before it just makes a mess and spills all over the place. If we keep getting that energy, we have to share it. And that was always something important to my mother.

33:32It was important within my culture. It's called tzedakah, just giving and charity. And it's biblical. Like it literally says, you know, in the Torah, in the Bible, it literally says when getting your crops, you're supposed to leave the field at the end untouched. so people can come in and get some of the crops. Right. And I'm a very firm believer in that. And I'm very grateful that Justin and Ariana and Demi and every, all these artists, Jay Bolvin, all these artists I've gotten to work with over the years, all of them said yes. And we brought in Shauna Knapp, who now runs our family foundation, but she's always run philanthropic and still does for most of the artists I've worked with and these families.

34:14And she's just absolutely amazing. And, you know, our job is to to make it and her job is to give it away. And that's just something really amazing. So I'm really grateful to all of the artists who signed up to do those incredible acts. I'm grateful to Justin for how many wishes he made over those tours and how many kids he made happy. And, you know, now, like, I'm very fortunate. I get to serve on the national board of Make-A-Wish. And whenever I go to a board meeting, Leslie, our CEO, who's incredible, I always tell her these board meetings, I benefit more than, you know, than the kids. because getting to hear the stories, getting to witness these wishes fills me up.

34:49And the greatest thing you can do is give because it's like, I promise you, you make another dollar, you're going to be looking for more and trying to find out how to be happy. You give something, you're going to get closer to that happiness. I think now you see Chance the Rapper, he gave a million dollars to the Chicago public school system. Taylor Swift would like give people their college education, their tuition. Do you think it's fair to say that you guys changed the culture of pop stardom and geared it a little bit more towards philanthropy? Look, that's a really beautiful thing to say. But I think the civil rights movement was paid for by Sidney Poitier and people like him.

35:30I think that artists throughout history have stepped up to help others. I don't think that started with us. I think we were inspired by the people before us. You've had time away from that part of your life. What do you look back on and feel the most joy about? Well, I also didn't know an adult life was like this. I've been managing since I was 19 and like full time since I was 19, like two phones, answering every phone call. So like the last two and a half years not managing because I announced it was, I guess, a year and a half ago, the 23 years. But it's really been two and a half years since I made this decision.

36:04I didn't know you could have like a weekend. I didn't know you could actually like binge watch an entire series on Netflix. Yeah, it's epic. Like it's I'm loving it. And I'm still like I got the hunger again to go do other stuff. And but it but it's been really nice to be so present with my children and be so present with my friends. And my friends talk to me about it. They're like, you use some of these skills to like make sure we're all good at stagecoach or if we go to Coachella or something like that. But like used to use these skills in other ways and it's kind of fun for you to use them for us and it's been really nice when I look back at the career it's a lot of small moments and then really big philanthropic moments okay it's it's like a little moment on a road trip or being in a restaurant in you know Europe on a promo trip when we were first starting and having laughs with the original crew it's you know watching marcus mumford come out at the manchester show and do the moment of silence and seeing 65 000 people completely silent yeah you know when you didn't even know if they were going to show up because of you know acts of terror it's it's little things like backyard concerts that no one will ever see you know with a guitar being passed around a fire pit it's it's all the things that made all the nonsense worth it you know all the things that make me happy when I look back I would have done for free and being able to tell the stories in private settings when people ask or sometimes that's the best moment because you take it for granted you almost act like you know you're feeling the injuries of it sometimes and you don't realize is how many great things came from it and how many beautiful moments and how many experiences.

37:53And honestly, it's just a lot of love. Like you're looking back, even like being on the road in the beginning and like pulling into Walmart at two o 'clock in the morning and the things that you'll see in a Walmart at two o 'clock in the morning in the middle of America, epic, epic. Do you have any regrets about that time? I think everything happens exactly the way it should. however i don't want to use mental health as a crutch because i think too many times people do that yeah i think people say oh mental health mental health it's almost like they don't want any adversity in their life and i don't think unless you take responsibility for your life you actually learn or grow but i do think the regret i have is not understanding taking self work time for both myself and encouraging it for the people I work with I think we all could have awaited a lot of pain I think we were so young that we all move so fast that we we didn't know you know and by I didn't figure that part I mean you're moving so fast and you're you're you're having all this success and you're not realizing the toll it could take on you long term of of not being present completely to the moment of all the pressures that come with it that you're not prepared for when they finally hit and I think understanding now at this age the importance of one to two weeks a year where you really take the time to go inward and build a foundation for yourself so when those waves come you can swim through them I didn't understand that lesson until I was older and I had to deal with hard things and I wish I knew it earlier and I would have been able to encourage it for everyone I was working with as well.

39:36That makes sense. So you pluck someone from Canada off of YouTube. You guys have this insane ride together. And then the working relationship has since come to an end. When did you guys know it was the end of that relationship? Because to me, it must sort of be like, like an intimate partner, like you just wake up one day and feel it like it's over or was it a slow roll I just think listen a lot of things happened and I think over time you know each one of us is making decisions for our own personal life and sometimes you drift sometimes a lot of people get in between sometimes you know I think the story's not done not in a working relationship but I think that's what happens with relationships like that, they ebb and they flow and they go up and down.

40:27And sometimes they go in one direction, sometimes they go another, but you always keep your heart open to the fact that that's family and it goes up and down and you have each other's back in the end. And I think that, you know, for me, my life went a certain direction where I was done managing and I wanted something else for my life. And I think his life went a certain direction where he was ready to really control his own destiny. And I think both are appropriate. And I respect completely, you know, that he is his own man now and that that, you know, he wants to build his career moving forward the way he sees fit.

41:06And he should. Same way, I respect the fact that I want to build my life a certain way moving forward. And I think you do so with love and respect. And you don't really sometimes you it's, you know, with other people, it was like, okay, this is the day and you point to it and other times you realize it just gets there one day and I think you treat both with respect. Was it tough? At times but like I said I feel like everything happens in the timing it should. You know the stuff that I was dealing with in my personal life was much tougher. You know divorce with kids I wouldn't wish on your worst enemy even with someone like my ex who we we did with such respect for each other.

