Unpacking that Who Is Elijah $1.4m tax debt headline

0:08This episode of Stylish is brought to you by QV's face range for sensitive skin. QB Face, powerfully sensitive skincare for life. Hello, guys. Happy Friday. I'm Rhiannon Joyce and I'm joined by a new co-host, but not so new. For those of you who don't know Naima or perhaps haven't heard her on the mic yet, Naima is Shameless Media's head of social. Third time's the charm. Third time's the charm. And the Friday F is quite good to have you because I feel you and I sitting at our chair, it's going back and forth and then me having to turn around and be like, no, no. Yeah. Same for the pod. Gil, the producer on Shameless, actually was giggling at us because we were like bouncing back and forth.

0:45And then we went, nope, no more. Usually that's Zara and Gil and Michelle's the one who has to step in and tell them stop. We have a lot to talk about today. You guys know this is the corner of stylish focusing on brand campaigns, career stories. We really wanted to focus on a headline today. One that has got a lot of people talking, particularly on socials, but also hit the mainstream media. If you haven't seen it, there has been some recent media coverage about Australian perfume brand, Who is Elijah? And how that's been playing out online has been really interesting and the reason why we wanted to chat today.

1:18But before we get into that, word of the week, it's actually my word of the week. And do you have a singular word? Yes. Multiple words. Well done. Yay. I do. Big round of applause for me. I have a single word. Well done. Thank you very much. My word of the week is A24. Love it. I'm a letterbox head. This is very exciting for me. Okay. So you saw this and thought, let's go. Let's go. You can contribute to my word of the week as much as I can then. Yeah. Guys, if you don't know what A24 is, basically they are a really popular, I would say at the moment, a lot of people think they're a production house in film.

1:52They're actually a distribution house. So they are behind some of the biggest films in the industry at the moment. Most recently, The Drama. Yes. Which stars Zendaya and Robert Pattinson. They also were behind Marty Supreme. They've become renowned for their marketing tactics and campaigns. Why I wanted to talk about A24 today as my word of the week is because literally every single time they drop a film, I go, bang, that's an A24 film. It's got a certain look. It's got a certain feel. They very much try and prioritize sourcing films that are very creative and directors take a lot of creative license.

2:27Films you wouldn't really see a traditional network pick up. So when I say network, the likes of like 20th Century Fox or a Universal, you know, they try and go a little bit more offbeat. What is really interesting with the most recent campaign that they've done with the drama is, I don't know if you saw this initially when they announced this film, they did a mock proposal. Yeah, I loved it. It was so good. It got me. I was like, this is brilliant. So they had a mock proposal piece run in a classic newspaper format, which is very reminiscent of how proposals used to be announced back in the day.

3:02So it always makes me think of Sex and the City. I was just about to say Sex and the City. I was like, yes, Charlotte. Yeah, Charlotte starts screaming when Carrie and Big's engagement is announced on page six. So it was very reminiscent. I loved that initial launch for the drama. Also the way that they've seeded out throughout the campaign. They don't ever actually tell you what the film is about. So they lean heavily into this, what would you call it? It's kind of like a surprise and delight sort of model. One thing I find really amazing is, you know, when you see an A24 film like the drama, what you actually hear people say now when they see an A24 film like the drama is, oh, I really want to see that new A24 film.

3:42Yeah. That is marketing, branding goals, particularly for a distribution house. Like, I can't think of any other player in that space where you would describe maybe Netflix, but Netflix for a very different reason. A24 for me when people are saying, oh, that's an A24 film, I think alternative, I think cool, I think eclectic. Usually it's starring some top tier names but then also has a mixed ensemble cast of people that maybe you haven't heard about. What do you love about A24? Because you were excited when I brought this up. Well, yeah, it's like you're not saying I can't wait to see the Paramount film that's coming out.

4:18No, you're not. Well, I think they've definitely, there's been a journey. like previous to that they were very much only known as kind of like that indie indie yeah no well production house no not production distribution they do produce some films yeah and I think as they've kind of garnered this reputation of like the edgier film yeah I guess I feel like they've been able to get more and more budget and I would love to be in the PR and marketing offices of any of these movies because I love it it's always so like left of field the especially with the drama where Zendaya and Alana Haim went to a chapel in Vegas.

4:57Yeah, I saw that. It feels like no idea is off limits with them. Like their brainstorming sessions must be like, guys, go big because we can do this. And it was really similar with Mighty Supreme. I know that got a lot of attention, their marketing strategy. A lot of their films have historically. Yeah. Yeah. I feel like they're just doing great things at the moment. And makes you want to see the movie. Makes you want to see the movie. but also my TikTok feed is blowing up with people watching the drama and then doing really good deep dives about the film and the amount of references to A24, just broadly speaking, as a key word, is like through the roof.

