In short
Rotten Mango Podcast Episode Notes
Episode Title
Ghislaine Maxwell Spills Secrets About 5 Billionaires In First Ever Prison Interview
Episode Summary
This episode dives into Ghislaine Maxwell's first prison interview, where she discusses her past connections, including her brother-in-law Al Sekel and his strange ties to Jeffrey Epstein. The discussion unfolds how Maxwell navigated her life intertwined with controversial figures and addresses various conspiracy theories surrounding her and Epstein.
---
Key Points
Introduction to Al Sekel
- Al Sekel's Parties: Known for eccentric gatherings in LA, Sekel had unique invitations asking guests to bring the most interesting person they know.
- Optical Illusions: Sekel was known for his collection of optical illusions and had a quirky personality.
- Connection to Epstein: Emails reveal Sekel helped Epstein clean up his public image post-conviction in 2010.
Al Sekel's Mysterious Death
- Death Investigation: Found dead at a cliff in France in 2015, missing a hand and foot; ruled as suicide.
- Questionable Circumstances: The episode raises questions about the number of suicides linked to Epstein and his associates.
Ghislaine Maxwell's Prison Interview
- Circumstances of the Interview: Conducted with government officials, it was her first chance to present her side of the story publicly.
- Denial of Involvement: Maxwell claimed she was largely uninvolved in Epstein’s activities, despite evidence to the contrary.
Political Dynamics and Conspiracy Theories
- Epstein’s Connections: Discussion includes Epstein's potential ties to intelligence services and high-profile individuals.
- The Transparency Act: Highlights political intrigue surrounding the act aimed at revealing more about Epstein's network.
Major Themes
- Illusions of Power: The podcast draws parallels between Maxwell's optical illusions and the deceptive nature of her and Epstein's societal façade.
- Victim Blaming: Maxwell attempts to shift blame to Virginia Giuffre for recruiting underage girls, perpetuating victim-blaming narratives.
- Media Manipulation: The role of media in shaping public perception of Epstein and his associates is scrutinized.
Closing Remarks
- Future Speculations: The episode ends with speculation on whether forthcoming files will provide substantial revelations about Epstein and his connections.
---
Key Takeaways
- The intertwining lives of Ghislaine Maxwell and figures like Al Sekel and Jeffrey Epstein highlight complex issues involving power, influence, and narratives surrounding crime.
- Maxwell’s interview largely attempts to downplay her involvement while hinting at larger conspiracies and connections with powerful entities.
- The ongoing discussions about Epstein's case and its implications reflect broader societal issues regarding trafficking and abuse.
---
Additional Resources
- Demand Justice for Epstein Survivors: [Change.org Petition](https://www.change.org/EpsteinSurvivors)
- Full Show Notes: Available at [RottenMangoPodcast.com](https://www.rottenmangopodcast.com)
Warning: Episode includes discussions of sensitive topics such as domestic violence, suicide, and child sexual abuse. Listener discretion is advised.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:02To be the best at something is already quite difficult. to be the best at hosting parties in Los Angeles is near impossible. I would not be surprised if the best party event planner in Los Angeles is paid in the seven-figure range per year. It's all about the famous caterers, the decorators, a giant ice sculpture shaped like a throbbing Academy Award because how else will anybody know that you have one? Trays of caviar being served with McDonald's chicken nuggets because pairing and wasting caviar on something that is not expensive is the ultimate signal of wealth in Los Angeles. These are likely some of the prerequisites on throwing the best parties in LA.
0:45Unless your name is Al. Al does not do any of this, but everybody wants to go to his house parties. There are no trays in the bathroom for people to do lines of snow off of. There's not a single fish egg in sight. Just strange invitations that show up at your doorstep. The invitations are vague, but they're pretty straightforward in the sense of like it's vague depending on how you're going to execute it. But quote, bring a copy of the book that you have most enjoyed. I would spend days thinking about that. Do they mean smut? Do they mean like fun book? Do they mean educational book, self-help book that transformed in my life or book that I had the most hee hee ha ha kicking my feet reading?
1:27What does it mean? Or another, bring the most interesting person that you've ever met. How do you even get the most interesting person to come with you? Because you're not the most interesting person. They're probably the most interesting person. When you show up, you likely realize that you have brought the least interesting person with you because there are Nobel prize winning physicists. The guy over there works for NASA. He won't tell you what he does, but he works for NASA. Magicians, celebrities who are not even the star of the party, the host himself, Al, will usher you inside with his arm draped around your shoulder as if you've been best friends for decades, even though he looks a few decades older than you.
2:07And almost like it is just planned from the beginning. Somehow he's asking you about how the car ride was. Was there traffic? How was it coming up the hills? and then suddenly you're standing in front of a painting on a wall and this painting is moving. Is the painting moving? It's likely that later someone at the party will lean over and tell you, oh you don't know? Al's the world's greatest collector of optical illusions. Apparently he made a lot of money dealing rare books and now he collects optical illusions like that painting. Al is the type of guy that likes to say things like, reality is that which exists independently of your perception or beliefs.
2:42Your perception may be aligned with reality and then it may not be and you wouldn't know. I don't know what that means. What does that mean? He's even released multiple books on optical illusions and a lot of people at the time think that this, he just has this oddball quality about him. He even gave multiple TED talks where he talks about how visual illusions are powerful because they violate your expectations. There's this one part where the crowd is just eating up everything he's saying and you would think that this is like a Netflix debut comedy special he shows a picture of what appears to be a man and a woman partaking in activities and this is shadow play so it's like the shadow of a woman leaned up against a glass bottle she's like inside the glass bottle and there's a man behind her you know doing what they do and he would say something like this is the best example of priming by experience that I know if you are a child under the age of 10 that hasn't been ruined yet you will see the emergency dolphins yeah you see dolphins no but it's odd that he says a child under 10 that hasn't been ruined yet it's just a little weird okay and then he goes on to show a picture of a thing that a six-year-old drew turned into her teacher the assignment being what do you want to be when you grow up and because of the way that the story is presented his voice his tone his cadence clearly it looks like this six-year-old drew someone who might be a midnight ballerina.
4:07That's what it appears to be. And the six-year-old writes on there, when I grow up, I want to be just like mommy. So now the insinuation is mommy is a midnight ballerina because it looks like someone on a pole and there's a bunch of people holding up wads of cash. The crowd is laughing and then he shows a letter. This is the letter that the mother sent the teacher. Dear Miss Jones, I wish to clarify that I am not now, nor have I ever been a dancer. I work at Home Depot, and I told my daughter how hectic it has been last week before the blizzard hit. I told her we sold out every single shovel we had, and then I found one last one in the back room, and that several people were fighting over it, and who would get it?