41:46But I don't think stories end the way you're describing. I think they're chapters, you know, and real relationships, you know, it's just you're in a different chapter, you're each at a different point in your life, and sometimes it comes together. It's like a good friend, you know what I mean? Like, sometimes you could be, ah, other times you could be like, oh, I've talked to you in years, you pick it up like that. You know, it's just, I don't think, I think the only thing that's definitively ending is a lifetime. You know, so the rest of it is you never know. Well, the way you're describing it makes it seem like you're hopeful that it'll come back together.

42:24Is that true? Not in a business way. Right. I said I'm hopeful in the fact of, like, he's not done, and I'm not done cheering for him. You guys created such a strong fan base, and recently his fans have been concerned about his health. People are speculating. USA Today said Justin Bieber's crashing out. there's videos of him at Coachella where fans raise concern about his appearance. What goes through your mind when you hear me say that or see those videos? That people should, if they really respect him, they should leave him and his family alone. I think he has a newborn child. I think he's married.

42:58I think that that life is not easy. And if they really did care, they would give him an opportunity to be a human being. yeah there was a moment we talked about this a little bit earlier but there was a moment when you yourself made headlines last year we repeatedly saw these headlines and it made it seemed like things were leaking where either an artist on your roster was coming out or leaking that they were leaving your management company and it seemed as though you were just taking hit after hit yeah how did it feel at that point because you mentioned you were under nda so you couldn't say anything Well, I also had a dream so I couldn't say anything.

43:35I was under 88, but my publicist for our company could have said, hey, that's not true, but I wouldn't let her. Why? Because I had a dream. What? Yeah, I had a dream. Can you share? Yeah. I'm not going to go into names, but one of my biggest clients came to me and said that they wanted to spread their wings and do something different. But I also knew that that was appropriate at the time because I felt the same way for quite some time, but I was too afraid to say it out loud because I was too afraid of who am I without them. okay so when this happened it was almost a catalyst for me realizing like it's now and I was on a vacation with my best friends who really in my divorce picked me up and I had never done like a boys trip in my entire life my entire adult life like this was the first one and I took all of them and like we went to Europe and I took them on a trip and like I'm talking he's gonna love this because I'm staying in the pocket like I got a buddy Paul Brown from Bridgeport he loves when I say his name.

44:30And, you know, Mike and Jay and Boek and, like, you know, all these guys who, like, came to this trip. Dave, Usher joined because we've adopted him into the childhood group. But some of these guys had never been to Europe. And, like, I was like, I'm taking you guys because you were there for me and I want to do something for you. And it was one of the greatest trips of my life, other than being with my children. And during this trip, this artist said this to me, that maybe we should change something. And I realized, I'm like, actually, they're right. Like, I've been avoiding this for quite some time.

45:00And I went and I actually took a nap. And I had a very vivid dream. And I have a tattoo on the back of my arm about this dream. What does the tattoo say? It's not what it says. It is a man standing in a giant flame. And the flame cannot touch him. And inside of him is the full universe. And basically what the dream said to me is, you are trying to navigate the perfect ending. and if you do that you're going to get slapped in the face because that's not what we want for you you have to pull the band-aid you have to stop managing and do what you know you should have done for quite some time and then you have to go silent if you do that i will let you have the rest of this 10-day vacation no one will interrupt which has never happened in my entire career and you will have the best time of your life and it'll show you what your life could be on the other side but on the final day all hell is going to break loose and everyone's going to say they all left you and people are going to completely misunderstand this whole thing so i wake up it's vivid and i tell my best friend jay williams who's on the trip and jay's like dude no one cares your manager it's not going to happen like that and i was like i'm telling you so we the rest of the trip is amazing no one bothers i make the calls that day yeah i'm no longer managing it's done all the clients know i've like had the phone i spent a whole day making calls the trip is incredible best trip of my life loved by my friends loving on my friends it was a beautiful beautiful trip it's one of the greatest trips all of us joke around will ever have okay the final day we're flying home and my phone just starts to go and literally all hell is breaking loose the press is saying every client's leaving me people are making t-shirts overheard la i was managed by scooter brawn and i left him like it was crazy and the publicist is calling me being like we We gotta respond, we gotta, and I said, you can't.

46:50Because if I do, then I'm gonna get in more trouble. I'm gonna get slapped. I had this dream and they're like, what are you talking about? I'm like, you have to let it go. It's gonna last for a week or two and then it's gonna disappear. And they're like, no, we need to say something, we need to say something. And sure enough, I stood in the fire. It didn't touch me. It all burned down around me. All my worst fears of what would happen if I stopped managing took place. And then after two weeks, it went away and it wasn't that bad. And the dream was real and it sounds crazy and I've actually never told that story publicly, but that's why I didn't respond it wasn't even about an indie I couldn't write 23 years for another year because we had to finish a lot of the contracts because I keep like lots of different reasons right but responding hey this isn't true I just couldn't because of this dream and then I went and got the tattoo because of it and have you ever listened to a dream before or this was the first you have yeah yeah and dreams have guided me in my life a bunch of times really yeah when they're that vivid yeah I think I think yeah I think you should since you were a little kid yeah sometimes they're daydreams sometimes they're this but that was really really vivid and it sucked because it was against everything I wanted to do and it was like it was hard and it wasn't fun and it wasn't like hey we're gonna you know this is gonna be an easy dream for you we're asking you to do something completely out of your character you have to let go you're not allowed to manipulate this you're not allowed to try and control this you have to let go and let it burn and that was really difficult but the crazier it got and the more people talked yeah the more conviction I had that the dream was true so it was like the more people said yeah and the more out of hand I mean they were like Carly Rae Jepsen left Scooter Braun I didn't manage Carly in like five years Carly's calling me like what am I having to do with this I'm like I don't know like you know Idina Menzel I'm like it was starting to get crazy people I hadn't managed recently Right.

48:37And and the crazier it got, the more I was like, God is good and it is real and like trust. So for the record, your clients did not leave you. One did. But the rest didn't. You left your clients. No, not that I left my clients. We had an honest conversation about really where I had been for quite some time and some were like, what does this mean? And will you still help? And this, that and the other but you know for the record I don't ever want to ditch this I didn't leave anybody we left each other it was time okay that's a wild dream did you I think I think the reason is also crazy because no one could imagine that like I would want that you know like no one imagined like when you're in that position that you actually don't want to do that job anymore yeah but you know who wasn't surprised every one of my close friends okay they no one checked on me because when they saw it, they've known for years how I felt.