5:31Even in our Slack channel, someone mentioned it the other day and everyone went, no, don't tell me. No, no spoilers. So it's like even that fact that it's very easy now to see a spoiler but people are actively trying to avoid it. That means everyone's really excited to actually go to the movie. they're not waiting for it to come to streaming. Yeah, I agree. All right. Let's get into today's episode. Naima, take us through. What are we talking about? As you said before, we're talking about the recent headlines around Who is Elijah? But before we really jump in, I'd love to know what was your first experience with the brand?

6:05Where did you see it? Is it one that you were familiar with before the headlines came out? Great question. Definitely familiar with before the headlines had come out. I've never purchased any of their products before. I see them a lot on TikTok. They are one of those brands that I do feel is building in public. So Raquel Boris is the co-founder of Who is Elijah? She actually co-founded the business with her husband and business partner, Adam Boris. And one thing I noticed is she does feature quite a lot in the brand's socials. They have that founder-led approach on social media. I'm also starting to see more of their team pop up.

6:40I would say the most renowned reference for Who Was Elijah for me is them being one of the OG dupe brands. Yes. Particularly the La Labo fragrances. I see a lot of videos online talking about how they are more affordable alternatives to expensive products. That's my general vibe check with them. Yeah. What's yours? Word of mouth, I have a few friends who have their scents and really like them. I actually didn't know that they were dupes. I don't know if that's something that they advertise. It's just something I've seen come up a lot with consumers creating their own videos and labeling that way.

7:13I don't know if they're advocating that. Like an Emco, for example, who was 100 % made duping part of their branding strategy. I don't see that as much for Who is Elijah. It's more so a consumer is interpreting that. But I could be wrong there. Maybe it's just like a thing that's organically happened and, you know, good for search terms. So they've kind of run with it. We are going to do a little bit of a background on Who is Elijah for you guys, but we'll do that right after a word from today's sponsor. As we get older, we learn we don't actually need that many products to take really good care of our skin.

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8:57So Who Is Elijah is a Sydney perfume brand. They actually went viral for their celebrity connection and big global deals with Sephora, Ulta and David Jones. They have a really strong social strategy, as you said before, Nima. They really tap into these viral moments. A similar brand in an Australian landscape that I would compare them to are the likes of Gem or TBH. That very similar look and feel on social media in terms of how they show up. they have claimed Who Was Elijah is a$20 million empire, which is massive. Massive. Particularly for an Australian business. And just to give you an idea of how successful they've been, in 2023, they reportedly made $2.2 million in Black Friday sales alone.

9:38So they've gone on the record and said that on a few podcasts. Yeah. This has been a headline that's been picked up quite a bit. Yes. And I think it's important to set that context up because what they've gone out to market and what they've said to people is that they are doing really well as a business. Yeah. And, I mean, I love that they're sharing that level of detail. No one really shares sales data, particularly for Black Friday. So I love a little bit of a sneaky insight. I'm nosy. Nosy gal. I want to know. Show me the sales stats. Seriously. So Raquel has, I would say, positioned herself as a front-facing founder of the business, more so than Adam.

10:12Adam definitely pops up in a few podcasts here and there. They're obviously in a relationship, so you see them on the socials sporadically. But I would say Raquel is very much the front-facing talent for this business. She has documented building her business from the ground up and has cultivated a personal following with that building in public strategy, which we kind of see happen side by side a lot. And I would say is really a strategy that a lot of founders are reverting to at the moment because it does seem to be working. Yeah. And I think it's smart for it to focus on just her. In like a very social media term, it gives me a character to hold on to.

10:45So I think it feels very like it's her journey. Then from a logistical point of view as well, if you like focus on both of them, it's like then they both have to be in every video. Whereas if it's just her and I can, I don't know this for a fact, but I would say she's probably the person driving the social strategy. She can just get in front of a camera. She can do quick pieces to camera and she can really continuously put out this content. Yeah, I think as well when you have a relationship dynamic playing out in the workplace, it's really important. And I have never worked with my partner. I really respect people that can manage that.

11:16But it seems to me that the most important thing is to have really clear roles and responsibilities. Perhaps the social media role that does sit in Raquel's camp and then Adam's responsible for other things that align with his skill set. In Raquel's official bio, she does actually describe herself as the brand's founder and creative director and in media coverage that we could find, I did find it was interesting. A lot of the images are mostly of Raquel, not them as a couple or Adam's standalone. And I do think that's intentional. And when you say images, do you mean in the media coverage? Yeah.