4:48Her picture doesn't show me dancing around a pole. It's supposed to depict me selling the last snow shovel we had at Home Depot. From now on, I will remember to check on her homework more. Thank you. So it's a lot of weird stuff but it's not alarming it's all like fun and games right until the recent release of the epstein emails december 16th 2010 one email from al seckle to jeffrey epstein reads the job was far worse than originally expected you have a dedicated group of people trying to undo and damage you he's talking to epstein in 2010 after his conviction his first conviction including now they have started up again last week full force again it's obvious that they can't fuck with your wiki page because we blocked that so he's going in and he's making sure no one can write in Jeffrey Epstein's Wikipedia page the woman from the Daily Beast who wrote an article about you we have programs that track this stuff and so for the past few days Mike has been having a cyber war with her minions we're actively trying to undo what we are doing she's trying to push her Daily Beast and other articles back up so we have to go back and push them back down in the Google searches Then there was the issue of trying to, you know, create a positive web presence for you with the science and organization sites.
6:02I spent literally four months of nonstop work creatively and my own political capital to get you this far, which saved you not only time, but countless dollars and isn't something that can be readily bought. I had people also working for free. We did manage to get rid of the Daily Beast article, which is now far removed in spite of their own efforts to keep it prominent. Wikipedia was an important victory, and it will always be at the top of the search engine results. Now the headlines do not mention convicted sex offender or pedophile. Instead, philanthropic work, Epstein Foundation, promotion of scientists.
6:32We've stopped the hacking on your wiki site, and that was a major effort. Your wiki entry now is pretty tame, and bad stuff has been muted and pushed to the bottom. Careful editing and wording has muted the effect immensely. We also hacked this site to replace the mugshot in the caption. They hacked Wikipedia. These emails are from 2010. What is the connection between Al Seckle and Epstein? Is this just another one of Epstein's friends who owes him a favor? Al Seckle is actually much closer than that. He's almost family in a way. He is Ghislaine Maxwell's brother-in-law. And soon after these emails, Al Seckle goes missing.
7:11At least that's what everybody thought. Until weeks later, there is a stench that leads investigators to the bottom of a 100-foot cliff in France, and there, missing a hand and a foot that was likely eaten by a wild boar, is Al Sekel. Wait, when did he die? 2015. So he sent the email in 2010? Yes. This was exposed in 2015? No, it was exposed recently. But in 2015, he died? Yes. There were allegations that he was a fraud rare book seller. but they say that he self-exited but it's interesting because how many self-exits connected to one case is too many and what does he do he why is he doing all of this for him is this just uh like he gets paid by epstein i don't think that he's getting paid much he was dating gillaine maxwell's sister so this is like a little favor to keep the family but i mean the speculation is, is it really a favor or is it maybe you owe Epstein?
8:13Because I mean, I love my extended family. I don't know if I would illegally hack a website for them. Go that far. Yeah, especially when they've been convicted of the crime that everyone on the internet is posting about. So truly, how many self-exits connected to one case is too many.
8:50we would like to thank today's sponsors who have made it possible for rotten mingo to support the coalition to abolish slavery and trafficking aka caste this episode's partnerships have also made it possible to support rotten mingo's growing team and we'd also like to thank you guys for continued support as we work on our mission to be worthy advocates as always full show notes are available at RottenMinglePodcast.com. This episode involves mentions of alleged DV, self-exit, CSA, trafficking. Please watch with caution. And this is part three of our coverage of the Epstein files. And I think by this point, hopefully the new Epstein files will be released.
9:26That's going to take a lot of time to sort through. If you guys are interested, I can definitely make some follow-up videos. But I mean, we don't even really know what's going to come out of the Transparency Act. Truly, like there is no guarantee that we're going to get any answers to this or if we're just going to get another dump of emails where it's like, oh yes, we kind of knew that these people had some sort of relationship, but these emails don't kickstart an investigation. They don't really bring justice or anything. So it might just be that. But just another side note, I am not legally accusing anyone of doing anything.
9:58All of these allegations, all of these accusations and the discourse around each person that's involved or not involved with Jeffrey Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell is readily available to be consumed online. There are countless court documents. There are countless things that have been released by the House Oversight Committee. There are so many things that have been circulating online that you can read for yourself and come to your own opinion. So with that being said, let's get started. The committee is where bills go to die. They are the gatekeepers. Before a bill even reaches the Congress floor, the congressional floor, okay, to have a full vote, they have to go through the committee first.
10:37And when they do, 90 to 95 % of them die. They never make it out of the committee onto the floor, except this bill, Jeffrey Epstein's Transparency Act. I mean, why would it not get signed by everyone, right? They just have to make it to the congressional floor. Why would you not want to know more about those that are involved with Eggstein. By the way, that was from a deposition, okay? So a lot of people have been calling him Eggstein recently. There was an old deposition of Jeffrey Epstein where he is asked about if his private part is truly shaped like an egg. And he gets so upset, he walks out of the deposition.
11:12And for that, he is now Mr. Eggstein. Now, the Jeffrey Epstein Transparency Act was a bipartisan joint effort from Democrat Ro Khanna from California. and Republican Thomas Massey from Kentucky. Interestingly enough, when the Republicans find out that Thomas Massey is working on this bill, so he's trying to get it onto the House floor so they can vote. Once they vote, it goes to the Senate. Then once they vote, if it passes, it goes to the president and it is now signed as an act. Like this is going to happen. When the Republicans find out what Thomas Massey is doing, they are not happy. The leadership is not happy, including Donald Trump.
11:51Trump attacks Massey on social media, calling him, quote, a real loser. Thomas Massey, the worst Republican congressman and an almost guarantee no vote each and every time is an embarrassment, with a capital E, to Kentucky. He's lazy, slow moving, and totally disingenuous. A real loser. Never has anything positive to add. Looking for someone good to run against this guy. Someone I can capital E endorse and vigorously campaign for. I don't know why embarrassment and endorse are capitalized E for Epstein, I guess, right? But like, he really hates Massey now. He made fun of him for getting remarried a year after his wife died last year in 2024.
12:31And Trump is posting online, boy, that was quick. No wonder the polls have him at less than 8 % chance of winning the election. Anyway, have a great life, Thomas and question mark. Because he doesn't know the new wife's name. His wife will soon find out that she's stuck with a loser Thomas Massey comes out swinging too I mean the girls are really fighting in this one In an interview he says The deal for Republicans on this vote Is that Trump will protect you if you vote the wrong way In other words If you vote to cover up for pedophiles You've got cover in the Republican primary I will say that the MAGA base Was having a hard time with this one With a good chunk of MAGA At least from what we could find online Siding with the Epstein Transparency Act Most likely this act was going to get stomped on.
13:14Because if party leadership doesn't want to get it passed, it's not going to get past the committee. Which is why Congressman Ro Khanna and Thomas Massey, they go around it and they do something called a discharge petition. I will say to get this act onto the House floor to be voted on was a pretty dramatic thing that a lot of people don't talk about. So it means that in order for you to bypass the committee, you have to do a discharge petition. For a discharge petition, you have to have majority of the house representatives you need 218 out of the 435 to file and sign this discharge petition but they make it so there's so many legal loopholes such as the 218 members of the house have to physically go to the clerk's desk at the house chamber to sign the document they can't do like a docu sign so it's hard yeah but also like it's kind of their job so just like go do it right and this is where three republican house representatives marjorie Taylor Green is of Georgia, Lauren Boebert of Colorado and Nancy Mace of South Carolina.
