Episode 348

22:06And I was going to save that for, you know, around the same time that I asked her last year, just kind of as a special thing.

22:13Mike Boudet:While keeping a close eye on Dennis, investigators also focused their attention on another man in Diane's life. Her friend and co-worker and someone who clearly had feelings for her, Ray Clancy. And Ray, what's the deal with Ray? Okay, so Ray is a very dysfunctional person from my standpoint in the fact that he seems to be attracted to women that are not attracted to him. Ray freely admitted that he had romantic feelings for Diane. But he denied that his willingness to help her, watching her dogs, fixing things around her house, had anything to do with that. He said he was simply trying to repay her for bending a few rules at IBM to help get him hired.

23:01People say you might have had a little crush on her.

23:03Mike Boudet:Diane? Oh, hell yeah. I've always had a crush on Diane since I remember. She hired me when IBM didn't hire me. I had a behind-the-GPA, and they refused to hire me at IBM. So she broke the rules and she hired me. I've been all over the world, 20 countries. I made a lot of money at IBM through all kinds of stuff. I could do anything with a computer because she broke the rules for me. So I had a—I'm caging. We have a real sense of obligation to people that we like, our family, our friends. And so I always have this obligation to take care of her and watch her house and take care of her kids because she did something that nobody else would ever do.

23:33Mike Boudet:It was no secret that Ray had a thing for Diane. And it was also no secret that she just didn't feel the same way about him. Even Ray admitted as much, insisting that he just accepted it. And Diane didn't reciprocate your feelings? No, no. She just screamed. How come? I don't know. Just never had any clean or none of that kind of stuff. Just friends. Always have been. Did it ever cause problems between you? No, never. No? Do you have arguments and stuff? No. In the beginning, I always wanted to. I always pampered her and took care of her and bought her flowers, all that kind of good stuff. It used to make her nervous, uncomfortable, because she didn't like guys pampering her.

24:13Anybody had a relationship with her? No. She asked me that, too. No, I never did. No sexual relationship at all? Never even kissed her. Never even? Did you want to? I always wanted to. I never did.

24:23Mike Boudet:naturally the investigators had to consider the possibility that ray hadn't accepted being just diane's friend maybe he was tired of helping her and getting nothing in return maybe he just felt like she owed him maybe he tried to make a move and when she turned him down things got violent. Well, one thing that you said, and then you kind of took it back. You thought she was good looking. I did. Getting that body. She did. You said you didn't want to have sex with her. And then you said earlier on, you said, yeah, you did, but it just never. Did you or not? It was full of friendship if we did. It always did.

25:08It was full of friendship if we did something like that. Both of us knew it. Just something we understood. Anytime you sleep with a lady, it changes everything. You get the feeling from a lady that. You made a pass at her and she said no. No, I didn't make a pass at her. I don't make passes at her. You didn't? No, I don't. I didn't. I like overwhelming, you know. You don't make a pass at her because it's kind of insulting. Because she said no, then you get no friendship anymore. Oh, yeah, you do. No, you don't. Because Diane's really sensitive to that kind of stuff. I didn't want to spoil the friendship with her.

25:35So I didn't push her. I didn't make a pass at her, all that kind of stuff. Just stuff that I didn't really do. Did you love her? Did I love her? I guess, like a friend. Did you ever tell anybody you loved her? Well, I love how? Like I love dogs. I love her dogs, too. Did you tell anybody you loved her? I don't think I would have said that, no.

25:54Mike Boudet:The bizarre thing about Ray was that he came off as a genuinely nice guy. Yet if he had killed Diane, it wouldn't have come as a surprise to anyone. So you think he pretty much is obsessed with her? I wouldn't even, I don't want to go there. I just want to say that... What was her falling out about? Let me ask you that. I don't know. It's – Ray presses. He presses like – he's always wanting validation. And honestly, if I was a woman, he would give me the creeps. Oh, really? Yeah. And again, it seems like the worst women treat him, the more he gravitates toward. It's a very unhealthy situation.

26:47Mike Boudet:For many of Diane's friends, there was something unsettling about Ray. Something they couldn't quite put their finger on. Yet somehow, he mostly came across as friendly and harmless. So, the big question just loomed. Was Ray just a hopeless romantic with an unreturned crush, let's say? or was he something darker? Was he a man willing to take what he wanted by force, by violence, by murder? Was Ray a monster? Did she ever tell you about anything inappropriate that he did that made her feel awkward? Well, yes. Then this was before we started dating. You would press her on just like things that were not appropriate for friends to press on.

