How Frownies Offers a Natural Alternative to Botox for Wrinkle Prevention

0:00Hey guys, welcome back to another episode of Scooter Anarchy. This is your host Dekda and I am so excited about the brand we're going to introduce you guys to today because I think there's a lot of a lot of you guys to be a lot of a lot of you guys to be a lot of a lot of a lot of a lot of a lot of a lot of a lot of a lot of a lot of a lot of a lot of a lot of a lot of the founder of frownies welcome to show helen i'm so excited to host you hi thank you so much for having me i do have to make one point of clarification i am actually the great great granddaughter of the founder our business our brand is fifth generation over 134 years old wow wow that's crazy so okay well yeah i mean it's a wonderful brand you know it's you guys have really done something very magical, you know?

0:52Awesome. So Helen, so I'm excited to chat with you about like what really led to the creation of the concept and the whole brand and obviously your journey in growing, you know, the brand to where it is now. If you could kind of walk us down memory lane and give us the background. Absolutely. So like I said, brownies were invented by my great great grandmother. Actually, my great great grandmother, my grandmother, her daughter was a concert pianist and a model. And you know, when you're sitting and doing something with concentration, like playing the piano, or like we stare at our screens now, you often furrow your brow and you don't realize it.

1:28And that's where you get that 11 line or those the wrinkles in between the eyebrows, right? Those furrow lines. And so they invented frownies to help with those furrowed lines that she was getting from playing the piano, obviously, because beauty and all of that is important when you're in like a modeling field. So they started making the frownies at home in their attic and using them personally. People started asking them about what they were doing and their skin was looking so great. And so they started making frownies for friends and little by little started marketing the product in the circles that she was in because she was playing the piano.

2:04They were around a lot of famous people, actresses and actors. And even she played the piano at the White House. So some different historical like presidential families use brownies. But anyway, her husband died, my great great grandfather, and he was a part of a barber supply company. And that company was kind of like dissolving or going out of business after his death. And she actually took over, I think bought the rights for the rest of the business and started manufacturing brownies under that business name. And so that's kind of how they got into, you know, like official production of the product.

2:38And over the years, it was always called Hollywood's Beauty Secret. My grandmother was actually raised by her grandmother, who is the inventor of frownies. And so she's called in the business very, very young. So it's these three women running the company and sharing frownies, like I said, primarily in Hollywood circles. There are a lot of old magazines, like there's a Life magazine from 1934 that mentions brownies and it shows young Hollywood actresses at an acting school, Fox drama school with brownies on their face. Brownies were featured in a lot of old Hollywood films. And so it was just this, like I said, Hollywood beauty secret, like the Botox before the Botox.

3:16Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So in the year 2000, that's actually when Botox was legalized for cosmetic purposes. Rene Rousseau, who is a Hollywood actress, was on the cover of Housekeeping Magazine. I believe it was her like 40th birthday. And it is whole spread about Renee Rousseau and her beauty secrets. She's fabulous under 40. And there were several pages dedicated to her talking about frownies. And we had no idea that was going to happen. And it kind of renewed the energy behind frownies. And a lot more people started to know about frownies at that time. But it's still, it was really small. We never did any formal marketing or advertising.

3:55There was, print ads here and there. But it was really just a small family business. Like I said, Hollywood Beauty Secret. When Botox became popular, a lot more people started looking for alternatives and options. In 2020, I got involved with the company. I had a little small social media side hustle. So I knew a lot about social media and marketing through social media. And so I came in to kind of be the fifth generation face of the brand. And I got on to TikTok at the end of 2020, beginning of 2021. That's also the time when Instagram reels came on the scene. And I started creating all these short form videos.

4:33And to be honest, we really went viral all of 2021 on TikTok. We grew from zero followers to now 280 ,000 followers because brownies just really became this viral trend on TikTok throughout the year of 2020. We were the number five search term in beauty on Google in 2021. And so we created this crazy organic social media boom around frownies. And that's when I really just started to build this community and share about my love for frownies and skincare and beauty and all these things. And the product has just taken off because like you said, truly the results speak for themselves. It was just a matter of getting the word out.