49:34So they understood, but I didn't leave anybody. Those are the greatest people to work with in the world, like the most talented people in the world. It was just time. Did you ever feel betrayed by a client? Yeah. And I'm sure they felt betrayed by me. You know, I don't want to, I think it's easy to point fingers at someone else and say, you did me dirty. You know, people hurt people, hurt people. You know, and I'm sure like when people have heard things over the years and misconstrued or someone gets in their ear, you know, they can feel, oh, he did this or he did that. Shit, the internet thinks I'm like all powerful, like, and I can do all kinds of things I have nothing to do with.

50:10But I think I try to have empathy in every situation because I felt betrayed before. I try to imagine if they're acting that way, probably they're feeling the same way somehow. And I think it's just easier to not hold on to that energy. You managed Kanye West for a stint and... A little while. How long? I think it was like two, three years. So your grandparents are Holocaust survivors. You stand up for Jewish people around the world. And Kanye West is now an anti-Semite and self-proclaimed Nazi. I'm curious what it feels like to have tried to help guide someone who now stands in opposition of so many of your deepest values.

50:53You know, the last time he spoke about me, he actually, like, he did a Charlemagne interview, and there's like a clip of it, and he talked about the relationship we had where I helped him. And he actually says, like, this Jewish man helped me because two of my brothers are black. And he was talking about my relationship, my brothers allowed me to have an understanding on how to talk to a black man because I have family that's black. And he was saying how I helped him over the years. And then three, four years later, the narrative that you're discussing started. I don't know him anymore. And I think the person that I knew wasn't someone who says those things.

51:32And I think sometimes the hardest thing to do with someone you care about is more than them while they're still here. And for me, the person that I knew is not the person that I'm seeing. So I don't have a relationship anymore. And I'd rather stand proudly in who I am and who my people are and be gracious and kind to all people than be a part of that. So I don't have any ill will. I have no interest in turning into the monster that people, you know, with anti-Semitism or hate want you to be. I'd rather be someone who is focused on positivity and being damn proud of who I am and who my grandparents were and who my people are and not fall for this narrative that I'm seeing all too prevalent since October 7th.

52:21And that's why I'm not scared or interested in talking about anti-Semitism as much as I am in talking about what a beautiful, kind and loving people we are. And it is to be a Jewish person of Jewish faith and Jewish culture. And I'd rather tell someone instead of like don't say that about me I'd rather say come to Shabbat and see who we are so you know I think he can be reached though I don't know and I don't know him and I think right now I have three beautiful kids that need a dad to focus on them and make sure they're prepared and strong in this world and that's gonna be my focus does any part of you ever wish that you didn't manage any of these people no I love I loved my life and I think my life has been like almost like this weird Forrest Gump journey of like how the hell did I get in that situation?

53:14I mean I got to like travel the world with Justin with Ariana but also with like Psy doing Gangnam style and like Harley Ray seeing Call Me Maybe and The Wanted doing Glad You Came and seeing Tori Kelly sing at a coffee shop to winning Grammys to you know Dan and Shay like and then all the different things so many different wild stories and artists and tech company like it's just all these weird situations I found myself in over the years and still find myself in and I always say like when you say do not wish you manage them I always think of do you remember Carl Lewis he won the gold medal for the U.S.

53:49he was like the fastest man in the world yeah and we were kids me and my brother Adam we were in an airport and we were probably like seven and five or like eight and six and Carl Lewis had just won the gold medal and he was in the airport and my dad pointed it out and me and my brother kept walking and then running past him and then letting him pass us and then we'd run past him and we were like we're the fastest guy in the world and there was one time where he kind of like looked at us and he made a move to like sprint and we like all giggled i'm 43 years old i have never forgot that moment and i said to chris paul who's an amazing point guard and an amazing friend i said to him one time i said you know what chris the coolest part about our lives now is that our every day is someone else's forever you know and that things that happen to us on a daily basis is that story that little kid remembered at 43 years old and as long as i don't take that for granted how cool is that and like that job afforded me all those memories so i love it if you had to throw like one fish back into the ocean though one fish back into the ocean this is gonna be fun if i had to throw one fish back into the ocean You're saying like one client?

55:00Yeah, like one client Honestly, I've never even thought of this But actually like Every experience was worth it So if people didn't know you from your work With all these artists like Bieber and Ariana They definitely know you from the Taylor Swift saga What happened? Started back in 2019 And I think we get quotes here and there Around the internet But we never really get the full story from you From your perspective, what happened? look for me it was six years ago I think like going backwards and like revisiting this is a waste of time I think that I I just assume you know since then there have been more deep dives but I think people cared less and less as in the years so I think a lot of the facts are out there now if people actually choose to go look at them but I always choose to think like the only thing I didn't appreciate is it was so public without an understanding of actually what was going on.

55:59But I think once you do that, it's hard to put it back in the box. But I also think that, you know, like when Taylor says that she wasn't offered the Masters, the reason I was under NDA was because we were in negotiations to sell it back to her. I just choose to believe her that maybe they didn't tell her. Who's they? Her team. Like maybe her team didn't tell her, didn't understand the negotiations. But But the thing, you know, for me, the only thing that I really regret is that it's easy to have a monster if you never meet them. And Taylor and I have only met three times in our life. I think at that point we hadn't seen each other in two, three years.

56:34I was managing people she wasn't a fan of. And she probably saw my name come up and was like, I don't like those people, so I don't like him. But, you know, we never had an opportunity to sit in front of each other and actually have a conversation to this day. And I think that, you know, most of the time when people actually sit in front of each other, the monster isn't real. That there's an understanding, that there's a healing, you know, that, you know, people can have a conversation. And because when I was asking for that, it just never happened. It really awry. And I chose to not say much.

57:04But the cool part is, if you actually pay attention, everybody in the end won. What do you mean? Well, yes, she could have bought them back and that could have been part of the victory. But I don't, I choose to think her team maybe didn't tell her. But like we ended up when they turned it down, we ended up selling it to someone else because she didn't want us to have it. We did very well in that sale because we bought it at a really great price and the value of Masters went up. And the thesis when I sold it was she had announced she was going to do re-records. And if you understand music, the value went up for Masters because Spotify and streamers created a longer decay than buying just CDs.

