What’s the Snark on the “Outer Banks” Cast?

26:56Then, March 11th, 2026, Luka Doncic, it says, choosing the Outer Banks actress over your kids is a choice. Speaking of which, the actress is never letting go, ever. I don't know what they mean by never letting go. But this came off the heels of Luka just announcing his split from his fiance, Anna Maria Goltz, with whom he shares two daughters. And fans noticed that at this time, Luca and Madeline started to follow one another on Instagram. So could he have broken up with his fiancée, baby mama, when he and Madeline became introduced? Who knows? And then, just a couple weeks later, TMZ published that Luca Doncic and Madeline Klein can officially be crossed off the rumored couples list because TMZ has learned that there's absolutely nothing going on between them.

27:43Sources familiar with the situation tell TMZ that they're not dating, and to take it a step further, they've never even met each other. So take that with what you will. There's also another blind item that was revealed on September 11th, 2025, and people don't know if this is about Madeline Klein or Madison Bailey. A blind stating that, quote, this streaming beach actress did a 30-day sit and rehab with no one noticing. and apparently she was seen grinding her teeth and wiping her nose a lot due to cocaine use at the premiere of I Know What You Did last summer and I did come across this interview of her on the press junket for I Know What You Did she's slurring her words she's like kind of falling all over the place and I'm sorry it reminded me of my girl Selena at the AMAs in 2019.

28:29This has been kind of like her reputation, I would say, for a while now is that she likes to partake. And obviously, this is all alleged. We don't know anything for certain. This is speculation. But that has been kind of in the rumor mill for quite some time. And I mean, look at look at the guy she's dated, like you said, Zach Bia. That's exactly what I was going to say. Davidson. Yeah. Yeah. I'm like, give me a break. Like, I have no doubt she's doing all this stuff. But also like, Like everyone, all of these actresses are. Exactly. If she's hanging out with Lucas Gage, if Lucas Gage is her best friend.

29:04Yeah. I know Lucas Gage partakes. Let me come on. I just, I wish that some of these, and I will say that I noticed Drew Starkey. I was watching footage of him at the Onslaught premiere. And Drew Starkey, you guys know, love him to death. He was doing like a little like sniffle, like, and kind of like a little jittery. And again, these are all like Hollywood actors. Like, of course they're partaking. It's nothing that scandalous. But I wish that they would realize how beautiful they are and how much this will age them if they make a bad habit out of it. Honestly, yes, it's true. Both Drew and Madeline are definitely the most gorgeous.

29:44They're so gorgeous. I also think that Jonathan Davis, gorgeous. Like those three I feel like are like top of the line, just stunning, stunning people. But I really hope you're right that they don't make this a habit because you don't want to lose those looks too early. Well, it's like, look at like Jax Taylor and Shep Rose, you know, two men that used to be so good looking when they were younger. And look at how they have been ravaged by drug use. So it's like, just be careful if you are a Hollywood star listening to this or anyone listening to this. And if you're good looking, if you're not good looking, then like, who cares?

30:19Keep on doing your thing. Keep on doing your, keep doing you. No, no. Now that you mentioned Drew Starkey and his like maybe like touching his nose, there was a TikTok of Carter, that guy who just signed Nick Vans from Love Island, whose best friends is Stassi Baby and Kylie Jenner. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. He's always around these A-list celebrities. And I think she has like a music production business. He's very well connected. He is just like a man about town. There is a video of Carter, Drew Starkey, Odessa. I think Stassi Baby and Victoria. Oh, yeah. Remember you and I? Were they like in the bathroom?

30:54Yes. Yeah. Give me a break. What were you doing? Like anytime you guys see celebrities taking photos or videos in the bathroom, 100 % with certainty I can say they were doing cocaine two minutes before. Like, I'm sorry. That's just what it is. Yeah. So. It's just funny how obvious it is because like you're in a bathroom. You're crowded in a bathroom together. It's very obvious what you're doing. It's like, do you need to post this? No, I know. It's very obvious. I guess they're not ashamed. Like why be ashamed of it, I guess. No, I know. I know. It's so obvious. But, you know, if it helps you get through the press and you're testing it or whatever, I mean, no.

31:30Who am I to say? Just do your thing. Just be safe about it. So in late 2024, a major de Mois blind item circulated that Marvel Studios was eyeing Madeline for a primary female lead in the upcoming Spider-Man 4. And industry insiders have debunked those rumors. They said, while Marvel may be looking for a Madeline Klein type actress for a female lead, Madeline herself has not signed on or entered into official discussions. And let's talk about why she hasn't really become like the next big thing, a la Zendaya and Sidney Sweeney. So people say it's due to a couple things. One, a Netflix cage simply due to timing and the really robust filming schedule that is Outer Banks.

