The Future of Clean Dermaceuticals with Topical Skin

0:02Hey guys, welcome back. It's from Anarchy. Today's episode is very special. I have a dear friend with me today and we're going to be talking about her brand brand name. which I have absolutely fallen in love with. She is truly an expert in the field of beauty. She's held positions in companies like L 'Oreal and has over 15 years of experience working with these companies. So without further ado, please welcome Evelina Ayosa, who is the founder of Topical Skin. Welcome, Evelina. I'm so excited to host you. Thank you, Ekta. Thank you for having me back. Yeah, no, I'm so glad we're doing this. You know, I love what you're doing with Topical Skin and I can't wait to dive into the brand, but I want to refresh everyone's memory about your experience because you really know this industry.

0:40You know, I think you're one of the few people I've met that can really speak to so many parts of the beauty industry and the moving pieces. And I'd love to kind of share that with our audience, learn more about you, you know, so can you walk us down memory lane again, and then tell us about your experience? Yeah, sure. I mean, I have over 15 years experience, you know, spanning luxury and professional beauty brands, mostly in skincare as a sector, but I've also incubated brands in nutraceutical and fragrance categories as well. I've held some pivotal roles at L 'Oreal SkinCeuticals, Osmotic Cosmoceuticals, Pierre Fab Dermacosmetics, Avent Brands, Glyton.

1:16So a lot of like established, I would say legacy, medical grade, professionally distributed and dispensed skincare brands, brands. And I feel like I bring the big beauty perspective, but I also have like this indie brand in January because I also incubated brands in the past for Sephora, for private investors. So I would say this is not my first rodeo. I also had a pleasure of working with a very well-known and respected contract manufacturer who provided products for a lot of physician brands back in the day, as well as private label. So microbiologists, cosmetic chemists, aromaterial vendors, suppliers are all like my friends from back in the day.

1:54And I purposely meaningfully stayed in this sector of professional grade beauty because that's where my network and expertise and actually passion are so that's in a nutshell i love that no i love that and again like you know this it's very important to like you know learn from professionals like yourself because i think the beauty industry is so it i mean there's a lot going on you know there's so many brands and there's so much going on but it's really interesting to see like you know the difference between luxury and then indie brands and how all of that really translate across the board so it's very fascinating that you have this background and you're coming into the brand with this you know that's very cool thank you i want to talk about i mean you coined this term right the quote-unquote clean dermaceutical what does that really mean and how are you applying that with topical skin yeah you know so as a marketer we are always taught to have like this one-liner or tagline but it's associated with the brand so if you don't have time for like elevator pitch you can just literally describe it in in a few words or like a short sentence to kind of like deliver the meaning of of the brand or what we stand behind and because i'm trying to pave a category new category by bridging the clean beauty which you know has been around for quite some time it's almost mainstream clean beauty natural beauty natural already derived ingredients with my background in derm beauty cosmoceuticals i decided to call topical skin clean derma circle because that's what it is it's a cosmoceutical brand derma Soroku brand with derm approved ingredients, ingredients that have been clinically validated to have some kind of efficacious action for the skin and benefiting the skin.

3:27But I'm also merging the world of clean beauty and natural beauty. I draw inspiration from Ayurvedic field, from traditional Chinese medicine, and also from, you know, my grandma from back in the day. So I'm trying to bridge the two worlds of clean natural beauty with derm beauty. A lot of derm beauty brands obviously are known for being result-oriented and that's their primary, secondary, and third kind of like storytelling and messaging. There are a couple of products that are now clean within those brands, but not the entire line. So I wanted to make sure that topical skin is known for being clean and derm approved and lead kind of with that positioning.

4:05Yeah, that's really fascinating because I think we're approaching this, I don't know, like, a tipping point in the skincare industry where, like, I think the word clean is not, it's not good enough anymore for consumers, you know what I mean? Where it's, like, you need more than that, you need to understand more than that, and I love that, you know, I actually love the term, clean dermaceutical, because it really does, I think, resonate more with the idea of, like, you want results, you know, with your skincare, and you want efficacy, but you really don't want to be putting stuff on that's bad for you, right?

