Tdhtdhtdhtdhtdh: Sound Effects!

26:26No, no, no. It was just where they shot it. Oh, okay. I would always ask, anytime you're shooting at one of the old Paramount Lot or Universal, I would always kind of ask the old-timers, like, hey, what was here? And, you know, one time it was Happy Days, one time it was Lucy. It was always kind of neat. Right. Hans Molman goes, I'm only 31 years old.

26:46A couple of books ago, I think three books ago, I read a really great Dent Stanley Kubrick book, and he talked about this fact, which was in Spartacus. He didn't like the audio recording of the Roman army marching. So he was trying to bring in a big, fairly expensive two day shoot to redo that. and Jack Foley was like, no, no, no, I think I've got this. And on the spot went and got car keys and was able to recreate the sound of like the armor kind of clanking such that even Stanley Kubrick approved of. Yeah, which is really saying something. Yeah. But it went from potentially flying back to Spain and rehiring thousands of extras and reshooting these two days just for the sound to, no, check out these keys.

27:32I just saved your movie. so much money. So just, I mean, that was his last one, too. That was a great way to go out, I think. Oh, absolutely. Great movie. There are about 100 Foley artists working today in the United States, which, you know, that's not a lot. I was sort of surprised it was that high, given sort of the digital takeover of a lot of things in Hollywood. But, you know, they call them artists because they are true artists. They have their, obviously, you know, I mentioned earlier, they have great ears. And apparently Dave found that some of them have to wear earplugs in movies and concerts and things like that because their ears are just so kind of tuned in and sensitive.

28:12Right. And they have their own language. You know, they don't say, well, they may say clip clop of a horse, but they definitely make words up as sounds like, you know, I need it to make a scritchy sound or it needs to sound poofy. And they just sort of know what they mean when they're talking to each other. Right. Oh, they definitely do. There's this really great profile in the New Yorker where I think that 100 working Foley artists came from. One of the Foley artists profiled said there was probably 100. But they, I mean, just the different words that they use for these sounds are like they immediately know what the other one is talking about.

28:48And just even more than that, they can point to some chain or block and tackle just hanging in a junkyard and say that'd make the swaying chink sound or something like that. And sure enough, they could go up to it and make it sound exactly like what they were just describing. So it's like a really niche group of people who work in this really niche art. It's like you said before, it's an art form. And it's just fascinating to read about, let alone talk about. I'm fascinated right now if you can't tell. Well, and just the ability to disassociate sound from object is key and just like super impressive.

29:33Like you mentioned, like to be able to look at a thing and not see the thing, but see the sound, you know, or hear the sound, I guess, in your head. For sure. Potentially. It's super cool. I love it. When I was a kid, I remember seeing videos of Foley artists at work with a split screen of what's going on on screen. And I was just like wrapped. Yeah. So that's how they do this. So usually they work in pairs because there's like in a given scene, there's probably frequently more going on than one person could possibly handle. I know Jack Foley pioneered using canes with shoes attached to the bottom to make multiple people walking at the same time.

30:15It's a lot easier to just have another person in there. So you have like a Foley partner that you work with. And then there's the Foley mixer. And apparently they don't really see what the Foley artists are doing because they're keeping an ear out to see if it matches what they think it should on the screen. They're making a lot of the final decisions on how it gets, like what sound gets made, how it gets sweetened or tightened or like tweaked or whatever. Yeah. And then if you step back and watch, like you said, they're in front of this giant screen or even a TV sometimes. and they're just acting along with the actor, but making the sounds with stuff that, you know, you just would never say like, yes, this is obviously, this celery is obviously what you would use to make the sound when somebody falls down and breaks a bone.

31:06Yeah. But they use celery. A celery snap is pretty good. Yeah, it definitely works. It's an industry-wide vegetable. It is. They start with a spotting session, which is essentially just sitting down with the director and all the sound department and Foley department and just making a huge list. You go through the movie and you just have a huge list of every single scene, every single sound you need to make. It's not the same thing as ADR, which is additional dialogue recording, which is a lot of times actors will have to come in. We had to do this for our own TV show a little bit. Yeah. And you have to restate your lines for one reason or another and try and match it up.

