In short
Rotten Mango Podcast Episode Notes
Episode Title
#324: Three High Schoolers SMIRKING In Court After Burning Cigarettes On Classmate’s Private Parts
Episode Summary This episode dives into the chilling case of three high school friends—Hellen, Coco, and John—who, after a series of escalated bullying incidents, kidnapped and tortured their classmate, Camellia. The discussion explores the psychological dynamics of bullying, the lack of supervision among international students, and the ramifications of their heinous actions, including the trial and the cultural implications of the case.
Key Characters
- Hellen: The leader of the group, known for her bullying behavior and entitlement.
- Coco: Hellen's best friend and accomplice in the bullying and torture.
- John: Hellen's boyfriend, who assists in the torture.
- Camellia: The victim of the kidnapping and torture.
Major Themes and Discussions
- Bullying Dynamics
- The episode outlines how Hellen and her group created a toxic environment, targeting Camellia due to a rivalry over boys and social status.
- Illustrates the hierarchy and power struggles within the high school setting, akin to *Lord of the Flies*, where a group of children, left without adult supervision, devolves into cruelty.
- Cultural and Social Context
- The students are international teens from affluent families in China, highlighting the pressures and social dynamics they face.
- Discussion on "parachute kids," who are sent abroad with little parental oversight, leading to a lack of accountability.
- Consequences of Actions
- Hellen's group faces serious criminal charges, including kidnapping, assault, and torture, which leads to a stark contrast between their privileged lives and the reality of their actions.
- The episode covers the courtroom dynamics, revealing the attitudes of the perpetrators during their trial, particularly Hellen’s arrogance.
- Judicial Outcomes
- Each of the main perpetrators receives prison sentences: Hellen (13 years), Coco (10 years), John (6 years).
- The discussion reflects on the broader implications for bullying and justice in schools, stirring conversations in both the U.S. and China.
- Cultural Reactions
- The case garners significant attention in China, leading to introspection about parental responsibility and systemic bullying.
- Community reactions range from outrage at the actions of the perpetrators to discussions about legal reforms in bullying cases.
Key Takeaways
- The case serves as a grim reminder of the consequences of unchecked bullying and the psychological impacts of peer pressure.
- It raises questions about cultural differences in handling bullying and the judicial system's response to youth crime.
- The importance of parental involvement and supervision in the lives of international students is highlighted, emphasizing that education is not just academic but also about moral and social development.
Conclusion The episode concludes with a reflection on the nature of bullying and the necessity for societal change in how institutions handle such cases. The chilling story serves as a cautionary tale about the depths of cruelty that can arise in unsupervised environments, especially among youth who are navigating complex social dynamics in a foreign culture.
For more detailed notes and sources, visit [rottenmangopodcast.com](https://rottenmangopodcast.com).
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:02Three international high school students were sitting side by side in a row. We have 18-year-old Helen, her boyfriend John, and Helen's best friend Coco. They're all planning what to do for Helen's 19th birthday that's coming up in literally a few weeks. Helen's like, maybe I'll go visit my parents back in China. Maybe I'll bring John to meet the parents formally for the first time ever. It would be kind of perfect because six of their closest friends just flew back to China from California. So they could all reunite and have fun. and Helen could drive them around her hometown in her Maserati.
0:37I mean, they were all really, really excited. The excitement was pushing them to be a bit goofier. They're poking fun at each other, giggling, whispering. Helen and John, they're still in their puppy love phase. So they're sharing these suggestive looks. They're eyeing each other up and down in front of everyone else in that room. The only time that they really snap out of it was when the door slams open and Helen's arch nemesis, her absolute enemy, walks in. And Helen's thinking, her again. How dare she show her face after everything she put them through? All three of the friends, Helen, Coco, and John, they stop talking to glare at her walking into the room.
1:19She never even glances back at them, but they make sure that she can feel their eyes burning holes into the back of her head. They wanted to make her feel as uncomfortable as possible. And then their names were called. Helen, Coco, John. It was their turn, so they stand up, straighten out their shirts, walk up to the front. Unfortunately for them, they were not in third period. They were not standing in front of their teacher. They were in a courtroom, and it was their turn to be tried for assault, kidnapping, torture. They, with nine of their closest high school friends, kidnapped, mutilated, and tried to light their high school classmate on fire.
2:01all because of a Facebook picture and a boy.
2:25We would like to thank today's sponsors who have made it possible for Rotten Mango to support the Megan Muir Foundation, which is a non-profit whose main mission is to support and inspire actions to end bullying, cyberbullying, and suicide. Megan Muir died by self-exit at the age of 13 years old after being cyberbullied by an adult neighbor. Her mother, Tina, founded the organization to prevent a similar situation in any way that she can. This episode's partnerships have also made it possible to support Rotten Mingo's growing team of dedicated researchers and translators while they focus on shedding light on stories from all over the world.
2:58We would also like to thank you guys for your continued support as we work on our mission to be worthy advocates of these causes. As always, full show notes are available at RottenMinglePodcast.com. We had our wonderful Chinese researchers and translators assist on the gathering of the data for this case. It was an interesting case because it's kind of an international case, but not really because the court case takes place in California. But as always, with any of these cases that require translations, if there is anything lost in the translation, something miscommunicated, or any additional details that you would like us to know, please leave it in the comments.
3:31And with that being said, let's get started. The six high schoolers, they looked nervous on the plane. Maybe this is their first time on a long international flight without their parents. They were flying from LAX to Shanghai, China. And they just kept anxiously glancing around the airport. Like the entire time through security, they kept their heads down. Almost as if if they lift their heads, if they lift their chins, someone's going to recognize them. And even now that they're on the plane, they still look a bit anxious. Like they're going to throw up any minute now. They look like they haven't showered.
4:03They spent all night packing and rushed to the airport. If you opened up their suitcases, you would likely see that they just shoved everything inside. They didn't neatly fold any of their clothes. they probably left most of their belongings back in California, where they would never be coming back. Because if they ever dare step foot on American soil again, they would be arrested and tried for kidnapping and torture. Meanwhile, another flight was headed in the opposite direction. So from Shanghai to California, one by one, six families land at LAX. Most of the six were middle upper class families in China.