57:45So it's like people would listen to them more. so there's a longer decay but it's still decaying but when she re-records all ships rise in a world of streaming so people were going on and they were a being them they were listening to see how much they sounded like so she did incredibly well and basically had the biggest moment of her career reinvigorating her career with each one it was brilliant on her part but also each time she released one you saw a spike in the original catalog and that's how we were able to tell okay if she doesn't want them this is still a really great asset and we actually created an earn out we did every one of our earn outs and we were right so funny enough everyone involved in the saga from a business standpoint one she's the biggest she's ever been biggest artist of all time we did really well with the asset the people who bought the asset did really well because of those spikes the only thing that i'm sad about is that's a great example where everybody all ships can rise and there doesn't need to be an enemy there doesn't need to be and in that if her team you know she could have bought them back but like even with not doing that right I wish kids and people out there understood that like there are scenarios in life where there doesn't need to be an oppressor and oppressed there are scenarios in life where it's a misunderstanding yet everyone can succeed and the whole reason I did that deal was not only because I believed in big machine and Scott and Thomas Rhett and you know Florida Georgia and all the amazing acts they had on big machine but you don't make a deal at that level unless you believe in her yeah you know so i believed that she was going to become exactly who she's remained to be and you know the narrative since then you know me even talking about this now there's going to be hello swifties they're going to be yelling and screaming and you know this that nothing you can't say anything right and it is what it is and you know my response to that is they made the horrible you know miscalculation that I care.

59:40You know, my thing is that I, you know, I just, I don't know those people out there. And if I met them in person, and they needed my help as a stranger, I would help them. And I've seen that on a human level. And I think people forget that when you have a fan base that big, if 10 ,000 people are yelling at you, it feels like the world is ending. But that's less than 1 % of a fan base that big. I think most people are dealing with their own problems. I think most people are dealing with their own insecurities, same way I am the same way every artist and every human being is. And I think that it's just a more productive use of your time to not get stuck in the craziness of celebrity fodder and focus more on being kind to people.

1:00:19It's interesting to hear that everybody won. Like net net, you made money, she made money. The thing that she told Time that I am curious about is she said, with the scooter thing, my masters were being sold to someone who actively wanted them for nefarious reasons, in my opinion. What do you think she's referring to? I don't know. I don't have any nefarious reasons. You don't, that was a major risk for me at the time to buy that company. I couldn't afford to do it for nefarious reasons to go, like just from a financial standpoint, that doesn't make any sense. I needed her to be successful for me to take that risk.

1:00:55There's nothing nefarious about it. There's nothing. I don't know what she was told, But the monster, if she ever wanted to sit in front of me, the monster doesn't exist and she'd be met with kindness. I just wish that it didn't take such a toll on my family with all the people that were activated by that stuff. Because it was a very tough time for us. Because there's a lot of people out there that don't understand and they hear this stuff and they take it to a level that's really not okay. And I think that's dangerous. You said earlier that she helps pay for people's college tuition. Yeah. Good on her.

1:01:31I'd rather talk about her doing that and talk about her nefarious reasons with me. You think there's a difference between what actually happened and what people think happened? Yeah, of course. That's 99 % of the things that people read on the internet. But at the same time, that's the whole lesson of self-work. You can't define yourself by what everyone else thinks, especially people that don't know you. That's the gift of being in the public eye. Because when you're not in the public eye, you can maybe hide it a little bit more. Right. But when you're in the public eye, it's so much easier to be misunderstood.

1:02:04And you better go deep inside yourself to figure that part out. But you're talking about someone who doesn't know me and I don't know them. So why would I wish them ill? You helped make so many other people famous. What surprised you the most when your name was in the headlines? Surprised you about how you reacted? It was the first time that I had ever had any negative press. What surprised me is how overnight everything I had done before didn't matter. What surprised me is how before that I was known for helping people and philanthropy and success and all these different things. And what surprised me is like the next day, all of that was out the window.

1:02:47You were defined by this one moment. That's what it felt like. And what a gift. Best gift ever. Because that was when I started the lesson of learning that all the praise that I thrived on before wasn't real either. That's why I told you earlier, the praise wasn't deserved and the hate wasn't deserved because none of these people knew me. And at that point in my life, I really didn't know myself. so the hate forced me between that and losing my marriage which had completely nothing to do with that something completely different you know and there were rumors about that but like that was just all of that led me to wanting to go to a deeper place and it's the reason I'm doing a podcast with you like I'm almost annoyed that we're talking about this you I think you can understand I don't want to talk about it I understand you're doing your job I do have two more.

1:03:35We'll see. But what I can tell you, like, as we joke about it, what I really hope comes out of this is that someone goes, damn, like, I'm going to forget all that noise and maybe look inward. You know, that's what I really hope. I think somebody realizes that, like, everything you need is in self-love. And I know that sounds cheesy and cliche, but it is so true. She's about to hit me with two more. Two more. Have you talked to your kids about it? I had to at this point. My kids were really young then, but my oldest is 10. And someone said something very mean to him at school. But the beautiful thing is I didn't have to talk that much because my kids know who their dad is.

1:04:16You mentioned a rumor about your marriage. There's been a lot of rumors with Taylor's lyrics. In vigilante shit, I hate cursing, but in vigilante shit, she writes and sings. She needed cold hard proof, so I gave her some. She had the envelope. Where do you think she got it from? Go ahead. Keep going. Now she gets the house, gets the kids, gets the pride. Picture me thick as thieves with your ex-wife. Did you ever think these were about you? No, because I talk to Yale every day. My ex-wife is one of my best friends. So me and my ex-wife laugh about that stuff. We don't even call each other ex. That's like my partner.

1:04:51That's the mother of my children. That is my family for life. I have a tattoo on my finger that says same team after my divorce because she and I are same team for life. It's what we say to each other. So no, I never thought that was about us. She never thought it was about us and everyone else kind of feeding into the fire great strategy move, but like Nah Can we talk about your divorce? Yeah, sure. I'll decide if I want to answer so You seem so fueled by success at least in your pre Hoffman life. Did you see divorce as a failure? At the time. Yeah, no one in my family had ever been divorced and And at that time I had built up this foundation of scooter because I didn't think Scott was strong enough I didn't know that yet.

1:05:37So having the perfect career the perfect wife the perfect life the kids the success I thought that made me worthy of love and it wasn't until Our marriage came apart. I couldn't fix it. I Felt like a failure because I didn't have a foundation But it was the greatest thing that ever happened to me because the ups and downs of artist life, the Taylor stuff, none of that actually affected me. Losing my marriage affected me. The idea of not being with my kids 50 % of the time deeply affected me. So much so that October 2020, when I didn't really even understand what was going on, I had a suicidal thought at the height of my career for 20 minutes.