31:44And we're watching the screen. But they do use the same technique called looping, which is just playing the thing on a loop over and over and over to try and, you know, sync it as close as you can. Yeah, and it's amazing that anybody can do that because it's really hard. Yeah. What, ADR or Foley? ADR. Well, both. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. ADR, I always felt kind of dumb when I had to do it because it was, you know, you're trying to, even though we were bad actors, like we were trying to convey, you're always trying to convey some sort of emotion. with everything that you're saying, even if it's just normal or bored.

32:18That is true. And to do that in a room looking at yourself, like, with no experience, it was tough for me. I blamed Brian for all of those. Oh, no. So. He'll hear this, by the way, so. Oh, yeah, I know. I'm hoping he will. Yeah, yeah, I knew it. One of the other very classic things you'll see in a Foley studio is the floor will basically have, like, a raised section, and it'll be divided into like squares. And one square will have like a concrete pad. Another square will have pebbles. Another square will have, you know, parquet floor. Leaves, yeah. Leaves. Although I saw that they don't usually use leaves.

32:56They use like old magnetic reel-to-reel tape. Yeah, yeah, magnetic tape. And just pull it out and crinkle it. And that makes a better leaf sound than a leaf. Somebody figured that out along the way that leaf sounds don't really make a good leaf sound. Isn't that crazy? That's how manipulated we are when we watch movies. True. But I have seen them go in the field for, like, forest walks and stuff. So there's a mix of everything. There's not, like, just one way to do things. Right, true. And they all, you know, share stuff. Like, whoever came up with the celery is probably regarded as a, you know, a genius in the field.

33:30For sure. Yeah, I'm sure they're a lot. They were using carrots before that. Right. I also saw there was in that New Yorker profile, one of the Foley artists talks about a Halloween mask of the Tin Man that got handed down from her former Foley partner when he retired. And she was like, nothing will ever make this sound. It's like a shit, like it's described as a yawning shit sound. I can't even wrap my mind around that. But what sound is it supposed to be? A yawning shit sound. I don't know. I think it used, it's. Like what's it used for? I don't know. Okay. If you wait a little bit, I can look her up and call and ask.

34:09Oh, no, no, no. That's all right. I just wondered if you were like, and that's the sound of a pot going on a stove. How about this? Let's edit this in. The sound of a pot going on the stove. Okay, perfect. But she was pointing out, like, I think they even said, like, she ordered a new one online. And it came and she was like, this doesn't sound anything like it. It's made of different materials. So, like, it's so nuanced. I saw a quote from David Fincher, the director, who is like a huge fan of Foley artists. And he basically was like, we're looking at like a scene of some people having a meeting in a lawyer's office.

34:50And he's like, what does the naugahyde or the leather on the sofa sound like? Yeah, yeah. Like, is it fake? Like, is this a strip mall lawyer's office? Or is it like a really well-heeled lawyer's office? So it's real leather? Like that kind of attention to detail that holy artists make, like that's what makes a movie like engrossing or, you know, at the very least extremely realistic, like that level of attention to detail. Yeah, or if you're not paying attention to detail like that, it makes something stand out. And you may not even recognize it, but subconsciously it may just, a sound may sit wrong if they don't do it right.

35:31Yeah, like if somebody sits on a leather couch and it makes a yawning shh sound, you're going to be like, what was that? That was a tin man helmet. Right. You wouldn't believe them if they told you. That's right. So the Foley stage is amazing. They have that floor. it's just riddled with props and weird things that they all, they don't call it by the thing. You know, they call it by the sound it makes. Like you don't say, give me those coconuts. You say, give me the hooves, although they don't use coconuts. It's a little bit of a Monty Python reference there. But yeah, it's a fun looking room.

36:03Like I encourage everyone to go like see some like YouTube video of a Foley artist in work in their little kind of cool air conditioned dark room. There's water, like there's usually like a bathtub. There's usually a working toilet and just all manner of props that people use. That's right. You want to take a break and come back and talk a little more about sound effects? Let's do it.