5:12And thanks to social media these days, you're able to do that. And then we really have, you know, dove in with our full like social media, building a community and things like that. And it's just the results. That is what has driven the brand. And so people rave about frownies. They love their results. And here we are today. Yeah, no, it's a really cool concept. And I think that the history definitely intrigues me because, you know, a lot of the when you were talking about old Hollywood I was really thinking of a lot of the old like secrets women would use you know for various different beauty needs right and it's very interesting to see how a lot of that stuff I mean it could still be very applicable now you know I think we've definitely shifted gears with aesthetic medicine and the growth of aesthetic medicine but I mean it's not for everybody you know also like when I look at your brand I just see options for women who just don't want to get any injectables like I'm one of them I've never gotten Botox I've never you know gotten a filler I've never done anything to my to myself from the aesthetic point of view because I just don't want to it's just a personal preference and so for somebody like me who still has you know because I I'm in medicine you know I've spent many nights you know kind of hovered over a book and and the brown lines definitely appear and the you know forehead lines appear and it's it is annoying but as you can have an option that brings you the flexibility you know what i mean of having this like efficacious option but it's not going to mean that you have to compromise your own personal choices of no i don't want to get injectables i mean that's huge in this industry right now you know to be able to say that so i really applaud you guys for giving that option to consumers because especially right now i mean you brought up tiktok one of the things i wanted to ask you about was like, you know, how was the response on TikTok from the younger generation for you?

7:04Because this is a really great option for them. You know, if they're like, yes, you know what I mean? Because they're so brainwashed. They think that they need that's right now. They think they need Botox at the age of 18. And I'm like, what? What the heck? Like, no, yeah, please don't go get Botox when you're 18. Even in your 20s, you don't need it. And so how was that? How was that for you guys when you're growing your social media? Like, yes, younger generation has been for me, that's my biggest passion. I actually started using frownies when I was 18, but it was like here and there, you know, like I had a day out at the beach and I was like, Oh, I feel like I'm getting a little fine line.

7:38So I would use frownies, but I'm now 41 years old and my forehead looks exactly the same as it did back then, because I've just always used frownies preventatively. And to your point, there is a huge push amongst girls and men and women, but more so women from the ages of like 18 to 25, where they don't have a single wrinkle, but yet they're getting preventative Botox or baby Botox, just to make sure that they never get a wrinkle. And I know the power personally of starting young, preventing and taking care of my skin using frownies. And if you do that, I mean, my mother is almost seven years old, 70 years old, and she doesn't have any wrinkles either, because she's done the very same thing.

8:18And I watched my grandmother, she passed at 95. She wore brownies her whole life. She had no 11 lines. Like it's just, It's one of those things that you have to understand. It's not, we often think like, oh, this is aging. I look old. It's, I don't see people's 11 lines or forehead wrinkles and think aging. I literally think facial tension. It's muscular. And that's why Botox is so effective, right? They're injecting it and it's freezing the muscle. It's paralyzing the muscle. So you can't make those expressions. But Brownies works on the concept that you're learning not to do that. You're learning to keep your forehead and your brows more relaxed.

8:50And if you start when you have a lot of collagen in your skin before those deep lines are embedded in your face, you never have to get those. And so the response has been huge. Before I came in, our customer demographic was mostly 50 and over. Even a lot of people, young women find out about frownies on TikTok and then they talk to their mother or their grandmother and they're like, oh, yeah, I knew about that. Oh, yeah, I used that 20 years ago. And so it's really a resurgence with the younger generation. And I am so like, like you said, it's crazy to think of these young girls, number one, just the money that's being spent when, you know, if women's earning power is less in this world anyway, we need to like not be spending our money on something we don't need.

9:35But then also the fact that like, whether you want to get Botox or not, like that's your personal choice. I support that. But I feel like it is a lot more sustainable to do frownies for 20, 30, 40 years than it is to start Botox at 20 and think you're going to keep it up till you're 60, 70, 80 years old. That's what, like 40 to 60 years of Botox. We just don't know what that will be like, you know, while they can say, oh yeah, there's very low rate of issues with it. Even though we do see that on social media too, right? Like you see it all, but sustaining Botox for 40 years, you know, it's just, it's like, there's a question.