1:06:22Because my marriage falling apart no one really knew i knew i couldn't understand why and i was like man if i can't be the father to them and you know this life i felt like i didn't want to be there and after that 20 minutes went by i was like what the hell was that that was really scary i never want to feel like that ever again and then the next day i actually opened up to a friend and he got recommended hoffman and i went two weeks later the same day ariana was releasing dangerous woman but i just decided you've you've done it this way for so long and look what it got you you know this deep depression now you got to choose something else and october 26th i went into the hoffman process and started healing and and got to this beautiful place where here i am six years later before never divorced no one ever said anything negative about me in the press there was everything online was very beautiful there's nothing negative six years later I'm divorced people talk shit about me constantly and I couldn't be happier I wouldn't trade it in a million years the relationship I have with my children the relationship I have with my friends you know do I wish you know you know do you wish like you know certain things didn't happen because they were painful absolutely but they were so necessary that must be weird though when your insides don't match the outside I didn't know because I didn't know how to be present so I always kept moving because I thought like that's how other people That's why I deserve love and when I finally had to slow down because I couldn't control it anymore I broke I had no foundation and that's when I had to put myself back together and other people helped me And Hoffman didn't fix me, but it started fixing me And it started me on a journey to like study breath work and study meditation and do therapy and study stoicism and study Kabbalah and study all these different things that I'm still doing every single day today.

1:08:15You asked me about like being flawed. I'm still flawed. I'm still battling every single day. What do you battle? You know, there's this book, Many Lives, Many Masters by Brian Weiss. One of my favorite books. And it's this idea of past lives. And one of the things he talks about is - You're battling your past lives. No, it's not even battling past lives. It's more this idea that he says, you're here to learn. And usually when you go, it's because there's nothing more for you to learn. The reason why I jump out of planes like learning i've jumped learn how to jump solo for my 42nd birthday or like i'll go swim with sharks it's because i know that i'm so screwed up and i'm still trying to learn every day that i really don't think it's my time to go because that book so i believe i'm flawed like everyone else because i still feel resistance i still have moments where i'm like oh the ego wants to win or i'm hurt or i'm angry or i'm disappointed or i'm like hurt by someone and i'm always trying to go towards it because that's where the good stuff is and as long as I keep having that resistance and keep having that hurt and keep having that struggle I know I'm still in it so I choose when does that trigger come up randomly sometimes it's a friend you know is celebrating something and you see it online and you're like was there a reason I wasn't like like you know it's it's it could be on the other side of the country and you just feel like left out or something or your insecurities make you think you have to do with something that has nothing to do with you or more personal or professional for you personal yeah but it's also like the slightest thing of like sometimes you it's an old thing that you think you were past and someone brings up an old wound and you were like damn I thought I was past that but okay I'm not let's keep working on this and luckily I talked to a therapist once a week which I never did when I was younger and she keeps me extremely accountable she calls me on my bullshit she goes no you're dealing with that.

1:10:02I know you are. And I'm really grateful for her. Hit me with the next one. No, there's, there's really none. My, I mean, personally, I'm curious. I don't know if you want to talk about this, but like Hive has since bought, what is it called? Quality control music. So like you've bought other people's masters and there's no headlines and no issues. So it didn't scare you away from it? Do you feel like there is like a legal moral way to do it that it doesn't explode? I think on this side of my career, I think there's lots of things I realize about the laws of the music industry that don't make sense.

1:10:39You know, and I won't even talk from a master's point of view. I think master's is you get what you negotiate in the music business. It's kind of like the Wild Wild West. And master's is a way that major labels feel comfortable investing in artists because they don't participate in publishing. Right. So by owning masters or participating in masters, it gives them a reason to take a big risk and a chance on emerging artists and helping you break. Like that's the reward that they're signing up for. I'll give you an example though on the publishing side that I disagree with and I actually wish it would change.

1:11:12And I've been a part of the problem in the past. Songwriters. I think that they're the most underpaid people in our industry. I think that they're responsible for the melodies and the stories that we love. They're unseen and they're not rewarded the way they should. And I think that one of the problems when you're majoring a major artist is unless that artist has a piece of the publishing, there's no way for the artist to protect their rights. So, for example, if an artist doesn't own a piece of the publishing, you can take the lyrics of their hit song and you can sell T-shirts without them with any design you want because you own the publishing.

1:11:46Wow. But that doesn't protect the integrity of the artist's brand or the design work or all the thoughtfulness they went into creating their merch and protecting everything that they've worked hard on. But the only way to protect that artist is by demanding a piece of something that is a very small revenue stream that those songwriters need. I think that there should be a way to protect the performer and the rights of the performer while not taking away from the revenue stream of the songwriters. And that's something that I'd love to see happen. And something that I realize now in this part of my career, that while I was protecting my clients, I might not have always been doing the right thing by the songwriters because I was I was doing my job.

1:12:30But what I'd like to do on this side, if anyone want to advocate, I'd be right there with them saying the laws need to be changed where you don't need to cut into someone's revenue stream to do the right thing by the performer. But even with labels, as much as it is true that they're taking all the risk, they're putting all the money up up front, they don't have anything without the artists. And all these young artists now, like Chapel Rhone just talked about it at the Grammys, they're like starting to wave their hands saying this isn't right. Like the labels, I don't know how else to say it, but the labels like just have them.

1:13:01Look, I think there's things about it that are wrong. And then there's things about it where, you know, how many artists who aren't successful are asking the label to keep investing millions of dollars in them when it's not worked yet. Right. You know, so I think there's always two sides of that coin that sometimes the artist in their individual situation is spot on. But then what do you tell the other artists where you're saying, well, because they said this, I no longer have the revenue to take a chance to break your next favorite artist. You know, I think like any business that needs to grow, it needs to change.

1:13:32There also needs to be stop fighting against technology and understanding technology can bring us new revenue streams that can change our business. I think people come really hard at Spotify and they're like, oh, they're not paying us correctly. But they also forget that if it wasn't for Daniel Ek, we wouldn't have the music industry value we have today. He saved a dying industry. He took a risk and people are mad that he's done so well. But at the same time, if it wasn't for him and streaming and what Spotify did, we wouldn't be having the revenue that we have right now. So it's always it's easy to kind of point fingers back and forth.