14:14They decide that they are going to be the three Republicans to sway from party leadership. No Republican wants to sign this discharge petition. Every single Democrat has signed it, except the only Republicans are these three Congresswomen and Thomas Massey. So these four people changed everything. Yes. Wow. Republican Speaker of the House, Mike Johnson. Fascinating guy. and by fascinating, I mean, what the hell? He states that he opposes the discharge petition because he was worried about the victims. Though most people believe it's more likely that he was just doing what Trump wants. Okay, so there was a lot of drama.
14:51In addition to the four Republicans signing this discharge petition, there was a situation where a Democratic House representative had passed away and his daughter actually got elected as the representative and she's clearly a Democrat and so she needed to be sworn in so that she could sign. Otherwise, they would be down a number from the Democrats. I mean, it's clearly she's going to sign it. She's a Democrat. But also, they were just really trying to not let her get sworn in to the point where at one point, the Republican House rep, Mike Johnson, was like, no, no, no, the government is shut down, so we can't sign her in.
15:29Or it's the weekend, or we only meet certain times of month, and we can't sign her in. And everyone's like, why can't you sign her in? A lot of people have been sworn in when they haven't had everybody present. And he's like, no, no, no, it's for her. I want her to get the full experience of being sworn in. Like it's a whole thing. It's a whole ordeal. And everyone's like, swear her in so that she can sign the document. There was a lot of drama. But ultimately, with the four Republicans and every single Democrat, the discharge petition gets 218 signatures. Exactly. Just to give you an idea, the modern discharge rule was established in 1931, and out of like 673 discharge petitions, only 47-ish have gotten the 218 signatures.
16:14And then out of those, like only a handful have gotten through. The odds are not in the favor of the Epstein Transparency Act. But it does now go to the floor to be voted on, and they have to get it through the House, then the Senate, and then finally the President. When the discharge petition gets on the House floor, the House votes 427 to 1. Who is the one lone no vote? Republican Clay Higgins of Louisiana, who argued that the release could cause undue harm to innocent witnesses and family members related to the case. He wrote on X, it abandons 250 years of criminal justice procedure in America.
16:54You know, as written, this bill reveals and injures thousands of innocent people, witnesses, people who have provided alibis, family members. If enacted in its current form, this type of broad reveal of criminal investigative files released to a rabid media will absolutely result in innocent people being hurt. So everyone voted to like release it at that point. Is it because like they know it's going to happen? yeah so at that point even uh once it got the discharge petition went through even trump was like republicans should just vote yes oh so republicans get the party leadership approval which is so everyone got the memo it's like okay this it's gonna happen now regardless but that guy still decided for no even house speaker mike johnson he decided to save his own skin because at that point everyone is looking at anyone who's gonna vote no and go hey so um yeah what's on your computer what are who are you emailing people wanted to know and so i think at that point everyone's saving their skin except for clay higgins who has always been super mega so then it goes to the senate and the senators they unanimously passed the bill and like it sounds climactic it sounds like every single one of them sat there and was like signing the bill but um no the they were just like hey can we just anyone have any objections or are we just going to unanimously pass it.
18:16They were like, okay, no objections. It is passed. And by November 19th, 2025, the bill lands on President Trump's desk and he signs it into law. There's a lot of reasons why people think and have these conspiracy theories that Epstein was a spy, an intelligence officer for a foreign nation. The main one that comes up is Israel, that he was an intelligence spy for Israel. Netizens think that this is just too much power. The way that if you read through Epstein's emails, he does not align himself with one political party in the United States. When someone he's talking to is Republican, he takes a more Republican viewpoint.
18:54When someone he's talking to is a Democrat, he takes a more Democratic viewpoint. And it just seems that all of his connections lined up more so to be in the Democratic Party. Because, you know, he had Ghislaine Maxwell, who knew the Clintons, and then they knew all of these connections. But it does not seem like he himself was like a staunch democrat like oh i lean left these are my political views which is so interesting but he's so well connected globally to a bunch of international foreign nations and leaders and the tapes the alleged tapes that epstein has of his client list abusing children there is this question of do those tapes exist or not because pam bondy attorney general of the united states has stated that she has seen tens of thousands of tapes, right?
19:39But she does state that it's between Epstein and miners, but they were never found. And some people say it's because they were never Epsteins. They belong to the foreign intelligences, and they're not going to let it be found. She has seen it? She says she has. But it hasn't been found. What does that even mean? Did you find it or not find it? Well, I guess the argument there is they're saying they're not going to release it because it's CCM. But she does state that it's Epstein and miners.
20:18now what's interesting is that all of the victims well most of the victims for epstein and galane they don't recall being filmed when they were partaking in activities with epstein but a lot of them recall that epstein and galane would allegedly talk about how they had some sort of power over these powerful men that these women were trafficked to, that these girls were trafficked to. So it doesn't make sense. That's why people are saying it wouldn't make sense that Epstein has videos of himself committing acts, like tens of thousands of videos of himself partaking in illegal activities with minors.
20:55Like what would be the purpose of that unless he gets off on it? But none of the victims have said, oh yeah, he gets off on filming these things with us. So that's why people think that those tapes are not of Jeffrey Epstein. But regardless, it seems like whether they exist or do not exist, the DOJ is not specifying anything more because they're saying it's CSAM. And no one is saying that it should be released or no one is saying that we should get screenshots or anything. It's just weird. It's weird. It doesn't help that Ehud Barak and a few other world leaders were pictured previously with Epstein or have admitted to having met him.
21:31And along with a massive dump of emails, Epstein's Kindle purchases get released, his digital Kindle purchases. I will say it's very interesting. In the beginning, he's reading books like Conversations with a Mathematician, Exploring Randomness, even the Jesus Dynasty, a Hidden History of Jesus, His Royal Family, and the Birth of Christianity. And then he starts picking up books about family wealth management, the story of a practical idealist, managing money books, Why We Get Sick, The Celebrity Assistance Handbook, which details how to deal with the ultra wealthy, Bitcoin for Dummies, Blockchain Technology Explained.
22:10He also purchases at least four separate books, digital books on Donald Trump. Another book about gay Catholic priests, another one titled The Serious Guide to Joke Writing, which is not about gay Catholic priests. However, it does appear that his interests start changing a little bit in 2014 with the books The Man from O.R.G.Y. It's a man who studies intimate relations and he studies it and he loves it and it makes studying intimate relations even easier. However, the blurb continues. He does odd jobs here and there for, quote, the most secret of American spy organizations. This unnamed agency, which is definitely not the CIA, might send him to various action spots in the world, but it's his lust that makes the spots get active.
22:57he just starts reading a bunch of spy books along with purchases like the complete guide of men pilates the physics of immortality which is about how humans can be resurrected which virginia dufret states in her memoir quote i'll tell you one thing though while i've read that epstein was buried in an unmarked grave not far from his parents in palm beach florida i don't believe that at all epstein had repeatedly told me exactly what would happen when he died his body would be placed in some sort of cryogenic chamber to be preserved until technology advanced far enough back to bring him back to life.