11:47So images associated with articles about them, Raquel features heavily. Very interesting. But again, I'm going to put a pin in that because I want to deepen this a little bit later. Yeah. Now, let's talk about the chatter this week. Naima, can you give us a really quick recap of what's been in the headlines if someone who's listening to this podcast hasn't heard it or seen it? So there was a Daily Telegraph article published March 31st, which alleges that the brand is facing over$1.4 million in unpaid tax debt and hundreds of thousands to owed suppliers. Sorry, that probably sounded like I just read that off my screen.

12:18You did. But do you know what, when you're reporting on a headline, it is okay to read off the screen. So read away. This was also made into a social media reel, which I think where we saw a lot of the commentary play. Yeah, that was where I first saw this piece. I didn't see the headline on the Daily Telegraph. I saw one person in their social team doing a piece to camera, reading out the article, which has become a very popular strategy for the likes of the Daily Mail and local media outlets. As you said, the comments section on these videos, particularly the Reel and the TikTok, were blowing up quite a bit.

12:51A lot of people wanted to weigh in on the coverage of this article, the relevancy of it, what they were actually trying to achieve. It was really interesting seeing the sentiment be quite, honestly, the word I would use is protective and defensive of Raquel and who is Elijah. And quite critical of the Daily Telegraph. Definitely, definitely critical. So I'm going to pull a quote from the piece so you guys understand a bit more about what this feature was actually about. So the ATO, which only lodges credit defaults that are more than 90 days overdue, has a registered default of$1.4 million as of March 17th.

13:26The credit inquiries on the brand have soared since Jan from one to two a month to 16 inquiries in Feb and 44 so far in March, with a wide range of businesses seeking information on the company's ability to pay its invoices. Raquel also responded in the piece and said, we are currently in a phase of refining and strengthening the business to support where we are going next. In relation to the financial figures referenced, these do not accurately reflect the current position of the business. I want to start with the way that the Daily Telegraph has reported on these ATO tax debts because viscerally when I read this piece, I felt confused as to why I was reading this piece.

14:04Like, why is this information relevant to me? I 100 % agree with you. I was like, is this news? And I'm obviously not an accountant and my style of marketing is a bit more creative and less analytical. For me, and based off my knowledge of how small businesses work, being in debt to the ATO seems like the norm. Well, that was where a lot of the sentiment went in the comments section. So a lot of business founders that I follow, Brittany Saunders being one of them who actually made a reel that you referenced in our notes, Naima, a few others that I saw in the comments section were coming in defense of Raquel and who is Elijah and giving context as business owners around the normality of having debt.

14:44Now, again, I'm not a business owner. I don't understand. And I appreciate that for all different businesses, there are different expectations and scope of debt that they're probably comfortable with. As of 2025 to 2026, their valuation is at$20 million. That obviously doesn't cover their costs in general. So that's not their full amount of profit. Yeah. So basically valuation is the estimated market worth. In the context of this being a$20 million business, allegedly, does the$1.4 million feel like a lot to me? Not really. No. The normal consumer doesn't care about the details of that. Yeah. It's interesting that a lot of the emphasis has been put on the debt that is owed to the ATO.

15:26There are also creditors that are referenced in this who apparently are owed money as well. I think what feels random is I think that they've gone looking for this information. A lot of the DMs that we got around this, putting the cover for the horse, but we did poll our audience. And a lot of the DMs that we got were, how would I know that information about owing to the ATO? So I do kind of question a little bit about what was the point of this article because I do feel like they've probably gone looking for this information. I think the point of the article was for them to expose a business from the guise that they're giving the consumer context and insight into who they're spending their money with.

16:03I just don't think it landed in the way that they were expecting. One of the reasons why this piece didn't land with me is the inclusion of the anonymous criticism and allegations about who was Elijah's workplace that were featured on Glassdoor. It felt to me that the Daily Telegraph didn't feel like they had enough of a headline with the ATO tax debt, so they had to pull in other information. I didn't love this. First and foremost, I think it's unreasonable to think that a business would have people leave their company and every single person in that company is going to be happy. People within their right to criticize and share their workplace experiences, whether they were positive or negative.

16:46I think their decision to go digging for this on Glassdoor and to use that as a way to beef out the piece felt very intentional. And this is where I think a lot of the criticism around it feeling like a hit piece or a takedown piece has come from. Yeah, it did feel like they did go searching for this information. I obviously want to, I never want to discount someone's experience at a workplace. No, absolutely not. If it wasn't great. Yeah, it wasn't great. I think it feels like two separate points to me, you know, one's about debt and one's about work culture and they've kind of been mashed together.

