Dr. Richard J. Brown: Health Isn't About Looking Better — It's About Living Better

24:27Dr. Richard J. Brown:And in that, what I mean is we all should at a base level be talking to patients about lifestyle change, about health and wellness, about what they can do to better their lives from the standpoint of moving their bodies and eating better foods, less processed foods. We should all be doing that. Peter Atiyah was talking about this. I saw him, I think it was on 60 Minutes. She asked him, how do you deal with your colleagues coming at you when you talk about nutrition and stuff. And he said, well, how much nutrition do you think I got in medical school? And remember, I went to Stanford. How many hours do you think I got?

25:10Dr. Richard J. Brown:Zero. How much training do you think I got regarding exercise and VO2 max and all of those metrics? Zero. We don't get that training. He's had to learn everything that he knows from just being out there and being a curious physician. So part of the answer is we need to integrate this into medical school. Every single doctor at a base level needs to have a much better nutrition knowledge than they have. I only have what I have because it intrigues me for myself and so I pass that along to my patients. So I think that's one of the things that we need to bridge is one at the earliest level of education in medical school, we need to be talking more and more and more about nutrition and more and more about diet and about exercise.

25:55Dr. Richard J. Brown:And then the other thing that I think is important to remember is that we have patients from all different economical backgrounds, right? So your mom who's working three jobs, who's just eating what she can and she's obese, it's not an excuse, but I do believe that there are lifestyle situations that prevent some people from feeling like they can do it, from feeling like they have the time to breathe, to do something for themselves. They're just trying to make ends meet for their kids. They're trying to make ends meet for them. So there's that, right? And then there's the more privileged people like us who we have resources.

26:30Dr. Richard J. Brown:Now, I don't think it's an excuse, but I do think that that plays into why we see so many people that can do it versus can't do it. I think it's resource allocation and just having access.

26:43Darin Olien:Yeah, man. I mean, if you, I mean, it's a big question, But if you were to kind of redesign the health care system, I mean, you kind of said it, you know, in terms of instead of leading the doctors through drug interactions and obviously specialties that are necessary and needed, the education for them is necessary because it's still a place of high authority for the majority of people. They're leaning on doctors to give them, but it's like this wild, weird disconnect between the fact that Peter Atiyah is still being asked by people today that that's weird. That's just a weird thing. I scratch my head going, what do you mean you guys are pushing back on lifestyle stuff?

27:44Darin Olien:how would you like if you had a medical system curriculum that you could build, what are some of the top things that you would kind of present for the curriculum for people to learn from becoming a doctor?

28:02Dr. Richard J. Brown:I think every doctor should have a basic understanding of how to create a workout routine. How do you create a routine that builds a person's VO2 maxing capacity? how do you build a routine that gets them resistance training how do you build if you had to have a client come into your office and say listen i want to be more healthy and work out every doctor every doctor should be able to have a basic conversation so i would i would integrate that for sure um and then we we for sure as you said i already said it nutrition is paramount like we don't talk about nutrition i mean shit they just trained changed the pyramid tree finally right?

28:40Dr. Richard J. Brown:The nutrition pyramid, which still isn't that great. But, you know, we need physicians to understand nutrition because, man, I'll tell you, every time we scroll a video on Instagram or social media now, I feel like I'm going, what? Wait, what? Wait, we have to debunk that now? Like, what are you saying? Like, what? People are just making any claim and no one has any context behind it. There's no literature behind it. So that's another thing is I think we need to have physicians. I will tell you as a doctor, even we don't really learn how to statistically analyze papers. We do a little bit, right?

29:21Dr. Richard J. Brown:We have journal club and we learn about journals and we learn how to the different types of studies and we do statistics in medical school. But like the public at large has no idea how to analyze a study. Anyone can type in for a PubMed title that fits what they're trying to post and throw a quick here's the pub bed see this headline says this meanwhile it was like in rats or it was an in of two human beings in the trial and it has no power no there's like this they're not statistically significant like the studies that people quote no one knows how to critique them so anyone can just say anything today and get away with it we need we need to have better doctors need to have better knowledge of studies to be able to debunk things too, I think.

30:05Darin Olien:Yeah, you're in this weird, it's, it's this weird world between there's, there's virtually no consequence for saying anything. Um, and, and, and unfortunately, you know, the, the, the, the desire for sales, for likes, for algorithmic, you know, runaway trains of something going viral. It all becomes about that as opposed to this moral, ethical landscape that is quite dangerous. And then if anyone has any significant following, they automatically assume that these people are an authority and then anything coming out of their mouth. And that's where it gets really tricky. And listen, not everybody, they're trying.