32:10So Outer Banks has been a massive success for the last seven years. They've been filming since 2019. But the filming of the show takes up a significant portion of the year, between six to eight months. So it's a massive commitment, which creates like a golden cage, leaving her with very small windows of time to audition for other roles or to promote major studio films. And I think like, I guess the same could be said with like Drew Starkey, though, because he has a lot of stuff going on. So why does he have more time? Yeah, yeah. Drew Starkey has like a ton of projects. in the pipeline. And I mean, it looks like she does too based on her Wikipedia, but Drew Starkey in that GQ interview that I think you read too, he talks about how every single year at the same time, they start filming Outer Banks and it takes up so much of their schedule.

32:55It's a very, you know, demanding filming schedule. They're doing physically demanding things and it just doesn't leave a lot of room for other projects. And now they're going to have more time freed up. So maybe she will be in more things, but I do think that like, she has some stuff coming out yeah it's probably also just her wanting to rest her body in mind like i can totally understand that too if you have a demanding schedule like maybe it's okay for drew starkey to go out and do audition for other roles but maybe for her she's like i have a little bit of time in a window to audition but like i'm just fucking tired which is totally fair yeah um there's also um oh the timing of when the writer's strike occurred so madeline gained some momentum when she starred in Glass Onion in 2023, and there was a lot of Hollywood, like, A-list stars in it.

33:43But the 2023 Hollywood writers and actors strike shut down the entire industry for nearly half a year. So when she was, like, kind of had her big break outside of Outer Banks, the writers strike basically froze casting, delayed film production, stalled the momentum of a lot of rising stars, not just Madeline. She signed on to the fashion brand deal. She signed a lucrative deal as a brand ambassador for Tommy Hilfiger and Revlon. And while these partnerships keep her highly visible globally and give her that potential it girl status, they place her in the public eye as a fashion icon slash influencer rather than a cinematic leading lady.

34:16But she has chosen on deliberately smaller character-driven independent projects over massive studio superhero blockbusters. So maybe it's by design. So for instance, she chose to star in the indie drama The Giant and the comedy thriller The Jury. and these projects really do build her acting credentials and respect within the industry, but they don't give her that same mainstream box office exposure needed to become more of a household movie name at this time. And also just transitioning from being a teen star to being an actor that's taken seriously, it is difficult. We've heard a lot of people talk about this.

34:50For instance, Hilary Duff and her role as Lizzie McGuire. She said that after leaving Lizzie McGuire, she felt like people only saw her as Lizzie or, for instance, Hannah Montana and Miley Cyrus. It is hard to kind of break out of your typecast. And because of her physical appearance and her breakout role as Sarah Cameron, Hollywood would frequently offer her roles as the popular girl, the trophy girlfriend, the bikini clad beach girl. And it is difficult for actresses, I think less difficult for actors or male actors. It is hard for women to break out of this box and secure the more gritty, dramatic, transformative roles that win awards and establish prestige.

35:30And Outerbanks is, at the end of the day, a YA teen melodrama soap. And Hollywood executives can look down on that due to the over-the-top stylistic acting. And the casting doesn't really see her as a serious, dramatic film lead. And I think that's where Sidney Sweeney, for example, she took on this gritty, like when she came onto her TV screens as Cassie, she played this gritty, very troubled, dilapolical, kind of like damaged, delicate, fragile young woman. And I feel like we wanted to see more of that, which is why she became more of like a box office hit. That's where I kind of see like the difference between Sidney Sweeney and Madeline Klein is that Sidney Sweeney kind of at the beginning of her career, she kind of went backwards where she showed us this like gritty, vulnerable woman on our screens in Euphoria.

36:20but then the roles that she's taken on since then has kind of made a scoff and been like, what are you doing? Like you have been this really great, you've shown us your acting capabilities on Euphoria but you've almost regressed. Whereas Madeline Klein, she's this soapy YA teenage girl and she doesn't have the same opportunities I think as Sydney Sweeney has had. Would you agree with like how Sydney Sweeney was like a more vulnerable gritty actress on Euphoria and that has set her up to be taken more seriously? euphoria is just a grittier show i would say that's that's what i think it is you're right is that it's just the roles are like a little bit meatier even though it is a ya show because it's actually like not a show for children it shouldn't be for children it's very like dark and like you said gritty and outer banks is like pure like cw slop which i love it we love it it's not it's not serious it's not gritty it's not dark it's not you know it's just it's like you know kids treasure hunting yeah yeah exactly and i think at this point in her career madeline needs a filmmaker willing to take a chance on her to do a juicy role to get her out of this kind of mold that outer banks has kind of put her in at this moment and i have no doubt like she could probably get there because again not only she's stunning but she's actually a really good act i think she's She is such a good actress.

37:43And that's what like, okay, like I always make fun of Emrata for this because I feel like Emrata is like, I am so beautiful that like it's hard for me to be taken seriously as an actress. And that's why like I had to stop acting. She has like in so few words said that multiple times that she is too beautiful. And it's like, yes, you're obviously beautiful, but you're also not a good actress. So it's like, why would they cast you? Like Madeline Klein is beautiful and she's genuinely a good actress. So like there will be rules for her. It just might not be – she might not be, like, winning an Oscar anytime soon.