10:12Honestly, honestly, I want to actually add to this because i you bring up a very very very solid point here and i i want to actually just throw this out there for the listeners starting botox at an early age by the way is like actually proven like in the literature like you can look at you know the literature and find the downside of starting botox early you know so there's this thing of like overuse and dependency that happens if you start at a young age so if you're getting botox treatments and you're really young like you know the ages we were talking about like 18 early 20s you know you can become very like reliant on this you know this option and then you become your muscles actually will require more to react to it you know to actually respond so there's a really like there's an array of different cons to doing that you know so like i personally am a huge advocate for if you don't i mean injectables are fine i think if you're going to the right person and you know all that the whole thing you're going to their dermatologist you're doing it the right way okay cool but you still have to consider age you do because you know certain things are just not meant for certain age groups you know and we're seeing that now more than ever right i mean look at the whole teens and sephora thing that's going on you know and well yeah and i'll tell you we have a lot of women i have a lot of women who come to me and they're like man i've gotten botox for years and now I'm Botox resistant.

11:38It doesn't work for me. And so then they start brownies and they tell me like, Oh my goodness, like this is even better. Like my skin, my results look even better and more natural too. And so there, there's that fact that like the, the younger you start, the better chance you have of something like that happening. And then there's also the fact that, you know, young 18 to 20 year olds, they're, they're not necessarily having babies yet, but we get a ton of women who come to us because they get pregnant and they were doing Botox, but now they can't do Botox. So they start on frownies through their pregnancy and breastfeeding.

12:09And then because they love how great they look, they oftentimes don't even go back to Botox. So it is definitely something that I always encourage people, listen, take, if that's something you want to do, you want to go down that route, take the least invasive option first, right? Start with frownies, see how it goes. And if you might find that it's enough for you, right? You might find that it's more than enough. And then from there, if you want to do Botox or you want to do something else, you still have like, there's still options. And we also have a ton of customers who do get Botox, but they use brownies in between appointments to prolong the time between appointments, the time between when they feel like they want to go back and do it again.

12:48So there's a lot of ways to incorporate brownies into your beauty routine, whether it's because you want to skip Botox altogether, or if it's because you're pregnant and breastfeeding, or you want to combine it with the use of Botox just to save money and to save on the amount of injectables that you are getting in your face. So there's a little something for everyone, for sure. No, I love that. I love that you have that, you know, flexibility in the line. And I really think that people, you know, right now, especially I've seen a lot that there's a lot of hunting going on for alternative options, you know, to things that were like kind of pushed on to the masses you know through marketing or just social media presence i feel like a lot of individuals got influenced and then you know realized very quickly this is not the best thing for me you know like it might work for xyz influencer that i watch on tiktok or i watch on instagram but it's not the best for you so to have options i mean i'm just a huge believer and like you know if you if you can look and find something that is more or less invasive i should say and it's just it's gonna fix the problem you're looking to fix why not you know like give it a shot it's better than you know just going the full what going from zero to a hundred and going and getting like you know procedures done that are invasive i mean just do your homework first right like that's really what i advocate for personally is like if you have options out there which the industry does now you know you guys are a great example of that so and i say to speak about the younger woman as well, you know, when you are 18 to 30, and you just have, you know, fine lines or whatnot, you still have a lot of collagen in your skin.

14:27And that's what gives the skin the bounce back ability, right? So if you use frownies, and you're young, you get great results. And honestly, you get great results really quickly. Now our demographic, they get I mean, I see the results every day. And I'm like, Oh, my gosh, I didn't even like, even though I see it all the time, I still my mind is blown every time, but it just takes a lot longer, right? Like it takes a whole lot longer to break the bad habit of furrowing your brow all the time. It takes a whole lot longer to work with the facial muscles to, you know, help relax those muscles. And then even just with the collagen in your skin, if you have waited too long, it's going to be something where you're probably just going to need to know that you're going to do this every single day.

15:07And it's going to be a process of just kind of ironing out the lines of the day. So, you know, for those older women, they do find their lines come back by the end of the day, you know, but over time they start to see more and more softening. It just takes a lot more effort. So with the young girls, it's like they can use brownies once or twice a week and they're like, man, this is awesome. I'm never going to need Botox. And so when you show someone how easy it is when they're young, because it is really easy when you're young, they're hooked and that keeps them from just going down the route injectables.