4:41I mean, they're not super rich. They're not the upper echelon of society, but they're very well respected in their fields and industries. And yet here they are canceling every single meeting that month, booking emergency flights, flying to America to handle their kids. They have these emergency meetings amongst them and they're ranting. They're complaining. It's so ridiculous. We did not pay this much in tuition every single year for our children to be treated this way. One mother tearfully spoke up first. My child only watched and she was still arrested. I just don't get it. Like, who do we have to talk to to get this resolved?
5:17Another parent was almost crying. My son only brought the scissors. He didn't actually even use them on her. The others used the scissors. What's so wrong with just grabbing the scissors for them? They asked him to grab the scissors. And for him to face the same level of charges as the others that actually use the scissors, It's just ridiculous. What kind of justice system is this? Another parent stated, we're not rich like all of you guys. You know, we sent our kids abroad. We scraped up every last penny in our savings to give these kids a better future. And now we're spending all of our money on an attorney and our kid could still go to a US prison.
5:53All of the parents nodded and agreed. Their children, the ones they saw once or twice a year, the ones that they shipped off to America and sent them big allowances to just keep them quiet. They're good kids. Should they really be judged for merely five hours of their entire lives? It was a five-hour mistake. They've lived 16, 19 years. I mean, how many hours is that total? A lot. This is just five. They're good kids. And now that the case has gone viral, the parents have to deal with the fact that their children are the most hated high schoolers in all of China. They don't even go to school in China.
6:35Now, here's a hypothetical question. If a group of teenage boys were stuck on a stranded island, how would they survive? How would they maintain some semblance of order? Would someone just start taking charge and everyone would blindly follow? Would there be a fight between two people who want to be the leader of the crowd? There's a story of a bunch of British boys. This is a fictional story of a bunch of British boys that were stranded on an island without any adult supervision. and each passing hour, you just see how these boys start losing their minds. Like they go deeper and deeper down this hole of madness and some of them never get out.
7:09Initially, they try to keep the peace in order. They replicate society that resembles the one in regular life. They elect a leader, Ralph. Ralph is a pretty reasonable guy. His main focus is getting a signal fire to attract the attention of any passing ships. He's like, we got to create shelter. we got to create a fire because someone's going to flag us down and we need to be safe until they do. We're going to be here for a while. And then there was another boy named Jack. Jack wants to be the one in charge, but he doesn't want to waste his time building a fire or some sort of shelter. He wants to hunt.
7:42He keeps telling everyone vegetables, fruit, grass, leaves, that's not going to do anything for us. If we want to be on this island for a long time and survive, we need meat. Meat is the most important thing. meat is what's going to keep us going. He decides to lead the hunting group who is in charge of not only hunting but keeping the signal fire going. And Jack convinces the group, listen, forget this fire. Nothing is as important as this meat. The rest of the group sees ships passing by. They get excited knowing that their fire is going and they're going to be rescued only to discover that Jack convinced the other boys that the fire was useless and meat and killing is the answer.
8:21And Jack almost becomes so fixated on the act of killing his first animal. Jack tries to overthrow Ralph from popularity by convincing the other boys that this is what they were put here on this earth to do, to hunt. It's their purpose. He creates rituals and even creates some sort of beast on the island. This like shadowy monster that's gonna kill them all at night. And his belief is, if he creates enough fear in the boys, if they have a common enemy, they're all gonna be way too scared to go up against him. They will think that the safest spot is under his guidance. They will even go as far to kill another boy because they mistake him as the beast.
9:00And in the end, egotistical Jack convinces the other boys to hunt Ralph down like an animal. It is a whole journey that they go through. And in the end, they are rescued by the British army. And all of the boys have to face the music of what they did on that island when they thought that nobody else was watching. When they thought that there were no consequences. This is the story of the Lord of the Flies. The judge presiding over this international bully case called this exact situation the Lord of the Flies situation. When a group of high school kids with no supervision create their own subculture and they just start creating enemies so vile, so evilly, someone takes charge, ego gets ahead of them and they decide to torture people.
9:47They literally start hunting other kids like animals. And Oxford High School is that stranded island. Oxford High School is a private school for middle upper class families in China. It's in Roland Heights in Los Angeles. Yeah, it's in the San Gabriel Valley area. It's a well-known Asian district. Strong, strong population of Chinese and Koreans. So you would imagine a private school catering to the middle upper class families in China and in Korea. It would be an impressive educational institution. because why would you send your kid abroad unless that's what you're doing? But it doesn't really look like the type of place you would have your child fly halfway around the world to attend.
10:27In my opinion, it looks so much worse than like 99 % of public schools in America. But this is one that you have to pay tuition for. There's no sprawling campus, no state-of-the-art facilities, classrooms with IMAX that we associate with private schools, No Olympic-sized swimming pool like most expensive institutions. Oxford High School is located in the back of a shopping plaza. Imagine your local American shopping plaza with a Ralph's and a nail salon and a Panera Bread. Like the true definition of suburbia, the school is behind that plaza. It's not even part of the plaza. The fence facing the mall parking lot is the school's entrance.
11:09If you were to walk out of the school from the main gate, you would end up directly in the shopping plaza parking lot. It's just kind of tucked away in the back. The parking lot looks like it would be terrifying to go to at night. The facilities include portable classrooms with foldable tables, three worn basketball hoops, a volleyball net, and a soccer goal just sadly sitting on a patch of dead grass. Wealthy parents pay$13 ,000 a year for their students to attend Oxford High School. That's just tuition. That's not living costs. That's not flights. That's not food. Nothing. Just tuition. Which, in my opinion, feels like a really bad deal.
11:49But there is something very fascinating about this place. There are allegedly 140 international students in attendance, mostly from China. This means that this school makes, on average,$1.8 million a year in just tuition costs alone. Some might have the opinion, and this is just an opinion, not a statement of fact, because I don't have personal ties to this institution, curriculum, or even their financials. But an opinion could be that the school works with parents to get international students F1 student visas, get them into the U.S., parents pay tuitions to make sure the visas stay valid because they have to be in school.