38:14Yeah. Agreed. Okay, so let's get into Chase Stokes. So Chase was born James Alexander Chase Stokes September 16, 1992 in Annapolis, Maryland, making him 33 years old today. And he was raised in both Canton, Georgia and Orlando, Florida. And he earned a bachelor's from Valencia College, but he also attended UCF and Seminole State College. And he once aspired to be a professional ice hockey player, which is, like, random. He had small roles in Stranger Things, Daytime Divas, Tell Me Your Secrets, like we mentioned a couple episodes back, The Uglies. The Uglies. His breakout role, however, was as John B.

38:53in Outer Banks. And he actually does have a couple things on his docket. He is playing a leading role in the feature film Marked Men, Roland Shaw, in the military thriller Valiant One. which actually both premiered in 2025. Yeah, I'm like, I haven't even heard of these. They came out last year. He was cast in AMC's NASCAR theme series, Thunder Road. And he actually announced his feature directorial debut, I Told the Sunset About You, which is with Monarch Media. And in a 2026 Hollywood Reporter interview, he discussed overcoming health struggles. He said, I probably wouldn't have been around much longer if I didn't take care of my body.

39:33He said that he tried to maintain his physical appearance to play a teenager for five seasons, and that actually severely damaged his body. He said that by the time that final season ended, his internal organs, namely his liver and his kidneys, were actively shutting down. And medical exams from an internal medicine doctor revealed that his testosterone levels were alarmingly low for a 33-year-old man. And in order to recover and stabilize his body, he went completely off the grid, undergoing blood tests every two weeks to stabilize his baseline health metrics. And not only was his physical health ailing, but his mental health was also suffering.

40:08And he explained, which I definitely have sympathy for, he said he spent his entire late 20s and early 30s as his character. And that actually caused severe mental dissociation. He stated that, quote, I've been John B. more than I've been Chase. And his brain chemistry was so out of whack that he underwent transcranial magnetic stimulation, also known as TMS therapy, which is a procedure that uses magnetic fields to stimulate your nerve cells and combat major depression. And he says he really fights ongoing severe anxiety and panic attacks. And I kind of sit with that for a moment because I am like thinking men just don't develop as quickly as women.

40:45I think biologically there's like studies that prove that. You mean like mentally, emotionally? Mentally, right. And I think when it comes to Chase, if he was cast as John B. in his late 20s, I don't think his brain, like they say your brain fully forms at like 26, but like maybe mentally you're not fully there yet, right? And you're trying to be this character, this treasure hunting man. And everyone sees you as John B. They don't know you from other bodies of work. They don't know you as Chase Stokes. They see you as John B. And I can imagine how difficult that would be as someone who's like the leading man of this show.

41:18All eyes are on you. Like the Netflix show, Outer Banks, no one I don't think saw it coming how much of a success it would be. and it blew up quite literally overnight. And during the pandemic when all of us were sitting at home with nothing else to do. So I can imagine how damaging that could have been on him. So I definitely, as much as I clown on this man, okay? I know, I feel bad now. I actually do feel badly for him. Yeah, no, I totally get that. I feel like it would be disorienting to play a role for so long. And also it's not like he's been in that much other stuff. And I don't mean that as shade, it's just like a fact.

41:48So it's like, he probably does lose his identity a little bit. Right, and especially when people are hounding you and all they talk about when they approach you is how much Outer Banks meant to them and how amazing of a show it is. It's like, but what about me? Like, who is me as Chase Stokes contributing to anything other than my role at John B? Like, that would be a mindfuck for sure that I can't even begin to understand or like really empathize with because who could empathize with it? You can only just sympathize and like feel badly for him. Right. And obviously he dated his co-star Madeline Klein from 2020 to 2021.

42:22And I remember that being a really big deal because people were really obsessed with them because they played onscreen lovers and then offscreen they were dating. And they were kind of under wraps about it for a while, but they definitely like decided to come public with it. And they posted an Instagram story about it. And I think fans, really parasocial young fans, were devastated upon finding out that he and Madeline decided to part ways because it was just like, what do you mean? Sarah and John are like OTP. Did you see the rumors also? And I don't believe these rumors, for the record, that they were hooking up during filming for this past season.

42:53I do not believe them. Okay, so I have a lot of thoughts about that because first I will say season five chemistry was off the charts and I would liken it to season one chemistry for them. I did notice in like I think season three, I can't remember which season because they've been so far apart at this point. There was one season when I think it was 2023 filming when she was dating Pete Davidson. It was so clear that they did not like each other. The chemistry was just really, really lacking and waning comparatively to other seasons. this season I was like oh my god they their physical chemistry and emotional chemistry is so palpable through the screen but Kelsey Ballerini does have a nod to a lot of her songs on her most recent record about her fear and anxiety around him filming with Madeline Klein and I remember dissecting these lyrics so intimately when her album came out because I was like oh my god she's talking about Madeline so let's get into that.