4:35Like, later down with like hormone imbalance or something so that's very fascinating and I actually really like that I like that term a lot yeah thank you you know when it comes to you know being clean I feel like I'm wearing multiple hats when I'm developing products and I kind of control the process from you know from A to Z where I know rheumatoid vendors and I know that I can buy a peptide or or whatever other kind of active ingredient in so many different blends and carrier oils and I purposely choose to have the cleaner version which you know for average consumer they not even might be aware they don't understand the ingredient list or the inky there might be one active but it comes in the blend of something else I can handpick and decide that I want to go with this vendor because of their reputation because of their sourcing because of how they maybe process the material as well so clean beauty for topical skin goes beyond what what's not in the formula, but it's also like the synergies of the ingredients, but also what are they being sourced and what kind of like carrier oils they are being delivered, what kind of carrier like baseline in a sense.

5:41Yeah, no, that's, I mean, that's actually something that very few people speak about is this idea that you do have to start vetting like what things are carried in, like what the actual formulation is, even if it is very scientifically forward. I mean, I mean, I think that's what I mean. Now is a time where we're finally seeing the true power of that word, right? Come out where it's like, okay, clean, but you don't have to sacrifice, you know, with the science. You can still expect that even with the really rigorous science of like delivery technologies or whatever it might be. So that's really cool.

6:10Yeah. I want to talk about biohacking with you because this is really a trending word, I feel like right now. And you know how it is with marketing. Everybody like gets behind a word. But what do you think, I mean, biohacking is when it comes to the skin and also, you know, skin care? Yes, I feel like the, you know, the term of biohacking is becoming more prevalent and popular nowadays because everybody wants to have a shortcut to health and wellness and kind of like accelerated way of getting, you know, to whatever their goals are. And same principle can be applied to skincare and skin science.

6:47And for me, biohacking means, you know, kind of accelerating or bringing a little bit, you know, or making it easier for people to achieve a healthier skin barrier or moisturized skin, because we know this is the foundation of healthy skin. If we don't have well-hydrated skin cells, they will not perform optimally. And then anything else that you put on their skin, whatever actives, you're just not going to capitalize on what you're investing in as much. So for me, biohacking is making sure that you take care of the foundation. And for topical skin is to formulate products that always have sensitive skin in mind.

7:20Always think about what kind of ingredients we can add into each and every single formulation that will help with skin barrier support. May it be hydrating oleosomes, may it be some certain antioxidants, anything that will help protect the skin barrier from environmental aggressors. So for me, that's kind of like the element of biohacking. and also taking into consideration like skin health and longevity kind of topic. Because again, we want to keep the good and healthy cells. We want to make sure that we encourage cell senescence and things of that nature. I feel like those topics are right now gaining momentum and you're learning about them slowly.

7:58And obviously all of these elements can be achieved with biotech, also with natural ingredients. And my job is to go and study them in PubMed. I read clinical journals to see who's doing research on what kind of ingredients. Have they been commercialized yet? At what percentage do I have meaningful action in skin? And see if I can encapsulate them within topical skin portfolio. Obviously, I have so many ideas on paper. Not all of them come to fruition. But I'm trying to biohack our way to healthier, more hydrated skin. And yeah, that's kind of like my primary goal with topical skin. that's kind of the foundation and common denominator across the line.

8:39I love that. No, I love that. And I like what you said. You know, I think there's a lot of things because it's very fascinating. I mean, you brought up longevity and I think this is a really good topic because when we talk about longevity, very few times are we really talking about topical solutions for skin. It's really about people love focusing on like supplements, but when you really think about it, it is what you said, you know, it's like great. You have to really hydrate your skin you know you have to keep it moisturized you have to do the the basics of what is healthy right for the organ overall and so I think that's where it's really fascinating for me because you know it you don't really think of it in the way of like I'm preserving my skin so that it's the aging that happens is a more it's not such a strong slope you know you're gradually aging that way and that is longevity so that's very fascinating yes I try to create products that have like this dual approach of like prevention and correction i feel like dermasurukus or cosmosurukus are mostly known for being corrective in nature right like anti-aging i want to also take the preventive route where you can actually hold on to the healthier skin cells a little bit longer you know incorporate antioxidants and not just any antioxidants i'm looking outside of the box always um so it's kind of like this dual focus on prevention and correction to help kind of like you know hack the aging process promote you know resilience and vitality in skin always using science and technology, right?