12:25And it could be in someone's opinion that the school's main focus is not necessarily education, but rather the legal status of residency for students. This is purely a theory and opinion I guess one could formulate by looking at the state of the school. It's also rumored that most of the students there do not speak English. And yeah, sure, it's because they just moved, but it might seem to some that this school just does not have the best or the most rigorous curriculum. The students are mostly here in the U.S. without their parents, and they live in what's called homestays. Homestays are a huge part of the international student experience.
13:01And I think it's kind of wild when you truly sit there and think about it because of just how unregulated the system is. Families in America, regardless of their ethnicity, I think they just have to have permanent residency or citizenship. They go to agencies, apply to be a homestay family. That means they will let an international student, usually middle, high schooler, come stay with them on a student visa. They will give them their own room in the house. They will feed them every day. they will in turn receive an agreed upon amount by the student's family, who are usually still in their home country.
13:35Legally, the homestay family will be registered as the student's legal guardians in the United States. The part that's wild is sometimes they don't even speak the same language. The homestay families and the international students. In order to qualify, you do a few background checks. You talk about what kind of food you're going to provide for the student, what language is spoken in the home, and that's it. It's not like a foster home where the parents are more or less responsible for the kid's well-being and they're required to take on some level of parenting or adoption where you have to provide every aspect of parenting possible.
14:11Most homestay families, this is not a dig at them. It's just the way that I think the quote contract or situation is usually set up. Most of the students' parents don't want the homestay families to take on parenting roles. They just want an adult in the house, a supervisor. This is purely anecdotal evidence, but from the Korean homestay situations I've personally witnessed, the younger the homestay students are, the more the homestay families will try to be pseudo-parents by encouraging them to sleep, eat healthier, sleep earlier, study more. But because the student is also how the homestay family gets paid, they don't want to overstep their boundary.
14:47They don't want to say too much. They want to keep the student somewhat happy. Usually the student's parents don't even want that. They just want the homestay parents to act like adult supervisors. Usually high school homestay kids, I mean the most that I've seen, the most parenting I've seen them get from their homestay families was just enforcing curfew. That's it. They truly didn't care too much about their grades even. But even then, they can't really get mad at the student for not following curfew. So it's kind of like, eh, you're enforcing it, but are you really? There's actually a name for this.
15:21the students are referred to as parachute kids because the parents from their home country will just ship them off to a new country with a parachute and hope that they land correctly all by themselves. The main incentive of this, because it sounds crazy when you just think about it from this perspective, but if you're studying in middle school or high school in the United States, it is much easier to get into an American college than if you went to high school in Korea or China, for example. So if you're trying to apply to UCLA, way easier if you're a high school student in the US. And once you get into that American college, so much easier for your life here.
15:56Get citizenship. Have more opportunities in the U.S., specifically China and Korea. I know a lot of people want to send their children to study in the U.S. Not because like, oh my God, U.S. supremacy or anything, but just the sheer amount of competition in those countries. The work environment where you legally only work 50 hours, but you probably work like 100 hours a week. the competition to get even a low-paying job is so cutthroat and miserable unless you have money and connections it's a miserable life it's definitely a hard life and i'm not saying it's easy anywhere in the world right but it's a very i think a unique work environment that a lot of parents don't really want their children to experience because they themselves have experienced it.
16:43So they send their kids to places like America. And sometimes it really does work. A lot of homestay kids, they understand the purpose of being here. So they're super self motivated. They get into great universities. They become a very strong contributing member of society here. Whereas other parachute kids, the other extreme, they end up in schools only to hang out with other rich parachute kids. They never learn English. They create their own mini societies in the school. They drive around in Mercedes, no curfew, no rules, no parents. They stay out past 2 a.m. on school nights, spend their time at karaoke bars, Chinese tea houses.
17:21They're drinking, they're smoking, they're spending their allowance on anything that they want that their parents pay them. And they also have a tendency to try and replicate some of the bullying environment that you might see in other places. And again, this is not a dig at like China or anything. I think different countries just have different ways they handle bullies. So I know in China and in Korea, bullies are often handled on the school level. In America, bullying is technically a crime. So if there's assault, it's happened on the legal level, regardless of if you're in school or not, if that makes sense.
17:55So there is that slight difference. I don't think one is better than the other. I guess it's up for you to decide, but just a little difference. Now, most of the high schoolers at Oxford, they fall into this latter category. They have their own unsupervised society within the school. None of them have parental supervision at home. It doesn't seem like the teachers and administrators at the school are even that involved in their lives. There were 86 students. The option to make friends, build new connections, super limited. and so what happens when you're stuck in this group and you're developing and you've got all this teenage angst and no supervision, no guidance, a lot of drama unfolds.
18:37There's a lot of tension and clicks within the 86 students and it feels more heightened, it feels higher stakes because each friend group, they need an enemy to stay together. I'm going to explain the dynamics in a second but they do not have supervision at this school or at home. Okay, just to give you like a visual picture and I'm not judging them. But a lot of them would wear stilettos to school. They would smoke cigarettes in the parking lot, literally right outside the door at school, which can you imagine doing that? That's pretty, that's ballsy. They would skip class to go drive their Mercedes and drink at tea houses, underage drink.
19:12It seemed like it got to the point where a few of them even lost touch with reality. Like they have no idea how consequences and how the real world works. They think this is the world. This little school, this environment, that's it. Or at least that's how Helen felt. She was Lord of the Flies.
19:41Helen was Queen Bee. She was one of the richer ones at the school. Back in China, her parents bought her a Maserati. She was always seen driving around in a BMW. She hated on cars lesser than hers. Like, recently, her parents had bought her a Lexus and she hated it. Lexuses are luxury vehicles, by the way. But she wrote on social media about her parents bought her a Lexus and quote, dude, this is such a stupid fucking car. I'm gonna fucking go insane driving this car. Bro, it's like those TikToks. Yeah. And just like Jack from Lord of the Flies, she needs an enemy to keep the rest of her group behind her because she's not going to do it with her stellar personality.