27:51And it wasn't sexual. It was just a lot of neediness. And apparently, I do remember now, that that's what the last conversation was about. I guess he was pressing on something and either she hung up on him or he hung up on her. She just had no patience with that. Do you think he's capable of doing something bad? Have you ever seen him lose his temper? Has she ever told you about anything where she was afraid of him? I do not specifically ever remember anything like that, no.

28:24Mike Boudet:With both Dennis and Ray looking like plausible suspects, investigators turn their focus to the evidence. Maybe the crime scene could point to which man had killed Diane. There were no signs of forced entry, meaning whoever did it was either invited inside or they had a key. To your knowledge, who has a key to that house? I may have. There's one in my car that I do not have a key on my keychain because I never had the need to. Okay. Do you know if Ray has a key? He has a key to our house, too. If you need copies of them, you can make prints of them. To your house? No, to her house. No, I'm going to take those keys.

29:07Okay. She's deceased and there's really no need for you to be in the house anymore.

29:12Mike Boudet:Both Dennis and Ray had keys to Diane's house. That detail, unfortunately, didn't help narrow things down. So investigators shifted their focus to each man's alibi. And when they each last saw or spoke with Diane. When's the last time you saw her? Saturday, two weeks ago. Saturday night in Dallas, she was a young lady. I don't really know her name. But I haven't heard from her since then. No word, no phone contact, nothing for about two weeks. Ray said that the last time he saw Diane was weeks before the murder. Dennis told police that his last contact with her was through an online chat while he was at work.

29:53Mike Boudet:When investigators checked on this, both stories appeared to hold up, which raised a new question. Were they looking at the wrong men altogether? Maybe Dennis and Ray were both innocent. What do you think happened? From what she told me, since she never went upstairs and her house is on the market, and you said she was trying to, I don't know what time, you didn't know what time. I would guess that she was showing somebody the house. Interestingly, when Ray was asked what he thought might have happened to Diane, his answer was almost identical to the answer that Dennis had given. Both men suggested that Diane could have been showing the house to a potential buyer, and then things turned violent.

30:39Mike Boudet:With no sign of forced entry, they reasoned that Diane must have let someone inside. And maybe that someone killed her. Investigators soon discovered that this theory wasn't far-fetched at all. While canvassing Diane's neighborhood, they learned that several residents had been approached by a strange man. Someone going door to door, claiming to be a rancher and asking about homes for sale. Not only that, but they later confirmed that Diane herself had been approached by this man in the afternoon on the same day that she was killed. This man comes and claims that he's a rancher and claims that he can pay cash for the house.

31:29But he needs to get with his wife and that he was going to come back the following day with his wife to see the house. We don't know if he has anything to do with it. I don't know. We're looking into it. It seems suspicious. We're going to try to get a composite. an older man, apparently he went to an older man's house Thursday, probably around noon. Yeah, because that's when Diane said that she thought she had sold the house. That was like about three o 'clock in the afternoon on Thursday. And I guess she had talked to her friend Tina that this guy had come to the house, but he didn't have a real estate agent with him.

32:11He came by himself. and, you know, I think she thought it was odd, but apparently she let him into the house. Jesus. But he left.

32:22Mike Boudet:For several days, investigators tried to untangle the stories of two men, a fiancé who might have been angry about a failed engagement and a coworker who might have been angry that Diane didn't love him back. But as the investigation moved forward, something much darker started to surface. Something beyond jealousy or heartbreak. In a disturbing twist, the evidence pointed to a different kind of motive altogether. One rooted not in love, but in perversion. and it suggested that whoever killed Diane Hollick hadn't come to win her heart. He'd come to feed a fetish.

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34:14Mike Boudet:In the days after Diane Hollick's murder, investigators pulled at every threat. Jealousy, rejection, heartbreak. Trying to figure out who could have killed her and why. but none of it fit. When they circled back to the most obvious suspect, her fiancé, Dennis, he gave them an alibi that couldn't be broken. Okay, so the last time you actually spent time with Diane was last weekend? Okay. And you drove back to Houston? And did you work all week? Yeah. I got a friend staying with me, so he can vouch for me if it comes to that. No, I just, you know we gotta do it. I understand. I understand. Investigators eventually confirmed that when Diane was killed, her fiancé Dennis was 200 miles away in Houston, working at his office.

