Making YouTube Pay: Why the SDHL moved to YouTube

0:05Hello everyone and welcome to another edition of Streamtime Sports. I'm your host Nick Meacham, CEO at SportsPro. Now this week's episode of the podcast is part of our new series called Making YouTube Pay. And in this edition, I'm speaking to someone who's based a little bit closer to home for me, and that is the CEO of the Swedish Women's Hockey League, Angelica Linda Batty. I got a chance to speak to her at the Sports Pro Media Summit where she had just come off stage presenting the approach and strategy that the Hockey League took to launch on YouTube. It's a really interesting conversation to hear what she's had to go through to get the league and the platform up and running in just a couple short months.

0:46So a great conversation that I really enjoyed both what I recorded and also catching up with her afterwards and talking a bit more about life in Sweden. But look, that's enough of me. It's time for me to hand over to me talking to Angelika Lindabady of the Swedish Women's Hockey League. So Angelika, thank you so much for joining us here in Madrid. We obviously, you've just come fresh off stage to talk about what you're doing with the Svenska Damans Hockey League or SDHL. Talk us through just what you've been talking about, I guess. But before we jump into that, let's a little bit about the construct of the league, how many teams, where you play, let's start from there maybe.

1:25Yeah, so the SHL was actually founded 2016, so next year we're actually celebrating the 10 years anniversary, so that sounds very fun. So we are 10 leagues, 10 teams in the leagues, and they are playing 36 games, 18 home, 18 away, throughout the country, and it's, as you know, It's a very long country, so it's long traveling. We're playing mostly Fridays and Sundays. And it's like our most important thing now, I would say, is like we have to kind of find a way to raise the visibility about the audience to come to the game. So it's been a fun journey the last 10 years, but we're kind of looking forward now, like what the next step will be.

2:13And so when you joined and started as CEO, what was really the main focus for you then? Was it the media side initially or was it basically everything that a CEO has to be focused on when running a league? It's a funny story actually. So I've been working with the league for eight years now. And as I mentioned, we were founded in 2016. So the first two years there were no one working with the league. so when I started I started as the first one to actually get hired at the Estatia so it was kind of a I used to say like I had a white paper in front of me and there were no one that has kind of draw something like ever so it was kind of to collect it from like okay we have to kind of look at from the schedule how would that look like and how would the media rights look like do we have any partners no we don't and and the funniest thing there was like I was hired to be a marketing coordinating coordinator and that was not my job to be honest I was kind of from the beginning a CEO as what I did not in the role as a title but but I actually did everything so I was the sport director I was the media I was the marketing but I think that's that has actually helped me a lot when now being the CEO because that was what I like in May it have helped me to actually understand every positioning of the company and knowing that it's nothing is easy but I know how we actually can progress it forward.

3:40So what is the relationship exactly with the Swedish hockey league the men the Swedish men's hockey league because obviously there's a lot of team the teams are synonymous with both I believe universally what is the relationship exactly ownership wise or who owns the league? Yeah that's actually a great question I mean we are a limited company so both the shl and the sdhl are limited company but we are not collaborating between us so our 10 clubs are owning the league as well as for the shl so shl are 14 teams and we are 10 teams and compared to shl we have eight teams in the sdhl that are also playing in the shl so of course it's a lot of things that are the same but we are not in like an ownership we are not doing anything more than just kind of talking.

4:30So let's talk about the process to work out the right media strategy that or the media strategy you've ended up taking. What was that process like? And I'm guessing you didn't jump straight into the idea of doing YouTube. You thought about all sorts of different avenues first. Just what was that like? How did you go through that? What were some of the steps you took and conversations you might have had? I mean, to give background, we have had a TV agreement since 2019. So we were one of the first women's leagues to actually have that type of a TV agreement, even though it might not give us that type of revenue.

5:07But now when we were sitting around the table with the different companies saying like, what are we going to do? Are we going to extend or are we going to go to another one? we have a slightly different opinions about the value of women's hockey and then women's hockey league in sweden so when coming to that decision we kind of ended up okay we don't get any offer from having offers we don't get any offers but we need to get the product out there so how do we do that um and and to be very transparent we had this was in june and we were dropping the parking on September 5th so it was something is gonna happen three months in time yeah so when we I together with Victor Iwansson who is the one that I'm cooperating with we sat down and he said like what about YouTube and I was like I've had this in my mind for a couple of years back and then it was like oh I don't think that's the thing but now when he actually said it was like I think maybe that's the right choice for us to do.

6:10Since being on, to be honest, I mean, we have been working with this league for 10 years, but the audience growth hasn't been there, even though it's racing, but it hasn't been there. So for us to actually go to YouTube was a way of kind of lower the barriers. I mean, getting more people to actually watch women's hockey rather than have to pay first in order to be interested. So that is kind of the strategy here that we want to make more people to see the games before they have to pay for it. So, dude, if that makes sense. Yeah, absolutely. Let's talk, before we go a bit further on the YouTube part, talk a little bit about the Swedish media market.