31:07Darin Olien:Maybe they're trying to do the best thing or they're trying to decipher. But like I said, even, you know, I have a physiology background, but we never went through tons and tons and tons of studies. Like that is a particular skill that I get a headache going through studies to this day. And that it's a muscle that like I'm like going, yeah, it says this, but the outcome is completely different than the abstract is saying like it's it's it's very challenging to understand. And then you have these people of authority saying this stuff. And, you know, and then again, how many people are taking action based on a 30 second reel these days?

31:53Dr. Richard J. Brown:Well, and I will so someone will send me a reel and say, Doc, I need you to debunk this. Or can you please talk about this? And I'll watch the reel and I'll be like, man, OK, I got to go do a literature search. Like I myself have to go do a literature search to really understand the literature behind what you're asking me to debunk. What I'm seeing is for sure BS and someone's like pulling the wool. And so I need to go check the literature myself. And that's where like open evidence is great for us now because we can assimilate the real literature right away and we know. But it's a real problem.

32:27Dr. Richard J. Brown:And as you mentioned, you know, I think that everyone's agenda today is how can I sell my program? What do I need to say to get the clicks? I just want to get the clicks and I just want people to sign up for my program. How can I scale my online business and how can I just make money and get out regardless of what that does to the person on the other end? And then there's a lot of legitimate people, too. so I don't want to knock them.

32:50Darin Olien:Yeah, yeah. Well, it's this world between like, wouldn't it be a great world to have, because doctors have a set of skills that are incredible. And the aptitude that doctors have to assess, go through information is extraordinary. So there is a set of skills that, you know, Peter Atiyah, as an example, and you as an example, you have a set of skills and an aptitude. So your ability to go through information and understand it because organic, inorganic chemistry, biochemistry, physiology, you've gone through that. So there's a framework that you're starting from that's different than the lay person, even though you may not have had nutrition training.

33:38Darin Olien:And that's probably where the acceleration of doctors, if they would turn their lens towards this functional component, which to me is just common sense. Like the oath that doctors are taking, if you really sit with the oath of do no harm, then isn't it upon them to also? But isn't there... Before we continue the pod, I want to share something. I've tried so many supplements. I've been in the space for 25 years. And every so often, something really pops out. Mana Vitality is that difference. It's not just about adding minerals. It's about tuning your body to the higher frequency, physically, mentally, emotionally, and spiritually.

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35:21Darin Olien:It's the same with me. The more I use it, the better I feel. My sleep improved, my skin glows, my stress goes down, my testosterone goes off, it's like my whole system is humming again. So if you're tired of low energy, brain fog, and or just not feeling the same and like something's missing, check out Mana. Go to manavitality.com. That's M-A-N-N-A vitality.com. Use the code DARREN20 and you get 20 % off your order. This isn't about health. It's about living in harmony with your greatest and highest potential. Isn't there this, you know, the pressure of the system that the medical field is in?

36:12Darin Olien:You have bills to pay, you have residency, you've gone through a decade of training, and now you're trying to have a practice and then pay off your, like, it's in and of itself, it's a tricky system to break out of, to have the latitude to then learn more. Right. So I can see how it's challenging.

36:37Dr. Richard J. Brown:You know, what Peter does is it's interesting because as, as I look at, I love being a surgeon. And if I wasn't a surgeon, what would I want to do? People ask me this all the time. Like if you weren't a surgeon, like what would you do without a doubt? I would want to be like Peter. I would want to be an expert at medicine 3.0. I want to be an expert at making generational health change. I wanted to start with the parents and trickle down to the kids. How do we get people into programs of really understanding what it's like to live a healthy life and starting to prevent disease at an early age, right?

37:14Dr. Richard J. Brown:Like we could see evidence of young gunshot victims, kids who we would see in trauma who are 15, 16, 19 years old, who would die from traumatic gunshot wounds. There was a pathologist who would look at their vessels, and they were already starting to see at an early age coronary artery disease. So we know that it begins as early as like 15, 16 years old. So for me, I 100 % would want to build a mecca of a practice like Peter has, where the sole focus is preventative medicine. Let's start preventing heart disease before it happens. That intrigues me so massively.

37:52Darin Olien:It sounds like that that's probably your next steps there. I don't know. It's kind of emerging right here. It's

37:59Dr. Richard J. Brown:been emerging for a while, but it's always like, how do you do that? What kind of steps do you take to do that? But Darren, I just care so deeply about people and I want humans to be happy. I want everyone to love each other and get along. I want everyone to want the best for each other. I want everyone to be excited about feeling good in their body and not want to not look good in their body. We all, I want everyone to care about how they look and feel because as I said, generational health is where it's at. It starts with the parents and the adults and it trickles down to their children. My kids, my boys are 16.