35:10Mike Boudet:He was eliminated as a suspect. Likewise, Diane's co-worker Ray Clancy was also at work at the time of her death, and in fact, hadn't spoken to Diane in about two weeks. The night of the storm. Tornadoes and all that. 10.30 I went home last night. 10.30 that night. Because the childhood was horrible. I got home and that's the night I stayed home and didn't go anywhere. I didn't sleep. I don't know what time I went to sleep. Or it's a little bit closed. Back to work the next morning about, got to work, I guess, 8 o 'clock. 8 o 'clock or so. With both Ray and Dennis ruled out, investigators turned their attention to a new lead.

35:49Mike Boudet:During an interview with Diane's friend Tina, they learned that a strange man had recently come to Diane's house, claiming to be interested in buying it. And she had said that a man had come over that was very nicely dressed, probably in his mid-30s, had come over and told her that he was interested in her house. And that he didn't have a real estate agent, that he was a rancher. And that's, I mean, she had that conversation with Tina, but she also made a comment to Tina that the man kind of gave her the creeps. And we don't know if this guy came back, but clearly he used the same ruse, so to speak, with an older man that lived down the street prior to going to Diane's house.

36:35Mike Boudet:On the surface, none of this seemed unusual. After all, Diane was trying to sell her home, and there was a big first sale sign out front. It wouldn't be at all strange for someone to stop by unannounced and ask about the property. But what caught investigators' attention was that this same man had been supposedly house shopping all over Austin for weeks. And nearly everyone who'd encountered him described him the same way. Creepy and strange. And just a little bit threatening. Probably by Monday we'll be putting out that on the news, that we are, you know, trying to speak with that man. Hopefully somebody will call in.

37:22Mike Boudet:When a composite sketch was released to the media, it didn't take long for investigators to track down the strange home shopping man. One woman who'd encountered him had been so unnerved by his behavior that she actually wrote down his license plate number. That plate number led investigators to a van registered to a Patrick Anthony Russo. Patrick Russo, right? Correct. Okay. And how old are you? 38. 38. 38-year-old Patrick, who sometimes went by his middle name, Tony, lived in Elgin, Texas, about 25 miles east of Austin. Patrick was a born-again Christian who worked part-time at his local church.

38:13What's the name of that church?

38:15Mike Boudet:New Life in Christ. New Life in Christ? Yes, ma 'am. Okay. And what do you do for that? I'm the music minister there. You said, and you're married? Your wife's name? Janet. Janet. Okay. And the two boys are yours? Yes. Patrick lived with his second wife, Janet. They had two children from a previous marriage. Though, they didn't live with them. On the morning of November 21, 2001, Texas deputies arrived at Patrick's home and asked both him and Janet to come down to the station for interviews. They agreed. You're not under arrest, okay? I am curious, so someone will be knocking on my door this early in the morning.

39:00This has to do with an incident that happened here in Austin, in northwest Austin. Some things are missing. I brought a calendar of November. If you can tell us, if you could start maybe the 12th and go through and tell us what you remember, where you were and what you did.

39:22Mike Boudet:Before revealing why they brought him to the station for questioning, investigators asked Patrick about his whereabouts during the week of Diane's murder. They quickly focused on the actual day she was killed, which was a Thursday. That day, a massive thunderstorm had swept through Austin. That was a big storm day, wasn't it? That is not a problem. Um, Thursday, I spent some time at the church again. I went to go to KNLE here in Austin. What time was that?

40:02I think it was about, let's see, I talked to my wife. I was pulling in the parking lot, so that would have been about 4 o 'clock, I believe.

40:12Mike Boudet:Patrick told investigators that on the day Diane was killed, he'd driven into Austin to visit a local radio station. He said he was supposed to meet someone there who was helping him set up a website for his Christian rock band. We have a website that we've been trying to get up for about four months and I have spent so much time with them trying to get it up so I went up there to try to see about getting that up since we got all the information that they needed and when no one came to the door I went ahead and left Who did you talk to over at K &L? Actually, I didn't talk to anybody because nobody answered the door.

40:53So you made the trip up there for nothing, basically?

40:55Mike Boudet:Pretty much. I mean, you didn't call ahead and say you were coming? Patrick told investigators that his trip to the radio station had been spontaneous. He hadn't made an appointment or even called ahead. When he arrived, no one was there to meet him. and no one at the radio station remembered ever seeing him, which meant Patrick had no alibi. After leaving the station, the storm rolled in. The heavy rain and low visibility caused Patrick to get lost. At least, that's what he said had happened. Made a right-hand turn and made an illegal U-turn. I was, there was the only way you could get around everybody.

41:38And then I went back out and got on the highway going back towards Bastrop. Probably took me about another 50 minutes to get home when it normally was a little bit quicker than that. So what time did you get home? 5.30, I guess, or 6 somewhere. I'm not really sure exactly the time frame.