43:49Chase Stokes he had an on-again off-again relationship with Kelsey Ballerini since 2023, which we've all covered on the show many a time and on our sub stack. But she had a pretty high profile divorce from fellow country artist Morgan Evans. And she had an album that was dedicated to her divorce called Rolling Up the Welcome Mat. And in that album, she talks about kind of getting back out there after having been in a really long relationship with Morgan. And Kelsey admits that she slid into Chase's DMs at around 1 a.m. with a simple hi, Chase Stokes. and they officially met in January 2023. And I listened to a couple tidbits of her Call Her Daddy interview where she describes a relationship that she had with Chase.

44:28So apparently they were just talking like virtually via FaceTime and like texting for weeks before they actually met in real life. And she really, really liked him. And when they officially met in January 2023, she says that they met at like a restaurant or some like bar and Chase hopped out of his car. He grabbed Kelsey's face, kissed her and said, thank God you're real. Wow, what a romantic. That's such a stupid line. That's so lame. I'll get the ick. Like, that's gross. And they made their red carpet debut at the CMT Music Awards in April 2023. And from there, they were constantly supporting one another online, at one another's concerts, the premieres.

45:06And throughout the relationship between Kelsey and Chase, there was a lot of Madeline Klein rumors. And unfortunately for Kelsey, like, I can imagine how difficult this would be. Chase had to continue filming romantic scenes with his ex because they were still together, Sarah and John B., on the show. And, of course, the internet was continuing to stir drama up about it. There's all these, like, young parasocial fans saying that they wanted John B. and Sarah to be back together in real life. And Kelsey did say on Call Her Daddy that Madeline was lovely. But fans speculated that Kelsey's song called Emerald City was about Madeline Klein.

45:40And this is when Chase Stokes had to publicly go online, And like push back defending both women. Because people were kind of like shading him. Saying did you cheat on Kelsey with Madeline when you were filming. So let me read to you the lyrics of Emerald City. Kelsey writes. I always liked the color of my eyes till I knew she had brown. I'm green. Always liked my naive innocence till I learned she got around. I'm green. Green meaning like envy. And she says if I got you why does she still get me? I hate to say it but damn she's pretty. Never known the shade of envy. Just tell me I'm your Emerald City.

46:13If she texts in the middle of the night when we're laying in the bed, is it green? And I hate how it takes me down an old road where she used to be yours. And it's tough to have been it, but it might break me. Let me know you hate to see me hurt. And then she had this other song called 587 about how they would do like kind of a long distance between, I think, where she was living and he was living. And she says, easy flight. It was always an easy flight. We did it Saturdays, but then we end up fighting over missed calls from exes, past life connections, and who's more impressive. so then it makes me wonder how much of the Madeline thing was an issue in Kelsey and Chase's relationship and Madeline Klein has brown eyes yeah so people were like who is she talking about other than Madeline yeah I mean it definitely would be tough for your boyfriend to be constantly you know like to have basically a co-worker who's his ex that they would be traveling together and be filming scenes together constantly.

47:09And also random tea is that even though Madeline and Chase, like you said, broke up pretty early on during the run of Outer Banks, they still would film all these scenes together. Whereas Rudy Panko, and I know we'll get into this, his girlfriend, who was an on-set assistant, she had some role on set, was so jealous of his scenes with Madison Bailey, who played Kiera, that they had to use a stunt double for some of their scenes. I fully believe all that. But Chase and Madeline, who were actual exes, could get through their scenes. But Rudy Panko, whether it was the girlfriend being jealous or Rudy not wanting to piss off his girlfriend or not wanting to touch Madison, whatever it was, the fact that he had to use a stunt double for those scenes where they would just be cuddling by a bonfire.

47:57Meanwhile, Chase and Madison, or Madeline, were literal, yeah, We're literal exes. And I think that does speak to the professionalism that is Chase and Madeline. Yeah, totally. And they do admit. Let's give him his flowers, Chase. Exactly. We're coming full circle. Wait, you guys. We were texting. Christy and I were texting. And we were like, there could be no other John B. Like, Chase really ate this role. Like, dare I say, dare I say, like, he should have won an award. No. Like, at least a Teen Choice Award. Give him the TCA. Yes. Yes. I completely agree. And, you know, Madeline and Chase were open and honest about how difficult it was to film their scenes together after they fucking hated each other's guts for a period of time.