20:20They need a purpose, something to talk about on a daily basis, someone that they're up against. Because if there's no common enemy, then the one in charge, Helen, naturally becomes enemy number one for the rest of the group. It would only be natural for them to slowly want to dethrone Helen. So she needs to have a mission for them to all look towards. And that person is Camellia. Helen noticed most people from her group were from Shanghai. Camelia was not from Shanghai. So she told them, Camelia talks shit about everyone from Shanghai. How every Shanghainese person is trash. She looks down on Shanghai.
20:58I have no idea if Camelia ever said anything disparaging towards Shanghai. I don't know where she's from or if this is just a big misunderstanding. I feel like I can see Helen saying something along the lines of, well, this is how we do it in Shanghai. and Camelia being like, well, that's kind of dumb. Like, I don't think she's saying this is how Shanghainese people do it. But just like, you know, she bullies someone and she's like, this is what it's like in Shanghai. And Camelia might be like, that's dumb. And instead of taking it as is, Helen, you're being stupid for being a bully. She could have turned around and told everyone.
21:32Camelia said Shanghai and everyone from Shanghai is stupid. Helen and the girls would post on Facebook and social media. Who gave that the audacity to offend everyone from Shanghai? Another one reads, Motherfucker, I'm so pissed off. Does she eat more shit than she eats salt? How can every word that comes out of her mouth be shit? She dares offend everyone from Shanghai? Her fucking audacity. At this point, it becomes very clear to Camillia whether or not she said something mean toward Shanghai or not, Helen is targeting her. Looking back, it seems like Camillia had made a comment on Helen's picture once.
22:09And okay, so this started a year ago. One year before the crime, Helen had posted an overly intimate picture with one of Camelia's exes. Camelia clearly trying to make Camelia jealous and annoyed. Camelia saw it and she responded in the comments, these are the guys that I'm done playing with. Insinuating that Helen was getting her leftovers. Which, okay, yeah, not the nicest thing to say, but it's just a tiny taste of Helen's own medicine. She is the evil queen of the school. She physically beats students on a weekly basis. It's time someone put Helen in her place, right? Helen did not think so.
22:47She waged a year-long war against Camellia, and there is only one option when someone like Helen is targeting you. Avoid them at all costs. Like if you don't, they will find something else to have a problem with. Did you accidentally breathe too loud near them? Did you stare at her for two seconds too long? She will point it out and blow it out of proportion and try to spin it to be something that it's not. Like what happened to Mai? Two days before Helen was kidnapped, Mai was one of the students at the school and she saw Helen bullying her friend outside. Mai runs over, gets in between Helen and her friend and everything just goes pen silent.
23:23Like you could hear a pen drop. Something snaps in Helen. It's almost this mixture of excitement on torturing someone, but also a mixture of pure anger that someone even dared to stop her from doing what she wanted to do. Helen gave Mai one single warning. That's all she would get. Get out of my way. Mai grabbed her friend's arm and walked away. The next day in class in front of everyone, Helen walked straight up to Mai and slapped her across the face. Everyone got quiet and pretended like they didn't see because they didn't want to say anything because they would be next. Helen put her arm around Mai like a good old friend, brought her outside, drove Mai to the quiet corner of the parking lot in the plaza, and started beating her, kicking her in the ribs, punching her in the face.
24:12John, Helen's boyfriend, is just standing there watching her. All the while, Helen is screaming, Do you know who we are? How dare you snoop around in our matters? You should get to know who you're messing with. I'll make you remember today. She accused Mai of being disrespectful and needing to be taught a lesson. Mai was beaten for over an hour. her arms were covered in cigarette burns. Her entire face was swollen and when Mai went back home she was with homestay parents she was terrified that if her homestay parents saw her state, her condition they would call the police. Then Helen would find out that she quote ratted them out and it would just cause more bullying and more problems at school so Mai wore a face mask all day at home until her whole face healed and she avoided her guardians at all costs.
Read the full transcript
24:56The mentality that a lot of the kids at this school Oxford High would develop was Helen's not going to stop. There's no consequences. So you're just going to get beat up. Just get it over with. Just crawl into a fetal position. Hope that Helen's not extra angry that day and then get it over with and then stay out of her way. She'll move on to the next victim. Mai was not the first victim either. There were so many before her. Helen just beat whoever she felt like, whenever she felt like. If you looked at her the wrong way, if you accidentally stepped on her foot in class, you would be beat. What's crazy is the teachers and administrators, even if they know what's going on, they did nothing to stop it or even to reprimand the students.
25:34There were literally no consequences. Because the school makes money with more children being enrolled and the tuition for one international student is three times that of a domestic student and because international students support the majority of Oxford High, the administrators allegedly just close their eyes and let Helen be. But of course, that's not going to help Helen's behavior. All she knew was, what are consequences? There's no such thing as consequences. Her behavior, her bullying, her temper, her violence, it got so bad that she went through multiple different homestay families. She was kicked out to the curb multiple times.
26:09The host families, they called her parents like, I can't do this anymore. Your child is out of control. She's like a ticking time bomb. I don't feel safe with her in my house. Helen's parents were not alarmed. They just found a new host family and sent Helen more allowance to help her emotionally recover from being kicked out of the mean host family's houses. Helen did not even let it bother her because she's the queen of the flies. So Camelia tries to skip a few days of school and diffuse the situation. She hopes maybe Helen would find someone else to bully or maybe she would forget about it.
26:43But instead, Helen posts on social media, stupid bitch doesn't even dare come to school because she's scared. ha ha ha ha ha. Two days after Mai was assaulted, Camelia received a text message from a girl named Lou to come meet her at an ice cream shop. She hoped it would be Helen or the girls handing out an olive branch, but it was not. That night, Camelia would be driving with way too many high school girls jam-packed in the back seat. They're all sitting on top of each other in the back. Nobody's using a seat belt. If Camelia got pulled over, she would have been arrested. there were way too many people in the back of her car legally speaking camelia almost wished she was pulled over she's gripping her steering wheel her knuckles are turning white one by one she's dropping off the girls and each time they would smirk thank camelia for a great time and for the ride and said that we should do it again sometime they would slam the door shut camelia would not even look at them she would just stare straight ahead at the road expression dead knuckles white focusing on the steering wheel.