36:39New year, new goals, and in this economy, a better money plan is more necessary than ever. I am Matt. And I'm Joel. We are from the How to Money podcast. And every week, we help you to spend smarter, save more, and make sense of what's going on out there. If you want 2026 to be the year you finally feel in control of your money, we're here to give you the tools and advice to help you make it happen. Listen to How to Money on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

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39:14Let me open my door. Yeah. Oh, that was good. And then look out, Chuck. Down out again. All right. So Dave kind of dug up some fun, classic Foley tricks from famous movies. And we're going to talk about those and more because we're going to get into Star Wars as well, because everyone loves talking about Star Wars. Well, the guy who was the Foley artist and I guess sound designer for Star Wars, Ben Burt, just changed the industry from what I could tell. He's a really interesting, creative guy. Yeah. We talked about him before. He was the Wilhelm Scream guy. Yes. Yes. Did you see the Wilhelm Scream thing I sent?

39:58I did not. Oh, I know the story of the Wilhelm Scream. You want to hear it? We did a whole episode on it, didn't we? No, we just mentioned it and then Jerry put the wrong one in. Oh, I thought we did a whole short stuff on it. On the Wilhelm scream? I don't think so. I thought we did. Either way, just go ahead. All right. If we have, then we'll edit this part out. But essentially, the Wilhelm scream was a scream that they think was recorded by a guy named Sheb Woolley, who is an actor and musician who's known for the song Purple People Eater. He's the guy who sang that. and it was in a movie called Distant Drums.

40:36And I think we can play the Wilhelm scream right here, right? I mean, I thought we could the first time and it didn't work. Well, let's try again. So this is what we're talking about. This is the very famous Wilhelm scream. Okay, so apparently Sheb Woolley recorded that for Distant Drums, but it didn't become kind of, I guess, a thing or iconic or well used until two years later, there was a movie called The Charge at Feather River, and a character named Private Wilhelm gets shot in the leg by an arrow, and he screams the Wilhelm scream. Still wasn't called the Wilhelm scream until Ben Burtt came along for Star Wars, and he'd seen just tons of Westerns as a kid, and the Wilhelm scream showed up in almost all of them.

41:23So he sought out that scream and found it in the Charge at Feather River Sound Library, and used it. The first time it shows up is when Luke shoots a stormtrooper, and the stormtrooper falls off of something or other. I can't remember where exactly. And he adopted it as a signature sound, and it just became kind of an iconic in-joke among sound editors since then. Yeah. You know, it may have been Movie Crush. That makes sense. Where I covered that. Yeah, totally makes sense. And I think it was all that's interesting said it's been in over 400 films. Amazing. Yeah. The E.T. sound, they needed E.T.

42:02to sound a certain way when E.T. walked around. Because they needed him to sound like an E.T., but also not be, like, gross. Right. They wanted people to like E.T., so they used, like, Jell-O wrapped in a damp T-shirt and raw liver, apparently, just for the sort of squishy walking sounds. That's a pretty good one. Yikes. What about Titanic? This is a good one. No spoilers. I'm going to spoil the end of Titanic. Oh, come on. So you can dial out now if you want to, but at the end of Titanic, Kate Winslet is floating on a door or a piece of wood or something. I think it's a door. And she's freezing cold, and they used apparently frozen lettuce to recreate the sound of her hair moving.

42:45Yeah. It was perfect because I remember that sound effect. I don't think I was like, that crispy hair sounds crazy at the time. But when I read about it, I remembered that it made some sort of impact on me. Yeah. to prevent anybody from emailing in. Apparently, it's not a door. Everybody says it's a door, but some people on Reddit found the piece of the staircase that it was taken from. So James Cameron's film was so accurate that you could determine that she was floating on a piece of staircase that is shown earlier in the Titanic before it sinks. I think it was a door. That's fine. I just wanted, I knew somebody was going to email in and I wanted to burst their bubble.