1:14:06I think it's better if we find ways to work together to create more, more prosperity for everyone. Well, to your point with streaming and so many independent labels, you artists need big labels anymore. I think it really depends on the case. I think sometimes a big label can use its power and its strategy and boots on the ground around the world to actually make a difference for you. And sometimes you're able to break through using the Internet and you can do a distribution deal. And I really think it depends on your needs. Some types of acts don't need a lot of money to tour or do things. Other acts need a tremendous amount of money to develop the music videos, the strategy, the development.

1:14:45Every act is different. And I think that, you know, pointing fingers at each other while others make money off of all of us is not necessarily the most productive thing. What do you think about the TikTok-ization of music? Too old. I mean, that's honestly the truth. I think when other people are coming on, they're like, what is this? And I'm getting to that age where I'm like, I don't understand the TikTok. Like, I'm too old. Like, I'm not native to the technology anymore. Yeah. So the same way my dad discovered vinyl, I discovered DJ Clue mixtapes. And, you know, some kid today is discovering on TikTok.

1:15:21The one thing that has remained constant is the love of discovery of music. So I'm not going to bad mouth how a kid discovers music today because that's their generation. But artists are making music for TikTok. Like, do you remember in the Instagram era, everybody thought that Drake would make these songs just so we would all have Instagram captions. And whether that's true or not, I don't know. I don't think all artists make songs for TikTok. I think artists like art take different mediums and different types of art. So what I mean by that is there are some artists who are still making albums.

1:15:56There are other artists who are focused on singles. Then there are artists who are focusing on TikTok. I think people make art specifically for the art they want to make. And we seem to judge it based on who makes the most revenue. That's been the biggest issue for me, not just with music, across the board. Why are bachelor and bachelorette lists based on net worth and not kindness? Or, you know, not even like if the person's attractive anymore. It's just like, seriously, it's like, how much, how rich are they? You know, and I think - Wait, what are you talking about? Bachelor and bachelorette lists.

1:16:26Like when we look at them, the most - What are bachelor lists? Like when you see the most eligible bachelors in the world. Oh, okay. You know, they'll be like showing their net worth. Oh, yeah. And I think that we've gotten away - And women's beauty. It's like, yeah, it's so to me, what's interesting about AI, if it really does take away a lot of jobs and does replace a lot of things. We've been a generation, the generation before us, that's defined by what we do. The next generation might need to be defined by who they are. Interesting. interesting because if you get a lot of people who have more time on their hands there's possibly like a artistic renaissance either artistic renaissance or we're going to have to deal with ourselves and not just be defined with what we do i don't know shakespeare says idle hands are the devil's play things we're going to find out okay at the height of it how many calls by the way i hope it's an artistic renaissance like you said and not idle hands i hope so too i think if AI, we don't have a great track record in America, but if AI gets into the right hands?

1:17:32Well, it seems to be in all our hands, especially with all the open source and everything that's happening. But look, the world's going to change drastically in the next couple of years. And we always seem to wait a figuring it out and going on a new journey. And I think that there's going to be a lot of opportunity for experience and art. And it's going to be an interesting world in the next 10 to 15 years if not sooner at the height of your managerial career how many calls were you making a day always all day emails calls all day like more than 300 yeah probably like over a thousand emails and texts a day and were you a zero inbox guy yeah how did you do it at night time it was funny my assistant would joke right in like two three in the morning it was just like this because I'd be answering everything Wow Scooter what's it been like to work this hard

1:18:33I've never been asked that I don't think I knew any other way for a really long time the more interesting question has been what is it like to work different the last couple years learning how to be present it's less a question of what to feel like to work that hard and how nice it is now to be here I don't think I knew how to be here I think I knew how to live in the future I think I knew how to prepare for every single moment. I knew how to always be on getting ready, getting ready, getting ready. And that made me really good at business. But you took a breath when I said that you exhaled. Why?

1:19:24Because I've learned how to exhale. That's the reason. It's when you're working so hard before, you don't know how to breathe. You don't know how to take a moment. You don't know how to not look at your phone. You're so afraid of what you're building not working. It's like my grandparents are Holocaust survivors. Like you said, it was a lot of Holocaust trauma of like tomorrow they're going to come and take it all away. Yeah. And the last couple of years, the pain of the last couple of years forced me to learn how to be here and learn how to take a breath. and that has been really nice because the closest thing I can relate to that is being a kid is like being a kid who's riding a bike around his neighborhood a kid who like like the thundercats and was silly and had fun and didn't have a phone yet and it was a lot more joyous than I was in my adult years and I'm I've got that back now you had the playfulness though like Like, I mean, maybe it was just on Instagram, but I don't know.

1:20:27I did. I did. But I was afraid of tomorrow. I didn't know how to be here today. And so my friends feel like you haven't changed, but they're like, now you're back. I didn't know how to be vulnerable. I didn't know how to like tell the, you know, what was really happening with me. I was, I was protecting all the time. And now I'm a mess, just like you. That's fine. Did you shed people? Yeah, but I think that happens naturally. I don't really like shedding anybody. Like, I'm just not built that way. My friends actually say it's a problem. But I just think you get to a point where you realize it's okay.

1:21:04Like, and I change in a week. So I actually at the same time shed people. I also know that they can change in a week and we can be friends all over again. You know, so I give people to benefit it out the same way I'd want them to do for me. Yeah. Okay, I was reading an article about you and there was a blind quote. and they said he's a good guy and can be ruthless in business. What's it like to hear me say that? That's their opinion. Is it true? I think that in my opinion, everyone who's ever done a deal with me has made a multiple. I've never lost money for anyone. I've never screwed anybody.

1:21:43I take a lot of pride in the fact that, especially in this town, there are not many people that can say that every investor they had did well. every partner we had did well that I'm still doing deals with those partners I'll never apologize for fighting for our worth and some people might have found that that'd be a tough negotiator but I always believe both sides can win and in the end we got there and being great and entrepreneur Jeff Bezos says you better expect to be misunderstood and I'm okay with that so when I hear it I don't take any offense to it because that might have been their experience but you know what they said the most important thing I thought I was a good guy so that's sweet that's nice of them?