23:34That's what he always bragged to me with that satisfied smirk on his face. I know it sounds far-fetched but I wouldn't bet against the notion that he somehow got his way on this. One of his last book purchases in the last three months of his life is Lolita, the annotated and revised version about a man who is obsessed with a 12-year-old girl. however the most interesting purchase that everybody has been dissecting thus far online is quote the title rise and kill first the secret history of israel's targeted assassinations people think it's interesting because there is a speculation that he he's an intelligence officer a spy for israel and then he ends up dying in prison later additionally in that vein he would also make these very strange notes that he would email himself.
24:21It's like the journals of a mentally corrupt human. I don't even really know what to call them. So he would just email these random, it'd be like one, two, three, four, it would be numbered in a bullet point list. And then it would be random words in sequences. It's like he's speaking in code or he's talking to himself, but it would say things like taste. Number 26, taste? Question mark. Food? Question mark. Kissing? question mark. It's like he's playing the world's weirdest word association game. Other lists include 26, money, agreements, debt, power, value, wealth, cost. Number 27, dreaming all day long.
25:01Number 28, only six senses question mark. And then at the bottom of this like numbered list, it would just be a whole group of people's names. Hopkins, Danny, Chomsky, Teal, Hoffman, Ehud, Bannon, Barack, Woody. What? So a lot of netizens, they've been speculating that these names correlate to a certain number. And these numbers are the last conversations that he had with these people so that next time he converses with them, he can remember what they conversed about or maybe what their interests were in but it's very weird because if you're just a normal person and you don't expect that these are going to go public why not write it in a journal where it's a little bit easier to understand why go through the why couldn't you just write hopkins and then whatever that was if that is in case what is happening here right right right so it seems like it's just code it's so you're saying that he expected to go public one day or he's sending this email to himself but there are other people who have access to this email or maybe he's taught always to write in code or to mix it up a little bit it's just weird yeah it's it's weird it's very weird and there really are only a few people that would understand what that is and one of them would be Ghislaine Maxwell there are only a few people allowed in that room when Ghislaine Maxwell gets interviewed for like the first and probably the last time a few months ago.
26:33Spencer Horn, Assistant Special Agent in Charge of the FBI. Deputy Attorney General Todd Blanche. Also in the room you have Diego Pistana, Associate Deputy Attorney General Mark Beard from the U.S. Marshals and Ghislaine's attorneys David Marcus and Leah Safion, Melissa Magical and Todd Blanche speaks. Go ahead. And I'm Ghislaine Maxwell. This is the proffer interview of Ghislaine Maxwell, July 24th, 2025, 10, 12 a.m. Todd Blanche tells her what a proffer agreement is and that it's quote, the most important part of this agreement is that this isn't a cooperation agreement, meaning that by you meeting with us today, we're really just meeting.
27:16I'm not promising to do anything. I'm not promising to ask Judge Nathan or any of the judges that's been assigned to your case to do anything about it. We are just talking. However, almost as important as the fact that what this agreement does for you is it gives you protection. The government cannot use what you say today against you with some exceptions, which we'll talk about in a minute. So those exceptions are things like perjury. Like if you lie, they can get you for perjury. But Blanche says, Ms. Maxwell, I guess about a week and a half or two ago, Mr. Marcus, your attorney, reached out to me and said that you wanted to speak with somebody from the government about not only your case but about everything that's been in the media and that's been publicized about mr epstein in your case the government said that i'm not doing anything for you but i'm gonna yeah you say you want to talk so i'm here to listen what is this all about right why is she telling all of these things without any returns and like when the fuck has the government ever listened to anybody let alone someone that has been convicted of any sort of crime.
28:16So it's very interesting. And like I said in the previous episode, it's interesting that this is all coming about when the administration is under a lot of fire about being connected with Epstein. Todd Blanch has some pretty strong connections to President Trump and not just by being the deputy attorney general. He was previously Trump's personal attorney. So there's a lot of a lot of weird things happening here. But one thing that's very important to note is this is really the first time that we hear from Ghislaine herself. We know Ghislaine from what everybody has said about her from the documents that have been released.
28:50She never testified during her trial. And there's just and even her trial itself, it was in federal court. It was never live streamed. This is the first time we really hear Ghislaine Maxwell, her voice for a prolonged period of time. Yeah. And she's just as crazy as I freaking imagined. So she starts whining initially about how nobody from the government ever wanted to talk to her, even when she was first indicted and prosecuted, which she states she always wanted to talk to someone at SDNY, which speaking of SDNY, there is a lot of drama happening right now where Marine Comey, the former FBI director's daughter, was a prosecutor.
29:29She was an attorney for SDNY. She worked on the... SDNY is... The Southern District of New York. This is a federal district. So these are the feds. so they prosecute a lot of white collar crimes this is the same district that prosecuted sean combs so it's it's federal court you can't bring cameras in there it can't be live streamed now maureen comey who also worked on sean combs case she worked initially on jeffrey epstein's case never went to trial because he died and then she worked on galaine maxwell's case and that did go to trial and she was convicted. Now she gets fired. She gets fired this year all around the time of this Epstein file talk.
Read the full transcript
30:11And her father, James Comey, who was the former FBI director, he's in like a huge lawsuit and it's so messy over there. But people just think all this timing is very odd and interesting. Very odd and interesting. So Ghislaine Maxwell is like, SDNY never wanted to talk to me. Even when they indicted me, they didn't want to talk to me. And she says, quote, and I offered myself and I kept asking if they would meet with me so I could talk to them. And for whatever reason, that was not happening. So she starts from the very beginning of how she met Epstein, where there were rumors that it was through her dad, that it was on a blind date.
30:47And in Ghislaine's version of events, she says her friend is like, hey, you're almost 30. So she says, quote, I don't need to tell you guys. That's a very important moment for a girl to like think about important things. So her friend is like, because you're an old, old decrepit little lady now, you got to think about dating somebody. So her friend introduces her to Epstein, who is dating the friend's sister. Imagine you're like, hey, you need a boyfriend. My sister's boyfriend could be a great pick for you. He's great. I think you guys should get married. and apparently that's what happened. So Ghislaine meets him at his office where she notices a giant ketchup stain on his tie and she is so smitten by this ketchup stain that she was like, yes, I will commit atrocious felonies with you.
31:35Let's do this. Ghislaine also thinks that we have the intelligence of a drowning cockroach because she tells Todd Blanche that she slept with Epstein one time in the beginning of their friendship, you know? They were never really dating per se. They slept together once and then she didn't sleep with him again for a very long time and it I mean just it was the relationship was just not that serious you know Epstein told me that he had a heart condition a what heart condition heart condition heart condition which meant that he didn't have intercourse a lot which suited me fine because I actually do have a medical condition myself which precludes me of having a lot of intercourse so what was your understanding of his heart condition and why that prevented him from having intercourse regularly?