43:27Fight club, you know, if you've ever heard of fist fight in real life, A, I'm sorry, because that's a really dumb thing to do is to punch somebody. But a punch to somebody's face in real life or to their body doesn't sound anything like it sounds in the movies. It's a fairly boring sound. So they need to recreate that, obviously. And a lot of times they're punching, you know, raw meat and things like that and adding extra, like, bass and kind of tweaking it in post. but apparently in Fight Club, chicken carcasses were pounded with baseball bats, along with the sounds of cracking walnuts. Yes. Pretty good.

44:05There was this movie called Burberry in Sound Studio back in 2012. Did you see it? I've never heard of it. It was a little arthouse movie. What's the British actor, the short British actor with classes, Toby somebody? He played Capote, Truman Capote. Oh, yeah. Toby Jones, maybe? Yes, you're right. So Toby Jones is in it, and he's a Foley artist who starts to descend into madness. And essentially the entire movie takes place on a Foley studio stage. And there's parts where they're stabbing a melon to make the sound of the person on screen getting stabbed. and the Foley artist who actually worked on that movie said that they had to use wet cloth and wood to make the sound of the Foley artist on the screen stabbing the watermelon to make the sound of the person on their screen getting stabbed with a knife.

44:59I think I do remember that movie. I don't think I saw it, but I remember that happening. It's worth seeing. It's a slow burn that possibly, depending on your view, never actually ignites. But it's an interesting movie. He does a good job. They should put that on the poster. Possibly never ignites Josh Clark. Right. They're like, this is the best we could get. Melons are useful. I use a lot of melons for a lot of things. A hand inside a melon apparently was when that first dinosaur egg hatches. Sorry, spoiler alert. In Jurassic Park, it was a hand inside of a melon combined with the cracking of an ice cream cone.

45:35Very nice. I also saw Raiders of the Lost Ark, that famous boulder rolling at Indy in the beginning of the movie. First movie. It was a car with no motor being rolled down a hill. Oh, OK. And that was also Ben Burtt. Oh, was it? That makes sense. Yeah, he did all the Indiana Jones movies. He did E.T. He was clearly a Spielberg, Lucas-y guy. He was good. And probably still is. Is he still working? I bet he is. He's in his mid-ish 70s, so I bet he's still out there. Okay, there we go. I like to think he is. Should we talk about some of those Star Wars sounds too while we're here? Yeah, I think so.

46:15The Blaster, Star Wars Blaster, very, very legendary film sci-fi sound. He, and you'll see a lot of sound people that just like kind of always carry around their recording device. I don't know if they do that kind of stuff on phones now just to say like, hey, this, like just to pick up the sound. But back then for Ben Burt, it was a Nagra reel-to-reel recorder. and he was just collecting sounds all over the place to potentially use for Star Wars, and that's kind of the fun thing is just looking around the world and just collecting noises and say, you know, this might come in handy later. You never know.

46:48And they were in the Poconos, and he saw a radio tower with those big taut, big bundled wire support cables, and he was like, I wonder what that sounds like when I hit it. He hit it with a rock, and it made that sound, and then he did it at another tower, a radio tower in the Mojave Desert, and combined those, tweaked them a little bit, and that's how you get that laser blast, which you too can make if you ever see one of those really, really taut cables. If you hit that thing with something metal, it'll go, cue! Yeah, there's a bunch of different laser blasts in Star Wars, but the ones that were made with that sound effect, once you know that, you can really clearly hear it.

47:27It's perfect. Yeah, I think it's the blaster sound. You mean Han Solo's blaster? Yeah, I mean, the blaster is just a type of gun. I mean, we're probably going to get in big trouble from Star Wars people. But when they put laser sound, I was like, I don't know, you can't say that, dude. It's a blaster. Let's move on to the TIE fighters. How about that? Let's do it. Those are actually, so the very famous... Hey, that's pretty good. Thanks. Those are African elephants that are roaring, layered over one another, and then distorted so that it doesn't sound like elephants. But when you hear that and you go listen to the TIE fighter sound being made, you'll say, yeah, that's an elephant, I think.