48:44And there was, like, a moment where they both had to sit down together and say, are we ready to stop hating each other because this is fucking miserable? Like, that to me is so professional because not only are you making your own lives hell, you're making everyone around, cast and crew's lives hell as well if you're not getting along. Like, that sucks for everyone. Totally. So I definitely think that's amazing that they were able to overcome that. But I can't even imagine how jealous I would be if I were in Kelsey's position and knowing that your boyfriend is filming with his gorgeous, stunning, perfect, like, ex.

49:13Yeah. And romantic scenes. Like, Kelsey's also a saint for having to put up with that. Yeah, that would suck. So they've split Kelsey and Chase multiple times. First in September 2025. After three years of dating, their busy schedules caused them to quietly split. But it was really confusing because just two days prior to People magazine announcing they had split, Chase had just posted a tribute for Kelsey's 32nd birthday. So people were like, when you hear about a People magazine split, it's happened long before. So why was Chase just like publicly explaining his love, effusing his love for Kelsey?

49:49So everyone was very confused by that. Then in November 2025, there were rumors that they had gone back together because they were seen spotted holding hands in Croatia. and around this time this is when chase was being super weird and lame and um like kind of going offline going back online defending kelsey against trolls but people never knew where they stood and just two weeks after their alleged reconciliation in croatia in november chase posted a series of cryptic deleted ig stories telling fans this is when i he pissed me the fuck off i was like you're so stupid like leave us out of this don't believe the media i'm blocked i did nothing wrong sorry heart I tried.

50:26I'm sorry for those who believed in us. It is what it is. Onwards and upwards. And the two at that point had wiped each other from their following list on Instagram. And there were reports that they maybe even blocked one another. Then a month later in December, they reunited publicly on New Year's Eve. Kelsey posted a photo of them kissing, writing about her desire to break patterns and stop internet speculation. And this is when it really pissed me off when it came to Kelsey and Chase. I was like, no one is trying to speculate anything. You guys are the ones that contributed to all this speculation.

50:57Like, don't gaslight us into making us think that we are doing this just to be annoying. You guys do this. Yeah. And then this New Year's Eve reconciliation only lasted like five weeks because in February, their reps confirmed again that they parted ways and Kelsey scrubbed him from her Instagram and unfollowed. Just super annoying. So some blind items about the two of Kelsey and Chase. This tutu wearing singer really wants people to believe that she broke up with her beach actor boyfriend. She loves the attention of people talking about her and her life. That's so, that's embarrassing. I have nothing against Kelsey Ballerini at all.

51:30But like, why? Why are you doing this? If this is true, honestly, I could see it being true because the on again, off again, and making it everyone's problem kind of leads me to believe that this is either for publicity or just for attention. And I said this like many a time in Dark Energy Tuesdays. I love Kelsey ballerini i've been listening to her music for like a decade now she i think she's weird now just as weird as chase because it's like no one gets back together like this is so toxic like you're in your 30s like grow up i'm sorry right there were also rumors constantly swirling that it was pure torture for madeline and chase to be filming scenes together and like i said madeline did confirm that the rumors were in fact true during an august 2026 interview where she admitted there were moments after their November 2021 breakup that were absolutely difficult and caused a lot of misery on set.

52:20But again, they decided to go back to normal, friends and co-workers. Yeah. So where does this leave Chase with his career? And he says that he really is inspired by Robert Pattinson, which I'm like, oh my God, I watched Robert Pattinson yesterday on The Odyssey. He says, I always reference Robert Pattinson after he finished Twilight and the Harry Potter franchise and how he took creative risks, but really challenged himself as an artist. That's the blueprint for me. I want to show people that the floppy-haired beach boy from the Netflix YA show is now 33 years old. And he has moved his primary residence out of Hollywood to Charleston.

52:54And he actually wants to do more behind-the-camera work. He says he wants to write and build creative narratives slowly rather than signing on to the first blockbuster superhero movie that calls. And he was recently cast as Ronnie Whitlock in the AMC NASCAR drama Thunder Road. He says, quote, I wanted to do something different that felt different. I wanted to do something that felt different. It felt like I was in a new world, but a world that people could find a connection in relation to. It's been kind of nice to not just jump into something immediately, especially after doing a show like Outer Banks, where everyone is asking, what's he going to do next?

53:25I've just taken some time to really dip my toes into different areas of the entertainment industry, encapsulating the idea of being a storyteller, not just in front of the camera but from every angle so good luck with that good luck with that yeah yeah good like i would be pressed to see you in anything else but i know i'm sorry i'm sorry chase like you're really you killed it as john b but like you said what i could not see him in anything else like genuinely i mean we'll see good luck talking about a typecast i feel like he is the blueprint for a typecast yeah okay so let's talk about madison bailey who plays kiara on outer banks so she was born January 29th, 1999 in North Carolina.