42:01Mike Boudet:Patrick told investigators he got home around 6 o 'clock in the evening. But his wife, Janet, gave a different time. Well, when he got to the station, there wasn't anybody there that was doing the website. So he was coming home. I know we were on the phone an hour because he was coming through all that storm. So we were on the phone probably from 6 to 7. What time did he get home? Should have been shortly after 7, probably between 7 and 7.15, I'm thinking. The couple's timelines were off by an hour. In a lot of cases, that kind of discrepancy might not mean much. But in a murder investigation, one hour can change everything.

42:47Mike Boudet:It can be the difference between being miles away from a crime scene or standing inside it. Did you ever stop to get out to talk to anybody? I believe I knocked on someone's door asking for directions. When you say someone's door, was that a residential door or was that a business door? No, it was a residential door. Do you remember what that person looked like? No, I have no clue. Imagine this. Just a few days ago, you're driving home when a brutal thunderstorm rolls in. Lorraine's coming down in sheets. Visibility's gone, and you take a wrong turn into a neighborhood you've never seen before.

43:35Mike Boudet:You're so disoriented that you stop at a random house, knock on the door, and ask a stranger for directions. Wouldn't you, I don't know, remember that? Wouldn't that whole encounter kind of, oh, I don't know, Stick in your mind a little bit, don't you think? Apparently for Patrick, nah. I want to ask you a little bit more about Thursday. You know, you talked about going to KNLE, and no one was there to tell us that you were there, okay? And then you talked about driving around and getting back on 183, and now you're telling us about maybe stopping at a residential area and talking to a gray-haired man.

44:23And is there any other places that you stopped while you were in this neighborhood? No. You didn't stop to talk to anybody else? No. I'm not lying to you if that's what you're asking me. That's what I'm asking you. I'm not lying to you. Plain and simple, you only stopped at one house. Correct. You talked to one man, an older man, and the gist of the conversation was you needed directions to get back to one anybody. Correct.

44:49Mike Boudet:Needless to say, investigators didn't buy Patrick's story. They were convinced that the house he stopped at wasn't random and that the person who answered the door was their murder victim, Diane Hollick. So you're saying you've never seen this woman, never been to her house, never been to her doorstep, never been inside her house, never been invited to look around. There would be no reason for anything to come back to say that you were in her house. No, sir. If she's saying that I've stolen something from her, then I'm sorry. I don't know what to say. Interestingly, when investigators showed Patrick a photo of Diane, he not only denied ever being in her house, but also spoke about her as if she were still alive.

45:39Mike Boudet:He seemed to believe, or wanted detectives to think he believed, that this was all about a simple burglary or break-in, and not a homicide investigation. Of course, the investigators weren't fooled by this performance, and they had more than a few reasons to suspect that Patrick was their man. This wasn't his first brush with the law. Patrick was on parole at the time and had already spent eight nights in prison for kidnapping a woman and tying her up. I had a nervous breakdown while on the job. I was trying to seek out a new life, which wasn't really going all that great. It ended up where I had a nervous breakdown, and I ended up holding the receptionist against her will.

46:31And basically, I broke down crying and just telling her all my problems, and then I left. How did you hold her? How did you? I tied her up. I just needed someone to talk to. I didn't feel like I had anybody, and I forced her to. I forced her to listen to my problems. And you'll see what it says in the case. Did you hurt her? I believe that anybody that ties anybody up does some damage. Physical damage, no, I didn't hurt her. Emotionally, I probably ruined her life.

47:02Mike Boudet:Patrick claimed that prison had changed him. He said that after his conviction, he found God, embraced faith, and left his old criminal life behind. He supposedly transformed himself into a humble Christian man.

47:42because that was my big problem back then was I went through the drug rehabs because I had an old drug habit that really took a toll on me.

47:53Mike Boudet:After his release from prison, Patrick wrote a book, joined a ministry, and even started a Christian rock band. All of this, he claimed, was part of his mission to help others find faith. When I got out, I've done everything from put a book out to try to help inmates and other people get their life in order through Christ. I have been a music minister. I have a ministry that I go into prisons with. Unfortunately for Patrick, the investigators weren't convinced by his supposed moral awakening. To them, this new Patrick looked a lot like the old one, a man with a history of violence and a record that included not just kidnapping, but also burglary.