32:22I don't know. I mean he liked other forms of sexual activities. So she states later that he really likes self-pleasuring and blowjobs. I don't know what the difference between intercourse and I don't know what is she says. So we stopped having relations in 1999. Not full sex. Sorry just to be clear you know. didn't mean that we didn't still share a bedroom sometimes or whatever. In fact, she says that they never really did it. And all of these women who are accusing her of bringing them into the room, leading the massage, being involved in these group activities, she's like, oh God, that's really not me.
33:00Like I've only ever done it with Epstein like a few times. And on top of that, I mean, people think that we are connected by the hip, but that is not at all the case. We barely ever hung out. We actually didn't really like each other like that. She says, in fact, I didn't like the people that he was with anyway. So how do I say this? He was always surrounded by young people, right? I like people who are my age or older, and I don't find the society of the companionship of younger people, I suppose, is really that enjoyable. So I don't like the company that he chose to be with. So I just I found it boring and fundamentally uninteresting.
33:38That's probably the nicest way that I can say it. he's throwing uh epstein under the bus now yeah and she says that by the way if case you guys didn't know i was in a full-blown relationship with a billionaire oh yeah she states that during this time she was dating another billionaire by the name of todd wyatt wait wyatt but he this is in from 2003 to like 2010 and she says that he is the founder of gateway computers quote as you may know and we had an amazing relationship that ended when up until 2010 I think and I was with Ted from that time so she says that she even attended Chelsea Clinton's wedding as Ted's guest weird and she says you know back in those times if you asked Ghislaine where Epstein was she would even tell you I would have no idea I didn't even have the keys to his houses like I think it's crazy like she makes it seem like it's crazy that everybody is saying that they were joined at the hip that they were bonnie and clyde she's like i barely saw the guy if you asked me where he was at any given point i don't think i would have had the answer i didn't think so i mean that's how detached we were what time frame was all the crimes happening is that the same time frame that she claimed yes oh so she claims that i wasn't even there yeah she's like i barely know the man blanche is like okay so when epstein was first arrested in like 2008 that's when you realize that something was wrong with the guy?
35:05She's like, I didn't even know that. I didn't even understand. She's like, I didn't even know that he was arrested. I read through the press. What? She's like, I didn't have any context for that. You know, I was, I didn't, I'm not even sure what I thought. I was like, that's weird. So after you find out what happens with your relationship with Epstein, I asked him, you know, I asked him what was going on. And he said, not to worry nothing nothing taking care of it don't worry about it he didn't share you know i wasn't part of it all i was off with ted i really just was off with ted meanwhile while he's in prison she continues to take care of everything for him and he keeps paying her lots of money okay so what's going on with this conversation like she's just making up random stories and they're just listening to okay yeah i believe you keep going yeah basically like this conversation doesn't make any sense at all.
36:00Are they pushing her? Are they like challenging her or are they just listening? Barely. And there's so many parts of this conversation. And again, I'm really not trying to let any sort of political bias come through. But I do think that there's very suspect things in this entire Proffer interview, including the fact that there are various times in which she brings up the conversation of Trump and talks about how he has nothing to do with anything. There's that one point at the end of the day on day one, because this proper interview lasted two days where she's like, you know what? I just want to say something before we end this interview.
36:34And she's like, it really bothers me. And this is paraphrasing, but I mean, you could see it. I'm going to insert the clip. She's like, it really bothers me that people are associating President Trump with all of this stuff. And like, I don't know what's wrong with the media. And it's like, girly pop, nobody freaking asked you that just now. It's just weird. It's weird. It gets even weirder because there are moments where, okay, so for example, there's this one point of the proper interview where Todd Blanche is just like, look, if Epstein's flying from Palm Beach to St. Thomas and he's flying all over the country to New Mexico, to New York, or even to Palm Beach, and then there's young women, you know, putting aside whether they're under the age of 18 or in their 20s, they're there every day at the house, multiple massages on some days, you're interacting with the masseuses constantly.
37:24Ghislaine hits him with a huh Todd Blanche walks it back or maybe that's not right that's not right let me take back what I just said ignore that part okay wait what is that because she the whole interview she's talking about how she never really even interacted with the masseuses so like if she went to go get a massage from a third party and she says quote not one of those funky places meaning like a proper massage place and she likes the masseuse she'll bring them in to work on Epstein but she never was like recruiting underage people. She never really hung out with the masseuses. She states she wasn't even the one paying the masseuses, which goes against like every single victim's testimony.
38:00But she's like, I really had nothing to do with these masseuses. I never even saw anything sexual happen with a massage, like a masseuse, nothing. And so at this point, he says, you're interacting with the masseuses constantly. And she just hits him with a, huh? He walks it back. Or maybe that's not right. That's not right. so like he's catering his story based on whatever she just said yes and i understand that there is to some degree you want to make the convicted felon feel a little bit more comfortable so that they feel like they should open up and they should tell you things that they might not tell someone who is bringing in a hostile environment however it's so accommodating that we're getting absolutely nothing out of this i mean it's so ridiculous is todd blanche am i todd blanche like this is the most non-confrontational thing that i've ever witnessed in my life but how are you the deputy attorney general and todd blanche is actually quite a confrontational person really yeah so i mean i just don't understand what the hell is happening here so they seem very friendly so friendly so accommodating so polite like um what is happening yeah i i don't even understand the purpose of this interview exactly the purpose really just seems to be president trump is a great man and i don't think that he's involved and they just let her get away with things they let her get away with saying things like you know he told me he had difficulty having an erection i believed him blanche is like can you elaborate like what do you mean by that because when i didn't have sex with him after the first time I took it as a you know I asked him so was it me and he told me it was him Todd Blanche is like what she says I had never up until this moment in my life as if I'm not stupid I'm very bright I've had an excellent education I've traveled all over the world I had boyfriends but I had never ever met someone or understood that somebody could would lie about not being able to maintain an erection it never occurred to me I didn't have a frame of context within my life or experience elsewhere that somebody would be so manipulative and devious with me.
40:07Plus, I didn't have, you know, I was happy to not have sex because I have a condition that doesn't lend itself to that. So she just says, I never had intimate relations with Epstein because he can't have a bonbon or whatever you want to call it. This is her excuse for everything. She says, I was never involved. I was never having these relations where I was assaulting children with Epstein because he cannot. I've only had relations with Epstein one time. And then it was only one time. So I asked if it was my problem and he said, it's not your problem.
40:54the only thing that Todd Blanche does kind of stick to is like hey but you are getting paid a lot of money so you're saying that you're not recruiting masseuses for him like inappropriate masseuses that these are regular massage therapists but then you're just what you're a house manager You're signing contracts for third-party designers for all of his homes. That's about what you're telling me your job duties are, right? So we're talking$18.3 million in 1999,$5.5 million three years later in 2002, $7.4 million in 2007. That money adds up to be around$30 million. Ghislaine Maxwell responds, I don't believe any of that was my money, even though they're going straight to her accounts.