54:02She was actually adopted and raised with six older siblings, five of which were also adopted through foster care. And she began acting in 2015 and came out as, she had like a couple of roles, Mr. Mercedes, Constantine, Black Lightning, Creepshow, before starring as Key and Outer Banks, which was her breakout role. She also came out as pansexual in May 2020. And she has a long-term relationship with former UNC Charlotte basketball player Mariah Linney, and they've been together since 2020. And the two sparked breakup rumors in April 2025 after unfollowing one another on Instagram, but no split was confirmed.

54:41And this was off the heels of Mariah, her ex, posting cryptic quotes about, quote, years not going to plan. There's not much about Madison Bailey, but there was a blind item that was published in September 2025. A current cast member of the Beat Show is getting canceled for something they posted on their story. She's also known for being a horrible person in their hometown, and no one there has said anything nice about her, hence why she never visits home. What did she post on her story? I don't know, but like, she seems totally harmless to me. She seems cool. That's kind of shocking to me. When I've seen press of her, she seems super close to all of her co-stars.

55:19Carlycia Grant with Madeline Klein with all the boys. Like, I don't know. She just seems like a delight to be around. So this was kind of confusing to me. Yeah. But there's also been a couple of blind items, again, about whether or not this blind item was about her, Madeline Klein. Speaking of skiing, at a recent event, this Outer Banks star couldn't stop grinding her teeth or rubbing her nose. So again, is this about Madeline? Madison? Who knows? But there's a lot of rumors when you talk about Madison Bailey, you can't talk about her without talking about Rudy Panko. And if you guys know, in season one of Outer Banks, filming started in 2019 and the pandemic had started in March 2020.

55:59The cast got very, very close. And if you followed any of them on TikTok or their Instagrams, they were basically living together in like apartments like right next to one another. So they got to be super close. And I feel like there was a lot of speculation as to whether Rudy Panko and Madison Bailey were maybe not only just like on-screen lovers. I can't remember when they got together on the show. But whether or not. I want to say like season three maybe. And it was after everyone was shipping them because remember her character was with Pope first and I actually liked them better. I thought that they had like to me more chemistry and made more sense.

56:34But the fans like love JJ and Kiera together. So I feel like the writers listen to the fans actually and put them together after that. Yeah. And it was so clear that when we were all watching Outer Banks in 2020 stuck at home, it was clear that there was something. They had chemistry. Like they were always posting together, always posting like selfies of just the two of them. People couldn't help but like think, is there something going on behind the scenes between Madison and Rudy? And a lot of stuff started to happen with between Rudy and Madison. Once Rudy Panko's girlfriend, Elaine Simic. So let's talk about Elaine.

57:16Let me pivot to Elaine and Rudy's relationship. So Elaine Simic, she worked behind the scenes as an assistant to the showrunner Jonas Pate. And she took a lot of like BTS film photos of the cast and crew while working on the set. So Elaine was heavily ingratiated with the cast and crew. And like Sophie just mentioned, a lot of fans were obsessed with the onscreen romance between JJ and Madison Bailey or between JJ and Kiera. And these YA parasocial tween people, I can only imagine, because who else is harassing a showrunner's assistant? started to harass Elaine really badly. Because she was dating Rudy Panko.

57:53Because she was dating Rudy Panko, and they really wanted Madison and Rudy Panko to be together. So Elaine, unfortunately, became the target of severe online bullying, cheating rumors, constant harassment from the toxic corners of the Outer Banks fandom. And these fans claimed that Elaine was taking advantage of Rudy and was using him purely for his wealth and his fame. He was barely famous at that point. I know. He was literally on a show for like a season. Probably had not even that much money, honestly. And also, like, I'm not one to defend Rudy Panko because remember, he was probably my worst celebrity encounter where he was really fucking rude to me, which I've talked about before.

58:32I know. That's really disappointing. But I feel bad. The Outer Banks fans, I think, because it's such a young show, are extremely young and extremely parasocial. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And so this kind of interaction with Rudy's girlfriend, Elaine, comes as no surprise to me. Because I'm like, of course they're pissed off. Like, it's so immature. It's young fans. Like, with nothing else to do. So even trolls tried to break up Rudy and Elaine in 2022. So there was a rumor that erupted online when fans started to circulate photos of a couple kissing on the street. And they're like, this woman is Elaine.

59:06And the man that she's kissing is clearly not Rudy. Unhinged and super weird. Yeah. But Elaine had to publicly debunk this rumor on Instagram the day the photo was taken. She had to snap a photo of her and Rudy and was like, listen, for everyone saying that I'm kissing this random man on the street, I'm actually flying from Barbados to Italy with Rudy. So this actually is completely factually incorrect. And it's just so unhinged. It's such unhinged behavior by the fandom. Like, I can't even imagine what this poor girl had to deal with and all the online hate. And not only were they bullying her and like, what?