6:53Because I think for some people, we might not be familiar with it. And I'm actually still learning it because I consume a bit of Swedish content. But that's still a learning phase for me, even after 10, 11 months there. is you have quite established players. There's a very strong pay TV arena. You do have obviously SVT and TV4 and so forth. They have obviously on demand and streaming products as well as their linear channels. But did that come on the radar potentially even of being available in their ecosystems or they weren't really keen to pursue that or was that you not keen to just be lost in their ecosystem?

7:34I would say a combination. So since we have been on SVT and TV4 for until since 2019, we kind of had this opportunity now to actually say, OK, what matters the most? What do we actually wanted to execute here? And as I mentioned, I mean, we we think or I think personally that it has been great for us to be in that type of context, to be accepted, to actually be seen by a lot of people. but for us to grow and also to get those revenue but also to monetize and grow the fan base we have to kind of look it from a different perspective and we always say that we shouldn't compare it with men's hockey and we still are in that context of course we're going to be compared so for us it was we had the opportunity to be on their kind of OTT but that investment would be have been saying as for be on YouTube so with all those kind of things in mind we thought like maybe we should just take a risk for us to do this I think it's it was right in time and I think for us now to also see all this data that YouTube provides and also to own everything I mean I said it on stage I mean when giving it to a TV producer or TV media house you kind of lose track of your own product, to be honest.

8:57And now we understand that there's a lot of things to do. And I mean, as someone I also mentioned on stage, it's not only like having distribution of games, you have to create a lot of things to actually keep you interest. And that's something we kind of now developing. So you talked internally and said, why not look at YouTube? But there's still a couple of steps there afterwards to get support from the teams and all other stakeholders as part of that. What was that like? What did you have to do before you could get the official we're going all full steam ahead with YouTube? I mean, it wasn't easy, even though it went fast, since we had to kind of take a decision.

9:37So we started off presenting for my board, and there were a lot of questions because everyone is kind of phased into this traditional thing. I think everyone thinks very high about traditional media, and that's fair. but I think to actually get as many of and many mentioned I mean we have to kind of get the younger audience to think this is interesting and that's not about traditional tv yet so it was a lot of convincing and having arguments for why this is good and connect that to our strategy which is to raise interest and popularity of women's hockey and when that was done it was to present it for the owners which are the clubs the 10 clubs and everyone has to align with that so that was also interesting uh we have um a lot of every club is good but some are more forward to be honest so and obviously when they said like what's to actually miss here i mean we have to we have to try and then there was kind of like let's do this uh so it was not that dramatic but it was from my personal thing i was like scared to be honest because i have one thing to do and it's to create revenue and he was about to invest something who we previously got money from.

10:51Yeah, it's an interesting challenge for sure. So you got the green light. What were some of the things you did then? Prior to making that decision, did you have a heavy dialogue with YouTube at all about that and how they could support it all? Was that really just you working out your own journey there? And then what steps did you have to take to manage the broadcast, the production? Was that already in place from your previous relationship or did you have to do something different there no to be honest not because we didn't reach out because we were just like okay we need to make this happen and in summer in sweden i mean everyone is kind of just taking their computer down saying bye people don't understand that that's really a thing in sweden right where basically people do shut down it becomes a ghost town in your area for a few weeks and everyone is off doing their own thing.

11:38For those in English speaking markets, that's quite a different thing and difficult thing to get their heads around. Yeah. And this was just like before midsummer and after midsummer that it's going to happen. So for us, it was like, okay, YouTube, we take contact with them after the vacation. And now it's just about going out with it because everyone was kind of, okay, what's going to happen? Everyone knew that, okay, we had this agreement that were actually, either way it's going to be extended or not. And everyone was kind of haunting us like, okay, what's going to happen? And the players didn't know.

12:15So it was kind of a mess, to be honest. But it was also for us to just kind of have control before we say something. So no, we didn't have any conversation with YouTube, though we do have it now and they are super supportive. And the funniest thing were in the first meeting that we had with them, Michelle Kadir in Sweden she said like the funniest thing is like we have a strategy that we're going to reach out to leagues now and you just kind of did my job and it was like amazing but they are super supportive and talk about us in different areas when they speak. Okay so you're up and running using Sportway to help get the broadcast production I'm familiar with that team here and actually here as well.

12:59Now, you're up and so basically you're up and running more or less off of that, the streaming to the YouTube was a go and that was all fairly straightforward to get up and running. Were there any major challenges that you faced getting actually that first game live? No, I think it was kind of undramatic. The thing now is like we, obviously our clubs wanted to have all the cameras up for the first game and that was not possible. I mean, it's a lot of things to do to install the games. or the cameras and so so we have had a one camera solution now the first games um and now i think first of december now we will have all all the cameras up and i think it's also fun because the first thing was like okay we're going for youtube and that was a big thing and now we can in december go out okay now have all the cameras so it it helps us to kind of stay out there and people wanting to talk about us so so but it has been kind of undramatic of course it's some things that are missing in some ways or the network is kind of losing.

14:01But that can happen for whatever. So it's not only for YouTube and us being there. So how has it performed for you? Have you been happy with the numbers? Can you share any insights into what sort of scale you've been able to achieve? And is that staying constant or is it maybe going up or down since it's been live? I mean, it's not a surprise that I was actually exceed by the numbers. We don't get all the numbers from TV productions earlier, as I guess all people know. But we actually got from the TV production that they've never seen those numbers when we were under their kind of umbrella. So that is something.