38:40Dr. Richard J. Brown:we're about to start 75 hard together. And it was, they wanted to do it with us. I've done it three times and my wife and I do it usually once a year for fun. Cause it just kind of like, I like the challenge. I like having boxes to check. I love that. And my boys were like, can we do it with you? And I was like, is it starting to happen?

39:02Darin Olien:So just to describe that for people, is that that's a commitment of 75 days working out.

39:08Dr. Richard J. Brown:and is there anything yeah so andy for sella put this program together years ago called 75 hard and it's gotten a lot of criticism but it's an incredible program and it's more of a mental program than it is physical but these are the components um for 75 days in a row without missing or you start back at day one you have to do two workouts a day and they have to be 45 minutes each and one of them has to be outside wow so my wife and i rock for 45 minutes and we get quality time together we just go we go walk around the neighborhood in a vest or without a vest or whatever so but it's two workouts a day 45 minutes each you have to drink a gallon of water every day you have to follow a meal plan no cheat meals you cannot cheat at all there's no cheat with sugar pizza and none of that stuff you cannot drink alcohol which is easy for me because I don't drink and the last component is you take a progress photo every day of yourself and then the last thing is you have to read 10 pages every day out of a self-help book an entrepreneurial type of a book it's not not a not a love sex novel it's a reading a book about something that's going to better you as a human being and so you do that every day for 75 days and if you miss one component, if you forget to take a picture, you start back over at day one.

40:33And he

40:33Dr. Richard J. Brown:actually has a program called the live hard program that goes for a whole year. There's other components to 75 hard that he expanded upon. And I've done it three times, man. And I will tell you when I am done with that program, I feel so high on life and in my body. I just, I can't even explain the the dopamine hit that you get when you finish it's crazy wow that's that's you're gonna do one workout a day i was like i'm cool i know you're not like doing it to the letter but the fact that you want to do it and you want to eat healthy and you want to exercise and you're you're and they drew up a contract for themselves and they signed it oh no way they drafted a contract and they're like we're gonna sign it and they signed the contract well there

41:19Darin Olien:you go that you know listen by your commitment and this is where we help our our first line of community and that's our family and and by you and your wife leading with health and wellness and and and then allowing your kids just to see and feel and experience and then they jump in

41:41Dr. Richard J. Brown:as teenagers that's badass it's the ultimate man and this is what i want to create for other people generational health. I want generations to change and it starts at the top and you don't have to be a parent. Maybe you're an aunt or an uncle inspiring some someone.

41:57Darin Olien:Wow. Yeah. I think about that. Jeez, traveling and stuff. How the hell do you do that?

42:02Dr. Richard J. Brown:Dude, I will tell you what's incredible about this program is that everyone says, well, I, and I did this for a long time. Someone tried to get me to do it and I was like, I can't do it, man. I'm a busy surgeon. How am I going to do two workouts a day? Like it's never going to happen. And I started listening to Andy's podcast and in one of the podcasts where he talks about it he's like listen you are going to find time in your day that you never knew existed because you have to plan your day when am I going to read my 10 pages when am I doing workout one when am I doing workout two you know I got to get my gallon and throughout the day you have to plan so hard for it that you actually

42:38Darin Olien:gain time in your day yeah meal prep and all of that stuff you can't just leave it to the wind and all of that. But that's, you know, listen, if you took most people's consumption of social media, you have hours in a day probably. You know?

42:58Dr. Richard J. Brown:Hours.

43:00Darin Olien:And that's the way to build life. That really is. And then with that commitment, those habits often continue along. Oh, yeah.

43:10Dr. Richard J. Brown:I mean, I might fall off my gallon when we stop or something like that, I still pretty much eat healthy every day. I still, you know, I fall off my reading sometimes. And I don't like that because I love when we're doing this program because it makes me read 10 pages a day. But it does, it bleeds over into the rest of your life. And I just, I want this for people because I think Andy says all the time for sell a personal excellence is the ultimate, ultimate rebellion. And I believe that if we all could want this for ourselves, if we all wanted to live in a healthy body, and we all had the desire to do it, I believe that our world would be a much greater place.