48:39Mike Boudet:And of course, Patrick had an excuse for that as well. What about the burglaries? All my offenses have to do with just anger. Was there somebody in the house when you did the burglary? Yes. Well, I didn't burglarize the house. I assaulted someone through their doorway. And so I got a burglary of a habitation with the intent to commit bodily harm when the burglary had nothing to do with it because it wasn't a burglary. I was actually looking for a friend of mine. I was looking for a drug fix. When investigators pressed Patrick about his criminal past, he grew uneasy. But detectives didn't let up.

49:19Mike Boudet:They hadn't brought him in to rehash his old crimes. Their focus was on the murder of Diane Hollick. I'm trying to stay, you know, relaxed about this whole thing, but y 'all are starting to grill me pretty hard for stuffing. I don't even have the slightest clue what's going on, but I do know that I'm trying to be as honest as I can with you guys. Are you? I mean, are you really? Yes, I am. Are you in the market to buy a house? No. No? Is there any reason why you'd be in a neighborhood looking for a house? No. Do you think it's a little coincidental that several people said that they saw you in a neighborhood?

50:08I think it's, well, it has to be coincidental because I haven't been in any neighborhood.

50:14Mike Boudet:Patrick insisted that everything leading police to his doorstep was just one big coincidence. The witnesses who'd seen him and his van cruising through their neighborhood, asking about homes for sale, they were all mistaken. It was just a case of bad luck and bad timing. Good luck convincing the investigators, or a jury for that matter, of any of that. Tony, what's happened? Okay, Thursday, more than three different people identified you as coming to their place, inquiring about purchasing a residence. Well, they're mistaken. Let me tell you how serious this is. I would appreciate it because I feel like I'm getting pretty banged here, and I don't even know what it's for.

51:03She's dead. I don't know if you noticed when you walked in here, this is the homicide unit. Well, okay. Wow. I'm sitting here thinking we're talking about burglary, and we're talking about a murderer. As badly as I feel for this woman here, I'm sorry, but you guys are barking up the wrong tree, and I don't care how hard you dig, you're not going to find me committing any crime like that. His lies, his evasions, the statements and the evidence,

51:36Mike Boudet:all of it made one thing clear. They were sitting across from a man who had strangled a woman to death. We can sit here and say, well, it might be somebody that resembles you or looks at you. They picked you out. Not a friend, not somebody that looks like you. They picked you out. They had a conversation with you. A lady took your license plate number down after you came and started asking some really, what did she call it, some unsettling conversation that she had with you. And she said she would never forget your face again, and she didn't. Five different people who live in five different areas who all pick you out.

52:19You know, you're being there, your van, got your license plate. I mean, that. I'm not disputing whether someone thinks they've seen me. Okay. But I'm telling you. What about your van? Well, I can't explain that. I can't explain it. You know, that may be coincidental, but there's a whole lot of coincidences in life. I can't do nothing about that. I don't think that's a coincidence. Okay. I mean, I just don't. You know, too many people, you know, if it was one person, maybe. But three, four, five. Well... Not just this particular day, but another day. That was a month ago. For weeks, or probably much longer,

53:01Mike Boudet:Patrick had been cruising the streets of Austin in his van, playing the part of the classic predator. He wasn't looking for a house to buy. He was hunting for a victim. and tragically he found one in Diane Hollick. I don't know what all you have that you're dealing with. Well, I'm dealing with a woman that's dead and I'm dealing with a neighborhood that's in a panic because a man came to several of their houses that same day. Some people spent quite a bit of time with that man. What am I supposed to say? Y 'all want me to say that I did something I didn't do. That's what you want. I just want you to tell the truth.

53:41That's all. Well, I'm trying to, but you guys don't want to hear the truth. Do you want me to hear me say that I went up to... Who else would have had your van on Thursday up in that neighborhood that you've already put yourself in? Well, you know... Lost in a rainstorm. Who has your van? Nobody has my van, except me. So, I mean, how do you explain that? Well, I can't explain it. A girl is dead in the same neighborhood that you were seen in by several other people. That's suspicious. We'd be remiss if we weren't looking into that. Well, and I'm not knocking you guys for that, okay? I'm not knocking you.

54:14But if you want me to say something that isn't true.

54:20Mike Boudet:Investigators pressed harder, confronting Patrick with all kinds of evidence. But no matter how much they threw at him, he wouldn't budge. He doubled down, denying, deflecting, and then denying all over again. I can assure you this one thing. I haven't murdered anybody. I haven't robbed anybody. I haven't burglarized any houses. and I don't care how bad it looks on me, I haven't done anything to anybody and you can search my house. Tell us what you've done. I haven't done anything, that's what I'm telling you. Were you in this neighborhood? No. You weren't talking to any of these people? No, I wasn't.