27:45She just needed to hold it in like a tiny bit longer. She just had one more girl to drop off. The one right next to her in the front seat. Helen. When she pulled up in front of Helen's car, Helen said, thanks for the ride. But she pauses and turns to Chameleon and says, you know, if you tell anyone what happened, I'm going to tell everyone that it was your best friend who did this to you, not us. And every single one of those girls that you They're going to back me up. It'll be 12 against your word. Do you really want your best friend to go to jail? And with that, Helen smirks and gets out of the car.
28:20Camelia felt exhausted and numb. From 7 p.m. to 12 a.m., the 12 high schoolers had tortured her. Like I said, earlier that day, Camelia received a text message. Meet me at Honey Me, the ice cream shop. to discuss things, the text said. It was from a girl named Lou, and Camelia knew Lou since they were in elementary school, so it's not like the strangest thing to receive a message from her. They knew each other. But Camelia was a bit hesitant because, you know, fine, it's honey me, but we haven't been close in a really long time. So Lou apparently changed after becoming friends with Helen and even bullied Camelia recently, or at least tried to bully her.
28:58But it would also kind of be weird for her to not show up, right? Because they're going to see each other again at school after the weekend. And she's going to wonder, why did you ignore my text message? And then it would be a whole thing. So Camellia thought, you know what? I'm just going to bite the bullet. At least she's asking to meet me in a very public place. It's an ice cream shop. But just as a precaution, Camellia asks her best friend Albert to come with her. So it just wouldn't be so awkward and weird. On the way there, Camellia is kind of feeling better about the whole thing. She's thinking, you know what?
29:26They're friends with Helen. Maybe Helen's over it. Maybe Helen wants to have some sort of like peace meeting. Maybe she's going to sit there and be like, Like, Helen wants to have a nice chat with you. Like, I think she feels bad. And then Camellia would be like, you know what? I feel bad. And they could all be better again. But the minute that they walk in through the ice cream shop doors, they know that's not what's going to happen. Camellia felt her heart drop because sitting right next to Lou with a smirk on her face is Helen and her boyfriend, John. They smile and they wave at Camellia. And now it's way too late to turn around because then what?
29:58What are they going to say at school then? It would just make things worse, more awkward, more uncomfortable, probably more violent. Maybe her and Albert could sit down, push through all of this, share an ice cream. It would be so awkward, but at least it'd be less awkward than running out right now, right? Camelia did not have time to think about her options. Albert sat down, oblivious, like clueless to how bad all of this was about to get. Camelia trails along, sits down. She assumes because we're in such a public space, it's gonna be safe, right? Before Albert can even bite his ice cream, Helen turns to him and asks, you should leave, right?
30:32I think what we're about to talk about should really just be left between girls. It's a girl matter. Which is weird because Helen's boyfriend is sitting right there. But Albert felt pressured. I mean, I have no idea if Albert had any clue what Helen had planned for Camellia. But he got up, took his ice cream, and left Camellia alone at the ice cream shop. But still, it's a public space, right? Camellia sat there trying to just stare at her lap, thinking of all the excuses she could try to use to leave. but Helen's already on her phone calling her friends one by one in front of Camellia asking them to come to the ice cream shop.
31:08Her best friend Coco was the first to pick up and she smirked when she heard Helen was with Camellia and she stated over the phone, I'll be there in a minute. In total there were 12 of them, Helen, her boyfriend and 10 of Helen's little minions including her right hand wing woman Coco. Something to note, these are all international students whose parents are from China. Most of them are from Shanghai and all of them, for whatever reason, hate Camellia. Camellia thought, okay, now there's no point of trying to make it less awkward. It feels like life or death. She just needs to get out of here.
31:41She gets up to leave, but before she can, she feels this cold hand on her arm. What are you doing? We have a full day planned ahead of us. Helen puts her arm around Camellia and guides her to the cars outside. They're going to take a quick visit to the park, Roland Heights Park. Camila tries to fight back and verbally says no, but they're basically kidnapping her. They arrive at the park at 7 p.m. Most families made it back home. The sun is setting. They choose a very remote area. I mean, most people don't even venture off and hike into this part. They drag Camila out of the car, throw her onto the floor, and they make the next five hours a living hell.
32:21They throw ice cream on the ground. Clean it up. They start smearing it with their stilettos. Use your hands. If she misses a spot, a high-heeled shoe would lift up from the ground and smash into her rib. One of the high schoolers took Camilla's phone and started smashing it into pieces in front of her on the ground, stomping her heels into it. Another girl kicked her in the back of the knees so that she was kneeling in front of them. And Helen laughed. But of course, in the beginning, Helen didn't even lift a finger. She just stood there, arms folded across her chest, literally like Queen of the Flies, instructing her little minions where to beat, where to punch, where to kick.
33:02Coco's standing a little bit behind Helen, smoking a cigarette. I mean, these two girls, they genuinely think that they're in some sort of gangster movie. And I mean, the only thing I can say is play stupid games, win stupid prizes. They supervise the torture of Camellia. Eventually, one of the girls brings over a giant jug of cold water and Helen nods in approval. They pour it all over Camelia. Her entire hair and body are drenched in cold water. And at this point, the sun has set in LA. It gets pretty cold at night. It's getting really chilly. I mean, of course, that's the least of Camelia's worries.
33:34But just to give you more context on how miserable this experience is, Helen sees Camelia holding onto herself, shivering. She says, someone take off her clothes. For a second, everyone went quiet. It's kind of an odd request. I mean, they never usually went that far. right? They would just beat people to a pulp, right? But getting them nude, it felt like it was crossing some sort of new barrier. And side note, they're also evil, so I don't know why they act like they have morals, but maybe they also thought it was weird that Helen's boyfriend, John, was there too. And Helen has notoriously been a very, very jealous girlfriend.