1:22:18I'm glad you didn't ignore that part. Not at all. So someone you've done a few deals with said to me, Scooter's able to determine what people want in a situation more than anyone. You wrote on Instagram that you like in meetings to ask people what their greed is. What do they want? Are you always cognizant of people's desires in your interactions with them? Yes, and it also makes things easier because people misunderstand the word greed. They think you know it's a dirty word because it's usually the thing that you feel shameful to say but it's usually the thing I need to know to make the right deal sometimes greed is money sometimes greed is fame sometimes greed is I want to spend more time with my kids sometimes greed is I want to be seen for who I am sometimes greed is I want to make sure this charity I love makes money you never know what the greed is but if someone can just say it and stop hiding it you can build a deal that works for everybody you know and so for me I try to push people to feel comfortable enough to say what they actually want so we can make a deal that works for everybody and it served you yeah you said you asked Jeff Bezos that what did he say asked him what what his greed was I never asked him that.

1:23:39I probably should. I asked him what he wanted. I didn't ask the greed question, but I said, what do you want? And I was looking at someone who I admired, who is misunderstood, you know, someone who has provided more jobs for this country than any person alive today, someone who provided more jobs in COVID than anybody, someone who changed the minimum wage at the corporate level when the federal government wouldn't, he did, and other companies followed and change it to$15 because he said, we can actually do this. Someone who's made trillions of dollars of wealth for other people, not just himself, but also is one of the most commercially successful people individually in the world.

1:24:19And I got to ask him, you know, what do you want? And he looked at me and he said, I want to evolve. I want to be more vulnerable. I want to be a better partner. I want to be a better father. I want to be a better friend. And I thought to myself, I don't need$200 billion to start that. And I felt like it was no cheat code. And I'm the reason I don't like to tell stories about certain people in my life, but I feel proud to tell that story about him because I hope more people hear it because no one needs that level of wealth to start that journey. You seem really passionate about people doing self-work.

1:24:53Is it because you feel so much better now? Yes. And I don't want them to be in the place that I was to start it. I had plenty of people who loved me trying to tell me to start self-work and I just didn't turn off the rat race. I said, I don't need that. Look, the whole world is telling me I'm great, so I'm great. And I refused to hear that little voice inside of me that was screaming like, come get me. We should start this. And I only started when I was in deep pain. So I talk about it a lot now because I don't wish that pain on anybody. And it's such an easy thing to start and you don't have to be in pain to do so.

1:25:35So I kind of wish people started before they get to the place I was in. I'm sorry you were in so much pain. You know what? I'm here now, so it's all good. What do you want moving forward? What's your greed? Oh, I want people to stop asking me about past dramas. Maybe after this interview, we can put it to bed. Maybe. I would love that. Honestly. What do you really want? Like no podcast answer. What do you actually want? I would like to build something that I could share with my children. Interesting. I'd like to build something next that if they said, Dad, can we come do this with you? There's enough space for them to not only do it with me, but find themselves in it as well.

1:26:18and I could share my creativity with them. Like if they wanted to do more of the business side, I could share that with them. Like I would like to do something that if they choose to do their own thing, that's great. But if there was an opportunity that they wanted to kind of do something with their dad, that would be a lot of fun. You shared a lot of stories with me today about like Amor Fati and Marcus Aurelius and you seem to have these sort of like Aesop fables in you. You post some of them on Instagram. I'm wondering why being a storyteller is important to you or why stories matter to you because they have meaning is that how you learn I think so I think you learn from your own experiences but I think you can learn a lot from stories I think I loved always reading stories about great people to kind of like have cheat codes like the story Jeff gave me that's a cheat code yeah you know here's someone who has all that and that's what they're looking for that's a cheat code.

1:27:15Like, great stories are a cheat code. Like, my favorite story in the scripture was like two weeks ago in a Parsha. And like, it's a cheat code. It's the story. Like, do you know who actually parted the Red Sea? No. Who do you think? Moses? People think Moses parted the Red Sea. Moses didn't part the Red Sea. Pharaoh? Nope. So the real story, I'm going to go biblical on you. Okay. The real story is the Egyptians were coming and they're going to kill everybody and everyone's freaking out and Aaron and Moses are standing up there saying God says trust him go into the sea and the sea is like choppy as hell the current's crazy like people go in you're gonna die and they're like Moses wants us to commit suicide like this is we're not doing that and Aaron's brother-in-law his name was Nachshon he was the head of the tribe of Judah he was this regular dude who was like the leader of his family something came over him and God said trust me and not shown not Moses walked into the sea and his family started screaming like don't do this you're going to die and it wasn't until his mouth and his nose went under the water that God parted the sea and it's like one of my favorite stories ever of this idea of trust and in life it's not until you go into a place that is unreasonable into a place of danger that shows up.

1:28:40And I love that story because that's like one of the greatest gifts. It's a cheat code of like, that's life, you know, like success and failure live next door to each other. You have to go into the resistance. You have to go into the fear. And it isn't until you put yourself into a place of unreasonable danger that usually the miracles happen. And I really like stories. That was a great one. Thanks. Well, it's not mine. I'm curious when you felt the closest to that fear and success. I mean, I've heard you talk about with Bieber, like you were basically down in your last dollar. Yeah, to Asher and Justin.

1:29:15Yeah. But is there anything later in your career where it felt that way? Like where you really felt like you were taking a big risk? My life changed after that where I'll admit it. Like I have the I have the luck of not being in that financial position ever again after that but yeah like I think it's not just about finance it's about all aspects of your life it's about going towards when I did the self-work for the first time I was lost and I went in to do something that was so out of character that was so surrender which I never did before and it wasn't until I put myself in surrender in a place of being vulnerable in front of strangers that I started to actually have the healing and the miracles take place.

1:29:59So I can talk about it from a business standpoint, but the most powerful in my life has actually been, you know, understanding that I'm not completely in control and that I've actually been taking care of. Most of us have been taking care of our whole lives. So for example, do you mind if I ask you a question? Sure. Okay. What if you had a friend your entire life who every single time, every single time you got in a bad position where you didn't think you were gonna make it that friend showed up and said I will take care of it and now you're this age and you're back in that position where it's the worst it's ever been you feel like it's the worst it's ever been and like you cannot control it it's gonna fall apart you're screwed and this friend comes to you and goes okay listen this one I need you to do I've earned this I need you to completely trust me you have no control of the situation I need you completely surrender and I'll fix it.