9:58Just to optimize the body's function, which includes obviously almost dermal health as well. Yeah. So that's why my formulations always leverage the most biologically active and scientifically proven ingredients. I try to include broad spectrum antioxidants, not just any antioxidants, biomimetic ingredients, which we hear about more recently, and obviously the concentration that will support the product efficacy as well. Yeah, no, I know. I want to talk about this because you're using a very interesting and very novel delivery technology in the line, and that's oleosomes. So can you tell us a little bit about what made you go with oleosomes?

10:35What was the most fascinating aspect of it for you from the formulation standpoint? Yeah, so I mean, from my knowledge, oleosomes have been for a while. I haven't really heard about any brands commercializing them or utilizing them. I was doing research and I was reading articles about skin barrier, hydration, but I was also looking for like a clean emulsifier for my formulas because again when I'm mixing oil and water to get in a product I want to you know we need to use an emulsifier I want it to be as clean and natural as possible and I came across oleosomes in my research apparently a lot of pharmaceutical companies are using oleosomes to deliver actives and you know that's always music to my ears but primarily I was looking at oleosomes as clean emulsifier but then the more I digged into like scientific paper and research, I learned that oleosomes, you know, have some amazing benefits, such as like hydration and, and moisturization.

11:29Actually, they burst gradually on skin. So they deliver hydration gradually, not instantaneously. So it's almost like more sustained. And I love the fact that they are natural. They come from safflower, plant seeds, the plant seed uses this oil to germinate. So you can only imagine how full of nutrients that oil is. And again, it checked all the boxes. It's an access of delivery system. It's super hydrating and it's a clean emulsifier in all my water-based formulations. So it was like a win-win. I'm not an advocate for oleosomes. I just thought that I kind of found a diamond in a raft, to be honest with you, just by doing research because I'm like this little nerd that loves to read a lot and then put the pieces of the puzzle together.

12:12But yeah, I found oleosomes to be quite fascinating, not to be confused with exosomes or any of those technologies, but oleosomes are like little oil bodies, oil droplets, but plant seeds produce and they are full of like vitamin E and they also store emollient plant oils in them like linoleic acid and other beneficial fatty acids. So it's all goodness and it's all natural. So you can't go wrong in my opinion. Yeah, no, I mean, I think it's really fascinating because I like that you're approaching the delivery technologies like this, because I think a lot of times it's very easy to make very broad claims.

12:48I've seen this happen a lot in this industry. I'm not saying anything negative about anybody, but I think it's easy to get wrapped up, and I think it's easier to do that more so than trying to explain what exactly we can expect as consumers, right, when it comes to, like, anything delivering something better to our skin. I mean, I think oleosomes, for me, they make the most sense, if I'm being honest, because, like, it's exactly what you said you know that whole idea of like a longer time in terms of like slow release over time that makes sense i think that is really where i love even the name of the brand topical skin because the idea is that you're supposed to still cater to your skin's need in a very like you know in the topical way you're not trying to do what a supplement would do that's the problem so when people talk about this i get kind of like like i don't want to go into that too much with the exosomes and all these other you know because i don't know sometimes you don't always have to get to like dermal layers to see better skin health improvement in skin texture those things you don't always have to like go super deep into the layers and so that's where i think it's very novel that you are approaching it from this standpoint rather than like i see this lot of trying to get in there with the deeper layers and sometimes it's just not beneficial so yeah and i feel like a lot of brands we want to launch with some kind of newness create a trend so it puts them on a map with me.