34:09Why would she want her boyfriend to see another girl naked? Coco straightened her shoulders and said, I'll do it. She asked two of the other girls to hold Camelia's arms while she was kneeling on the ground and Coco forced all of her wet clothes off of her. So now Camelia is kneeling in the cold, completely nude in a public park. A huge speculation on this part. A few things. Up until this point, actually till the very freaking end, Camelia never once showed weakness. She tried fighting back and then eventually she stopped fighting back. She was severely outnumbered. She realized it's not going to work, but she did in a sense like that submit to the torture that's happening because there's no way out of it.
34:50So it's not submitting to the torture. It's being smart about it, right? But she never cried. She never begged for them to stop. She never complimented Helen in hopes of winning her over, saying like, please, you're right. I'm going to listen to you. You're the queen bee. She just stared dead into their souls. And perhaps Helen thought getting her completely naked in public was going to degrade her to a new bottom, a new low, where she would finally submit and beg or cry. but it didn't work. Camellia never gave in. So Coco removed the cigarette from her mouth, stared at it, smirked, walked over to naked Camellia and started burning it all over her chest and her nipples.
35:34She would hold it in place waiting for Camellia to scream or cry but she would not. The other girls joked, we should take it slower so we can last longer. You know, stamina. Coco would joke, you think you're tough, right? Eventually everyone breaks. Helen is standing there watching all of this with her arms crossed and she's seething, just dripping with hatred, like this disgusting yearning for power that she was not getting from this abuse. One of the girls notices that Helen is losing her patience and in an effort to prove herself to the queen, she brings out her lighter and suggests they just light chameleon fire.
36:14Helen smiles and nods. They hold Camelia down, who again is not crying, not begging, not groveling at their feet. They try and try to light her hair on fire. But because these monsters, these people, had just soaked her completely in water, it doesn't work. Helen stared at all the parts of Camelia's chest that were basically burned and mutilated by Coco. But it just wasn't enough. Because now Helen's thinking, you know, she could hide these behind clothes. She could wear clothes to school tomorrow and no one would know. if we can't light her hair on fire, let's just cut it all off. She turns to her boyfriend and asks him to go home, go home to fetch a pair of scissors.
36:55He leaves, goes home to fetch a pair of scissors, brings it back. I mean, I'm truly at a loss for what kind of relationship this is. I feel like you would imagine girls like Helen would be pick me's and only show this evil side to all the girls, but hide it from the boyfriend and act like a soft little girl in front of them. But the fact that she's showing this side to her boyfriend and he's dutifully going to grab the scissors, it's so bizarre. He comes back with the scissors and finally Helen kneels down, stares at Camellia's face, and she just starts roughly chopping off all her hair, throwing it onto the dirty, sticky, ice cream-melted gravel beneath Camellia and tells her, eat it.
37:36I'll let you go home if you eat it all. Camellia freezes, still no tears, no begging. She goes to grab a fistful of hair with her hands, but they stop her. And Helen says, with your mouth, like a dog. The other girls take that as a cue to smash Camellia's face into the ground, making her eat her own hair along with sand. She's still unclothed, soaking wet with burn marks, bruises all over her body. And when they're done, they made her drop them all off. March 30th, 2015, a 911 call was placed after midnight. On the other end was a soft, weak girl's voice. She was not crying. She was not hyperventilating.
38:18It seemed like she was very confident of what she was saying, but she just did not have enough energy to say it loudly. She just sounded exhausted. But the message was clear. My name is Camelia. I had just been kidnapped and beaten for five hours by my classmates. Please help me. Police arrive at the scene, pick up Camelia. they get ambulances I mean there was no question if her story was true or not her hair was extremely choppy like someone had turned off the lights in the bathroom and just started lifting up strands of hair and just blindly chopping not even caring if the scissors were going to cut her face every part of her hair was like an inconsistent length her entire body and face were covered in bruises her face hands and feet were so swollen she couldn't even stand she had burn marks all over her body and every time she tried to sit up, stand on her own, she was wobbling like a baby giraffe.
39:11Her entire body looked damp as if she just got out of the lake 30 minutes ago but never had a towel so she was forced to air dry. The police were just unnerved. They're thinking, can this really be the work of high schoolers? The nurses almost winced when they gave her a more thorough examination. they tried to ask her about her pain levels because pain is a subjective thing so a lot of hospitals they have pain level scales they're just trying to see where your pain tolerance is and how much pain you're in right now most pain scales are from zero through ten so a score of zero means no pain ten is like the worst pain you've ever felt in your life so zero no pain one pain is noticeable but then like you don't really think about it it's like a paper cut you If you think about it, it hurts, but if you don't, you forget.
40:00Two is minor pain. Maybe a paper cut when you have to run it underwater. It's that like, ah, annoying pain. Three, noticeable pain, but you can still distract yourself. Maybe if you play a video game. Four, moderate pain. If you're involved in a high intensity activity, you can ignore the pain for a little while. Five, moderately strong pain. You cannot ignore the pain for more than a few minutes. You will be like, oh my God, I'm in pain. Six, you're in a lot of pain and you're still trying to do your normal day-to-day activities, but you're not performing well. You can't concentrate on anything but your pain.
40:37Seven, strong pain. You cannot do your normal activities. Eight, very strong pain. It's hard to do anything at all. Nine, you can't even hold a conversation with someone because you're screaming in pain. Ten, the worst amount of pain imaginable.
41:06It's interesting. Doctors say the pain scale is just part of what they're looking for. So it's not just the number that you say. They'll actually analyze your breathing, your blood pressure while you talk about your pain. They take into consideration if you were just calm, giggling, or asleep two seconds ago before you rate your pain a 10 out of 10. So there's a lot of factors that they consider. but it was clear a lot of Camelia's injuries were between 8 to 10. And nobody would question that. Her injuries were really bad and they were all inflicted by high schoolers. When Helen was arrested, she looked really bored.
41:43She looked really arrogant. Like it's not that big of a deal. All she has to do is pay a fine or pay the victim some money, shut them up, be on their merry way. So why are all these cops pretending to like go through these motions? She turned to the head officer when she was arrested and said, how long do you think this is going to take? I got to go home back to China for my 19th birthday later this month. They just smiled at her because they're like, there's no way this girl is going home for her 19th birthday. She's probably going to be in prison. They didn't tell her that, though. They just let her slowly find out.