48:10You do a Chewbacca too, don't you? No. I thought you used to do that, no? My Chewbacca sounds like this.

48:19It's like a nitrous. I could have sworn it was you that did a pretty good Chewbacca. But maybe not. But apparently Chewbacca was made by just combining a bunch of different animals. and again layering them on top of one another, including a walrus, a badger, and a bear at the very least. And then we got to mention R2-D2 because that's where Ben Burt brings in, you know, a big change in the industry is when the synthesizer, especially the Moog, was invented because not only could you make all sorts of like cool space-agey music for soundtracks, you could also make just bleeps and bloops, which is what he did.

48:55He had a Korg synthesizer, a very early Korg, and did these, you know, beeps and boops for R2-D2. And, you know, you think, all right, that's great. Big deal. But the genius of it is that he somehow creates emotion and conveys emotion through these beeps and boops from a little droid with a synthesizer. Yeah. It's magic. That's the reason Foley artists are still around, because you just can't do that with stock stuff from a sound library. Yeah. Or you could tell when it's done that way. For sure. There you go. So one other thing we should probably touch on real quick are nature documentaries. Yeah.

49:36Get ready to be disappointed. Yeah. They get a lot of guff for basically fudging stuff, and they are legendary for fudging stuff. Like apparently they'll use semi-domesticated animals that they rent to film, you know, chasing a lamb around or something like that. but one of the things they're very frequently criticized on is using sound effects and really kind of going overboard with them but it by the nature of what they're making they have to use sound effects to begin with yeah i mean a lot of this stuff is filmed on very long lenses from very far away if you're if you're filming a a lion tracking down an antelope and killing it right you're not like right up on it you know so you don't have the sound to begin with Maybe they bring some people out there with those long-distance mics to record some stuff.

50:26But then there's just so much ambient sound, they probably can't use it. So generally, if you see, like, you know, a Planet Earth Discovery documentary, the sound department is handed kind of like a silent film almost. And they use, you know, it's not like they got to have to use, like, real animal calls for the real animals. They're not just like, hey, let's make this lion sound kind of, like, different. Right. So they want accuracy there for sure. But, you know, when you see a mushroom growing in a time lapse, they're just adding all those sounds of like a mushroom stretching its arms out. I guess a mushroom doesn't have arms, its head.

51:02Sure. I mean, lean in and put your ear to a mushroom as it's growing and you're not going to hear anything. Yeah. Doesn't make a sound. No. Another one they get accused of is making the northern lights make a sound. Yeah. Those don't make a sound. And there's just all sorts of like if you stop and think about it, like a close up of a spider walking on a leaf, it wouldn't make a sound. But it would look weird to not have a sound or at the very least, it looks better that makes the whole thing better to add a sound. I don't really I mean, nature documentaries are so fudged to begin with that. I don't really have a problem with that.

51:38Yeah, I don't have a problem. And I think if someone, like you said, if you sat someone down and showed them just the realistic thing with just the realistic sound, it's probably not nearly as compelling. They'd be like, can I leave now? You got anything else? Yeah, one last thing, just sort of on the note of using things like Pro Tools. I mentioned earlier that it was kind of budget related. And obviously, big movies can just afford to do whatever they want in terms of that kind of thing. But even then, the sound line items are often just a very small part of the budget. You know, it kind of depends.

52:14But, you know, when you budget out a movie or a TV show or commercial or anything, you kind of have a general template to work for. Like, we're going to allocate this percentage for this, this percentage for this. Camera department's going to get probably something like this. And sound is always like maybe 10 % or so. And a lot of times that can include the rights to play soundtrack stuff. And, you know, it depends on the movie. if it's like Dazed and Confused or something like that that's really music-reliant, you know you're going to have to spend a lot of money on that. So you may look at the post-production sound and be like, I'm sorry, you have very little to work with.