14:06It's more about like what has been validated. In fact, I actually had my, one of my advisory board members, Dr. Jack Dale, he's a dermatologist, Sonny State University, and he did a review paper on all your somes just to justify my findings, because it's one thing that I'm reading and I'm interpreting information and data, but he actually did the review paper and had it published in a peer review journal called archives of dermatological research and it's all on all your songs as it pertains to topical skin so for me it was music to my ears checked another box i can move on you know with the formulation i got the green light so i love that that's really cool so i want to talk about the face oil i really like the face oil it's very nice and i know you're using it's called the x exposome defense technology can you explain that what is what is an exposome oh okay great well exposome is pretty much an element of nature or like environment that your skin is exposed to so something that is not necessarily beneficial but it can cause accelerated aging or inflammation in skin it could be anything from pollution to uv rays anything that you know causes free radical damage in the skin interesting that's really yeah i've never heard of the term before that's really cool exposome yeah so anything that is exterior to to your skin your skin because of the modern lifestyle like listen we are sitting in front of the blue light emitting devices right so that obviously has some kind of negative impact on our our skin we get uv exposure the ozone layer is obviously shrinking pollution especially if you live in an urban area you are exposed to it more than in suburbans or in other areas of the country so you know that's why you need an extra dose of antioxidants and botanicals and flavonoids to help protect the very very precious skin barrier of ours yeah no I love it and honestly the oil is one of the best oils I've used I really really enjoy the just the formula overall it's not too heavy for my skin like I have more like combination skin for anyone listening if you're on the oily side I think I relate more to you guys you know than the dry skin side but I really like this oil I think what you the way you formulated it it's not heavy you know it doesn't like weigh my skin down what is what is the formula i don't want to know the exact formula but what did you use like the main oils yeah i mean listen that's like my my baby i've i think i've not that i've dreamed about this product but i've been imagining this product quite same time there's no shortage of face oils on the market beautiful face oils don't get me wrong but again i know how to read ingredient labels and i know what the main you know the workhorse is and you know what ingredients in those face oils i really drew inspiration from like biblical recipes and then some research that i've conducted so i decided to include a combination of 10 very very unique oils i feel like there's nothing like this on the market you might find a product with pastor oil you might find a product with i don't know rosehip oil but But what topical skin is delivering in this little one ounce bottle is holy basil, which is a non-adaptogen and antioxidant.

17:08You have frankincense, you know, but it's known for like skin regeneration, anti-aging benefits, frankincense oil itself. I have baobab, which I don't really hear about baobab being utilized in skincare. But I did my research and I've heard that it's huge, especially in African continents. So again, like I told you, I draw my research and inspiration from nature. I do a lot of global almost scouting for unique ingredients. And baobab is known as the tree of life. It's rich in vitamins. It's deeply moisturizing. I also have bakuchiol, which we all know it's like the plant-based retinol alternative, but it has a lot of rejuvenating properties.

17:45Rose, I have seed oil, which is rich in vitamin C. So instead of just including vitamin C, I'm giving you the source of vitamin C. It helps with evening the skin tone. I have Tsubaki oil, which, you know, if you're from Japan, you probably heard about Tsubaki oil, but it's great for like skin firmness, elasticity, more like collagen-rich appearance. Evening promise oil, which is more like calming, balancing, soothing. There's a lot of research done, but evening promise oil will also help with some other conditions. Chamomile flower oil, very soothing, calming, again, hydrating. It contains bisabolol.

18:21You might be familiar with it. A lot of companies use Bisabolo for like brightening purposes. There's castor oil, which is, you know, it's mostly like the carrier. And a grapeseed oil, which regulates oil production on skin. It's balancing. None of it is, you know, conmodogenic. So it's a unique combination of really interesting oils. And they all have different benefit that your skin can tap into. Yeah, no, this makes sense now. because that's a really, I mean, well-researched oil product. I think a lot of times for me as a consumer, like when I use like oil serums for my skin, like I don't feel like it's like a serum, but this one definitely, it feels like a serum.

19:02You know, it doesn't feel like I'm just layering on oil. It's a very different feeling. And I think the skin overall, like the way, I don't know, a lot of people are shifting in the way they are for skincare. For me, I'm getting more minimal with it. And so this is a really great product, I think, for anyone who just wants something that's going to keep you hydrated. It works really well with makeup, like under makeup. I love it. It's really gives your skin a radiance to it. So I think this is like a really nice, like all-in-one kind of solution for a lot of people, especially if you have like dry skin, I think, because if it works for me, I'm sure it works amazing for dry skin.