42:16Bail was set at$3 million each for Helen, Coco, and John. So there were 12 bullies. I mean, it was really easy to find them. Most of them went to Oxford High with Camellia. She knew who they were. Out of the 12, six were arrested the very next day. What about the other six? They fled the country. Three of the six that were caught were minors, so we don't have their names. The other three were above the age of 18. We have Helen, her boyfriend John, and Coco. They would be tried as adults. Side note about the six that fled the country. Technically, they're going to have no consequences. Zero consequences.
42:53China will not be trying them for the crime because it took place in America. The only thing, I guess, is if they ever set foot in America again, they will be arrested at the airports. But still, that's not really a consequence compared to what they did to Camilia. Meanwhile, the parents of the six, the three minors, the three adults, they all really wanted the torture charges taken off. Because torture for adults carries a life sentence with the possibility of parole, at least for the adults. One of the attorneys even tried to argue for Helen, Coco, and John. He stated, I'm sure these kids suffer from loneliness.
43:27So they bond with other kids in the small Chinese circles with no supervision, no one to turn to for assistance. So these things, they can get out of control. John's attorney threw Helen and Coco under the bus and basically stated he's merely a bystander. All he did was grab the scissors. Coco's attorney threw Helen under the bus and they stated, Coco is more of a follower than a leader. She's a very young girl. She's not mature enough to evaluate everything happening in the park and make a more thoughtful, careful decision. Everyone was trying to point the finger at Helen, who honestly could not care less.
44:04Like the minute that she stepped into that courtroom, she's smirking, she's giggling, she's making like sexy eyes at her boyfriend John. She is not taking any of this seriously. She is not afraid. She just has this cocky expression on her face that a lot of people describe as wanting to punch it off of her. She acted like, what's the big freaking fuss, everyone? Jeez. When Camellia went up to the stand to give her statement, Helen kept interrupting her and commenting on her statement. Glaring at her, trying to intimidate her to shut up. You would think that Camellia was giving a science project speech and Helen is bullying her in class.
44:42which is still horrendous, but it's kind of unimaginable that someone is doing this in the courtroom. She's cussing at Camelia in front of the judge while she's on trial for trying to set Camelia on fire. The looks she's giving Camelia were so heinous, the judge warned her, you gotta stop or else. These are the three that pled not guilty. Later, Helen's attorney would argue mental illness. I mean, I guess Helen was beyond helping, so he really has no choice, but he's like, clearly she's ill. during psychiatric evaluations it was determined that she was in a completely stable mental state at the time of the incident and capable of bearing responsibility.
45:20Helen's attorney read her statement in court which Helen thought which Helen thought was going to help her case. Side note Helen seems really really upset about the fact that the internet hates her so she thought not only would this get the judge to see her for who she really is which is like this sweet kind person but the internet would fall in love with her after this too. Let me know if you think it worked. Helen wrote, your honorable judge, attorney, and everyone concerned. I sincerely apologize to everyone. I am so sorry. I've made a terrible mistake and there's nothing I can do to make things better for the people that I've hurt.
45:54I accept full responsibility for my behavior and I hope my consequences are a lesson that helps others avoid making similar mistakes. I'm not a bad person. This case is about two days of my life. I wish I could go back in time and wake up the day before this happened and do the right thing, but I know that's impossible and now I will accept the punishment for what I did. It's very hard for me to say how I feel right now. I feel scared, but also glad that this case is over. I wanted to improve myself, stay out of trouble, and even earn a college education while in prison. I'm a good student. I know education is important for my future when I'm released.
46:31And while I was in jail during awaiting this trial, I not only worked on my schoolwork, but I began studying the Bible every day. I know that Jesus will help guide me through my stay in prison and for the rest of my life. I know he has seen the changes in me and seen the remorse in my heart. I just feel so regretful and I have sought forgiveness and I hope to earn it. As I said, I'm not a bad kid. If I am judged based on the two days out of my 19 years that got me into so much trouble, I must look like the worst person in the world. I have read that I am hated here and in China. I probably deserve to be viewed that way.
47:10But the other and better side of me is a person who tries to help other people. People who know me, they write nice letters about me. They know that I'm a young lady who loves and helps others in every way that I can. while in jail i've helped others learn better english and even spanish i've received honors from jail for my studies i always look forward to receiving new books to read from my mother i want to thank my parents is this an oscar winning speech or is it like yeah i want to thank my parents for helping me through this part of my life especially my mother who has traveled back and forth to china to visit me in jail i owe everything to my parents i know i've let them down but I promise I will someday make them proud again.
47:53They sent me to the United States for a better life and a better education. Along with that came a lot of freedom. In fact, too much freedom that I just wasn't used to. In China, I was very obedient and cheerful while living with my parents. Here, I became lonely and lost. I didn't tell my parents how I felt because I didn't want to burden them. I didn't want them to worry about me. I wish I told them how I felt. I took all that stress and carried all the emotions by myself without saying a single word I'm sure my emotions began to take over and I did bad things to people I reflect on my behavior and I ask how could I have done such bad things?
48:34I have no answer except to say there's no excuse and no one to blame but myself I really miss my family, my friends, and the little things in life that we don't really think a lot about until we lose them life is not only about having the latest iphone or pretty dresses also when people like make a really heinous action but they're like let me tell you what i learned from this you are in no teaching spot lady like you are not a motivational speaker girl what's going on it's about respecting others and being kind and respectful to your parents and everyone else. When I got arrested in this case, I lost those things.
49:15I never thought about the consequences. Now I know what bad behavior can do to you and how fast I can lose the love and company of my parents and my freedom. I'm asking those whom I have harmed for forgiveness. I'm deeply sorry. I mean that with all sincerity. I hope they do not carry the wounds from what I did throughout their lives. Please find it in your hearts to forgive me. The whole time the attorney read her statement, Helen had her face covered with paper. So we have no idea what her expression was. Well, she didn't read it. Oh, no, her attorney read it. She covered her face with paper.