41:36What I'm just trying to make sure that I understand is that the idea that you were paid$30 million in order to buy Mr. Epstein to reward you for recruiting young women, you're saying that is categorically completely false. That is categorically false, correct? And then he doesn't really do anything about that. So then we just start going down the list of everybody that she's met and interacted with. She's asked about RFK Jr. And she's asked, did you meet RFK Jr.? Which he's like the head of our FDA right now. he's the Tylenol guy anyway she's like I'm sorry did you ever meet RFK Jr. yes when was that I met him at Andrew Cuomo's uh no Carrie's wedding who did Carrie marry Andrew Cuomo yes Andrew Cuomo's wedding she says that she likely met him before she was friendly with Epstein and quote I fancied him RFK Jr.
42:32I thought he was very attractive okay besides finding him attractive and fancying him did you have any sort of social relationship with him i mean we knew each other i thought he was wonderful and fun and i enjoyed meeting him we went out and i want to say we had a dinner or two but obviously i was very excited but that was it and i yeah and then i knew his brother i knew his brother and so now she's talking about andrew cuomo again i knew his brother you knew his brother he has a brother right what's his name he's on tv chris right christopher christopher cuomo but I would just say socially I'm just not close friends or anything but I was friends with Carrie which is Andrew Cuomo's ex-wife and I met him a few times and I certainly met his brother as well a few times yeah Carrie Andrew Cuomo's ex-wife is also Carrie Kennedy of the Kennedy family so um just so you know she's she's also not just part of the Kennedy family she is JFK's niece former president JFK's niece she was married to Andrew Cuomo until 2005 nevertheless the list of names continues.
43:37Ghislaine says that she does recall meeting Alan Dershowitz and his wife on the island but never had any sort of inappropriate behavior, never witnessed anything. How about Mr. Weinstein, Harvey Weinstein? What would you like to know? Do you know him? Yes. How do you know him? I wouldn't say that had I had any type of relationship with Harvey Weinstein socially. I would meet him because I would go to events that Harvey would be at and also his wife was English back then, Georgina, and I was friendly. Friendly would be a big word. We would see each other. Have you ever met Bill Gates over the years?
44:09Yes. Because of your relationship with Mr. Epstein or separate? I met Mr. Gates when I went to a TED conference. I actually spoke at the TED conference, not the main stage, the sub stage. And I also gave a few TEDx speeches, but I might have met them there. But we were friendly and I actually did meet him because I knew of, I don't know if he was chief of staff or whoever but Boris I met him I think once I may have actually yeah I may have met him a few times once and that would have been because of Epstein because Epstein was friendly with Boris and Boris uh that's all I remember who's Boris Boris is the chief of staff for Bill Gates apparently you don't ever recall being on a plane with Mr.
44:53Gates and flying to an island or anywhere no do you know Elon Musk I do and how do you know Mr. Musk I met I don't remember the year. It's going to be 2010, 2011. Something like that, if my memory serves. I was at an event for Sergey, the co-founder of Google. She is... How is she in everybody's business? It's crazy. Everybody's business. That is crazy. Yeah, that's why everyone's like, So she's like the peak social climber type of... People are saying, this is not a normal level of social climbing either. It's so weird. And the fact that Ghislaine Maxwell comes from a disgraced family, where her father was like stealing money from pension funds, it doesn't make sense.
45:38Right, right, right. It's like, why are these people talking to her? That's why people think that she was working with intelligence agencies. But she said that she was at an event for Sergey, the co-founder of Google. And Sergey, it was his birthday. And so a bunch of them, she says, quote, maybe, I don't know, if I would say 40, it could be wrong. It could be 30 or 50, I don't remember. went to another friend's island somebody called mr pigosi in the caribbean not with epstein he was not there so we were there to celebrate sergey's birthday and we were there together i want to say three to four days something like that and in my memory um mr musk was present for that so everybody has an island and you just like hop to different people's island yeah and she does mention that like richard branson also has an island nearby yeah oh my god did you uh did you meet or know Mr.
46:27Musk's brother. I don't know if I ever met him. I know that he has a brother. I don't think I met him. She mentions that they also met again after an Oscars after party. Elon Musk? Yeah. I believe that Epstein knew Musk. And the only reason I say that is not from my memory, because I saw, I mean, I think I saw. My memory is that in Discovery, they were communicating via email. But I mean, it's not necessarily the most incriminating thing. People have not been bringing musk's name into the epstein client list because he was the one that tweeted that trump is not releasing the files because there's there was a whole drama so there a lot of people are like well he probably is not on the files if he's saying all that yeah yeah and lots of people were on the emails also he's like the richest man in the world don't sue me then they go back to rfk jr and again he is the one with the worm in his brain and he does sound like he just smoked like nine cigarettes before doing a press interview it's crazy but Ghislaine says that she had gone dinosaur bone hunting in the Dakotas with him.
47:28So protect the dinosaurs and protect the bears is what I'm learning from this. And she says, I knew Bobby's wife. So Bobby is his nickname. I knew Bobby's wife, Mary, pretty well, actually. And before he met her, Mary passed away in 2012 while her divorce with RFK Jr. was still pending. This divorce is not without its controversies. RFK Jr. accused Mary of running over and killing their family dog in the driveway, that she was violent and abusive. Mary accused RFK Jr. of being a sexual deviant, of constantly cheating on her and waging a scorched earth campaign against her. And whilst the divorce was pending, Mary died by self-exit.
48:08Ghislaine states that her boyfriend back in the 80s had a brother who dated Mary, and that's how they knew each other. And then Mr. Epstein, did Mr. Epstein meet Bobby Kennedy through you? I don't think so because Mr. Epstein, you know, surprisingly everyone says everything happened through me. That's just not true. I mean, I think yesterday I'd explained that he had friends from London and those were very what the people would call fancy. So she's like, no, he didn't meet Bobby through me. But then she states, I never saw anything inappropriate with Mr. Kennedy. I mean, yesterday, if I didn't make it clear, I will reiterate, I never ever saw any man do anything inappropriate with a woman of any age.
48:46I never saw inappropriate habits. Now, I'm not going to say hands or I mean, that to me is not inappropriate. A what? I guess like holding hands. Oh. Now, somebody's inappropriate and mine might be different. We're not talking about anything that resembles the accusations that we've discussed. So that would be a flat out no to any man. Also, she just can't remember anything. And as for why she can't remember a single damn thing and has the hippocampus of a toad that's been deceased for half a century she says i don't recall all of them not because i'm trying to be evasive or anything but i just don't remember them and after a while you know in the incredible job that you all have all of you that when you're so high pressured and you're spending so much time with extraordinary people like with president Trump it can blur it just does she really talk like that yeah basically so I mean this is like a very dramatic interpretation but I think that her accent doesn't help she does have a very posh way of speaking that's very holier than thou she just she has a very posh accent she also says about Bill Clinton so I started spending a lot of time I don't want to categorize that but I started spending time with the former president and with Doug and his team and then um I have no purpose really other than I obviously offered something I don't know ideas of I don't know and he started to travel who started travel Bill yeah so she's like I'm traveling with Bill Clinton and like I offered him ideas or like I don't know or like ideas or like I don't know it doesn't make any sense and then she talks about how there is a rumor where she flew Bill Clinton on a helicopter to the island for nefarious reasons.