43:51Darin Olien:Big time. You know, the thing that I think about probably the most is this, you know, this really does come from within. Because even to do something like that, you have to decide first, right you have to decide here in my heart to go i'm doing i'm committing that's an intention right even you don't even know what that looks like yet you don't know how the ups and downs yet because you'll go through that because you're changing things but that inner world it's all coming from there and then following up with actions that's literally how we change everything and it and it and it becomes less about god if that government official if that other person if that thing going on in this other country that that we can easily get obsessed about because we're getting overly stimulated those can become excuses because number one it's draining

44:58Dr. Richard J. Brown:i just cut myself off oh i don't watch any of all of that so i just cut it the other day i was like what happened in Venezuela? They're like, Oh, this is three weeks old. I was like, Oh, I had no idea. Right.

45:09Darin Olien:And you know, it's, it's, but, but like you said, when you have solid, healthy, happy humans, you're more apt or you're more apt to be happy. And then, and then you're affecting everyone you're coming in contact with. This is how we build a new world. I think there's a world here that continues to be distracted. And, you know, I think everything we talked about today, I think of the healthcare system, I think of different interventions, all of that stuff, but it really comes down to a choice. It really comes down to us. And we have so much agency that if we just take that on, and with that, stuff comes up.

46:02Darin Olien:Whatever limits, whatever mental health things, whatever I don't deserve, whatever that stuff, then deal with it as it comes. But gosh, we just talked how quickly time goes by. We're already three weeks into the new year. We're almost a month down. What else are we going to do? just continue to react to life? Or are we going to be proactive? Because time's going by, and we might as well be proactive and be the catalyst for our own opportunities. And I think, I don't know about you, but manifesting our life, being available to the miracles, being available to the love that's around us, you have to put yourself in a position and by taking these actions for yourself for being healthy uh you you create more probability i believe this at the core of my being more probability of miracles showing up of of opportunities being there because you're receptive and you're not shut down it's an opportunity to open to life and you know taking care of yourself you just are stronger and stronger and stronger and any resilience uh or any stress that comes your way you're more capable of receiving the ups and downs of life as well you know so like i'm with you like Like this is, that's why I called my first book Super Life.

47:42Darin Olien:That's why like, it's because it's like, we share that vision because it's just something that's needed more than ever. The more chaotic things get, the more I'm like, let's just do what we can do in front of us.

47:56Dr. Richard J. Brown:The burning question that I have to solve that I've tried to think about a lot is how do we get everyone to want this? how do you get everyone to want what we're talking about how do we how do we get people to believe that they can do it how do we make it available for people to do i mean listen like like you said you don't need a fancy gym you don't need fancy equipment you don't need a membership you need your body weight and the desire if you have your body weight and the desire you don't need any of the other fancy stuff you can do it and and people that say it's too expensive to eat healthy rubbish that is crap you can choose things that aren't a candy bar you can choose things you can get an apple instead of a candy bar you know arguably it has more sugar but it's it's really honestly it's the health is all around us but how do we get people to want this

48:54Darin Olien:you know yeah that is a powerful question and part of me feels like there is a whole population of people that do want it. And there's a whole, there's a bunch of people that won't like, they're just going to be in their loop of whatever they believe is important in their lives. And unfortunately, you'll wake up one day with your health not being there for you. And, and, and, and that's a, that's a rude awakening. Um, you know, my mom, uh, over this weekend had to be induced into a coma. Um, yeah, it was pretty, pretty intense. Uh, she, she got sick, she got pneumonia and then she, within two hours of my brother checking on her, she couldn't breathe brought to the hospital.

49:50Darin Olien:Uh, they're like, Oh, she has lung disease. We're like, we didn't know that. And, uh, she's had heart attack. So it's not to, my mom has just not kind of taken health on. My first program I gave my mom was when I was 18 years old. I wrote out, printed out, like before the internet, clearly. And what was it? I was 18. It was 88, 1988. And I've tried to be there for her as much as I can. There's been opportunities and then to ups and downs but when you don't have your health you don't you don't have many choices and and you know health is a a proliferation of choices that you have in your world and i think i think one answer to what you're saying is community i have seen one of the strongest things I've ever seen when I've, I mean, I helped put programs together for Beachbody for the last 20 years.

50:56Darin Olien:I put programs together in multiple situations all over the place. The thing that's the most powerful, you can inspire people. We can talk and we have group gatherings and we can, we can inspire. The thing that's the most powerful that I've seen is group accountability. It doesn't have to be difficult, but a group of people, three to five people that are just saying, I drank my water today. Hit send on a text message even. Everyone goes, yeah, way to go. I hit mine. I hit mine. I moved today. It was a hard day, but I got outside in my snow boots. You know, whatever it is. And then those people are supporting you, and you know that they're also challenged and going through it.