15:37Yeah, absolutely. That makes sense to me. And, you know, also like one thing I wanted to discuss is like the fact that people don't really understand like the facial anatomy, like all of the specifications, like in terms of like the muscles on your face are very thin. You know, they're very, very thin. And so when you do have an issue that's resulting in like wrinkles or lines, those muscles, like they're not as hard, in my opinion, to like, I don't know how to say this properly, like articulate it well. But I mean, ironing them out is like a good way to think about it. You know, like you're kind of pushing them back into a place because they're the ones, the muscle is the reason your skin indents the way it does, you know, because of the structure of the muscle, the positioning of the muscle, the tension on the muscle.

16:22So all of those things are very logical reasons as to why you would use something like a patch to, you know, literally iron it out, you know, so it makes actual physiologically, it makes sense. And so, you know, the facial anatomy is something very, it's very important to understand and to kind of wrap your head around because it gives you, I think, a lot more freedom to explore when you understand that, you know, and it really gives you an idea of like, hey, you know, I don't have to go and like completely like paralyze this muscle group, you know, for my lines to go away. you don't have to do that so yeah it's very cool one thing i want to want to discuss though is like how do you see like you know the whole like a space i mean like in terms of like from the wrinkle you know prevention standpoint like what is your opinion on like all the treatments out there now and just watching the brand you know kind of like grow along with this movement that's kind of happened in aesthetics you know any opinions you have around that yeah you know it's a really it's a really tricky kind of fine line to walk because I will say personally for me, I do not like the term anti-aging.

17:29I never use that phrase. I think that there is a big movement that's an amazing thing and it's happening on social and it's happening just in the world of really being more pro-aging and really giving older women a voice and also trying to bring light to the fact that like women are worth more than just what they look right and that you don't Don't reach a certain age and become worthless because your beauty has faded. So there's this whole thing that I really care deeply about of really, you know, celebrating women, celebrating aging and like finding your value in more than just your age or your beauty at a certain age.

18:10And then at the same time, there is also this desire to take care of yourself. Look your best. Put your best foot forward. Being body positive doesn't mean, well, I'm never going to work out, right? In fact, quite the opposite, you can love yourself at every size, you can be strong and fit and healthy and active at every size. And it's better for you to be healthy and active and strong, right? And that has nothing to do with a body shape or a body type. And I think similarly, when it comes to aging, if you are pro-aging and you want to like allow women to age and to still, you know, feel valued at every age, that doesn't mean that you need to throw out your skincare.

18:51That doesn't mean you need to throw out your serums and your frownies or even your Botox, if that's your thing. It's really all about doing these things because we're taking care of ourselves, right? We take care of our houses, we take care of our cars, and we try to keep them from aging, not because aging is bad, but because we want them to last. I get this one body, I get this one face, I get this one layer of skin, and I plan to live a long, healthy, happy life. And so I want to take care of this house that I live in. And so to me, also, when it comes to frownies, I always say I don't see frownies as an anti-aging product, again, because there are wrinkles or skin issues that happen with age, such as like crepey skin, loose skin, thin skin.

19:40Frownies will not change any of that. Frownies are really combating facial tension. So I don't even see this as a thing that's combating aging or stopping the aging process. That's why a lot of people equate their 11 lines or their forehead wrinkles with age. I see young girls even who have forehead wrinkles as early. I mean, my college roommate was 18 and she had such deep forehead wrinkles, but she had he always had tension headaches. She was always holding a lot of tension in her face. Eyes were eyebrows were always raised. So she had those lines, which is part of her anatomy. Right. And it was facial tension.

20:12Now, if you can relax that facial tension, there's actually a physiological, emotional and mental benefit to that, as well as a beauty and aesthetics component. When you're furrowing your brow, you're sending a signal to your brain that you're stressed, you're frustrated, and it just creates more tension in your body. And overall, your stress levels are higher. Just the same as studies show, scientific studies show, if you smile, even when you're not happy, you smile, it starts sending signals to your brain you're happy, and it releases those chemical reactions in the body to make you actually feel happier.