50:31And she says, that is so patently absurd that I flew him in a helicopter. I am a helicopter pilot. That is true. But the notion of me flying an ex-president in a machine, that would terrify me. I would never, ever even take that responsibility. Can you imagine? Yeah, no. And then she goes on to state that the reason that she can't really remember anything is because she was in solitary confinement at MDC Brooklyn for quite some time. And MDC has one of the most heinous and she starts talking about the prison system there and Todd Blanche is like not on my transcript we're gonna stop you right here moving on yeah he said not on my watch so but she just tried to blame MDC Brooklyn for the reason that she's very messed up and I don't think so because I mean yes I think prison reform and I think MDC Brooklyn is probably one of the worst of the worst but also you were messed up from the get-go so I don't know what she's talking about Ghislaine also goes on to state that any woman that she saw around Epstein's vicinity was very interested in him.
51:32Nobody was there by force or uncomfortable or in distress. She says, I never saw that. She said, you know, if you were massaging his feet, I mean, they were happy to be there. Did you see him engage in sexual conduct during a massage? Well, you could define sexual conduct as in, I did see women who would have been, you know, less than normally clad for massages, but especially on the island where they would be in bikinis or possibly even topless. Yeah, I did see that. But she doesn't have any recollection of anyone underage giving Epstein a massage or doing anything inappropriate during a massage.
52:06Did you ever observe Mr. Epstein self-pleasuring during a massage? Yes. Okay, so what are you saying? I mean, when I'd seen him on a massage table, I had seen him masturbate. I don't know if there was a masseuse present, but I've seen him on a massage table masturbating. Okay. What? Okay. And then she says, you know, let me give a rant. And she just starts ranting. The narrative started in 2009 is really when it started. So that narrative that was created and then built upon and it just mushroomed into basically what is like the Salem witch trial. People have gone and lost their minds for this thing.
52:46But the issue is, how do you satisfy a mob who can't understand the lifestyle because it's like P. Diddy on TV? That's a bad example. Has she not been watching the news? Yeah, has she not watched the new Netflix documentary? With the Clintons and Trump. I mean, it's bananas. And while some of it's real, he did do those things. Epstein. I'm definitely not disputing that. But this is one, you know, one man. They've made him into this. This big, he's not that interesting. He's a disgusting guy that did terrible things to young kids. Who? Epstein. Wait. Oh. Yeah. Wait, he's saying we made him into a nasty thing or he is?
53:29He is, but we made this into a whole conspiracy involving her when she's so clearly innocent. Wait, I thought she just said that she never seen him do anything to anybody. Yes, she says that she never saw, but she believes the victims. Oh. At least the ones that don't accuse her. I see. Oh, she just... Oh, I see, I see. So she thinks that Epstein is evil and nasty and does these things to young kids. Just she was... She's never seen anything. Yeah. So that... Okay. And she says, you know, if you met Epstein, there is no way that this cast of characters, which is like extraordinary, and somewhere in your cabinet who you value as co-workers, you know, would be with him if he was a creep or because they wanted sexual favors.
54:12A man wants sexual favors, he will find that. They didn't have to come to Epstein for that. Now, did some of them? Okay, I don't know. I wasn't there. I didn't see it. Okay. How does she have this attitude when she's already, you know, in prison for this long and all? And the way that she's trying to convince us of these things, she would have an easier time convincing everyone that she stuck a seven foot Christmas tree up her butt. I don't understand. I don't get it. And then she goes on to state that this is all Virginia is doing, that she has nothing to do with this, that she was just working for Epstein, but it was all Virginia.
54:46Now the DOJ does redact Virginia's name, but it's very clear that from context, it's Virginia Dufresne. Ghislaine accuses Virginia. December of 2011 or 2001, he met Virginia. And I think Virginia was responsible for that in its entirety. When Virginia was a child herself, like this is what she's saying. Like Virginia was a child herself and she is saying that Virginia is responsible for this. Ghislaine says she was a self-confessed having been sexually abused as a young girl and was trained her words I'm quoting now not mine in all the arts of whatever you know that is the sex program by a man named called Ron Eppinger.
55:26Virginia Giuffre was trafficked by Ron Eppinger if you listen to part one and Ghislaine is saying that she was trained to do this that was she was trafficked. And she continues, who was her pimp from when she was 14, I believe, 15, I don't know. And in her book describes him training her to be what every man wants in all its manners, fellatio and everything else. Ghislaine goes on to spew nonsense about how Epstein's interest in underage masseuses started because of Virginia and that Virginia was the one recruiting fellow young girls to come in and service Epstein. She also badmouths Virginia by saying things like, So then I think she takes up with a local drug dealer.
56:05Virginia writes about in her book, she was dating a guy named Tony. And he becomes, she becomes a druggie. You know, you know, how druggies? Well, maybe you don't, but they become even more unreliable than normal. So now she's saying she's unreliable because she got into drugs. And so she blames everything on Virginia Giuffre. And how convenient is that when Virginia Giuffre, just a few months before this proper interview, passes away. She says, quote, I don't know. Everyone, every single person who came to his house, came through Virginia and her boyfriend, Tony, and then whoever else was underneath her.
56:41That is how it started. Did they push back on that when she said that? No, they just kept saying things like, well, let's not get into he said, she said. Let's not get into individuals. It's just it's messed up. But one of the biggest things that came from this Proffer interview is that lends itself to the theory that Ghislaine and Epstein were working as foreign national spies, gathering intel and blackmail material on the most powerful people in the US. There is a fascinating email from a redacted person who reaches out to Epstein in 2013, asking what he knows about being an offset service provider.
57:17I don't know what that means. That sounds like you work for Verizon or something, okay? But Epstein responds, yes, one of the most complex negotiations, as they are very strange. Someone buys fighter jets, but with the fighter money, some must be used for specific third party items, such as I will buy your pussy for$10 ,000, but with two of the 10, you have to buy me food. And to make matters worse, I need to borrow another 10 from you. The person responds, so the offset service provider does what? Negotiation between the parties? Complex. Sounds interesting. Epstein says, Brazil has tried to buy fighters in the past.
57:52They don't have a lot of money. The redacted email responds, Apparently Brazil is a hot investment place now. It's more about the offset part than the jet deal. Sweden and the USA are all lobbying to get the jet deal, as aviation is tied with potentially big tourism deals. 36 planes. I was just on call with a guy in Sweden who is dealing with this. I never know if the stories are real, but he claims to work with the Brazilian president, Obama and Warren Buffett, etc. So, I mean, it's... What is happening? The amount of knowledge that he has in military contracts and fighter deals is odd. So people are saying this doesn't sound like someone who's just scheming billionaires.
58:25Like if he is just blackmailing billionaires or being a financial tax advisor, this is weird stuff that he has access and knowledge to. In another email, he tells a redacted individual, I passed your message. In addition, I'm not sure what role you and your boss would like to play in the Yemen issue moving forward. The rebel leaders are ready to propose a document. They would like a ceasefire and halt. If you'd like, I could pass on their proposal. This is not what I do. My expertise is only money, but it seems like your part of the world would like advice. So he's now dealing with a ceasefire in Yemen.