51:43Darin Olien:that to me has has brought together such a bond of strength that i think what we have to do is break this idea that we are alone yeah and we are siloed and that's not true we know the plasma of

52:02Dr. Richard J. Brown:the universe we're connected to everything and everyone yeah so let's follow nature let we know

52:09Darin Olien:that longevity goes up. We know that adherence to everything. We know happiness is increased with community, all of those things. So there's ways. And I think about this all the time. And we're building some stuff right now to kind of help do that because we got to take the modern world where it is and then see how we can improve upon it. And I think breaking these bonds of of isolation is, is one of the biggest ones, you know, community is everything.

52:44Dr. Richard J. Brown:There's no question. Community issues. I mean, I see it. I still do CrossFit. I've been doing it for so many years and the community that I have at my, at my gym is just bar none. Like I suffer with them, right? They pull me through a workout. I do more reps because I'm next to them because I want, I should be able to keep up with that guy, or I should be able to keep up with that girl. I mean, I play that game a little bit and if we're not for the community, you probably wouldn't push yourself as hard. But it definitely keeps me coming back.

53:15Darin Olien:Yeah, I've been working out with the same group of guys for almost 20 years.

53:18Dr. Richard J. Brown:That's awesome. Very cool. Yeah. I love that.

53:22Darin Olien:Yeah. So what's next for you? What do you –

53:28Dr. Richard J. Brown:I think we just talked about it. Yeah, that's I'm trying to figure out, you know, I need my I need my home based practice to just be busy and thriving. And then the goal is maybe eventually to be able to hire another surgeon and train them and teach them so they can take over most of the operating so that I can focus on some of this other joyful stuff that I think is going to really bring me me joy and help other people. so that that's the goal I'm trying to build my surgical practice to the point where I can train someone younger to come in and just absorb a lot of the surgery stuff and I still love operating but I would cut back on that and I would want and then I want to figure out how to engage in like what Peter does kind of I just and I and I want to change plastic surgery I'm trying to figure out how to marry this with plastic surgery and have a different approach to plastic surgery that's always been my goal is to change the landscape of plastic surgery and have surgeons stop focusing just on making the money doing the surgery.

54:28Dr. Richard J. Brown:But let's offer, we have an opportunity where we're bringing in patients who potentially might need mental health help on body image, who might need some nutrition consulting, who might even just be a candidate for GLP-1 and we can provide the proper people for them to do that. I want to bring all of that into plastic surgery and let's stop thinking that we just have to cut, cut, cut, make our money doing that and move on. There's this whole other wellness avenue and things that we can do. Because look, if the patient learns how to live the right lifestyle, how to lose the weight on their own, how to eat well and exercise, then when I do the tummy tuck, should they still need it?

55:05Dr. Richard J. Brown:Now they're set up to maintain that result and they're not going to rebound.

55:10Darin Olien:Not to mention they're going to heal a lot faster. Totally.

55:14Dr. Richard J. Brown:100%. yeah by the way i know i know we have to wrap up but the last time that i did 75 hard i failed do you know why i got burned that was my burn remember my burns my legs that was on day i think i was on day 55 oh and i and when my grill exploded and burned my legs i literally the next day my wife was laughing at me. I'm like, no, no, I'm not quitting. I'll be fine. I went outside on the porch with dumbbells and was doing pushups, wrapped up legs, burned. I was like, I can still get my workings. I'll do two of these a day. I'll be fine. And literally later that day, she was like, stop. I don't like losing.

55:59Dr. Richard J. Brown:She was like, you're done. 75 hard is over. Okay. I was like, you're right. It's over.

56:07Darin Olien:Mama executive came in.

56:09Dr. Richard J. Brown:She was like, you're done. Get inside. Get back in bed. That's, that's pretty badass, though, that you still had that, that, that power and initiative

56:21Darin Olien:to want to quit.

56:22Dr. Richard J. Brown:I just didn't. I was so mad because we were on cruise control and just crushing it. But it's all good.

56:29Darin Olien:Well, you're an inspiration. And I'm so grateful for you being in the position you are and, and, and helping people. And, and I'm, I'm a, I'm a big fan and also a big advocate of you doing exactly what you want to do because the world, the world needs it. Um, and we got to break these systems and, and rebuild them, uh, so that people can have other options because it's, it's time. It's time.

57:02Dr. Richard J. Brown:I'm with you, man. And I think we're poised. I think after COVID, a lot of people realized that they needed to take their health seriously. So I think we're primed in a place that if we can get good people putting in front of other people, that maybe we'll get more people to bite on the lifestyle.

57:16Darin Olien:Yeah, man. Well, thank you, Dr. Rickey. You're the best. My pleasure.

57:21Dr. Richard J. Brown:Thanks for this epic chat. I appreciate it.