59:38Oh, what were you going to say? I was just going to say also Rudy Panko. I mean, you could argue like Drew Starkey also was like the heartthrob of the show. But Rudy Panko from the beginning was the heartthrob of the show. John B. Chase Stokes never really was. It was always J.J. He was the hot one that everyone was obsessed with. I even started Outer Rinks. I mean, I watched it during the pandemic when it first came out, but I remember seeing a fan cam of J.J. on Twitter and I was like, wait, the show looks good. This guy's cute. I'm going to watch. Like, he was kind of like the draw to the show, even though he wasn't.

1:00:08And that's also why I feel like we make fun of Chase Stokes, because he was like the narrator and the star of the show. But there were so many other people that overshadowed him, including Rudy Panko. Right. Because with John B., he's supposed to be the leaning man. But offline, off screen, it wasn't that. Well, on screen, too. He completely was overshadowed by these better, more interesting characters. Yes. Yes. And actually, that's a good point. And I think when it came to Rudy Panko's character, JJ, JJ was like a troubled teen. He had like really, really like horrific internal family structures.

1:00:44He just was. You rooted for him. Yeah, you were really rooting for him. And I think that's also what led to a lot of parasocialness between him and the fans because they're like, he's this like young man who needs our help. And it just breeded a lot of toxicity. Yeah. I also noticed that the last season. So spoiler alert, you guys. I'm sure you know this by now. JJ dies at the end of season four. So season five is, you know, no JJ. He exists only in like flashbacks. And I think that's why I started to appreciate Chase Stokes as John B more because there wasn't JJ there to overshadow him. Yeah.

1:01:22I was like, wait, he actually is good as John B. And I actually am drawn to this character in a way that I never was before. And I think it's because JJ wasn't there. I didn't actually think of it like that. But that's actually a very good point. JJ really, when you're looking at the Pogues, JJ seals the screen. I think even more than Madeline Klein because of his character and his acting ability. And a lot of people, I don't know if I believe this, but a lot of people boycotted the show after JJ was killed off. And apparently the viewership, it's still number one on Netflix, but apparently the viewership was down a lot and people were like, I'm not watching because JJ's gone.

1:01:56But I don't think JJ was killed off against Rudy Panko's will. I think Rudy Panko wanted to leave the show. He was ready to move on and he was sick of the harassment that him and his girlfriend were facing. So I wonder what the tea is there, especially because Madeline Klein unfollowed both of them. Yes. So we'll get there. So just one other thing on Elaine, because yes, I think that is very important as to why Rudy Panko's character was killed off. It wasn't against his volition. Like, he wanted this. I think he requested writers to take him off the show because he couldn't handle, one, the toxicity of the fans.

1:02:30And two, he was not getting along with his castmates. And it's very, very clear on the press junkets that the current cast is doing right now. It's abundantly clear at this point. They're not even trying to hide it. And I'm seeing all these comments. Everyone's like, they're not even media trained. Like, they literally roll their eyes. Any time JJ's character is brought up, they completely skirt around the question. It's so uncomfortable. Oh, my God. That's so funny. I didn't even notice that. Oh my God, no, I'll have to send you. I wonder like what the beef is. I mean, like I said, I met him in person.

1:03:00He was an asshole. He was also like clearly like high, like not high on uppers. It seemed like he was literally just like high from like smoking weed, which like is fine, but he was really rude. You guys know I've been all about transforming my space in 2026. So far, that's included house renovations, hiring a home organizer, et cetera, et cetera. Now I'm on to tackling my closet because a huge part of having a calming zen space is letting go of all the stuff I haven't worn in years. That's why I'm so excited this episode is sponsored by Vinted. Vinted is a secondhand marketplace app that makes it so easy to sell the pieces you're no longer wearing so you can make space for stuff that you actually will.

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1:05:36Firestone, always dependable since 1900. Yeah, so there's a lot of rumors is that this rift between Rudy Panko and Elaine v. everyone else started in June 2023 at a cast dinner. So I guess following this specific dinner, Madison Bailey and her partner unfollowed Rudy's girlfriend Elaine and, sorry, just unfollowed Elaine. I don't think Rudy Panko just yet. And then everyone was like, why would the both of them unfollow Elaine? So maybe something happened at this dinner that caused a divide between Madison Bailey versus Elaine. And I think probably what happened was the entire cast took Madison Bailey's side and Rudy, of course, took his girlfriend's side and that caused this like schism.

1:06:21Yeah. That makes sense. Yeah. And when I was watching this interview, the interviewer asked Madison, how do you feel about, you know, the fans really wanting J.J. back and how you were avenging his death? Like, what is a show without J.J.? And Carlecia Grant literally like puts her head down. Yeah, who plays Cleo. Literally throws her head back. And Madeline kind of like her eyes start darting back and forth. And Madison kind of puts like she Madison Bailey kind of just puts her head down. You can just tell it's like a weird subject that no one wants to talk about. The guys, however, are very open to talking about it.