19:35Yeah, no, it's definitely good for dry skin. Some of my makeup friends mix it with like a foundation. So your skin looks more dewy and glowy you can also like dab it or combine it with your moisturizer if you wish there's a lot of super antioxidants in there i feel like it's a very well-rounded formulation you have cool ingredients that you might have heard of from almost like your medicine cabinet like corset or turmeric you know rosemary green tea all goodness there's no water in the formula so when you look at like 90 over 90 of it is just oils plus the antioxidants and all the other beneficial ingredients so and it also taps into skin aromacology so the essential oils that are contained in the face oil called pyroax face oil are like the key components of aromacology and they promote stress reduction and mood enhancement so it kind of helps target the angsy aging um you know and obviously promote skin vitality but anybody who has mature skin especially my mature skin ladies or those but uh like approaching menopause i mean you guys will love this because your skin will just soak it up and like i said you can layer it easily you can't go wrong and a little goes along the way like literally you know don't put down on it you just need a little drop and yeah you will lock all the moisture that you have yeah i know it's a really really good product like i was i was really just taken aback by how much i fell in love with it because I usually don't gravitate towards oils, but it's a really nice like all-in-one.

21:04And I feel like especially if you're like a busy, you have a busy lifestyle or if you're always like always finding yourself switching products, like it's a really good one to, you know, kind of hone in on and use for multiple reasons. You know, not just, you can use it at night, day, whenever. That's why I really, I'm very intrigued by it, you know. Yeah. With oil products, it's very hard usually to have that kind of flexibility with how you can use them. So yeah, this is a really heavy hitting product. Thank you. I was also a lot of my esthetician friends who are part of my like focus groups.

21:32They love to do facial massages. And I know they need that kind of like slip continuity in order to conduct facial massages. And this oil has been tested when they have the steam going on. They put a little bit of oil. They can just provide a beautiful massage, not only like with wash and tools, but also with their hands. So I feel like it's very versatile. You can't go wrong with this oil. I want to talk about your eye cream, too, because I really like this one. And I think that with eye creams, it's very hit or miss. Like I usually don't, like most times eye creams for me are like, eh, you know, like, okay, I used it.

22:04Or, you know, like it just doesn't work. Like my, I have very sensitive eyes. So for me, I guess I'm more picky with eye creams, but yours is really, really nice as well. This is a great product in addition to the oils. Let's talk about the eye cream. What went behind the creation of this one? Oh my gosh. So this one, listen, I feel like eyes are giving away our age, I think first before, you know, any other parts of our body. and I know that the skin around the eyes is a little bit different when it comes to like structure and functionality so I wanted to create an eye cream that will be obviously rejuvenating super hydrating you know to the eye area so we don't see those creases especially if you're applying concealer but I was researching what else is beneficial around the eye area I think a lot of us have like the puffiness as a concern and obviously dark circles and and quite frankly there are so many amazing brightening agents that you can use but for me since the skin around the eyes is like super thin and sensitive i didn't want to add any typical brightening ingredients i figured let me just find something that maybe like light reflecting spheres but when you take a photo the light reflecting spheres will kind of like brighten the art area or when somebody's looking at you they don't see the darkness they just see you know like light reflecting because that's kind of like the main point so i did include mica that has like this almost like it's not it's not glitter by definition but you know when you apply it on the skin And it will help reflect light and visually brighten the eye area.