55:00Mike Boudet:Eventually, this interview ran its course and to Patrick's surprise, the detectives didn't arrest him. Instead, they placed him and his wife, Janet, in the same room. The moment she walked in, Patrick broke down, sobbing and pleading with her to believe he was innocent. I'm so sorry you're going through this. But I promise you this is what I'm supposed to do. I never did anything to anybody. And I can't explain it. I can't. But I can promise you all my heart they're wrong. But I can promise you this. Listen, I promise you this. It doesn't matter what anybody says or does. Because I'm telling you, Janet, no matter what anything looks like, I'm not guilty of anything.

55:50Mike Boudet:After his emotional display, Patrick was allowed to leave the station. But his freedom didn't last long. The very next day, detectives arrested him and brought him back in. Up to that point, Patrick had flatly denied ever cruising through Austin or asking about homes for sale. But now, he had a problem. At one of those houses where witnesses had identified him, investigators had found his fingerprints. When police released a picture of Russo, another woman called saying Russo had said the same thing to her. Police say fingerprints left in her home matched Russo's. Even with this evidence, the police didn't charge Patrick with Diane's murder.

56:33Mike Boudet:At least, not yet. Instead, they booked him on a parole violation, which was clearly a strategic move to keep a suspected killer behind bars while they built a stronger case against him. Part of that effort included executing a search warrant on Patrick's home. But when they did, Diane's engagement ring was nowhere to be found. To this day, it has never been recovered. Nonetheless, Patrick's arrest gave investigators a chance to interrogate him again, and maybe this time get a confession.

57:32And they're mistaken because it's not me. Coincidences happen. If they didn't, they wouldn't be called coincidences. I'm sure of one thing, that I didn't murder anybody.

57:45Mike Boudet:Despite the arrest and despite all of the evidence, Patrick continued to play his tired old game. I'm a little, frankly, a little fed up with all this coincidence stuff. it's not adding up and you know it doesn't add up and we know it doesn't add up I know it doesn't look good but I'm telling you I didn't murder anybody you say you didn't murder somebody maybe you didn't but you were in that neighborhood Tony and you talked to several people in that neighborhood they said that you were there at their home and it wasn't at 4 o 'clock in the afternoon it was earlier than that and you've been in other places in Austin doing similar stuff with your van being written down.

58:34The license plate of that van was written down at another time. Not just this past time, but another time. And you told me yesterday that nobody else drives your van except for you.

58:47Mike Boudet:In the short time between Patrick's first interview and his arrest, investigators uncovered a few new details about him. Details that were deeply unsettling. It turned out that the Diane Hollick case wasn't the only active investigation where the name Patrick Russo had come up. You know what? Let me ask you something. We called Lake Jackson yesterday and we talked to several detectives who knew Patrick Russo really, really well. We had some very interesting conversations about some cases that you were involved in that you were never filed on for. And you know what those cases involved? Those cases involve you choking women, you tying women up and choking them.

59:35I find that very interesting. Another one of those coincidences. I suppose that's a coincidence.

59:41Mike Boudet:Naturally, Patrick had even more denials and excuses about all these other eerily similar investigations. They have multiple women over there that were choked by Patrick Russo, and they all picked you out. You admitted to the one that you knew you were busted on because you were picked out of that lineup. I admitted to every single thing that I've been in trouble with. You never said anything about choking any of those other women. I got arrested. Tying them up. I tied up one person when I had my nervous breakdown. I'm talking about the ones that you didn't talk about. I'm talking about the women that you did tie up and choke, but you didn't talk about.

1:00:23I have not tied up anybody and choked anybody. Really? Now, I have assaulted a couple of people, and I have tied up. Women or men? They were women. That's what I'm talking about. They have at least five cases. They got a stack. Of women who said, yeah, that's the guy that choked me. You only told us that one because that's the one you got convicted on. There's multiple cases that they could have filed on you, and why they didn't, I don't know. And you know what? They were like, I can't believe he's out of jail. There's several women that said you tied them up. You tied their hands up. How about the one who came out of her bedroom when the other one was tied up, and then you had to tie her up too?

1:01:05You guys are twisting things up. We're just repeating what they told us. That's what they told us. You need to read the police report. Don't listen to overtalk from 10 years ago because it's real easy to start confusing things. You read my files and see what was said and written in those things, and then come talk to me about them.