17:21I think there's just like an overall lack of contextualisation within the industry. Like if they had pulled multiple small businesses that owe money to the ATO and it's like they're talking about consumers shouldn't purchase from these businesses when they owe money. Sure, but I think they've gone specifically for one person and that's where it feels a little bit malicious. Yeah and that came out a lot in the response that people had to the media coverage. We will deepen that a bit more but that will be right after a word from today's sponsor. There is nothing in the world like Parisian style.

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18:26So like we said, the Daily Telegraph video that went live on Instagram Reels and TikTok, they were both flooded with hundreds of comments from different founders, just general people as well, people in the general public, not really agreeing with how this business was being portrayed, but also how Raquel was being targeted. I saw a lot of references to tall poppy syndrome. Yes. Did you see that? I did. There was a lot of references to tall poppy syndrome, which if anyone doesn't know what that is, it's pretty largely associated with Australia, I would say. And it's when someone is doing really well in a public eye, they are often, you know, taken down.

19:04Yeah. Or being criticized for being someone who is quite, you know, vocal about their success. Generally, there's this sentiment in Australian culture that subconsciously we carry a lot of tall poppy syndrome in how we perceive people who are successful. So it is something that I feel I've seen bubbling away quite a bit on social media as a bit of a trend and a reference point. I know historically we've referenced this article in our Wednesday episode. I believe it was Maddie who spoke about it, which was the Make Australia Ambitious Again. It was a piece that ran on Rolodex Media's site, and it garnered quite a lot of attraction and attention and conversations online about founders who build in Australia and how much Australia is not really set up for ambition or entrepreneurship.

19:48And tall poppy syndrome was one of the main themes that came out of that article. Kind of that vibe that it's not cool to try. Yeah. It's cool to try privately. Well, it's cool to try until you're really successful and then it's not cool and all of a sudden we're turning our back on you. There's like that thing before it goes whoop. Yeah, it's a bit of a rollercoaster I would describe it. I agree. There was obviously lots of founders in the comment section of this video. One actually even made a response video to this reel, which was Brittany Saunders, who's the owner of Fake the Label. We've actually had her on the pod before.

20:24We have. And I actually think it's quite a good comparison because she is also a founder who is really, really front facing and has built her brand in the public. Yeah, that's a really great shout. I think she is very vocal. She's very transparent about the sales, all of it. She is so upfront about it. This is quite a good comparison, in my opinion. What was really interesting about her response video was that she kind of just said, this is normal. Yeah. She was like, I would have this amount of debt to the ATO as well because the way that this works isn't that you pay your tax month to month.

21:00You get handed a bill at the end of the financial year. And that is often quite a big bill. We really wanted to speak to our audience about this because that was a real talking point for me. Does the average consumer actually care? So we did poll our community on the Stylish Instagram. we actually asked you guys, when buying from a brand or business, do you care if they owe money to the ATO? 70 % of you said no. And the remaining 30 obviously said yes. I do want to acknowledge that in the DMs, a few people did ask for the option of being like, I'd never thought about this. And I think I sit in that camp as well.

21:35I would have answered no, because I've never thought about this as a consideration for why I would purchase from a business. A business's debt owed is not a relevant metric for me to decide whether or not I'm purchasing from a brand based on historical. I will say we had an amazing DM from a listener that I did want to share because it has shifted my perspective slightly. And I think it's really important context. We need to keep coming back to this point of context because I think fundamentally the reason why the Daily Telegraph piece didn't sit so well with me is because there was none of that context.

22:08This listener wrote,

22:38Depending on the scale of the debt, I think how a business responds and takes ownership matters, and I think people should care. On a day-to-day, it might not feel like it affects us as consumers, but we have a responsibility to vote with our pockets. I believe in supporting businesses to grow through hard times, but the ripple effects of poor financial behavior always land somewhere, and morally, I don't support that. Great DM. Great DM. Thank you, stylish listeners. Thank you, because I have to acknowledge there was an element of ambivalence and an element of, well, well, why is this relevant to me?

23:09I don't need to know this. Now that I've read that, I'm like, huh. But what did you think of this listener's contribution? I thought it was amazing because it did help me step out a little bit. I think I was like probably concentrating on the ATO part of it a lot. I think at any point a business owes suppliers multiple invoices. Like it's never like you owe someone the next day. They're a long-term one. So at any one time you would be owing people lots of money. But I think I care more if it's smaller businesses that they owe money to. If they owe money to Ulta, I don't really care that much, to be perfectly honest with you.