49:47Wow. She just sat there. I mean, I doubt her face looks remorseful. I mean, the fact that she's talking about how she's only being judged for two days of her 19 years of living is honestly, arguably, I don't know why her attorney approved it. But she covered the face? Yeah, she was like covering her mouth area like this and stuff with paper what what is that i feel like she's probably smirking or she knew it's full of lies and can't look at the judge yeah i just think sometimes i don't know why the attorney let this happen it's just logically speaking not the smartest choice it it would take 10 seconds for someone to shoot someone and kill them should they be judged for those 10 seconds of their lives?
50:28Because 10 seconds is such a short amount of time compared to the 50 years that they didn't shoot someone. Like, what is that argument? And it's clear where all these kids are getting it from. None of the parents were any better. One of the dads of the minors was arrested during this trial. He flew from China, got arrested. Why? He tried to bribe the victim to say something nice about his daughter tried to give the victim money hoping that the judge will give all the other kids higher sentences and go lenient on his daughter because the victim would say this one was the one that was nice or she seemed like too scared to stop it yeah the victim did not fall for it he was caught trying to bribe the victim was arrested on suspicion of bribery and obstruction of justice it only backfired because it only attracted more attention to this case in China.
51:20I will say this case blew up a lot more in China than in the US. And for a lot of reasons, Chinese netizens were so disgusted. And it also was a soft point for the nation itself, because there are a lot of, you know, hard relations with the United States. And to have these high schoolers that are Chinese nationals go to the United States, do such heinous things, it was just so disappointing and embarrassing as a nation. So it became a topic of conversation where it's not just a bullying case, but like, what are we doing as parents? Like, are we headed in the right direction? Is this a good idea for parents to just like parachute their kids to all these other countries if they can't handle their children?
52:09Like, that's not good parenting. And his arrest would only draw more attention to that. The prosecutors would end up dropping the charges because he was technically caught before he could actually pay and bribe the witness. But I think it answered the question that netizens had of, how do the kids even get like this? Yet they're parents. The answer is they're parents. In the end, Helen was sentenced to 13 years in prison, kidnapping, assault, and serious personal injury. She can get out in eight years for good behavior. Coco, who burned Camelia with cigarettes, was sentenced to 10 years, but can get out in five years.
52:41And then John was sentenced to six years in prison, but can get out in three. The first time the court saw any emotion other than giggly, cockiness, and sexual innuendos and looks between all of them was when their verdicts were read. They sobbed so hard, their whole bodies were shaking. Yeah, I guess they couldn't believe it. According to their defense attorneys, they advise their clients to not appeal because if they continue to fight, they will likely get higher sentences. This was the absolute best outcome that they could have ever wished for. Which is infuriating. As for the three underage kidnappers, they had a private trial.
53:18They were all sentenced to under a year in a juvenile facility, and they will not be deported back to China after they complete their sentence. The three adults will be deported back to China. A lot of people were upset about this. There was actually a lot of discourse amongst Americans, too, about Helen, John, and Coco, and about the American prison system and justice system when it comes to foreign nationals who commit crimes. Some American taxpayers were upset that their taxpayer money is supporting these three in jail, and then they just get sent back to their home country. Then others were arguing, actually, no, the American prison system is so miserable.
53:53They kind of deserve it. So it was a debate, but these were the most hated high schoolers in China. A lot of Chinese netizens, they did feel very embarrassed on behalf of the nation, but they also were using this as an opportunity to change how they saw things. So there was actually a movement of sorts to have way stricter rules and regulations enforced for bullying in high schools in China, even though this didn't take place in China. So they were saying how this is actually maybe we should follow that route. So in China right now, if you're caught for bullying, it's amongst the school and administrators.
54:33In America, it seems like it was a legal case. We should make it a legal case. And another thing is the victim ended up suing the three adults for, you know, wrongful, involuntary captivity or something along those lines, right? And it was another conversation in China because for financial compensation for crimes in China, it's really hard to reach a settlement. when an adult causes a death the victim's family is only compensated typically for funeral expenses emotional and mental damage compensations are not as common in china but in the u.s courts are usually more open to taking that into consideration for victims of violent crimes so china was really enraged about this and netizens are saying maybe there are a few things that we should also adapt into our legal system because it just doesn't make sense which side note i don't want to make this like a one country versus another country or a comparison, I think bullying is definitely an international problem.
55:28Every country has a lot of work to do to create a safer space for children. I mean, clearly in America, I would hardly call schools a safe space for kids. So safety in schools generally is a global issue that needs to be addressed. So it was a way to have that hard conversation. But this did not stop the internet from ripping Helen Coco and John to shreds. Tiffany was even telling me about this, but they called John helmet head hair boy. They ripped apart Helen's statement. One Redditor said, I love how the girl blames her situation on too much freedom when the root cause is too little personality, ethics, and adult supervision.
56:04You don't need a boot on your neck and a gun near your back to be a decent human being and do the right thing. Other Chinese netizens joked and laughed about how they were really excited to see what kind of bullying the three adults in Doran prison in the U.S. prison system. Other Chinese netizens wrote about how Chinese parents need to do better when sending their children abroad. It's only hurting them, but they convinced themselves that this is the best thing that they can do is provide a better education by being away from them. But what are your thoughts? Do you think a lot of this has to do with the fact that they were left unsupervised in a new country?
56:39Do you think regardless of where these heinous people were, they were going to do heinous things eventually do you think the punishment is harsh enough let me know in the comments please stay safe and i will see you guys on wednesday for another episode bye
From the publisher
Hellen, Coco, and John were 3 peas in a pod. Hellen was dating John but Coco was her best friend and they did everything together. Right now, they were sitting side by side planning what to do for Hellen’s 19th birthday.
Hellen and John shared suggestive looks with each other before the door opened and their nemesis walked in. Camellia. Hellen and Camellia had been in a fight over the same boys and it was coming to an end now. Hellen had finally put Camellia in her place.
The 3 best friends’ names were called. They stood up, smiled at each other, and made their way to the front. The judge read their charges - “kidnapping, assault, and torture.” How do you plea?
“Not guilty.” They smirked and glared at Camellia.
Full Source Notes: rottenmangopodcast.com
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