1:01:23Mike Boudet:As the investigation into Patrick deepened, a disturbing pattern became very clear. One that pointed to a twisted fascination with choking women. That dark obsession was also confirmed by statements from his own wife. He has always been fascinated, I will say this, he has always been fascinated with my neck. I guess because I have such a skinny little neck. I mean, I will say that he does tend to put his hand on my neck, but if I say let go or I can't, airway is getting restricted, and he always lets go. I mean, he realizes. What would you say if I told you that your wife told Detective Gilchrist that you choke her during sex?

1:02:13What would you say to that? I would say that what I do in my sex life is nobody's business. It may not be, but I think it's very pertinent to this case and what's happened here and what's happened in your past. You like to choke women. That's obvious. Why would you choke your wife during sex? You guys, after my phone call, came in here and are instantly hostile. Why, I don't know. Okay, this is my life here. This is my life that's on the line here. Right. Now, I didn't do anything to hurt anybody else's life. And yes, I have a reason to feel the way I feel.

1:02:51Mike Boudet:Patrick kept up his act. The cooperative, wrongfully accused man just trying to clear his name. But it never worked. The web of so-called coincidences and mounting evidence had become far too much for him to overcome. I'm trying to cooperate with you guys. You know what? You're not trying to cooperate. You're trying to snow us. You're trying to get over on us so they will think that you're this high and mighty religious whatever that is so much better than your past that you've done all that. You're through with all that. And nothing happened. You're innocent. You couldn't have been anywhere that we said you were.

1:03:33when the facts, indisputable, concrete facts, say different. Quit all this crap about coincidences and no, I wasn't here, no, I wasn't there, and get right, admit to what you did, and maybe we can get to the forgiveness part. Because this is just crap. It's just bullshit, and you know it.

1:03:56Mike Boudet:Like his first interview, this interrogation eventually ran its course, and Patrick held firm to his story. He clung on to his lies and refused to confess. I'll tell you what I am. I'm in real big days here because I can't believe this is happening in my life. Well, you better believe it, and you knew it yesterday. You knew it yesterday. You know exactly what's going on, Patrick. I know what's going on. I can't help it if I can't believe what's happening. Well, you know what? We're going to prove that you did it, and it isn't going to be that hard because you're there. Everybody saw you there.

1:04:34You're just making it worse for yourself.

1:04:36Mike Boudet:I did not kill anybody. You're just making it worse for yourself. While Patrick sat in jail on his parole violation, investigators kept working the case. And before long, they had enough to move forward. Formal murder charges were filed against him. In May, Russo was indicted for the November 2001 murder of Diane Hollick. Hollick's Northwest Austin home was up for sale. Police think Russo posed as an interested buyer. An arrest warrant explains November 15th, Hollick told a friend a man was going to sell his ranch and buy her home. The next day, police found her strangled body. As expected, Patrick pleaded not guilty.

1:05:14Mike Boudet:And what followed were months of motions, hearings, and seemingly endless days. This is supposed to be a hearing where Patrick Russo's defense finds out what evidence the prosecution has against him. But the judge decides to focus on other capital murder cases first and postpones the hearing. I'm absolutely innocent, and I don't think that sitting around in here for two years of my life... It's a setback for Russo and his family. One of the things that I think has just really been frustrating is the fact that with all the postponements, it doesn't seem to be a system that brings about justice the way that maybe we thought it would.

1:05:55Russo's family members don't want to talk about details, afraid it might hurt the case. But say they know Russo's innocent and just want the chance to tell his side and get him home. Basically, our lives are on hold right now until the situation gets resolved.

1:06:09Mike Boudet:By 2003, Patrick's case finally went to trial, nearly two years after Diane Hollick's murder. Prosecutors laid out a chilling case. They told jurors that Patrick Russo had spent months cruising neighborhoods around Austin. posing as a cash buyer interested in homes for sale. Nearly every person he approached was a woman. He'd introduce himself with different names, spin stories about selling a ranch, and insist on meeting alone. They presented witnesses, realtors and homeowners, who identified Patrick as the man who'd made them uncomfortable with his behavior. Then came the forensic evidence. DNA from Diane's left hand that matched Patrick, and hairs found on a towel inside her home that couldn't exclude him as the source.

1:07:04Mike Boudet:But what truly unsettled the courtroom was testimony from Patrick's first wife. She told jurors that during their marriage, Patrick had a disturbing sexual fixation, that he could only climax while choking her. In part, that testimony helped prosecutors expose what they believed to be Patrick's motive. On his home computer, investigators had also uncovered over a thousand images from an asphyxiation-themed porn site called Necrobabes.com. You're welcome, weirdo. To the prosecution, this wasn't just pornography. It was Patrick's violent fantasy. brought to life in the murder of Diane Hollick. Why would you all even think that I would do something like that?