23:27Obviously, we all experience fine lines, wrinkles around the eye area. So I wanted to have some rejuvenating ingredients. That's why you see bakuchiol, niacinamide. We know that they have been proven to deliver on the promise of reducing the appearance of fine lines and wrinkles. And obviously, helping with the texture as well. and since hydration is is key for me i've included a whole bunch of amino acids which are pretty much mimicking the natural moisturizing factor i call it a natural moisturizing factor complex but you have you know a lot of those amino acids you have algae because i'm all about ocean beauty and we know that algae especially the one that i selected it's a bladderwag so for you for you guys who are into nutrition you know how amazingly nourishing bladderwag is obviously see there's oleosomes we cannot forget about oleosomes they have vitamin e niacinamide whole bunch of antioxidant again it's a very very well-rounded formulation it's as clean as i can make it to be and it's almost like a super food for the eye area like i said these ingredients that i've selected at the level or percentage level but those raw material vendors starting to have some kind of you know meaningful result on the skin so i'm not skimping out on the bacuccios i also have chaga mushroom which again if you're eastern european or of descent you understand that chaga mushroom is like this super food and super antioxidant that you know we consume on a regular basis but now it's also made its way to you know topical skincare formulation the way it's being extracted it's very very special so it's also a clean way of getting those um extract and we know that it's actually higher in antioxidant capacity than vitamin c so So there is a reason why all these interesting ingredients in this formulation.

25:16And it's super lightweight, I would say, because, again, I don't want to create a super rich cream for the eye area where you have to, like, massage it in and rub it in. Because you don't want to tug on that skin. You just want to pat it in. And this product does it. It's literally a little goes along the way. I tell people, don't cake it. You don't want to cake the ice cream. Just a little bit, dub, dub, dub, dub. and some of my focus group members were saying that you actually feel not like a cooling sensation but I feel like the cooling sensation is pretty much like a hydrating sensation that they are hearing because they probably feel the moisture being attracted pulled from the atmosphere into the skin mostly because of the amino acid so again it's it's it's something that you know was created in my head but based on the research of like best in class eye creams out there plus Plus, what else can I add as my unique spin?

26:04What else would I want to put on my eyes, on my mother's eyes? And that's usually what goes into topical skin product. It's not created to be super commercial and whatnot applicable to everybody. But for somebody who's a skin intellectual and appreciates the clean and the cosmoceurical nature of what topical skin has to offer, I think will really enjoy this product as well. Yeah, no, I mean, I definitely love it. I think the whole line is so well crafted. I think this is, I brought up the eye cream because I think it's very fascinating that you used such tried and true ingredients. I love chaga mushroom.

26:39I love niacinamide. And I think people underestimate what you can do with the under eye area with just those ingredients because it's very complex, right? With the eyes. Like I think for me, whenever I see products that have like 50 different ingredients for the eye area, it's very overwhelming because that, I mean, a lot of consumers know this, but just to refresh, like that whole area of skin is so thin that you don't need a lot, you know, and you don't need all of these different things going on. Like that skin just needs to be well nourished. And even with things like dark circles, people talk about my main problem is dark circles or like puffiness.

27:14But it's like if you understand skin physiology, it's very easy to see that those concerns can be addressed with just the basic ingredients that we usually love. You know, so you mentioned antioxidants like that's huge. Antioxidants are absolutely huge for the under eye area and just that thin skin because that it's going to get damaged more readily. So it's very important to have that there. And so I think when I look at this overall product, it actually makes more sense as an eye cream than a lot of the ones I've seen before. So I think it's really cool. Thank you. Thank you. And if you're a fan of concealer, because obviously some of us are not blessed with perfect complexion, you can just mix this eye cream with a concealer.

27:52I know a lot of my makeup artists are doing it and apply it with a little brush and then the concealer doesn't cake. So again, it's going to make your concealer last a little bit longer. and I think it's all about the radiance at the end of the day glow radiance glass skin we hear about it all the time but you know the eye skin needs different ingredients than the face cream and I feel like it deserves its own product and but yeah thank you for recognizing it yeah no it's a really great product I mean that's the thing is like we want to be able to combine science with actual functional formulas you know what I mean like it's one thing for you to have like a really great scientific thought process with your formulations but it's a whole different thing to have that be like translated to actual products that work and I think you've just done such a beautiful job with that you know the whole line really resonates for somebody like me I'm a skincare geek you know I love skincare I think it's obvious you know the name of my podcast but I mean at the end of the day it's really about efficacy for a consumer like myself and I I really appreciate this much effort when brand founders can put this much thought behind products because it does show at the end of the day results will speak no matter what no matter how much marketing is there no matter anything else like if my skin is not looking better feeling better it doesn't matter the product doesn't matter to me so I think what you've done is really cool the way you've approached the whole brand thank you I appreciate it I want to talk about because you're really it's interesting the way topical skin because you're also in medical spas right and dispensing clinics yeah so and I don't see that a lot with more like the clean leaning brands How was that, making that decision to go into the spa space?