20:43So there's a component to brownies to me that has nothing to do with aging, even though we are considered to be in that aesthetic anti-aging kind of grouping. So there's a lot of editing that I do around that. But then just to bring it back to this concept of like pro-aging versus anti-aging, it has everything to do with your motivation. If you look in the mirror and you're thinking to yourself, I hate the way I look. I hate these wrinkles. I look so bad. I look so old. If that's what you're feeling, now what you're turning towards is an anti-aging problem and you're trying to attack yourself from a negative standpoint.

21:15And I always believe that if you want a positive output, you can't have a negative input. So a negative input doesn't lead to a positive result, right? So I think though, if you look in the mirror, you're like, man, I'm worth taking care of. I want to take care of myself to the ends of my days. I want to love my skin at every age. I want to relax the tension that I see in between my brows that's come from the years and the stress and whatever, and you approach your beauty and aesthetic treatments from that place of like, I love myself. I want to take care of myself. I'm celebrating life. Then you get a different outcome.

21:47And it's not just a different outcome in the way you look. It's an outcome in the way you feel. It's an outcome in the way you show up in the world. And I think that the most beautiful women with the most beautiful skin generally also are very beautiful on the inside. They love themselves. They're happier. There's a joy. There's something that comes from the inside out. and you can get all the Botox and all the fillers in the world. And you really don't look more beautiful. You don't look more youthful. You don't, you don't look any better because there's this motivation of it's never enough. I'm never good enough.

22:20And being that in your face and the results from these aesthetic treatments. Right. Whereas like if you love yourself and you're like, I just want a little, a little touch of this, a little bit of that, a little frownies, a little something, but you're still you because you love yourself and you value yourself. There's a very different outcome in the way you look and in the quality of your life. I completely agree with everything you said, honestly. And you know, what's interesting about this is like, I don't know if you feel the same way, but I watched this weird, like progression happen. For some reason, the beauty industry, I remember, you know, growing up, like beauty used to be fun.

22:56You know, it was a fun experience it was something that yeah you go and try products and you have fun and you you share them with your friends and you know like it's just a process that we did when we were younger you know yes then aesthetics came into the picture and i'm not i mean i completely i'm 100 behind science and medicine and all that wonderful stuff but i think that there is a fine line between where if you give options to people for everyday use that are actually meant for like Like, you know, more like aged skin, for example, like, you know, we were discussing earlier, we were discussing all these injectables.

23:33They were actually originally met for more like aged skin types. Okay. It was not met for people in their, even their early 30s, you know, really. It was more for people approaching 40s, 50s. That's what I always saw growing up. I mean, it became like the movement in my eyes went from beauty is this really fun and safe place to now there's no way to stop a young girl from going down this rabbit hole. And it becomes very dark at one point, you know, because of everything that we were talking about here, which is the self image issues, you know what I mean? like the body issues all of this stuff they see you know all the filters on social media and they think this is natural my skin should look like this my body should look like this and we are fueling that you know the aesthetics industry fuels that and I have a huge problem with that because I think that you know at the end of the day you have to really advocate for the idea that beauty is meant to be fun it's meant to be something that's enjoyed and yeah okay you might have you know some great results along the way like things like yeah your your lines were you know kind of smoothed out you know and and you feel better about yourself because of that and that's wonderful but you don't have to compete i mean it's like this competition somehow happened you know what i mean like this competitive energy and this dark dark place you know all the internet started kind of you know snowballing and that's where i look at that as even as a consumer i look at that and i'm like i just wouldn't i don't know i just don't feel good about that you know seeing that there are so women out there that now it's like it's giving them more reasons to like not like themselves yes all these artificial results everywhere you know well and i think that you know you because of social media we get so much more exposure to everyone in the world but there's of, you know, there's a ton of people, I think, in, you know, famous Hollywood, or even honestly, now just like influencers, because that's, you can have just as much influencer fame as, as a Hollywood star that have so much aesthetic work done.

25:47And everybody starts to look the same, and everyone's trying to look the same. Whereas if you think of, I view all of us as like walking artwork like we are human art pieces and what makes art beautiful is the originality of it is that each individual piece is an individual piece and when you try to take it and make it this assembly line where we're all getting the same Botox and the same filler we're all trying to get the same injections and we're all trying to look the same as this like you said ideal kind of pie the sky woman that's in the filter on social media and then we end up losing that beauty that was fun that unique style and look that was geared towards each individual looking more like the best version of themselves rather than looking like more like the person that they see on social and I think that is our beauty and even like just all the trends like home decor like all the things And so much of the world starts to look the same because we're all trying to look like that person on social.