58:56In another text message, Epstein is talking to another redacted individual writing, spoke to my China guys, and they said China stronger, plays weakened, strife art of war, etc. Said all the players are Xi loyalist. Main complaints is that there's no counterparty in US, either no one home or new to the game. He texts again. This is just a year before his death. I had three China guys today. I told them that they should brief you. There's a 40-year anniversary in Beijing of the beginning of Economic Growth Initiative. He's also meeting in 2017 with the Mongolian ambassador for the UN. And this is in 2017.
59:30This is just two years before he dies. He also emails about how he just spoke with one of the Ambani family members, one of the billionaire families from India. He also writes, India, Israel, key not for email so this is um a lot of people have interpreted this as telling an ambani family member that the key for india and u.s relations to soften is israel israel is the key wow this is wow there's also pictures of him with african warlords which galen comes up with this like very bizarre explanation for that in the proper interview where she says no so the reason that he hangs out with African warlords in that picture is because he had a business idea where if a billionaire had money stolen from them, like if a cartel has money stolen from them, he would go find that money, track it down, and he would bring it back and he would get a percentage of the recovered money.
1:00:28And everyone's like, what does that have to do with African warlords? But to address the rumors that Epstein and Ghislaine were spies, Todd Blanche asks her, have you ever had any contact with any representatives that you know from Mossad, the Israeli intelligence agency? Can you ask me that again? Have you ever had any contact with any individuals that you understand to be from Mossad, an Israeli intelligence agency? Well, not deliberately. Pardon me? Not deliberately. Okay. And did you, we asked this, we talked about this a little bit earlier, but just to put a finer point on it, did you ever know or were you ever told, did you ever think that Mr.
1:01:06Epstein was getting any money from any intelligence agency, including Mossad. Well, I don't believe so, but I wouldn't, I mean, I would be very surprised if he did. I don't think so, no. Were there any international businessmen or politicians that had a very close relationship with Mr. Epstein that we haven't already talked about? Off the top of my head, I can think of Ehud Barak, the former prime minister of Israel. What was his involvement? She says that they weren't that close. And she says for good measure, you know, anything that touches Israel or the state of Israel, I'm always interested in because my father loved Israel.
1:01:41And so I pay attention to it. And we have ties to, you know, Israel. Ties meaning friends and family relations. Also, this is like a lot of people have interpreted this as she's trying to tell Israel that like she's not turning on them. It's really weird because the way that she's just is like, I have family in Israel and I have so many ties to Israel and And I'm always interested in Israel because my father loved Israel. It's really bizarre. Do you know the nature of Ehud Barak's relationship with Mr. Epstein? I don't. Were you ever with them together? I think I met. I have a memory of meeting Ehud.
1:02:15But I don't know if he was with Epstein. I don't remember. You know, I'm struggling to remember the context around it. I'm sure it happened. But it must have been very brief that they met because I don't have any serious memory of it. and then as to make things I mean this just makes everything sketchier but she says certainly my father had a background in intelligence he was a British intelligence officer I think that my sort of belief is that once you've been an intelligence officer you've kind of it doesn't mean that you're formally employed so I don't think my dad has any formal sense was you know employed by the agency and then she's like you know but I think it's absurd that everyone thinks that we are spies but then later she'll say shit like this I've had some interesting things that have happened in my life and one of them was i found out the ira so this is in ireland had me on their kidnap and murder list what does that mean kidnap and murder list because i think her dad is like a british intelligence officer yeah but after that happened you know my father always wanted to put a lot of protection on me obviously so it's it's weird because this didn't make it any clearer i don't think that this profit interview is going to make these conspiracy theories die down or feel less legitimate to the people who already believe it.
1:03:29It's just very odd. Now at this point, that's pretty much all we got from her proffer interview and there have been speculations because she was moved to a very low minimal security prison that she's going to get pardoned at the end of Trump's term and he has been very evasive about it. He would say things like, I don't want to talk about pardons, let's not talk about pardons right now but she's she's got access to phones emails weekend visits recreational sports i believe it's like unlimited yard time so she was moved after this interview yes exactly so she's moved after this interview and she's still trying to get out of her entire conviction by saying that she had a non-prosecution agreement as by the sweetheart deal that Jeffrey Epstein signed in 2009.
1:04:17So I guess we're gonna have to see. But Virginia Giuffre on page 139 of her memoir, she writes, I had been trafficked to dozens of men by this point and I remember their faces clearly. There were old men and even older men, nerdy, shy men and boorish, arrogant men. There were men who wanted me to wear outfits and men who wanted to see me naked and men who didn't notice if I was clothed as long as I touched them. There were men who behaved as if I were lucky to be with them and there was at least one man who ignored me as i serviced him sexually preferring instead to focus his eyes upon and even fondle epstein someone just like yeah a lot of people want to know who that is a lot of people want to know who everyone is virginia writes in her book nobody experiences trauma and emerges unscathed i certainly haven't even before i met epstein i'd experienced awful things that i've made some observers label me as his perfect victim but I was also resilient or I wouldn't be here now.
1:05:13I still have night terrors and panic attacks. I still have moments of feeling worthless. Perhaps I always will but on many days especially when I've been able to help another survivor I thrive. My hope is that this book can aim some light at the darkness and force it to crawl back into its cave. My point is that while Jeffrey Epstein is dead and gone there are many others around the world who are still committing the same kinds of crimes that he did. Hopefully the files will put an end to that and the files should be coming out like after you see this probably in like a week but we don't know if we're just gonna get, if things are gonna be how they've always been and we're gonna get a whole bunch of nothing or if we're actually gonna get something this time.
1:05:55So stay tuned, let me know your thoughts in the comments, stay safe and I will see you in the next one.
From the publisher
Almost everyone in Los Angeles hopes that one day they’ll receive an invitation on their doorstep inviting them to one of Al Sekel’s parties. In order to attend, he always provides a vague caveat like, ‘bring the most interesting person you know.’
Fulfill it and the host himself will likely usher you inside his mansion, give you the tour, and show you a giant painting that seems to be…moving?
Later on, someone at the party might clue you in, ‘He’s the world’s greatest collector of optical illusions. He likes them because they violate expectations.’
Al Sekel is known as a harmless, artsy oddball who just happens to be Ghislaine Maxwell’s brother in law, until the most recent release of Epstein’s emails.
An email from Sekel to Epstein in 2010 reads in short, ‘Now the headlines do not mention convicted sex offender or pedophile…Your wiki entry now is pretty tame and bad stuff has been muted…We hacked the site to replace the mug shot and caption.’
According to the email, Sekel helped Epstein clean up his online image. To Sekel, the damage control is likely just another optical illusion.
However, we’ll never truly know why because soon after those emails, Al Sekel goes missing. Weeks pass and authorities find his body at the bottom of an 100 ft cliff in France. One of his hands and one of his feet is nowhere to be found. Yet, authorities say he died by s*icide.
But how many s*icides connected to one case is too many?
Demand Justice for Epstein Survivors: https://www.change.org/EpsteinSurvivors
Full show notes available at RottenMangoPodcast.com
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.