14:43And we were kind of like for the first game, me and Victor talked and it was like, OK, if it's 500 people watching live, that would be amazing. and then when the first game were kind of happening and I'm sitting on the live at the arena and I watch it like, oh my God, it's over 2 ,000 people watching now, like live. And then after when the game was done and the next day was 19 ,000 impressions. So obviously people think this is a good idea because now you can actually watch it. It's accessible and you can watch it from wherever but also outside of Sweden. So that was really good for us, I think.

15:16And then now when we're two months in, we can also see things that many people ask, like how are people actually going to find you? And how, for the older people, will they actually find you? And over 64 % are from watching TV and the audience over 60 years old are very high. So obviously they find us. That sounds great. So now you talked about one of the challenges is driving revenue for the league. How do you see that now playing out now that you've got the YouTube visibility and that's all working for you, will you be relying, for example, mainly on YouTube's tools to drive revenue? Or are you now able to, and are they helping you maybe have conversations with more brands and partners to tell that story better?

16:06Yeah, I think, I mean, primarily we will start off and we have started off with the YouTube ads just to kind of get some things going. but along the way we are obviously with the present partners to actually talk with like now you have visibility that you didn't collect former but now you can have it. So they are super interested and other brands that now see like, okay, maybe it's cheaper to go into a stage shell but get really good visibility rather than go to a more expensive league to be honest. So we will look into that but I mean, as I mentioned, it went fast. So we're kind of learning to walk at the same time we're running.

16:46And that has been a challenge because we together with my organization, but also the clubs, want to do all these things. And we want to do this and that. And then we just kind of go one step back and say like, OK, but do we actually know how to do it? And no, we don't. But we have to kind of. And that's the thing. I mean, we have passion for it. So that's what's going to make us going forward. But we have to, I think, take one thing at a time and then do it right. And then it's going to be wrong. It's going to be things that we do that is not successful. And that's okay. And I think that is something we have to kind of, within Sweden, within women's hockey and especially hockey in general, it's kind of conservative in Sweden.

17:30You can't do wrong. And here I think we have a place to take that we try and we take innovative things. and maybe it works, maybe it doesn't work. And that's not the entire thing. So you're now up and live on through your own channels. Are you doing anything through, say, the team's channels? What are you giving them access to? Do they have, for example, in some leagues, there's heavy restrictions on what sort of content the teams themselves can publish through their own YouTube channels, let's say, or other social channels? Are you giving them, do they have a lot of flexibility to do their own thing?

18:08And let's start there. Do they have a lot of flexibility to do stuff where you focus on growing the SDHL core channel first? I mean, I think it's a benefit for us when they actually want to do things. So they have flexibility and they can do pretty much what they want to do with the highlights or the content that they get or download the entire game and do whatever. So I think that's one thing that we want to focus on to just say that do these things. Because to be honest, I mean, SDHL is big, but the clubs are bigger. So if they do things, that will help us to grow the SDHL. But if we only do it and keep it on the SDHL channel, it will take much longer.

18:52And you've talked before about the athletes have been supportive of this move. Where do you see, do you see that there'll be, for example, there's other leagues, like for example the women's super league in the uk the football league that they have there they've actually given a lot of rights and tools to the athletes to create their own content uh are you is that something that may be on the horizon is to try and give more access and more opportunity for the athletes themselves to leverage the the league and the content that you're creating yeah i i think so and i think we're talking a lot with the pwh in north america and they've done a tremendous work the last two seasons.

19:35And they have done things that we want to kind of copy with pride here, which is to give the athletes a lot of things for them to actually provide on their social media. And I think that is something in Europe and particularly in Sweden. It's kind of, it's hard for them, like the athletes to actually be big on social media because I guess you know, I mean, it's, you shouldn't stand up in Sweden and you shouldn't believe you are something and and that is kind of a hard thing to come around so we have to kind of find a way where they can be ambassadors and and and being on social media without connecting that to be real influencers because that has kind of a negative thing in Sweden um when it comes to our athletes so and then also it's a hard environment on social media I don't know if it's that in in North America but they're saying that it's it's pretty good so and that could be right or wrong i don't know but but but but athletes don't may say that it's a lot of hate and negative things on their social media but in sweden there's a lot of that so really so i think yeah so i think we have to kind of come around that so they kind of feel like it's a safe environment to publish things well so i mean look i'm not you know i think each market's different and Sweden, every market in Europe and across the world has its own unique characteristics.

21:00So I'll be interested to see how that does play out. Look, I'm conscious of times. I think we've covered quite a good overview of what you've been able to do. And I really look forward to following the SDHL journey from here. And I was saying before that we started recording that I was trying to get to a game this weekend before we came here, but I couldn't make it happen because then I had to fly out to this event in Madrid. But a big thank you Ejelica for joining us and sharing the story. Thank you. And you will have multiple opportunities, Coach. Absolutely. Cheers. Thank you.