26:52Exactly. Exactly. And, you know, what's crazy about it all is that even medicine has no real answer right now, you know, for how to keep our individuality intact when we're getting these like ridiculous procedures. I mean, it's the truth. Ask any cosmetic surgeon, ask any dermatologist. they're going to tell you that there are certain verticals in place that deal with facial symmetry and they deal with you know certain parameters that are followed when you're giving someone someone something like a facelift or something like injectables to you know accentuate their features there are certain ratios that are followed you know i mean that's fine but at the end of the day you know it's exactly what you said what ends up happening is a bunch of people that look exactly the same in terms of their facial structure and that's really like i mean you can see it you know it's like it's obvious when someone's gotten the work done i mean there's nothing again i'm not demonizing it okay i don't want anyone to think like i'm coming at you or anything like that i'm just stating a fact that you know you do lose a part of your individuality when you've gone through a certain amount of you know aesthetic procedures and you know it it is a fact so it comes down to making a choice you know it comes down to making a choice of how far do i really want to go and if you are willing to push that line then you have to ask yourself why you know why am i doing this and is it really because i want to look better or is it because i'm competing with something that's crazy not you know yeah yeah right yeah well and i think that's That's for me, one of the reasons why I love frownies so much is, you know what?

28:29Yes, I do want to have glowing, smooth skin. But I also have to accept the fact that as I get older, I will get some measure of fine lines. I will see some wrinkles, like it's going to happen. But if I can slow that down, if I can do the things that like make me feel really good, but they don't compromise my health. They don't potentially come with any warning labels. They don't change the way I look. And they don't communicate a message to my daughter or the younger women around me that you've got to do all these things. You cannot get older. I think what I'm doing is I'm enhancing my natural beauty.

29:12I'm working with what I've got. You know, just the same as I work out every day when I am 70, 80, 90, my body is not going to look the same as it looks right now, even though I'll keep working out and it's going to look great for that time. Like it's going to be, I'm going to be strong. I'm going to be mobile. I'm going to be able to take care of myself, but I also have to accept this is a part of life, right? So there's, there's an element of acceptance rather than, you know, willing to do anything to avoid aging at all costs. and there's an also an element like but you know what that doesn't prevent me from trying my best you know and doing what I can and I think I do that not because aging it aging is a bad thing but aging is a privilege and how about I squeeze all of life that I can out of every year that I get to live whether that's with my skincare or in the gym or the adventures that I go on like I don't want to just say oh well I got older so I give up like let the wrinkles come to me you know what I mean?

30:13I do what I can, but I also have my, I have the limits. I have my standards for myself that I'm like, not willing to cross because I, I just feel that, like I said, I want to maintain some element of uniqueness. And I, and I want to set an example for the younger people that are watching me to see like, Hey, you can be 40 and not get Botox and rock it and look beautiful. Like you don't have to go the way that the aesthetic industry, you know, kind of markets like you better, you got to do this, you know, and I get it. They're marketing. It's a money making industry. But I just kind of want to show younger women like you don't have to.

30:52And there are options. There are options. Exactly. There are options. And then at the end of the day, you know, what that does, like, you know, indirectly is also take a lot of pressure off. Because, you know, we when we create options, then we also create this idea of like, okay, wait a minute, let me pause for a second. you know i mean like now i can think now i can i don't feel the pressure of only going down this one road you know that everyone's been shoving down my throat this whole time you know it's like you can finally pause for a minute and say no okay let me try something that's a little you know it's more fun you know it's more light-hearted it's more like that's how i feel you know when i when i look at the options like you know frownies to me if i were to put this against a Botox range, right?

31:37I would be like, okay, listen, this one feels safe to me. I like this and I would like to experiment at least, you know, give my body a chance. And then if I absolutely feel like there's nothing I can do, I'll go down this road, okay? And I'll experiment with the other option. But first, let me try this, you know, because it feels safe and it feels like more like home to me. You know, that's the best way I can see that from my perspective. And I think that that's something to be really applauded and really kind of understood that it's very valuable to have that, you know, that feeling of like, okay, let me experiment.