1:07:05When Chase Stokes was asked on the carpet, look at Chase being an unproblematic king. Like what a 180 I've done. You know what? I respect him. No, like he. He's so professional. You know what, Chase Stokes may be the most professional one on that cast. Like, genuinely. Honestly, I think he is. No, like, and you know, I think also he's maybe the oldest. Him or Drew Starkey. I don't know. I think he is the oldest, except Cleo. I think she's like 35. Yeah. How old is, um. She actually, I was just reading that she is this, Carlicia Grant is the same age as the actress that plays Rose. Oh my God, it doesn't say her age on.

1:07:42No way. Wikipedia. Yeah, isn't that crazy? That doesn't math to me. Oh my God, that's crazy. Yeah, so Drew Starkey is 32. Chase Stokes is 33. Oh, she's 35. Yeah, I think she's 35. Yeah. So when Chase Stokes was asked about J.J., it was kind of cute. Like Chase is like, you know, me and Pope, Jonathan Davis who plays Pope, we actually had a conversation about how we would kind of like honor J.J.'s legacy on the show. And we both said, you know, Rudy Panko was kind of the comedic relief and he brought so much life and humor to the set. And so me and Jonathan Davis had to sit down and say, like, how do we keep J.J.

1:08:21and honestly Rudy's spirit both alive on set and on screen? And I think he said something like he keeps I may be watching this and forgive me. I think he said he like kept something of Rudy Panko's as like to commemorate like the soul of that character, even after he left in season five. Well, that's nice. That, like, I guess not all of the cast hated him. But there was clearly some drama there. I think it's Madison, Madeline, Carlecia are so fucking over Rudy and the girlfriend. Yeah. And Rudy is over them, too. Which kind of sucks because, like, I think of—this is just me with my own personal stuff.

1:08:57Like, when I studied abroad, you have this, like, community of people where I remember the last day we all left each other. All the guys were crying. All the girls were crying. We all just felt like we had created this family. and to feel like someone in the family leaves, it's just really sad. And I feel like they created a family for seven years and all of a sudden one member of the family is gone. It just, it makes me sad because I feel like they were all super close at the beginning and it just felt like a study abroad experience, but with like macro fame and all that to be put down the drain because of like one fight.

1:09:32I mean, we'll never know. And I feel like they're all really mum about it, but maybe add it to the list of things I could find out. One, Mary Kate's involvement with Heath Ledger's death. What happened in Lamar and Khloe's home when Rob Kardashian was living there? And three, why is Rudy iced out from the female members of the cast of Outer Banks? Yeah. So there's definitely something there and I'm very interested. And it definitely has to do, I think, with his relationship also. And you know how crazy these trolls are against Elaine? So trolls organized targeted smear campaigns where they mass messaged corporate brands and companies that Elaine collaborated with because she's a photographer, like a freelancer.

1:10:14They demanded that their businesses drop for sponsorships. I mean, people are psychotic. Like trying to literally ruin her livelihood and her way to earn money. The internet is making the scariest people. Like I'm actually terrified of how of the new generations and how they're being raised on the internet to think that this is normal to have parasocial relationships, to bully people online, to just be like horrible sociopaths online. Like it's actually crazy. It is. I can't for a moment even understand like why anyone found this to be appropriate behavior. So that's that on the cast of Outer Banks.

1:10:53Well, Jonathan Davis, I guess, doesn't have like any tea or drama. No, I know. We'll have to do like a separate episode, I think. Jonathan Davis is, I think, really low-key. I'm really happy that he's going to be playing Snoop Dogg in the biopic. And it's so cute. I was watching some interviews with Jonathan Davis, and he was saying how he's now friends with Snoop's kids. And he'll say that Snoop's kids will say, it's so weird when I'm talking to you, I think I'm talking to my dad. He actually does play Snoop super well, and he said that he's gotten really close to the family. And I don't know.

1:11:24Jonathan Davis, I think he has a lot to—I think he has a lot of career headway ahead of him. I think he is lovely and so sweet as Pope, and I want to see him take on greater roles. Yeah, for sure. So—and we'll have to do a whole other episode on our boyfriend. Yeah, true. Yeah. An ensemble episode like this, it's—we need more for our boyfriend. He deserves that. Yeah, for sure. So what did we talk about on Patreon yesterday, Sophie? Do you want to tell the audience? Oh, the FIA scandal. Phoebe Gates' company that has gotten in big trouble recently with cookie stuffing. If you don't know what that means, listen to the episode.

1:12:08That's on Patreon. Do you hate it when, like, billionaires try to, like, billionari them more? You are the daughter of a billionaire. Why are you committing fraud? Like, it just makes no sense. Genuinely. It doesn't. And if you guys don't already know, our Patreon releases ad-free episodes Tuesday, Thursdays, and we do bonus content every Wednesdays. We have a sub stack that releases every Friday. All that is in our show notes. Follow us on Instagram. That's also in our show notes. And we love you guys so much. We'll see you on Tuesday for another episode of DET. Bye. Bye.

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