1:30:55Could you do it? Yeah. You really? Yeah. I'm proud of you because most people are going to be like complete control. Like, yeah, the friend can help me, but like I'm talking, you're not even allowed to know. You have to just say, I trust and fall back. Yeah. Okay. I'm really proud because you're an evolved person. In some ways. To me, that's the universe that's God. Like how many times have all of us in our life, if you're at an age of like over 20, over 30, you've already had enough life experience that there's been so many points in your life yeah where you thought there's just no getting out of this so many of them that you've forgotten at this point because they've been healed since where you thought it was the end of the world and it's far years later and you've removed and every single time steps up so now i got to a point in my life where it was like okay cool you think you've been controlling this but i've actually been the one helping you the whole time so can you just fall back and let me help you and i finally got and got to the point and i work on that every day because you say yeah i'm still working on full surrender.

1:31:52I'm not there yet. You're better than me. No, not full. But the caveat is, had I not been, had I not had those moments, I couldn't have said yes. Well, I think we've all had those moments and I'm still not able to say fully yes. It's the thing I'm working on every day. That's really interesting. I'm shocked to hear that. I'm better at it, but like. Because you had to surrender your whole life. Yes, but I still struggle with it because it's scary. Yeah. I'm so much better than it was, but it's scary every single time because what if they're not going to be there? But they've proven, you know, God, universe has proven me a thousand times that it is.

1:32:29Yeah. That's called faith. And I think I'm still working on that. Is there anyone in your life who has like really, really beautiful faith that you admire, that you look to? My mom does really believe in the goodness in people. Obviously, it will change as they get older. But because my kids are still kids, I get to see it in them. You've been behind some of the most iconic careers of the last 15 years. When someone asks your eldest son what his father does, what do you hope he says? He's Jagger's dad. I have some rapid-fire questions for you. Something that really scares you. Whatever the first thought was.

1:33:10Health for my family. The biggest misconception about you? That I control everything and I'm a crazy man. What do you wish you knew when you started out in the music industry? That I don't control shit. What's a risk you're glad you took even if it didn't work out? I tried. What does that mean? I just got out there and tried. Do you believe in karma? Yes. But in a way that it's teaching you, never hurting you. Say more? I think karma, I believe that like all of us are on our journey and I think karma is there to give us corrections. never to hurt us. It's always to teach us. I like that. What's something everyone should try once?

1:33:56The first thing that came to mind was skydiving. But I don't know if that's a good idea. I can't. If you were a tree, what kind of tree would you be? Oak or an olive. Something that you've changed your mind about recently. Or an orange tree. I like to give people, yeah, probably an orange tree. Just like lasting fruit. Yeah. Something you've changed your mind about recently? Something I've changed my mind about recently. I was doing like a really healthy diet and yesterday I was like, screw this, I want that cookie. So I changed my mind about the diet yesterday and I ate the cookie. Okay, a book that changed your life, something you think everybody should read.

1:34:34Many Lives, Many Masters. That's a really good one. Will you grab the question everything card game and pick a card, whichever one speaks to you? This is the one right here. Okay. what's your superpower

1:34:50I think I try to see people I think my superpower is I think sometimes superpowers can hurt you and that's a good thing so I think my superpower is deep down I really just want everyone to be okay that's my superpower I give people the benefit of the doubt I actually just want I don't like conflict with people I want everyone to be okay. I want people to get along. And I think even when people are treating, you know, even when my friends think I shouldn't be like that, I'd rather be that way. That's interesting because usually what we give people is what we need most. Yeah. Maybe I just want to be okay and understood.

1:35:37Maybe. This is a great therapy session. Music takes. Okay, these are going to be fun. An album you listen to, no skips. Lauryn Hill, Miss Education Lauryn Hill. Usher Confessions, another one, no skips. That's a good one, too. Okay, three albums to listen to for the rest of your life. One I just named. Well, I'll name other ones. Three albums for the rest of your life. Tribe. God, it's so hard. I know. Albums for the rest of your life. Just because I named my kid after Sticky Fingers by the Stones. and Born to Run or Springsteen. Obama would agree with you. AI, good or bad for the music industry?

1:36:20I think things evolve and when we fight them, we get in trouble, so good. Spotify or Apple Music? I'm a fan of both companies, but I have been a long-term supporter and shareholder of Spotify, and I think what Daniel did is remarkable. Who's an artist we should all have our eye on? Scarlet Opera First CD or tape you ever bought?

1:36:46Tevin Campbell, The Single Round and Round A song you wish you had discovered Oh, excuse me, a singer you wish you had discovered or managed first I mean, Alive or Dead, you're saying? Yeah, an artist you wish you had managed I don't ever want to manage again But in the past Is there ever someone that you really wanted on your roster that you never got? I'm good. I had a great run. I'm good. That's my answer to the question. Like, I don't have that wish anymore. I had an amazing run. I had an incredible management career. I'm good. And I think everyone was with the person they're supposed to be.

1:37:23Yeah. Peace, love and happy endings. OK, an artist people would be surprised that you love. George Benson. A concert that blew your mind. Michael Jackson bad. An artist that you think is still underrated even after all their success. Tori Kelly. I agree. I also put Mario in there. Miguel? But I just, I'm saying Tori. Tori Kelly. I've worked with Tori. I think she's one of the most remarkable voices of all time. And you talk about underrated. Tori Kelly. A lyric that lives rent-free in your head. cooler than a polar bear's toenails oh hell there he goes again talking that shit scooter thank you or i'm from jamaica queens where i beat you up and take your jeans i always thought that was a funny line okay you know what time it is today's a good day to have a good day i'll see you next week

1:38:40Hey, y 'all, what's up? This is Lorna Rosa from the latest with Lorna Rosa, the podcast. Remember Varnell Hill from the 90s sitcom Martin? He's back. And now on Paramount Plus, more than 30 years later, Tommy Davidson is stepping back into the spotlight in an all-new Martin spinoff, the Varnell Hill Show. And Varnell has just one question. Did you miss me? Now he's got network execs, a wild writer's room, family drama, and everyone telling him he's passed his prime. Varnell isn't slowing down, bringing raw, unfiltered jokes every step of the way. From executive producer Martin Lawrence, The Varnell Hill Show premieres September 1st, streaming exclusively on Paramount+.

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