29:29I think it's just, you know what, it came with the territory because that's kind of the sector of the industry I operate in. Most of my network are dermatologists and estheticians. This is where I get ideas from. So for me, it was like a low hanging fruit to be available at that level, at that setting and have the professional recommendation. I feel like because topicals can, as you can see, these are like very comprehensive products. they require an extra element of education and only an esthetician or dermatologist can really translate some of the science into like, you know, simple lingo terms for the patients, for the client to really understand and benefit from.

30:06So for me, this is kind of like the first go-to-market strategy to have that presence in a spa channel, resort spa, medical spa, select, you know, clean boutiques or marketplaces and obviously dermatology practices, just because it helps validate that kosmosuruku, dermaturuku positioning of the line, but also helps with the educational component and then trust as well. So I think that the discovery happens at that level of, you know, at least photopagal skin brand. It might change, I don't know. But again, I just stay true to what I've known. I've always drank the Kool-Aid of SkinCuruku, SkinMerica, Obagi, Elastin Skincare, SkinBetterScience, you name it.

30:44These are my benchmarks. I don't benchmark against non-scientific brands. So I figure I'm just going to stay, you know, authentic and true to the channel that I've been within the last 15 years. I love that. I love that. And I'm so glad that you're expanding into that realm. I think that it's very much needed. And I want to get some words of wisdom from you as our closer for anyone out there who wants to go into the beauty industry. You know, it's a really scary industry, I think when you're a first time entrepreneur, especially and like just being able to navigate it. I mean, any advice that you can offer for anybody that wants to come into this space and understand like how beauty works from the inside?

31:22Yeah, I feel like you just have to be very passionate about what you're trying to achieve and pursue because solopreneurship is not for the faint of heart. Sometimes it's a very, very lonely journey. So you have to be very determined. There'll be a lot of ups and downs, not to sound negative. It's just reality of life. And I feel like you need to surround yourself with advisors or mentors. somebody who has done it before so they can create a shortcut to certain milestones for you. Otherwise, it's a long learning process. I'm a big believer in mentorship and also a big believer into outsourcing to experts because none of us are jack-of-all-trades.

31:56And there's a lot of regulations and compliance and obviously even packaging engineering, so many elements to creating a brand that, again, if you tap into an expert who has done it before and they can help you navigate the waters that's that's that's probably like my number one advice don't skimp out on that and do your research obviously there's a lot of skincare and beauty brands out there quite frankly the there's so many but it's it's almost overwhelming in the united states it's going to be very um hard on the very beginning to i guess get through the noise and the clutter and then really stand out i think it takes approximately 12 touch points with a consumer to even notice you forget about you know even giving a consideration of purchase so So I would say be prepared to spend a dollar or two in the very beginning before you can even see the needle moving.

32:45But I want to remain optimistic. My glass is always half full. So I encourage if you have an idea, it's a novel idea. Newness always sells. And, you know, new technologies, new molecules, you know, the more the merrier, right? Because we all need tools of trade to pick from. Absolutely. No, I love that. I love that. Thank you for that. And for everyone listening, you really got to check out Topical Skin. It's a beautiful brand. And I really love the formulations. You can see how much work has gone into every single product. And, you know, Alina, hats off to you. I love your work. And I think that what you're doing is so needed.

33:22Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. We're trying to go global eventually. So hopefully we're going to resonate with audiences beyond our United States. And we would love for your help to spread the world. Absolutely. No, full steam ahead. We need brands like Topical Skin, honestly. There's a lot of noise in this industry right now. And I love seeing people who really are doing it in the way of like, you know, it's science forward, but it's still appealing to individuals who might just want really great clean products, clean dermaceutical. So I love it. You know, it's really cool. Thank you. Thank you.