52:49So that's where you're going to get stuff like pulled from libraries a little more. When you get these big, big movies, that's when they can afford to bring in the Foley artists and the whole teams, and that's why the sound is always really awesome, and that's why they highlight it at the Academy Awards. Yes. Nice. Nice. Yeah. So go forth and watch movies and listen out for sounds and you'll probably be amazed here or there. Yeah. But don't get so caught up in that. Like, I wonder if Foley artists can even watch movies and enjoy them. I feel so bad for people who can't watch movies, who can't enjoy food because they're chefs or something like that.

53:23Yeah. Yeah. Totally. Can't enjoy simple pleasures in life because they know too much about it. You know, Can't enjoy bologna or sausage? Yeah, I say, here's a new Stuff You Should Know t-shirt. We have a new t-shirt seller, right? Yeah, it's on Cotton Bureau, our new merch merchant. Yeah, we've never put a lot of effort into merch, but we always hear people asking. So Cotton Bureau, Stuff You Should Know, you can find our merch now. And I think a new t-shirt should be, stay dumb, enjoy things. Oh, that's a good one. Yeah. That's a great one. All right. Well, let's have Aaron Cooper get on it because I think two-thirds of our shirts in our merch store from Aaron Cooper because he's really good at it.

54:04Yeah. And Statham Enjoy Things is perfect to promote a show that's all about trying to make people smarter. Precisely. Yeah. I wonder if we can get a shirt that says... How would you spell that? I don't know. I'm going to leave that to Aaron Cooper. Yeah. Well, since we said Aaron Cooper's name at least two times, I think maybe three, we've unlocked listener mail. You don't want to say it three times because he'll be right behind you. All right, here we go. This is from Stephanie. And I feel bad about this because I even knew this. Hey, guys. Thanks for the great episode about the militarization of the police.

54:39I'm truly grateful for the decade of learning since I've been listening. One of you commented, I think it was me probably, that you were surprised to read about the police in Teen Vogue. I thought you might be interested to know that Teen Vogue is pretty well known for serious journalism and being an example for taking young women and girls seriously. I knew that. And we have even talked about this before, and so I don't know why I was like, oh, Teen Vogue. No, it was me. Was it? Yeah, it was 100 % me. No, I thought it was me. Well, I'll throw myself on that grenade. That's okay. Along with you.

55:10That's all right. But she says, here's an article from Jezebel by Julianne Escobedo-Shepard. If you're shocked, Teen Vogue is great. You're not paying attention. I imagine you may get other emails like this, although I may be the first since I was up crazy early. and listened right away. Thanks and have a great day. And that is from Stephanie. Thanks, Stephanie. Those are the corrections that we love to get where it's very gentle, but also like you guys come on, you know? Yeah. If you can balance those two things, you've come up with a great correction email as far as I'm concerned. Agreed. If you want to be like Stephanie and send us a correction or just an email to say hi or whatever, you can send it off to stuffpodcast at iheartradio.com.

55:54Stuff You Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app. Apple Podcasts are wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

56:10Hey, it's Joel. And Matt from HowToMoney. If your New Year's resolution is to finally get your finances in shape, we've got your back. Prices, they're still high, and the economy is all over the place. But 2026 is the year for you to get intentional and make real progress. That's right. Yeah. Each week we break down what's happening with your money, the most important issues to focus on, and the small moves that make a big difference. Kick off the year with confidence. Listen to How to Money on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm John Polk. For years, I was the poster boy of the conversion therapy movement.

56:47the ex-gay who married an ex-lesbian and traveled the world telling my story of how I changed my sexuality from gay to straight. You might have heard my story, but you've never heard the real story. John has never been anything but gay, but he really tried hard not to be. Listen to Atonement, the John Palk story on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, Kyle. Could you draw up a quick document with the basic business plan? Just one page as a Google doc and send me the link. Thanks. Hey, just finished drawing up that quick one page business plan for you. Here's the link.

57:26But there was no link. There was no business plan. I hadn't programmed Kyle to be able to do that yet. I'm Evan Ratliff here with a story of entrepreneurship in the AI age. Listen as I attempt to build a real startup run by fake people. Check out the second season of my podcast, Shell Game, on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed human.