1:07:59What motive would I have had to do something like that to somebody? I have no idea. Was it a burglary? Was it a robbery? Was it a rape? I don't know. I mean, that woman never did anything to hurt anybody. Everybody loved that woman. I mean, I haven't heard one person say a bad thing about this person. I mean, had no enemies. There's no reason for it. None whatsoever.

1:08:25Mike Boudet:After learning that Diane had been murdered, her family, friends, and investigators all struggled to understand why. Why would someone tie her up and strangle her for no apparent reason? In the end, the answer wasn't complicated, just horrifying. Patrick Russo had a fantasy, an overwhelming compulsion to choke women, one that overpowered reason, empathy, and even his own fear of losing his freedom. What he did wasn't driven by rage. It was driven by a perverse need for power and control, deliberate, predatory, and obsessive. This reality paints a chilling picture of Diane's final moments. We know that Patrick went to her home, tied her up, and strangled her to death before maliciously cleaning the scene and fleeing.

1:09:27Mike Boudet:But Patrick never confessed. The most haunting details remain unknown. How did he gain control of Diane? How long did he keep her restrained before deciding to kill her? what did he say to her what did she say to him did she beg for her life did diane know she was going to die all these questions and so many others will likely never be answered trying to live my life and do what's right i mean you say that but would you really admit to it if If you did? If I did it? Would you do the Christian thing? I mean, you wouldn't hide behind this whole Christian cloak thing. It's not a cloak thing. It's a for real thing.

1:10:14And as a Christian, I wouldn't do something like that.

1:10:17Mike Boudet:Patrick had spent years constructing a mask. To the world, he was a man of faith. A Christian. A music minister. A husband. A family man. But behind the facade was something else. he was a predator prowling for women and attempting to perfect his routine over and over until the day he finally struck it's disgusting to sit here and listen to you talk about being such a devout christian and forgiveness and how much you've turned your life around when this one coincidence after another this whole thing goes back to similarities that I'm sure are coincidental back in 1989, 1990, 91, 92, you know? But you're this reborn Christian, and you're going to sit here and lie about it?

1:11:08Mike Boudet:The split between the life Patrick performed and the darkness he concealed is ultimately what defines him. And it's what stripped away any doubt about who he truly was. Not a man of God. Not a misunderstood soul. but a monster hiding in plain sight. Tragically, the person who paid the ultimate price for this monster's desires was an ordinary woman. Someone simply trying to sell her home and start a new life with her fiancé. Tell me what her daily routine is, do you know? Gets up about 8.15, heads right over to the computer, gets some tea makes sure the dogs are fine and she just starts cranking away until like noon and I think she usually takes a shower and gets dressed, runs errands or whatever and then cranks until whenever she needs to crank and she'll go work out or go down to town lake She liked to go out to have sushi once in a while She wasn't a big, not as of lately I think that's a couple of years.

1:12:20Big going out person. Mostly staying at home. She did a lot of eating at home. Her kids were her life. Her dogs, sorry. Her dogs. We'll call them her kids. That's what I call them too. They were very important to her. So she always took care of them. She didn't leave them by themselves. So she was, that was her family, I guess.

1:12:38Mike Boudet:On May 9th, 2003, a Texas jury returned a guilty verdict for Patrick Russo. But because they couldn't reach a unanimous decision in on the sentencing, the judge imposed an automatic sentence of life in prison without the possibility of parole, sparing him the death penalty. For investigators, this conviction was the end of a long and difficult case. For Diane's friends and family, it was the end of something far greater, a life that never should have been taken. As for Patrick, he will spend the rest of his life behind bars, remembered not for his music or his faith, but for the false life he built and the violence that exposed it.

1:13:48Mike Boudet:If you like that, and if you like things like that, head on over to swordandscale.com, download the app on your Apple iPhone or your Android whatever, and, you know, subscribe to Plus. You can get all kinds of extra content, including commercial-free episodes of everything, including Nightmares, Sword and Scale, our old plus show. This doesn't happen to people like me. We've done all these other podcasts. So you could go get all of that stuff. You can get, you know, commercial free versions of this show for the last 13 years. Again, this is episode 348. There's 348 of them plus 150, 160 plus episodes plus 60 something nightmares.

1:14:35Mike Boudet:I don't know. There's a lot of stuff. Go get it. Go get it right now. Go get it right now!

1:15:26Mike Boudet:We'll be right back.

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